House ObamaCare bill: Here comes the taxes!

posted at 12:15 pm on October 30, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

Americans for Tax Reform has culled the 1990-page Pelosi health-care overhaul bill to find the taxes that will supposedly collect over $540 billion in revenue over 10 years.  It’s quite an impressive list of new burdens on Americans and their health-care providers and producers — but that’s redundant.  After all, who do you think will end up paying for the medical-device taxes?  It won’t be insurers or doctors:

  • Employer Mandate Excise Tax (Page 275): If an employer does not pay 72.5 percent of a single employee’s health premium (65 percent of a family employee), the employer must pay an excise tax equal to 8 percent of average wages.  Small employers (measured by payroll size) have smaller payroll tax rates of 0 percent (<$500,000), 2 percent ($500,000-$585,000), 4 percent ($585,000-$670,000), and 6 percent ($670,000-$750,000).
  • Individual Mandate Surtax (Page 296): If an individual fails to obtain qualifying coverage, he must pay an income surtax equal to the lesser of 2.5 percent of modified adjusted gross income (MAGI) or the average premium.  MAGI adds back in the foreign earned income exclusion and municipal bond interest.
  • Medicine Cabinet Tax (Page 324)
  • Cap on FSAs (Page 325)
  • Increased Additional Tax on Non-Qualified HSA Distributions (Page 326)
  • Denial of Tax Deduction for Employer Health Plans Coordinating with Medicare Part D (Page 327)
  • Surtax on Individuals and Small Businesses (Page 336)
  • Excise Tax on Medical Devices (Page 339)
  • Corporate 1099-MISC Information Reporting (Page 344)
  • Delay in Worldwide Allocation of Interest (Page 345)
  • Limitation on Tax Treaty Benefits for Certain Payments (Page 346)
  • Codification of the “Economic Substance Doctrine” (Page 349)
  • Application of “More Likely Than Not” Rule (Page 357)

See the ATR post for detailed descriptions of each new tax.  For the moment, I just want to focus on a couple of interesting choices.  For instance, the new “codification” on page 349 essentially allows the IRS to willy-nilly disallow legal deductions based on their view that the motive for it was not “entirely business related.”  Gee, I wonder how many times the IRS will reach that conclusion when the government needs cash?  The entire point of tax law is supposed to prevent that kind of subjective decision-making — and the historical thrust of American jurisprudence is to assume innocence until guilt is proven.  Now, the IRS can just ex post facto assume guilt and penalize the taxpayer.

Note, too, the two attacks on health-savings accounts (HSAs) and similar structures that allow people to use non-taxed cash without itemizing.  Congress wants to double the penalty for using HSAs for non-qualified distributions, which they have not done with similar shelters such as IRAs, 401(k)s, and the like.  They also have entirely eliminated non-prescription medication from the qualifications, except insulin, which means that taxpayers will pay more taxes and have less reason to keep HSAs.

And the Limitation of Tax Treaty bears special mention.  The Obama administration abandoned an effort to tax foreign earnings of American corporations, finally convinced that it would make US companies less competitive overseas (see here for explanation).  This codicil doesn’t quite restore the Obama plan, but it places a penalizing tax on American earnings for corporations with overseas profits.  That should drive those corporations that can relocate to foreign shores, while making other American corporations less competitive.

Jazz Shaw writes:

So while the Obama administration’s talking heads continue insisting they will only tax the “very rich” (a joke which really never gets old) and they work on taxing cigarettes, soda, coffee, gasoline and heating oil, (with hamburger soon to follow, I’m sure) now we’ll be treated to a whole new set of taxes. Need more help with your health care needs? No problem! We’ll just tax your wheelchairs, your teeth and your prosthetic devices!

Has the middle class discovered the biggest lie of the Obama campaign yet?  When statist policies get imposed, everyone pays.  Everyone.


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That picture of Nancy Pelosi doing her fake tears-for-fears-and-violence thing always makes me want to woof up my cookies.

Daggett on October 30, 2009 at 12:18 PM

If this monstrosity passes, there won’t be enough proctologists…..

Patrick S on October 30, 2009 at 12:19 PM

Don’t tax me, bro’!

jamie gumm on October 30, 2009 at 12:20 PM

Holy tax hike Batman!

If this is a trick for Halloween.. I don’t wanna see the treat.

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:20 PM

Can’t wait to see the 10 CD version of Turbo-Tax.

fourdeucer on October 30, 2009 at 12:21 PM

Let me be clear….

……….Everyone pays.

Baxter Greene on October 30, 2009 at 12:21 PM

Has the middle class discovered the biggest lie of the Obama campaign yet? When statist policies get imposed, everyone pays. Everyone.

Except those who are menber of Congress… the Senate… and of course the POTUS.

Yep… we are now slaves. Liberals, you wanted to rage against the machine, why don’t you rage against the Hill?

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:22 PM

I think the middle-class already knew they would be the ones who took the hit.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:22 PM

Has the middle class discovered the biggest lie of the Obama campaign yet? When statist policies get imposed, everyone pays. Everyone.

You mean Pelosi lied? I heard her say that we were going to ensure 96% of Americans were going to be insured and everybody’s costs were going to be going down! She wouldn’t be deliberately trying to deceive, would she?

highhopes on October 30, 2009 at 12:22 PM

Can’t wait to see the 10 CD DVD version of Turbo-Tax.

fourdeucer on October 30, 2009 at 12:21 PM

ftfy… :(

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:23 PM

If this monstrosity passes, there won’t be enough proctologists…..

Patrick S on October 30, 2009 at 12:19 PM

If this passes, I will start making plans to move, while supporting the chance of secession. Better to secede and stay put than move.

Unfortunately, I have been predicting all along that health care that will kill private insurance and hand all control to gov’t will pass – and I haven’t changed my mind. So I better start packing.

Daggett on October 30, 2009 at 12:23 PM

You know what qualifies as taxable medical devices? Breast pumps, heart stents, tongue depressors, syringes and tampons.

With that list in mind, I can only imagine what else will eventually be included as taxable health care equipment.

Bishop on October 30, 2009 at 12:23 PM

I think the middle-class already knew they would be the ones who took the hit.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:22 PM

Too bad they did not come to that realization last November.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM

Can’t wait to see the 10 CD version of Turbo-Tax.

fourdeucer on October 30, 2009 at 12:21 PM

Actually Obamacare helps make taxes easier. The new 1040 is simply a form that says “Give us all your money.”

highhopes on October 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM

There are so many ads that could be done from this list, and I sure hope the companies affected are gearing up.

I’d also hope that the RNC would do the same but, then again, I hope to a billionaire before the end of the decade…

By winning every lottery next year.

TXUS on October 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM

Of, business can pay 0% of an employee’s premium by firing them.

Blake on October 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM

She wouldn’t be deliberately trying to deceive, would she?

highhopes on October 30, 2009 at 12:22 PM

It would be stupid of her not to try. The Democrats have been deceiving their voters for a 100 years and it works every time!

neuquenguy on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

For instance, the new “codification” on page 349 essentially allows the IRS to willy-nilly disallow legal deductions based on their view that the motive for it was not “entirely business related.”

First Hate Crime Laws and now this. Motive is not even a necessary element in proving guilt but increasingly it is a crime in and of itself. How exactly can these things not be Thought Crimes? Where the hell is the ACLU on this anyway? Isn’t this why the ACLU got started? Isn’t it the ACLU’s entire raison d’être?

Rocks on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

Every time I see that woman I wish death upon her. I wish it weren’t true, but it is. I hate her.

SouthernGent on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

If the Castro brothers were smart, they would declare that Cuba is open for business, is a fully free society, and declare a single 15% consumption tax.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

Actually Obamacare helps make taxes easier. The new 1040 is simply a form that says “Give us all your money.”

highhopes on October 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM

It’s even easier than that. They’ll implement 100% withholding. No forms to fill out.

Daggett on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

They talk about choice and competition and yet they use coercion to those who choose not to have HC. And if you choose to not wanting HC you will be punished through taxation, or prison. Can someone please throw water at Pelosi so I can enjoy watching her melt?

jaboba on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

Is it time for the pitchforks and torches yet? San Fran Nan and reality parted company a long time ago..

kingsjester on October 30, 2009 at 12:27 PM

Actually Obamacare helps make taxes easier. The new 1040 is simply a form that says “Give us all your money.”

highhopes on October 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM

I thought they were changing the final line to how much you can keep?

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:27 PM

So in return for paying higher taxes, we’ll get to stand in line behind all of the illegals in line to get “care”.

After all, they don’t have jobs to go to, so they can clog up the line when they get the sniffles.

Which if we actually want care, will cost even more.

So let’s see, that’s crappy health care, for higher taxes and higher surcharges.

Sounds like a great deal, especially when the people who pushed this will now gracefully exempt themselves from the system and continue to enjoy gold-plated care.

Anyone who thinks this is a good idea is either a Democrat politician or a complete fool.

NoDonkey on October 30, 2009 at 12:28 PM

So what this means is you are just peachy if you don’t work, don’t make any money and are on the dole! None of those nasty taxes to worry about and you can gripe that being ‘poor’ means you shouldn’t have to pay any other tax, too.

The government backed lifestyle of choice: depending on someone else to do the work for you.

Of course it gets a bit tough once the people that work realize that not working is far easier to do than working for a pittance to ‘spread the wealth around’. Then things go downhill rather quickly.

ajacksonian on October 30, 2009 at 12:29 PM

House ObamaCare bill: Here comes the taxes!

Duh!

Johan Klaus on October 30, 2009 at 12:30 PM

ahem, let me be a lib…

You stupid conservatives, the time for debate has ended, how dare you read the bill!!!!!!

joeindc44 on October 30, 2009 at 12:30 PM

SouthernGent on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

Agree. I can’t think of anyone on this earth who I despise more than Nancy Pelosi and that includes whomever is hiding in caves along the Pakistan border.

They’re supposed to be our enemies.

She’s not.

NoDonkey on October 30, 2009 at 12:30 PM

Good Lord – I knew it would be bad – that’s even worse than I thought.

These people are out of control

gophergirl on October 30, 2009 at 12:30 PM

Has the middle class discovered the biggest lie of the Obama campaign yet? When statist policies get imposed, everyone pays. Everyone.

I knew this long before Obama was elected, and thru out the years, when a dem was elected. It’s hard not to notice a party who espouses regularly, that they are for the middle class, and poor, and almost each, and every time they’re elected, no one’s situation changes, and more often, than not, it gets worse.

As for Clinton? Don’t bother. As angry as I am at Newt, it was his leadership that brought about prosperity during Clintons administration. Had Clinton gotten things done his, and Hillarys way….we’d already be in a government controlled health care system, and had lost a lot of our liberties, years ago.

capejasmine on October 30, 2009 at 12:32 PM

I knew it would be bad – that’s even worse than I thought.

Never underestimate the corruption, incompetence and the totalitarian nature of Democrats.

As low as they get, they can always go lower.

Although this is an impressive new low for them.

It will only get worse.

NoDonkey on October 30, 2009 at 12:32 PM

“Free” health care for all!

Except when it’s not!

/Obamacrats

Good Lt on October 30, 2009 at 12:32 PM

You know what qualifies as taxable medical devices? Breast pumps, heart stents, tongue depressors, syringes and tampons.

With that list in mind, I can only imagine what else will eventually be included as taxable health care equipment.

Bishop on October 30, 2009 at 12:23 PM

Band-Aids, cough drops, and Alka-Seltzer, no doubt.

Aitch748 on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

Is it time for the pitchforks and torches yet? San Fran Nan and reality parted company a long time ago..

kingsjester on October 30, 2009 at 12:27 PM

My Christmas wish list just got easier. A large vat of tar and a truckload of feathers and I’m happy!

highhopes on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

There was a good article today that spells out the problem here and why so many of us are looking for some answers elsewhere.

I’m for a public option. I’m one of those who believes in this. However, this bill is an unwieldy big program that appears to be absolutely impossible to implement properly. It’s the worst of big gov’t thinking.

The article pointed out that the bill goes absolutely against the current flow, where everything is about multiple choices, from your phone services to TV. The author put his finger on a very relevant point. This is going to strike a lot of people as really old thinking.

I’m not sure which darn blog I read this piece on. It was good, though.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

ftfy… :(

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:23 PM

Maybe they could get it all in 4 or 5 Blu-Ray discs, or as highhopes said Give us all your money.

fourdeucer on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

Why, it’s almost as if they want to permanently cripple our economy.

Bruce in NH on October 30, 2009 at 12:34 PM

Maybe they could get it all in 4 or 5 Blu-Ray discs, or as highhopes said Give us all your money.

fourdeucer on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

I am hoping Alaska seceded and soon.

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:34 PM

So in return for paying higher taxes, we’ll get to stand in line behind all of the illegals in line to get “care”.

Well, the bill isn’t passed now, and in LA, it’s impossible to find swine flu vaccine unless you’re willing to go to neighborhoods and stand in line for hours.

So, this particular system isn’t exactly winning awards, either.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:34 PM

Zero won’t sign this though, will he? I vaguley remember him saying something about not raising taxes, maybe it was a dream. If this thing goes through, we’re way past Fu*ked, but I’m not sure what that would be anymore.

Brat4life on October 30, 2009 at 12:35 PM

Rocks on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

It all started when umpires were allowed to determine if a pitcher hit a batter on purpose. All downhill from there.

a capella on October 30, 2009 at 12:35 PM

Does she even really have the votes yet? I am not entirely sure she does.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:36 PM

I am hoping Alaska seceded and soon.

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:34 PM

You know, I’m no hunter and I’m not fond of cold weather, but if Alaska secedes, I’ll have to give serious consideration to moving there.

Aitch748 on October 30, 2009 at 12:36 PM

Folks, remember, this is also on top of the Bush tax breaks that are set to expire soon. Add this and that, and presto, we have the largest tax hike in all of US History!

Johnnyreb on October 30, 2009 at 12:37 PM

This is just sickening. They want to take as much as they can.

WisCon on October 30, 2009 at 12:37 PM

Surtax on Individuals and Small Businesses (Page 336)

Corporate 1099-MISC Information Reporting (Page 344)

Application of “More Likely Than Not” Rule (Page 357)

I’m not clear on the last two, but I have a feeling this is going to cost me a bunch of money.

forest on October 30, 2009 at 12:38 PM

There was another article about the absurdity of the opt-out. Your state still has to pay in. You’d just be denying the citizens benefits.

Will some fall into the same stimulus bill trap we saw earlier this year? That’s a sucker’s punch, for sure.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:38 PM

Anyone who thinks this is a good idea is either a Democrat politician or a complete fool.

Or someone so drunk on a tincture of moral righteousness to believe that healthcare isn’t a commodity but a right.

There really are people out there who do not get it. They do not believe that medical personnel and supplies are of limited quantity, that there really aren’t enough doctors and beds and medicine to go around, and who believe with their very soul in the moral imperative that private insurance should be outlawed.

Revenant on October 30, 2009 at 12:38 PM

Let it pass. Then let the Conservative Independents sweep the House and Senate in 2010, repeal this peice of crap bill and refund the taxes (in cash) paid by the working citizenry.

Key West Reader on October 30, 2009 at 12:39 PM

Folks, remember, this is also on top of the Bush tax breaks that are set to expire soon. Add this and that, and presto, we have the largest tax hike in all of US History!

Johnnyreb on October 30, 2009 at 12:37 PM

Tax on what? There aren’t any capital gains. The tax base is eroded.

Heck, even the rich are hurting. Real estate for the prime properties are tanking.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:39 PM

I’m for a public option. I’m one of those who believes in this.
AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

A public option will eventually lead to single payer government run health care. Is that what you want? Yes or no?

a capella on October 30, 2009 at 12:40 PM

SouthernGent on October 30, 2009 at 12:26 PM

I understand your sentiment — she’s an enemy of the United States of America.

D2Boston on October 30, 2009 at 12:40 PM

Anybody else get the feeling that alot of people are being led to believe “deficit neutral” means “won’t cost anything”?

forest on October 30, 2009 at 12:41 PM

They will never tax my condoms.

faraway on October 30, 2009 at 12:41 PM

Folks, remember, this is also on top of the Bush tax breaks that are set to expire soon. Add this and that, and presto, we have the largest tax hike in all of US History!

Johnnyreb on October 30, 2009 at 12:37 PM

Well, I do agree with the general direction. I have absolutely no interest in living in a country that feels no moral obligation regarding the health of its citizens.

I think the system simply used to work better. Right now? It’s not. There are too many people falling out of the system.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:41 PM

Tax on what?

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:39 PM

Income. The marginal rates are going back up across the board unless action is taken.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

A public option will eventually lead to single payer government run health care. Is that what you want? Yes or no?

a capella on October 30, 2009 at 12:40 PM

I personally wouldn’t care. However, no in a general sense.

I was hoping for a very simple major medical/catastrophe plan.

This is just too complex for words. There is no way Congress can oversee such a program.

We have our human limits.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

I’m for a public option. I’m one of those who believes in this. However, this bill is an unwieldy big program that appears to be absolutely impossible to implement properly. It’s the worst of big gov’t thinking.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:33 PM

How do you think anything else could be implemented? You’re expecting the “best” of big government thinking? Some kind of public-private partnership where everyone sings around the campfire and an MRI in every pot?

How’d that work out with Medicare (bankrupt)? Social Security (bankrupt)? Medicaid (bankrupt)? Every government solution out there is bankrupt and systemically incapable of providing an efficient solution to whatever problem they’re supposed to address. And here’s one reason why: when bureaucracies behave rationally, they grow by accretion, protecting their least competent aspects at the detriment to the most competent; when businesses behave rationally, they grow by extension, favoring their most competent aspects to the detriment of the least competent.

This is what government does. It can do nothing else.

spmat on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

With that list in mind, I can only imagine what else will eventually be included as taxable health care equipment.

Bishop on October 30, 2009 at 12:23 PM

Betcha it exempts MRI and CT machines, EKG machines, and ultrasound machines. Guess who makes those?

rockmom on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

The next Tea Parties need to occur in the middle of the night wherever it is that Pelosi and Reid and the rest sleep. If these creeps can simply blow off one-to-two million people protesting in DC, maybe it’s time to raise the level of protest from “talking truth to power” to “harassment.” These b***ards want to seize control of our lives. If we need to be less free, then they need to be made less comfortable.

Aitch748 on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

Income. The marginal rates are going back up across the board unless action is taken.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

Yeah, but that affects the top income earners, right?

I think the real danger is spelled out here. They have figured out to apply charges everywhere to hide tax increases.

It’s a wierd way to implement flat taxes.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:44 PM

I have absolutely no interest in living in a country that feels no moral obligation regarding the health of its citizens.

I think the system simply used to work better. Right now? It’s not. There are too many people falling out of the system.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:41 PM

You do understand the difference between health care and health insurance, right? Nobody, repeat nobody, in this country is denied health care.

faraway on October 30, 2009 at 12:45 PM

And watch those tax rules changes. I’ve been banging this drum for awhile because I’m convinced most of their tax increases will be carried out by expanding the application of existing taxes and killing deductions – especially for 1099 people and small businessmen. Others will be tacked on as “fees” “surcharges” and “penalties”.

It’s all one big tax increase – especially focused on entrepreneurs.

forest on October 30, 2009 at 12:45 PM

There really are people out there who do not get it. They do not believe that medical personnel and supplies are of limited quantity, that there really aren’t enough doctors and beds and medicine to go around, and who believe with their very soul in the moral imperative that private insurance should be outlawed.

Revenant on October 30, 2009 at 12:38 PM

These are the same people who believe that we can run a giant welfare state and also have open borders.

AZCoyote on October 30, 2009 at 12:45 PM

Yeah, but that affects the top income earners, right?

It effects everyone. Bush cut taxes for all income brackets. Once those cuts sunset, everyone’s income tax percentage will automatically increase.

Revenant on October 30, 2009 at 12:46 PM

This is the final act of an insane congress.

I can see small business contracting instead of expanding when you consider the new taxes and mandates coming to light here.

Plumbers that may want to add a new truck and employee will reconsider. A case may be made the plumber will now stay small, work enough in a year to stay under the tax thresholds and sit for a few months a year.

The incentive to earn and expand will be trumped by the knowledge he works just to pay taxes and benefits.

FireBlogger on October 30, 2009 at 12:46 PM

After all, who do you think will end up paying for the medical-device taxes? It won’t be insurers or doctors:

Not entirely true — they will lose revenue because of it.

Count to 10 on October 30, 2009 at 12:46 PM

What is “qualifying coverage”? I know, go read it, but as soon as I do, they change it.

Sue on October 30, 2009 at 12:46 PM

You do understand the difference between health care and health insurance, right? Nobody, repeat nobody, in this country is denied health care.

faraway on October 30, 2009 at 12:45 PM

Yes, but it’s awful right now, faraway. We have people literally dying in emergency rooms in LA. They dump people in front of the Mission here, who clearly need to be hospitalized.

Well, anyway, enough of my soft-heart stuff. I do agree with you all that this bill is ridiculous.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:47 PM

rockmom on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

It probably exempts every medical device made by G.E., and all its affiliated companies.

AZCoyote on October 30, 2009 at 12:47 PM

Betcha it exempts MRI and CT machines, EKG machines, and ultrasound machines. Guess who makes those?

rockmom on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

GE has already been the recipient of Obama’s generosity and will stand to gain more under cap-n-trade.

fourdeucer on October 30, 2009 at 12:48 PM

I wonder if there is any way some conservative entrepreneur can come up with an inexpsnsive “non-insurance” plan that will pay for catastrophic health care costs while letting people pay for their own routine care. I have seen reports of a few of these so-called prepaid health plans run by doctors, though they cover routine office visits too. If it isn’t called insurance, it won’t be subject to these new rules and taxes, it can be sold nationwide, and conservatives who don’t support this junk legislation could all enroll in it as a protest move.

rockmom on October 30, 2009 at 12:48 PM

I personally wouldn’t care [for a public option].

There is no way Congress can oversee such a program.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:43 PM

It seems your thoughts are contradicting themselves in a single comment.

Catastrophic health insurance is available now. Buy a plan with 10K deductible. Tear down the walls to sell insurance and treat individual purchases the sames as business, and there you go.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:48 PM

I should say, you cannot expect government bureaucracies and businesses to be able to work together systemically to solve any problem in the long term. Governments only work when they play umpire: establish the rules of the game (laws) and watch the players impartially. ObamaCare, or any kind of big government solution, does not do this: it puts the umpire in the role of a player and warps outcomes inevitably in favor of the umpire’s play-style, i.e. to bureaucratic solutions.

Bureaucratic solutions seldom work for large-scale problems.

spmat on October 30, 2009 at 12:49 PM

Medicine Cabinet Tax (Page 324)

WTF? Look it up.

Del Dolemonte on October 30, 2009 at 12:50 PM

Yeah, but that affects the top income earners, right?

I think the real danger is spelled out here. They have figured out to apply charges everywhere to hide tax increases.

It’s a wierd way to implement flat taxes.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:44 PM

Top Bracket: 35% => 39.6%
Bottom Bracket: 10% => 15%

Flat tax? What are talking about? Flat taxes are not going to come from Dems.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 12:50 PM

We have people literally dying in emergency rooms in LA.

I am speechless

faraway on October 30, 2009 at 12:50 PM

I thought Obama said he wouldn’t raise taxes just cut on spending. No hope and change… //sarc

vcferlita on October 30, 2009 at 12:51 PM

I think the system simply used to work better. Right now? It’s not. There are too many people falling out of the system.

By what standard are you making the determination that “the system” is not “working?”

The fact that some people do not have the wherewithall to purchase health insurance does not then mean that others should be forced at gunpoint to pick up the tab for them or else face government penalties.

Some people don’t have the wherewithall to buy food either. That means, by your logic, that “the system” is failing because those individuals (and that’s what we’re talking about here – we exist as individuals and not as some mindless herd of bodies) won’t buy food. You would say “can’t.” Nonsense. Unless they’re physically disabled or severely mentally unstable, they have the capacity to work and to find work. There is no “free” lunch.

Does this then mean that we have to destroy the private system of the food distribution and production in this country? Should we nationalize the food supply to help the comparatively tiny portion of individuals who for whatever reason can’t figure out what the other 4/5 of the population have figured out?

If people don’t have a “right” to food, then they don’t have a “right” to health insurance funded by me just because you say so.

The system works fine for most people. It’s those who can’t figure it out (again, 1 of 5 people roughly) who want to “tear it all down? and replace it with something that only benefits them and nobody else.

Good Lt on October 30, 2009 at 12:52 PM

We have people literally dying in emergency rooms in LA.
AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:47 PM

Yeah, a gunshot to the head usually has a way of doing that.

*rolleyes*

upinak on October 30, 2009 at 12:52 PM

What is their problem with Health Savings Account?

Cindy Munford on October 30, 2009 at 12:52 PM

Here come the taxes!

fap, fap, fap

/democrats

LibTired on October 30, 2009 at 12:54 PM

Tampons already cost a fortune — now they want us to pay even more? For something we HAVE to buy? Why isn’t this called extortion? That’s what it is.

I see also where reading glasses, sunglasses and contact lenses are on the list. No regular prescription glasses — yet. Rest assured, they will be added once they see the need to squeeze more $$$ out of us.

NoLeftTurn on October 30, 2009 at 12:54 PM

. We have people literally dying in emergency rooms in LA. They dump people in front of the Mission here, who clearly need to be hospitalized.

.

AnninCA on October 30, 2009 at 12:47 PM

People die in emergency rooms everyday. And it’s the law that people dumped must be treated.

You. Are. A. First. Class. Idiot.

Knucklehead on October 30, 2009 at 12:55 PM

This will encourage businesses to keep their employee base small and outsource many functions overseas.

But but but those companies are OBLIGATED to hire only American workers and to operate at a loss. In perpetuity. Because of somebody’s “feelings.”

That’s “free market capitalism,” dammit.

Good Lt on October 30, 2009 at 12:56 PM

Medicine Cabinet Tax (Page 324)

WTF? Look it up.

Del Dolemonte on October 30, 2009 at 12:50 PM

It sounds like something Pelosi ought to be opposed to. I’ve always wondered what ol’ buggy eyes has in her medicine cabinet.

forest on October 30, 2009 at 12:56 PM

Tampons already cost a fortune

NoLeftTurn on October 30, 2009 at 12:54 PM

Keep your taxes out of my vagina.

faraway on October 30, 2009 at 12:58 PM

What is their problem with Health Savings Account?

Cindy Munford on October 30, 2009 at 12:52 PM

It allows individuals to make their own decisions about how to spend their health care dollars. Statists don’t like that. They want government to control everything, because they run the government and they think they’re smarter and better than the rest of us. We can’t be trusted to make decisions for ourselves.

AZCoyote on October 30, 2009 at 12:59 PM

Good thing we have a extremely low deficit and a robust economy/sarc

Seriously, any of you history buffs out there ever wonder what it would be like to witness one of History’s turning points?

The first landing at Jamestown, Washington crossing the Delaware, The seven days, ..

Well here you are! Ain’t it wonderful!!!

Juno77 on October 30, 2009 at 1:00 PM

Cindy Munford on October 30, 2009 at 12:52 PM

They’re efficient, they work, and they don’t require government thus they must be abolished.

DerKrieger on October 30, 2009 at 1:01 PM

The system does work right now. This is about two things. Medicare going broke and a massive government for control of the people.
The system needs to be fix, insurance is not accessable enough but healthcare could not possibly be more accessible. This bill will cause people to die and die painfully and broke.

ORconservative on October 30, 2009 at 1:01 PM

Revolution is the only answer. Pelosi, Reid, Obama and much of the far Left don’t care if the Democrats get wiped out in 2010 because it’s highly unlikely the GOP can ever elect enough of a majority to abolish this nonsense and when the public is forced into government dependency then the Democrats can emerge as the champions and saviors of our health care much as they made themselves into the protectors of Social Security and Medicare. They believe once they accomplish that, then they will be in power permanently.

Thus, revolution or secession is the only answer. I refuse to be a wage slave to another American citizen or illegal alien. I’ve been angry with our government before but never have I hated it. Now I do.

DerKrieger on October 30, 2009 at 1:05 PM

When a “wild” animal, let’s say a lion, lives in a zoo since it was born, it is incapable of being returned to the wild. The zoo environment provides for all the lion’s needs without the lion having to do anything to meet those needs. The lion must rely on the zoo for its survival.

The welfare state is a zoo for humans…only if “liberals” understood this simple fact.

WashJeff on October 30, 2009 at 1:07 PM

If you drive a car-car I’ll tax the street
If you try to sit-sit I’ll tax your seat
If you get too cold I’ll tax the heat
If you take a walk I’ll tax your feet
Tax man

Attila (Pillage Idiot) on October 30, 2009 at 1:08 PM

Juno77 on October 30, 2009 at 1:00 PM

Yes, it reminds me of that old Chinese curse: May you live in interesting times.

AZCoyote on October 30, 2009 at 1:08 PM

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