Pelosi backs off Medicare rates in “consumer option”
posted at 9:30 am on October 29, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
Nancy Pelosi and the House Democratic Caucus will unveil their version of ObamaCare this morning, and the New York Times reports some significant changes made in the last few days. First, the “public option,” which had changed to the quasi-Orwellian name of “competitive option,” now goes the full 1984 to the “consumer option.” Gone, though, is the reliance on Medicare rates for the government-funded coverage plan, as moderate Democrats from rural districts insisted that hospitals would go out of business:
Under pressure from moderate-to-conservative members of the House Democratic caucus, Speaker Nancy Pelosi has decided to propose a government-run insurance plan that would negotiate rates with doctors and hospitals, rather than using prices set by the government, aides said Wednesday.
Ms. Pelosi said the public plan, which she prefers to call a “consumer option,” would compete with private insurers. But the speaker was apparently unable to muster the votes needed for the “robust” liberal version of a public plan, which she has repeatedly said would save more money for consumers and the government.
Members of the House Democratic leadership team offered these details of their bill, to be unveiled on Thursday. It would provide coverage to 35 million or 36 million people. The 10-year cost of expanding coverage would be less than the $900 billion ceiling suggested by President Obama. The cost would be offset by new taxes and by cutbacks in Medicare, so the bill would not increase the federal budget deficit in the next 10 years or in the decade after that.
The new bill, like an earlier version, retains a surtax on high-income people, but increases the thresholds. The tax would hit married couples with adjusted gross incomes exceeding $1 million a year and individuals over $500,000 — just three-tenths of 1 percent of all households, Democrats said.
“Consumer option”? Any choice made by consumers is a “consumer option”. It’s an almost meaningless phrase, except for what it hides. Pelosi’s newest nomenclature hides the fact that consumers don’t pay for it — taxpayers pay for it.
Ending the Medicare reimbursement rates will certainly gain Pelosi some votes, but that sounds fishy. The bottom-line number didn’t change from last week to this. How did the House bill calculate the costs of negotiated rates as opposed to the Medicare rates they used in their earlier calculations? How did that not increase the overall cost of the bill?
Well, it turns out that Pelosi & Co have decided to shift more of those costs onto the state. Earlier versions had people at 133% of the poverty line eligible for Medicaid, the costs of which states largely have to bear. The new version hikes that to 150% of poverty line, forcing more people onto state rolls rather than federal. That allows Pelosi to claim some cost savings, but the public burden felt by taxpayers will increase, thanks to unfunded mandates on the states.
For that matter, increasing the surtax thresholds should have cut back on their revenue expectations. Did they increase revenues elsewhere to maintain deficit balance? If so, where? Here’s one place where Pelosi cribbed from Max Baucus in the Senate:
The new House bill would also impose annual fees on manufacturers of medical devices like heart pacemakers and artificial hips. The fees — in effect, excise taxes — would total $20 billion over 10 years.
Taxing innovation — the Democratic way to better health care!
Hopefully, the CBO will score this one quickly and answer the big questions. Meanwhile, be sure to read Keith Hennessey’s analysis of upcoming Senate votes on ObamaCare.
Update: Politico notes another problem with the bill, which is that it runs surpluses its first five years — mainly because it doesn’t pay benefits until 2013 — and then deficits thereafter (via Geoff A):
The CBO analysis will show that the bill runs surpluses in the first five years and deficits in the second, making it deficit neutral during the first decade. BUT those late decade deficits were raising questions about whether the CBO will be able to declare the second 10 years deficit neutral.
It would appear that this is the same problem seen in the Baucus plan. It uses a head start on revenues to mask deficit spending overall. Also, the new Pelosi bill reneges on the White House agreement with pharmaceutical manufacturers, and it also engages in the same dishonest Doctor Fix strategy that flopped so badly in the Senate:
A permanent doc fix will be carved out of the reform bill and introduced separately today without pay-fors. That’s not going to make docs happy because even if the doc fix bill passes the House, the Senate has already killed a similar proposal. Drug makers are also getting shellacked. They’re looking at between $125 billion and $150 billion in cuts – almost twice the $80 billion they agreed to under the White House deal.
These aren’t even new ways to be dishonest.










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Trick or….Oh,no, no treats. Just tricks.
Wethal on October 29, 2009 at 9:32 AM
Put lipstick on a pig….
tottoritodd on October 29, 2009 at 9:34 AM
But healthcare will still be free, right?
Bishop on October 29, 2009 at 9:36 AM
Nancy is just a big bag of mashed up meat with lipstick or something.
Akzed on October 29, 2009 at 9:37 AM
Cosmetic surgery and treatments? Botox? Collagen?
That picture looks like the one Drudge had enlarged a few weeks ago. You could see little red welts along her upper lip. Since she’s a little old for zits, and acne doesn’t usually appear in straight lines, it was obvious the picture was taken after she’d had collagen injections with a needle to plump out the wrinkles.
The camera can be so cruel in a digital age.
Wethal on October 29, 2009 at 9:37 AM
Ok, so it’s the same as the Baucus bill. Doesn’t that mean it’ll never pass the Senate? So why are we wasting our time?
Doughboy on October 29, 2009 at 9:37 AM
Please don’t insult barnyard animals when referring to Pelosi
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:38 AM
The “Consumer Option” —-> Now with 100% more mandatory!
LibTired on October 29, 2009 at 9:38 AM
When will it be time for Nancy to take the blue pill?
tim c on October 29, 2009 at 9:38 AM
Hospitals will go out of business?
How is that possible?
Aren’t they in business to help people? Shouldn’t “profits” be optional?
After all, you can eat good will and feeling good about helping people.
Apparently, it’s what Nancy Pelosi sits down to munch on in her palatial mansion.
NoDonkey on October 29, 2009 at 9:39 AM
Nancy is just a big bag of
mashed up meatfecal material with lipstick or something.Akzed on October 29, 2009 at 9:37 AM
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:39 AM
+1
cmsinaz on October 29, 2009 at 9:40 AM
That pic is scary! She is such a Hagula.
OmahaConservative on October 29, 2009 at 9:41 AM
LOL…Provides 110% of the minimum USDA daily requirement
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:41 AM
The bill tries to do too much and is going to end up upsetting everyone. The progressives are upset. They really thought it would be a cadillac plan at peanut prices. Medicare folks are upset. They’ll view every interaction now through paranoid eyes. They’ll be convinced people are trying to not treat them fairly to save money. The middle-class will hate it. They’ll be convinced their own private plan increases are due to this. The poor people will laugh. Who could afford current Medicare rates anyway? That’s around 500 bucks a month. If they had that? They wouldn’t need insurance.
It’s a bad piece of reform legislation that will not accomplish the goals.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 9:41 AM
I want Billy Tauzin rolled hard
let his rolling be a lesson to others who would cit a deal and leave Americans to pay the price
that is all
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 9:42 AM
/cut a deal
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 9:42 AM
There isn’t enough Vaseline in the world to smear on the camera lense to hide the mileage ion that face.
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:42 AM
Seriously, you can slap a bow tie on a pile of sh!t and call it art if you want. We all know it’s still a pile of sh!t.
milwife88 on October 29, 2009 at 9:43 AM
lens
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:43 AM
ps based on my COBRA rates it turns out I have a ‘Cadillac plan’
now all I have is a United Health Care PPO, so if my plan si the Cadillac we are all frakked
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 9:43 AM
If you don’t peg it to Medicare rates, then it will be MORE insolvent than Medicare. The problem with the plan is that taxpayers will have to pay the claims.
Call it whatever you want, but you are saddling future generations with a liability without first paying for the current Medicare liability that our country suffers under now.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 9:44 AM
I get a stronger feeling that this will not pass every time they try and change the name. The “stimulus/recovery” bill isn’t doing Jack and more people are starting ask why. Now they want to spend ANOTHER trillion dollars.
Mord on October 29, 2009 at 9:44 AM
This is smoke and mirrors – collecting taxes and fees for ObamaCare for five years without providing benefits.
Now … I’ll tell you what will happen.
As the revenue from those new ObamaCare taxes and fees start rolling in – the Democrats will spend them on initiatives completely unrelated to ObamaCare. Things like – oh more Pork for their special interest groups.
That means OCare won’t be deficit neutral in even YEAR ONE.
I feel like I’m watching the Rodney King riots – with the Democrats “looting” the National Treasury and the Taxpayer.
Whatever. It’s like I tell my wife … “Go ahead if you want that Mazerati so bad – go buy it. We’ll only pay notes on it for two months before it’s repossessed!”
LOL
And that’s EXACTLY what will happen here. This WILL BANKRUPT our economy and when it does – it’s going to cause severe civil unrest when people are denied their benefits. And just like the sub-prime crisis – the titty babies in the Democratic party will find a way to blame the GOP for it.
HondaV65 on October 29, 2009 at 9:45 AM
but the private insurance companies are the ones who make up for the shxtty Medicare rates now Thacker!
they typically pay 140% of what a hospitalization costs, this is to make up for Medicare which pays less than 50% of whayt it costs
if there are no more private insurers to pick up the slack, we will wind up with both less hospitals and doctors and higher taxes for less service
a lose/lose
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 9:46 AM
I had nothing to do with this.
/the camera
LibTired on October 29, 2009 at 9:47 AM
Congress has lost sight of its original goal which was to try and slow the growth of health spending. Their proposals will send it over the cliff. Instead of 1/6 of the economy, it will be 1/4 or 1/3. They are going to require health plans cover far more than is covered now, sending the cost skyrocketing. Scrap this pig and lets get back to catestrophic coverage and people pay for routine maintenance.
bopbottle on October 29, 2009 at 9:48 AM
That’s about half the funding for this bill. I agree that something’s off if they scrapped this AND raised the threshold for the high income surtax, but the bill’s cost isn’t skyrocketing.
BadgerHawk on October 29, 2009 at 9:48 AM
I hope Governor Schwarzenegger sends another one of those F.U. letters to Queen Nancy. This bill will put the final nail in the fiscal coffin of California.
rockmom on October 29, 2009 at 9:48 AM
Pelosi and Reid both say they have the votes. Pundits shilling for the filthy lying coward are out there openly weeping for the cameras and declaring that we finally have completed the journey for universal healthcare started in 1940…..
So if all of this is true, why don’t they STFU and vote this through now? It
highhopes on October 29, 2009 at 9:48 AM
Pelosi’s as sharp as a bag of wet mice.
Meric1837 on October 29, 2009 at 9:48 AM
This is an example that people don’t understand this debate. I’m not singling Ann out for any reason other than to illustrate a point.
When she says ‘Medicare rates’. . . it isn’t the rate that the ‘consumer’ pays. When she ties it to ‘medicare rates’, she means DOCTOR REIMBURSEMENT RATES.
This is why it is a bad bill altogether. People talk about premiums as though that is the ‘health care cost’. The ‘health care cost’ is what you have to pay the doctor to get well.
MEDICARE PAYS DOCTORS LESS FOR THE SAME PROCEDURE THAT PRIVATE INSURANCE PAYS. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH PREMIUMS THAT PEOPLE PAY.
Pelosi doesn’t want people to understand what she’s talking about. Nobody understands what she means by ‘medicare rates’ or ‘negotiated rates’ except people in the industry.
Those rates have nothing to do with the CONSUMER. Those rates only deal with what you pay the doctor. Medicare underpays – that’s why you couldn’t ‘compete’ when you calculate the premiums that people have to pay for the plan.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 9:49 AM
LOL..camera close ups look like a Grand Canyon airplane tour
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:49 AM
A lot of what is lose/lose is due to the healthcare costs. We can’t forget this reality.
Here’s a typical example. Friend of mine has a sister with diabetes on disability pay. She cannot afford her medications. She has not yet been able to get any help from the state. She’s not quite old enough to qualify for medicare.
So, she ends up hospitalized. 3 time in 2 years. And we’re not talking small stuff. In for several days each time.
That is due to lack of medication.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 9:49 AM
But remember being a Cadillac in the Age of Obama is not saying much :-)
johnsteele on October 29, 2009 at 9:50 AM
So, if I pay less for a widget, I can charge less. If I pay 50 dollars for a doctor visit, and private insurance pays 100 dollars for the same visit, then who will have to charge more in premium or go out of business (or in the ‘consumer option’ stick it to the taxpayer?)
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM
Mice have very sharp teeth, wet or dry.
BadgerHawk on October 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM
I get it. I also thought I had read that the subsidies were eliminated.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM
Hagula
Hagula’s ugly sister
OmahaConservative on October 29, 2009 at 9:52 AM
Pelosi and Reid claim they have the votes. Pundits are breaking down in tears as they go in front of cameras to declare that the universal healthcoverage journey started in 1940 has finally come to an end under this president and Congress.
My question is simple, if all of that is true and it is not going to cost Americans one more penny or add to the deficit as the filthy lying coward keeps claiming…. What’s the hold-up why is there so much blue on blue friction? Something isn’t adding up and I don’t mean the savings claims.
highhopes on October 29, 2009 at 9:52 AM
LOL too!
I hope governors and state representatives are keeping their eye on this ball. States already transfer an insane amount of money from tax payers to the feds to cover Medicaid. Here in NC, I believe county governments still transfer a portion of the money they take from property owners to the the state to help cover the fed’s bills. So, shifting more burden to the states/county/property owners, will hopefully stir up some #@*%!
j_galt on October 29, 2009 at 9:52 AM
Hmmm Nancy the lipstick on a pig pelosi has no clue on Governing a Nation!. argg
hawkman on October 29, 2009 at 9:53 AM
If you think you’re unlucky, imagine being the bathroom mirror at Pelosi’s house.
Imagine what you’ve seen.
Imagine going blind.
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 9:53 AM
This is why Diane Feinstein in CA expressed reservations about voting for the bill.
Plus, this bill covers illegal immigrants, too. That will be the final nail in our coffin.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 9:54 AM
Saw an ad on TV this AM sponsored by some senior group and Joe Lieberman. Boy did he smash the public option being paid for by cuts in Medicare. Had a bunch of seniors on it talking about they had paid in blood (WWII pics in the background) and dollars for their promised medical care. A very strong ad that would be nice to see on more stations. If anything passes that even hints at touching Medicare dollars, we are going to see a ballot box revolt.
Johnnyreb on October 29, 2009 at 9:54 AM
Would a Horse Turd by any other name still smell like $&#t??
BigWyo on October 29, 2009 at 9:56 AM
Yes, they are against the bill because if they did have a ‘consumer option’ tied to Medicare rates, they could undercut private insurance.
If they undercut private insurance and drive them out of business so that the ‘consumer option’ is the only thing left, then our hospitals and doctors will have to accept less for their services.
This is why I’ve been saying that if they have a public option, the doctors and hospitals will go bankrupt and shut down. I don’t care about the insurance companies. . . but I do understand the important role they play in this system. Medicare reimburses less than the cost of the services. . . so doctors opt out of new Medicare recipients because of the low reimbursement rates.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:00 AM
Don’t witches start to spin uncontrollably before they disappear? Halloween is coming up.
Kissmygrits on October 29, 2009 at 10:01 AM
meaning her concern was that doctors and hospitals would go out of business if a ‘public option’ was tied to Medicare reimbursement rates. People love to hate insurance companies. But insurance companies pay a LOT of money to doctors and hospitals in this country. Without their payments we would not have as quality of coverage.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:01 AM
Nancy will stop at nothing to take home more free crap for her parasitic constituents in San Francisco.
rplat on October 29, 2009 at 10:01 AM
Well, someone better yell uncle. If they cannot negotiate, then the country will end up with a single-payer system.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:02 AM
A Grand Canyon air tour is a thing of beauty pal. -_+
thomasaur on October 29, 2009 at 10:03 AM
The issue is transferring the cost to states. Remember, CA is worse than broke.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:04 AM
I can’t wait for my free healthcare
I cant wait for my free downpayment on that house
I can’t wait for some free Obama cash for my new car
I can’t wait for free unemployment Obama cash
I can’t wait for my free Obama food
Free, free, free, free……everything is now free thanks to Obama.
I can’t wait to move somewhere else, so that I don’t have to pay for everybody else’s free stuff.
PatriotRider on October 29, 2009 at 10:05 AM
Whack the 17th amendment. This is nuts and is going to crush the states.
WashJeff on October 29, 2009 at 10:05 AM
Insurance companies negotiate all the time with hospitals and doctors. The hospital takes into account their underpaying Medicare people and uninsured and proposes rates to overcome their shortfall there. Insurance companies then make a counter offer which is not as much but still much higher than Medicare, Medicaid, or no insurance.
Doctors and hospitals like the insurance companies. Without them, you wouldn’t have doctors and hospitals like we have today. But it is good that they negotiate because when you need heart surgery is not when you should be haggling with the surgeon over the price. . . insurance companies do that for you well in advance when you are completely healthy.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:06 AM
Good point…I should of mentioned some ugly fissures somewhere
Jeff from WI on October 29, 2009 at 10:06 AM
Repeal 1913.
BadgerHawk on October 29, 2009 at 10:07 AM
Hey Commies in CONgress, we’re not “consumers.” We’re American citizens and we’re your boss.
flyfisher on October 29, 2009 at 10:08 AM
That’s a separate issue. Medicaid is the unfunded mandate to the states to provide health care insurance for the poor. The states have to pay for the check that DC cashes when it comes to Medicaid.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:08 AM
Not enought coffee yet. Forgot that the whole year sucked.
WashJeff on October 29, 2009 at 10:09 AM
This is just more BS from Pelosi.
dogsoldier on October 29, 2009 at 10:09 AM
AND WHOSE FAULT IS THAT??????????????????????????????????? THE DEMOCRATS IN CALIFORNIA; THAT’S WHO…
Khun Joe on October 29, 2009 at 10:10 AM
Thacker
I have worked in health insurance for 20+ years I am a fan.
:)
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:10 AM
ha! Thanks ginaswo :)
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:11 AM
Speaking of…she just looks she has halitosis.
SouthernGent on October 29, 2009 at 10:11 AM
So who will research and produce vaccines? Zimbabwe?
Tom
marinetbryant on October 29, 2009 at 10:12 AM
Precisely why we fled KalifoЯnia in 2005.
OmahaConservative on October 29, 2009 at 10:12 AM
Lots of people believe that the “public” or “consumer option” means that health care is free. That the government will take over all health care bills and no one will have to pay for health care anymore except those that work for a company that already pays for it…
(And where does dental care come in all of this?)
albill on October 29, 2009 at 10:13 AM
anninca
disabled people are eligible for medicare before age 65
have your friend apply
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:14 AM
I refer her as “Coffee Breath.”
flyfisher on October 29, 2009 at 10:15 AM
Let’s review:
1. Trillion dollars we don’t/won’t have.
2. Will eliminate the competition it’s supposedly creating
3. Will only cover 1/2 of the currently uninsured.
Uh, cut the sh*t, you liars and crooks. Who do you think you’re fooling?
marklmail on October 29, 2009 at 10:15 AM
Five years of “surpluses” (= higher taxes for NOTHING) to “balance” five years of deficits, just to fool the CBO.
Let’s make a deal, Fancy Nancy! You pay me $50,000 a year starting now, and move into my house in 2014. What? Why not?
Same reason we don’t want your pay now, buy later plan!
Steve Z on October 29, 2009 at 10:16 AM
Your friend would likely be able to pay for her own medications if the government got the hell out of the healthcare issue altogether, allowed interstate purchase of policies, slashed policy mandates across the board, and instituted “loser pays” and other tort reform measures.
All of which could be done with a couple of separate small bills in a week or two.
Youngs98 on October 29, 2009 at 10:18 AM
It’s one of those permanent versus not deals? Yes, I know. Her sister knows. The hospital even knows. She can’t seem to get her *hit together with all the needed paperwork.
It’s sad.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:19 AM
Um, isn’t Empress Pelosi aware of the fact that the states are broke too? Trying to look like the good guy (free health care for all!) while making the states look like the bad guy (cuts to other services and higher taxes) does not wash anymore, Nancy. You are a fraud.
rbj on October 29, 2009 at 10:19 AM
anninca
the subsidies they say they are eliminating are Medicare Advantage
now the problem there is not only does Medicare Advantge give seniors services like you know HEARING AIDS and EYEGLASSES something ALL seniors need, they ALSO serve the POOR
The problem is those poor DONT KNOW they HAVE medicare advantage!
that was part of the deal the private insurers cut, that they would serve the poor in exchange for getting to sell their products to Medicare recipients with govt subsidy
the reason Dems went along then, was rural areas NEED medicare advantage b/c NO PROVIDERS in rural areas will take medicare rates, not enough doctors/patients for them to survive on that
remember Joel in Northern Exposure? there was no dr in that town in Alaska, and he wanted to go earn a bundle in NYC and who could blame him? so to lure providers they pad the medicare rates in rural areas with Advantage
so with Medicare Advantage for example 600,000 seniors in TX get their coverage. How many are the subsidized poor? Dunno but in rural areas it is A LOT
The reason the blue dog dems are fighting the medicare tie in rates for the public option is they KNOW it will mean the loss of medical care for their constituents
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:20 AM
anninca
i am very good at that paperwork for sad reasons but that is another story
pop by my blog and comment if you need a hand
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:21 AM
the really sad thing is the new nifty life saving meds will not be produced if this goes thru IMO
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:22 AM
anninca
one of the things that burns me up about this is how the WH cut that deal to PREVENT RX importation from Canada which would help many many many oh so many on rx costs!
frakkin Billy Tauzin arrrrgle
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:23 AM
ginaswo on October 29, 2009 at 10:20 AM
well done ginaswo! The whole Medicare Advantage thing is hilarious. They try to demonize insurance companies by saying it is a subsidy for insurance companies. . . but they don’t appreciate the extra benefits that these people get for FREE!
Medicare Advantage plans cost the recipient ZERO, ZIP, NADA. Guess who likes those plans? THE POOR! Guess what will happen if they cut the subsidies. . . it won’t be free anymore and guess who will be hurt? THE POOR!
They are making this change under the guise that they are hurting the insurance companies, but they are only going to be hurting the poor people who get MA plans because they are free.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:24 AM
And ironically enough, we got a bill that controls everything but costs.
I want to spend a lot of time looking at how the POp is set up, particularly the language (if any) about how it has to be funded 100% by premia or copays and can’t receive other sources of government funding. I also want to know where all the operating costs are reported (they should all be in one place, not buried in the GSA budget, etc.).
DrSteve on October 29, 2009 at 10:25 AM
Won’t any of these front loaded tax bills be deadly for Democrats in 2010? Years of increased taxes, fees, fines, etc. before any benefit is felt whatsoever would have to really hit home for almost every working stiff in the country.
joedoe on October 29, 2009 at 10:26 AM
Thanks!
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:27 AM
batterup on October 29, 2009 at 10:28 AM
I’m convinced it will absolutely floor people, but only if it increases their costs directly while not providing benefits.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:28 AM
I agree. There are a lot of things we can do to lower rx costs. I like the drug importation issue and have advised my clients in border towns to cross the border to get scripts filled.
I also think that they could reduce the number of years they allow drug patents. If they allowed generics to come out sooner, that would cut prices without cutting too much of their profit initially. Generics are a key answer to lowering drug costs.
There are a LOT of small solutions that could help. These guys want one big solution that will make a bad situation worse. If they weren’t so liberal, they wouldn’t have a problem passing them.
ThackerAgency on October 29, 2009 at 10:28 AM
I don’t believe that Pelosi is deliberately using the technical language to confuse people. I believe she can’t get out of the language to communicate effectively.
That was part of the problem all along. Every single Dem speaker for the reform bill was, in fact, very inarticulate. They failed to explain. Then they really confused people.
And, hence, the Townhalls were raucus.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:30 AM
Oh, rates are going up, I assure you. Between guaranteed issue, subsidies (if any remain) and 30 million new insured, you can forget about any of this reducing either the median family’s premium or the share of GDP spent on health care.
DrSteve on October 29, 2009 at 10:31 AM
One of things the Democrats are going to be weak on is how ObamaCare will impact Military retirees and Vets. Certain commitments have been made to them in the past – but I don’t see how the Democrats can honor all the promises made.
For instance – here’s a “menu” of options for screwing military folks from the CBO and I’m willing to bet the Democrats will embed these into one or both of their bills …
As a military retiree, myself I have no problems with these options. I pay $3 for Nexium every month at Walmart and the drug costs almost $200. There’s a problem there – I’m not paying enough. However, I think this is probably the way most private health insurance runs and it’s indicative of a problem with the cost sharing structure of our health insurance. These kinds of things can be addressed in a comprehensive health care reform which has, as a goal, lowering costs of health care overall – not simply income redistribution to Democratic voting blocs.
Having said that – I’m NOT williing to pay more, or see any of my benefits cut back to fund medical coverage for illegal aliens or to fund abortion. I’m not willing to have my benefits cut just to subsidize the health care of a lazy individual.
I bring this up because I’m willing to BET that the Democrats have messed with military retirees and/or vets in their health care bills. If we can spot where they did it – and scream loud enough early enough – we can kill ObamaCare.
None of the Blue Dogs will vote for a bill that screws vets.
So I’m kind of hoping the Democrats have made the mistake here – it will be fatal.
HondaV65 on October 29, 2009 at 10:36 AM
I agree. But then, the entire swine flu story is playing out and explicating what a large part of the problem is about.
I have some “Millenium” buddies. They all are on the bandwagon of no vaccinations. OK, but then they want to be tested to see if the flu they have is really swine flu. LOL*
I laugh because, who the heck cares after you’ve already gotten it!
Lordy, people are odd when it comes to healthcare and what they demand these days from doctors.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:36 AM
Mandate … mandate … MANDATE … manDATE … MaNdAtE …
Anyway you look at it … I dont like it…!
Badbrucskie on October 29, 2009 at 10:38 AM
With this rush to install European style Socialized medicine in this country why has no one reported on how it got that way in the first place? I’ve seen no reports on the roots of Europe’s system and am very curious about it. My guess is that it developed due to America footing the bill for costly things like national defense, which would have freed up money to build a nanny state.
This begs the logical question, “Who’s going to subsidize us?”
miles on October 29, 2009 at 10:39 AM
B*tch Pelosi on now. Her minions are clapping behind her! Clap with them! YAY! /sarc
NathanG on October 29, 2009 at 10:40 AM
Post WWII, and of course, the US has been paying the military bills.
Actually, the progressives are right about one thing. If you actually want to accomplish lower costs, probably the best route would be a single-payer system. This hybrid is sort of the worst of all versions. The paperwork alone will choke us to death.
AnninCA on October 29, 2009 at 10:45 AM
How do you fight a Congressional majority that willing to stand before the cameras and the people and simply lie their azzes off?
Griz on October 29, 2009 at 10:46 AM
Nancy said it will lower the deficit. By adding $980 billion in new spending.
That’s a pretty good trick.
hawksruleva on October 29, 2009 at 10:51 AM
By educating more Americans. As long as millions of poor folks are willing to stand in line for “Obama money”, we’ll face politicians who know they can buy votes with lies.
hawksruleva on October 29, 2009 at 10:52 AM
It’s only cheaper because it brings on rationing of health care – and there is no other place for people to run to.
It’s cheaper also because it makes Doctors all government employees – which means they make less money. This means that talented Americans don’t go into the medical profession – they go elsewhere where they can make money. Where then do the Doctors come from? Why … they come from the THIRD WORLD … where immigrating to America to become a government employee is actually a step UP in life.
So it’s not just rationed – it’s lower quality care. Yes, I just said it – outsourcing medical care to third world doctors means LOWER QUALITY.
HondaV65 on October 29, 2009 at 10:53 AM
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