Reid: Yes, the Senate bill will have a public option
posted at 4:31 pm on October 26, 2009 by Allahpundit
He hasn’t even sent the bill to CBO to be scored yet so I’m not sure what we’re supposed to react to here, aside from the left’s success in getting something with a public plan to the floor which (a) may not even have 60 votes behind it and (b) is almost guaranteed to lose The One’s very small fig leaf of bipartisan support as Olympia Snowe walks away (skip ahead to 5:00 for his comments on that). Politically, I don’t see how he had any choice except to cave to progressives. His reelection bid’s already in trouble; if he’d stiffed them on their public-option fetish, he’d be finished. So here’s his attempt at a compromise to save his own ass, featuring a P.O. watered down with a state opt-out clause to try to draw Blue Dogs but with enough tweaks to the tax threshold for “Cadillac plans” to get big labor to stop grumbling about how this bill isn’t “robust” enough.
I’ve written a little about the opt-out scheme before and still don’t understand what advantage states will derive from it. If some sort of federal tax is eventually levied to help pay for ObamaCare’s cost overruns, I take it opt-out states will be exempt, yes? There has to be some benefit to opting out or else the inevitable underselling of private insurers by a public plan that doesn’t have to obey the same rules of finance will create immense political pressure on opt-out states to opt in. So what’s the benefit?
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Harry Reid’s latest scam of “opt out” isn’t going to get it. That’s still a public option that will bankrupt insurance companies.
There will not be true competition in health care until Congress allows health care insurers to do business across state lines.
The “opt out” will just put the politics of the whole mess on the states.
Government-run health care is not an option for Americans and free enterprise.
Ricohoc on October 26, 2009 at 4:33 PM
Allah is back! hope you had a nice vacation!
clorensen on October 26, 2009 at 4:34 PM
It doesn’t matter at this point. The Dems are circling the hole now. Whatever they do can be repealed.
They’re toast.
History.
So yesterday.
Akzed on October 26, 2009 at 4:34 PM
Waterloo.
elduende on October 26, 2009 at 4:34 PM
Learn the facts… it’s not the public option anymore, it’s the Competitive Option.
Waterloo? Marginalized?
MobileVideoEngineer on October 26, 2009 at 4:34 PM
A brazen bull for Harry. That’s the only sort of health care he deserves.
Despicable, lying scum. These people are the lowest that humanity has ever produced. Ever.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 4:35 PM
The entire opt-out sounds like a crock. Unless there’s some mechanism in place to keep the states that opt-out protected from the taxes and fees used to fund ObamaCare (unlikely), why would any state opt-out?
BadgerHawk on October 26, 2009 at 4:35 PM
Sadly, this is untrue. Nothing they do can be repealed. If they pass this cr@p, it’s all over for sure.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 4:36 PM
Not being in the room when Dusty Reid farts…
Seven Percent Solution on October 26, 2009 at 4:36 PM
Just no rest for the evil in DC
PatriotRider on October 26, 2009 at 4:37 PM
What’s interesting is Reid says Snowe is frightened by their proposal.
If RINO Snowe is frightened, you know it’s incredibly bad.
Enoxo on October 26, 2009 at 4:37 PM
If a state “opts out” of the public option, there will most likely be a loss of federal funds, in much the same way highway funds are withheld from states that fail to enforce the National Minimum Drinking Age Act. No state will be willing to do that. So, the “opt out” thing is just for show.
uncivilized on October 26, 2009 at 4:38 PM
Texas can opt out by seceding.
txag92 on October 26, 2009 at 4:38 PM
I wonder who the next Senate leader will be?
portlandon on October 26, 2009 at 4:38 PM
Not at all. Think of public school systems and property taxes. You pay whether your kids go to public schools or not and whether you have kids or not.
This opt-out is an insane attempt at faux federalism, backwards. It is insane, un-Constitutional, un-American, fraudulent and should be enough to toss everyone who votes for it into jail for life, at the least.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 4:38 PM
Another ridiculous ploy for a “compromise” that gets “bipartisan” support?
MobileVideoEngineer on October 26, 2009 at 4:39 PM
The leadership of the democrat party has gone insane, and half of the people in the country have gone with them.
Skandia Recluse on October 26, 2009 at 4:39 PM
Of course it will. This isn’t about health care or reform It’s about government control and power. KILL THE BILL. Once again, how much of the $500 billion in waste have we saved and are the sewer rats going to be covered by the public option.
rjoco1 on October 26, 2009 at 4:40 PM
That’s the only move left. This feral government will not be domesticated, again. It has reverted to an utterly savage state of nature and will never return.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 4:40 PM
I’m so thankful that Reid and Pelsoi are idiots.
This country would be in real trouble with they were smart.
blink on October 26, 2009 at 4:40 PM
The communists are absolutely desperate to force their population control mechanism upon the American public. More abortions of the “undesirables”, eventual euthanasia of the old and sick and denial of care to those who are “problems”.
No wonder Hitler wrote to American progressives on how best to institute his eugenics programs. He knew they knew what to do.
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 4:41 PM
Does anyone really think the CBO or the public will see this bill before they vote?
txhsmom on October 26, 2009 at 4:42 PM
I hope this doesn’t pass. What happens if you are in a state that decides not to opt out? Are you still going to get fined in that state? Why do other states have to pay for the states who opt in? This is bad for our country. Bad!
I guess when Hubby retires from the military I will make sure we are in a state that has opted out. Then can states opt in and out as the political scene changes for that state or once you opt in your done?
This is scary stuff.
Brat4life on October 26, 2009 at 4:42 PM
Wouldn’t the public option jack up the cost of the bill, preventing it from being deficit neutral and therefore rendering it unacceptable to Obama?
Doughboy on October 26, 2009 at 4:42 PM
Poll Shows Clear Majority of Americans Support Public Option When Described as “Magic Pixie Dust” http://optoons.blogspot.com/2009/10/poll-shows-clear-majority-of-americans.html
Mervis Winter on October 26, 2009 at 4:43 PM
And in 10 minutes, the Senate will announce a plan with no public option but with a trigger instead. And 10 minutes after that…
We’re witnessing the equivilent of ‘thinking out loud’. Watch for another 75 or so ‘tweaks’ before this monstrosity reaches a vote.
joejm65 on October 26, 2009 at 4:44 PM
Blue Cross is a collection of non-profits that service about 1/3 of the population. How is that not already a “public option”? So, the treasonous dems want to have Fannie Med versus Blue Cross?
Why has no one bothered asking these scumbags about existing non-profits?
This is infuriating.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 4:44 PM
Dingy Harry’s swansong…
d1carter on October 26, 2009 at 4:44 PM
NO NO NO.
KILL THE BILL.
Even if you include an “opt out” for the states, they’ll probably sweeten the pot and let the SEIU force states that opt out not to make darn well sure they opt in.
Make no mistake, this is a back door theft of our liberties and freedom.
Skywise on October 26, 2009 at 4:44 PM
The Opt-Out is nothing more than a stimulus for the moving business
PatriotRider on October 26, 2009 at 4:45 PM
Opt out is in a year, next November! Followed by another in 20012!
chickasaw42 on October 26, 2009 at 4:46 PM
Can I “opt out” of participating anything that this corrupt, incompetent Congress scribbles down?
And that this circus clown of a president, signs?
Because it would be nice not to be involved in a train wreck.
NoDonkey on October 26, 2009 at 4:46 PM
I am SO ready for secession. No taxation without representation, and they don’t represent us at all anymore.
Daggett on October 26, 2009 at 4:46 PM
I can’t wait to hear 3 of the most beautiful words…”former Senator Reid”
R Square on October 26, 2009 at 4:46 PM
Nothing but a big smelly gas that is coming out his a**
hawkman on October 26, 2009 at 4:47 PM
There is no bill they can pass that their base will support.
It’s over for them.
jhffmn on October 26, 2009 at 4:47 PM
Health insurance providers have something like a
3.5% profit margin!Fixed
R Square on October 26, 2009 at 4:48 PM
If states can opt-out, then the citizens of that state, as a principal of equity, would seem to be put under an injustice if they also paid for it, as it would be taxation without benefit for the citizens of that state, either directly, or indirectly via some government activity at the federal level that only the Federal government can and should do (eg., national defense). Thus, the citizens of that state should not pay in any way for this system if their state is not in the system.
But if the state is neither in the system, nor do its citizens pay for it, then the question is naturally raised why the system is a federal-level item in the first place, since the other states have done nothing but outsource the administration of a program to the federal government that they could very well do themselves. This national system is not something that only the Federal government can do, it is not authorized as an activity of the Federal government under that national constitution, and it therefore should not be done. The Federal government is the one that should opt-out, by dropping the entire matter, and the states should “opt-in”, if they so choose, via the method of their state legislatures writing legislation for such a program if they choose and paying for it as they see fit or are able.
Hold the line.
Horatius on October 26, 2009 at 4:48 PM
If they do, I’m so there.
j_galt on October 26, 2009 at 4:49 PM
How many will opt out? And of those that do: how many will see ACORN running the next elections?
Jed_Eckert on October 26, 2009 at 4:49 PM
And the rest of the sane states
MyImamToldMeToDoIt on October 26, 2009 at 4:50 PM
In an alternative universe somewhere…
Americans are laughing at countries like Russia and China as they try to implement this crap, while we laugh all the way to the bank as we tap into yet another oil cache to sell to the rest of the world.
Seven Percent Solution on October 26, 2009 at 4:51 PM
They don’t care. The Precedent is a political suicide bomber and the useful idiots on the Hill are smiling as they walk alongside him into the mall.
“Hey, that’s a nice backpack you’ve got there, Precedent Hussein.”
“Yeah. This health care bill is pretty big. And it came with this trigger here …”
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 4:51 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
Why in the world would the federal government ever give the states an option to opt out of a specific Federal tax?????
I’m sorry, but that doesn’t sound like the money-hungry Obama I know.
jimmy the notable on October 26, 2009 at 4:53 PM
Most realistic zombie ever.
lorien1973 on October 26, 2009 at 4:53 PM
“You can opt out. Maybe. After a while. If we don’t change our minds.”
mojo on October 26, 2009 at 4:54 PM
With the presidency, it will take at least 65 votes to repeal. 60 votes for cloture, plus an extra 5 to cover the RINO’s who defect.
Without the presidency, it will take at least 71 votes to repeal.
This will never be repealed.
MarkTheGreat on October 26, 2009 at 4:54 PM
Just like trying to reject the Stimulus money- the Governors and/or Legislature who try to opt out will be under such tremendous stress from the liberals/unions within their own states that they will cave.
journeyintothewhirlwind on October 26, 2009 at 4:55 PM
It’s like they’re throwing jello on the wall to see what sticks. Frightening that these idiots are in charge.
SouthernGent on October 26, 2009 at 4:55 PM
Last night on 60 Minutes they had a story on Medicare fraud. In the story they interviewed the person at Medicare who is in charge of stopping fraud, and she stated that Medicare paid out $430 billion in claims. The fraud was stated to be $60 billion, or 14% of the claims paid. Two thoughts come to mind. First the fraud percentage is three (or more) time the profit of the insurance companies. Second is this another reason Medicare has such a “low” overhead – no fraud prevention? They had one woman, who for 6 years has been telling Medicare that someone was submitting false claims on her account. Is this the “public option” Reid wants? Personally I’d rather pay insurance company profits than line criminal’s pockets.
4of8 on October 26, 2009 at 4:55 PM
he doesn’t have the votes, he is putting it out there and waiting to see his own party cave in to the left, He is not a good majority leader and for all intensive purposes shafted Baucus and the dems as well as Snowe who pushed forward a proposal.
rob verdi on October 26, 2009 at 4:55 PM
In the new United Maoist States of America, Texas will be our Taiwan.
Long live the Republic.
Fallen Sparrow on October 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM
On the bright side, Medicare has a low administrative cost.
It’s pretty cheap to rubber stamp claims.
If Obama Care passes, we’ll just need to buy more rubber stamps, problem solved.
NoDonkey on October 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM
I continue to be amazed at how weak the Democrats are on this thing. The keep changing the details of this beast weekly, not exactly a sign of strength given the number or seats they hold in both chambers. I think that the strategy now is to remain ideologically pure and if it dies (which appears more likely by the day – and will be even more likely if NJ/VA and NY-23 go for the GOP) then they can try and pin it on the “opposition”. They’re in real trouble with this folks, make no mistake. 2010 is looking like it’ll be a bloodbath for the Donks, maybe not enough to nix Pelosi but enough to seriously cripple any more of Obama’s agenda.
volnation on October 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM
I’m going to post the college student side of a discussion on health care I am having.
My question was for the student to cite where the constitution or bill of rights guarantees health care.
This is the students response….
I have NEVER seen such a bastardization of the bill of rights to justify Marxism in all my days! Mind you, that was written by a college student!
And I googled that entire argument and found it WORD FOR WORD on three separate blogs. It was plagiarized from the teachers guide for health care and the “National student/parent mock election” for 2008.
In Obama land, students don’t need to study! Their teachers will tell you how to think.
Morons!
csdeven on October 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM
A rose by any other name is still a rose . . . the gutless fools are beyond contempt, now they’re trying to deceive and confuse the people. These leftist bums must go.
rplat on October 26, 2009 at 4:58 PM
Polish a turd and it’s still a turd.
MobileVideoEngineer on October 26, 2009 at 5:00 PM
Ok, what can be done if this mess is passed. Im not giving up hope, but I am trying to learn of the options. I assume if we take back the house and senate we can repeal it with cap and tax. But there is no way barry will sign it, so we would have to use the checks and balances in the house and senate to override his veto? I assume this is all impossible and if it does pass we are screwed. Are there anymore options out there to fix this mess?
Jack Daniels on October 26, 2009 at 5:00 PM
Secession. Now, that’s a public option I’m hoping Texas soon will decide to take.
Think of it as the ultimate opt-out.
We now ship billions and billions to DC, receiving back but a pittance…
And the middle finger.
TXUS on October 26, 2009 at 5:02 PM
What if 50 states opted out? Would Obamacare only apply to DC and Congress?
We’ll have to get the details before we can see whether “opting out” might be advantageous for a state, but what is the purpose of a Federal law that applies to some states and not others? Isn’t that unfair? Or maybe unconstitutional?
If a state “opts out”, are its taxpayers exempt from the costs and fines associated with ObamaCare. Or should we call this ReidCare, or ReekDare?
Steve Z on October 26, 2009 at 5:03 PM
… of Texas.
TXUS on October 26, 2009 at 5:03 PM
Harry looks like he needs a multi-year vacation
J_Crater on October 26, 2009 at 5:04 PM
Harry Reid–Lame Dunce. I imagine he already has a cushy lobbyist job lined up after he’s bounce. Right along side Dashwhole in the Health Industry.
chickasaw42 on October 26, 2009 at 5:04 PM
No, 40 percent of any state budget is Medicaid payments and they might opt out to spare them the burden, even a partially funded one a new program would have. A state might possibly opt out to spare business this disaster as well insure that at least some doctors will stay in the businesses before the government takes over their livelihoods. For the life of me I cannot envision how the a Federal tax to pay for the public plan could only be levied in some states and not others, by the way considering government entitlement programs will end up relying on the general fund all of out tax dollars will be used to prop up the system
rob verdi on October 26, 2009 at 5:05 PM
Maybe it is time the non Marxist states considered “opting out” of the “union”.
elduende on October 26, 2009 at 5:05 PM
Yup, Texas secession — the ultimate opt-out.
publiuspen on October 26, 2009 at 5:05 PM
Not really.
– The SCOTUS should rule it un-Constitutional, which it clearly is, but they won’t.
– The Precedent could be found ineligible, thrown out of office, and have everything he signed rendered null and void (though I’m not sure about that last part) … but it won’t (see above)
– Secession
That’s really about it. Sad. But these are the sorts of situations that a feral government produces. Other than the above, the American creed will die, with only American conservatives left to carry it as a belief that they, alone in the world, espouse, without a land in which to practice it and without the ability to live by the framework set down by the founding documents and the traditions established by American culture.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 5:07 PM
:)
truetexan on October 26, 2009 at 5:08 PM
Ok so what are the chances of having it repealed through the natural checks and balances within the system?
Jack Daniels on October 26, 2009 at 5:09 PM
Hmm, would not it have been nicer if instead of Snowe who–horror of horrors–threatens to filibuster this bill, a democrat was the representative from Maine? Next time, as a true conservative, I will work to ensure the defeat of Snowe and elect a democrat–just to teach these buggers a lesson!
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:09 PM
It does seem like our options are getting fewer. After the last election I don’t really have that much faith in the election process, and the communists in the White House will do everything they can to rig elections.
It’s quite obvious what the majority of people in this country want … and “health care” isn’t one of them. Washington isn’t listening, Washington doesn’t want to listen. They just want us to shut up and keep giving them our money.
Washington fears the left. They will never listen to us until they fear us more.
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 5:10 PM
i wonder how a former Senator Reid will fill his time….
alexraye on October 26, 2009 at 5:10 PM
Smoke. And. Mirrors.
Just trying to sound reasonable to soothe the masses.
The end goal is still the same, they want a public option, and they will get a public option.
No matter what.
juanito on October 26, 2009 at 5:10 PM
And sorry: really amusing to see the “true” conservatives crying here–secede! Ha! Hello, don’t these guys want to throw out everyone who does not think exactly like them and did not the great leader De Mint say he would have rather have 30…
Sure. Maybe 20 De Mints would be even better.
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:11 PM
csdeven on October 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM
The equal protection clause means that everybody has to have exactly the same amount of stuff?
Where do they dig up these clowns?
MarkTheGreat on October 26, 2009 at 5:11 PM
Does anyone really believe that if the bill had a public option or that the CBO scored it as costing even three trillion dollars over ten years that Ms. Obama is Historic Snowe, and Ms. Olympia I must protect the Obama Presidency at all costs Snowe wouldn’t vote for it? As for enacting and repealing this snake oil legislation, we must be reminded that it is unlikely that republicans will regain control of both houses next year let alone that they would get a sixty vote majority in the Senate, let alone a 2/3 majority. So any repeal would be vetoed by the One and sustained by both houses of congress unless the dems lose so big they get whipped into repealing this overwhelmingly which I don’t foresee (but then I am not Nostradamus). At best Republicans if they had a filibuster proof senate and a substantial majority in the house could cut off funding any public option or any portions of the bill, but again that could be vetoed as well, which could lead to a Newt Gingrich like shut down of parts of the government that occurred under Clinton.
eaglewingz08 on October 26, 2009 at 5:11 PM
And the 7 or 8 other states.
lorien1973 on October 26, 2009 at 5:12 PM
e
How about winning an election, buddy?
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:12 PM
What?
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 5:13 PM
In Wilmington, DE, when you come into the city on 95, there is a big billboard of a graveyard and all the crosses on the tombstones are painted blue. It reads, “HEATH CARE DENIED.”
I guess BSBC is evil too.
Joe Caps on October 26, 2009 at 5:14 PM
pm
read up dude: some of the true heroes here want to secede.
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:15 PM
Repealing it will never happen.
Even if you have the presidency, you are going to have to break the fillibuster in order to pass the repeal. It’s a given that the Democrats will stick together on something this important to their base. So you will need 60 votes to break the fillibuster. It’s a given that 5 or more RINO’s will break ranks, so in actuality, you are going to need at least 65-67 Republicans in the Senate to repeal this (I’m assuming that by the time the Republicans have 60+ seats, that all of the purple states have been flipped Republican, the only Democrats left are those from solidly liberal states.)
If you have to over come a veto as well, you will need 72-75 Republican seats.
That’s never going to happen. This thing has to be defeated before it goes in. Failing that, the only remaining option will be secession.
MarkTheGreat on October 26, 2009 at 5:15 PM
Yes … win, not steal like communist democrats.
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 5:15 PM
Some college. Probably UNLV.
csdeven on October 26, 2009 at 5:16 PM
for this little weasel to attach his name to the Public Option is the final nail in his coffin….
Of course, it is the final nail in the coffin of this country if this load of crap passes too….
SDarchitect on October 26, 2009 at 5:16 PM
I’m not sure what to make of this at all.
This is what my gut says …
Firstly – Dingy Harry is a stupid guy and an incompetent Senate leader – but not that stupid and incompetent.
I think he may not have the votes to pass this – and I think he knows it.
Bear with me …
Last week – ole Dingy allowed a vote to go the floor on the $250 BILLION doctor payoff. He lost his ass on that vote. No Senate Leader sends a bill like that to the floor unless he KNOWS its going to pass. He knew it wasn’t going to pass – but sent it anyway – because he’s tired of the Health Care game. He’s tired of the pressure the White House is putting on him and he’s tired of watching his approval rating sinking into the 9th ring of hell.
I think the Blue Dogs and the Progressives and everyone in between are just TIRED – and they’re sending this thing to the floor to let the chips fall where they may. All of them know they are in deep extremus when it comes to next year’s elections and they’d rather concentrate on digging out of the hole instead of just making it deeper.
And, no rest for the wicked – right after this fight – comes Cap-N-Tax.
I think Dingy is tired.
I could be wrong.
This is what my gut tells me.
HondaV65 on October 26, 2009 at 5:17 PM
If that’s what makes you happy, sure. You can join the idiots on the Left who still keep crying over the “stolen” 2000 elections.
Others, who are more realistic, are interested in winning in 2010 and throwing out the democrats–and not in stupid conspiracy theories.
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:18 PM
I’ve heard it discussed as one option of many to fight an ever growing and powerful federal government. Your point?
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 5:18 PM
Don’t forget, Sotomayor thought that there were no adjectives in Spanish – when she was already in Princeton!! It really doesn’t get much dumber than that.
And look at her, now. Thanks, Lindsay, you f#cking despicable …
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 5:19 PM
I’m not quite sure what your argument is. We all want to do that. Being realistic is recognizing that massive voter fraud occurred and will probably play a big part in future elections. Especially with Holder as AG.
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 5:21 PM
Similar feelings…they bring the bill up to vote as a bone to the left, then they can say..”I did my job”, we brought it to vote, but you (the left) guys don’t have enough muscle.
They are tired of being beat up, and they just want this stuff to go away…plus the most important thing to him is getting re-elected. He could care less about the bills, except for the ones he has to pay without a job.
right2bright on October 26, 2009 at 5:21 PM
A feral government.
progressoverpeace on October 26, 2009 at 5:21 PM
Yet another allahpundit link to msnbc – - – - he hates palin – - – is allahpundit really kieth olberman?
Freddy on October 26, 2009 at 5:22 PM
My point is to discuss what is realistic. (Not to mention same sort of rhetoric was heard from the Left during Bush years and would have been windely condemned here.) Which is to win the next elections. And you don’t win by ideological purity or by throwing out people. Neither is there any glory in defeat as some guys thing here is: We will stand by our “principles” even if that means we are reduced to 20 Senate seats That is BS.
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:22 PM
Sorry. read that as: as some guys here think
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:23 PM
Don’t be fooled. He’s a secret admirerer of Palin. He does this to throw us off.
darwin on October 26, 2009 at 5:24 PM
.
And if that had truly occurred, McCain and Palin would have accepted defeat? Sure, ACORN did what they did but Obama won by 7 million votes. It was not even a close contest.
rightistliberal on October 26, 2009 at 5:26 PM
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