Video: GOP reacts to PWC audit on Baucus plan
posted at 2:55 pm on October 12, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
Fox News gets Senator John Barrasso (R-WY), one of the Senate’s two actual physicians, to react to the PriceWaterhouse Coopers audit of the Baucus plan this morning. To boil the response from the GOP down to its essence: We told you so. It hikes costs so much, in fact, that the PWC audit notes that a “bronze” level plan now would qualify as a Cadillac plan by 2019, thanks to the massive increase in premiums:
As TNR notes, the PWC audit ignores the subsidies offered to families below the $88K/year income level, but that’s not relevant to actual cost. PWC wanted to take a look at the actual cost of premiums, not the impact on subsidies, which is a political rather than economic question. The subsidies will still be in place, but they will apply to policies that cost a lot more than Baucus projected.
How much more? Take a look at this analysis from page 6 of the report:
PwC also examined the impact of the excise tax on the mandated plans expected to be offered under the state health insurance exchanges detailed in the Senate Finance Committee Bill.17 We estimate that in many metropolitan areas, which tend to have higher than average medical costs, the lowest option plan (Bronze Plan) would be considered a “Cadillac plan” as early as 2016. By 2016 at least one of the mandated plans will be considered a “Cadillac plan” and be subject to the 40 percent excise tax in 17 of 50 states. By 2019 at least one of the mandated plans will be considered a “Cadillac plan” and be subject to the 40 percent excise tax in 24 of 50 states.
Barasso didn’t get fooled by the subsidy red herring, either. He notes that the subsidies don’t start until 2013, but the taxes and fees kick in immediately. That will start the price pressure on premiums next year, not in 2013, and it will actually make the problem of uninsured worse in the short run.
Besides, what was the rationale for the excise tax on Cadillac plans in the first place? It intended to discourage plans that allowed for overuse of the system. By the end of its first decade, the Baucus plan makes most plans subject to that tax, which means that there is no real penalty for offering them or buying them. It transforms quickly into another general industry tax and does nothing to encourage rational use of the system.
We cannot reduce costs by imposing massive new taxes on the medical care system. To argue otherwise is simply Orwellian, and PWC just restates the obvious in more specific terms.
Blowback
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Government control always works, look at the soviet union………..
Johan Klaus on October 12, 2009 at 2:58 PM
One more nail in the coffin…
PatriotRider on October 12, 2009 at 2:59 PM
Won’t matter. This only affects rich people. Or, by the time they redefine rich to mean anyone making $30k or more a year, it will only affect rich people.
spmat on October 12, 2009 at 3:01 PM
The leftist Democrats can only succeed in a nation of idiots and fools . . . fortunately only half of this country falls into those categories and therefore we may still be able to survive.
rplat on October 12, 2009 at 3:03 PM
Who could have seen this coming?!
Dash on October 12, 2009 at 3:04 PM
Where subsidies exists, the price of the subsidize good or service goes up (e.g., college).
WashJeff on October 12, 2009 at 3:06 PM
“We cannot reduce costs by imposing massive new taxes on the medical care system.”
I can’t remember, in the end who pays these “massive new taxes?” Oh, there he is in the mirror.
perroviejo on October 12, 2009 at 3:07 PM
Eventually, we’ll be spending quadruple the current price for compulsory medicine. Death panels don’t have to be drafted in the bill. It will happen naturally because the costs to stay alive will be prohibitive.
anXdem on October 12, 2009 at 3:07 PM
But we’re only taxing “the rich.”
Ahem.
perroviejo on October 12, 2009 at 3:08 PM
I, for one, am shocked SHOCKED I tell you!!
alohapundit on October 12, 2009 at 3:10 PM
Yes, we told you so. But who the hell is listening?!?!?
Bueller? Bueller?
glennbo on October 12, 2009 at 3:10 PM
Govt. Sponsered health care $4,000.00. Opt Out Cost $1,500.00 = Savings $2,500.00
BigMike252 on October 12, 2009 at 3:12 PM
Do the Democrats also intend on keeping us from seeing the final bill until 2013? They can’t hide it forever!
txhsmom on October 12, 2009 at 3:12 PM
Back in 1990, the US govt seized the Mustang Ranch brothel in
Nevada for tax evasion and, as required by law, tried to run it. They failed, and it closed. Now we are trusting the economy of our country, the auto industry, health care, and the banking system to the same dumba**** who literally couldn’t make money running a whore house and selling booze!
abobo on October 12, 2009 at 3:13 PM
Something here has got to be unconstitutional!
Forcing some to pay more so others don’t pay at all but get the samer or better treatment?
Voting on bills not even written. There is no bill just a concept?
Adding amendments to bills already voted upon and approved.
Are there no lawyers in the Republican Party, in the House or Senate?
Where are the lawsuits aginst these outrageous bills and confiscation of wealth?
Anyone who votes for this must be gone R or D out of there!
We’re in debt up to our eyeballs now thanks to Pinnochio and his merry band of thieves with 40% of taxes going to pay the interest on the debt and revenues declining we cannot afford any more entitlements or debt.
We are being sold into servitude to the Government and non-achievers!
Fundamentally transforming America, returning the wealth to its rightful owners! The do nothings of society benefit while the rest toil for how long?
For how long will the Chinese and Saudis buy our debt?
dhunter on October 12, 2009 at 3:14 PM
And when the Democrats with the help of McCain and Gramnasty pass amnesty and voting rights for 30 million illegals here and many more to come the 1/2 way point will be ancient history and we will be doomed to work for Big Government and those who won’t!
dhunter on October 12, 2009 at 3:18 PM
Smells like freedom to me. – Bleeds Blue
lorien1973 on October 12, 2009 at 3:20 PM
Obama gets an A- on this clusterfark.
Cicero43 on October 12, 2009 at 3:20 PM
Fairy tales had the 3 blind mice.
We have a bunch of blind democrats, that don’t know squat about any of this, and making big decisions, that will affect millions. Now THAT is scary!!!
capejasmine on October 12, 2009 at 3:24 PM
Fourteenth Amendment?
jimmy2shoes on October 12, 2009 at 3:26 PM
Last week, an article in The Washington Examiner pointed out the following:
“The government would also levy more payroll taxes. Included in a footnote in the CBO report is the revelation that the government expects to raise an extra $83 billion in payroll taxes in the next 10 years thanks to the higher taxable wages they predict employers will offer in place of non-taxable health care benefits.” (emphasis added)
I thought Dems were telling us that no employers would react adversely to Obamacare and would not drop their health plans. In fact, aren’t they banking on that to be the case in order to make Baucus’s numbers work?
What happened to “if you like your plan, you’ll be able to keep your plan”?
BuckeyeSam on October 12, 2009 at 3:27 PM
Subsidies encourage uneconomical usage at the given price point, which is usually below market cost although China has gotten whiplash up and down with gasoline when it was cheap, during which there was a great expansion of use and income, then at the higher level when money drained out per gallon from the State. Iran has done that with gasoline and natural gas to the point it now must export significant quantities of both, while its refinery system decays.
Getting a ‘tax break’ means the ‘break’ doesn’t show up during the year of purchase but after it, thus you pay out money and hope to get some back in the ‘subsidy’. That money has gone through the federal government, which has problems being efficient at anything, save taking in money, and you get a fraction back of what you put in. What that means is that one should end payroll deduction and just pay up at 15 APR… save that you get a penalty for doing that, because the federal government is ever so wise to mandate its money now, not when the bill comes due.
Because government, like loan sharks, are wise operators and want the money NOW.
ajacksonian on October 12, 2009 at 3:30 PM
They say $4K. Which means it will be $8K.
angryed on October 12, 2009 at 3:30 PM
Always a transparent lie from the most transparent administration ever!
mr.blacksheep on October 12, 2009 at 3:33 PM
This entire Obama generated goat rope is a lie and a farce.
rplat on October 12, 2009 at 3:34 PM
Keep gov. out of health care and our lives for that matter.
rjoco1 on October 12, 2009 at 3:35 PM
Isn’t this the plan? Increase the cost of private insurance to drive people to the “public option”, which will further increase the price of private insurance, which will drive more people to the “public option”, etc.?
malclave on October 12, 2009 at 3:35 PM
Who pays for a $1 million pre-existing condition?
This alone will bankrupt the healthcare insurance business. Maybe even the country.
faraway on October 12, 2009 at 3:35 PM
While I personally condemn the practice of prostitution and don’t partake of liquor, I just have to say the following:
If you can’t make money selling whores and liquor you should quit whatever job you have take up charitable basket weaving.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 3:35 PM
AARP .. neutral through disbelief
J_Crater on October 12, 2009 at 3:38 PM
Frankly, the real news is that the mandates kick in 3 years before the benefits.
Honestly, no program has ever been introduced this way.
It’s absurd.
AnninCA on October 12, 2009 at 3:39 PM
On this I agree with you Ann.
At least with private insurance, your covered from the day you start paying premiums. With this system, we’re paying premiums for three years before we start seeing coverage.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 3:40 PM
I think that may be more realistic in the long run.
Oldnuke on October 12, 2009 at 3:41 PM
indeed that is one solution . . . or, you can rape the treasury and steal from the citizens which is the path this inept, crooked government has taken.
rplat on October 12, 2009 at 3:41 PM
The gop can raise a stink but it’s dems. who have the power to stop it.
ohiobabe on October 12, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Well, yes, except with the health insurance yahoos. They turn down benefits AFTER the fact.
What idiots. That 1930′s practice is exactly why their necks are on the chopping block today.
Unbelievable business practices, stupidity 101.
I’d be shocked, except I used to work in business. It really is just like a small DC bubble. They honestly do manage to think nobody will notice.
AnninCA on October 12, 2009 at 3:48 PM
On paper, this is true. Dems can just get 60 votes in the Senate and be done with it.
However, this isn’t happening primarily for two reasons:
1) Both House and Senate dems are divided.
2) they don’t want to end up owning this bill like they own the stimulus… so they want some republicans to get on board too.
Noting the above, it’s critical the GOP remain united on this issue.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 3:49 PM
I fell for that bait right quick. Boy I’m an idiot today.
Note to self… never, ever, ever, ever state you agree with a troll.
And another thing: my Mother was at least able to get her coverage paid for after a good letter from her lawyer. My mother would be much harder pressed to sue the government than another private entity thank you much.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 3:51 PM
Someone should tell Rother that at least the PWC assessment was on paper, unlike the Baucus ‘bill’. Does an outline count as a bill?
Phil-351 on October 12, 2009 at 3:54 PM
Noting the above, it’s critical the GOP remain united on this issue.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 3:49 PM
//
That’s the big unknown isn’t it?They should not sign off on any of it.This is the dems. bed.let’m sleep in it.
ohiobabe on October 12, 2009 at 3:56 PM
Excellent point Phil. The legislative language of the Baucus bill hasn’t even been written yet.
Who knows what sort of crap will come spewing forth from that language?
On the flip side, that only makes the PWC assessment more convincing in that it proves that the Baucus bill’s plan will only increase costs on principle. In other words: the details may be different but the results will largely be similar in that there will be increased costs for the average american.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 3:58 PM
The insurance exchanges start in 2010.
Jimbo3 on October 12, 2009 at 4:00 PM
Precisely. This is why I’m so averse to soft republicans who want us to ‘go slow’ on this (like Romney). This is also a reason why I’m a Palin fan on this issue as she’s the only one to show that she sees it like it is.
I’m almost certain that if the GOP sticks to the principles of limited government that Obamacare in any form won’t be passed. But I’m almost certain that the GOP won’t stick to principle… though I’d love to be wrong here.
Chaz706 on October 12, 2009 at 4:01 PM
obooba hates all American people….bowl me over with a feather
Ris4victory on October 12, 2009 at 4:06 PM
Is anyone still a member of AARP? they have sold out their constituents in hopes of gettin some Change outta Pinnochios’ power grab.
Why would anyone believe this Pinnochio Presidente he lies like a bedwetter to others don’t ya think he will to you.
Dump AARP,RINO’s and Dems!
Arizona have you found someone to run against McRino and South Carolina have ya done anything about Grahmnasty yet?
dhunter on October 12, 2009 at 4:11 PM
That should tell everyone that a) they aren’t even confident that their plan will work as they advertise or b) they flat out know it won’t work. It allows them to get elected before we see the results of their mess.
It is of the same transparent motive behind not pushing the bill now. They want some R’s behind it so the blame can be shared even though it’s not necessary.
Pure treachery in what they seek to do and how they are going about it.
anuts on October 12, 2009 at 4:11 PM
The dark lord, Sauron’s gaze has been redirected.
PriceWaterhouse Coopers just ensured that the auditors will now become the audited.
R Square on October 12, 2009 at 4:18 PM
And for an encore, now we’re ALL about to get shafted as the pendulum swings the other way. >.<
I hope and pray this bill gets defeated because innocent people will die if it doesn’t.
Dark-Star on October 12, 2009 at 4:21 PM
Frankly, you are just a lightweight thinker. Forget the introduction of the bill; get angry over the absurdity of the contents of the bill.
ladyingray on October 12, 2009 at 4:22 PM
But you get three more years of adoring Obama before you figure out how badly he screwed you! Total bonus!
anniekc on October 12, 2009 at 4:35 PM
This is going to hurt us badly.
Diane on October 12, 2009 at 4:36 PM
Kill the bill. All versions, all conceptual frameworks.
publiuspen on October 12, 2009 at 4:38 PM
Drive a stake through its heart and burn the carcass. NO DEALS!
indypat on October 12, 2009 at 5:13 PM
1. “Stimulus bill” which does not stimulate the economy…but which greatly increases future taxes and destroys jobs.
2. “Climate bill” which does not affect the climate…but which greatly increases taxes in the near future and destroys jobs.
3. “Health Care” bill which does not deliver health care…but which greatly increases taxes immediately and destroys jobs.
Does anyone else see a pattern here?
landlines on October 12, 2009 at 5:18 PM
But the public schools are turning out 18-year-olds who don’t know history, and may be destined to repeat it.
Steve Z on October 12, 2009 at 5:29 PM
ladyingray at 4:22
I was glad to read your post. A couple of commentors on this site like to deflect serious deserved criticism from Obama’s actions by pointing to some minor obvious defect.
GaltBlvnAtty on October 12, 2009 at 5:31 PM
Stupidity 101….something with which you are intimately familiar.
xblade on October 12, 2009 at 6:36 PM
The question: is Snow listening? She is such a trader, people need to contact her, even if you don’t live in Maine. She will affect the whole country so people from all over need to contact her and express their disdain. I also contacted Baucus though I am not from his state to tell him how I feel. And I feel these people are imperialists who simply want to impose their will thru government on all of us minions, in their sight. I did not say that, but did imply it. If this passes, most of our rates will go up significantly and this will hurt this country, badly. WE need to fight and the way to do it is go after Snow. I think she is the only one who is waffling, but correct me if I am wrong.
immigrantchick on October 12, 2009 at 7:13 PM
Obama is a megalomaniac who thinks way too highly of himself, but n fact he is not even very smart. Bush was much smarter, he could REMEMBER a speech, this guy can’t if he cannot read it he is lost. He also knows little about history and only knows how to say: let me be clear. He never even published an article in law school, probably because the choosing of articles for publishing is an anonymous process and he could not say: hey I am barack hussein obama you should chose me cause of my name and skin color and radical beliefs. He is dangerous because of his inflated non-deservedly ego. He is a lost soul who is dangerous, very very dangerous because he controls so much now. God help us. He will help those he loves and love him, but I pray he helps this country again. I just don’t think this country deserves it any more. I pray I am wrong.
immigrantchick on October 12, 2009 at 7:20 PM
And don’t forget that the Bush tax cuts are set to expire with no hope of being permanent. Nancy Pelosi/ Barack Obamao are salivating at having more of your money to spend on social programs.
onlineanalyst on October 12, 2009 at 8:46 PM
Whoa–Hannity just credited HA!
lovingmyUSA on October 12, 2009 at 9:26 PM
Yea, but you guys are forgetting that everyone will have a piece of paper stating that they are ‘covered’ by medical insurance and they can frame it, hang it on their wall and smile at it all day…but if they ever need medical ‘care’…well that’s completely another story…
Ltlgeneral64 on October 12, 2009 at 9:33 PM
My hopes are that Baucus being from Montana rides horses and on his next trip home he falls off the horse and breaks his lying neck.
bluegrass on October 12, 2009 at 9:58 PM
At least with the current system, you have options, Like legal action, charity, or just out-of-pocket. With OboobyCare, your totally SOL. Legal action against the Fed Gov’t? HAH! Charity or out-of-pocket? The doctors will be behind schedule with OboobyCare patients. Who will see you?
Phil-351 on October 13, 2009 at 8:55 AM
Back in 1990, the US govt seized the Mustang Ranch brothel in
Nevada for tax evasion and, as required by law, tried to run it. They failed, and it closed. Now we are trusting the economy of our country, the auto industry, health care, and the banking system to the same dumba**** who literally couldn’t make money running a whore house and selling booze!
abobo on October 12, 2009
But this time for sure!
SKYFOX on October 13, 2009 at 9:00 AM