Telegraph: Obama furious over McChrystal speech in London
posted at 11:36 am on October 5, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
Do you think that a President might get a little miffed when his battlefield commander goes public in demanding a decision from his Commander in Chief? Would a President get his feathers ruffled when that commander also publicly pronounced other options unacceptable and compared them to letting half a building burn to the ground? Just possibly, according to the London Telegraph:
According to sources close to the administration, Gen McChrystal shocked and angered presidential advisers with the bluntness of a speech given in London last week.
The next day he was summoned to an awkward 25-minute face-to-face meeting on board Air Force One on the tarmac in Copenhagen, where the president had arrived to tout Chicago’s unsuccessful Olympic bid. …
An adviser to the administration said: “People aren’t sure whether McChrystal is being naïve or an upstart. To my mind he doesn’t seem ready for this Washington hard-ball and is just speaking his mind too plainly.”
Well, at least McChrystal finally got a face-to-face meeting with the President after that speech. After McChrystal’s appearance on 60 Minutes, it seemed as though it would have taken an act of Congress to get McChrystal some face time with Barack Obama.
As for naïveté, the real question is about Obama’s comprehension of the war and international relations, especially after the embarrassing performance in Copenhagen. McChrystal may not know the ways of Washington, but that’s not his battleground. It seems as though Obama knows Afghanistan less than McChrystal knows the Beltway, and that should be much more of a concern for the White House and its advisers than whether McChrystal is playing by Marquess de Queensbury rules while speaking publicly.
Jules Crittenden says that Obama should have learned a lesson about stalling generals while they await the CinC’s direction:
Theoretically Obama must be PO’d at Petraeus, too, because he essentially, if more diplomatically, said the same thing a couple of weeks earlier.
The big question now is whether this is going to be about Obama’s ego, or about winning in Afghanistan. If any general is ill-advised to shoot his mouth off, this business may also teach the administration something about blowing off generals at (unnecessarily extended) criticial moments and insisting that political parameters trump military ones in wartime.
McChrystal didn’t act insubordinately by speaking his mind. This is not even close to the situation which forced Harry Truman to cashier Douglas MacArthur in the Korean War, when MacArthur dared to publicly challenge Truman’s authority and judgment. McChrystal may have acted in an impolitic manner, but at this point, I doubt McChrystal cares much for political niceties. He has waited weeks for an answer to his analysis and request for more troops and resources, and he’s apparently not worried about being honest about his assessment in public.
Up to now, Barack Obama has made good moves in supporting the war in Afghanistan and adopting intelligent positions on resourcing and strategy. But as I wrote earlier, he’s reached a point where he has to decide whether he’s willing to go in for the long haul and actually win this fight over a period of years, or whether he will cave to his Left and refuse to make that kind of commitment. Hopefully, Obama will stick to his commitment made during the campaign to fight the war to a successful conclusion and break the backs of radical Islamists in the Af-Pak theater, but he’s going to have to actually make a decision instead of voting ‘present.’ If a speech by McChrystal that states nothing but the obvious gets this far under his skin, I suspect that decision will be a retreat.
Update: Jazz Shaw argues that McChrystal ought to be cashiered for insubordination, but there’s one fundamental problem with his argument. Nothing McChrystal said contradicts what the White House has said all along on either tactics or strategy. In fact, the only reason McChrystal’s speech is controversial at all is because the White House appears to be wavering now on Afghanistan, which isn’t McChrystal’s doing. Nothing in McChrystal’s speech differs from the “one voice” argument in the present status; it’s that it might differ if Obama changes direction.
Blowback
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as a young recruit in basic at great mistakes, we were lectured about the ucmj. they said that we had a a duty and obligation to refuse an officers direct order if that order was illegal and immoral. out of the nurenburg trials, regular bundeswehr soldiers and officers repeatedly testified, “they were just doing their duty.” out of that testimony came the idea that a soldier has an obligation and a duty to disobey orders when directed to commit acts such as genocide. but the us military took it a step further by stating that it is a soldiers duty to speak up and speak loud when something is happening or isn’t happening that is grossly illegal or immoral. but the lectures also said you better be damned certain, have damned big balls, and be prepared for the damned consequences.
obama sitting on the sidelines while us, nato, and civilians are dying in afghanistan is my definition of speaking ones mind. he had the report for enough time now. he only spoke once with his commander. the decision to win a war is a political one, not military. obama has already made that one clear. if you have no intention of winning, than pull out. finish the long, slow retreat already. or say we are going to win, and commit the resources to do the job. stop voting “present.” people continue to die while you sit with your thumb in your ass and finger held up to the proverbial winds.
McChrystal was right to speak his mind. it is an untenable situation he is faced with. his cinc blows him off and flies to copenhagen while his boys and girls die. McChrystal is right to do what he did. but he better be prepared for the consequences. i only worry about the political ass-kissing “yes, sir” general that will replace him.
photoboy74 on October 5, 2009 at 2:25 PM
No. The U.S. Marshals are the only agency with the legal authority to remove the POTUS.
Well dammit get to it!
Eyvonne on October 5, 2009 at 2:29 PM
You ain’t kidding. Anyone who bought into the lie that Obama was going to pursue this war wasn’t paying attention. PT Barnum had it right
Gang-of-One on October 5, 2009 at 2:30 PM
WFB was right.
Highhopes/JTP 2012
Laura in Maryland on October 5, 2009 at 2:32 PM
He’d probably have to be impeached by Congress first and I can’t find substantiation online but I know I heard it from the mouth of a US Marshall over a decade ago.
elduende on October 5, 2009 at 2:34 PM
It sounds reasonable to me. The point of the SCOTUS throwing him out, as a defacto circumstance that would arise by a ruling of his ineligibility, is an area that was never addressed (so far as I have ever seen) because I don’t think anyone considered the possibility that an ineligible person would actually get through to the office, in the first place – kind of like why no one was even checking eligibility in the first place.
progressoverpeace on October 5, 2009 at 2:39 PM
Well, we are truly in uncharted waters with this turd.
elduende on October 5, 2009 at 2:41 PM
Scarey thing is–I think you’re right…
lovingmyUSA on October 5, 2009 at 2:47 PM
*Trying to figure out how I can fit that into a bumper sticker*
lovingmyUSA on October 5, 2009 at 2:48 PM
pantywasts afghan “policy” is nothing more than a head fake
important things like that are just distractions to his moronic radical domestic policies
he doesnt give a rats a$$ about the war on terror, our troops or any kind of victory there
sidewinder22 on October 5, 2009 at 2:49 PM
As a former Petty Officer, I think you might be on to something there-at least in these Orwellian times. After all, what could be more contemptuous of the President than Blunt Truth?
Gang-of-One on October 5, 2009 at 2:49 PM
A number of you are missing the point about McChrystals point about the Koran. It’s not whether or not similar tactics have been used in the past by Muslims, or whether or not you can find Muslim authorities today who support what the jihadists do.
The point is that you can use the Koran and Islamic history and current Islamic scholarship to break into the support that the jihadists receive. That by itself will not be 100% effective, but it is a weapon that can be used against them.
exhelodrvr on October 5, 2009 at 2:50 PM
There’s an intermediate tactic, where we simply hold Mecca hostage. To demonstrate our intent, we detonate a nuke exactly 10 miles East of Mecca. Every time there is a significant terrorist attack on the United States or it’s allies, we reduce that distance by half.
This has the nice irony of using terrorist tactics against the terrorists.
ZenDraken on October 5, 2009 at 2:51 PM
We elected this mincing tart of a President, but he’s still the President. Commanding generals need to follow the chain of command, even when the one at the top is only “present”.
spmat on October 5, 2009 at 2:51 PM
How so? The jihadis are straight out of the Koran and islamic history – all of islamic history. Islam was nothing but a political ideology built to support a growing land empire built by desert arabs. Mohammed attached a mythology to it, merely to steal legitimacy from the powerful and well-known religions of the time. Islam was never a religion, but a formalization fo desert arab culture (which is pretty friggin’ savage) and a mechanism of ruling this growing empire that sought to piggy-back on the extra power that religious imagery and references can have, along with trying to steal legitmacy by insinuating Mo into the Biblical lines (by plagiarizing Biblical stories, making up ridiculous ideas about Biblical lines of descent, and then calling Jews and Christians liars for having printed something different that Mo stole from). The audacity of Mo was really quite incredible. Historic.
In the end, islam is about nothing but getting control of everything and everyone and nothing else matters. That is islam and that was Mohammed’s life, which is the perfect muslim life. The koran cannot be used for anything but the justification of killing non-muslims. That’s what is was written to do and that’s what it does. There are no moderating elements of the koran or islamic philosophy.
The koran is not a useful weapon against anyone but non-muslims. That’s how and why it was designed.
progressoverpeace on October 5, 2009 at 2:59 PM
I don’t know if anyone else noticed this, or if someone has already mentioned it, but it seemed quite telling to me that McChrystal showed up for his meeting with Obama wearing not his Class A uniform with medal ribbons and badges, but in his combat fatigues.It could be read in a couple of ways, as a slap to Obama, or as a sign that “Look, I am a fighting soldier, I’m in theater, I know WTF I’m talking about.”
But since Obama knows so little about, and cares so little about the military, either point would have gone right over his head.
Trafalgar on October 5, 2009 at 3:00 PM
I was out shopping this morning and a beat-up old truck pulled up in the parking lot with four teenage young men in it. All four were kind of scruffy looking, long hair, ugly jeans and t-shirts, baseball caps on backward, etc. They were kind of loud and I thought ‘this looks like trouble, bunch of punks.’ Then I watched all four walk into the US Army Recruiting Center and I berated myself a little and smiled and my heart swelled with pride.
Trafalgar on October 5, 2009 at 3:05 PM
And Biden got his war experience where? There is a clear case of elections matter. Bush handed Obama a war that was won, Obama will consciously lose Afghanistan. Dishonor–thy name is OBAMA!
No Biden has no military service. He was rejected by the draft board for medical reasons. Joe Biden received five student draft deferments during his college years — the exact same reasons as VP Cheney. He eventually was rejected later for asthma, despite his superior records in high school sport
Wiki.Answers.com
———————————————————–
During the 2000 presidential campaign, and particularly during the 2004 campaign, President Bush’s rather thin military resume (he served honorably, but he didn’t serve long) was the source of constant scrutiny from the media. But with Obama’s announcement of Joe Biden as his running mate we find ourselves with the first presidential ticket from either party that doesn’t have a day of military service.
In the 2004 election President Bush, as I’ve already mentioned, served in the Texas Air National Guard and John Kerry made much of his now-infamous service on a swift boat in Vietnam.
In the 1992, 1996 and 2000 elections Al Gore was on the Democrat ticket and he served in the Army. For Republicans, in 1988 and 1992 George Bush Sr. (a WWII veteran) was on the ticket. In 1996 Bob Dole (also a WWII veteran decorated with two purple hearts and a bronze star) was on the ticket.
Michael Dukakis, the Democrat candidate in 1988, served in the Army in Korea.
I could keep going, but you get the point. It’s been a long, long time since we’ve had a Presidential ticket without at least one candidate having some military experience. If that’s ever happened before. I certainly haven’t been able to find an example, though my search hasn’t been exhaustive.
So why isn’t the media mentioning this oddity of Presidential politics? After all, Bush’s service seemed to matter to much to them in 2004. Why not Obama/Biden’s lack of service in 2008?
http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/is_obama_biden_the_first_presidential_ticket_in_history_with_no_military_ex#c329550
lovingmyUSA on October 5, 2009 at 3:06 PM
Yes, what we need are more people who understand the way the Washington cesspool of corruption and incompetence work.
We need to throw out every Democrat and most Republicans in Congress and replace them with retired military officers.
They have demonstrated competence, they know how to lead, they have executive experience, they love their country and they are incorruptible.
We need a retired military coup in our government.
NoDonkey on October 5, 2009 at 3:09 PM
Yeah, I see what you mean. The fix is more accurate. Thanks.
Gang-of-One on October 5, 2009 at 3:09 PM
Dang, I’ll get it straight one of these days. In the mean time, thanks.
Gang-of-One on October 5, 2009 at 3:15 PM
progressoverpeace,
Again, you’re missing the point. You need to separate the jihadist fish from the sea that they are swimming in. The religious aspect should be a part of that.
exhelodrvr on October 5, 2009 at 3:19 PM
History is full of examples of idiotic military strategies — that were enacted at full speed, and ended up succeeding beyond any possible expectation.
Second-guessing your commander’s orders is almost always unnacceptable in a military officer. But there is one trait that is always unnacceptable in any military commander; and that is indecision.
If a commanding officer is unwilling or unable to GIVE any coherent orders — if he tries to abdicate responsibility, rather than clearly delegating authority — his subordinates have not just the right, but the unequivocal obligation to first question him, and then if necessary take measures to remove him from the chain of command by any means available to them.
logis on October 5, 2009 at 3:19 PM
I have some free counsel for the C-IN-C: 9/11 almost happened in Chicago, too.
And this is no longer a game, this is no longer Springfield… this is D.C.
Air Force One is not a toy, it’s a responsibility.
The Armed Forces are not a toy, they’re America’s Heroes!
When the General wants a word, give him more than a few. Unlike you, he’s had to justify to military families sacrifices… including the ultimate sacrifice :-(.
HotAirJosef on October 5, 2009 at 3:21 PM
I just started doing some part-time consulting work with a company headed up almost exclusively by retired military senior officers (everybody there is a general or admiral it seems), and let me tell you, it’s the greatest place to work. People are motivated, dedicated, respectful; meetings are short, sweet and completely focused and to the point; there’s no time-wasting or water cooler chat sessions; and no bullsh!t tolerated. I’m loving it…not bad for a former E-6.
Trafalgar on October 5, 2009 at 3:21 PM
See McChrystal is only concerned about the men and women under his command losing their lives and limbs for our country. He is not into politics that pay little heed to the safety of those in the line of fire. I thought we got this out of our system after the loss in Vietnam. Does this guy “loath” the military also? Seems to be a Liberal Democrat MO.
SGinNC on October 5, 2009 at 3:22 PM
Still, McChrystal can’t be fired — unless they get his copy of the birth certificate.
Dr. Charles G. Waugh on October 5, 2009 at 3:24 PM
Trafalgar on October 5, 2009 at 3:21 PM
I should have included senior enlisted.
I’ve been far more impressed with the officers and senior enlisted (and many junior enlisted) I’ve worked with in my career, than any of what passes for our current “leadership” in Congress or in the White House.
We need to tear Washington down to the roots, by throwing out all of the current politicians who got where they are by being an old boy, by family connections, by being party favorites.
They all suck, period. There are less than a dozen politicians in Washington that I have an ounce of confidence in.
Circus clowns, thieves, liars and jackasses, that’s who we have in Washington and that’s why we’re in the mess we’re in.
We need to get retired military men and women to run and throw out the current batch of incompetents and keep those who aspire to be like what we have, out.
NoDonkey on October 5, 2009 at 3:37 PM
hold yer horses there, logis. i was in no way insinuating that the good general, or any other flag officer should take it upon themselves to replace their “commanding officer.” and you should be well advised that there is a not too subtle difference between “commanding officer” and “commander in chief.” a “commanding officer” is a commissioned by congress officer who serves in the military or coast guard. a “commander in chief” is a someone elected to the highest political office in the country – the president of the united states of america.
that being said, and if i understand you correctly, and if i have correctly corrected the terminology you used…if any officer feels that his commander in chief is indecisive “have not just the right, but the unequivocal obligation to first question him” is ok. but be prepared for the consequences. but to suggest that the commander in chief is a “commanding officer” or to fail to differentiate between the two and say that the subordinate has the, “unequivocal obligation to first question him, and then if necessary take measures to remove him from the chain of command by any means available to them” is grossly unaware of the importance of civilian control of the military, however maddening our politicians may make us at times or how much we disagree with said politicians.
to act as you suggest would make us no better than any banana republic where the military says what you said, and replaces a democratic tradition with a military dictatorship.
photoboy74 on October 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM
Obama Bin Lyin needs to take a history lesson from General Charles Lemay.
“I’ll tell you what war is about. You’ve got to kill people. And when you kill enough, they will stop fighting.”
Alden Pyle on October 5, 2009 at 3:43 PM
If Bush was “the decider” then Obama is “the Fence Sitter”
E L Frederick (Sniper One) on October 5, 2009 at 3:45 PM
NRO
If Obama goes this way, McChrystal would either have to either retire and be quickly painted by the MSM as over-reaching with unreasonable troop demands, while “calmer heads in DC” prevailed or McChrystal would have to suck it up with fewer troops than he needed, and as, Brookes, notes, a stalemate results.
Of course, a stalemate is not what Obama wants going into 2012…
Wethal on October 5, 2009 at 3:59 PM
I use the analogy of driving a car. Barak Obama was sitting in the back seat, criticizing literally every turn George Bush made.
Now they’ve switched seats, but Obama is crossing his arms and refusing to put his hands on the wheel. When the inevitable crash occurs – even if it’s years later – Obama will still try to claim he isn’t responsible for it.
logis on October 5, 2009 at 4:01 PM
War is not a campaign for political office. Our people are dying while the one who is caught in a giant trap of his own political blundering, back-pedels out of the war he said was the one we needed to win. Face it, military force is what Obama would like to use against his conservative enemies here at home -that’s what that civilian force equal to….was all about. Would my dream come true and have a top general quit and publically announce that it’s because of a lack of faith in the CIC and his unwillingness to win the war.
Don L on October 5, 2009 at 4:05 PM
McChrystal is a racist!
ronsfi on October 5, 2009 at 4:12 PM
Here is a man that is responsible for the lives of American service men and remembers Vietnam and the cost of fifty thousand lives over a war driven by politics back home. He is also a man of honor and courage.
On the other hand, we have the exact opposite. B.O., and his administration of disgrace.
Hening on October 5, 2009 at 4:34 PM
Opposite is right. Liberals consider the Seventies their golden age. And they will do anything to get back to that.
logis on October 5, 2009 at 4:40 PM
saying “you lie” in the middle of Bambi’s speech in Congress is probably inappropriate. McChrystal’s comments during speech probably inappropriate, too.
but you know, sometimes the truth must be told.
kelley in virginia on October 5, 2009 at 4:46 PM
I’m glad Gen.McChrystal spoke his mind, Obama has no clue,is unable to make a decision,cant vote”present”, and cant assign the decision to Congress to come out with a 1000pg bill nobody will read anyway. This is what Community organizer in chief does, nothing,nothing,nothing.
oh, and didn’t michelle and obama look great in copenhagen?next to
orcai mean oprah?Is it time to vote this idiot out of office yet?
BEFORE MORE OF OUR TROOPS GET KILLED THROUGH THE INACTION OF THE COMMANDER IN CHIEF?
UNREPENTANT CONSERVATIVE CAPITOLIST on October 5, 2009 at 4:47 PM
I would like the Military take a confidence vote on Obama, all the of them not just the generals.
Old Hippie Vet on October 5, 2009 at 5:01 PM
Obama dithers, while our victory whithers.
coyoterex on October 5, 2009 at 5:03 PM
McChrystal… dude’s messing with Candace’s golf game. He could have gotten a couple holes in on the putt-putt area of Air Force One during those 25 minutes. But noooo! He had to spend them dressing down the general who is just supposed to a) deliver the magic unicorns and b) STFU. We already know what a great sacrifice it was for them to be there in Copenhagen, as Michelle reminded us.
Is it 2012 yet?
evergreen on October 5, 2009 at 5:10 PM
Military service should be a requirement to run for president.
Johan Klaus on October 5, 2009 at 5:13 PM
Obama is a racist.
Johan Klaus on October 5, 2009 at 5:16 PM
So should be PUBLICALLY VERIFIABLE U.S. citizenship…
I’m just saying…
Khun Joe on October 5, 2009 at 5:27 PM
Did anybody hear Glenn Beck’s radio show today? He had audio of a guy speaking at the same conference where Obama told ACORN they would help shape policy. (I can’t remember the guy’s name) He was talking about what is needed to fundamentally change America – basically the political & community organizing machine, visionary leadership, and a financial and/or foreign policy crisis which shakes the foundations.
This is basically an admission – at the very conference Obama was at – that Cloward-Piven is the method for their radical agenda. The new twist it adds is the FOREIGN POLICY component.
Yuri Bezmenov spoke about that too. He said that, following the demoralization process, “The next stage is destabilization. This time subverter does not care about your ideas and the patterns of your comsumption. Whether you eat junk food and get fat and flabby doesn’t matter any more. This time, and it takes only from two to five years to destabilize a nation, it’s the, what, what matters is essentials. Economy, foreign relations, defense systems… The next stage, of course, is crisis. It may take only up to six weeks to bring a country to the verge of crisis.”
Obama is kissing up to tyrants, communists, and Islamo-fascists. He’s pissing on our traditional allies, committed to freedom. He’s reducing not only our defenses but the defenses of anybody who trusted us to be there for them. He can’t decide whether it’s OK for America to win a war that he had previously called necessary.
The economic crisis didn’t destabilize us enough. He’s got to hit the other 2 essentials Bezmenov mentioned: foreign relations and defense systems.
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that these foreign policy “blunders” are deliberate. This man is a maniac who is not loyal to America AT ALL. And he IS destabilizing the country.
justincase on October 5, 2009 at 5:36 PM
Yes. And that’s why the general had to act, career be damned.
Don’t forget what Obama’s real endgame is: to lay this country low in all spheres of interest. Obama wants America to lose. Mostly certainly does General McCrystal know that, though he can’t say it without suffering the consequences.
And veterans.
Normal military retirement has nothing to do with age. I retired at 42.
baldilocks on October 5, 2009 at 5:50 PM
Good points, but the economic crises is not done yet. The Government is cooking the books to make things look better than they are.
NONE of the underlieing issues which brought on last years crises have been addressed. The toxic assets are still out there, just not counted as they changed the rules for Mark to Market… the banks are still in trouble… there is still a lack of credit… Cash for clunkers was short term, and now those companies will fail…
We’ve now spent trillions, not on investing in America… but in bailing out banks… or, to put it in sports terms… we’ve spent so much money on the scoreboard that we can’t afford good players for our team…
They may be able to push the collapse past 2010 (elections) with government spending and bailouts, but past that the spending will bankrupt the government… and then it all falls apart.
Romeo13 on October 5, 2009 at 5:57 PM
AnninCA
He’s 54… West Point class of 1976
Khun Joe on October 5, 2009 at 6:03 PM
Birthday: Aug. 14, 1954
Sorry, he’s 55…
Khun Joe on October 5, 2009 at 6:05 PM
The current PC term used by the DoD is to call it “transition” instead of retirement. It’s not a bad change IMO since it is probably more reflective of the reality. That being said, as long as the retirement checks (now called annuity payments) clear, they can call it whatever they want.
highhopes on October 5, 2009 at 6:07 PM
McChrystal holds a bachelor in science degree from the United States Military Academy (West Point), a master of arts degree in national security and strategic studies from the United States Naval War College, and a master of science degree in international relations from Salve Regina University.
Defense Distinguished Service Medal
Defense Superior Service Medal (with one Oak Leaf Clusters)
Legion of Merit (with two Oak Leaf Clusters)
Bronze Star
Defense Meritorious Service Medal
Meritorious Service Medal (with three Oak Leaf Clusters)
Army Commendation Medal
Army Achievement Medal
Expert Infantryman Badge
Parachutist Badge (United States)
Special Forces Tab
Ranger Tab
Joint Chiefs of Staff Identification Badge
*
2LT – June 2, 1976
1LT – June 2, 1978
CPT – August 1, 1980
MAJ – July 1, 1987
LTC – September 1, 1992
COL – September 1, 1996
BG – January 1, 2001
MG – May 1, 2004
LTG – February 16, 2006
GEN – June 15, 2009
*
Obama:
Columbia University…B.A.
Harvard Law Degree
Community Organizer
Lecturer of Law
Illinois State Senator
U.S. Senator
President
*
So there we have the comparisons, Obama telling the General what to do…
right2bright on October 5, 2009 at 6:08 PM
He DID!
Nero and his flunkies spent weeks on the phone playing footsie to try (and FAILING) to get ONE city, Chicago, the Olympics………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………IN 2016!
Yes America, while our and NATO troops are fighting and dying in Afghanistan, Nero is AWOL, slithering and dithering all over the world!
DSchoen on October 5, 2009 at 6:09 PM
People, people, people.
Remember, he is the one he has been waiting for. Whatever that means.
This guy is every bit as bad as Jimmah Carter was and the two go full circle; Jimmah allowed the Iranian revolution, enabled the Arab states to stir hatred and anger toward Israel and CrockObama is enabling them to “attempt” to destroy Israel with nuclear weapons..
God has another plan in mind for Israel and it aint’ looking good for Syria, Iran or Russia.
dthorny on October 5, 2009 at 6:10 PM
They’ve sworn an oath to uphold his orders no matter how much of a lying filthy coward he is. It’s up to the public to look out for the troops since so clearly the rat bastard traitor in the White House is more interested in going to parties in Europe than he cares about the young people losing their lives while he dithers over the political polls.
highhopes on October 5, 2009 at 6:12 PM
As is so with all authoritarians and wannabe dictators, the law will be whatever Obama says it is.
Well predicted.
After it’s spun…pray. Pray now, actually.
Did you ever read the Looming Tower?
baldilocks on October 5, 2009 at 6:13 PM
McChrystal is white. Obama is not. case closed.
kelley in virginia on October 5, 2009 at 6:14 PM
I don’t know about the rest of you but I’d rather be the General that went down in history as the one that got fired for telling the Precedent to go “eff” himself rather than the General in history books who conceded to an amateur, costing the lives of his troops. But that’s just me.
gopmom on October 5, 2009 at 6:17 PM
Oath
JellyToast on October 5, 2009 at 6:18 PM
old trooper2 on October 5, 2009 at 6:20 PM
There are ways of being that General without resorting to telling the CINC to eff himself. Keep in mind his retirement grade has to be confirmed by the Senate and as much as Democrats loathe the military, they’d be happy to downgrade the retirement of the one who embarrassed the filthy lying coward in the White House.
highhopes on October 5, 2009 at 6:23 PM
Obama’s entire public life and his life prior to that make option 1) a certainty.
That guy is the father of the Marine whose photo while dying was published by Ass. Press.
baldilocks on October 5, 2009 at 6:26 PM
That was the kind of oath that Hitler’s officers swore.
American Officers swear an oath to the U.S. Constitution and there is not even a mention of any President in their oath.
MB4 on October 5, 2009 at 6:29 PM
I didn’t know that although I knew that his son had been killed.
MB4 on October 5, 2009 at 6:30 PM
Thank you both, for that…I just spent time reading the link.
lovingmyUSA on October 5, 2009 at 6:45 PM
Nonsense. And this drivel just goes to show how ignorant McChrystal is about Islam. The Jihadists have the testimony of the Islamic holy books and Islamic history firmly on their side. The “radicals” know this, and so do the “moderates.”
2Brave2Bscared on October 5, 2009 at 6:46 PM
back up to a previous comment: so if McChrystal ret’d today, Congress gets to decide whether to pay his retirement at 4-star rank or a lower rank?
the US SEnate, right?
could they be that low?
kelley in virginia on October 5, 2009 at 7:02 PM
Mehsud Hakimullah in South Waziristan
Pakistani Taliban Chief cracks jokes, vows vengeance, bombs UN Office
maverick muse on October 5, 2009 at 7:03 PM
Obama is a disrespectful pos. That is a General in command of thousands of troops. Degrading him degrades his troops. Those are our boys out there you scum bag. Back off and get out of our house.
highninside on October 5, 2009 at 7:04 PM
and Bill Clintoon was “the face sitter”
sorry bout that, low hanging fruit and all….
bullseye on October 5, 2009 at 7:06 PM
Romeo13 on October 5, 2009 at 5:57 PM
I agree. Seems to me like the financial crisis is the loss of trust. Companies can’t invest when our Congress acts like a 16-year-old with PMS; they have no idea what they’re gonna be hit with next.
Some sales people visited us yesterday for 3 hours about an investment. We’re scratching out day to day and I told them that the last person who invests before the nation goes communist is the loser. They said, “Oh, but you’re guaranteed a return of… blah blah blah.” I said, “You don’t understand. Nothing is guaranteed. The government can take away anything we have. There is nothing to stop them from doing anything they want.”
Looking at the chart showing what they were saying unemployment would be if Congress did nothing, compared with what has actually transpired now that they’ve spent our children’s future, makes a person think they intended that upward climb – since on its own it would have settled down.
Between the foreign policy crap, the defense cuts, the racial crap, the ACORN crap, the swine flu hysteria they’re trying to generate, and the framing of conservatives as violent… I think they’ve put the ingredients in and are just waiting for it to boil over so they can get martial law initially and then a communist take-over.
justincase on October 5, 2009 at 7:07 PM
I’ve worked for this man before and I can say without pause that he is not naive.
mjtyson on October 5, 2009 at 7:10 PM
highhopes on October 5, 2009 at 6:23 PM
As a stay home mom with no military connections whatsoever and no right to say this… I say losing a rank ranks higher than hanging your troops out to dry.
My take, though, was that McChrystal has already told Obama to go “eff” himself.
gopmom on October 5, 2009 at 7:13 PM
highhopes on October 5, 2009 at 6:12 PM
Officers don’t swear an oath to the president. They swear an oath to the Constitution.
justincase on October 5, 2009 at 7:14 PM
Officers don’t swear an oath to the president. They swear an oath to the Constitution.
justincase on October 5, 2009 at 7:14 PM
dhunter on October 5, 2009 at 7:20 PM
I took that oath in 1970 Jr. and now in 2009 this president is very close to, or has gone against the Constitution Of The United States Of America. That puts him in bad spot…….maybe not with you kids but with us old Vets, his crap ain’t smellin good and we will stand by our oath to defend the United States Of America against ALL enemies both foreign and domestic.
This asshole in the WH is a COMMUNIST and the Constitution dose not mean a damn thing to him…..it’s just something to piss on and laugh at. Urkel Big Ears Obama and his people are making a power grab……………it’s time to take a stand. I for one will NOT give up my freedoms and rights to this clown and his followers. You can do what you want.
Just so you all know……I am not a Republican.
Old Hippie Vet on October 5, 2009 at 7:22 PM
Where are the trolls?
hawkdriver on October 5, 2009 at 7:32 PM
Advisor to the administration said, “People aren’t sure whether McChrystal is being naïve or an upstart. To my mind he doesn’t seem ready for this Washington hard-ball and is just speaking his mind too plainly.” I’m laughing my a$$ off at this tool…An upstart, really??? A General Officer in the United States Military has walked the walk and talked the talk in war and peace for decades…He has spent thousands of sleepless nights in $hitholes all around the globe with single minded purpose of completing the mission and taking care of his troops. And, he has been extremely effective in both. That is why he is a General Officer. He didn’t get there because he went to school with someone who knew someone. He is not a political appointee who doesn’t know a d@mn thing about what he is supposed to doing. He is not a lawyer who makes a living parsing words…The fool who made this statement is truly clueless and this does not bode well for our wartime mission…In my mind, McChrystal is one of a long line of fine military officers. He makes statements which he believes will best support the mission and the troops. He’s not the type who will sell his soul for the next higher promotion. God bless him. Now I know our troops in the Afghan theater are in good hands…
Nozzle on October 5, 2009 at 7:34 PM
highhopes on October 5, 2009 at 6:12 PM
Officers don’t swear an oath to the president. They swear an oath to the Constitution.
justincase on October 5, 2009 at 7:14 PM
“I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.”
My son just took it.
I told him to concentrate on his studies, and to leave the enemies of the domestic variety including POTUS to me, HOTAIR, Malkin, Hannity, Coulter, Rush, Levin, Savage, some I forget and damn few Congress Critters and Senate Scumbags!
Arizona retire McCain he has been derelict in duty and when Pinnochio introduces Amnesty to save his party in 2010 McCain will be derelict again!
dhunter on October 5, 2009 at 7:34 PM
I thought he looked young. Do generals retire, really, I mean like others in the military?
AnninCA on October 5, 2009 at 7:41 PM
The big question left unanswered is WHO leaked the report that started this public back and forth?
Who gains most by making Obama look weak, timid and indecisive in a time of war?
Let me re-phrase….who, WITHIN the administration gains the most and had the access to the report?
Me thinks a certain little lady from Ark..uh, I mean Ill, uh I mean NY comes to mind.
2012 Dem primaries will be fun to watch…if we make it that far.
tatersalad on October 5, 2009 at 7:48 PM
That is the oath that enlisted take, not officers.
“I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God.” (DA Form 71)
MB4 on October 5, 2009 at 7:56 PM
there is no way that McChrystal is naive. you don’t get to be 4 star by being naive.
oh yeah, well, someone in the administration looks at that short haircut that screams out “hey, i’m a bubba dumb soldier” & the uniform that screams “i don’t know how to dress nicely, nor can i afford to so i gotta wear these BDUs” & assumes that Gen. McChrystal is slightly more intelligent than a slug.
har. har. gotta love those Ivy Leaguers.
kelley in virginia on October 5, 2009 at 7:56 PM
MB4: you have been on fire about this issue. many thanks.
kelley in virginia on October 5, 2009 at 7:57 PM
The wordings of the current oath of enlistment and oath for commissioned officers are as follows:
Enlisted Oath
“I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.”
(Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).
Officer Oath
“I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God.”
(DA Form 71, 1 August 1959, for officers.)
As you can see, the officer does not swear to obey the orders of the President. We only have an obligation to defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic (for example, a Presidential Usurper).
Our forefathers were so brilliant to foresee a situation like we find ourselves in now. The officer oath is a safeguard to protect the Constitution against a corrupt elected government. Officers only have an obligation to defend the Constitution. Military officers have a lot of legal clout when it comes to Constitutional matters. The officer oath does not mention following the UCMJ laws as does the enlisted oath.
And here’s the Oath of Office Barry took:
I do solemnly swear that I will faithfully execute the office of the President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States.
- source
MB4 on October 5, 2009 at 8:07 PM
No matter what Obama does at this point he will likely lose. It’s apparently his nature to win an admission/election and then not succeed at the position he obtained. That’s because its always about him, and he won’t take risks that could harm his brand. He doesn’t follow through or take responsibility, that would be too risky. The irony is the low risk methods he is comfortable with, the ones that helped him win a couple elections, are the same methods making him fail as president.
ray on October 5, 2009 at 8:11 PM
Perhaps Acorn ran out of money to pay them. The left only works the street when they are getting paid.
ray on October 5, 2009 at 8:13 PM
Until Bill Clinton, every president since WWII had been a military officer.
ray on October 5, 2009 at 8:17 PM
Back in my DAY, I was enlisted… we were told we had to follow a Lawful order, if it was not a Lawful order then things could get interesting. Obama is going to make it interesting.
As far as the oath Urkel took…he had his fingers crossed.
Old Hippie Vet on October 5, 2009 at 8:17 PM
God bless your son and keep him safe! Please thank him for us. Thank you also, for your sacrifice as you watched your son swear this oath–I can only imagine how your heart felt….
lovingmyUSA on October 5, 2009 at 8:24 PM
This is the first time in the history of the US, that both the president and the VP have never served in the military.
lovingmyUSA on October 5, 2009 at 8:26 PM
Without reading any comments, we all know this brouhaha over McCrystall is bullsheet, do we not?
Earlg on October 5, 2009 at 8:31 PM
Don’t ya just know McCrystall thinks Obama Bin Lyin is a pussy and wants to slap him arounf like the candy ass little bitch he is.
Alden Pyle on October 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
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