Video: “Growing Pains” star ready to save America from rational thought
posted at 9:13 pm on September 25, 2009 by Allahpundit
It’s times like these that I wish Tony Danza were an atheist so that we could have a proper theological debate between stars of bad 80s sitcoms. After this week’s post about America’s trend towards non-religion, I figured I owed you guys some end-of-the-week comment fun at the expense of atheists, Darwinists, and all the other racist/sexist/crypto-Nazis in the Kirk Cameron cosmology. Dig in.
Brought to you by the same two guys who think bananas not only appeared on Earth in their current form, but that they are, in fact, a fruit-formed “atheists’ nightmare.” Exit question: Kids can no longer “pray in public”? What?
Blowback
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you suck. always have.
wccawa on September 25, 2009 at 10:14 PM
Really? And you know this how? Because you read a science journal telling you so? Sort of like … Global Warming?
You do know that’s simply a “theory”, right?
How many times a year do you read a quote by some “scientist” reporting that … “we now know” what we once “knew” was not really true at all?
Gregor on September 25, 2009 at 10:14 PM
I recall that FOX did a show around 2000 called something along the lines of Who’s The Smartest Kid In America? They had 100. The top 10 were 70% home schooled. Turns out the winner was a home schooled kid.
The show couldn’t find any educational sponsors and it didn’t air in 2001.
I have a friend who has home schooled all 6 of his kids and the 3 oldest are in secular institutions of higher learning (U.C Irvine, USC, UCLA it’s fun during NCAA football in their household) and they are kicking ass.
Oh AP, you did so well for a while, but again, you’re an evangelical atheist and cannot help but remind people, every chance you get, that in case they forgot you still don’t believe in God. Nice that a website devoted to all things politics, we can still be constantly reminded that you don’t believe in God.
I can’t wait for Ed and Michelle to start posting things regarding theism, granted, there are tons of websites for people who care about such things, but it’s nice to know that you are always looking out for us and bringing the wonderful world of Atheism to HotAir.
Please, do us a favor, unless an Atheist post in some way actually has anything to do with politics or a policy, please keep your philosophy porn on your own favorite sites to visit.
RobertInLexington on September 25, 2009 at 10:15 PM
@ aigle on September 25, 2009 at 10:11 PM
Question it with facts and observations, not by just throwing your bible at it.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:15 PM
Friday night evolution thread a few weeks after open reg. is always fun to watch unfold. (resumes lurking)
thomasaur on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
True. Not all Christian schools include Biblical studies.
terryannonline on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
me, either…
It will take Skynet. :P
Seriously, it’s all falling apart. I don’t know about your community, but people are seriously getting freaked about stuff here. That is, people not named “ernesto” or anything like that.
wccawa on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
RCIA = definition, please….
Red State State of Mind on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
Glad to know you’ve got the vernacular definition of “bashing” straight in your head. You can demonstrate your intellectual prowess further by applying the physical definition to a model involving your head and a brick wall.
MadisonConservative on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
Oddly enough the same thought process behind ‘faith’ is responsible for most of rational thought and problem solving including science.
Our ability to jump from sky gazing to creator also gives us the ability to jump from finch beaks to the origin of life.
I’m just saying, the two thought processes behind both faith and scientific thought aren’t all that different. Just think about the sort of thinking behind forming a hypothesis. So it’s unfair to say the belief in god is irrational.
Granted religion and deism are two separate things and claiming that a banana fiting into your hand, a fruit domesticated by humans, rules out scientific evidence supporting the theory of evolution just makes you a jack ass.
jhffmn on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
I think you’ve confused me with someone who asserts things that can’t be known to be true. There are plenty of people doing that in this thread. :-)
DaveS on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 PM
Join the club. It seems likely we can’t know that much. Close, but not Time=0.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:17 PM
@ HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:13 PM
So your answer is no, nothing will ever cause you to question your faith because there will always be a bible verse that you can vaguely use to describe any situation just like the Nostradamus people do. Ok. Least you are honest.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM
Great, AllahPundit on his atheist jihad again.
As a Catholic, I can’t imagine anyone more irrational than evolutionists who don’t believe there is some type of intelligent design behind evolution. . .except for maybe those who believe in global warming.
Let’s see: These atheist, evolution fanatics, like AllahPundit, believe in a “theory” that evolution by natural selection magically causes new species to suddenly appear. These dummies believe this “theory” despite not ONE SINGLE new species having appeared in the last 150 years since the “theory” came out.
Also, they can’t point to one single mutation that has been more complex that what came before.
These evolution fanatics, like AllahPundit, usually are the types that also believe if I don’t recycle, then Mother Earth will decide to get warmer because the bad karma. Talk about irrational. But people on a jihad usually aren’t rational.
Gabe on September 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM
By the way, what an absolute surprise to see that Jenfidel is nowhere around to verify her posit that I hate anyone who believes in some sort of god.
MadisonConservative on September 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM
+1
John the Libertarian on September 25, 2009 at 10:19 PM
I have missed you.
TXMomof3 on September 25, 2009 at 10:19 PM
Has anyone EVER had their mind changed by arguing about religion? Really? Why be nasty to each other? Allahpundit throws out the bait and then sits back and laughs while people go after one another. People — really smart people — have argued about this over the millenia and guess what? No consensus. Deep down, we all think we’re right and the other is wrong. Nothing comes from arguing except hurt (or more likely, angry) feelings.
cynccook on September 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
.
Point of fact. The Universe is expanding everywhere equally and any point therein can be seen as the center. In other words there is no “center of mass”.
ronsfi on September 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
Why? I skip posts about topics I’m not interested in or not in the mood for all the time. It’s not that hard.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
Got it. They are just a bunch of non-connected individuals. That’s the funniest thing I have read in a month. Oh, brother.
faraway on September 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
At worst he wants them both taught. That’s hardly striking anything. That teachers can’t even mention books which explore the possibility isn’t any better.
Esthier on September 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
WTF does global warming have to do with this? They are two separate things with two separate sets of facts by which they must be evaluated.
Expansion of space is something that is quite well founded, based on observations and relatively simple laws of physics. You sound incredibly uneducated here.
DaveS on September 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
From one Catholic to another…you’re way off base there. The Catholic Church accepts evolution, and does not condone atheist bashing either.
JetBoy on September 25, 2009 at 10:21 PM
ernesto seems to have this whole thing nailed down. Ask him.
wccawa on September 25, 2009 at 10:21 PM
I have to admit, in order to dispel the notion of intelligent design when addressing human beings as we exist today, one needs only to visit their local Wal-Mart and just…look at people.
Would anyone actually design some of them?
MadisonConservative on September 25, 2009 at 10:21 PM
Allah, don`t you know better than to post anything that goes against what many here believe?
Now write what they tell you to and they`ll give you a Allah Snack.
ThePrez on September 25, 2009 at 10:22 PM
Did you drop out of seminary, AP?
JKahn913 on September 25, 2009 at 10:22 PM
I supposed I’ve had better experiences with Ernesto. It’s not that he doesn’t make a point to stir things up, but I consider him genuine.
I’m very glad.
Esthier on September 25, 2009 at 10:22 PM
So, faith stops with the hypothesis and scientific thought proceeds to test it. Why is it acceptable to so many to desperately cling to an untestable and wildly improbable hypothesis?
ElectricPhase on September 25, 2009 at 10:22 PM
Probably so. My apologies. I still like to talk about it, though…even with like-mindies. :)
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:22 PM
Shame on you Mr. Allahpundit! You are faith-baiting everyone here and I am very disappointed in you.
redwhiteblue on September 25, 2009 at 10:23 PM
It has gotten grumpy around here so I’ve been lurking between sporadic smart @$$ remarks. Howdy -_*
thomasaur on September 25, 2009 at 10:23 PM
It’s pretty unavoidable. The theory grew to explain observed facts that were a really big surprise.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:23 PM
@ Gabe on September 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM
Do they tell people in churches to sound as dumb as they possibly can when discussing evolution as some sort of strategy to piss off people who are educated on the theory at least?
Lets see
You have no idea what evolution is, and you can’t even understand the word apparently. To evolve, according to you, is to magically appear suddenly. Yep, its easy to have a rational debate with someone like this.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:23 PM
Grow up.
Hot Air isn’t the echo chamber of your mind…or mine. It’s pretty easy going around here…learn to skip past the stuff that you’re not crazy about.
Asher on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 PM
Cute. :P
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 PM
What made you have anger toward religion?
faraway on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 PM
Who said I was a Christian? Did I?
I simply affirm that I believe in a God. I’m a religious “searcher” … I’m seeking the truth. I have read the Bible – and I’ve also read the Bhagvad Gita, the Mahabarata, and the Ramayana … and some other texts from Tibet, etc.
I thought Atheists were supposed to have a “wider view” of the world than religious folk. And yet here we see most of the atheists in this comment thread restricting their observations on religion to Christianity.
Come on – I thought you guys were multi-taskers!
HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 PM
“No, but I’m not aware of any scientists who claim the universe was created from ‘nothing.’”
OK,
http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/craig-atkins.html
Craig points out that Atkins’s views are very marginal among atheists, however.
ebrown2 on September 25, 2009 at 10:25 PM
You may be right, but I sincerely hope not.
ElectricPhase on September 25, 2009 at 10:26 PM
Can’t we all just get along :)
terryannonline on September 25, 2009 at 10:26 PM
Also goes against the idea that we’re evolved though.
To be fair, posts like that generally make bad peace offerings.
Esthier on September 25, 2009 at 10:26 PM
I keep addressing you, but you keep dodging. It’s an article of faith. It’s not testable and “wildly” improbable for a purpose. And who are you to say it’s desperate?
John the Libertarian on September 25, 2009 at 10:26 PM
The “Kirk Cameron” & “Left Behind” sect of Christianity is a bit creepy, and pretty hard to defend.
brak on September 25, 2009 at 10:27 PM
heh…reading over this thread, it’s funny to see how some self-professed Christians are really spreadin’ the love.
What else is new.
JetBoy on September 25, 2009 at 10:27 PM
Welcome to Hot Air. This appears to be your first visit. Let me show you around.
MadisonConservative on September 25, 2009 at 10:27 PM
@ faraway on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 PM
I read the bible. And posts like Gabe’s last one, where people who are all in on the religion sound like the dumbest people in the world. And the fact that it makes no sense and that people are encouraged never to question their faith and are directed away from educating themselves on things such as evolution which makes complete sense if you ACTUALLY read the evidence.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:27 PM
Hehe I remember when he got his costar fired because she once posed for playboy, what a dick.
It was his onscreen GF I believe.
Squid Shark on September 25, 2009 at 10:27 PM
I subscribe to the theory of devolution.
MadisonConservative on September 25, 2009 at 10:28 PM
I would be annoyed, as a theist, if nearly every time I came to HotAir Ed or Michelle posted some piece dealing with theism. Atheist’s want to remove In God We Trust from currency…great, write about it or provide a link. That deals with politics, kinda what HotAir is about. But this posting of a stupid video of what Kirk Cameron thinks just shows that AP felt like preaching again. Who cares what Cameron thinks? If I wanted to know what he thinks, I will Google his website, but I feel no way indebted to AP for providing me the opportunity to know what Kirk Cameron thinks.
This BS is just to stir up people, and collect ad revenue.
RobertInLexington on September 25, 2009 at 10:28 PM
;)
Hey, what could be more rational than saying, “It should happen once. Therefore it happens for every ‘step n.’ Then after taking the limit of all of these past universes one gets a limit past universe. Do this over and over again. Keep going. Eventually, one must get to an uncountable number of past universes. Keep going…”
MeatHeadinCA on September 25, 2009 at 10:28 PM
Something’s gotta explain liberals…that’s as good a theory as any.
JetBoy on September 25, 2009 at 10:29 PM
Not at all; they adapted to fit their environment.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:29 PM
@ HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 PM
Hmm, I wonder why. Its a thread about a notoriously ignorant christian pushing his religion on others and calling out atheists in a thread which is majority christian arguing with atheists about the validity of evolution whilst not even knowing the first thing about said scientific FACT. Wonder why I would focus on christianity.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:29 PM
Such compassion will not go unnoticed …you are a truly fine atheist …God bless you…
jerrytbg on September 25, 2009 at 10:29 PM
Who?!
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 PM
Huh? The only time you addressed me, I responded.
Asserting that something wildly improbable and not testable is desperate by definition.
ElectricPhase on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 PM
That is absolutely not true – and another example of simple-minded atheism which groups all religious people together.
In fact – many religions – Hinduism for one – encourage education. And in fact – many Christians believe in evolution.
HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 PM
Fair enough. I didn’t think we needed to be getting into relativity and 4-dimensional views of the universe. We wouldn’t want Gregor quizzing us about whether or not we were saying things “because you read a science journal telling you so”.
DaveS on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 PM
Some things you can’t prove, hence they are considered theories. Darwin’s theory of evolution is a theory because it assumes all life has a common ancestor. There is evidence that supports this theory, however it cannot be proven so it is taken on faith. Granted evolution and the theory of evolution are two separate things, evolution itself is a provable phenomenon.
You can argue that existence is evidence of a creator in the same manor that background radiation is evidence of the theory big bang. Or heck you could argue that the big bang is evidence of a creator.
jhffmn on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 PM
I hesitate to get involved in one of these mad discussions (and am not even going to mention creation ex nihilo. But…
Do you realize how short a time 150 years is?
Tzetzes on September 25, 2009 at 10:31 PM
Is it tacky to reference another blog here? Folks who are interested in these theist/atheist things might enjoy The Thomas Society; it’s intended to be a forum for both religious believers and atheists.
FeetOfShadows on September 25, 2009 at 10:31 PM
It’s a stalemate.
Believing in something that you do not have empirical evidence for is as illogical as being absoluting sure something doesn’t exist because you haven’t seen evidence ot it.
Many religious persons do claim to have seen or otherwise percieved something therefore they as indivduals are acting in a logical way even though their persoanl evidence can not be passed on to others.
LeeSeneca on September 25, 2009 at 10:31 PM
PIMF
ElectricPhase on September 25, 2009 at 10:31 PM
We certainly have ample evidence for it.
I don’t see how. People like that are far less likely to be able to pass along their genes.
Esthier on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
Athiest have their own “Left Behind” with the new ABC show, Flash Forward. (They were going to name it Flesh Forward, but thought better of it.)
faraway on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
In the 150 years since Darwin have myriad species been discovered. Far, far more than would’ve fit on a big ship made of gopher-wood and measured in ells.
Tzetzes on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
Alternative title: Atheistic thought shown to be harmful for country–despite claims of rational thought.
ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
Time + Chance + infinity= stuff
makes sense, right? Especially complexities like the human body…the internal mechanisms that seem so..so…designed. Little machines inside of us, you know? Not to mention the order built into the universe. It utterly amazes me…
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
Please explain how Kirk Cameron is pushing **anything** on you.
When did he come to your house and hold a gun on you and tell you to believe?
By God – we’ll jail this Christian Pirate!
HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
LOL! Well thank GOD I haven’t been “uneducated” as you have.
What does “Global Warming” have to do with this? Hmmmm …
Sound familiar?
The point is, that you base your “opinions” on the word of other men or women who voice their theories as facts. These “scientists” have spent thousands of years CHANGING THEIR MINDS repeatedly on theories, and every time telling you that they’ve now figured it out, even though they told you that the last ten times only to realize later that they were wrong.
Scientists have absolutely no idea what a black hole is. They guess, based on the tiny bit of information they have. Scientists have absolutely no idea how the universe started. They GUESS, based on the tiny bit of information they have. Scientists have ABSOLUTELY no idea how man was created, SO THEY GUESS and pass it off as fact.
Ultimately, you’re still left with the same problem once you believe what they tell you. Where did the gas and dust come from? How and why did it explode? What existed before the gas and dust that created the Big Bang?
Scientists don’t know Jack.
Gregor on September 25, 2009 at 10:33 PM
Exactly.
JetBoy on September 25, 2009 at 10:33 PM
Dude, you’re deep in the comment thread about something you don’t want to know about. If Allahpundit is there with you forcing you to read it take a picture. We’ll make it worth your while.
I don’t really care about Cameron’s view on anything either. But I’ve got a tab open with a Julie McCullough google image search, my beer isn’t cold yet, and my fish is still frozen. I’m just rolling with it.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:33 PM
Sure, but why?
ElectricPhase on September 25, 2009 at 10:34 PM
Dear goodness….you did it. You brought up the “Left Behind” series.
Nothing gives me greater chills…
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:34 PM
We are the lucky ones… Just wait till we encounter those un-designed aliens from the other planets that have evolved past an asteroid ;)
MeatHeadinCA on September 25, 2009 at 10:35 PM
I know of, uh, genes being passed along in a Wal-Mart.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:35 PM
(gasp) ME?! But, I’m…I’m mommypundit.
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:35 PM
I thought Allah’s birthday was last month. Silly me.
Cindy Munford on September 25, 2009 at 10:36 PM
The telling point for me is when you ask a scientist what was out there right before the Big Bang. They don’t know, and neither do I.
When you don’t know, you can’t make hard assertions. Bama is sort of a poster child for this rule…child, anyway…for how he has tried to sell the health plan.
So. I am a Christian, Jesus is my savior for all my failures. I find that the teachings of Jesus have made my life better, and could benefit more than a few other people if they would adopt them as a guide to life.
The atheist can proudly strut his disbelief, everyone needs an ego, but what do they have as a way to navigate life in a positive manner? I won’t claim expert here, but I don’t see much. It pretty much seems to be “I don’t believe, nyah, nyah…” without any discussion of a substitute moral code or anything that leaves a body with a touchstone for those days when the world seemms to be a madhouse and you need to turn off the white noise. Okay, so you deny God. And that means….?
I accept as a Christian that there is going to be a lot I will not understand…it’s too complex for a human. The atheist usually has no such humility, they really do have the answer. Just like Algore. I have found my intellectual limits, lessons learned from people I dismissed initially because they were old or slow or janitors…wisdom is where you find it…to be clear.
I think when you think you know it all, the science is “settled”, that you cannot bring new ideas into your mind and you have started to die. If you can’t adapt (take new information and change), you die. Duh.
The atheists might be right. I don’t think so, but I really don’t know. They can do what they wish, but don’t trash me or my faith. I don’t care what you do, as long as you treat my ideas with the same respect you expect me to treat yours. Neither of us really know, or can.
Maybe when we die we will find out.
Harry Schell on September 25, 2009 at 10:36 PM
Hey, hey now… everyone knows how you hate on Beck ;)
MeatHeadinCA on September 25, 2009 at 10:36 PM
Why would you even imagine that?
Esthier on September 25, 2009 at 10:37 PM
*shakes head*
humanahumana
JetBoy on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
@ HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 PM
For the last time, I am NOT talking about the FREAKING HINDUS.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
.
Umm…why would I do that?
ronsfi on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
Oh my.
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
Hehe … they have THIS.
HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
Slow down. Take a deeeeep breath.
What is the definition of an article of faith?
Okay, now that we’ve answered that, then: if it is an article of faith, do you see the fallacy of asking for evidence?
Small steps, Elly. Small steps.
John the Libertarian on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
Admit your hate now, and we’ll spare you.
MeatHeadinCA on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 PM
@ HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:32 PM
I said “others” not “me”. He is passing out books full of christian lies and he is trying to get his lies back into schools. Did you even watch the video and hear all of his complaining?
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
dthorny on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
I feel…cornered.
Diane on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
Yes, two different realms here. They don’t have as much to do with each other as some think.
exception on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
How about a little rational thought about science? If there is no God and no miracles, the laws of nature are immutable and never change. The Law of Entropy, which states that non-living matter always tends toward greater randomness and disorder, has therefore always been true. Le Chatelier’s Principle, which says states that a chemical reaction will reverse itself if the products of reaction are more plentiful than the reactants, has always been true.
According to Evolution theory, at sometime in the distant past, there was no life, no proteins, no DNA. Maybe there was an ocean filled with amino acids covering the earth. There are 42 different amino acids, in left- and right-handed forms, but protein molecules only use left-handed forms. To make an enzyme molecule of say, 100 amino acids, all lined up in the right order, the chances of this happening at random is 42 to the 100th power. Even if we imagine an ocean 1 km deep covering the earth, filled with amino acids, reacting at 100 trillion reactions per second per molecule for 5 billion years, the chance of getting 1 protein molecule in the right order, with the Law of Entropy in effect, is less than 1 in a trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion.
When amino acids react, they release water. According to Le Chatelier’s Principle, the accumulating water would reverse the reaction, breaking apart the protein.
If the laws of nature do not change, no protein molecules ever formed spontaneously from non-living amino acids in the absence of RNA (which attracts amino acids to reaction sites) and cell structures which remove water from the reaction.
There are therefore no functional enzymes (proteins), no DNA, and therefore no living cells on Earth.
Oops, wait a minute, the real Earth is full of people, animals, and plants, which all have trillions of cells, proteins, and DNA molecules.
Therefore, we must assume that there was a time in the past when the Law of Entropy did not hold, or that some tremendous intelligence “organized” living organisms and programmed them to reproduce themselves. But what, or who, could change the immutable Law of Entropy?
This isn’t religion, this is biology and chemistry and statistics and rational thought, which leads to the need for some superior intelligence to transcend the laws of nature. Rational thought leads inexorably to belief in miracles.
Steve Z on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
Look to Darwin when you need a friend /s
MeatHeadinCA on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
Yeah, because the headlines each day get better and better.
Did you get your unicorn yet?
wccawa on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
@ dthorny on September 25, 2009 at 10:41 PM
Yep, THAT is what people are trying to argue with. So freaking sad.
thphilli on September 25, 2009 at 10:42 PM
Are you an atheist? Forgive me – but I’m not sure. If you are – then aren’t you being a bit selective in only addressing the Christian view of religion?
And – I don’t think you’ve answered my question on how Kirk Cameron is FORCING his beliefs on you. Seems he’s put out a video – and you can watch it or not.
And he’s being pelted with criticism as if he were Hitler. Think what you will about his comments – but they aren’t dangerous.
Lighten up.
HondaV65 on September 25, 2009 at 10:42 PM
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