NYT/CBS poll shows Obama losing ground on health care, Afghanistan

posted at 9:35 am on September 25, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

The latest New York Times/CBS poll has some bad news for Barack Obama, although the two media outlets did their best to avoid it in their sampling.  He has lost ground on Afghanistan, almost certainly from his liberal base, and his media blitz has done nothing to change minds on health care.  His approval ratings remain relatively high, but that has more to do with the sample, which has become an absolute embarrassment in political polling (via Tom Maguire):

At 56 percent, Mr. Obama’s job approval rating is similar to what President Ronald Reagan’s was at this point in his first term (53 percent); President Bill Clinton’s was at 43 percent. Still, Mr. Obama’s approval is down from 68 percent in the spring.

The percentage of people who approve of the way he has dealt with Afghanistan has dropped to 44 percent from 56 percent in April. The percentage of Americans who approve of his handling of the economy, at 50 percent, has dropped from 61 percent since April. In April, Mr. Obama had a 43-point advantage over Republicans in terms of who would make the right decisions on the economy; that has dropped to a 26-point advantage. …

The poll found that an intense campaign by Mr. Obama to rally support behind his health care plan — including an address to Congress, a run of television interviews and rallies across the country — appears to have done little to allay concerns.

Majorities of respondents said that they were confused about the health care argument and that Mr. Obama had not done a good job in explaining what he was trying to accomplish.

Let’s get to the sampling first.  The party split in the sample has Republicans at 22%, Democrats at 37%, and independents at 33%.  That would make sense — if Barack Obama had won the presidential election by 20 points last November.  Since Obama won by seven points, with strong support from independents and some crossover Republicans, the notion of a 15-point gap in party affiliation was ludicrous then, and is even more ludicrous now.  Their July sample had a 14-point gap, which means the pollsters must feel that Democrats have gained ground over the last two months.

In fact, one might suspect that the gap has narrowed since the election, especially considering the public reaction to Obama’s plans.  However, the NYT/CBS polling a week before the election — when they were trying to pick the results as closely as possible to bolster their credibility — showed a seven point gap between Democrats and Republicans, 30/37/27, respectively.  It seems that the NYT/CBS pollsters know how to find a reliable, predictive sample when it suits their purposes, and how to avoid one as well.

Even with the artificially inflated partisan imbalance and the use of adults rather than registered or likely voters (which are more predictive), the poll has bad news for Obama.  The 15-point advantage only gives him a 10-point advantage on the economy (50%-40% approving), down from a 32-point gap in April.  He has a two-point gap on health care and fails to get a majority in support (47%-45%).

And here’s an indicator that the Hope and Change has begun to wear off: a majority (56%) believe Obama will break his campaign promise not to raise taxes on the middle class. That may be the reason why support for a complete overhaul of the American health-care system has dropped from 38% to 27% in five months.  Or, it could have something to do with 78% of respondents being satisfied with the quality of health care they receive.

Obama should take no satisfaction in these poll results, if his advisers are looking honestly at how the NYT and CBS conducted the survey.  And these “news” agencies should be explaining why their sample varies so widely between the final election polling and pretty much every other time they survey.  It’s dishonest to the extreme.

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Comment pages: 1 2

These polls come out about every other day and for weeks have said the same thing. Nothing to see here…REALLY!

Jeff from WI on September 25, 2009 at 9:37 AM

D +15 sample.

They should be LAUGHED at by other media outlets.

Oh wait, they support their mission.

artist on September 25, 2009 at 9:38 AM

The latest New York Times/CBS poll has some bad news for Barack Obama, although the two media outlets did their best to avoid it in their sampling.

Barack Obama: So baaad, that not even race bias NOR sampling bias can hide his crappy performance anymore…

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:39 AM

At 56 percent, Mr. Obama’s job approval rating is similar to what President Ronald Reagan’s was at this point in his first term (53 percent)

They couldn’t resist… are they also predicting a 49-state swamping in 2012?

mankai on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

An American Idol goes to Washington. What could go wrong?

Electrongod on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

The Paulistas will almost certainly point to this as proof they are gaining huge numbers of osterich-imitating adherents.

unclesmrgol on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

It’s dishonest to the extreme.

Ya think?

Obama should take no satisfaction in these poll results

I doubt he’s looking (or caring) about the polls — he and the dems are gonna “ram” through this debacles on health care and then take 3 years to run for reelection. It will probably work.

rebuzz on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

NYT/CBS poll in 2012: Republicans 5%, Independents 30%, fellow comrades Democrats 65%

nyx on September 25, 2009 at 9:41 AM

Well when you are asking for a bailout you better give the president the numbers he wants.

sammypants on September 25, 2009 at 9:42 AM

The poll found that an intense campaign by Mr. Obama to rally support behind his health care plan — including an address to Congress, a run of television interviews and rallies across the country — appears to have done little to allay concerns

.

Which means that the filthy liar and his corrupt party will bypass “stupid Americans” and seize healthcare “for our own good” and the gratification of the radical special interests. That’s right, the rat bastard traitor is intending to use the nuclear option.

highhopes on September 25, 2009 at 9:42 AM

They couldn’t resist… are they also predicting a 49-state swamping in 2012?

mankai on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

That would be a 57-state swamping. Obama has a few more electoral votes in his pockets from the additional states.

unclesmrgol on September 25, 2009 at 9:42 AM

Now this calls for a song…

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:42 AM

Ed: Question? Is it possible to re-calculate the poll mumbers to show new results on the basis of what the election demographics were? That would provide some interesting contrast to this obviously skewed poll.

PatriotRider on September 25, 2009 at 9:43 AM

Proves two things. a. Public increasingly rejecting Obama’s agenda, and b. The msm desperation and dishonesty is growing to the point of criminality.

marklmail on September 25, 2009 at 9:43 AM

It’s dishonest to the extreme.

Honesty is not a liberal virtue. In fact, to them it’s cool to be deceptive. How silly of us to expect any of them to tell the whole truth especially their lead liar in the White House.

Christian Conservative on September 25, 2009 at 9:44 AM

I doubt he’s looking (or caring) about the polls — he and the dems are gonna “ram” through this debacles on health care and then take 3 years to run for reelection. It will probably work.

rebuzz on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

Maybe for the filthy liar but not so much for Congressional candidates and the Senators up for reelection in 2010. What it really comes down to now is who is going to take a bullet for the filthy liar- Bluedog Democrats or the fringe left who are upset that the proposals don’t go far enough.

highhopes on September 25, 2009 at 9:44 AM

can a poll be reweighted without introducing a lot of bias?

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:45 AM

This poll should be renamed the Pravda Poll.

ICBM on September 25, 2009 at 9:45 AM

Even with one term, at the rate Joker is fouling up this country we should be reduced to the status of a small European duchy by the time Hillary gets elected…..and if in some amazing quirk, he gets impeached…..we get VP Dumbbell as POTUS.

Hening on September 25, 2009 at 9:45 AM

What is it with the NYT/CBS pollsters? They’re the worst when it comes to sampling Dems over the GOP. At the rate they’re going, the polls right before the 2010 midterms will be outsampling Dems over Republicans by 30%.

Doughboy on September 25, 2009 at 9:46 AM

If an election was held in Australia today Kevin Rudd would win easily as well.

What is wrong with the world?

Crux Australis on September 25, 2009 at 9:46 AM

What is it with the NYT/CBS pollsters? They’re the worst when it comes to sampling Dems over the GOP. At the rate they’re going, the polls right before the 2010 midterms will be outsampling Dems over Republicans by 30%.

Doughboy on September 25, 2009 at 9:46 AM

when all you have to sample from are the invite lists from cocktail parties, then what else would you expect…?

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:47 AM

The next poll NYT/CBS will put out will be a dismal Palin poll. This will make all the democrats breathe a sigh of relief that at least he is more popular than her. Because that is all that matters, you know, how LIKED you are. Competence is secondary. Sick to death of this idiot president.

KickandSwimMom on September 25, 2009 at 9:47 AM

It’s dishonest to the extreme.

I love the joint session, “you lie!” picture accompanying the blog post. It fits perfectly with the story line. Brilliant!

glennbo on September 25, 2009 at 9:48 AM

Fake and inaccurate.

SouthernGent on September 25, 2009 at 9:50 AM

The lede should be:

A recent poll by State Run Stenographers shows continued high approval of Mr. Obama’s presidency, but with lessening support for his healthcare and Afghanistan programs.

TXUS on September 25, 2009 at 9:51 AM

It seems that the NYT/CBS pollsters know how to find a reliable, predictive sample when it suits their purposes, and how to avoid one as well.

Keep on keeping them honest…at least we can count on you to take apart a spoll–even this pathetic attempt at one.

RepubChica on September 25, 2009 at 9:51 AM

a majority (56%) believe Obama will break his campaign promise not to raise taxes on the middle class

He’ll break it and tell us that a tax isn’t a tax.

Meanwhile, any tax on those who produce goods and services is immediately passed on to consumers.

Barack Obama is an insult to the intelligence. This guy has done nothing but lie to the American people from the moment he took office.

NoDonkey on September 25, 2009 at 9:51 AM

It’s not his fault.

He’s dealing with a country so stupid they think a fine collected by the IRS to pay for a government program is really a tax.

Chuck Schick on September 25, 2009 at 9:52 AM

He won. Shouldn’t that be enough?

/lib

crazy_legs on September 25, 2009 at 9:52 AM

I ran the numbers in a much more scientific way. Taking out the skewed figures and plugging in the actual % of voters and their registration…then re-adjusting for local anomolies…I created a computer analysis. It took awhile the final result is much more accurate. This is the printed result.

“OBAMA SUCKS”

right2bright on September 25, 2009 at 9:53 AM

Obviously he just isn’t able to get his message out over all the “noise”… a few more TV appearances and his numbers will come around.

saint kansas on September 25, 2009 at 9:53 AM

“OBAMA SUCKS”

right2bright on September 25, 2009 at 9:53 AM

must be a capitalist computer….

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:55 AM

It’s dishonest to the extreme.

I expect nothing less from the SRM and the Obama administration.

farright on September 25, 2009 at 9:57 AM

Obviously he just isn’t able to get his message out over all the “noise”… a few more TV appearances and his numbers will come around.

saint kansas on September 25, 2009 at 9:53 AM

Absolutely, if only he were more visible on this issue. Maybe he should be doing some town halls to convince the majority of Americans that they just don’t get it.

highhopes on September 25, 2009 at 9:57 AM

can a poll be reweighted without introducing a lot of bias?

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:45 AM

Yes. Can and should be. That would make it a stratified poll — which is the right way to do this. They know how to do a decent poll; they just don’t wanna.

Pythagoras on September 25, 2009 at 9:59 AM

Maybe we could send him to VEnezuela–i betcha he polls better down there….

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:00 AM

…didn’t believe he had done a good job explaining himself. More like, don’t buy what he’s selling but answering politely.

Kissmygrits on September 25, 2009 at 10:01 AM

crazy_legs on September 25, 2009 at 9:52 AM

I realize you posted that with tongue firmly planted in cheek but, when you think about it, the “I won” attitude is pretty much the way he’s organized the debate on this issue. We were not supposed to ask the critical questions about Obamacare. We were not to question our leaders or demand a say in the debate. The filthy liar in the White House simply doesn’t respect Americans enough to take our concerns seriously. He thinks he has a far bigger mandate that he has and the freefall is about to slap him hard.

highhopes on September 25, 2009 at 10:02 AM

It is surprising that they threw the Afghanistan question into the poll with the others that they wanted to inflate in The One’s favor. They could have easily added it to another poll, and undersampled Democrats, and made it look more favorable to Obambi.

mwdiver on September 25, 2009 at 10:02 AM

Obviously, they only polled in urban areas

J_Crater on September 25, 2009 at 10:02 AM

Next NYTimes headline: “Why is America becoming more racist!”

rbj on September 25, 2009 at 10:03 AM

can a poll be reweighted without introducing a lot of bias?

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 9:45 AM
Yes. Can and should be. That would make it a stratified poll — which is the right way to do this. They know how to do a decent poll; they just don’t wanna.

Pythagoras on September 25, 2009 at 9:59 AM

You’re right. I found some stuff where epidemiologic data is weighted IN FAVOR of minorities etc. because they aren’t as included in the sample, hence unrepresented. The statisticians then weight the sample toward the unrepresented minority towards something that better reflects the actual proportion of minorities in the population of interest.

It’s funny how those same methods are completely ignored in political polling. What an utter farce…

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:03 AM

Ogabe’s advisers have created a new tactic to regain the initiative: Give a townhall speech and say exactly what he has been saying for the last five months.

Bishop on September 25, 2009 at 10:03 AM

if his advisers are looking honestly at how the NYT and CBS conducted the survey.

they’ll take anything they can get and proudly proclaim it…

cmsinaz on September 25, 2009 at 10:04 AM

For all we know they sampled 1% republicans.

It’s the media, stupid.

fogw on September 25, 2009 at 10:04 AM

Absolutely, if only he were more visible on this issue. Maybe he should be doing some town halls to convince the majority of Americans that they just don’t get it.

highhopes on September 25, 2009 at 9:57 AM

I would like to see Obama do town halls without the “plants,” bet he would get a lot of “you lie.”

farright on September 25, 2009 at 10:04 AM

speaking of polls, have we had the obligatory “Obama hits new low” poll thread of the week yet?

is rasmussen off?

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:05 AM

OK, and the three-letter networks can claim moral superiority in their objectivity over Fox, how?

AZfederalist on September 25, 2009 at 10:05 AM

In other words, Dear Leader has fallen so far that short of only polling the people who work for the NYT and CBS they can’t get the “Obama Rulez” result they desire.

THAT should scare Zero and the dems.

wildcat84 on September 25, 2009 at 10:06 AM

Something is very fishy about this poll. Dear Leader should have at least a 99% approval rating.

bitsy on September 25, 2009 at 10:06 AM

baracky needs to go on Dancing with the Stars, America’s got Talent, Big Brother, Wife Swap, and Top Model to up his numbers. Why are they hiding him ?

runner on September 25, 2009 at 10:07 AM

No wonder the diversity czar at FCC wants a paralell news network run by government, on top of what exists.

They can’t get the answers they want even from the pandering media. Need more control to get the RIGHT numbers.

I want to wake up from this bad dream.

Harry Schell on September 25, 2009 at 10:07 AM

These pollsters begin with the results, then fudge, jimmy or jigger the methods until they get them.

It’s going to get so bad that they’ll have to concede that they are beginning to actually pay democrats to say that they love barack obama and sing his praises like da little tykes up in NJ.

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:08 AM

My goodness! You’ve used ‘Obama’s advisors” and “honestly” in the same sentence? Please Ed.

Griz on September 25, 2009 at 10:08 AM

baracky needs to go on Dancing with the Stars, America’s got Talent, Big Brother, Wife Swap, and Top Model to up his numbers. Why are they hiding him ?

runner on September 25, 2009 at 10:07 AM

whew, i feel sorry for some unlucky dude on wife swap. sheesh.

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:08 AM

“Uh, and, y-y-you know, the tracking poll is sort of like the stock market in economics. It bobs up and down day to day, uh, and if you spend all your time worrying about that, you’re probably going to get long-term strategy wrong,” Sheik Barack Hussein al-Kenyi bin Obooba, J.D., President of the United States.

Akzed on September 25, 2009 at 10:08 AM

However, the NYT/CBS polling a week before the election — when they were trying to pick the results as closely as possible to bolster their credibility — showed a seven point gap between Democrats and Republicans, 30/37/27, respectively. It seems that the NYT/CBS pollsters know how to find a reliable, predictive sample when it suits their purposes, and how to avoid one as well.

I see you fail to site this stat:

How would you describe your views on most political matters?

Lib 21; Mod 39; Con 36.

http://documents.nytimes.com/new-york-times-cbs-news-poll-confusion-over-health-care-tepid-support-for-war#p=25

And to your claim that the NYTimes is purposely skewing the political leanings of the poll one way or another, they posted how they conducted the poll on the site:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/25/us/25mbox.html

It’s done more or less at random.

But, this poll shows the same result that every other poll out there has shown… there is public support for a public option. It’s not a radical left-wing position, but a moderate position with support of the majority of Americans.

Tom_Shipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:10 AM

Dear Capitalistic Scum Bourgeouse filth American people,
I am saddened by your losing interest in my magnificence. Father Obama is very upset at your lack of respect for Daddy’s plans about your tonsils Health Care and gallantly surrendering in Af-ghan-nees-stanh and Pah-keeh-stan. Your constant 9/12 protests disturbed my date with Mrs. Obama and a day of weeping at the feet of negotiating with my true love Iranian President Ahmadinejad. I will shortly send in my eunuchs my flatterers media to fudge get your opinion. I hope you would not making your Father angry due to your latent racism skepticism.
Yours
B.H.O

nyx on September 25, 2009 at 10:10 AM

The DeadTree/VacuumTube media strikes again. Both of these organizations have lost the faith of the national audience. They are desperately trying to hang on to their core constituency by giving them what they want.

Hint: It ain’t working fools. That economic model is a failure.

BillyGoatGruff on September 25, 2009 at 10:12 AM

At 56 percent, Mr. Obama’s job approval rating is similar to what President Ronald Reagan’s was at this point in his first term (53 percent); President Bill Clinton’s was at 43 percent. Still, Mr. Obama’s approval is down from 68 percent in the spring.

And where does it stand in relation to Dubya’s at this point in his first term?

The answer to that question is not one that will ever see the light of day in the New York Times.

Pablo on September 25, 2009 at 10:12 AM

speaking of polls, have we had the obligatory “Obama hits new low” poll thread of the week yet?

is rasmussen off?

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:05 AM

Rassmusen has Obama polling ahead slightly at 51/48%.

farright on September 25, 2009 at 10:13 AM

Tom_Dipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:10 AM

It is socialism. What’s moderate about that?

Akzed on September 25, 2009 at 10:13 AM

No wonder the diversity czar at FCC wants a paralell news network run by government, on top of what exists.

They can’t get the answers they want even from the pandering media. Need more control to get the RIGHT numbers.

I want to wake up from this bad dream.

Harry Schell on September 25, 2009 at 10:07 AM

Their problem is that the people are seeing through this. Most view the “mainstream” media negatively and as propaganda spreaders.

The HUGE miscalculation that 0bama made and continues to make is that his election was a mandate to transform the United States from a Constitutional Republic to a Soviet Socialist “Republic” within months and to do so out in the open without the people shouting HELL NO!

wildcat84 on September 25, 2009 at 10:14 AM

whew, i feel sorry for some unlucky dude on wife swap. sheesh.

ted c on September 25, 2009 at 10:08 AM

A replacement for waterboarding in new enhanced interogation techniques.

farright on September 25, 2009 at 10:15 AM

The poll found that an intense campaign by Mr. Obama to rally support behind his health care plan…

It’s good to see the media finally admitting that Dear Leader is doing nothing but campaigning.

behiker on September 25, 2009 at 10:15 AM

I was watching TV last night and even a lib said that someone (i.e. group) is going to be shafted with the NHC bill, they just can’t figure out who it’ll be. I think it was in the context of seniors facing Medicate cuts and how the Dems better pass on angering them. I think that the Dems are going all in on this and if it fails (which may be their objective) blame the “right-wing nuts” to temper the coming 2010 losses. See Schumer and Rocky’s insistence on the inclusion of a public option in the Baucus Bill for affirmation – I thought that the PO was dead in the Senate? Go figure.

volnation on September 25, 2009 at 10:16 AM

I’m truly looking forward to the day in the not too distant future when I can read/hear that the NYT has gone bankrupt.

BillyGoatGruff on September 25, 2009 at 10:17 AM

How shocking.

JeffinOrlando on September 25, 2009 at 10:17 AM

Obama should take no satisfaction in these poll results, if his advisers are looking honestly at how the NYT and CBS conducted the survey. And these “news” agencies should be explaining why their sample varies so widely between the final election polling and pretty much every other time they survey. It’s dishonest to the extreme.

The great thing about polling is you really only have to be right just before the election to maintain your reputation, because there’s no other real verification process. So as long as the numbers aren’t so skewered that they glaringly stand out (such as a sampling with Republican IDs in the teens and Democrats in the 40s or 50s), you can get away with what’s basically a sampling-based push poll.

jon1979 on September 25, 2009 at 10:17 AM

It’s not a radical left-wing position

yes it is. they’ve been rying to shove this down our throats for the last 40 years. never worked, never will work. ruinous for every country that tried it. just like socialism, but, the proletariat of the world would like to thank you for your efforts.

runner on September 25, 2009 at 10:17 AM

GOP sample is 22%? Are you kidding me?
That their Dear Leader is only at 56% tells you how bad it really is.

jjshaka on September 25, 2009 at 10:17 AM

Don’t you love liberals: “Wow. This is getting hard. Let’s quit!”

Rod on September 25, 2009 at 10:18 AM

It’s not a radical left-wing position, but a moderate position with support of the majority of Americans.

Tom_Shipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:10 AM

You lie.

fogw on September 25, 2009 at 10:19 AM

World leader know there’s a Democrat in power, so they rightly sense weakness. They’re now shocked by the tea party protests coming so soon after his messiah like election.
The world knows we elected a man who had accomplished nothing, and continues in that fine tradition. We can only his removal by 2012 so we can “toughen up” the Presidency before it costs us big.

Jeff from WI on September 25, 2009 at 10:21 AM

If an election was held in Australia today Kevin Rudd would win easily as well.

What is wrong with the world?

Crux Australis on September 25, 2009 at 9:46 AM

My niece move to Tazmania from Texas and attended the “uni”, as she says, and in only four years of propaganda, she made a hard left turn.

Johan Klaus on September 25, 2009 at 10:21 AM

Crux Australis on September 25, 2009 at 9:46 AM

Fair dinkum!

OldEnglish on September 25, 2009 at 10:24 AM

They couldn’t resist… are they also predicting a 49-state 57-state swamping in 2012?

mankai on September 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM

Fixed it for you.

Fortunately Hannah and James “fixed” ACORN, so that leaves Zero only 3 years to build a replacement.

That’s why we need to be vigilant, as ACORN disappears that it’s parts don’t just re form under a new name.

wildcat84 on September 25, 2009 at 10:25 AM

Tom_Shipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:10 AM

Communism/socialism is moderation? Is that from “Merriam’s” dictionary?

Johan Klaus on September 25, 2009 at 10:25 AM

He doesn’t care. It’s about deconstructing and reformulating domestic American life around a State-run economy, then waging a scorched-earth reelection campaign, a strategy which will include going to war in 2011.

rrpjr on September 25, 2009 at 10:26 AM

There’s just one poll that will matter: the one taken in Nov. 2010.

NebCon on September 25, 2009 at 10:27 AM

Larger truths and hand grenades.

spmat on September 25, 2009 at 10:30 AM

Johan Klaus on September 25, 2009 at 10:21 AM

Tasmania is not part of Australia. Well, … it is, but we don’t like to admit it.

OldEnglish on September 25, 2009 at 10:31 AM

WOW, the Propaganda arm is flailing OVERTIME.

marklmail on September 25, 2009 at 10:39 AM

You lie.

No, it’s you guys who lie when you paint the public option as a radical idea that does not have moderate support. Even Rasssmussen show public support for the public option:

2* Suppose the President and Congressional Democrats decide not to include the public option in the final health care legislation. Would that make the legislation better, worse, or have no impact?
22% Better
41% Worse
19% No impact
18% Not sure

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/toplines/pt_survey_toplines/august_2009/toplines_public_option_august_17_18_2009

Tom_Shipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:40 AM

I would love to see just one poll from someone were the sample was consistent with the true make up of the american people.Like this 42% conservative,38% moderate,19% liberal.

thmcbb on September 25, 2009 at 10:46 AM

Let’s get to the sampling first. The party split in the sample has Republicans at 22%, Democrats at 37%, and independents at 33%.

ROFL

Another blatant affront to our intelligence. They are desperate. Even their cheerleaders engage in lying to prop them up.

dogsoldier on September 25, 2009 at 10:48 AM

Let’s get to the sampling first. The party split in the sample has Republicans at 22%, Democrats at 37%

It’s an awful lot worse than that. This is what is referred to in statistics as a SYSTEMIC ERROR. It cannot be corrected by any amount of mathematic manipulation.

It isn’t like there was a pot full of Republicans and a pot full of Democrats that they randomly selected the wrong number of samples from. Their polled sample from came from a more-liberal-than-average group.

This means that the Republicans in the sample are likely to be more liberal than a random sampling of Republicans would be. That goes double for the “independents”. And even the Democrats in the poll would be somewhat more liberal than average Democrats.

logis on September 25, 2009 at 10:48 AM

Obama should take no satisfaction in these poll results, if his advisers are looking honestly at how the NYT and CBS conducted the survey. And these “news” agencies should be explaining why their sample varies so widely between the final election polling and pretty much every other time they survey. It’s dishonest to the extreme.

His advisers know that the NYT and CBS will always carry water for them, and they know that just enough Americans won’t pay attentions to the underlying sampling games that NYT and CBS are playing. So they don’t have to be honest.

In addition, the NYT and CBS have way too much invested in Obama, so they’ll never allow him to look as weak as he really is. As long as they can game the results to keep Obama as “no worse” than anyone else, they’ll do so.

BuckeyeSam on September 25, 2009 at 10:49 AM

Would that make the legislation better, worse, or have no impact?

22% Better
41% Worse
19% No impact
18% Not sure

Tom_Shipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:40 AM

National Survey of 1,000 Likely Voters
Conducted August 17-18, 2009

By Rasmussen Reports

HAHAHAHA. That’s all you got, a stale poll.

fogw on September 25, 2009 at 10:50 AM

It’s dishonest to the extreme.

In other words, “business as usual” for the Left Stream Media.

GarandFan on September 25, 2009 at 11:00 AM

Tom_Shipley on September 25, 2009 at 10:40 AM

Also from Rasmussen, September 25, 2009 – a little more recent than your poll Tom ……

“Fifteen percent (15%) say most members of Congress are genuinely interested in helping people, but 74% say they are more interested in furthering their own political careers. These results have remained fairly consistent since January 2009.”

Consistent from January 2009. Hmmmmm, what’s the significance of that?

fogw on September 25, 2009 at 11:04 AM

Consistent from January 2009. Hmmmmm, what’s the significance of that?

fogw on September 25, 2009 at 11:04 AM

It’s pretty common for Congress to poll low. Most people dislike Congress but USUALLY like their own Congressman (ie: they dislike everyone else’s).

However, when people connect their OWN Congressman with something they really dislike, such as Obamacare or Cap and Tax, as voting for it and going against their will, then polls like this take on an extra significance.

wildcat84 on September 25, 2009 at 11:21 AM

HAHAHAHA. That’s all you got, a stale poll.

fogw on September 25, 2009 at 10:50 AM

The other thing is that the public option as described by Obama and Co. in 2009, versus what the public option is meant to accomplish, i.e. drive private insurers out of business over time, decreases the reliability of any poll that doesn’t include a clause about the fact that the public option, in all likelihood, will eventually drive private insurers out of business. I doubt that would poll well as a description of the public option, but it would be the most accurate description, and the Left knows it.

venividivici on September 25, 2009 at 11:42 AM

I’m surprised they still even both to poll Republicans at all. You’d think they’d just officially declare us unpersons and stick to the liberals and independents.

Blacklake on September 25, 2009 at 11:44 AM

What is it with the NYT/CBS pollsters? They’re the worst when it comes to sampling Dems over the GOP.

Doughboy on September 25, 2009 at 9:46 AM

Actually I saw an al-AP “poll” a few months back-it sampled twice as many Democrats as Republicans.

Del Dolemonte on September 25, 2009 at 12:23 PM

And to your claim that the NYTimes is purposely skewing the political leanings of the poll one way or another, they posted how they conducted the poll on the site:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/25/us/25mbox.html

It’s done more or less at random.

But, this poll shows the same result that every other poll out there has shown… there is public support for a public option. It’s not a radical left-wing position, but a moderate position with support of the majority of Americans.

Tom_Ochs_Sulzburger on September 25, 2009 at 10:10 AM

FIFY

Del Dolemonte on September 25, 2009 at 12:25 PM

f.a.i.l. please Mr. Obama. FAIL!

redwhiteblue on September 25, 2009 at 12:47 PM

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