Can Obama do math?

posted at 10:50 am on September 12, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

I’m not asking this to be snarky, or at least not entirely.  Barack Obama twice this week made an argument that he can squeeze $4 trillion in deficit reduction “over the long term” from an industry that generates a total of $2.3 trillion a year — by slowing the rate of cost inflation through his overhaul prescription.  Put aside for the moment whether ObamaCare will slow the rate of growth at all, and how Obama plans to make that happen without rationing.  How can he claim to get $4 trillion out of a $2.3 trillion stone, especially since the government’s portion in that is only somewhere between a third and a half?

And as I have said over and over again, I will not sign a plan that adds one dime to our deficits – period. This plan will be paid for. The middle-class will realize greater security, not higher taxes. And if we can successfully slow the growth of health care costs by just one-tenth of one percent each year, it will actually reduce the deficit by $4 trillion over the long term.

According to Pacific Research Institute, Medicare and Medicaid cost slightly over $800 billion in 2008, or just about 35% of the entire gross product of the US health-care industry. PRI also notes that government costs have risen faster than the health-care system as a whole, which calls into question whether government programs are the actual cause of the rate of growth in health-care costs. Those numbers appear to correlate with the latest figures of the Census Bureau, which puts the government coverage of the American people at around 34% of the insured population.

But the problem goes further than that. How can Obama claim that he can get $4 trillion in deficit reduction from reducing the growth rate in health-care costs? I posed this question to King Banaian, everyone’s favorite economist, who produced a spreadsheet using data from the HHS on the entire industry, outlining the entirety of cost savings to the industry as a whole (and not just the deficit) by slowing down the cost curve:

In a ten-year window, even if Obama delivered what he promised twice this week, it would save a grand total of $33 billion dollars — and that’s for the whole industry.  If the government covered a third of the costs, the total deficit reduction over ten years drops to a mere $11 billion dollars over 10 years.  At that rate, how long will the “long run” need to be to save $4 trillion dollars in deficit spending?   It would have to be 3,634 years.

Either Obama needs a remedial math lesson, or he’s lying through his teeth.

Addendum: I reserve the right to use this as an OOTD later this week.

Update: Actually, I made a math error here.  The $11 billion was over ten years, not one year, which makes the actual time 3,634 years — or about the same period from Moses to now.  One reader says that I’m not considering compounding, and he puts the overall savings at $220 billion over ten years and the government savings at less than $80 billion, but that still makes the payoff to $4 trillion hundreds of years off.

Blowback

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I don’t understand how people are falling for this guy’s lies after 1 speech? What is wrong with this country and its people? I expect things like that in Hitler’s GErmany and Europe, but America? This guy is so obviously a charlatan and I simply cannot believe that a speech can make such a difference. Anyway, Fox is reporting that 10s of thousands are in Wash DC, is that true? It looks like a lot more people. I sure hope so because when conservatives protest, it better be large crowds for the media, in light of their subjective coverage or non-coverage and open HATE for conservatives.

immigrantchick on September 12, 2009 at 11:58 AM

liar in chief: “no, your honor, i did not rob the bank, i just asked for a loan with my gun drawn and they gave me the money.”
judge: “who brought these bogus charges against you? you are free to go.”

mydogwonthunt on September 12, 2009 at 11:58 AM

An actual “thousand” is called a “trillion” in that very special community organizer Ebonics math.

TexasJew on September 12, 2009 at 11:58 AM

There are three types of people in this country. Those who understand math. And those who don’t.

Crusader Rabbit on September 12, 2009 at 11:59 AM

If we just applied Obama math to everything then there would be no deficit currently. He would have cured all of the problems he inherited in his first hundred days and we’d be well on our way to bigger and more government-y things already.

By his ‘jobs saved or created’ logic it’s surprising he hasn’t claimed to have saved trillions in cost already. I guess it was his back pocket asset to sell Obamacare.

Lying, math, these are not the President’s problems. His problem is that there are people who can do math. He’ll have to turn his sights on education next to take care of that problem.

Dean_L_Can on September 12, 2009 at 11:59 AM

TexasJew at 11:58: It depends on the situation. Under Obamacare, trillions of dollars are “not one thin dime.”

GaltBlvnAtty on September 12, 2009 at 12:01 PM

Math is hard!
Where is my free health care?

Lonetown on September 12, 2009 at 12:02 PM

I don’t understand how people are falling for this guy’s lies after 1 speech? What is wrong with this country and its people?
immigrantchick

They aren’t. People are slowly waking up. They are giving him a year or two in time (‘benefit of the doubt’} but Barry will be in a free fall afterwards.

nyx on September 12, 2009 at 12:04 PM

He excels at division.

beatcanvas on September 12, 2009 at 12:11 PM

Math,schmath. A commie will say and do anything to get through their insidious agenda, numbers don’t mean a thing. Until election day that is. I don’t think ACORN will be around for the next one…How many dead people will that be out of the process???? Try to do the math on that Comrade in Chief…….

adamsmith on September 12, 2009 at 12:11 PM

They aren’t. People are slowly waking up. They are giving him a year or two in time (’benefit of the doubt’} but Barry will be in a free fall afterwards.

nyx on September 12, 2009 at 12:04 PM

That’s my take as well – which is why he’s trying to ram everything through ASAP. I think that by mid-2010 his name will be mud. Not much said about this, but if the two governor’s races go strongly red this fall, a good many Congressional Dems will go white with fear for 11/2010.

volnation on September 12, 2009 at 12:11 PM

nyx at 12:04
I am not sure we have that much time to prevent huge damage to our country. We are dealing with an enemy that knows there will be a counterattack someday, so they are doing all they can to make their actions irreversible from a practical point of view.

GaltBlvnAtty on September 12, 2009 at 12:11 PM

His I.Q. is off the charts.

Did it ever occur to you that the reason you can’t understand him is because his modalities of thought are way out there and yours are pedestrian and common sense.

I sneer at the lot of you.

jeff_from_mpls on September 12, 2009 at 11:26 AM

Are you serious?

Obimbo has the I.Q. of a donut hole. His literacy extends to reading teleprompters and parroting Axels talking points, which is apparently the best Harvard has to offer.

anXdem on September 12, 2009 at 12:13 PM

“Shut up, ” Obama calculated.

PackerBronco on September 12, 2009 at 12:13 PM

This guy is completely lost.

Does someone around him have enough sense to stop this clown from wrecking the world? The Chinese and Japanese have been treating us like a teenager at a mall with a credit card for years. Then they watched this guy spend. Now they laugh at our currency. And they are buyning gold.

Our enemies in the mideast waited out our last leader who stood up to them. They were rewarded with the bowing and scraping of his successor. Now the followers of Allah laugh at our military resolve. And they wait to retake Afghanistan and invade Iraq at the right time.

See what I mean about wrecking the world?

IlikedAUH2O on September 12, 2009 at 12:18 PM

His I.Q. is off the charts.

Did it ever occur to you that the reason you can’t understand him is because his modalities of thought are way out there and yours are pedestrian and common sense.

I sneer at the lot of you.

jeff_from_mpls on September 12, 2009 at 11:26 AM

I challenge him to a debate on the subject in Healthcare.

3 Rules:
1) No Teleprompters
2) No notes or reminders of any kind
3) Winner is determined by a panel of 100 likely voters.

Chaz706 on September 12, 2009 at 12:20 PM

I do not like the place but there are much brighter people at Harvard than the example which was carried into the White House.

IlikedAUH2O on September 12, 2009 at 12:21 PM

If Obama can use the line of “created or saved X amount of jobs”, then it is not much more of a leap to make the Democrat`s healthcare plan deficit neutral.
They just use the phantom “we saved X amount in costs that would have been there if we would not have made changes” trick.
Deficit minus phantom savings = not one dime of a deficit.
Who can prove the that they did not?

albill on September 12, 2009 at 12:25 PM

Joke suitable for Reader’s Digest:

A woman at a supermarket was working the express line which had an overhead sign that read: “Maximum 12 item limit”

She saw a young man in line with 45 items. She asked him if he was from MIT and couldn’t read or from Harvard and couldn’t count.

IlikedAUH2O on September 12, 2009 at 12:25 PM

LIAR!!!

Ogabe on September 12, 2009 at 12:28 PM

A friend of mine kept telling me that they were going to cut the waste and fraud in Medicare. I asked him how. Fraud is only caught by insurance companies.
As for waste, what kind of waste? Too many tests? Too much toilet paper? Too many bed changes? How does one cut “waste” exactly?

Then I asked why they were waiting until 2013 (if this bill passes) to cut “waste and fraud” in Medicare. Why not start now?

I didn’t get an answer to any of those questions. Because they don’t have any.

mjk on September 12, 2009 at 12:29 PM

Liar… w/a proven track record

RalphyBoy on September 12, 2009 at 12:32 PM

I remember the first company I went to work for, which promised a technology that was 4 times better than the state of the art. After a while working there, I realized that it wasn’t possible given our technology. And finally I looked over the original proposal that made that claim. It claimed (without evidence) that the first step of our process could improve things by 10%. Then the next could improve things by 20%. And with enough steps, we could multiply it all together at get a four-fold improvement. The math wasn’t wrong. There was just nothing to support it.

Obama’s not good with numbers. We know that. But even if he were, without a concrete plan for his proposed price-fixing, it’s all just talk.

calbear on September 12, 2009 at 12:38 PM

Guys please………you miss the point or points: 1) Dems don’t pay taxes so they don’t give a sh__ about tax money, 2) Team Obama hasn’t told a single thing yet that wasn’t a total lie! That’s what they do in Community Organizer school – learn to lie. For example, first question: Dear Prez, were you both in Hawaii or Kenya? Obama: OK let’s see I have to lie,……Hawaii!!!

Cinday Blackburn on September 12, 2009 at 12:41 PM

At this point in time, Obama can continue to remain in campaign mode for the next three years

Kini on September 12, 2009 at 12:44 PM

1) Obama Math

2) ….

3) Rainbows

scituate_tgr on September 12, 2009 at 12:44 PM

IlikedAUH2O: I do not like the place but there are much brighter people at Harvard than the example which was carried into the White House.

Which perfectly illustrates the problem with affirmative action for the sake of diversity.

scituate_tgr on September 12, 2009 at 12:48 PM

Maybe Obama’s using hyperinflation dollars. $11 Billion today = $4 Trillion in a couple of years.

zmdavid on September 12, 2009 at 12:49 PM

Obama + Math = Jethro + Gazintas

scituate_tgr on September 12, 2009 at 12:50 PM

Either Obama needs a remedial math lesson, or he’s lying through his teeth.

His cavities have plenty of company.

Jim Treacher on September 12, 2009 at 12:52 PM

Serious answer to question: No Obama can’t do math.

Does he care? no.

zmdavid on September 12, 2009 at 12:52 PM

“Billion. Trillion. Whatever.”

azlibertarian on September 12, 2009 at 12:54 PM

Obama is either lying or he does not know what he is talking about, neither of which inspires confidence.

Terrye on September 12, 2009 at 1:04 PM

He doesn’t need to

daesleeper on September 12, 2009 at 1:05 PM

I do not like the place but there are much brighter people at Harvard than the example which was carried into the White House.

IlikedAUH2O on September 12, 2009 at 12:21 PM

There are, but they did not get in through Affirmative Action.

bayview on September 12, 2009 at 1:08 PM

It’s obvious why Obama won’t release his college transcripts. He never took a math or economics class, and probably didn’t take Western Civilization either.

rockmom on September 12, 2009 at 1:19 PM

Why doesn’t someone in the press just ask Gibbs this during the daily press conference, tell him you understand this is a difficult question, and you are giving it to him as homework, and that he is to come back the next day with the answer, and the mathematics to prove it.

Canuckistan on September 12, 2009 at 1:23 PM

He counted 57 States in the USA.

bayview on September 12, 2009 at 1:25 PM

He counted 57 States in the USA.

bayview on September 12, 2009 at 1:25 PM

But he’s right. Including the 50 states we all know about there’s:
1. South-SouthWest Dakota
2. Massandiana
3. McDonald’s Presents: Chicago
4. Hawaiiiiiii (the extra i’s are for incredible)
5. Polar bearolina
6. The Really Gay Part of San Francisco -lifornia
7. Floriuba

Obama was just using fancy Harvard Math – the type us peasants can’t possibly understand.

mjk on September 12, 2009 at 1:35 PM

Math isn’t a priority in the state-run school systems anymore, so it’s no surprise that Obama’s starry eyed groupies won’t notice these statistical lies.

infidel4life on September 12, 2009 at 1:37 PM

Cipher who lies.

Schadenfreude on September 12, 2009 at 1:38 PM

Bozo is a liar and he cannot do math. Moreover, he doesn’t care about facts.

dogsoldier on September 12, 2009 at 1:41 PM

I don’t understand how people are falling for this guy’s lies after 1 speech? What is wrong with this country and its people? I expect things like that in Hitler’s GErmany and Europe, but America? This guy is so obviously a charlatan and I simply cannot believe that a speech can make such a difference. Anyway, Fox is reporting that 10s of thousands are in Wash DC, is that true? It looks like a lot more people. I sure hope so because when conservatives protest, it better be large crowds for the media, in light of their subjective coverage or non-coverage and open HATE for conservatives.

Speaking of that, I was in a heated debate with someone the other day and, before I was called a racist for wanting illegal aliens to be sent packing since they violated our laws, someone actually used the “logic” of Obama said it, so it must be true. Critical thinking has gone out the window!

tanvec on September 12, 2009 at 1:47 PM

How Owe-bama does math:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfq5kju627c

mrt721 on September 12, 2009 at 1:49 PM

How Owe-bama does math:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfq5kju627c

mrt721 on September 12, 2009 at 1:50 PM

sorry, double post

mrt721 on September 12, 2009 at 1:50 PM

10,000 pennies guy explains why Obama can’t balance the budget – the hungry baby gorilla will beat us to death LOL!

Dr Evil on September 12, 2009 at 1:54 PM

If the healthcare industry were to grow at 7.2% indefinitely versus 7.1% indefinitely, it would take about 30 years to realize an accumulated $4 trillion difference. Or if the numbers were 7.2% versus 7.165%, it would take about 40 years. But this is more an exploitation of moronic economic assumptions than anything; over 100 years, the “savings” balloon to $2.4 quadrillion.

theperfecteconomist on September 12, 2009 at 1:55 PM

I was going to say “Of course he can… and probably does”
Then I re-read the headline and realized it said math… not meth.

LegendHasIt on September 12, 2009 at 2:03 PM

I was going to say “Of course he can… and probably does”
Then I re-read the headline and realized it said math… not meth.

+1000 I lol’d

tanvec on September 12, 2009 at 2:10 PM

We should have a name change for dear leader.

OWE-Bama

Mojave Mark on September 12, 2009 at 2:20 PM

Relax, oh ye of little faith. Where did Obama say he is using the HHS forecast for health care costs? He’s actually planning on hyperinflation, Zimbabwe style. 30 billion can turn into 4 trillion (in “current” dollars, not today’s dollars) very easily. So see, he probably does know what he’s talking about.

chris999 on September 12, 2009 at 2:55 PM

10,000 pennies guy explains why Obama can’t balance the budget – the hungry baby gorilla will beat us to death LOL!

Dr Evil on September 12, 2009 at 1:54 PM

That is one of the best videos I’ve ever seen in my life. Applying common sense is such a novel proposition these days.

Black Yoshi on September 12, 2009 at 3:19 PM

It still hasn’t sunk in yet that Obama and his Communists don’t want to tell the truth or solve any problems that we are faced with in America. This is reparations and Racism Straight Up! He wants to redistribute America’s wealth just like he told Joe The Plumber he would. He is trying to take over the government and all profitable institutions with his lying words. This is much easier for him than an actual military coup. I think Obama has been used to lying through his teeth to the ghetto idiots he “organized” in his previous career. It is a different story trying to deceive literate working Americans. They use real math in their budgets and will not sign on to the lies of this Communist, Kenyan, Muslim, Narcissist, Lying , Treasonous, Traitor! Dealing with the truth about Obama is the beginning of the end for him! He makes perfect sense if one stops trying to see honorable motives to anything he does. Skipping the 9/11 ceremonies in NY sums up all one needs to know about this evil man!

Marco on September 12, 2009 at 3:41 PM

Liar in Chief strikes again. With sabotaging friends like Obama, who needs enemies?

marklmail on September 12, 2009 at 3:58 PM

Don’t know much about history.
Don’t know much geography.
Thought math was a bore for the nerdy kids.
All I need is oratory.

May not be quite so easy, Hussein.

Harry Schell on September 12, 2009 at 5:24 PM

Zero can do math, he just thinks we’re all stupid where stupidity generally hangs out on the fringes of each side of the political scale and ignorance sprinkles the in between.

He’s also the biggest liar we’ve ever had in office I think, and that says a LOT.

Spiritk9 on September 12, 2009 at 5:30 PM

Unfortunately they don’t teach math at Ivy League schools.

MeAlice on September 12, 2009 at 7:14 PM

Obama math reminds me of South Part episode 217 where gnomes are stealing underpants. Their plan is
Step 1: Steal underpants
Step 3: Huge profits

Wait- whats step 2? Uhh we don’t know but step 3 is huge profits!!

LOL

MidWestFarmer on September 12, 2009 at 7:40 PM

The maggot-in-chief lies like a dog begging for dinner. He has no problem lying. He actually enjoys lying. Lying makes the maggot-in-chief feel like a real man! Lying makes him feel superior. Lying is all he’s got. Lying is all he’s ever had to offer… the country we love. Lying is his strategy. His agenda. His administration’s only purpose is to sell you a bag of goods. All lies. All the time. The Chicago way. It’s going to be a miracle from God if this loser and his gang of communists leave anything America can work with to resurrect a country worth living in. A miracle from God it will take.

Griz on September 12, 2009 at 8:16 PM

I’m wondering why it stops at $4 trillion? If he thinks America is going to same money, do the saving suddenly stop at some point in the “long term”?

unclesmrgol on September 12, 2009 at 9:59 PM

save money, that is.

unclesmrgol on September 12, 2009 at 10:00 PM

Other factors?

I went over the above with three libs who visited today (ok, I actually caught them at a neighbor’s house and used his computer – true libs don’t generally visit me) and they understood him completely. They said that there were parts that he didn’t introduce since it would confuse us. See? In time, all will be revealed.

IlikedAUH2O on September 12, 2009 at 10:35 PM

I would really like to see the math behind the claim. Is it just a matter of carrying it out to a long enough term that you can get any number you want?

As far as ignoring compounding, I’m not sure how 33 billion compounds to 220 billion in 10 years, although the cash flow would increase each year as the calculation is carried farther. However, all that said, it doesn’t appear that there’s any discounting of the cash flow in the calculation above, either.

But the real point is, I want to see Obama’s math.

DKH on September 12, 2009 at 10:35 PM

P. S. chris999 on September 12, 2009 at 2:55 PM

They really hated you.

IlikedAUH2O on September 12, 2009 at 10:36 PM

Whether Obama-nation can do math is immaterial his followers can not, and he lies contently.

darktood on September 13, 2009 at 7:33 AM

Obama was just using fancy Harvard Math – the type us peasants can’t possibly understand.

mjk on September 12, 2009 at 1:35 PM

mjk, you have a small error in your list. You need to replace one of the seven with Kenya.

Ampleforth on September 13, 2009 at 8:45 AM

Math is racial profiling!

Cybergeezer on September 13, 2009 at 9:49 AM

Obama will be worse than Bernie Madoff!

Cybergeezer on September 13, 2009 at 9:51 AM

Of course he can’t add or tell the truth for that matter.
“You Lie, Mr. President”.

mmcnamer1 on September 13, 2009 at 12:14 PM

I think this is a really important point that isn’t getting much visibility.

Obama emphasized that by cutting one tenth of one percent we save 4 trillion dollars.

I sure can’t figure it out.

Help me understand. It was said above that:

“If the healthcare industry were to grow at 7.2% indefinitely versus 7.1% indefinitely, it would take about 30 years to realize an accumulated $4 trillion difference.”

I did the math and assumed we started with 2402 billion healthcare costs in 2008.

If we go 40 years at 7.1 % versus 7.2% growth, I get a cumulative savings of 437 billion. That is still ten times less than what Obama was talking about. So where am I wrong?

4thQTR on September 13, 2009 at 5:20 PM

Well let me correct my previous post.

I made a mistake in my spreadsheet. And I agree with the 30 year number at the difference between 7.1% and 7.2 %.

That does add up to 4 trillion.

Sorry for the confusion.

4thQTR on September 13, 2009 at 5:35 PM

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