Blue Dog: Hey, maybe we should start over on ObamaCare

posted at 9:08 pm on August 17, 2009 by Allahpundit

Never ever will it happen, but the fact that Blue Dogs are even willing to entertain this notion aloud makes me think they might show some spine when the House and Senate produce a compromise bill and the moment of truth arrives.

At the first event of the day in Cross City, he held up a copy of the bill passed by the Energy and Commerce Committee and embraced by the congressional leadership.

“I cannot support this bill in the version it is in now,” he said. “We can do better. We can make it better.”

He emphasized to the skeptical crowds that he will work to reduce quickly-rising medical costs; that any bill must not add to the deficit; and that Blue Dogs like himself fought to delay consideration by the full House of Representatives to allow members to hear directly from constituents during the August recess.

When a questioner, Ray Evans, said he believed the President wants to do too much at once and asked whether Boyd would “be willing to scrap everything” and start over to do pursue reform more incrementally, the congressman responded: “I think that is an excellent idea … we may end up there.”

In a later interview with CNN, he said the idea had been been floated with the congressional leadership. He said that with the strong emotions and heated opposition he is seeing, the idea of doing health reform in a more piecemeal fashion is something he is strongly considering.

The Democrats can’t afford “piecemeal.” They’re almost certainly going to lose seats in the midterms, and maybe a lot of seats if Nate Silver’s worst fears prove true, so their best chance is to ram home something big right now. It seems to me the question of who prevails is fundamentally an organizational question: Progressives are whining about tire tracks on their chests, but ultimately the worst possible outcome for them is a no vote since it leaves the status quo unchanged. Even an incremental change towards a co-op is some kind of change. For Blue Dogs, from purplish districts, a no vote is acceptable if sub-optimal; the worst vote is a yes to socialized medicine. With those incentives at play, how do the progressives maintain their solidarity? That is to say, if a public option is ideal for progressives but a dealbreaker for Blue Dogs and a co-op is sub-optimal for both, if you’re Obama how do you bypass the co-op and pass the public option? Half a loaf for both is better than any other option, no?


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Never ever trust the Joker.

Who would trust Obama, Reid and Pelosi with their lives.

tarpon on August 17, 2009 at 9:10 PM

They will fold like card tables under the pressure and/or offers from The One.

This Spruce Goose is going to fly. The real question is, will they loose the House and/or Senate and be able to stop this bleeding?

watson007 on August 17, 2009 at 9:11 PM

heh….

Chairman Soeotoro would LOVE the ability to try to hide his pap in plain sight….

sven10077 on August 17, 2009 at 9:11 PM

What percentage of Americans identify themselves as progressives and why would anyone care what they want?

txag92 on August 17, 2009 at 9:12 PM

Start over in 2011? Tahehe

SouthernGent on August 17, 2009 at 9:13 PM

That is to say, if a public option is ideal for progressives but a dealbreaker for Blue Dogs and a co-op is sub-optimal for both, if you’re Obama how do you bypass the co-op and pass the public option?

He was probably banking on the demagoguery until he saw it wasn’t working. He’s probably just going to try to overshadow it as quickly as possible. Chances are he’s just waiting for some sort of attention-getting overseas action.

MadisonConservative on August 17, 2009 at 9:15 PM

Never ever trust the Joker.

Who would trust Obama, Reid and Pelosi with their lives.

tarpon on August 17, 2009 at 9:10 PM

Not me.

ladyingray on August 17, 2009 at 9:16 PM

Allah, I think you just described the Prisoner’s Dilemma at the end, there. Let me break this out…

If Blue Dogs support socialized healthcare, they likely lose their seat next year. If the Progressives support co-ops (or some lesser version), they likely lose _their_ seat next year, or at least suffer retaliation from voters. And if they support opposing views, then nothing passes.

No, it’s not actually a Prisoner’s Dilemma… but it’s close. Politically speaking, it’d be better for the progressives to ‘suck it up’ and take a watered down bill or no bill, because the alternative could easily lead to losing Congress next Fall. However, by a mathematical or psychological view, it’s going to end in deadlock, which could mean no bill at all. That can be spun into actual positives for the liberals, in terms of long-term control of Congress… but I rather doubt that they’ll be successful at that.

Scott H on August 17, 2009 at 9:18 PM

“With those incentives at play, how do the progressives maintain their solidarity?”

I am assuming that you actually believe that ‘progressives’ actually have strong beliefs founded in the best interests of the Founding Fathers of this country based on individual rights and freedom from tyranny, the Constitution, and the Rule of Law, as well as a soul……….

………. Otherwise, they would just be political whores who hide behind lies to advance a Marxist/Socialist agenda to control every aspect of this society as they feel fit, and would lie, cheat, steal, intimidate, and eat their own to get it?

Am I missing something………?

Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 9:18 PM

Never, never trust the extreme left…they are going to do something and it is going to be called Health Insurance Reform.

d1carter on August 17, 2009 at 9:18 PM

MadisonConservative on August 17, 2009 at 9:15 PM

You’re right. He’s looking for a diversion or some sort of verbal camoflage so he can keep it in the bill. This is what he has wanted to do all his life. His ideal Socialist nation is within his grasp and he’s not going to give up on it.

kingsjester on August 17, 2009 at 9:19 PM

Wait, I thought the GOP was the party that was falling apart? MSM, I NEED ANSWERS!

Keef Overbite on August 17, 2009 at 9:19 PM

If the Progressives support co-ops (or some lesser version), they likely lose _their_ seat next year

No way.

Allahpundit on August 17, 2009 at 9:19 PM

You have a tire track on your chest? Take a number, a doctor will see you within 4-6 weeks.

Jim Treacher on August 17, 2009 at 9:20 PM

Obama’a got bigger problems now… I suspect we’re seeing the start of a downturn in the market (normal september drops coupled with other bad financial news) That’ll put the emphasis back onto failure of the stimulus package. Meanwhile he’s got another blow up about to happen with the Cash for Clunkers deal and car dealers beginning to not cover it because the government hasn’t paid them yet.

Socializing health care should be the least of his worries right now.

Skywise on August 17, 2009 at 9:20 PM

The dems are going to pass it. Obama will give them the big carrot. Namely they will get jobs in his admin if they lose their seats.

Unfortunately Obamacare is a done deal. The only question is what cost to the dems and the nation ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:21 PM

Madison: Less ‘overseas diplomacy issue’, which he frankly sucks at, and more an issue at home that would be the healthcare equivalent of waving the bloody shirt.

I’m, quite frankly, surprised we haven’t had such an event already. I guess it’s the fact that this administration has such a low opinion of the proles that they feel just saying there’s a crisis is enough to make us believe that there is one. If I were an unscrupulous administration hack, I’d be front-paging a horrible ‘current event’ healthcare issue (manufactured or not), and then using that to scare people into believing me.

Scott H on August 17, 2009 at 9:21 PM

now kind of feel like we have a tire track on our chest where the bus that rolled over us is,” Weiner said.

The bus!?!? What bus would that be? What are you talking about?

Hahahahahaha…even his friends don’t feel safe with this guy behind the wheel…I love it!!!!

AUINSC on August 17, 2009 at 9:22 PM

Pelosi said there would be no way progressives would not vote for something call healthcare reform even if they were unhappy with it. The incremental camel’s nose under the tent possibility is worrisome to say the least.

txmomof6 on August 17, 2009 at 9:23 PM

I suspect we’re seeing the start of a downturn in the market

A “crisis” foe the dems to exploit. They will push stimulus 2 saying “look at those mean nasty GOPers who hate people who have lost their jobs. “

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:23 PM

Allah: Oh, I wasn’t trying to say that progressives (by which I guess you mean the hard leftists) would lose their seats to _right-wingers_… but they might lose their seat to more ideologically pure (read: politically stupid) left-wingers. After all, if a Democratic party supermajority in all branches of government can’t get a liberal agenda in place… any liberal hack can argue that they’ll do a better job, no? ;)

Scott H on August 17, 2009 at 9:24 PM

Amos: I think the polls show that demonizing the Republicans is soooooooo last administration. :p

Scott H on August 17, 2009 at 9:25 PM

Unfortunately Obamacare is a done deal. The only question is what cost to the dems and the nation ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:21 PM

I agree. The next question is will the wave of changed seats be enough to repeal it…over a veto?

SouthernGent on August 17, 2009 at 9:26 PM

I think the polls show that demonizing the Republicans is soooooooo last administration.

Really ? After all the racist and Nazi labels and hater speach thrown at the town hall protestors and tea party activists ? What makes you think that has changed ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:28 PM

I rather disagree on the philosophy that Obamacare is a ‘done deal’. Just like in any other strategic situation, there must be a cost-benefits analysis, and I think at this point it should be very clear to the Blue Dogs that no amount of Democratic party backing is going to save their seat for them next year if they bend on this.

Scott H on August 17, 2009 at 9:29 PM

I agree. The next question is will the wave of changed seats be enough to repeal it…over a veto?

SouthernGent on August 17, 2009 at 9:26 PM

The GOP has done jacksquat to get any message out there. They sit on the sidelines forcing Americans to do the work they wont do.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:29 PM

Amos: Oh, it still happens, but it has very little effect. The mantra of the ‘evil GOP’ has become so overexposed, it has no traction anymore. ‘Crying wolf’ is a very good method of viewing it.

I find it rather heartening that the GOP silence on this debate (by and large) has sort of galvanized the people. If the GOP fired on all cylinders against this, the people might have been willing to let them all fight it out (and blame the GOP if the bill passed). It’s almost political judo, if I thought the GOP was doing it deliberately. ;)

Scott H on August 17, 2009 at 9:31 PM

The GOP has done jacksquat to get any message out there. They sit on the sidelines forcing Americans to do the work they wont do.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:29 PM

In this instance I think the Americans doing the work is more effective and more detrimental to the left.

HoustonRight on August 17, 2009 at 9:33 PM

What is killing Obamacare is two things. One conservative america is finnaly fed up waiting for our own party to show us leadership and taking it to the democrats ourselfs.

The second thing is that Obama is badly overexposed. People are getting sick of hearing about him.

Finally with the bad economy and large spending most americans have seen little benefit to their daily lives. You can make all the promises in the world but people do expect you to at least try and keep them.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:34 PM

Oh it’s a full loaf… pinched off into a big sandwich, and we all have to take a bite.

Chuck Schick on August 17, 2009 at 9:35 PM

You have a tire track on your chest? Take a number, a doctor will see you within 4-6 weeks.

Jim Treacher on August 17, 2009 at 9:20 PM

Nice one!!!

pilartx on August 17, 2009 at 9:35 PM

The GOP has done jacksquat to get any message out there. They sit on the sidelines forcing Americans to do the work they wont do.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:29 PM

This has bothered me as well. Is this a case of not getting in the way of your opponent committing suicide or the failure to take advantage of a situation?

Les in NC on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

The progs will piss and moan (nothing unusual there) but its not like they’re going away from the dems…

I’m sure Rahm’s decision tree 6 months ago was this…

- Probability of ramming through an ultra-commie Obamacare – 10% Yes / 90% No
- push through co-op, very liberal plan (70% yes with probability of yes, giving failure of commie plan, 60%)
- pass moderate reforms 90% Yes, 80% if previously failed on commie plan

So it the wisdom of the Chicago Way, they pushed hard, expecting that they would still get the country more than half-pregnant… they never expected the push-back from the unwashed hoards…

Now, given the momentum, can WE THE PEOPLE, kill the entire bill… and wait until real tort reform is proposed.

Given the negative momentum, the

phreshone on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

In this instance I think the Americans doing the work is more effective and more detrimental to the left.

HoustonRight on August 17, 2009 at 9:33 PM

The left has tried to demonize those protesting but that really comes off as elitist. They can smear Palin and other policians but they havent had success doing it to 50 Something regular joes and janes.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

In this instance I think the Americans doing the work is more effective and more detrimental to the left.

HoustonRight on August 17, 2009 at 9:33 PM

I agree. However, it is getting close to the time the GOP has to get it together and take over the leadership. The voters will stay actively focused and engaged for only a short period of time.

ICBM on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:34 PM

What really is killing him is that is credibility has tanked because of porkulus…people can be all hopey changey right up to the point were they are out of work and their house just foreclosed…and none of the miraculous help his mega-spending package was supposed to provide is actually helping anybody but his cronies…the crony capitalists and rich liberal establishment elites.

AUINSC on August 17, 2009 at 9:38 PM

AP: Please stop using the term ‘progressive’ in your posts. If you’re going to cave that far, why not just refer to Conservatives as “bigoted white rich evil folk?”

fossten on August 17, 2009 at 9:39 PM

The GOP has done jacksquat to get any message out there. They sit on the sidelines forcing Americans to do the work they wont do.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:29 PM

Come election time……….

…….. it will be interesting to ask the question:

“Where the hell were you?!?”

Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 9:39 PM

The second thing is that Obama is badly overexposed. People are getting sick of hearing about him.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:34 PM

Not to mention seeing his hubris condescending puss on every media outlet that mankind has invented……..

Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 9:42 PM

Where the hell were you?!?”
Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 9:39 PM

Backing Romneycare ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:42 PM

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

ICBM on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

My point exactly. And, I do believe that the GOP must follow-up with an alternative and a steadfast devotion to defeat any govenmental health care.

HoustonRight on August 17, 2009 at 9:43 PM

A Blue Dog Do Over!!

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 9:43 PM

Half a loaf for both is better than any other option, no?

Allah, you’re talking about a guy with no legislative or executive experience, but with an overinflated EGO. IT’S ALL ABOUT BARRY! If 30-40-50 Democrats have to fall on their swords in 2010, so be it.

GarandFan on August 17, 2009 at 9:45 PM

Backing Romneycare ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:42 PM

(crickets chirping)

Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 9:46 PM

Dammit – when will someone challenge these Socialists with the Constitution? The federal government is not allowed to establish a health care plan in any form. Even Medicare and Medicaid are unconstitutional. If we can’t draw a Constitutional line in the sand here and now then we never will and the Progressives will have won. The history of Progressives is one of unrelenting incrementalism and a compromise now is merely a delay in achieving their ultimate goal. Control.

“In questions of power, let no more be heard of confidence in man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.” – Thomas Jefferson

And secondly – just what do the Marxists think we Conservatives will do if this Obamanation is passed? Do they think we’ll accept defeat and just go home and sulk? I expect serious 10th Amendment challenges from several states and the Federal government won’t have a leg to stand on. The 10th Amendment is quite clear, “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.” The Constitution does not delegate the power to create Obamacare to the federal government. I believe this AZ initiative will be the tip of an iceberg for the ship of the Left.

DerKrieger on August 17, 2009 at 9:46 PM

American citizens united for the purposes of freedom, liberty and truth in government hereby demand that HR 3200 and all Senate versions be summarily destroyed in place.
We have witnessed the expeditious rollout and attempted passage of 1,017 pages of an omnibus legislative effort using tactics meant to deny the American Citizen the liberty to debate this bill on its merits. A deeper examination of this healthcare legislation has revealed nefarious ethics, increased taxpayer costs and a significant loss of freedom to patients and providers alike. Congress and the White House have lost a significant amount of trust by this rapid effort as both polls clearly demonstrate.

Today, we witness the attempted “piecemeal editing” of these healthcare legislative efforts. The Senate removed “death panel” provisions and yesterday the White House signaled removal of the “public option” portion of these bills. This modification effort via piecemeal implies the premise that the legislation is right and proper and simply needs modifications around the edges. The American public fundamentally rejects this notion and firmly insists that the legislation that was omnibus, far reaching and massive in its initial presentation, similarly be returned, in its entirety, to its ill-prepared originators in a massive signal from the American Citizen that this legislation is not worthy of our trust, nor time.

Congress and the President seized upon the liberty to create and attempt to pass this 1,017 page monstrosity. Moreover, they are now seizing upon the liberty to edit it in place. They vigorously attempted to deny the American Citizen the liberty to debate and inspect this legislation before passage. Why does Congress think it can deny debate about the bill and edit it too?

I submit that we deny Congress the liberty of editing HR 3200 in place. Denial of liberty is a door that swings both ways. Deny our liberty once, shame on you, deny it twice–shame on us. This bill is NOT going to be piecemealed back–a rescaling of provisions, a renaming of portions, a billion here, a billion there. Negative. The American Citizens are seizing upon our liberty to force the disposal of that nefarious legislation to the scrap heap of history.

In summary, piecemeal editing on omnibus legislation is disingenuous and wrongly assumes the first effort was largely correct. This legislation is being returned in the same fashion it was delivered.
Please help further the argument against editing this legislation. It should be returned.

ted c on August 17, 2009 at 9:46 PM

Joker rising ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM

Not to mention seeing his hubris condescending puss on every media outlet that mankind has invented……..

Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 9:42 PM

Seven Percent Solution: Its a Lefty Cult thing!!:)

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM

The GOP has done jacksquat to get any message out there. They sit on the sidelines forcing Americans to do the work they wont do.

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:29 PM

And if they were doing anything, does anyone here think they would be getting any coverage on the MSM? They’re smart to leave the peeved people to push it as much as they can, stoked on by retirees like Newt and Sarah. No reason to give the MSM any sound bites to used against the GOP in 2010.

The more they just shut up and take in the peoples action, the more likely it is that they figure out that the need to kill the bill instead of falling into the typical liberal legislative tricks

“Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.” – Napoleon

phreshone on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM

The voters will stay actively focused and engaged for only a short period of time.
ICBM on August 17, 2009 at 9:36 PM

I don’t know if that’s true this time, ICBM. This is starting to feel like the Iran election (a lot of people saying it has become “bigger than Mousavi”)….meaning people tired of years of crap finally standing up for themselves.

Count me as one who is just tired of the years of whiny-ass lefty professional victims saying Gimme Gimme Gimme, and now we have Hydra coming at us with ObamaCare, Cap and Trade, Card Check, etc. I haven’t busted my hump for 35+ years only to trade my American Dream for his Soviet Nightmare.

Patrick S on August 17, 2009 at 9:49 PM

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM

Is that the ultimate “can you beleive these idiots put me in office” expression or what?

HoustonRight on August 17, 2009 at 9:51 PM

And if they were doing anything, does anyone here think they would be getting any coverage on the MSM? They’re smart to leave the peeved people to push it as much as they can, stoked on by retirees like Newt and Sarah. No reason to give the MSM any sound bites to used against the GOP in 2010.

The more they just shut up and take in the peoples action, the more likely it is that they figure out that the need to kill the bill instead of falling into the typical liberal legislative tricks

“Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.” – Napoleon

phreshone on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM

While I agree their silence has been best for conservatives at this point, given their recent history of wussiness, I wouldn’t exactly call it strategy on their parts, but rather an “oh schniekies, we don’t even have to put our arses on the line by speaking up!” – still forgetting that true conservatisms wins elections, not RINO theology.

pilartx on August 17, 2009 at 9:53 PM

Joker rising ?

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM

William Amos:This looks similar as well!

—————————————–

http://www.picsearch.com/info.cgi?q=Howdy%20Doody&id=jNckacGsATqUxZFwoXhTHeI6WjKNWiS5a8syABqQWbc&start=57&opt=%26cols%3D6%26thumbs%3D18

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 9:54 PM

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 9:54 PM

Now THAT cracked me up. Thanks, canopfor.

Patrick S on August 17, 2009 at 9:55 PM

Obama’a got bigger problems now… I suspect we’re seeing the start of a downturn in the market (normal september drops coupled with other bad financial news) That’ll put the emphasis back onto failure of the stimulus package. Skywise on August 17, 2009 at 9:20 PM

The MSM is pushing the story that the recession is over, and that the jobs will predictably lag a few months behind. (Remember during Bush it was like–some say the recession is over, but where are the jobs?) If that’s the case, bad economic news in September will knock that meme in the teeth, and then the “jobless recovery” conversation will have to begin. Heh, heh.

smellthecoffee on August 17, 2009 at 9:59 PM

William Amos on August 17, 2009 at 9:47 PM
Is that the ultimate “can you beleive these idiots put me in office” expression or what?

HoustonRight on August 17, 2009 at 9:51 PM

HoustonRight:What your descibing,could be this!!

http://www.turnersculpture.com/gallery/163.htm

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 9:59 PM

We need to make sure the American people know that a public coop is a public option. Don’t be fooled. It will all result in single payer in 10 years.

Christian Conservative on August 17, 2009 at 10:00 PM

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 9:54 PM
Now THAT cracked me up. Thanks, canopfor.

Patrick S on August 17, 2009 at 9:55 PM

Patrick:—:)

canopfor on August 17, 2009 at 10:01 PM

Geez louise, I’m just starting to feel a little better, log on to hotair for some extra juice, and get nuttin’ but Eeyoreness. Hee-haw! Cheer up, dang it, we’ve at least got them running scared…don’t by any means let up, but CHEER THE HECK UP!

Chewy the Lab on August 17, 2009 at 10:07 PM

If that’s the case, bad economic news in September will knock that meme in the teeth, and then the “jobless recovery” conversation will have to begin. Heh, heh.

Small business owners stopped investing 15 months ago in anticipation of the Bush Tax-cuts being allowed to sunset w/ DC controlled 100% by democrats, never mind the high risk of increased tax rates beyond the old code.

phreshone on August 17, 2009 at 10:07 PM

We need to make sure the American people know that a public coop is a public option.
Christian Conservative on August 17, 2009 at 10:00 PM

I read “co-op” as “coop.” Now that there’s funny, I don’t care who you are!

Chewy the Lab on August 17, 2009 at 10:09 PM

That is to say, if a public option is ideal for progressives but a dealbreaker for Blue Dogs and a co-op is sub-optimal for both, if you’re Obama how do you bypass the co-op and pass the public option? Half a loaf for both is better than any other option, no?

I love game theory.

BPD on August 17, 2009 at 10:10 PM

The Democrats can’t afford “piecemeal

Well, we couldn’t afford the full rollout of omnibus health legislation.

Shoes on the other foot now dems. You’re getting this craptastic bill right back atcha, just like you wrote it. You don’t get the chance to have a full rollout, then edit it in place. Nope, cake’s gone jack. What you fellas are feeling right now is the door swingin’ the other way and hitting you in the a$$. So, sit yo butts back down at your macbooks and reconsider whether or not you want to rewrite this thing again and face the wrath o’ granny. No wonder you wanna pull the plug on her…

ted c on August 17, 2009 at 10:11 PM

Who would trust Obama, Reid and Pelosi with their lives.

tarpon on August 17, 2009 at 9:10 PM

The fact that Obama let Pelosi take the lead on this bill (with her radical left SF nutbag constituents) driving government run healthcare down the rest of the nation’s throat says it all. A socialist/marxist community organizer from Chicago and the wicked witch of the west does not make the greatest of “bedfellows” with mainstream working class folks who see this government powergrab and (thankfully) understand social security and medicare are already broke. Add Pelosi’s grand plan to suspend porkulus until the election cycle to spread money into the liberal’s districts, and it makes you really wonder who’s running this country.

“I think that is an excellent idea … we may end up there.”

The townhall revolts are not just about healthcare moron. Look and listen to the taxpayers that are wondering how their children and grandchildren will survive this spending madness.

Rovin on August 17, 2009 at 10:11 PM

The best healthcare reform that could come out of Congress that WOULD work, that WOULD reduce costs?

Could happen:

Tort reform.

Won’t happen. Too many congressmen are lawyers, and the DNC is more beholden to the trial lawyers than even the unions.

wildcat84 on August 17, 2009 at 10:21 PM

As I have been pounding on the Healthcare takeover I have grown ever more frustrated that no pundits are discussing one of the truly serious issues facing our country if the (D)emocrat/Socialists conquer.

COR, is the ratio of claims paid to premiums collected and industry wide it runs about 1.02, or $1.02 in claims & administrative costs are paid out for every premium $1 collected. Efficient insurance companies dodge the burdensome state level regulation by staying close to this ratio and thereby expand their book of business by spreading the risk over ever more policy-holders through good underwriting practices.

So you say… No. No Insurance company is going to run at a loss. But they do. Why? Well… Billions of premium dollars flow in and the lag time between the payment of those premiums and the coverage of claims provides a float to the Insurance industry making them the largest capital investment source in America at… yes… 2%.

Wouldn’t you borrow money at 2% if you could for reinvestment?

Now. Take a deep breath and let it sink in. Has the light bulb gone off yet?

What happens if the (D)emocrat’s National Socialization project takes over the Health Insurance industry? What happens to all that capital?

It goes away.

Without those dollars what happens to the Stock Market?

It goes down. Way down.

What about the credit markets? Remember the last panic that justified the stampede that rationalized the 3/4 Trillion in TARP dollars, and the 1/2 Trillion dollar government spending expansion, and the 1 Trillion dollar stimulus? What will happen when the dollars behind 20% of the entire American economy are no longer available for capital investment in American business?

End game.

DANEgerus on August 17, 2009 at 11:02 PM

Wasn’t this the “Post of the Day”…………?

Seven Percent Solution on August 17, 2009 at 11:03 PM

We need to make sure the American people know that a public coop is a public option. Don’t be fooled. It will all result in single payer in 10 years.

Christian Conservative on August 17, 2009 at 10:00 PM

Remember Obama’s “it will take 20 years to get there” comment?

TopLawyer on August 17, 2009 at 11:44 PM

I pray the Democrats stay resolute and stick to their convictions. Seriously.

I hope the Blue Dogs refuse to vote for any public option bill. I hope the House Commies refuse to vote for anything without it.

Deadlock. Best of all possible outcomes.

Besides, it appears that no matter what the House passes, the Senate will s***-can it and go with coops since it appears that even with 60 Rats there aren’t enough votes to pass this “public option.”

JoeinTX on August 18, 2009 at 12:08 AM

I finished reading HR3200 tonight and have generated five pages of “cliff notes”. This thing is not just awful, its OMG awful.

dogsoldier on August 18, 2009 at 12:20 AM

Obama’s Permanent Campaign song

profitsbeard on August 18, 2009 at 12:32 AM

Scrap Obamacare? Kill it with a resounding “No!”

Fabian socialism has no place in America.

coldwarrior on August 18, 2009 at 12:33 AM

Obama has yet to appoint someone to the post of Medicare and Medicaid. He’s been in office six months and hasn’t found anyone to serve? Both programs are in facing financial trouble and are key to his healthcare reform. Smart power? Ready to Lead on Day One??!! Do we really need a nationalized healthcare reform with no one at the helm?

(from patriotroom.com)

TN Mom on August 18, 2009 at 12:48 AM

OT, but a huge story, please check out this post about the Rifqa Bary story at AtlasShrugs: http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2009/08/rifqa-bary-before-her-escape-beatings-brutality-subjugation.html

Unbelievable! This girl’s life must be preserved!

sanantonian on August 18, 2009 at 12:59 AM

OT: Obama Joker artist is Kucinich supporter from Chicago. Attends U of Illinois and is of Palestinian descent.

agmartin on August 18, 2009 at 1:05 AM

That we have AP wondering how the left can best deceive the electorate into following their path, or not even deceive, but force the vast majority of the unwilling down that path, shows how sick this country is and how illegitimate our government is.

amkun on August 18, 2009 at 1:05 AM

Not quite OT: A fifth State Department worker has been convicted of snooping into the passport files of famous Americans.

Oh yeah, I really want gubmint drones to have access to my complete health records… I’m sure they’d never do anything unethical with them!

/sarc

ya2daup on August 18, 2009 at 1:08 AM

He is caught between Barack and a hard place.

Geochelone on August 18, 2009 at 3:42 AM

How would they explain this?

“We miswrote this bill…”

ted c on August 18, 2009 at 6:35 AM

It’s like Mark Steyn said, their goal is to “cross the river and burn the bridges.” If they can get full-blown Obamacare, great. If they have to back off a little, so be it, as long as they get the government’s foot in the door even more than it already is. Never, never underestimate how calculating the true-believer libs are. It’s not paranoia to recognize they’ll stop at nothing to advance their agenda.

ncborn on August 18, 2009 at 7:55 AM

Hey maybe the wrong people are in office! yeah I like hat idea better.

johnnyU on August 18, 2009 at 8:05 AM

This has bothered me as well. Is this a case of not getting in the way of your opponent committing suicide or the failure to take advantage of a situation?

Les in NC on August 17, 2009

I believe the progressives in the GOP have the same ultimate goals as the progressives in the Democrat Party. Why should they put effort into stopping something that will drive the electorate to serfdom? Better to let the Dems do it, take a beating for it, then take away their power positions before they can reap the benefits of lifetime incumbency. Both sides are gambling with our liberty. That’s what sucks.

SKYFOX on August 18, 2009 at 8:37 AM

Another argument we can use against this bill is that, even modified, it will still contain 1000+ pages of regs & rules. Well, there is a fundamental idea in American law that ‘ignorance of the law is no excuse!’ Take a look sometimes at the CFR (Code of Federal Regs)—-it is a 50 volume set the last time I looked. The truth is, ignorance of the law IS an excuse when no ordinary citizen can understand all these rules & regs. Crap & Charade & HR3200 will each add a few volumes to this brainbuster. My proposal is simple….Congress can add no new law or rule without repealing some other, so that the total quantity of rules/regs can never exceed what exists today.

GnuBreed on August 18, 2009 at 8:37 AM

Send over Beatrice Kiddo with her five finger death punch to…..

KILL THE BILL

Jerome Horwitz on August 18, 2009 at 9:04 AM

Hmmm.

Insurance costs are rising because of the lousy economy is hurting the insurance companys’ investments, a lack of tort reform, excessive state ordered insurance mandates and … the devaluing dollar.

That’s pretty much it. So this “reform” stuff simply will not work since it doesn’t address any of these reasons.

memomachine on August 18, 2009 at 9:16 AM

Insurance companies are now heavily regulated at the state level. Please explain, Christian Conservatives why “co-ops” would be any different than the current situation.

Jimbo3 on August 18, 2009 at 9:24 AM

ATTENTION Death Panel

It’s time to euthanize Obamacare!!!!

PatriotRider on August 18, 2009 at 9:30 AM

Chances are he’s just waiting for some sort of attention-getting overseas action.

MadisonConservative on August 17, 2009 at 9:15 PM

I was thinking the same thing over the weekend.

OT: Obama Joker artist is Kucinich supporter from Chicago. Attends U of Illinois and is of Palestinian descent.

agmartin on August 18, 2009 at 1:05 AM

Wow. Interesting guy: “Alkhateeb’s views on foreign relations align with the Democrats, he said, while he prefers Republican ideals on domestic issues.”

RushBaby on August 18, 2009 at 9:37 AM

I heard the best line ever that is starting out there.
I WOULD RATHER TRUST MY DOGS WITH MICHAEL VICK THAT TRUST MY HEALTH CARE WITH OBAMA!

That is too good!

patriotparty1 on August 18, 2009 at 9:42 AM

So they want to kill it and start with an undead hand and bring up the Zombie one part at a time. No thank you. Kill it and bury the thing.

Obama screwed up and showed his end game before it started. DO NOT let them acheive their goals by incrementallizing it.

- The Cat

MirCat on August 18, 2009 at 9:51 AM

I think we need to look at two areas that are driving up medical costs.

Frivalious lawsuits and excessive governmental regulation. Any healthcare reform that doesn’t look at those two issues is in the wrong direction. And oddly enough, the government would have the authority to reduce their regulatory oversight (since they didn’t have the authority to put it in in the first place) and to prepare tort reform.

I’ve yet to hear anything about these two topics from DC though. Highly doubt I will.

TKSnider on August 18, 2009 at 10:03 AM

ya2daup on August 18, 2009 at 1:08 AM

HR3200 gives them complete access to your bank accounts too. As well as your medical records and your tax records. And it creates several new agencies that play with your data.

dogsoldier on August 18, 2009 at 10:40 AM

I like Diana Krall’s “Pick Yourself Up.”

“Pick myself up, dust myself off, start all oer again.”

MPCpian on August 18, 2009 at 11:04 AM