Rasmussen: 54% would prefer no bill to current ObamaCare proposals
posted at 7:15 pm on August 15, 2009 by Allahpundit
Ace says that’s not enough. Is it?
Thirty-five percent (35%) of American voters say passage of the bill currently working its way through Congress would be better than not passing any health care reform legislation this year. However, a new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that most voters (54%) say no health care reform passed by Congress this year would be the better option…
Among those not affiliated with either major party, 23% would like the Congressional reform to pass while 66% would rather the legislators take no action.
Voters who earn less than $20,000 a year are evenly divided but a majority of all other voters would prefer no action. Middle income voters, those who earn from $40,000 to $75,000 a year, are most strongly in favor of taking no action.
Assume opposition ticks up to 60 percent, which is probably the ceiling. Would that really stop it, as Ace expects? Passing a bill with a public option would alienate the center, passing a bill without one would alienate the left, but passing nothing — while enjoying a supermajority in Congress — would be unthinkable. The obvious analogy is to the GOP failing to pass social security reform in 2005 despite controlling both branches, but this would be worse: The Democrats’ advantage is bigger, they have the media on their side, and social security was never a policy showpiece for Bush the way ObamaCare is for The One. If they can’t buy off enough progressives and Blue Dogs to pass this, either with pork or with secret promises that whatever passes will/won’t eventually lead to single-payer, the Democratic coalition will appear ungovernable and the myth of transformational Hopenchange will be shattered — which I suspect will feed a backlash even among voters who don’t want them to pass anything. No wonder that party elders are already massaging the nutroots about accepting compromise. Something’s going to pass. It simply has to. The only question is what.
Exit question: How much of a risk is there really of Obama alienating the left? Granted, the O-bots in Organizing for America who are already tired and complacent won’t take kindly to The One telling them it’s time to MoveOn.org from health care. But if the big fear is of a galvanized nutroots launching primary challenges against Blue Dogs who vote against ObamaCare (or any version of ObamaCare with a public option), then the more likely a GOP wave next year seems, the dicier that becomes for liberals. Do they really want to drag a centrist congressional incumbent to the left in a primary when the country’s trending right? Better to leave them alone and follow the Barney Frank approach of accepting a bill that’s half a loaf and then trying to leaven it afterwards until it becomes single-payer.










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Waterloo.
elduende on August 15, 2009 at 7:15 PM
and this is without support from the health care players.
rob verdi on August 15, 2009 at 7:16 PM
I betcha 54% would prefer no President to current Obama poseur.
misslizzi on August 15, 2009 at 7:16 PM
Following the Constitution would be even better.
Fletch54 on August 15, 2009 at 7:17 PM
OT: Ann Coulter SKEWERS Kathleen Parker in her latest online column.
John the Libertarian on August 15, 2009 at 7:18 PM
That does it. 54% of Amerikkka is Racist!
Flag them all!
Upstater85 on August 15, 2009 at 7:18 PM
http://market-ticker.org/archives/1337-USPS-Threatens-Health-Pension-Default.html
“USPS Threatens Health Pension Default”
House of cards.
the_nile on August 15, 2009 at 7:19 PM
Thanks… now something to read
Upstater85 on August 15, 2009 at 7:19 PM
Hey you know what would help? Getting his sorry looking ass of my TV for a few days. At this point, I’d even be willing to throw him a few dollars to keep him off there.
elduende on August 15, 2009 at 7:20 PM
Just watched tonight’s stand-up comedy show. This is just too much. A baldface liar like this we’ve never seen.
Mr. Grump on August 15, 2009 at 7:21 PM
The Congress will ram the Health Scam through and their political careers will end in 2010.
yoda on August 15, 2009 at 7:21 PM
Rock meet hard place.
Popping the corn pouring the scotch.
HoustonRight on August 15, 2009 at 7:22 PM
Come on, Allahpundit! Tell us how your butt surgery went yesterday. Is it still sore?
Blake on August 15, 2009 at 7:22 PM
He’s soften you up , soon you’ll beg for his health care reform.
the_nile on August 15, 2009 at 7:22 PM
So when do we get the promised economic report?
Freebies are hard to kill.
tarpon on August 15, 2009 at 7:24 PM
Ace is right, I think, but the game isn’t over. So is Taranto, incidentally.
Spirit of 1776 on August 15, 2009 at 7:24 PM
Yep, Barry’s got all that ego wrapped up in this one. Screw the party and the consequences; what it will come down to is WHAT WILL BARRY ACCEPT? The One would have no problem sacrificing his party for his narcissistic gains.
Exit question: Does this remind anyone of another leader of a European country, circa 1930-45?
GarandFan on August 15, 2009 at 7:25 PM
I just saw a clip of the Chief Liar on the CBS local news (between golf and football!) from his Montana townhomer. One guy slipped through – maybe – and declared the notion that the plans can be accomplished without tax increase to be “bull.” They went to The One in a white shirt open at the top with no tie who said that raising taxes a little on “people like me” would be OK.
Trouble is, Obama doesn’t have any proposal. He keeps referring to “My proposal” as if it exists. Has anyone seen it? I haven’t. Where is it?
EconomicNeocon on August 15, 2009 at 7:26 PM
We should get the man his own TV talk show. Barack Obama and his sidekick Arsenio Hall. Although Obama’s so fond of himself he’d only interview himself. Obama interviews his mirror on healthcare. Obama interviews his mirror on Iran.
elduende on August 15, 2009 at 7:27 PM
And yet despite all this, he is right now in Colorado again spouting his usual line about how the insurance companies are using scare tactics to defeat his healthcare plan, and how he will not be swayed and blah blah blah, yak, yak, yak, Ne-Ver-End-Ing-Stooooooooooooooooooooooooooooory!!!
pilamaye on August 15, 2009 at 7:27 PM
December 2012
chemman on August 15, 2009 at 7:29 PM
Give the libtards a fig leaf, throw a few billion at medicare and let them declare victory for he children.
Does it really matter? They’re out on their asses in 2010 either way.
jeff_from_mpls on August 15, 2009 at 7:29 PM
Anyone else beginning to think that the Dems traded the probability of a 12-16 year hold on the White House by picking Obama over Hillary?
cpaulus on August 15, 2009 at 7:30 PM
Hey, just switch over to TVLand…Al Bundy Marathon!
Fittingly, in the episode that just ended, Al’s daughter Kelley brought down a Chicago politician.
Del Dolemonte on August 15, 2009 at 7:31 PM
If I were Obama I would tell the left to get bent. Where are they now when he needs them?
TendStl on August 15, 2009 at 7:31 PM
So we would want to make sure that whoever it is that has run the USPS into the ground should NEVER be in charge of the health care of millions of Americans – right?
katablog.com on August 15, 2009 at 7:31 PM
I am afraid if the GOP offers up a competing bill it will be seen as accepting the need for national health care.
Would be much better to concentrate on medicare, medicade, the VA and the native American plans.
fourdeucer on August 15, 2009 at 7:32 PM
You know what Obama needs to do to bring this home? More T.V. appearances.
Weight of Glory on August 15, 2009 at 7:32 PM
Breaking headline: Precedent tells himself to get bent.
chemman on August 15, 2009 at 7:32 PM
Hah, great show. Thanks.
elduende on August 15, 2009 at 7:33 PM
SO people aren’t buying this ad campaign? “Joe Bama ‘Smooth Character’ Ad Campaign Used to Promote Administration Health Care Policy” http://optoons.blogspot.com/2009/05/joe-bama-smooth-character-ad-campaign.html
Mervis Winter on August 15, 2009 at 7:33 PM
Peter Principle: That would be their next promotion.
chemman on August 15, 2009 at 7:34 PM
You asked for it…
My my, at waterloo napoleon did surrender
Oh yeah, and I have met my destiny in quite a similar way
The history book on the shelf
Is always repeating itself
Waterloo – I was defeated, you won the war
Waterloo – promise to love you for ever more
Waterloo – couldn’t escape if I wanted to
Waterloo – knowing my fate is to be with you
Waterloo – finally facing my waterloo
My my, I tried to hold you back but you were stronger
Oh yeah, and now it seems my only chance is giving up the fight
And how could I ever refuse
I feel like I win when I lose
Waterloo – I was defeated, you won the war
Waterloo – promise to love you for ever more
Waterloo – couldn’t escape if I wanted to
Waterloo – knowing my fate is to be with you
And how could I ever refuse
I feel like I win when I lose
Waterloo – I was defeated, you won the war
Waterloo – promise to love you for ever more
Waterloo – couldn’t escape if I wanted to
Waterloo – knowing my fate is to be with you
Waterloo – finally facing my waterloo
Ugly on August 15, 2009 at 7:34 PM
The current proposal is totally and unequivocally un-Constitutional. That’s all anyone needs to know.
progressoverpeace on August 15, 2009 at 7:35 PM
The
Party ofMajority of NO!Hmm, I wonder if 54% of the nation are now determined to be racist.
gekkobear on August 15, 2009 at 7:36 PM
I just hope his WH keeps telling us what idiots we all are…and I hope Dear Leader keeps making those glib remarks at all of his Campaign(townhall) rallies.
d1carter on August 15, 2009 at 7:36 PM
Only 35% support that piece of garbage.
The Democrats are in it deep if they pass it.
forest on August 15, 2009 at 7:36 PM
Hah. Thanks. I’ll never voluntarily type that word again.
elduende on August 15, 2009 at 7:36 PM
I love it, love it. Destroying the left wings golden child is awesome.
lavell12 on August 15, 2009 at 7:37 PM
Good thing Hillary has found success as a diplomat, now that her life’s mission has been botched by the idiot she endorsed for President.
Too fun.
jeff_from_mpls on August 15, 2009 at 7:39 PM
The Dems have to pass something. For all the reasons stated above and one that is less obvious.
They need the political weapon.
Once they pass it, they will hammer every Republican candidate from now until the end of time with “He wants to take away your health care!”
Which is one reason why no matter what, no Republican can vote for this bill. Passage of this bill will damage the Republican party forever.
Chris of Rights on August 15, 2009 at 7:42 PM
We need to focus on the secret Deal with Big Pharma. That will sink the Bill and Obama too.
Obama = oPharma.
Geochelone on August 15, 2009 at 7:45 PM
While I do understand what you are saying, the GOP can bring a bill that deals with tort reform, medical savings accounts and increased competition for insurance companies to sell across state lines.
There are issues the GOP can put forth that show they are concerned about health care for citizens without presenting the “need for national healthcare”.
ladyingray on August 15, 2009 at 7:47 PM
I hope these statists go noclear on Obama and the Blue Dogs (not that Obama has any limited govt bone sin his body). They must not know that it is the nature of governments to grow in power and reduce the liberties of constituents. There are desires fit with the natural ebb and flow of government.
How I wish it was the reverse (governments natural shed powers to the people).
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 7:52 PM
Allah (or Ed) please, please do a main article contrasting the positions of Wal-Mart and Whole Foods on Obamacare (Whole Foods opposes, Wal-Mart supports).
funky chicken on August 15, 2009 at 7:52 PM
This is Obama at the townhall today:
This problem with misinformation in our country. It seems to me that it’s not only hurting healthcare reform, health insurance reform, it’s dividing our country. Is it not maybe time… I think we all know where it’s coming from… is it not time that something can be done? Okay, I gotta watch what I’m saying…
He is getting scarier and scarier every day.
KLI50 on August 15, 2009 at 7:54 PM
I like that.
Has anyone yet drawn a cartoon of these bedfellows together?
misslizzi on August 15, 2009 at 7:54 PM
Er, I’m not on board with demonizing “Big Pharma.” penny wise and pound foolish…
funky chicken on August 15, 2009 at 7:55 PM
I believe that was person asking the question who said that.
misslizzi on August 15, 2009 at 7:56 PM
Statist shop at Whole Foods (at least used to). Statist hate Wal-Mart. Another bug for their arse.
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 7:56 PM
Why doesn’t it surprise me that the two biggest RINOS think we will lose this issue?
Blake on August 15, 2009 at 7:57 PM
Booooosh!!!! Evil Booosh!!!
jana on August 15, 2009 at 7:57 PM
Good grief. He’s slandering citizens across the nation.
INC on August 15, 2009 at 7:57 PM
I think the “middle incomers” KNOW who will be pay for it.
Kris on August 15, 2009 at 7:59 PM
At least the social security debate was on the up and up in 2005. Points like:
- The system is solvent unti 2042.
- You will be forced to invest in the stock market.
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 7:59 PM
So was the Government take over of GM and the Chrysler Bankruptcy where senior creditors got sold out for union preference. But did you see any one stop it?
katablog.com on August 15, 2009 at 7:59 PM
Good call, lady; and this is exactly the time for the GOP to put this forward. I would add;
1. The GOP bill should be short – < 300 pages, if possible. (much more easily “digestible” than all of the current proposals.)
2. If the GOP were to include a true “retail” option for health care (think health care, purchased in the same manner as life insurance – from a big, established, national insurer,) then they can say “this is in place of the public option.
Tactically, this also makes the GOP the party of “hey, we listened to the American people, and came up with a bill based on what they wanted!
massrighty on August 15, 2009 at 8:00 PM
Unfortunately, most of us know it will never really be over. The liberals will try it this way, and that way, and try to tack something on to an unrelated bill that starts the whole mess again. The GOP needs to do something right (pretty please, for once?)to address some of the major concerns, such as tort reform. Free market solutions, not government control.
bookman on August 15, 2009 at 8:00 PM
No no, that wasn’t Obama. It was a guy with a lisp and an effeminate voice. The part where he said “I gotta watch what I’m saying” you could hear him peeing in his pants, a little trickling sound, because he was having visions of getting beat up or something. I was driving and listening to it on Fox News, but he sounded like Son of Pony Tail Guy from Virginia, 1992.
jeff_from_mpls on August 15, 2009 at 8:01 PM
There has got to be a way to make hay with this deal without demonizing the Pharma companies. The deal should at least make the statist squirm. Why are you (the statists) sleeping with your enemies? Wal-Mart? Big-Pharma?
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 8:01 PM
Rasmussen breaks the poll down to this:
Some of those Blue Dogs will have to pay attention to the demographics of their constituency. 54% may be the average across the board, but that’s only because the Dems drag it down.
If the Dem numbers go below 60%, then that will make a dent. There have been raucous town halls in Blue districts with voters objecting to health care reform. Ed had mentioned one in MN with Keith Ellison.
Jammie Wearing Fool reported on one in Brooklyn:
Brooklyn Mobsters: ‘You Are Bankrupting Our Country. You Guys are Crooks’
The momentum is on the side of increasing opposition.
INC on August 15, 2009 at 8:04 PM
An amendment that allows citizens to challenge the constitutionality of laws would be a nice addition. Thomaas Jefferson suggested to Madison that the Supreme Court should get veto power over laws that do not fit the constitution.
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 8:04 PM
Okay, I feel a little better then, not much, just a little.
KLI50 on August 15, 2009 at 8:04 PM
Obama said it best:
“”Post Office sucks and looses money, so we want to help with “Insurance Reform” “Health Care Reform” or whatever reform we can cram down your throats without reading the bills. Thanks Nancy Pelosi for making HR 3200 public see what you have done”"
I think that is a direct quote or something like that.
Sanmon on August 15, 2009 at 8:05 PM
I agree. Wouldn’t people just assume that Big Pharma was being threatened by the thug in the White House, so they went along with a secret deal?
After seeing what the Marxist in Chief has done to the auto industry, I’m sure Pharma would be forgiven for trying to make out with as little damage to their industry as possible.
jana on August 15, 2009 at 8:07 PM
Thanks. For a minute there, I doubted my memory.
Anyway, the lisper said that after he heard moaning from the supposed opponents in the audience. Too bad Obama didn’t pick one of them to ask a question.
misslizzi on August 15, 2009 at 8:07 PM
Look, no one is taking away my right to choose my own healthcare. And no one is going to get any money out of me to pay for the healthcare of those too lazy to get their own or for illegal aliens. It’s not going to happen. No matter what stinkin’ RINOs say.
Blake on August 15, 2009 at 8:07 PM
Why so socialist?
Laughing Bear on August 15, 2009 at 8:08 PM
Something will pass. We just have to hope it is not the public “option”. That is the Trojan horse. If no public option, then the right has won – for now. If a public option, then the left has won forever.
That is the insidious nature of creeping socialism. Like the IRA told Thatcher after their hotel bombing luckily just missed her: You have to be lucky every time. We only have to be lucky once.
If the Left gets lucky just once with this bill, and gets the public option, and they can keep trying for 3 more years, then the Trojan horse is through the gate and socialized medicine will become, with time, a fact of American life. Maybe not this generation, but for sure the next. Socialism is nothing if not patient.
keep the change on August 15, 2009 at 8:11 PM
I vote no bill no way no how. I would like a major retraction of the long and dirty arms of daddy gov.
Obama today said medicare is unsustainable, so how complete socialized medicine sustainable??
60% the ceiling? likely so, but if we want to remain a free nation that number should be 85%!
allrsn on August 15, 2009 at 8:11 PM
Why is it demonizing to show a secret agreement that doesn’t address consumer’s concerns and simultaneously breaks a campaign promise?
Spirit of 1776 on August 15, 2009 at 8:12 PM
uh Blake, don’t look now but you are indeed already paying for illegal health care if you pay a dime in taxes. They just show up at emergency rooms.
katablog.com on August 15, 2009 at 8:13 PM
Look we need to make Obama own this crap sandwich. No negotiations and no compromises. Nothing that has Obama’s approval should be accepted. Nothing.
Let them force this takeover on the nation without support because it will destroy them and permanently cripple Obama.
Kill the bill.
elduende on August 15, 2009 at 8:14 PM
This really needs to be Point One in our argument against this government takeover.
Patrick S on August 15, 2009 at 8:14 PM
Those against health care reform need to inform seniors that Obama is going to cut Medicare Advantage (it may already be slated to be phased out in 2011?).
Today in Colorado, Obama finally said it straight out that the $177 billion he’s been talking about cutting in order to find money to pay for this *is* Medicare Advantage.
Obama defined the program as one that just pays people extra to administer something that seniors already have for less with straight Medicare; however, this is disingenuous to say the least.
Now that Obama has actually uttered from his own mouth that he wants to cut the program, opposition finally has something meaty to address that will drive most of the rest of seniors into opposing “reform”.
Greyledge Gal on August 15, 2009 at 8:15 PM
The left has been making inroads for decades with: medicare, medicaid, s-chip, cobra and more. continuous expansion.
Yes they will get ‘some’ bill passed if not this year then 2010. What ever does pass will expand rapidly.
allrsn on August 15, 2009 at 8:16 PM
Don’t assume.
Blake on August 15, 2009 at 8:16 PM
Just remember, if anything does pass, it can (and will) all change during reconciliation where they throw back in anything they wanted.
katablog.com on August 15, 2009 at 8:17 PM
My apologies to those with a little extra around the waist, but just thinking about a bill like this being passed makes me look at overweight (or smokers, heavy drinkers, drug users, etc.) people and think, “why do I have to pay the same as them if this plan passes?” I cannot imagine I am alone with these thoughts. This bill will create more tension in our society than we are seeing now in its protest.
I have a little saying:
Socialism builds isolationism
Individualism builds communities
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 8:17 PM
‘Death panel’ is not in the bill… it already exists
By Joseph Ashby
Former Alaskan Governor Sarah Palin has come under fire for her Facebook post accusing President Obama and the Democrats of including a “death panel” provision the health care bill. The Associated Press recently ran a ‘Fact Check’ article rebutting Palin’s claim.
AP argues that the bill’s end-of-life counseling provision has been mistaken as a promotion of euthanasia and thus the death panel assertion by Palin and many other conservatives is false and misleading.
The New York Times has joined in the death panel bashing. Jim Rutenburg and Jackie Calmes assert the following:
There is nothing in any of the legislative proposals that would call for the creation of death panels or any other governmental body that would cut off care for the critically ill as a cost-cutting measure.
The AP is technically correct in stating that end-of-life counseling is not the same as a death panel. The New York Times is also correct to point out that the health care bill contains no provision setting up such a panel.
What both outlets fail to point out is that the panel already exists.
H.R. 1 (more commonly known as the Recovery and Reinvestment Act, even more commonly known as the Stimulus Bill and aptly dubbed the Porkulus Bill) contains a whopping $1.1 billion to fund the Federal Coordinating Council for Comparative Effectiveness Research. The Council is the brain child of former Health and Human Services Secretary Nominee Tom Daschle. Before the Porkulus Bill passed, Betsy McCaughey, former Lieutenant governor of New York, wrote in detail about the Council’s purpose.
Daschle’s stated purpose (and therefore President Obama’s purpose) for creating the Council is to empower an unelected bureaucracy to make the hard decisions about health care rationing that elected politicians are politically unable to make. The end result is to slow costly medical advancement and consumption. Daschle argues that Americans ought to be more like Europeans who passively accept “hopeless diagnoses.”
McCaughey goes on to explain:
Daschle says health-care reform “will not be pain free.” Seniors should be more accepting of the conditions that come with age instead of treating them.
Who is on the Council? One of its most prominent members is none other than Dr. Death himself Ezekiel Emanuel. Dr. Emanuel’s views on care of the elderly should frighten anyone who is or ever plans on being old. He explains the logic behind his discriminatory views on elderly care as follows:
Unlike allocation by sex or race, allocation by age is not invidious discrimination; every person lives through different life stages rather than being a single age. Even if 25-year-olds receive priority over 65-year-olds, everyone who is 65 years now was previously 25 years.
On average 25-year-olds require very few medical services. If they are to get the lion’s share of the treatment, then those 65 and over can expect very little care. Dr. Emanuel’s views on saving money on medical care are simple: don’t provide any medical care. The loosely worded provisions in H.R 1 give him and his Council increasing power to push such recommendations.
Similarly hazy language will no doubt be used in the health care bill. What may pass as a 1,000 page health care law will explode into perhaps many thousands of pages of regulatory codes. The deliberate vagueness will give regulators tremendous leverage to interpret its provisions. Thus Obama’s Regulatory Czar Cass Sunstein will play a major role in defining the government’s role in controlling medical care.
How does Sunstein approach end of life care? In 2003 he wrote a paper for the AEI-Brookings Joint Center for Regulatory Studies arguing that human life varies in value. Specifically he champions statistical methods that give preference to what the government rates as “quality-adjusted life years.” Meaning, the government decides whether a person’s life is worth living. If the government decides the life is not worth living, it is the individual’s duty to die to free up welfare payments for the young and productive.
Ultimately it was Obama himself, in answer to a question on his ABC News infomercial, who said that payment determination cannot be influenced by a person’s spirit and “that at least we (the Federal Coordinating Council for Comparative Effectiveness Research) can let doctors know and your mom know that…this isn’t going to help. Maybe you’re better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller.”
Maybe we should ask the Associated Press and New York Times if they still think we shouldn’t be concerned about a federal “death panel.”
nondhimmie on August 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM
NYT, CNN, MSNBC
You want Death Panels, go to the stimulus bill….there they are.
nondhimmie on August 15, 2009 at 8:20 PM
This any many other bills; espicially if talking to a rep. Make them tell you how they are either (a) fulfilling their oath of office or (b) violating their oath of office.
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 8:20 PM
And tireless in it’s persistence.
They’ve been trying to get this boondoggle through since the ’50s.
jana on August 15, 2009 at 8:22 PM
Joker speaks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZ8L0RE2Axs
pearson on August 15, 2009 at 8:22 PM
Since you brought it up, can you help me understand reconciliation. I have read about it but can’t comprehend the process as it relates to the two bills out there.
sherry on August 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM
54 Percent are OFFICIALY RACIST
CWforFreedom on August 15, 2009 at 8:24 PM
WashJeff on August 15, 2009 at 8:01 PM
Ya know, the whole Whole Foods/Wal Mart thing has me scratching my head. Wal Mart buys lots of cheap crap made overseas and sells it cheaply…but those products used to be quality, American-made consumer goods. When towels and sheets and T-shirts were made in America, they lasted a long, long time. My parents gave me the towels they bought when they got married when I went to college…up until then, the family used them.
So, Americans lost good paying jobs, small towns were devastated when the textile plants shut down, China became a serious economic threat, and conservatives cheer?
Whole Foods actually does purchase things from local farmers and craftsmen, and sells those things at a price that allows the family farmers etc to make a living. Whole Foods pays their employees very well and provides generous benefit packages. They provide a premium product that their customers are willing to pay for. But conservatives spit at them?
My dad’s family came from a family farm. Family farmers have been driven out of business by the Smithfield Foods and Tyson CAFO operations, because family farmers actually live on the land they use to raise their animals, and therefore won’t trash the land like Smithfield and Tyson do….but conservatives cheer for Smithfield and spit at Whole Foods, who buys from the few surviving family farms?
You know, the “all natural” farmers are just raising animals the way my grandparents, great aunts and uncles, and cousins used to. But conservatives make fun of them?
funky chicken on August 15, 2009 at 8:25 PM
Middle income voters end at $75k? Whoa…I’m rich!
Don’t let Obama know.
Since even before that. Persistence indeed.
Bob's Kid on August 15, 2009 at 8:26 PM
No it doesn’t. I’m not willing to accept that, and I don’t think I’m being Pollyanna-ish.
If we continue to hammer them through September and the first two weeks of October, then we won’t have to worry about anything happening until after the new year because, of course, they have another recess from mid-October until the second week in January.
I’m thinking by then it will be too close to the 2010 midterms for them to risk alienating even more people.
IrishEi on August 15, 2009 at 8:27 PM
No Bill, No Way, No How!
Fighton03 on August 15, 2009 at 8:27 PM
This is getting real old.
He says he wants to protect us from the insurance industry.
So why pass laws that take power and choice from us??
He says he wants to ensure those who aren’t insured.
So why ration care? Doesn’t that remove coverage from people??
He says it’s not about him. So why does he always refer to himself when he gives a speech about health care,,, “I want to do this” “I am going to do this” ” I am not going to allow that” on and on and on.
He is like some kind of life sucking leech stuck to our rear side. Besides driving people apart this guy’s only purpose seems to be to take things. To take power from us, to take liberty, to take property, to take freedom, to take our money and to take our very lives if he can. Take Take take. And we are suppose to just shut up. What a freaking nightmare.
JellyToast on August 15, 2009 at 8:28 PM
A Blue Dog ran as a Democrat for plain and practical reasons, and that is understandable. But life is arbitrary and unfair, and if he is too play a larger role besides being an appendage to a party that does not love him, he must simply decide now, based upon an understanding of the future that is not going to become any more clearer before he is called upon to take action, whether he wishes to affirmatively support a socialistic agenda and a far-left Democrat party quite likely not in harmony with his constituents by that action, whatever his own words and thoughts may be. It is the act of voting that will define him, not whatever he may actually be, and unfortunately it will have to be that act that must be acted upon. Quite simply, while politics is the art of the possible, and compromise is necessary, he must understand that becoming a Democrat merely because one did not wish to validate Republicans does not remove him from the need not to then validate a party he very likely would not have joined actively in arms except for the Republicans. True leaders are those with an independence of spirit and ability to see where they wish to go, even if there at this time exists no path to get there. I ask the Blue Dogs to think carefully how much more allegiance is due their current leadership, and to vote their consciences appropriately. He who dares ultimately wins.
Horatius on August 15, 2009 at 8:29 PM
You for the tax policies of good ole daddy gov which highly favored the giant farms of today.
allrsn on August 15, 2009 at 8:33 PM
Lots of “unthinkable” things happen. Imagine back in coming up to the 2006 elections. If the democrats get a majority of seats in either/both Houses of Congress (Congress, of course, having the “power of the purse”) it would be “unthinkable” for Bush to increase, not just to not decrease but to actually increase, troop levels and spending in Iraq. Guess what?
MB4 on August 15, 2009 at 8:35 PM
That’s very true, but we have taken a gigantic step forward with health care. This is individual, and the universal mandates mean that it affects every single person. This is also not a takeover but the whole creation of a new arm of government.
Don’t get me wrong, they are both as un-Constitutional, but the difference is of orders of magnitude. Of course, those of us who pounded on the un-Constitutionality of the GM/Chrysler deals (which you were probably one of the more vocal ones – along with the desecration of contract law) warned taht it would lead to much worse, which is what we have with this insane health care proposal. This time, instead of dictating the board of GM, the government will get into dictating our actual behaviors (smoking, weight, …) since they will be picking up the bill for the health care.
All of these warnings need to be made, but the un-Constitutionality is still the only real argument, since arguing the other areas is almost surrendering the Constitutional question, which is what happened with all of those other un-Constitutional actions up to now.
There were never any big Constitutional arguments offered against them, but, even so the federal judiciary was criminal in how they handled the one official challenge they did get.
progressoverpeace on August 15, 2009 at 8:39 PM
Yeah,, lets throw a party! The Democrats and Obama are going to take things from us!
They’re not the Nazi’s,, we are! Who would have known!?
They’re not seizing private property,,, they are protecting us from those evil car makers!
They’re not seizing the medical industry! They are going to protect us from those evil doctors, nurses and insurance companies!
They’re not destroying the economy! They are just saving jobs by eliminating jobs!
The MSN isn’t really a mouthpiece for the Obama administration! They just repeat everything Obama tells them to! They are protecting us from the facts!
JellyToast on August 15, 2009 at 8:40 PM
I called my mother who is a conservative Democrat in Colorado to see if she was watching the President and she said no she was too busy watching Tiger Woods. I am proud to say, her county carried McCain by 75%.
yoda on August 15, 2009 at 8:41 PM
because the ad would be playing off the “Big Pharma is evil” meme? That was the initial connotation of the post I responded to…sadly, people on the left side of the political spectrum don’t seem that outraged by broken campaign promises. don’t ask me to explain that, because I can’t, by the way.
funky chicken on August 15, 2009 at 8:41 PM
I don’t know what is going to happen, but I never thought Obama would screw this up as badly as he has. So maybe they will go right on screwing up until it blows up in their faces.
Or maybe it will pass in the House and die in the Senate like cap and trade.
Terrye on August 15, 2009 at 8:42 PM
NO, of course not. And the “farm bill” travesties passed over the last couple of decades have only helped the big factory farms/CAFOs too. Unfortunately, Bush signed several crapfests like that….and McCain actually voted against them.
That’s one reason why I never hated McCain. He certainly wasn’t my guy in the primaries, but he was better than Bush in many ways, and his record goes back to 1981 on idiot spending measures and taxes. And Bush was way more for open borders than McCain was in 1999/2000.
funky chicken on August 15, 2009 at 8:45 PM
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