Poll: 28% of Republicans don’t believe Obama was born in America? Update: Skeptics mostly southern
posted at 12:05 pm on July 31, 2009 by Allahpundit
On the one hand, the poll was sponsored by … Daily Kos. On the other hand, Research 2000 is a reputable pollster as far as I know and the way they posed the question wasn’t slanted.
The survey of American adults asked, “Do you believe that Barack Obama was born in the United States of America or not?” It found that 77% of Americans answer affirmatively, 11% say “no,” with the balance unsure.
Notably, that 11% closely tracks the — extremely stable — share of the electorate that thought Obama was a Muslim, bolstering the notion that there’s a certain share of the party’s base (and this may well hold for both parties) that isn’t about to let facts get in the way of negative views of a president of the opposite party…
With nearly a third of Republicans believing the theory, you can see why Republican politicians are inclined to treat it with some respect.
Party-line breakdowns: Dems 93/4/3 (the last figure is “don’t know”), Indies 83/8/9, and GOP … 42/28/30. Fully 58 percent of Republicans aren’t willing to accept a state-issued Certification of Live Birth as proof that The One was born in Honolulu? I’m skeptical, but, er, not so skeptical that I’m willing to poll this myself at HA. Sounds like a job for Scott Rasmussen. How about it, Scottster?
Update: Voinovich 1, Vitter 0.
Only 47 percent of Southern respondents believe Obama was born in the USA. By contrast, 93 percent of Northeasterns said yes, he was born here, 90 percent of Midwesterners did and 87 percent of Westerners.
Wow.
Blowback
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No. Just, no.
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:16 PM
It won’t. If you haven’t noticed, most of the birthers are the same ones in every thread. Meanwhile, if you go back a year ago, when this was all starting, most posters discarded the idea. It’s still that way.
MadisonConservative on July 31, 2009 at 7:17 PM
I don’t know if the hearing date is set, I believe he still has to rule on whether or not the case has merit.
Califemme on July 31, 2009 at 7:18 PM
Depends on what Definition of “Natural Born Citizen” the Supreme Court decides on…
If they use the above… McCain could be in trouble to… as his already released birth cert, which shows the hospital where he was born… and the laws at the time… would NOT make him a “Natural born citizen”… and anything Congress did after that, while advisory, would not be binding…
Messy…
Romeo13 on July 31, 2009 at 7:19 PM
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:19 PM
Whoops – blockquote error.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:19 PM
My estimate from personal experience.
The push to portray us as kooks was far stronger for the global warming idiocy. We kicked their butts at that, too. This situation is even more cut and dried. Eventually, when they have to start talking about multiple citizenship in the media (which they studiously ignore) they are going to sink like a rock.
Well, I don’t know what changed their minds (as they had gone out of their way not to mention the case of Major Cook, when his deployment was just revoked with no charges) but then they jumped into the the whole discussion – always looking for the position most mocking of the “natural born citizen” and never even talking about multiple citizenship (save that one thread with Orly Taitz’s appearance on Colbert – as she was talking about it). Once we all saw the 1000 count threads, it seemed pretty clear that this wasn’t going away quietly.
Yes. I’m not saying that you want to ban anyone, when I call you a suppressor, just that you want us to shut up. The suppressor label is not literal. It’s just a naming reaction to your group for calling us “birthers”. I don’t like ‘anti-birther’, so I opt for ‘suppressor’. it’s just a name for your group, not some ultra-serious description.
Well, I have read many of the briefs filed and I know that your assumption about people having checked anything is just wrong. Aside from that, there are these serious questions about ‘natural born citizen’ that no SecState knows the answer to. The fact that none of the sought guidance shows that they didn’t check. Many of the briefs for the cases against the SecStates show that they didn’t check anything but relied on the parties’ words. They actually said that, exactly.
It is part of the documentation needed to establish the idiot messiah’s citizenship status. It is not the be-all and end-all, but it is a part of it. Adoption info would be reflected in it, name changes, … But this is for the courts, now, not for me. I ask for official verification, not public disclosure to satisfy my curiosity.
ALl that needs to happen is for one court to grant standing (which is well-deserved in many of the cases that have been brought) and then everything will work its own way out and we will get direct guidance on the operational definition of ‘natural born citizen’.
Meh. If the whole thing fizzles, it will be forgotten in no time, no matter how much the MSM might try to push it. Just the point of having fought against simple disclosures for so long would taint The Precedent. Even the left-tards, like Jonathan Turley, don’t understand why he hasn’t just presented lots of the info requested (though that would have no impact on the court cases that we want heard and ruled on).
McCain didn’t stick up for Palin and he didn’t attack the idiot messiah. If he had, things would have been very different.
If you’re worried about being painted a loon, just think “global warming”. There was no bigger push by the left and the media to paint us as kooks as with the global warming insanity and we beat them silly. And that was an international push against us, including thousands of pseudo-scientists and every national and international organization around.
progressoverpeace on July 31, 2009 at 7:20 PM
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 7:15 PM
Good points. If even one state actually has access to the legal evidence and he’s shown to be ineligible in 2012 he’ll be off the ballot everywhere.
To be honest I don’t think he’d get re-elected anyway, at this rate. What I’m more concerned about is how much he can destroy our foundations before he leaves.
He’s definitely been going for the jugular, and at hyper-speed. http://www.veritasbelt.blogspot.com
justincase on July 31, 2009 at 7:21 PM
Actualy, one of the lawsuits which is ongoing uses that as one of its points…
That Mccain was investigated, while Obama was not, thus there was no “Equal Protection”…
Romeo13 on July 31, 2009 at 7:22 PM
I have to show a birth certificate to get a job working for my aunt, this tool should have to show his too
MyImamToldMeToDoIt on July 31, 2009 at 7:22 PM
Look around, dude, look around. Remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
Califemme on July 31, 2009 at 7:24 PM
Occam’s Razor on this (IMO)…
Assuming the Long Form of the COLB has a blank for “Religion”, then my guess is that it really does say “Muslim”. And they made the decision long ago that they didn’t want that to be made public.
I ain’t saying he’s Muslim, and I wouldn’t truly care if he was. But some folks would. And he’s still got another presidential election to consider.
Unless my one assumpion is wrong, I think it is the most succinct and complete explanation. QED
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:24 PM
So, when there is ample evidence that something is amiss and the subject of that suspicion is acting oddly and blocking all attempts at providing proof to the contrary, you call that person a ‘conspiracy nutjob’?? In most jursidictions, the cops would call that “reasonable suspicion”.
I’m skeptical of polls but, if it was done right, then 28% is a lot of people asking “Where’s the beef?”
People can be easily fooled and the ‘conventional wisdom’ is often wrong. Some examples from history
- Americans thought the Japanese would make poor pilots because of their eyes and that no one could drop torpedos in Pearl HArbor.. Some nutcased claimed otherwise.
- Neville Chamberlain believed the one testicaled paperhanger and came back with a piece of paper proclaiming “Peace in our time”. Some nutcases claimed hitler was going to be a problem.
- SOme guy named Maddoff Bilked what? 50 billion or whatever. HE didn’t bilk the corner drunk, he bilked supposedly intelligent people with 7 figure net incomes. Some nutcases went to the DA saying there had to be something wrong.
There is no effective vetting process in place. Sometimes bluff works. When I worked for the NAvy, I tall skinny guy pasted a picture of Gorbechov over his ID pic. For two years he walked right onto our compound every day and was never challenged. He didn’t even have a big red spot on his forehead.
There is ample evidence to suggest something isn’t right aboout ozero, he has provided no documentaation adn the system hasn’t vetted him.. Nutcase conspiracy?? I don’t theeeenk so Lucy.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 7:27 PM
So you have no evidence of any spending on his part. I’m interested in facts, not guesses. His campaign had normal legal expenses, very similar to McCain’s campaign. As far as I can tell, that’s where the million dollar estimates are from which is insane (believing a near billion dollar campaign’s total legal expenses were to defend a couple of frivolous lawsuits).
If by “gone all the way to the Supremes” you mean rejected immediately without comment, then I guess you’re right. But that doesn’t cost Obama a dime. His lawyers have written a few letters, but beyond that I don’t see any accounting for expenses. Many of the cases weren’t even against him (Greenberg v. Brunner, Martin vs Lingle, Wrotnowski v. Connecticut Sec State, etc etc).
jonknee on July 31, 2009 at 7:29 PM
That could be it. Or a different father.
If the document his campaign put out as his COLB turns out to be altered – even after they swore up and down it was legit, it’s fraud. If you donated time or money to the campaign, you could sue. That could be very inconvenient, even if only a few did sue. But it might also inspire someone to move on impeachment. It could also lead to a more comprehensive background check. This is why I want to see it.
I’m not a Birther – didn’t we decide a few days ago to call ourselves “Documenters”?
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:29 PM
The system has vetted him. There may well be something on the COLB that he does not want public, but it is not his citizenship.
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:29 PM
I would not be ashamed to be called that (if i cared that much, which I don’t).
But the topic of this post was republicans that believe Obama was not born in the USA.
And stupid Southerners. Of which I are a part.
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:31 PM
The same could be said of Palin threads, Meghan McCain threads, atheism threads, police abuse of power threads, gay marriage threads, etc. Comment count does not correlate to relevance in the national dialogue, merely to the passion with which people on each side on Hot Air feel about the issue.
Then how about “terminators”? It sounds even cooler, and you could argue that we’re trying to “terminate” discussion. Again, I don’t want people to shut up. I want people to spend less time on this, and move on to more important matters. Also, I’d like the idiots claiming to know what is on the long form birth certificate they haven’t seen to shut up, since, as I said, they haven’t seen it and so don’t know what’s on it.
Then you seem to be differing from a great number of your peers in that. This is the first time I’ve seen you clarify that you’re asking for authorities tasked with this responsibility to affirm it, and not anonymous internet commenters. If that’s the case, I apologize for lumping you in with the nuts. You’re more like the yogurt-covered raisin, and I like those.
I truly hope that you’re right, but look at how long they’ve held onto their smears of Palin. It doesn’t look good. These people hold onto this stuff forever.
Fair point.
But once again, you have to take into account that numerous high-profile conservatives have dismissed the BC controversy. For that to be an apposite comparison, that would require that a good amount of climatologists, meteorologists, and other scientists had questioned global warming from the start. It took them a while to come around.
MadisonConservative on July 31, 2009 at 7:32 PM
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:29 PM
And if the place of birth is not the point in question, then it changes the nature of the questions to mere curiosity (fanatical curioisity, for some).
No other question except the place of birth has anything to do with constitutional presidential qualifications.
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:34 PM
Hollowpoint,
In our Constitutional republic, the SCOTUS has assumed the position as the final arbiter of the meaning of the Constitution. It has historically refused to get involved in political questions. However, it has never shirked from the responsibility of defending the Constitution. It has repeatedly struck down acts of Congress as being unconstitutional. It has even decided a national election in Bush v. Gore. Assuming the standing issue could be satisfied and the NBC issue addressed on its merits, the SCOTUS could declare Obama to be a citizen, but not a NBC and not qualified to be POTUS. If that were to happen (I’m not saying that it would happen), but if it were to happen, there would be no need for a Congressional impeachment. The Obama Presidency would be declared null and void for failing to be qualified. All his orders would be rescinded. All laws signed by him would not longer be law. Our country would be thrown into a real live Constitutional crisis. It would take years to unwind everything. It would be fascinating to watch. I’m sure that the SCOTUS would be loathed to do it. That is why the Courts will continue to be unsympathetic to the various standing arguments and that is why the Court if it does address the NBC issue may very well ignore the framer’s intent and interpret NBC to mean citizen at birth. However, just because the effort will most likely prove unsuccessful is not a reason to not pursue it. If you believe we should respect the framer’s intent, then that applies as a principle, not just to the 2nd Amendment, but to the entire document, including Article II NBC.
tommylotto on July 31, 2009 at 7:38 PM
Hate to break it to you, but yes, you are a conspiracy theory buff. You believe in (and loudly supporting) a theory that Obama was born outside the US, and multiple people are conspiring to cover it up.
Try to rationalize it however you wish, but at the end of the day this makes you (and the rest of the Birther crowd) no different from the nutjobs who believe that Bush intentionally failed to stop 9/11 as an excuse to go to war, those how think the CIA killed JFK, the moon landing was faked, and there’s a captured UFO being held by the military.
No. Different. At. All.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 7:39 PM
Okay. I’ll give up the million dollar argument IF the anti-birthers will admit that there is no ethical purpose in keeping any of his birth/school/state senate records secret.
Face the truth – anybody who is afraid of what is in his past is dirty today.
He is a filthy lying POS. Right here, right now, in real time.
platypus on July 31, 2009 at 7:39 PM
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:34 PM
Citizenship and natural born citizenship are different. If BHOSr. is the father, Obama Jr. is not natural born.
But I’ve been making the point, after being ridiculed, that for many “Birthers” there are more issues. Documentation has not been provided and whether it’s our fault or Obama’s fault or the media’s fault does not matter.
Question – Is he not releasing the birth certificate that would make all of this go away because then there would be pressure to release the other documentation he might not want released?
My point has always been, since I raised this on my blog last year, is that this guy is missing something and is dangerous because of it and we need to know the truth – it will bring more people to our side. He’s a lying crap bag that is systematically dismantling the constitution and traditions of our nation and I will continue to throw everything and the kitchen sink at him.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:41 PM
When and where did he get vetted?? Supposedly each states’ election board is supposed to validate the status of a candidate. Unless you show me a state that required documented proof of eligibility for POTUS, I’d have to say it never happened.
Think about it. Most people can’t think outside the box. If you were to tell someone “make sure you check the status of the presidential candiates” I’d be willing to bet that most people wouldn’t even do a half-butted job. Look at the way most magic tricks are done. People see what they are expecting to see.
I was involved with a state level campaign. I can tell you from firsthand experience that outsiders are raked over the coals with regard to verification. OTOH, the incumbents of both parties are pretty much given a pass. We reported some verifiable fraud. It went to a judge and the judge played the “no Standing” crap with the person who filed the complaint. There was a felony committed but the two parties worked together to bury it. One of the other challengers made a technical error, not in my opinion fraud, and had tons of legal bills.
We can still fix this in 2012 if we have strict vetting by a couple of states, that is if DA ONE will still allow elections.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 7:41 PM
Can’t disagree. I just simply regard his right to privacy, until he is under actual investigation for criminal activities.
In other words, I expect that right to be revoked before the year is out.
MadisonConservative on July 31, 2009 at 7:43 PM
This thread has over 1,000 comments.
The thread about abortion coverage being re-inserted into the Obamacare bill has under 75.
This troubles me a bit.
jazz_piano on July 31, 2009 at 7:48 PM
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 7:39 PM
Again, I disagree. The theories you mentioned are completely different in that this would mean the destruction of our nation. I take that a bit more seriously than the moon landing. And regarding the 9/11 truthers, I take great offense – which you probably intended – to you saying I’m their equivalent. That is a heinous theory developed by political operatives designed to gain power not a grassroots investigation started by a public hungry for information.
OK, I changed my mind. You’re probably always an a$$. Are you 60 or 16? I can’t tell which.
But when the revolution comes, we will still be fighting on the same side – the Right side.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:51 PM
Where was he vetted? The machine, dead people vote state of Illinois?
Yeah, I feel better now.
ORconservative on July 31, 2009 at 7:52 PM
I’m actually watching “Hardball” and Chris Matthews has spent the entire hour hyping this “daily kos” poll and throwing the entire South under the bus. Fascinating.
Marcus on July 31, 2009 at 7:52 PM
.
MadCon & gopmom, I couldn’t AGREE more. I’m guilty of pushing too hard sometimes, and sometimes for the wrong reasons. I get a consummed, like an addiction, with this one thread/topic and lose all perspective. I’m sure my posts contribute to the “crazy train” stereotype.
.
Your point about all the other areas that Obama is failing in that are being neglected, I plead guilty. I’m watching all of it, but only blogging about the citizenship. It is worrisome that the timing of all the public interest in Obama’s citizenship issue is taking away from the Obama/Dem leadership debacle. I guess It’s easier to focus on one thing at a time for me- unlike all of the others who are all over the issues. I envy their power to multi-task!
.
In the end, we are all on the same side. Maybe if we can stop turning all our energy inward on eachother and just speak our piece respectfully without ridicule we might learn from eachother. I’m not lecturing- I’m guilty & going to try to avoid repeating bad behavior myself.
.
Whoever labeled it a “civil war” was right- is a distracting waste of time. We all have a lot to lose like the TOTAL LOSS OF OWNERSHIP OF OUR OWN COMPUTER’S FILES TO THE GOV’T that happens if (see my 5:23PM O/T Glenn Beck post & reply by powerpro on July 31, 2009 at 5:51 PM) you go onto the government’s Cash for Clunkers website. Once agree to their TOS, you’re giving the gov’t the right to collect information from your computers and in some cases your phones.
.
We are rapidly losing our rights. To privacy. To free speech. To vote.
.
This “war” could go on like the Middle East. I’m not sure who said it but I like the sound of a HotAir Truce.
NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 7:54 PM
Are you saying that a person occupying a public office has a right to privacy substantially equivalent to a private citizen? I’m pretty sure I disagree with that.
On the other hand, if you are suggesting it is bad form to subject public servants to colonoscopy then I would say it depends.
platypus on July 31, 2009 at 7:56 PM
jazz_piano on July 31, 2009 at 7:48 PM
This is inappropriately tongue in cheek –
Why would it bother you? In both threads Obama is the monster.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 7:56 PM
You were expecting a big difference of opinion on that other topic?
Ronnie on July 31, 2009 at 7:56 PM
Fine, as long as you admit that giving a crap about what he got in Cell Biology class and dimly and quixotically obsessing over his now firmly established eligibility hurts our country, it doesn’t help it.
For the last time, you bottom feeding nutjobs, Obama isn’t hiding anything. Actually, he’s wearing his socialist intentions on his sleeve.
justfinethanks on July 31, 2009 at 7:57 PM
Actually….I think he was hatched.
purgatory on July 31, 2009 at 7:57 PM
justfinethanks on July 31, 2009 at 7:57 PM
False.
True.
They are related.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 8:00 PM
Somewhere in-between. The privacy of politician’s personal lives used to be far more guaranteed when they weren’t covered like celebrities. In other words, I don’t give a fetid dingus what Michelle Obama is f***ing wearing to their $100,000 getaway that I could only ever dream of going on, yet am paying for anyway!!!
Sorry, got a bit emotional there.
MadisonConservative on July 31, 2009 at 8:00 PM
Right- the notion that the government intentionally allowed 3,000 people to die in a terrorist attack or that a government agency murdered a sitting President are mere trivialities.
Not knowing which parent signed his birth certificate means THE END IS NEAR!!!!
Watch out for the black helocopters when your “revolution” spreads- they can be a real pain. Tinfoil headgear is your only defense.
Or so I hear on the Internet.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 8:01 PM
MadisonConservative on July 31, 2009 at 8:00 PM
These are emotional issues in emotional times. We all just need more empathy.
That tent just keeps stretching and stretching.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 8:02 PM
connertown on July 31, 2009 at 7:24 PM
We already have his Indonesian school registration form saying he was Muslim and he’s openly admitted that his dad was Muslim. I don’t think the certificate would add anything to the mix.
After having his mother’s nude pics all over the net, I doubt that the question of who his dad is would be his reason for holding out. If he had Malcolm X or Frank Marshall Davis for a dad it would at least remove the issue of dual citizenship.
I don’t think trying to protect his story is it either, because FOIA documents have proven him a liar about his past a hundred times over.
And he posted a forged COLB. He could have requested a COLB which verified only his name and birthplace, but he didn’t. Which claim did he think they wouldn’t verify – his name, or his birthplace? He could still – at this very moment – request a COLB verifying those things. But he won’t.
The only thing I can think of that he would want to hide is the statement on his COLB or birth certificate which says it is a late filing – because then the legitimacy of the claim of the certificate is, by Hawaii law, up for question. That notation would have made his certificate mere hearsay, with the judgment of its validity relying on the supporting documents.
If there were no supporting documents besides Ann or Madelyn’s statement, then the myriad pieces of evidence that he was born in Kenya would carry more weight. And if anyone got a foot in the door with a judge the records from Kenya could perhaps be subpoenaed?
This scenario would explain all the evidence I’m aware of. I know of no other theory which does.
justincase on July 31, 2009 at 8:03 PM
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 8:01 PM
But wait – which is it? 60 or 16?
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 8:03 PM
How about race = white.
Both the race of mom and dad are listed but not is. What is mom wanted him to be white? Kind of tough to be the first black president if you are listed as white on your BC.
jmarcure on July 31, 2009 at 8:07 PM
justincase on July 31, 2009 at 8:03 PM
I think the forged COLB released by the campaign was the big mistake. ANd it leaves a lot of questions to be answered.
Thanks for the links – I hadn’t seen all of them.
G’night.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 8:08 PM
Neither. 39.
Or at least that’s my very possibly fake birth certificate suggests. I suggest a grassroots investigation to find THE TRUTH.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 8:08 PM
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 8:08 PM
Never saw that coming. We’re the same age.
Oh well. Still so snippy. G’night.
gopmom on July 31, 2009 at 8:11 PM
My question is, if he was born here, why do records in Kenya need to be sealed? Why are there records in Kenya?
Conservalicious on July 31, 2009 at 8:12 PM
Yeah. The theory that his pregnant mother, while living and working in 1961 Hawaii, didn’t secretly hop a plane, fly to Kenya, give birth, immediately fly back and fake her son’s birth? Completely improbable.
How likely could it possibly be that her mother instead just decided to give birth near her home in Hawaii? That’s just crazy talk right there; I don’t see how anyone could believe something so ridiculous.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 8:15 PM
My fish says it has him listed as race = white.
jmarcure on July 31, 2009 at 8:17 PM
Obama is nothing but a arrogant, lying, socialist thug. His recent world apology tour linked with his damaging economic policies and race baiting indicate to me that he is not an American. Citizen? maybe, anti-American definately. I would like nothing more than to see him forcably removed from the WH. I don’t see that happening but what is he hiding? I am proud of my college transcripts and must present them for employment. We are his employer and I want to see what he is hiding. Yes I am one of those 47% in the Southern half of the nation.
farright on July 31, 2009 at 8:18 PM
MadisonConservative’s first link does not show the majority of comments prove him right or agree with him.
In the earliest threads regarding Obama’s links to Bill Ayers and then later the circumstances making Obama’s legitimacy questionable under Article II of the Constitution, I offered a lot of links to lawyer blogs in my HotAir comments, producing the scholarly research online for Ed and whoever else to study. To date, those who don’t want to touch Obama’s illegitimacy won’t, and never would, and never will. And as the months progress, the progressives become more vile with the juvenile radical name calling towards reason.
Here’s a blast from the past.
maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 8:23 PM
Strawman alert. The issue isn’t his grades. I teach as an adjunct prof. There are a lot of students who are in class who are on student visas. With all the records sealed, we leave open the possibility that Obama was enrolled as other than a US citizen.. Perhaps Indonesian.
The second point is your arguing via didactics “His firmly established eligibility”… His eligibility is far from ‘firmly established’. So far, the only docments presented do not establish eligibility and even they have been reasonably proven to have been photoshopped.
Your other claim that this ‘hurts our country’ can also be easily challenged. How would having someone who is ineligble sitting in the white house help our country. Gee if we had an imposter they might do crazy things like spend 4 trillion we don’t have, give loans to people who can’t pay them back, shelve investigations into voter fraud in philly, hire tax cheats as secreas, Hire a nutcase who argued that we should put sterlizing drugs in the water as science tsar, close gitmo, release terrorists into our country, bow to foreign kings, give the finger to our best allies etc. Thank GOD we don’t have a usurper in the whitehouse or stuff like that could be happening.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 8:23 PM
Yeah, you make a good point. It’s not like she would have any reason to go to Kenya like her kid’s father being Kenyan. We all know that the biplanes travelling between Hawaii and Kenya would have taken two weeks to make the trip.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 8:25 PM
You see? this is the entire problem….
You wish us to point to actual evidence and numbers, which he will not release…
Yet, based on common sense and personal expience (2.5 million total on an intellectual property case, that never even got to trial)… I know that Lawsuits are VERY expensive, on both sides.
This has not been “a few filings”… this has been hundreds and hundreds of hours, by lawyers, in MANY different jurisdictions (thus they must all be written differntly as they are under different legal systems).
But… I can’t proove it to you, because THEY WILL NOT RELEASE THE DOCS, and because they won’t release the docs, you won’t admit proof, and thus dismiss the entire question…
Even when BASIC common sense says that all lawsuits are inherently Expensive.
Romeo13 on July 31, 2009 at 8:26 PM
You win. After a couple of hours of reflection (actually a dinner with a friend and a couple of minutes of reflection), I’ve decided you are right. And that you are performing a useful service in mocking them. I don’t have the patience or the time for it myself right now, but please continue. Maybe, I’ll join you in a mocking ceremony in a day or two when I need to blow off some steam.
To your victory, brother!
thuja on July 31, 2009 at 8:28 PM
Thanks for identifying my social group correctly.
As far as what he’s hiding, his application to college is the mother lode. The BC flap is simply to prove that he will hide things that don’t matter. Therefore, when the time comes to justify hiding his college apps, the judge will be more likely to decide that there’s no reason to deny access to the records.
Anyway, your over-reaction indicates that either your meds need adjusting or your therapist is incompetent.
platypus on July 31, 2009 at 8:30 PM
The jury’s out.
maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 8:30 PM
No proof to them means you are a nut.
Doesn’t matter what Barry’s hiding, you are a nut.
Doesn’t matter that there are lawsuits, military orders rescinded, you are a nut.
So what if O was an Indonesion until after he was an adult, the world loves him and you are a nut.
Case closed.
ORconservative on July 31, 2009 at 8:31 PM
then… why not just say that? Why send a letter to a hospital on whitehouse stationary saying you were born THERE? Why the multiple stories? (as to which hospital?)
It goes to veracity, and credability.
It this was true, theres NOTHING TO HIDE! So, why hide it?
Romeo13 on July 31, 2009 at 8:32 PM
platypus on July 31, 2009 at 8:30 PM
That is exactly correct. The BC has something but the other is the piece that really must stay hidden to keep this out of the SCOTUS.
ORconservative on July 31, 2009 at 8:34 PM
Four legs good, two legs bad. Certification good, Certificate bad. Ignorance is strength. Subservience is Freedom. Blindness is sight.
Cheshire Cat on July 31, 2009 at 8:36 PM
Does anyone know about flights in the 1960′s Just for kicks I looked and the flight from Hawaii to Kenya is about 11k miles or so. Interesting thing though is that Indonesia is halfway between Hawii and Kenya (Of course, there are other routes possible. THe shortest route seems to take you over China which would not have happened in the 1960s
So, any aviation buffs.. What was it like to fly from Hawii to Kenya in the 1960s?? Would it be withing the means of a Kenyan Economist to make the flight for two people??
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 8:38 PM
Dude, are you dense? Asked AND answered EVERYTIME you’ve asked, on EVERY thread. AGAIN, for those who are slow…
Califemme on July 31, 2009 at 8:40 PM
Allah, someone on LGF did a little research into this poll, and it really appears bogus. If you want to see the post, I can link you up.
capitalist piglet on July 31, 2009 at 8:42 PM
Every birthplace of a president is marked with a commemorative plaque.
.
Tell me the exact spot where Obama’s birth plaque will be placed.
NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 8:49 PM
Yeah, those biplanes are a bitch flying over oceans. I had to take one about the same time in the early 60′s flying from Chicago to Vienna. It was pure hell. Too bad there weren’t any commercial planes then. ;)
Just kidding. I loved flying in the 60′s, and I did it all the time, mostly to Europe. Don’t know about Hawaii to Kenya, but let’s face it. It wasn’t the Dark Ages of aviation anywhere in the world.
Cody1991 on July 31, 2009 at 8:51 PM
And for those of you who think World Net Daily is some NUTTER website, There is this from Wiki:
They are one of the longest online NEWS websites (yes, its true) with a reporter in the white house press.
Suck on that.
Califemme on July 31, 2009 at 8:58 PM
allah or ed, please move this down into the main rotation so we can comment on it. Please.
peacenprosperity on July 31, 2009 at 9:02 PM
Another Random thought
Would there have been other reasons for Anne Dunham to try to establish citizenship for little barry barack hussein obama soweto?
For example, we regularly have sweeps in our area because people are sending their kids to school districts other than the district in which they live.
One of the arguments by the Bliefers is that “It is crazy to think that Anne dunham would have tried to secure citizenship for little barryo to make him elibible for the presidency”
I have to agree that there is some merit in that line of thinking.
However, that line of thinking ignores the possibility that there were other motives for her trying to establish citizenship
1. Less possibility of discrimination (which was rampant in the 60′s). Barry was raised as white. Had he been identified as Kenyan, that might have been a hinderance to him
2. Going to school. I’m guessing that barryo went to a public school. This was in the days before our idiocy of ‘let everyone in’. Now, if barryo was a Kenyan citizen, I’m not sure he would be able to waltz into the local public school. Stanley Anne Durham would not have known what path her life was going to take and may have decided to establish an american ID for barry.
3. The same thing might apply to any welfare or social benefits. I’m not so sure about that though because again, I don’t think welfare was as rampant and also, supposedly Stanley’s mother was fairly well off.
There are some other possibilities. Also, keep in mind that Stanley Anne Durham met Barack Senior while at a Russian Language class. There is no possibility at all that there would be any KGB agents interested in Americans learning Russian… nope, none at all.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:04 PM
Obama converted to Rev. Wright’s racist anti American church. From what? He is now a heretic to Islam… which means you know what to other faithful Muslims. I will prove it here:
His polygamist (bigamist) Dad was Muslim, (up to 4 wives are ok in Islam) his entire paternal side of the family IS Muslim. He lived in 97% Muslim Indonesia much of his childhood, he had a Muslim passport to be able to travel to Pakistan as a young adult, Rezko and others who helped him with money and his rise to power are Muslim. Faithful Muslims are required to bow to the King of Mecca which he did recently, and he Freudian slipped on “my Muslim faith” and “I campaigned in 57 (Islamic) states” among others.
Liberal friends, please think about this.
scotash on July 31, 2009 at 9:04 PM
Her kid’s Kenyan father (her husband) was living in Hawaii with her at the time. Did she take him along? Did he convince her that they had such awesome hospitals in the third world country that making the journey while pregnant and giving birth there would be much better than just staying in Hawaii? They had so much money to burn that a very expensive (in 1961) trip to Kenya seemed like a good idea?
Psychotropic meds. Cup of water. Birthers. Some assembly required.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 9:06 PM
You have evidence that his campaign pays law firms. Every campaign pays law firms. McCain’s campaign paid tons of cash to law firms too. Why do you believe the only thing they did with lawyers was fight frivolous lawsuits by a couple of low-quality lawyers looking for publicity? You’re just making it up and calling it a fact.
jonknee on July 31, 2009 at 9:07 PM
OMG! Obama is a Russian spy!!!!11!!! Teh Conspiracy deepens!!!!
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 9:08 PM
ZOMG
How deep does the rabbit hole go?
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:10 PM
You know who’s been a reporter in the White House press even longer?
Helen Thomas. Guess that makes her extra credible, right?
If you have to rely on WND to back up your argument, you seriously need to re-evaluate your position.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 9:11 PM
Well, I guess you are right. I knew dozens of people in my neighborhood who were studying Russian. It was the thing to do in the 1960s.. Fuggedabout Fwench, German or ITalian.. Russian was the rage.
My point is quite simply that it would be naive to think that the Russians weren’t aware of the classes and that they would have no interest or contact with anyone taking those classes.
Oh, maybe you are right. that thinking is as crazy as thinking that we would elect a president who spent a lot of time with a guy who planned to blow up soldiers at Fort Dix and whose wife cheered those who stuck a fork in a pregnant woman.. yep, you are right. that is crazy talk.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:13 PM
An interesting exercise for any Birther would be to cite a “source” or “evidence” that does not within two links in the text link back to World Nut Daily.
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:14 PM
???
First of all, that IS crazy talk.
Second, what does that have to do with invalidating the COLB?
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:16 PM
An interesting exercise for any Bliefer would be to cite
1. the vetting process for the eligibility of potus. Ie. the defining document and procedures
2. Provide an example of when and how that was followed.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:17 PM
Wow, you read the book. .. the book of how the Soviets used Psikhushka. Stalin and Lenin would be proud to know their technique is still around…
Oh wait, that is crazy talk. No government would be able to hide that kind of abuse from the world for 3 decades..
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:22 PM
I’m following up on the O/T post earlier regarding today’s FNC Glenn Beck show re: Gov’t Takeover of Your Computer. And it’s all completely legal. Clip now available- see for yourself.
.
If you go to the gov’t website to participate in the “Cash for Clunkers” program, BEWARE. This is the relevant portion of their Privacy Act & Security Statement:
.
Should be called “Cars for
ClunkersSuckers”NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 9:23 PM
What the hell is a Bliefer?
You mean we’ve gone 220+ years without one?
Why is it SO IMPORTANT of BHO?
Educate everyone. Show your work.
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:24 PM
* should be “Cash” not “Cars”
NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 9:24 PM
Oops, don’t go getting your “YES WE CAN” panties into a knot. .
FACT – William Ayers was one of the heads of the Weather Underground – A terrorist organization
FACT – Ayer’s wife – hagface Dohrn is on record in cheering the Tate Murders as “Cool, they killed her and stuck a fork in her”
FACT – Obama served on several boards with Ayers
SPECULATION – There is evidence that Ayers might have ghost written parts of Ozeros Dreams of my Commie Daddy… unless obama spent time on the sea that we don’t know about.
So, where is the crazy talk there?? Obama had a relationship with a known terrorist. It’s crazy to think that the dork is an ‘esteemed professor’ isn’t it?
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:27 PM
Let’s face it, the typical Obama supporter will like this because it demonizes people who have a product for sale but are not willing to devote their heart and soul to Obama.
Only companies who will open their hearts and hard-drives to The One will receive salvation.
Buddahpundit on July 31, 2009 at 9:27 PM
As others have pointed out Anne Dunham was very young when she gave birth. It’s plausible and understandable that her parents may have done everything possible to help her and the baby. That seems reasonable.
It also seems reasonable to me that we should know the details of our president’s life. IIRC, McCain not only released all medical information but a psychiatric evaluation as well during the campaign.
Obama is our employee. We are not his servants. We are entitled to far more than he has given.
For those who think this is trivial think of it this way. If you were responsible for hiring someone to head up a multinational company responsible for the employment of several thousand people with government contracts that involved national security, what would be your standards for evaluating that person’s employment?
Would you simply interview him/her on the recommendation of a head hunter and agree to employment on the spot? Or would you interview and do your own due diligence to make sure that there will be no misunderstandings and possible embarrassments to your shareholders and the government?
When we elect a president we’re hiring a CEO. Some of us want to be damned sure we know what we’re getting. We weren’t convinced during the election, and we’re more convinced now that we were purposely mislead.
Some of you may find that “crazy.” I call it responsible.
Cody1991 on July 31, 2009 at 9:28 PM
It is important because of (1) the unanswered questions as to his legitimacy and (2) the fact that he seems bent on Cloward Plivening our country.
This is the first guy, except for Mccain, who has a questionable eligibility.. Actually, there is evidence that there was a president int eh 1800′s who might not have been legit.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:30 PM
ook, wrong thread post that one.
Buddahpundit on July 31, 2009 at 9:31 PM
.
Bliefer = Meme for “Blind Believer”, It is my answer to being labeled a “birther” because Obama told us he was a dual citizen.
NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 9:33 PM
Answer.
Deal. That goes for the rest of you.
And no, I did not vote for President Teleprompter.
Unrelated to eligibility.
How did the nation survive?
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:34 PM
You mean…like a Christian?
I keed, I keed.
Good luck spreading that one around.
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:35 PM
Good Lt, thuja, jonkee or whatever:
Every birthplace of a president is marked with a commemorative plaque. If it’s so clear to you, just tell us the exact spot where Obama’s birth plaque will be placed.
.
New meme: Where’s the plaque go?
NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 9:37 PM
Honolulu.
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:38 PM
.
Don’t need luck, I’ve seen on other sites already. Even in the comment section of WSJ. Blind Believer IN OBAMA.
You can call him christ if you want, while we still have freedom of religion, that is.
NightmareOnKStreet on July 31, 2009 at 9:41 PM
I love how Birthers think you somehow support Obama if you don’t follow them down Birther Lane.
I don’t “believe in Obama.” I also don’t waste mine and everyone else’s time with childish conspiracy fantasies.
Oh, you poor, oppressed soul.
This time next year, you’ll be in jail for going to church for sure.
Lose the drama queen act, please.
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 PM
Just modified it for you a bit.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:47 PM
Doing a great job.
Birthers:
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=%22Birthers%22&aq=f&oq=&aqi=g-s5&fp=-Pw1cEIpNGU
Bliefers:
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=%22Bliefers%22&aq=f&oq=&aqi=&fp=-Pw1cEIpNGU
Keep up the good work.
Good Lt on July 31, 2009 at 9:47 PM
So I think BO was born in the US… but think pressure needs to be kept on him to release his Birth Certificate because either (1) he has something he is hiding, or (2) the most transparent administration ever who is tired of “politics as usual” is withholding documents to gin up a “conspiracy” for distractions and political gain.
What do I call myself?
well I guess the reason could be (3) he is an arrogant SOB who can’t believe the plebs would dare demand a BC from him so he will never simply produce the document.
Ampersand on July 31, 2009 at 9:51 PM
Unfortunately, the majority of American voters looked at his thin resume and decided to hire him anyways, even if it wasn’t as comprehensive as we’d have liked.
Deal with it. He’s neither likely or obligated to hand over every scrap of paper documenting his past that his political opponents demand. Even if he did, it would just provide another opportunity to the Birthers to scream “fake”.
Obama is becoming vulnerable, but not because he’s been less than open and honest about his past. He’s becoming vulnerable because he’s doing a lousy job as President. Hit him where it hurts, not where it opens you up to an even harder counter-punch.
Hollowpoint on July 31, 2009 at 9:51 PM
Ah, the old didactic argumnet again.. I sez so.
The reason for the requirement is simply to reduce the possibility of someone with loyalties other than to the US taking control. The Founding Fathers correctly assumed that such a person may want to weaken or destroy the country as it was.
We don’t really know where obama’s allegiance lies. I do know some things that I don’t like
- his associations – ayers, dorhn, rezko, wright
- He claimed he sought out marxist professors
- He grabs his package instead of saluting for the anthem
- His father was a marxist, his mentor was a marxist pedophile, some of his tsar pics are marxist
We have someone who, among other things, is poised to destroy the greates health care system in the world.. I want to make sure the dirtball is legit.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:54 PM
Consider for a moment the possibility that Obama is illigitimate and he knows it. IF that statement is true then it would be reasonable to assume that he would p*ss on other aspects of the constitution and how the presidency is spelled out. IE. he is already been looking into the possibility of removing the two term limitation (ever wonder why he was so upset when the honduran wanna be dictator was outse in an entirely legal proceeding??)
Also consider the guy’s level of morality. He is a guy who argued that it was OK to allow babies to die of starvation, dehydration and exposure. I know bikers who are repulsed by that and I’m talking the chains and colors bikers.
IF he is in power illegitimately, then he simply does not care about the constitution. In fact he has as much as said so.
bullseye on July 31, 2009 at 9:58 PM
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