AIP Column: Faith-based economics

posted at 8:47 am on July 31, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

Recalling Barack Obama’s promise to restore science to its rightful place in policymaking during the campaign, I wondered earlier this week whether Obama knew that mathematics is a science.  After all, the CBO continues to rip Democratic claims of big savings through ObamaCare by doing the actual math that Democrats and the White House won’t do.  Congressional Democrats threw in the towel this week by changing the argument to claim that ObamaCare is so super-duper, new-and-improved, better-than-Brand-X cool that it will produce savings that no economist can predict ahead of time.  I dedicated my weekly AIP column to the new faith-based economics:

The Beltway newspaper The Hill reported that Democrats now want voters to disregard the financial analysis from the Congressional office they control … In other words, don’t pay attention to the actual numbers provided by people who use math to calculate costs. Instead, have faith in the remarkable cure-all powers of Dr. Obama’s Health-Care Reform Elixir! It has so many benefits and cost savings that even the nation’s leading analysts cannot detect with the naked eye!

This doesn’t just represent a new spin for a failing policy. It undermines the entire argument for health-care reform, at least as presented by Obama and his allies. They justified the nationalization of the health-care industry on the premise that uncontrolled costs would bankrupt the nation as well as an increasing number of individual Americans. The Obama administration and Democratic leadership in Congress argued, both implicitly and explicitly, that their reform would install rational cost controls while giving greater access to all Americans. In fact, that is the only possible rationale a politician could have for the government to restructure a private industry.

This new approach completely undermines the argument for a systemic overhaul of the industry. Thanks to the CBO, we know all of the costs – and it’s important to remember that while the official deficit hit in Decade One is $239 billion, we only get within that close to break-even thanks to almost $600 billion in new taxes over the same period. Now, however, we have no idea what cost savings we will see, let alone whether we will have overall better access to medical care, or even the same level of access as most Americans do now. Gallup polls show 83% of Americans satisfied with their current coverage, so this question is of vital importance in any overhaul, both practically and politically.

Do Americans want to buy another round of Dr. Obama’s Magical Medical Elixir?  I think voters had enough the first time, when we drank Dr. Obama’s Magical Economic Expander, which was guaranteed to add a “jolt” to your economy, or … well, unfortunately, we don’t get our money back.  Ever.

Read the whole column, and while you’re there, don’t miss AIP’s excellent bloggers.


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Ah yes, faith based economics . . . a concept and process Jim Jones would have fully endorsed.

rplat on July 31, 2009 at 8:53 AM

Faithonomics – Bow your head, gov’t picks your pocket.

TinMan13 on July 31, 2009 at 8:55 AM

Dr. Obama’s Magical Medical Elixir.
koolaid.

SHARPTOOTH on July 31, 2009 at 8:57 AM

“It is easier to appear worthy of a position one does not hold, than of the office which one fills,” -Francois de La Rochefoucauld.

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 8:57 AM

If there was ever a moment where the term “voodoo economics” made sense, this would be it. No reporter on the planet dare say it today.

RobertE on July 31, 2009 at 9:01 AM

Healthcare for clunkers… no thanks, I’ll pass

gatorboy on July 31, 2009 at 9:03 AM

And the Obamessiah laid his hands on the economy and said “Be healed!”

backwoods conservative on July 31, 2009 at 9:04 AM

totally O/T but interesting: 5thCD Va. Dem Cong Perriello says that many letters he got against the Cap ‘n Trade bill (which he voted in favor of) were forgeries.

new excuse, huh? well, he better have his game on for his townhall meetings with us rednecks in the boondocks.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:05 AM

And doesn’t the CBO have a record of under estimating the actual costs? On many historical programs CBO’s original predictions have been wildly inaccurate. I am sure there are a lot of variables that they couldn’t enter into the original equation but I think most have vastly exceeded expectations.

Cindy Munford on July 31, 2009 at 9:06 AM

letters he got against the Cap ‘n Trade bill (which he voted in favor of) were forgeries.

A dem knowing what a forgery looks like? Pretty good odds.

A dem using ‘forgery’ as an excuse to hide from his district? Priceless

gatorboy on July 31, 2009 at 9:06 AM

The mythology of “The Expert” has always been part of the Enlightenment song and dance.

The idea is to insinuate mystery and numinous overtones into the persona of The Expert so as to make him unapproachable and immune from questions. His job is to dispense Settled Science.

And the People, being rubes, are afraid to question the Expert because the Expert shouts them down and ridicules them for not being Experts themselves.

Modern-day libs have succeeded in exploiting this age-old tactic. Ivy league universities have gone along with the scheme and have profited from it.

What do you say we push these experts a little harder? See what they’re made of. See if we can make them crack under pressure and sob like little girls? I say they’re as phony as the Wizard of Oz.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:07 AM

totally O/T but interesting: 5thCD Va. Dem Cong Perriello says that many letters he got against the Cap ‘n Trade bill (which he voted in favor of) were forgeries.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:05 AM

What about the phone calls and protests? Where those figments of their imagination? I guess when they get booted out of office next year, they’ll allege voter fraud.

Doughboy on July 31, 2009 at 9:09 AM

Do Americans want to buy another round of Dr. Obama’s Magical Medical Elixir? I think voters had enough the first time, when we drank Dr. Obama’s Magical Economic Expander, which was guaranteed to add a “jolt” to your economy, or … well, unfortunately, we don’t get our money back. Ever.

I think it is going to be a very tough August vacation for Congress. I certainly intend to do my part.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:09 AM

Do Americans want to buy another round of Dr. Obama’s Magical Medical Elixir? I think voters had enough the first time, when we drank Dr. Obama’s Magical Economic Expander, which was guaranteed to add a “jolt” to your economy, or … well, unfortunately, we don’t get our money back. Ever.

I think it is going to be a very tough August vacation for Congress. I certainly intend to do my part.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:09 AM

Healthcare for clunkers… no thanks, I’ll pass

gatorboy on July 31, 2009 at 9:03 AM

Being a visual person myself, I wish there was an artistic way to connect the failure of the user-car-clunker program with health care.

You would think the images and the YouTube material would write themselves, but I just can’t think of anything. I got nothing. Clunker car. Health care takeover. I just can’t get an image in my mind to link them.

Maybe the GOP has some ad wizards who could hit this softball out of the park?

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:09 AM

AIP Jimmie Bise

What if ObamaCare is like Cash for Clunkers?

The money was supposed to last until October.

It lasted four days.

Washington has shut down the Cash for Clunkers program because it’s out of money.

Excellent note.

/Anticipate every job being appropriated into a government job. Salaries? LOL. We’ll be given Gumbobama made of our flesh.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:10 AM

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain….

Wethal on July 31, 2009 at 9:12 AM

they’re as phony as the Wizard of Oz.
jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:07 AM

Yes. But these wizards are backed by blackshirts with assault weapons drawn.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:12 AM

If there was ever a moment where the term “voodoo economics” made sense, this would be it. No reporter on the planet dare say it today.

RobertE on July 31, 2009 at 9:01 AM

This is the perfect time to bring the word “mountebank” to the forefront of the average American’s vocabulary. Besides loving the word, it describes Obama to a T!

Mountebank noun; a person who sells quack medicines, as from a platform in public places, attracting and influencing an audience by tricks, storytelling, etc.

Youngs98 on July 31, 2009 at 9:14 AM

totally O/T but interesting: 5thCD Va. Dem Cong Perriello says that many letters he got against the Cap ‘n Trade bill (which he voted in favor of) were forgeries.

How exactly can a letter to a Congressman be a forgery? Does he mean that they were not written by legitimate members of his district? That isn’t forgery, that’s spam mail. And what does it matter, it’s not like those letters really do anything anyway. Some twenty-something staffer just put’s a check in the “for” or “against” box and sends out a generic thank-you letter.

What I really think is going on is that Dems are looking for cover. Since they voted for the energy bill, they will be called on the carpet for the fact that they now support trillions of more at a time the public is saying that the piggy bank is closed.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:14 AM

Mountebank noun; a person who sells quack medicines, as from a platform in public places, attracting and influencing an audience by tricks, storytelling, etc.

Youngs98 on July 31, 2009 at 9:14 AM

Barker H. Obama

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:15 AM

Just words; Just speeches… America, I will change politics as usual in D.C… I will not allow lobbyist into my administration. I will bring members from both sides of the isle together to join me in change American’s can believe in. I will have the most ethical, the most transparent administration ever.

Jeez, what a bullshit artist!

Keemo on July 31, 2009 at 9:16 AM

I got nothing. Clunker car. Health care takeover. I just can’t get an image in my mind to link them.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:09 AM

Not even turning in Grandma to the government healthcare system’s “end of life counselor” when she gets past her prime?

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:17 AM

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:14 AM
Some twenty-something staffer just put’s a check in the “for” or “against” box and sends out a generic thank-you letter.

At least my Rep, Frank Wolfe (R), VA, hand signed the 3 page letter I received after sending him my $.o2 on the “Energy Bill.”

Youngs98 on July 31, 2009 at 9:17 AM

Hurrah, hurrah, hurrah!
Step right up, folks.
Witness the most miraculous … evah!
Just For You
…those best of intentions

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:18 AM

Neil Diamond wrote the song already.

It’s Hope! Brother Hope!
Say Brother Hope’s travelling salvation show (halle-halle)

reaganaut on July 31, 2009 at 9:19 AM

Yes. But these wizards are backed by blackshirts with assault weapons drawn.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:12 AM

The secret service pulled guns and assault rifles on Tea Party protesters in Virginia?

Hey libs, you know all the crazy stuff you guys used to claim President Bush was doing to eliminate dissent? Okay, same thing with Obama, except he’s actually doing it.

Eeep.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:21 AM

Obama, Reid and Pelosi are driving our economy into the ground by passing legislation designed to cripple the private sector. Every economic indicator we see points to their abject failure to maintain our standard of living: millions of unemployed Americans, a stagnant GDP, greatly reduced tax revenue, loss of consumer and business confidence, the list grows daily.

America wonders why the Democrats aren’t serious about true stimulus. Why haven’t tax cuts been passed? Why haven’t unecessary regulations been rolled back? Why is there no tort reform, especially in the health care industry?

What we see is a party in power bereft of any concern for the welfare of the populace, creating villians from honest businessmen and demonstrating their hatred of average Americans.

BackwardsBoy on July 31, 2009 at 9:21 AM

I keep thinking, how fast will we become a 3rd world nation?

RED DAWN this MF’er

igglesphan on July 31, 2009 at 9:22 AM

Keemo on July 31, 2009 at 9:16 AM

industrial global scale bullshit

/and the greenies have it out for livestock?!

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:22 AM

I keep thinking, how fast will we become a 3rd world nation?
igglesphan on July 31, 2009 at 9:22 AM

They are already bulldozing Michigan.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:23 AM

At least my Rep, Frank Wolfe (R), VA, hand signed the 3 page letter I received after sending him my $.o2 on the “Energy Bill.”

Youngs98 on July 31, 2009 at 9:17 AM

I have nothing but respect for Frank Wolf. I helped in his first campaign to Congress back before the 10th district got Gerrymandered so that Wolf deals with Winchester and most of Fairfax County gets one of two nasty rabid socialists.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:24 AM

BackwardsBoy

Obama, Reid and Pelosi are driving our economy into the ground by passing legislation designed to cripple the private sector.

Cripple? Annihilate.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:24 AM

They are already bulldozing Michigan.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:23 AM

Yep. Most of Michigan is shovel-ready.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:27 AM

about the “guns drawn” photos from teaparty in bristol, va. i want to say that obambi overstepped, but it is what the secret service is supposed to do. go to gateway pundit for the long explanation.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:28 AM

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:21 AM

Before Obama was elected, the story would have been simply unbelievable because the occurance would never have happened.

Not now. The ugly reality has begun.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:28 AM

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:18 AM

Ahhh! Rush of nostalgia! I read those books to my kids.

Cindy Munford on July 31, 2009 at 9:29 AM

And doesn’t the CBO have a record of under estimating the actual costs? On many historical programs CBO’s original predictions have been wildly inaccurate. I am sure there are a lot of variables that they couldn’t enter into the original equation but I think most have vastly exceeded expectations.

Cindy Munford on July 31, 2009 at 9:06 AM

I can’t put my finger on the statistics at the moment, but believe you are correct. So, Barry and his supporters want us to ignore even the rosey scenario for how disasterous Obamacare will be.

Loxodonta on July 31, 2009 at 9:30 AM

If there is any “faith” involved in our radical atheist President’s healthcare projections, it is bad faith. He’s a lying bucket of scum.

Jaibones on July 31, 2009 at 9:31 AM

7 in 10 Americans still want healthcare reform. What’s also interesting is that if 80% say they are happy with their insurance, 30% of Americans are already participating in some form of government plan.

Hmmmm*…. I take it that means the government gets a good grade, then, on satisfying patients.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:31 AM

Who will emerge as Ochimpy’s shill for this scam?

Peggy Joesph?

csdeven on July 31, 2009 at 9:32 AM

I have nothing but respect for Frank Wolf.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:24 AM

Oops, I thought his last name had an E. Sorry Congressman Wolf!

Youngs98 on July 31, 2009 at 9:34 AM

Ah yes, faith based economics . .

Actually, I have “faith” in the American public that will give every one of these congress-critters and Senators an earful when they take their August recess. The 83% of Americans satisfied with their current health care plans are far from “comfortable” with the language coming out of both bills in the House and the Senate.

Again from Suzanne Fields W.Times commentary:

The Clinton administration knew Hillary Care would be a tough sell, so they kept it secret while they worked on it. That scheme crashed, anyway, when we discovered that it would make health care worse, not better, but more elusive. The Obama administration has gone to the other extreme, turning it over to Congress where everybody wants to get an oar in, and we’re frightened on a daily basis. Meanwhile, the president keeps repeating his defensive rhetoric, defying the drip, drip, drip of hard, cold facts. His health care scheme promises change, but it’s hard to see how both quantity and quality of care will not be compromised. Can the president deliver both? He no longer sounds like a man who thinks he can. (emphasis mine)

That “drip, drip, drip” you’re hearing is sound of dam leaking—and about to burst open with total economic revolt against these morons in D.C. that are still refusing to admit the cost far outweighs the benefits. When your “representatives” return home next week, show up to the town hall meetings with a bucket full of holes. Maybe they’ll get the message.

Rovin on July 31, 2009 at 9:34 AM

7 in 10 Americans still want healthcare reform.

Hmmmm*…. I take it that means the government gets a good grade, then, on satisfying patients.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:31 AM

I’m one of those 7 in 10.

I want tort reform, specifically caps on punitive damage awards. But President Obama has said he will never, ever sign such a bill.

So basically, President Obama is trying to govern against the will of the People, which is why he will be removed from office after one failed term.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:34 AM

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:12 AM

That is pretty scary.

becki51758 on July 31, 2009 at 9:35 AM

I want tort reform, specifically caps on punitive damage awards. But President Obama has said he will never, ever sign such a bill.

Tort reform is a separate issue and wouldn’t be counted in this poll, because it would apply to other areas, too.

Unless you’re in favor of singling out doctors to be exempt from the same laws that apply to the rest of us.

I presume that’s not what you mean.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:38 AM

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:28 AM

NO Destiny. It’s not normal for the secret service to pull their assault guns on conservative protesters as they drive through town.

You cite the heightened threat during the transition between presidents in conference as if it were applicable to Obama’s entry to a townhall. If Bristol VA created a heightened security threat to the POTUS, Obama didn’t belong there at that moment, imho.

just as the Bush White House warned the U.S. <a href=”http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2008/11/06/2008-11-06_obama_gets_his_first_threat_briefing_as_.html#ixzz0MqN384NQ

“>faces a “heightened period” of danger during the transition.

The outgoing President’s spokeswoman, Dana Perino, said there are no specific plots, but officials remain “very concerned.”

“We do know that this is just a heightened period of concern,” she said.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:40 AM

Tort reform is a separate issue and wouldn’t be counted in this poll, because it would apply to other areas, too.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:38 AM

yeah, that’s it, when someone says they want healthcare reform, they can’t mean tort reform.

Sure, let’s go with that. Cuz face it, you got nothing else.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:43 AM

LOL* Nobody I know would call tort reform healthcare reform. But if you honestly do, then OK.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:45 AM

Jaibones on July 31, 2009 at 9:31 AM

Thanks. You hit on my problem with Ed’s crative phrase “faith based economics”. It is an insult to folks’ good faith. The questionable (in my book, given my preference for limited gov’t) “faith based initiatives” of the Bush Administration were centered on assisting good works by organizations of people of faith. The Obama Administration’s “economics” are distortions (if not outright lies) that in no way reflect good faith.

clorensen on July 31, 2009 at 9:45 AM

7 in 10 Americans still want healthcare reform. What’s also interesting is that if 80% say they are happy with their insurance, 30% of Americans are already participating in some form of government plan.

It’s moronic leaps like this which makes the whole issue, already complex, worse.

Of course it isn’t true that satisfied= government plan participant. It’s even more absurd to use words like “reform” to measure satisfaction. It is too vague. Everyone wants clean air and good government too but until you get down to the specifics such polling is meaningless.]

The filthy liar in the White House and the morons in support of single-payer systems intentionally use these tactics to defraud the American public into accepting something that will further bankrupt the nation for no reason but partisan politics. For that they are harming America and should be denounced as the traitors they are.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM

In the meantime, 70% still want healthcare reform. No shift on that one.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM

Cuz face it, you got nothing else.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 9:43 AM

But it’s a consistent nothing. At least you have to concede that.

Loxodonta on July 31, 2009 at 9:47 AM

The statement that 83% of people like their insurance as it is has been quoted. I merely was pointing out a reality: 30% of Americans already use a government plan.

That would indicate that they aren’t too unhappy with it, unless you think all 30% are the “unhappy” ones. :)

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:48 AM

Congressional Democrats threw in the towel this week by changing the argument to claim that ObamaCare is so super-duper, new-and-improved, better-than-Brand-X cool that it will produce savings that no economist can predict ahead of time.

It bewilders me that people will buy into some BS like this after all the double talk, lies from this administration. GWB wouldn’t have been allowed to get away with stuff like this and neither should Zero.

Herb on July 31, 2009 at 9:48 AM

LOL* Nobody I know would call tort reform healthcare reform. But if you honestly do, then OK.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:45 AM

That’s because you are myopic and deliberately ignore the fact that a holistic approach is required for real reform. Frivilous lawsuits are a factor in healthcare cost so tort reform is a part of healthcare reform.

Whether through ignorance or intent, your comments are virtually worthless since you don’t want to deal with the parts of the current system that don’t fit into your agenda.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:49 AM

maverick muse: about the guns drawn from Secret Svc: i was just passing on Gateway Pundit article. really, i wouldn’t think Bristol VA is that scary.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:53 AM

Tort reform is a separate issue

The 1000+page democrat bill HR 3200 did NOT address Tort at all.

Last night’s C-SPAN Republican Health Care presentation elucidated the issue from both sides of the aisle without rancor, without snide characterizations. The Republican presentation was a good teaching moment and learning experience for everyone, absolutely clear analysis of the situation in America and which party’s bills address which portion, and the effects that will result of each bill.

When the subsequent hour began LATE following dead air with the Democrats unprepared on show, those first two Democrats given the floor failed to state exactly what they were discussing, only stating that they were representing the Dept. of Energy (that could mean ANYTHING) and that the Republicans were do-nothing wrong, foolish ostriches with their heads stuck in the sand.

It was obvious which party has America’s best interests at heart in the efforts to improve health insurance and medical costs and allow the finest independent medical practice/treatment.

KUDOS, GOP!

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:53 AM

The news gets even better for those seeking something to blame on Bush!

corona on July 31, 2009 at 9:53 AM

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:53 AM

Anyone with eyes to see recognizes who presented the threat of violence.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 9:54 AM

anninca: 100% want a fairy tale healthcare. i would love to have top-tier teaching hosp. in my locality. and i would love to have family members that were big time docs who could shepherd me thru the system without all the waiting around BS. and finally, i would love to not have the weird issues i have.

but we can’t have that. so i’m satisfied with what i do have.

that’s what the avg person is telling you.

those that are dissatisfied, want to live in the ER of Cornell for free. aint gonna happen.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:56 AM

Dr. Obama’s Magical Medical Elixir followed by Professor Burp-n-Slurp Biden’s 2-ply…

Drink! Wipe!

Mr_Magoo on July 31, 2009 at 9:56 AM

agree maverick.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 9:57 AM

It bewilders me that people will buy into some BS like this after all the double talk, lies from this administration. GWB wouldn’t have been allowed to get away with stuff like this and neither should Zero.

Herb on July 31, 2009 at 9:48 AM

I will be the first to tell you that no economic forecast is worth the ink it costs to produce it. Economics is the best con game in the history of mankind. You throw out a forecast supposedly based on a model and then all you have to do is come up with excuses in case the reality doesn’t match the model (if it does match, you bill yourself as an economic superstar).

That being said, and I probably shouldn’t be giving this advice to the Democrats, but the only way to save Obamacare is if they get off the traditional BS approach where they trot out uninsured cancer patients and talk about healthcare as an inalienable right. The filthy liar in the White House and his henchmen in Congress need to make the fiscal case instead of simply telling us to ignore any projections and focus on ambiguous claims about “savings from eliminating inefficiencies.” Such statements are not quantifiable and are really code word for kill off private insurance.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:57 AM

Tort reform for ONLY the healthcare industry is what I’m hearing some of you want.

I could easily predict how angry that would make the public.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:57 AM

Being a Marxist is a matter of faith, or perhaps hate…an emotional mindset that certain dogma will succeed, though it never has, to produce the great outcome promised.

This is one reason Marxists usually have to take a violent or at least coercive line against non-believers, they have nothing else to use to win the debate, and when the promises are not met, they have to keep control of the system they install rather than change and cede control. Chavez’ progressive (pun intended) path in Venezuela is a classic.

“Ignore the CBO” is another call to buy the dream and forget about logic or reality. Reduced to little bites of words, like “single payer now”, the ignorant and emotional find comfort and acceptance of peers in the “movement”.

It reminds me of the passionate anti-Vietnam war student whose big deal was the possibility that elephants might come across the border from Uganda into Nam into free-fire zones and get blown away. Other issues related to the conflict were lost on her. Quite a confused person, but very passionate about ending the war and giving peace a chance.

Nothing is scarier than ignorance in action. Somebody else said that, and they are right.

Harry Schell on July 31, 2009 at 9:59 AM

My point is that you’re pushing an unpopular agenda. 70% of Americans want healthcare reform. They disagree about how fast it should happen. That means, the GOP is pushing an unpopular idea with the public.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:59 AM

The news gets even better for those seeking something to blame on Bush!
corona on July 31, 2009 at 9:53 AM

Newman: When you control the mail, you control information!

Mr_Magoo on July 31, 2009 at 9:59 AM

Tort reform for ONLY the healthcare industry is what I’m hearing some of you want.

I could easily predict how angry that would make the public.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:57 AM

You’ve got a tin ear if that’s all you are hearing. Fact of the matter, tort reform is a dead issue because of Democrats.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 9:59 AM

In the meantime, 70% still want healthcare reform. No shift on that one.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM

Do you have a current link?

Thanks!

ladyingray on July 31, 2009 at 10:01 AM

30% of Americans already use a government plan.
That would indicate that they aren’t too unhappy with it, unless you think all 30% are the “unhappy” ones. :)
AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:48 AM

The only Americans already on a government plan are the military and seniors on medicaid/medicare. Even government employees are often on private HMO plans, not a “government plan”. It isn’t as if the military enrollment have a choice, whether happy or not. The same with the elderly, who ARE unhappy since the government fails to pay doctors enough to treat them without the doctor going bankrupt.

Those happiest with “government plans” are the crooks who are stealing tax funds from Medicaid/Medicare because the government made it so easy to make a BUSINESS OF FRAUD!

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:01 AM

anninca: i think Americans as a whole, don’t like what they view as lawyers sucking off the poor, infirmed, blah, blah.

i think people are often put off by people making money in “scammy” ways. but to a tort lawyer, he’s not scamming. its all in the perspective.

kelley in virginia on July 31, 2009 at 10:01 AM

Gallup poll link, lady-in-gray.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:03 AM

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:31 AM

Stuk on stoopid.

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:04 AM

Coming soon to capital hill!
Czarina Michelle O. as director of the Dr. Obama’s Office of Medical Magic Elixir….aka..DOOMME

jbinnout on July 31, 2009 at 10:04 AM

Mr_Magoo on July 31, 2009 at 9:59 AM

And last week provided another example of how far the Socialists control the message content and flow of mail from legislators to their constituents.

FRANKING COMMISSION GONE TOO FAR

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:04 AM

I’m not sure about tort reform in healthcare. I’ve read some reports that hospital mistakes are worse in the US than in most. Seems like they need to lose a few whoppers to maintain standards.

Did you see the Dr. Oz show where he advised everyone to use a magic marker to write down which side you’re being operated on because so many instances occur where the wrong organ/whatever is taken?

That was telling.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:06 AM

HR 3200 ObamaCare will fine doctors $2000./day each time the doctor refuses to comply with the plan directives to deny treatment.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:06 AM

I especially like all the provisions in HR 3200 for home visitations by govt workers to conduct prying interviews. That’s a nice touch. That’s just the kind of reform we need.

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:10 AM

AnninCA
You claim to be a nurse with your own non-profit business employing a total of 3 people.

Exactly what is your business and your job description?

Given Obama’s Way, every business will be non-profit competing for the limited government grants. There will be no such thing as the private sector, a thing of the past.

You feel confident you’ll survive the throng of EVERYONE pressing for the limited/nonexistent funds from a bankrupt government?

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:11 AM

Tort reform is the root cause of health care costs.

Obscurantists like Anna will pimp the party line out of loyalty. But real Americans detect a problem. If the People want health care reform, why is Congress unable to pass it?

Answer: the people want to fix the root cause of health care costs. And the root cause is the Democrat Party’s addiction to big Trial Lawyer Money.

This fact, this inner contradiction of liberalism, is destroying the Obama legacy.

And let me be clear: I’m enjoying every minute of it.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 10:12 AM

Reminds me a little of Harold Hill:

…and we’ve got trouble, right here in DC,
and that starts with “T” and that rhymes with “P” and that stands for Polls…

DrAllecon on July 31, 2009 at 10:13 AM

Did you see the Dr. Oz
AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:06 AM

That was telling

…and I’d be willing to bet that a lot of your beliefs come from Oprah also.

thomasaur on July 31, 2009 at 10:14 AM

In the meantime, 70% still want healthcare reform. No shift on that one.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM

70% of the American public would love to take a ride on the space shuttle Ann. While I’m not willing to give up “my seat”, I’d suggest you take a ride on the next Haley’s Comet that passes by. What you continually fail to comprehend is that the “healthcare reform” being written in Congress is NOT being accepted by the general population—who do understand that the public option and single payer plans are just a ruse for a government take-over of YOUR health care. The intrusion into this field by government arbitrators who will decide the fate of YOUR health is NOT what these 70% want and neither is it REFORM. Echoing the rhetorical bovine feces Obama and your liberal cohorts are spewing isn’t going to cut it this time sweetie.

Rovin on July 31, 2009 at 10:14 AM

Amendments to ensure that no taxpayer money is used for abortions have been presented in various House and Senate committees but all have failed so far. Several congressmen held a press conference on Wednesday, July 22, to discuss this issue. Representative Joe Pitts (R-PA)stated: “Without an explicit exclusion, abortion will [eventually] be determine to be included in [the] benefits standards.”

Nineteen House Dems wrote to Speaker of the House Nancy Eyebrows stating: “We cannot support any health care reform proposal unless it explicitly excludes abortion from the scope of any government defined subsidized health insurance plan.”

So since child sacrifice is the sine qua non of liberalism, the progressives’ sarament, OboobaCare will certainly fund it, and the few moderate Dems who are prolife will fight it.

Dear Lord please confound your enemies!

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:15 AM

GOP issue #1. Tort Reform to reel in health care costs.

Progress.

Real reform.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 10:16 AM

In the meantime, 70% still want healthcare reform visits by govt workers to interview their children and elderly parents about sex and euthanasia. No shift constitutional authority on that one. AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM

FIFY.

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:17 AM

I especially like all the provisions in HR 3200 for home visitations by govt workers to conduct prying interviews. That’s a nice touch. That’s just the kind of reform we need.

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:10 AM

Ultimately, health workers would be armed, and that includes those enforcing the vaccinations for our own good.

The new census is marking each domicile point of entry. Obama’s presidency is moving towards unmanned enforcement.

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:17 AM

AnninCA
You claim to be a nurse with your own non-profit business employing a total of 3 people.

You got part of it right. No, I’m on the board of a non-profit organization that has a staff of 2.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:17 AM

In the meantime, 70% still want healthcare reform. No shift on that one.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM

Congress is unable to pass the bill even though they possess a filibuster-proof, veto-proof majority.

This is odd, if the American people want health care reform by an overwhelming majority.

How do you explain this glaring contradiction?

Careful, if you answer like a kook, you’ll lose what remains of your credibility.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 10:19 AM

The new census is marking each domicile point of entry. Obama’s presidency is moving towards unmanned enforcement. maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:17 AM

Census takers (ACORN drones) will be marking homes with GPS coordinates.

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:19 AM

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:17 AM

She can’t answer what she would know from her own experience.

AnninCA
You claim to be a nurse with your own non-profit business employing a total of 3 people.

Exactly what is your business and your job description?

Given Obama’s Way, every business will be non-profit competing for the limited government grants. There will be no such thing as the private sector, a thing of the past.

You feel confident you’ll survive the throng of EVERYONE pressing for the limited/nonexistent funds from a bankrupt government?

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:11 AM

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:20 AM

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:19 AM
will be/ are

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:21 AM

…and I’d be willing to bet that a lot of your beliefs come from Oprah also.

That was the only time I watched his show. No, not an Oprah fan here. But I definitely saw the problems in hospital care when my mom was in there, so I didn’t have any problem believing his statistics. We really don’t have a good track record on hospital safety. Way too many errors occur.

My real point is that when a TV show doc comes out and tells you to take steps to prevent wrong operations?

Whoa, I really don’t want tort reform quite yet! LOL* Maybe you are at ease with the idea of the wrong kidney being taken, but I’m sure not.

(Did you hear the one about the dentist who dropped not 1 but 2 instruments down a patient’s mouth on 2 occasions? Poor fellow died.)

Anyway, you’re free to trust away. Me? I’m taking a magic marker with me.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:21 AM

You got part of it right. No, I’m on the board of a non-profit organization that has a staff of 2.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:17 AM

You claimed to be a nurse. Back-pedalling?

Finish your explication.

You claim to be a nurse with your own non-profit business employing a total of 3 people.

Exactly what is your business and your job description?

Given Obama’s Way, every business will be non-profit competing for the limited government grants. There will be no such thing as the private sector, a thing of the past.

You feel confident you’ll survive the throng of EVERYONE pressing for the limited/nonexistent funds from a bankrupt government?

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:11 AM

maverick muse on July 31, 2009 at 10:23 AM

Akzed on July 31, 2009 at 10:15 AM

This is why Obamacare as written is harmful. Proponents would essentially put the feds into the baby killing business. Who is to say that pro-choice wouldn’t evolve into the government medical agent deciding on procedures to abort those expensive cases where the child would require life-long care? Where is the respect for those of us who think that abortion is heinous? Government should not be in the business of playing God.

highhopes on July 31, 2009 at 10:23 AM

What in the world prevents the Democrat Congress from passing Obama’s health care plan with a filibuster-proof, veto-proof majority?

This is a very, very difficult question for left wing ideologues.

This question torments because it challenges the validity of their core argument, the specious claim that the majority of people want Obama’s health care plan.

Fact: the majority of Americans REJECT Obama’s health care plan.

Keep drilling on this point. Don’t let the bitter-end ideologues deflect the conversation.

jeff_from_mpls on July 31, 2009 at 10:25 AM

How do you explain this glaring contradiction?

I think 70% is a pretty definite number. It’s been the Gallup number now for awhile. Dispute it if you wish.

I can only guess that the Dems not backing it are true Blue Dawgs, with more Republicans than Democrats in their districts. I can guess that the lobbyists are winning. They are spending millions on this, of course. Pelosi wasn’t wrong about that one. And I believe absolutely that Obama blew this by scaring everyone with the stimulus and GM bailout deficit.

44% still believe reform could lower costs. And less than 70% believe it’s not necessary to pass anything this year.

So people seem to ME to be saying: We want this. But we’re nervous about the deficit.

That’s just my guess. Polling isn’t exact.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:26 AM

I’ve never claimed to be a nurse. You must be mixing me up with another poster.

AnninCA on July 31, 2009 at 10:27 AM

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