VA failed to provide adequate care to female veterans

posted at 11:36 am on July 15, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

Granted, this story is nowhere near as bad as the Walter Reed scandal from two years ago, and especially not as bad as the Indian Health Service.   However, it shows again that the single-payer medical-care system for our veterans continues to be plagued with bureaucratic sclerosis, lack of planning, and failure to meet the needs of its captive market:

The Department of Veterans Affairs often fails to provide adequate medical care to female military veterans, five of them told the Senate Veterans Affairs Committee Tuesday.

A Veterans Affairs official agreed.

“At the root is a system that has not been responsive to the needs of women veterans,” said Patricia Hayes, the department’s national director of women’s health care.

Of course, that could be harsh; after having women in the military service for more than 60 years, who could have foreseen the need to offer Pap smears and mammograms?

Department representatives acknowledged Tuesday that they’re struggling to adapt to the unique needs of female veterans. The idea that the military should provide pap smears and mammograms is still somewhat new, they said.

Women have served in the nation’s military in significant numbers since at least World War II.  Since 1973, the percentage of women in the military has increased from 1.3% to 8.5% in 1980, and about 20% today.  In 36 years of the all-volunteer military, the geniuses at the VA didn’t think about basic gynecology until just recently?  If a private-sector clinic refused to provide those services, it would make headlines — and would be out of business in short order.

And Walter Reed may not be the only VA facility needing a mop, some brushes, and a boatload of ammonia.  One woman testified about the facility where she unsuccessfully sought treatment for combat-related PTSD.  Sound familiar?

“The facility did not smell clean and was crowded with veterans who seemed to have poorly managed mental health concerns,” she said. “I was not given clear information about what services were available to me.”

Recall this assessment from last month:

Amid growing controversy over procedures that exposed 10,000 veterans to the AIDS and hepatitis viruses, the Department of Veterans Affairs is now bracing against news that one of its facilities in Pennsylvania gave botched radiation treatments to nearly 100 cancer patients.

Veterans groups and lawmakers say VA hospitals have permitted these violations because federal regulations allow doctors to work with little outside scrutiny. They say the VA health system, with its under-funded hospitals and overworked doctors, is showing signs of an “institutional breakdown,” in the words of one congressman.

An official with the American Legion who visits and inspects VA health centers said complacency, poor funding and little oversight led to the violations that failed the cancer patients in Philadelphia and possibly infected 53 veterans with hepatitis and HIV from unsterilized equipment at three VA health centers in Florida, Tennessee and Georgia.

“Lack of inspections, lack of transparency” were likely to blame, said Joe Wilson, deputy director of the Veterans Affairs and Rehabilitation Commission for the American Legion, who testified before Congress this month on transparency problems in a budgeting arm of the VA.

The US government operates three single-payer systems for large markets of consumers: Medicare/Medicaid, the VA, and the Indian Health Service.  None of them run properly.  Medicare pays doctors so poorly that many providers have stopped accepting new Medicare patients, and many others have to balance the losses they take on Medicare patients by overcharging other patients.  The IHS, as the AP reported yesterday, doesn’t even make a pretense of providing anything but emergency care under the most dire of circumstances, and contribute to the already-poor life expectancy among Native Americans on reservations.  The VA provides this nation’s most courageous citizens — those who volunteered to serve their nation in war and peace — with substandard care, a lack of accountability, and enough cluelessness that they can’t even anticipate that female veterans will need Pap smears and mammograms.

Is it too much to ask that Congress and the White House fix the broken single-payer systems they already run before attempting to overhaul private-sector health care, which may have its problems but outperforms GovernmentCare in just about every possible measure?

Blowback

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Comments

They shouldn’t have gotten sick… it’s

their

fault.

mankai on July 15, 2009 at 11:38 AM

Government should be rquired to fix all the things it has already broken before starting a new, large program.

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM

They served their time, they got paid…quit whining you little girls. A little cancer toughens you up.
That is what you get when you join the military and kill innocent children and families…liberal’s talking about military personnel.

right2bright on July 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM

The VA’s I’ve been in cater to quite a few marginal characters. The worst group were the 25 or so guys who gathered every morning to get their methadone doses. They would harrass females going in and out and sell drugs on the premises.

But hey, the good news is that Obama is going to spread guys like that around so that we can all enjoy their presence. Instead of caring for the truly sick, hospitals and physicians can spend their time policiing unruly juvenile delinquents and doctors can spend their time on patients “doctor shopping” for prescription highs. Wonderful.

NoDonkey on July 15, 2009 at 11:43 AM

Shocking!

Not.

SouthernGent on July 15, 2009 at 11:44 AM

Government should be rquired to fix all the things it has already broken before starting a new, large program.

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM

Even betrter…Federal Government should be required to cease and desist all programs not allowed for by the constitution.

WashJeff on July 15, 2009 at 11:44 AM

In 36 years of the all-volunteer military, the geniuses at the VA didn’t think about basic gynecology until just recently? If a private-sector clinic refused to provide those services, it would make headlines — and would be out of business in short order

Just one thing to answer before you begin your stone throwing again. What are the usage rates by gender? The VA has a lot of problems but as a system that uses rationed health care as does any system including Obamacare. I think your snarkiness would be somewhat undercut by the numbers of females entitled to gynecological services through the VA (certainly for the first decade or so of that 36-years). Okay, back to your stone hurling.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 11:45 AM

AnninCA says: That’s awesome! I can’t wait for that sort of excellent treatment.

lorien1973 on July 15, 2009 at 11:45 AM

Women should shut up. Stop being Victims. Thomas Frank said so.

portlandon on July 15, 2009 at 11:46 AM

Government should be rquired to fix all the things it has already broken before starting a new, large program.

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM

This is probably the most potent argument for everything that is going on. I’ve made this case a ton of times to leftists. Shuts em up, right away.

lorien1973 on July 15, 2009 at 11:46 AM

Anecdotal obviously, but I have not had one problem.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:46 AM

I just no fan, period, of the VA. Too much family and personal experience that showed me that the ‘t’ crossers and ‘i’ dotters kept the keys to the operating rooms.
I know, anecdotal.

Limerick on July 15, 2009 at 11:47 AM

I get a letter every year for my pap and mammogram. I also get a phone call the day before the appointment.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

Just curious: has anyone run numbers on what the government pays for VA health coverage per veteran, as opposed to the cost of top of the line private insurance? I am wondering if a case can be made for closing the entire VA healthcare system and having the US pay for whatever insurance individual vets and their families want to buy. Just speculation on my part; I don’t have any idea what the numbers are.

jwolf on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

AnninCA says: That’s awesome! I can’t wait for that sort of excellent treatment.

lorien1973 on July 15, 2009 at 11:45 AM

+1,000

my FIRST THOUGHT when reading the headline was “wonder how Ann will spin this one”.

such an arrogant little statist, wanting to TAKE AWAY my family’s chosen health care and replace it with this sexist govt style care that is passively killing off American Indians

exit irony: I’ll bet AnninCA is “pro-choice”—– except when it comes to, yknow, your own personal health.

battleoflepanto1571 on July 15, 2009 at 11:49 AM

Government should be rquired to fix all the things it has already broken before starting a new, large program.

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM

By that argument, we should have never gotten rid of the Articles of Confederation.

The fact of the matter is that everybody knows what the broken programs are. The problem is that no politician is willing to be the one that inflicts the pain to fix it. This is why I’m somewhat optimistic that the filthy liar in the White House will ultimately fail on both cap and trade and Obamacare. He can bully them through the legislative process but the outcome when people are denied treatment or are paying over 50% of gross income in taxes will be the death knell to Obama brand socialism.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 11:50 AM

Even betrter…Federal Government should be required to cease and desist all programs not allowed for by the constitution.

WashJeff on July 15, 2009 at 11:44 AM

Yes, I prefer your option.

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:50 AM

lorien1973 on July 15, 2009 at 11:46 AM

Any successful business in this country knows the answer to the question “What is our core business?”

Because to be successful, you need to find out what that is and get it right. Otherwise, you go out of business.

What is the core business of the federal government today? Everything and anything, apparently. And that’s why they can’t get anything right.

Our Founders defined it pretty well I think, but along the way, their vision was disregarded to “keep up with the times”.

Which has resulted in disaster. The federal government should concentrate only on what the Founders intended and the rest should either be left to the states or to private enterprise.

NoDonkey on July 15, 2009 at 11:51 AM

they’ve got to field test their procedures somewhere… sheesh! how else can they test the HIV infection of citizens?

Amid growing controversy over procedures that exposed 10,000 veterans to the AIDS and hepatitis viruses

gatorboy on July 15, 2009 at 11:51 AM

Anecdotal obviously, but I have not had one problem.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:46 AM

Do you believe that the standard of care might vary widely depending on the particular facility? Do all VA hospitals offer the same treatments, i.e., all offer methadone programs?

Blake on July 15, 2009 at 11:51 AM

The US government operates three four single-payer systems for large markets of consumers: Medicare/Medicaid, TRICARE the VA, and the Indian Health Service. None of them run properly. Medicare pays doctors so poorly that many providers have stopped accepting new Medicare patients, and many others have to balance the losses they take on Medicare patients by overcharging other patients

Socialized medicine doesn’t provide forward thiniking fixes for things until they become problems. It is inherently a reactive system. Problems get fixed only when a majority of the voting constituency raise enough heck to effect a change. The healthcare market doesn’t determine need and fill it with good products to meet those needs at values that consumers voluntarily pay. However, the socialized medical system waits for problems to emerge (ie, PTSD, amputees, head injuries, ob/gyn, smoking, divorce, drug abuse) and then evaluates the cost to treat vs the cost to ignore. Then–you get what you get. Welcome to socialized medicine.

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 11:54 AM

When Ruday took over in NYC he and his police commissioner took on that “broken windows” theory of fighting crime. It worked.

We need to take that approach to the federal government, wherein, all of those programs over the last 60 years that have failed, but are still on the books and being funded need to be abolished. All of the current major programs that are failures need to be fixed before any member of Congress can write new legislation.

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:54 AM

What are the usage rates by gender? The VA has a lot of problems but as a system that uses rationed health care as does any system including Obamacare. I think your snarkiness would be somewhat undercut by the numbers of females entitled to gynecological services through the VA (certainly for the first decade or so of that 36-years).

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 11:45 AM

This is spot on.

The VA I frequent, however, made it its business to better serve female veterans. I thought that this move was VA-wide but apparently some facilities have been better at serving female veteran requirements than others.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:55 AM

I am wondering if a case can be made for closing the entire VA healthcare system and having the US pay for whatever insurance individual vets and their families want to buy.

jwolf on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

Please keep in mind that there is more to the VA healthcare system than clinics and hospitals. I’m currently going through the disability claim process subsequent to retiring from the military. It’s a cumbersome process and the bureacracy is absurd. Nevertheless, I’m not sure how you’d legally or efficiently do some of the functions of the VA healthcare system through private insurance.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM

Do you believe that the standard of care might vary widely depending on the particular facility? Do all VA hospitals offer the same treatments, i.e., all offer methadone programs?

Blake on July 15, 2009 at 11:51 AM

We were thinking the same thing at the same time. I frightened! You should be too. :)

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM

I’m

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM

Socialized medicine doesn’t provide forward thiniking fixes for things until they become problems.

I agree in general, but under the Democrats, there is no doubt that health care will be politicized.

The best example of this is how AIDS (an entirely preventable disease in the vast majority of cases) has received funding way out of proportion to the number of people with the disease.

When the government controls medical assets, decisions on whom and what to treat will be made on the basis of politics. Not ethics or medicine. Politics.

NoDonkey on July 15, 2009 at 11:57 AM

I am wondering if a case can be made for closing the entire VA healthcare system and having the US pay for whatever insurance individual vets and their families want to buy.

jwolf on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

can you hear the laughter from DC?

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 11:57 AM

Hmm, my late father had health coverage through Tricare and it was just superb – no problems whatsoever.

The one downside – and it’s inherent in any third party payment program – is that the hospitals ran tests and procedures that were clearly duplicative and unnecessary. Once I was given medical power of attorney for my father we were able to rein in a number of unnecessary procedures but a few like x-rays and MRIs still were done.

SteveMG on July 15, 2009 at 11:58 AM

I agree in general, but under the Democrats, there is no doubt that health care will be politicized.

under the government, will health care be politicized. R’s or D’s will politicize it. It is bad to give it up to them no matter the party affiliation.

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 11:59 AM

For all of you, veteran and civilian, get every thing you need to get done right now–especially dental care–before Obamacare takes hold. After that, it’s black market medicine.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 12:00 PM

health coverage through Tricare

Tricare is the military health care program.

And my father’s treatment/care was done by private hospitals and not – with one exception – the VA system.

SteveMG on July 15, 2009 at 12:00 PM

VA, sh*t! Active duty care was bad enough. Now, it turned out well in the end, thank God, but…mid 80′s, found a lump in my breast in Sept., couldn’t get in to see a Navy Hospital know-it-all until Dec. They were “backed up with loads of testicle problems”. So I sat ’til then. Hardly any girls in the navy then, less mind a few of us (under 5000) in the Marine Corps. We just weren’t a priority and it was too expensive to turn things around to make us one.

Or at least as important as “testicles”.

tree hugging sister on July 15, 2009 at 12:00 PM

What a minute…the Women’s Studies Program at my university told me that “the difference between men and women was a social construction”. But this story seems to indicate a biological difference between men and women. I am now confused.

cyclown on July 15, 2009 at 12:01 PM

Hmm, my late father had health coverage through Tricare and it was just superb – no problems whatsoever.

The one downside – and it’s inherent in any third party payment program – is that the hospitals ran tests and procedures that were clearly duplicative and unnecessary. Once I was given medical power of attorney for my father we were able to rein in a number of unnecessary procedures but a few like x-rays and MRIs still were done.

SteveMG on July 15, 2009 at 11:58 AM

dude: I agree–as a tricare provider and patient, it is, for the most part, superb. At least until you have something–ie an injury or disease that is out of the norm. And, tricare routinely purchases healthcare in the civilian sector for conditions and services that it cannot provide. The main question is, what happens when the civilian sector looks like tricare–where do we go to get the services that we once purchased….? things that make you go hmmm

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM

tree hugging sister on July 15, 2009 at 12:00 PM

Things have improved great since then, at least at the local VA in So Cal. I had a bit of a problem back in 2001 and got in right away.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM

Not to be orthogonal to the story at hand, but my favorite part of the single payer option debate is that the White House team seems to believe that the single payer option will make insurers more competitive! Uh, what brand of crack are they on?

Forcing insurers to compete with an entity that reimburses less and one which is not required to produce a profit is not competition, it is a death sentence to private industry. By forcing hospitals to charge less there will be hospitals, fewer doctors, and fewer good doctors (all cost more money). Instead, our elected officials should be removing the barriers to competition (tort reform), not stymying it. I cannot fathom why our fearless leaders cannot comprehend this. But then again, perhaps competition would be counterproductive to a social engineering a worker’s utopia.

NickelAndDime on July 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM

For all of you, veteran and civilian, get every thing you need to get done right now–especially dental care–before Obamacare takes hold. After that, it’s black market medicine.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 12:00 PM

been saying that to my family as well…obamacare= ration care

cmsinaz on July 15, 2009 at 12:03 PM

Don’t worry about pap smears and mammograms…Top rated abortion services are on the way!

CMonster on July 15, 2009 at 12:03 PM

myrenovations on July 15, 2009 at 11:41 AM

The only way these single payer systems will be fixed is when they are scraped.

chemman on July 15, 2009 at 12:07 PM

The VA I frequent, however, made it its business to better serve female veterans. I thought that this move was VA-wide but apparently some facilities have been better at serving female veteran requirements than others.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:55 AM

Along the same lines, (and I don’t know the answer) were female veteran requirements not being met or did they have to get a referral outside the VA system for some services?

Everybody knows the VA has its problems and I can utterly relate to some of the comments about complacency, poor funding, and little oversight. However, reading through the testimonal quotes at the top of the thread, I see five women upset with the system got to speak as well as the VA director of women’s health issues who said that more needs to be done (which isn’t exactly agreeing as the article claims). It would seem to me that this testimony might be anecdotal from the disgruntled and not necessarily reflective of the system as a whole.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 12:08 PM

i’ve said this for months:

take this article, take the articles from Canada & the UK about women with breast cancer & the abysmal treatment (& even death) associated with socialized medicine & tell a woman with breast cancer.

tell a breast cancer survivor–they are the women who can get things done. tell those susan g. komen people.

these women can change the world.

and call your congressman. today.

kelley in virginia on July 15, 2009 at 12:09 PM

And, tricare routinely purchases healthcare in the civilian sector for conditions and services that it cannot provide. The main question is, what happens when the civilian sector looks like tricare–where do we go to get the services that we once purchased….? things that make you go hmmm

Sure, it can now piggyback – as it did in my father’s case – off the private sector.

I’m pretty sure that if my father had to use the VA system I wouldn’t have been so satisfied.

SteveMG on July 15, 2009 at 12:13 PM

Has anybody seen this?

http://docs.house.gov/gopleader/House-Democrats-Health-Plan.pdf

Chainsaw56 on July 15, 2009 at 12:14 PM

“The facility did not smell clean and was crowded with veterans who seemed to have poorly managed mental health concerns,” she said. “I was not given clear information about what services were available to me.”

A precursor of Obamacare.

Being a military family member (active duty), you avoid the military hospital’s ER after hours unless it’s life-threatening. It’s awful. Crowder’s video yesterday doesn’t come close to how awful it will be.

Is it too much to ask that Congress and the White House fix the broken single-payer systems they already run before attempting to overhaul private-sector health care, which may have its problems but outperforms GovernmentCare in just about every possible measure?

Apparently it is too much to ask.

conservative pilgrim on July 15, 2009 at 12:15 PM

The one downside – and it’s inherent in any third party payment program – is that the hospitals ran tests and procedures that were clearly duplicative and unnecessary.

SteveMG on July 15, 2009 at 11:58 AM

From which standpoint? As a taxpayer, I don’t want Tricare to be billed for unnecessary procedures and tests. As a patient, I don’t want the provider to skimp on tests and procedures that are necessary. As a doctor, I don’t want to be sued by our litigious society because tests weren’t done.

My only point is that everytime a test or procedure may be “repetitive,” it might not be the hospital trying to overcharge the government. That being said, from my experience, part of the absurdity is in what the system will and won’t pay for. For example they will pay if you get tests X,Y,and Z done but don’t even think about getting paid if you only do test Y.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 12:17 PM

Has anybody seen this?

http://docs.house.gov/gopleader/House-Democrats-Health-Plan.pdf

Chainsaw56 on July 15, 2009 at 12:14 PM


Drudge
has had it up all day.

conservative pilgrim on July 15, 2009 at 12:19 PM

It hasn’t been repeated in roughly the last 20 posts, so QFT:

Even better…Federal Government should be required to cease and desist all programs not allowed for by the constitution.

Amen!

aelhues on July 15, 2009 at 12:20 PM

Is it too much to ask that Congress and the White House fix the broken single-payer systems they already run.

It would be nice if they could demonstrate JUST ONCE, that they can run something without screwing it up!

It would also be nice if they had a policy of only writing new laws when they have enforced existing laws.

But maybe they could try the a simple competency question first.

Chainsaw56 on July 15, 2009 at 12:26 PM

A precursor of Obamacare.

Being a military family member (active duty), you avoid the military hospital’s ER after hours unless it’s life-threatening. It’s awful. Crowder’s video yesterday doesn’t come close to how awful it will be.

These are excellant examples of Gov’t ran Healthcare. God help us all as we know the Hussein Administration will not.

BigMike252 on July 15, 2009 at 12:26 PM

20 years ago, I literally would not have wished VA treatment on a dog. But under Bush, they started programs that let veterans choose their own coverage, and often get treatment in private hospitals. The vets under that program didn’t just get good healthcare, they got TOP FLIGHT health care.

Obama doesn’t just want to prevent vets from getting that; he wants to exclude every American citizen.

logis on July 15, 2009 at 12:27 PM

Is it too much to ask that Congress and the White House fix the broken single-payer systems they already run before attempting to overhaul private-sector health care, which may have its problems but outperforms GovernmentCare in just about every possible measure?

Same argument applies against comprehensive immigration reform.

Observe current laws before burdening tax payers with more layers of bureaucracy. More legislation simply creates more employees who fail to perform up to job description. The bigger the apparatus, the larger the clusterf8ck.

Insurance is a bureaucracy that is not a benevolent dictator nor a public benefactor. The industry has already fomented too much bureaucracy between patient and doctor. The government Socialists covet the industry, and want to assimilate it into federal Statism. It’s hard enough to combat poor insurance service when the free market exists. It will be impossible to argue any case against a state self-interested insurance industry that is set vs. citizen, vs. service.

If taxes actually paid for what they were enacted to fund, Social Security would be a huge financial reserve earning tons of interest. Our highways would be perfectly designed and maintained without the addition of tolls given the fuel taxes we pay per gallon.

The only new legislation we need is to RESCIND what breaks our liberty.

maverick muse on July 15, 2009 at 12:29 PM

The VA’s I’ve been in cater to quite a few marginal characters. The worst group were the 25 or so guys who gathered every morning to get their methadone doses. They would harrass females going in and out and sell drugs on the premises.

But hey, the good news is that Obama is going to spread guys like that around so that we can all enjoy their presence. Instead of caring for the truly sick, hospitals and physicians can spend their time policiing unruly juvenile delinquents and doctors can spend their time on patients “doctor shopping” for prescription highs. Wonderful.

NoDonkey on July 15, 2009 at 11:43 AM

Just keep this in mind, folks:

This is what Obama has in store for your parents and grandparents.

He wants to pay for at least half of his health care plan with over $600 billion in cuts to Medicare.

After all, why should the elderly, our parents and grandparents, who paid into the system all their lives, who fought in our wars and paid our taxes and created what we have today — why should they escape having to push past drug addicts and juvenile delinquents in order to get their health care?

Why, when Medicare funding is dramatically cut, they can just go join the indigent and mental patients waiting in line for Obamacare.

Or, of course, if they happen to have a whole lot of money, they can spend 2, 3, 4 times what they have to spend now, on Medicare supplemental insurance.

None of us wants to have to suffer through the indignities of national health care, where all hospitals will become King Hospital in Los Angeles (the one where the patient died in the ER waiting room after being brushed off by ER personnel, and even calling 911 looking for intervention).

But the thought of it is even worse, when we consider that the first people Obama wants to inflict this on are our elderly parents and grandparents.

J.E. Dyer on July 15, 2009 at 12:29 PM

Even better…Federal Government should be required to cease and desist all programs not allowed for by the constitution.

That is exactly what California must do. Bankruptcy from funding illegals costs more than citizens can pay.

And I agree, the only new legislation we need is to RESCIND what breaks our liberty.

maverick muse on July 15, 2009 at 12:33 PM

TRICARE is a fine system. But, the reason is that it relies almost exclusively on civilian hospitals and care providers. These providers agree to accept what the government will pay for the care provided.

However, in the most common TRICARE plan, TRICARE Prime, you have a primary care provider that must refer you to any specialist. And, that specialist must be in the network. So, you can only choose your doctor from amongst a limited field. And, you sometimes have to go a long distance to get care.

Additionally, because of the rates authorized by the government, many offices will choose not to participate in TRICARE.

Such is socialized medicine. Your care is limited by what the primary care doctor will authorize, it’s available only at a limited number of facilities and it is not necessarily going to be at a convenient site.

So far my experience has been that the primary care doctor is willing to refer you as you desire and that quality care has been available within a 45 min to an hour drive. But, the potential exists that at their discretion, not yours, this could change drastically.

SoonerMarine on July 15, 2009 at 12:36 PM

the first people Obama wants to inflict this on are our elderly parents and grandparents.

J.E. Dyer on July 15, 2009 at 12:29 PM

Cowards always attack the weak.

Obama’s Socialist Absolutism holds no place for those who know better. Eliminate the written record, fabricate the revisionism of history, and smother all memory.

maverick muse on July 15, 2009 at 12:37 PM

Or at least as important as “testicles”.

tree hugging sister

P.S. Tree, there’s nothing more important than testicles!

SoonerMarine on July 15, 2009 at 12:39 PM

Ed,

I don’t understand all the objections…within 1 year we could be walking hand in hand with the Irans down one of the many healthcare walking paths. Doesn’t that sound just lovely?

NickelAndDime on July 15, 2009 at 12:41 PM

I remember when all this Socialized insurance programming began with the HMO vs. Blue Cross Blue Shield and the simple catastrophic health insurance policy becoming obsolete. It was STATE employees who paved the way for HMOs before big businesses joined the fray late 1960′s-early 1970s. Everyone was told they must have more insurance, more insurance, more insurance. Then came the uber-liberal law suits of malpractice with monstrously high results and financial burdens that would have been impossible to sue for prior to the HMO.

Thinking that getting into bed with Big Brother makes you safer from abuse is foolish and incestuous.

maverick muse on July 15, 2009 at 12:45 PM

Any veteran who has a service connected 100% disability can be referred out to a community clinic or physician on a fee basis procedure and not only if it is service connected.

rlwo2008 on July 15, 2009 at 12:46 PM

I get a letter every year for my pap and mammogram. I also get a phone call the day before the appointment.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

er..as…well…er…hmmm…ahh…er…no comment…er..ah

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 12:47 PM

See as it’s a government program, and noting the governments push for diversity, will the military people needing the services of witchdoctors be supplied.

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 12:51 PM

Speaking of the treatment of our troops under Obama: BOMBSHELL VICTORY WON YESTERDAY AGAINST OBAMA’S ELIGIBILITY THAT PUTS TROOPS IN JEOPARDY (IF CAPTURED, TROOPS MAY NOT EVEN BE COVERED BY GENEVA CONVENTIONS) Even linked in DRUDGE and… crickets…???
.
…”We won! We won before we even arrived,” she said with excitement.
“It means that the military has nothing to show for Obama. It means that the military has directly responded by saying Obama is illegitimate – and they cannot fight it…”
.

THIS DESERVES ITS OWN HA THREAD WITH A LOGICAL, EASILY IDENTIFIABLE TITLE (NOT BURIED IN OBSCURITY AS USUAL)</ strong>
.
——————
BORN IN THE USA?
Bombshell: Orders revoked for soldier challenging prez
Major victory for Army warrior questioning Obama’s birthplace

—————-
Posted: July 14, 2009
9:53 pm Eastern

.

A U.S. Army Reserve major from Florida scheduled to report for deployment to Afghanistan within days has had his military orders revoked after arguing he should not be required to serve under a president who has not proven his eligibility for office.
.
His attorney, Orly Taitz, confirmed to WND the military has rescinded his impending deployment orders.
.
“We won! We won before we even arrived,” she said with excitement. “It means that the military has nothing to show for Obama. It means that the military has directly responded by saying Obama is illegitimate – and they cannot fight it. Therefore, they are revoking the order!”

She continued, “They just said, ‘Order revoked.’ No explanation. No reasons – just revoked.”

A hearing on the questions raised by Maj. Stefan Frederick Cook, an engineer who told WND he wants to serve his country in Afghanistan, was scheduled for July 16 at 9:30 a.m.
.
“[Then] any order coming out of the presidency or his chain of command is illegal. Should I deploy, I would essentially be following an illegal [order]. If I happened to be captured by the enemy in a foreign land, I would not be privy to the Geneva Convention protections,” he said.

The order for the hearing in the federal court for the Middle District of Georgia from U.S. District Judge Clay D. Land said the hearing on the request for a temporary restraining order would be held Thursday…”

NightmareOnKStreet on July 15, 2009 at 12:51 PM

A Vet is a Vet, male or female. They all deserve better than this.

n0doz on July 15, 2009 at 12:54 PM

AnninCA says: That’s awesome! I can’t wait for that sort of excellent treatment.

lorien1973 on July 15, 2009 at 11:45 AM

Taking advice from someone who’s never had to clarify Obamacare rationale, arguing only that his way is the only way, simply swallowing and regurgitating propaganda whole as an a priori “given” reality, someone who does not participate in the free enterprise business world but rather milks Statist grants for tax funds aka “income”. She’s hardly the reliable source of wisdom. Rather AnninCA is just another tax burden demanding to be funded by you and by me without herself producing sufficient revenue. She’s entitled.

maverick muse on July 15, 2009 at 1:02 PM

I get a letter every year for my pap and mammogram. I also get a phone call the day before the appointment.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

er..as…well…er…hmmm…ahh…er…no comment…er..ah

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 12:47 PM

That’s probably your best bet. :)

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 1:02 PM

NightmareOnKStreet on July 15, 2009 at 12:51 PM

“I will obey the orders of the President, and the officers appointed over me…”

that MAJ took an oath.
these tactics have been tried before. The DoD has the authority (and the servicemember the responsibility) to order someone to deploy.
He has very little legal ground to stand upon, if any.
This fella hasn’t won a thing. The other shoe will drop–mark my words.

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 1:12 PM

Obama now mugging in presser with nurses.

Serenity now.

BuckeyeSam on July 15, 2009 at 1:14 PM

He has very little legal ground to stand upon, if any.
This fella hasn’t won a thing. The other shoe will drop–mark my words.

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 1:12 PM

Exactly. Let’s remember the part about protecting and defending the Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic. Even with a valid birth certificate, I would consider the filthy liar in the White House a domestic enemy. That Major can’t refuse to deploy on the basis that the POTUS isn’t a valid leader without wondering why he didn’t do something to defend the US from an illegitimate leader.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 1:17 PM

I get a letter every year for my pap and mammogram. I also get a phone call the day before the appointment.

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 11:48 AM

er..as…well…er…hmmm…ahh…er…no comment…er..ah

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 12:47 PM

That’s probably your best bet. :)

baldilocks on July 15, 2009 at 1:02 PM

LOL…I think so too

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 1:20 PM

I can’t seem to find a doctor to perform a good blood letting with leeches anymore.

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 1:22 PM

This is probably the most potent argument for everything that is going on. I’ve made this case a ton of times to leftists. Shuts em up, right away.

lorien1973 on July 15, 2009 at 11:46 AM

I’m surprised – I’d expect most leftists to say the same thing they currently are about Porkulus: It wasn’t big ENOUGH!!!!!eleventy!!1one11!1!!1!

gwelf on July 15, 2009 at 1:25 PM

He has very little legal ground to stand upon, if any.
This fella hasn’t won a thing. The other shoe will drop–mark my words.

ted c on July 15, 2009 at 1:12 PM
Exactly. Let’s remember the part about protecting and defending the Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic. Even with a valid birth certificate, I would consider the filthy liar in the White House a domestic enemy. That Major can’t refuse to deploy on the basis that the POTUS isn’t a valid leader without wondering why he didn’t do something to defend the US from an illegitimate leader.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 1:17 PM

.
While I agree more with highhopes, my main point is that regardless of the projected outcome- this SHOULD BE front page news – at least Drudge linked it yesterday, before the military revoked his orders to deploy and again today. HotAir should give it its own THREAD (not an obscure headline that will be lost after 3 hours) WHY NOT AIR THE STORY & LET OTHERS DECIDE HOW THEY FEEL?.
.
There is a legal question on the table about Obama’s legitamacy re his dual- NOT NATURAL BORN citizenship AT BIRTH. See my previous post for links.

NightmareOnKStreet on July 15, 2009 at 1:29 PM

Consider how the Government solved the problem in the Post Offices. People would point at the clock mounted above the counter and complain that they had waited for 20 minutes to get to the counter.

Do you know how the Government solved this problem?

THEY REMOVED THE CLOCKS FROM ALL THE POST OFFICES.

This is who we want in charge of our health?

portlandon on July 15, 2009 at 1:30 PM

Gubment health care is terrific, unless you’re the disgruntled one who receives botched care or no care at all.

A military hospital’s negligence and poor care killed my sister and nearly killed my mother a few years later. But I’m sure Obama can do better, especially if we get the entire US population on the same system.

Laura in Maryland on July 15, 2009 at 1:31 PM

I can’t seem to find a doctor to perform a good blood letting with leeches anymore.
Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 1:22 PM

Just wait, that’ll be standard treatment for pretty much everything under O’crap-care.

- with a 6 month waiting period of course, and the number of leeches will be strictly rationed.

Chainsaw56 on July 15, 2009 at 1:36 PM

- with a 6 month waiting period of course, and the number of leeches will be strictly rationed.

Chainsaw56 on July 15, 2009 at 1:36 PM

Instead of rationing them, can’t we just send the leeches back to Mexico?

Laura in Maryland on July 15, 2009 at 1:42 PM

Instead of rationing them, can’t we just send the leeches back to Mexico?

Laura in Maryland on July 15, 2009 at 1:42 PM

ROFLMAO!

Chainsaw56 on July 15, 2009 at 1:59 PM

as a tricare provider and patient, it is, for the most part, superb. At least until you have something–ie an injury or disease that is out of the norm. And, tricare routinely purchases healthcare in the civilian sector for conditions and services that it cannot provide.

My first experience with Tricare in 2002 was finding out that they had a policy of not doing something that was standard of care. (ultrasound at 16-20 weeks of pregnancy)

Since my response to “no” was “but that’s standard of care” the doctor found some excuse to say I needed an ultrasound.

Then I got to wait for a referral, spend a bunch of time on the phone to find out that no DC military facility could see me, then got started on the process of going to an off-base private facility.

Now, at our small base here in Texas, there is one pediatrician. If he is not working or out sick, there often is no one available to see your child.

While I haven’t had any terrible experiences, these aren’t the kind of thing that happen in the private sector. Any there are plenty of people who have had terrible experiences with Tricare.

MamaAJ on July 15, 2009 at 2:00 PM

My mom has been using the VA for years (since the early 80′s), and has always told me it’s hit and miss with them when it comes to female-specific care. Back when she had a cancer scare (uterine), she had problems getting proper treatment (and ultimately went to a civilian doc) – but she’s been able to receive treatment at the VA for other issues.

I don’t use the VA yet, because as an AD spouse, I still am eligible for Tricare. I’ve had issues concerning timeliness in getting pap (and other, for that matter) appointments (3+ months in some cases) – well, I’ve had a billion issues with Tricare since I enrolled after boot camp.

I realize my mom and I (and those like us) are very fortunate to have access to this healthcare – but for all we’ve done and sacrificed, I feel we deserve a tad better treatment from gov’t facilities. But I have a personal hatred burning here, and I’ll admit, it clouds my judgment.

Anna on July 15, 2009 at 2:06 PM

Just wondering…with the crummy reputation the VA has had for decade, regarding care of BOTH genders of soldiers,why is it AGAIN about women?
Is EVERY day “Breast Cancer Awareness Day”?

Geez..give it a rest

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 2:59 PM

decades

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 2:59 PM

There is a legal question on the table about Obama’s legitamacy re his dual- NOT NATURAL BORN citizenship AT BIRTH. See my previous post for links.

NightmareOnKStreet on July 15, 2009 at 1:29 PM

But that isn’t the legal question on the table. The legal question is if an officer can refuse to deploy based on an unproven allegation. Until the filthy liar in the White House is deemed unqualified for office (by the Constitutional use of the word), that officer can’t refuse orders from his chain-of-command.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 3:00 PM

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 11:45 AM

You did allude to rationing and Obamacare, but the objection that there wasn’t a high number of women needing VA services goes to the heart of the objection to gubmint care. If you have a common illness injury/disease, it’ll hopefully get taken care of pretty quickly. If you’re an unfortunate outlier, under Obamacare in 2-5 years- good luck. The current services for unusual but crucial cases will be much harder to find- too expensive to keep up.

cs89 on July 15, 2009 at 3:02 PM

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 2:59 PM

You mean there isn’t a director of Men’s Health looking out after the guys?

Seriously, you bring up a valid point. The VA healthcare has had “issues” for decades. Frankly, I think it less about funding than about management and organization. It’s like asking the DMV to offer medical services.

The VA website lists 23.4M vets in 2008, 1.8M of them female. Why is this one hearing so much worse than so many other lapses of a system? How many unavailable non-gender related procedures are out there being ignored?

P.S. The VA can do better but it will take a reformer and a mandate. The VA has neither in the current director.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 3:07 PM

P.S. The VA can do better but it will take a reformer and a mandate. The VA has neither in the current director.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 3:07 PM

I’m not trying to be sarcastic, but I guess women’s health has a better marketing program. I swear every other weekend is another breast cancer run or something. I guess prostrate cancer isn’t a glamorous disease.

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 3:13 PM

I’m not trying to be sarcastic, but I guess women’s health has a better marketing program. I swear every other weekend is another breast cancer run or something. I guess prostrate cancer isn’t a glamorous disease.

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 3:13 PM

I guess it needs its own ribbon.

It’s not spiteful to point out that too much of the public policy discussion about where the research money for “cures” goes is based on the “popularity” of the disease.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 3:23 PM

I guess it needs its own ribbon.

It’s not spiteful to point out that too much of the public policy discussion about where the research money for “cures” goes is based on the “popularity” of the disease.

highhopes on July 15, 2009 at 3:23 PM

I myself enjoy watching and donating during the “Prickly Heat” Telethon.

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 3:38 PM

“[Then] any order coming out of the presidency or his chain of command is illegal. Should I deploy, I would essentially be following an illegal [order]. If I happened to be captured by the enemy in a foreign land, I would not be privy to the Geneva Convention protections,” he said.

What a weasel. That war was STARTED by a duly elected president, there jackass, and it’s this duly elected president’s duty to support them. Tens of thousands of your brave brothers and sisters in arms have and are serving there, and, if you’re ordered there, that’s YOUR duty, loser.

And no worries about capture ~ the Taliban and al_Qaeda aren’t big on conventions, Geneva or otherwise.

tree hugging sister on July 15, 2009 at 3:50 PM

It’s not spiteful to point out that too much of the public policy discussion about where the research money for “cures” goes is based on the “popularity” of the disease.

highhopes

You know, that’s true. If men were as vocal about their…um…”thang”…prostate cancer might have gone the way of the dinosaur.

tree hugging sister on July 15, 2009 at 3:52 PM

Like baldilocks, I haven’t had any issues with my local VA. I have an annual pap and have had several mammograms.

When my mom had a colonoscopy (private) that revealed cancer (small, early and completely removed with surgery Praise God) I called the VA to have a colonscopy done.

Mom’s surgery was about a month after her colonoscopy. My colonoscopy was a week before her surgery. I haven’t seen anything resembling the horror stories I’ve been hearing about.

kimsch on July 15, 2009 at 3:58 PM

And Walter Reed may not be the only VA facility needing a mop, some brushes, and a boatload of ammonia. One woman testified about the facility where she unsuccessfully sought treatment for combat-related PTSD. Sound familiar?

Ed:

The Walter Reed Army Medical Center had never been part of the VA hospital system. As a registered nurse working there for the last 30 years, I strongly object to your comments related to our care and cleanliness. You obviously had never been to our main hospital building nor understand that the WaPo article referred to a facility that was not even physically in our campus and was not a direct patient care area either.

The care provided by my colleagues, both civilian and military, to our active and retired warriors and their families is world class and we don’t take a second place to anyone.

El Coqui on July 15, 2009 at 4:10 PM

You know, that’s true. If men were as vocal about their…um…”thang”…prostate cancer might have gone the way of the dinosaur.

tree hugging sister on July 15, 2009 at 3:52 PM

LOL..you’re probably right. The reason I like my doctor, who I only see once a year to get a new prescription, is that he NEVER asks any qyestions or bothers me with any tests. It’s just , Hi Doc,I need a new prescription, and I’m gone. This doc is great.

Jeff from WI on July 15, 2009 at 4:24 PM

The idea that the military should provide pap smears and mammograms is still somewhat new

In 36 years of the all-volunteer military, the geniuses at the VA didn’t think about basic gynecology until just recently?

1st off VA is not he military health care system (one of the ones you missed on your list) and we do plenty of pap smears and mammograms.

the VA used to cover mostly service-related medical conditions and disabled veterans. That was changed by Bush and now it is basically medicare for veterans. they take you based on your income and service. (in addition to all service-connected injuries/conditions)

This changed recently (ie w/in the last 5-6yrs), so it’s not 30yrs of dropping the ball… more like 5′ish because Pap smears and mammograms are preventative screening exams ONLY. The biggest question should be why did Bush expand the VA coverage as much as he did? (“Hey this system sucks…lets make it bigger!”)

BadBrad on July 16, 2009 at 7:26 AM

El Coqui on July 15, 2009 at 4:10 PM

I used to work at Walter Reed as well. Not only is the hospital clean, it gives great care to it’s patients. I hate people who talk smack but have never been there (like most of the reporters who trashed it in the press). That “SCANDAL” about WRAMC was 90% political posturing and faux outrage. Noone questioned congresses part in holding up the renovation funds. Was Walter Reed overwhelmed… Yes. But why were they overwhelmed? The decision was made to keep wounded veterans longer (sometimes more than a year) to give them better rehab and a chance to stay in service. in the past these amputees, etc would have been immediately found unfit for continued service and discharged to the VA. The uptick in violence and resulting spike in transiet (ie not permanent) servicemembers living there was more than they could handle. So I can forgive the problems in that context (ie they were ‘trying’ to do the right thing and bit off more than they could chew) instead of the opposite (ie apathy… hint,hint VA hint,hint).
The real loser in this was the commander Gen Weightman who had his career sacrificed on the political alter… any military member who has been to WRAMC knows that place has a mind of it’s own and cannot be changed overnight.

BadBrad on July 16, 2009 at 7:41 AM