I saw recently someone comment that the only thing that will save our country would be another attack on our country. Sad, very sad.

workingforpigs on July 14, 2009 at 1:41 PM

Sad, but probably true.

I have my doubts it will happen, based on the Leftist bent of 99.9% of “historians” in this era, but Carter and Clinton will someday be remembered as two of the worst American Presidents ever.

We’ll see.

<a href=”http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D99EC8E00&show_article=1

“>US General Walter “Skip” Sharp said that if diplomatic efforts fail, he is “absolutely confident” that the United States and South Korea can intercept North Korean missiles fired at the South and quickly and successfully defeat any land or sea attacks. Sharp was also asked about North Korea’s suspected involvement in cyberattacks last week that caused Web outages in the United States and South Korea. Sharp would not confirm news reports that the North was involved, saying officials still were working to see where the attacks came from. The U.S. military, he said, has not been hurt by the attacks, although he called them a worry. The attacks caused outages on prominent government-run sites in the United States and South Korea.

coldwarrior on July 14, 2009 at 4:25 PM

I agree. The regime could be toppled in a long weekend, BUT you would have to ensure dear leader is taken out so they cannot launch the missles. A combo of taking out the leader and the nukes would work, but the American people are not ready for that and our military is too bogged down in Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere.

For some odd reason, I think the residents of South Korea would seriously mind.

BallisticBob on July 14, 2009 at 3:35 PM

Guys, I didn’t say “nuke” them…

The only hope would be to take out the entire upper leadership so that the troops don’t have anyone to order them to fire on Seoul

Uhh, doesn’t Kim Il Dingleberry Dip Squat have like, the fourth largest standing army in the world? And the Korean peninsula really isn’t that big.

The NK Army is down to a few divisions, if you can call them that, that are actually considered combat effective, and they have had no combined arms training in well over a decade; the NK air force is down to a smidgen of its air fleet, rusted aircraft sitting on hardstands, a few of their best inside underground bunkers, which are observable even from Google Earth…can’t hide addets and aprons; their Navy? Not much for surface warfare craft, far fewer deep ocean capability, if any, and at-sea training, nil.

The NK armed forces are getting the second largest portion of the NK economy, after the 1%, the KWP elites. And their present rations are subsistence, not high caloric, not the sort of thing that builds strong minds and bodies.

And they have “nukes.” OK. Deliverable? Possibly. To where? South Korea and Japan. But we have pretty good indication where they are and where their missile “facilities” if you can call them that are located. There are choke points all across that country…physical and political, and most of all militarily. Kim Chong-il still hangs on to power…and only he can release any weapons…and if he is not able to follow day to day, hour by hour, events, in his present state…who will give the orders to attack or counter-attack, or order the release of their cache of WMD? Not a whole lot of initiative among the military leadership…to do so is to invite being purged.

The populace? Well, 1% are living high on the hog. The other 99% not so much.

Repression? Abundant. Even among the elites.

Power struggle? In motion. The O Kuk-ryol faction is backing the baby Kim [Kim Chong-un] and there is evidence of the oldest son having a following of his own. Some scant evidence of a few among the leadership having cut out their own territory. In between, a lot of that 1% vying for their piece of the pie once Kim Chong-il has shuffled off his mortal coil….which is predicted before the end of Summer, perhaps early Fall.

In other words…what better time to strike and remove the pestilence?

Wait around a year or two, watch a minor purge or two take place, watch baby Kim as Prince Regent being led by O Kuk-ryol, who has had this vision of a modern 20th century combined arms force for North Korea; O Kuk-ryol who has been abroad, and has seen up close what a trained force can do and what an ossified force such as North Korea’s today cannot do.

But, as a cost-benefit thing, hit them when they are at their weakest and in disarray. Or try to weigh the costs when they have reconstituted themselves, and have a new leader and a Prince Regent to defend…with updated training, arms, and new western tactics…and allies from Tehran to Caracas.

Jingoist? Maybe. But Eagleburger has a valid point. it should be examined closely as such.

Compared to voting “present” instead of making hard decisions.

Myself? Perhaps allowing the nation to starve itself into submission would be a better tack. But, personally, I dislike watching innocents by the hundreds of thousands die to prop up a dying regime…and they lost a few million last decade. Would have lost more had it not been for UN and US and other nation’s food aid given freely…most of it going to that 1% and to the military.

If we had a President who was actually in tune with the real world, instead of clinging to an imagined and desired Utopian dream, we could make this work.

How many looked it up?

d1carter on July 14, 2009 at 1:09 PM

Timidly raises hand….

txag92 on July 14, 2009 at 1:13 PM

I did, but it was after either Ed or AP used it in a post a few months back.

I love it, though…the single best description of BHO one can have…

Yes, that nonsense comes up way too often. I don’t get it, though. I can’t figure out what makes so many people, liberals most often, embrace the notion that a country that enslaves its own people is morally superior to America.

What was the liberal cry in the 60s: Power to the people?

What other Nation has given that except America? But liberals don’t understand that, as you and I do–among others here.

I don’t get the notion that a woman raped and murdered in a dark alley is more moral than a woman who guns down her attempted rapist with .45 autoloader.

I don’t understand how we came to believe being in poverty and living on the public teat is more noble than working for a living. Ever see The Lost Battalion, my newfound friend? It says a lot, in a short conversation between two soldiers. If you haven’t seen it, I recommend it for your viewing pleasure.

I don’t believe what you and I hope for is impossible. It’s hard, yes, but not out of our grasp. The Founders set it up so that might be so; they gave us a Republic if we can keep it.

With enough people like you and I, we will.

Regards, with prayers of all peace and prosperity to you and yours,
Liam

d1carter on July 14, 2009 at 1:09 PM

Raises hand. Cool word too.

right2bright on July 14, 2009 at 1:35 PM

For some odd reason, I think the residents of South Korea would seriously mind.

Not if we nuke them first. I say that we should attack first and use nukes. What are we going to do wait until NK launches one or two on Seoul or even Japan before we take them serious. Use the Nukes Now and end this before they can a bunch more.

Sporty1946 on July 14, 2009 at 2:53 PM

The NK artillery is all hardened: we could blow all of our nukes on them and they would still level Seoul once it was over.

I’m on your side here, please know. I’d love seeing NK popped out of the known universe by American power, either militarily or economically–in any and every way our United States wins.

Our policy should be strong as you and I agree. But in reality, there are a lot of people in DC who would never allow it. We like our views and, I promise, I’m on your side; we’re of the same mind. Then reality sets in, so we’re both screwed.

Liam on July 14, 2009 at 2:56 PM

I understood this, Liam. I was just saying what should be, by my thinking, though it’s clear that there’s no chance of any of it being implemented, given what we have in Washington. I just wanted to directly address some of the issues you raised, as to declarations of war, family of nations, etc., since they come up all too often.

OhEssYouCowboys on July 14, 2009 at 1:27 PM

I’m not sure China cares that much about a few nuclear detonations. One of the more fascinating DVD’s in our local library back up in Port Clinton, Ohio was on the history of nuclear weapons. Great footage of blast effects, even some from inside submarines as they collapsed from local test blasts. The best one, though, was propaganda footage from the Chinese of how they would use a nuclear weapon on a battlefield. It showed a nuclear blast, with mounted cavalry soldiers charging toward it. So they sacrificed maybe a couple thousand of their own soldiers to make a movie.

They just don’t value human life the way the West does.

Hello again!

I’m on your side here, please know. I’d love seeing NK popped out of the known universe by American power, either militarily or economically–in any and every way our United States wins.

Our policy should be strong as you and I agree. But in reality, there are a lot of people in DC who would never allow it. We like our views and, I promise, I’m on your side; we’re of the same mind. Then reality sets in, so we’re both screwed.

I don’t buy the ‘family of nations’ thing any more than you. America is a sovereign Nation, the greatest challenge to the old world order in all human history. In 1946, we could have controlled the world and enforced a Pax Americana but we didn’t. A testament, to be sure, of what you and I believe.

The reality of ‘now’ is what it is. WE can’t just wipe NK off the map tho, like you, I believe we should. The greater, and maybe sad reality, is that NK is going to get away with what it does.

Taking another tack, does not liberty require letting other nations be what they will to be? American liberty is for Americans; we didn’t go to war to impose our Constitution on the monarchies of Europe after we became a Nation.

At this point, rhetoric of tiny bankrupt nations really don’t matter. If we acted on the words of Kim Jong, we’d have a crapload of diplomatic matters to attend. Why go there? Idiots are their own undoing, so let KJIllness rant. He’s his own undoing.

Again, I’m on your side in desire to trash his shitty little hovel of a country. My tactics are just a little different. Excess is always it;s own undoing.

Regards always,
Liam

NK could use Seoul as a hostage against PRC invasion as well. China has a much bigger and more important economic relationship with ROK than NK now. At that point NK would have nothing else to lose anyway.

DarkCurrent on July 14, 2009 at 2:35 PM

Hmmmm. Then that gets tricky.

War to win that won’t work for the US at this point, under this POS ‘president’.

Liam on July 14, 2009 at 2:30 PM

This is true.

progressoverpeace on July 14, 2009 at 2:39 PM

To clarrify, I only meant that it was true that we had a POS Precedent who wouldn’t let the US do what we needed to do. A war would still work, but this treasonous Precedent would never allow that, since it would work.

Ah, but they haven’t attacked.

They declared the war, “On”. That’s quite enough.

Their threat to launch a missile on July 4 was stillborn; maybe a ploy to get us to move first and cry ‘victim’?

Who cares what their “ploy” might have been? I don’t see the relevance.

NK talks but doesn’t act beyond its limited capacity. If the US responded militarily on mere words, we’d be seen as the bad guy, the ‘aggressor’ in UN parlance.

The US is seen as the bad guy, the ‘aggressor’, no matter what. I don’t see how this would reasonably figure into our policy, as it is a constant.

My view, instead of military action, is let NK spew all it wants while ignoring them. Ever see the show Family Guy? Stewie is basically Kim Jong Il. Ignore him and he freaks. The difference is KJ Ill is soon to die. Stewie ceases to exist soon as the network cancels the show.

I don’t think this is good policy. It only invites greater problems.

NK needs to be removed from the ‘family’ of nations, no doubt.

To be honest, I never quite understood the meaning of this “family of nations” thing. It’s never used except to stop us from dong what we need to do. But the rogue states do whatever they want, anyway. I look at any “family of nations” talk as a cop-out. It is meaningless.

War to win that won’t work for the US at this point, under this POS ‘president’.

Liam on July 14, 2009 at 2:30 PM

This is true. I am speaking about what US policy should be, if we didn’t have a retarded traitor in the White House. Given the fact that The Precedent is a great hater of America, it’s clear that he will not do anything that might be good for the US.

I pusillanimously looked it up too…

d1carter on July 14, 2009 at 1:17 PM

(slang for cat) for short…as they were “p**sies” for not stepping up and stopping him.

Funny how a word loses it’s meaning when tacking on a couple of syllables.

right2bright on July 14, 2009 at 1:34 PM

Not really. The synonymous meaning between the long word and the slang is what made the meaning of the longer word easy to remember.