Obamaweek: You know who’d make a great Pope?

posted at 11:00 am on July 12, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

It seems as Barack Obama’s polling numbers increasingly come down to Earth, his media apologists get more desperate to hail him as the secular Messiah.  Perhaps no effort gets quite so embarrassingly sycophantic as Newsweek’s decision to print this mash note from Kathleen Kennedy Townsend on the occasion of Obama’s first visit with Pope Benedict XVI at the Vatican this week.  Townsend argues that Obama is literally more Catholic than the Pope.  Here are Newsweek’s alpha and omega:

In truth, though, Obama’s pragmatic approach to divisive policy (his notion that we should acknowledge the good faith underlying opposing viewpoints) and his social-justice agenda reflect the views of American Catholic laity much more closely than those vocal bishops and pro-life activists. When Obama meets the pope tomorrow, they’ll politely disagree about reproductive freedoms and homosexuality, but Catholics back home won’t care, because they know Obama’s on their side. In fact, Obama’s agenda is closer to their views than even the pope’s. …

Notre Dame awarded the president an honorary degree because it saw the need to highlight the best of Catholic teaching as applied to politics: the ability to open the eyes of those who would prefer to keep them closed, and to open the hearts of those who would prefer not to know the pain that their actions cause. The pope has a lot to learn about Catholic politics in America. Barack Obama can teach him.

In between these two paragraphs, Townsend fills the pages with the usual liberal complaints about the church, including gay rights, abortion, and — this is the best part — a complaint that the church hierarchy doesn’t listen to the congregations and change religious doctrine to match public opinion.  She lauds Obama for his ability to “listen” to other points of view, apparently missing the months-long repetition that no one had an alternative to Porkulus when Republicans and Democrats both tried to get votes for smaller and more intelligently-crafted alternatives.

Townsend makes the same mistake about religion that many other Catholics (and not just Catholics) make about it.  A church isn’t a democracy, nor is it a nation.  The Catholic Church serves what its sees as eternal truths about God, Jesus Christ, and the world, and invites those who believe similarly to join.  No one is forced to remain a Catholic anywhere in the world, nor are Lutherans, Episcopalians, and so on.  Certainly one can disagree on policy and practices, as many Catholics do, but on doctrine, the church does not take polls.

Thus, one can agree on the doctrine of social justice but disagree on the best policies to achieve it.  One can agree on the dignity of human life and still disagree on issues like incarceration, executions (which, contrary to popular belief, is not proscribed by Catholic doctrine), charity for the poor, and the economic policies of free nations.  But someone who believes that infants born during botched abortions should not be protected by a law requiring the abortionists to seek independent medical help for them is acting contrary to Catholic doctrine, which is and should be immutable.

At least Obama doesn’t claim to be Catholic, even if Townsend thinks he’s more Catholic than Benedict.  Townsend wants a church that bends to the will of the mob, which isn’t a church at all but a social club or a political party.  Let Obama remain the head of his political party, and perhaps Catholics like Townsend should pay more attention to the church’s teachings — or find a social club to join instead.


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Kathleen Kennedy Townsend’s piece is rabid-left propaganda presented as reporting.
P A T H E T I C !

jgapinoy on July 12, 2009 at 11:03 AM

Townsend just reinforces that liberalism is a progressive mental disorder. His new messiah is suffering with the same affliction.

volsense on July 12, 2009 at 11:04 AM

The line I like? “The Pope has a lot to learn about American Catholic politics.”

Wow…Don’t these writers blush when penning some of this junk?

AnninCA on July 12, 2009 at 11:05 AM

CINO

Immolate on July 12, 2009 at 11:06 AM

Why would he want to be pope?
BHO is much more powerful than the pope.

jgapinoy on July 12, 2009 at 11:06 AM

Let her leave Holy Mother Church and establish her own Church of Obama. She can establish him as head of the church (like Church of England has the monarch). She could even set herself up as a Cardinal or Bishop or some such like a lot of the characters who run the break-away protestant denominations do. Be sure, Katy, to wear the clerical collar (Madalyn Murray O’Hare did at times).

Dan. on July 12, 2009 at 11:08 AM

In his speech yesterday in Ghana, in front of the slave port church-B.O. got to apologize for the Catholic Church as well as his Country. Banner day for him!

ndulik on July 12, 2009 at 11:10 AM

When will this affliction called the Kennedy family be lifted from America’s shoulders? I really can’t decide any more which one of them disgusts me the most.

GISAP on July 12, 2009 at 11:12 AM

A Kennedy lecturing anyone on what direction the Catholic Church should take is about as silly as Jeffrey Dahmer selling DVD’s containing healthy diet advice. Let me guess, does this Kennedy nitwit believe it isn’t a sin to murder a young woman by drowning?

David in ATL on July 12, 2009 at 11:12 AM

Not suprising that a standard Kennedy (Catholic Due to Birth Only) would say “The pope has a lot to learn about Catholic politics in America.”

It appears that she has a lot to learn about Catholic religion

katiejane on July 12, 2009 at 11:13 AM

the Kennedys would like some acknowledgment that they are the Catholic Hierarchy in the US and that as such they don’t need some foreigner in Rome telling US Catholics what to do. Kennedy-Townsend should soon be busy organizing pilgrimages to Cape Cod to put Morning After Pills, Condoms and such at the Shrine of Our Lady of Hyannis Port. I think I’m seeing what’s at work on this Kennedy Curse stuff, the whole damn clan sold their soul to old Scratch for gold and power and buck teeth.

JohnBissell on July 12, 2009 at 11:13 AM

I couldn’t get past the title when I saw it on Drudge this am….

cmsinaz on July 12, 2009 at 11:13 AM

I hate that phrase

social justice

what the hell is that

redistribution
me paying for Jenny and Ladijons abortions
having my kidney taken and given to an illegal?

blatantblue on July 12, 2009 at 11:14 AM

Y’all don’t get it. If Barry is Pope he can call home the ‘Crusaders’. Peace in our whine.

Limerick on July 12, 2009 at 11:15 AM

Obama threatens to start his own church if Pope doesn’t give him annulment to marry Brazilian soul mate.

JiangxiDad on July 12, 2009 at 11:16 AM

An embarrassing piece, or it would be if Townsend or her editors had any shame.

Does explain the mindset of American Catholics (including some I know) who voted for Obama.

cs89 on July 12, 2009 at 11:16 AM

“…The pope has a lot to learn about Catholic politics in America. Barack Obama can teach him.”

Don’t they have editors at Newsweek to prune out embarrassing sentences like this?

No wonder their circulation can be measured in the hundreds.

cruadin on July 12, 2009 at 11:17 AM

Obama would have said much smarter things from upon the Cross than Jesus did, too.

profitsbeard on July 12, 2009 at 11:19 AM

The wrongness is so complete, I don’t know where to begin in taking it apart.
I would suggest calling in an air strike and flattening it from a safe distance.

Count to 10 on July 12, 2009 at 11:19 AM

Errrrr – why would anyone take any piece of advice from KAthleen KENNEDY Townsend?

She Nevah won a election on her own.

She lost to a Republican when she ran for Governor in MARYLAND.

As Lt Gov she did nothing and proceeded to completely ruin the juvenile justice system in Maryland.

Her husband is a typical Kennedy family alcoholic whose numerous drunken episodes were an embarrassment to the state.

Yes Newsweek, she qualifies as a political consultant.

iam7545 on July 12, 2009 at 11:19 AM

Notre Dame awarded the president an honorary degree because it saw the need to highlight the best of Catholic teaching as applied to politics:

_________________

poppycock!

cmsinaz on July 12, 2009 at 11:22 AM

Obama would have said much smarter things from upon the Cross than Jesus did, too.

profitsbeard on July 12, 2009 at 11:19 AM

God, why have I forsaken me?

fogw on July 12, 2009 at 11:23 AM

Comedy at its finest.

It was supposed to be funny, right?

Daggett on July 12, 2009 at 11:23 AM

What did you expect from a limousine liberal like Kathleen KENNEDY Townsend? Were it not for the MIDDLE NAME, would anyone have ever heard of her, or published her drivel?

GarandFan on July 12, 2009 at 11:24 AM

Note to Kathleen Kennedy Townsend:

Kathy, honey, the line for Complimentary Ambassadorships forms to the rear. Wait your turn.

uncivilized on July 12, 2009 at 11:26 AM

barack obama can teach him????? i am literally vomiting at that sentence.

Ghoul aid on July 12, 2009 at 11:27 AM

I’m waiting for, “That’s not the Pope I used to know”.

ccbokc on July 12, 2009 at 11:28 AM

Obama is Chauncey Gardner.

We are living the sequel to Jerzy Kozinski’s Being There.

Does any distributor have the stones to re-release the movie starring Peter Sellars, you know, to catch the youngsters up with what’s going on?

jeff_from_mpls on July 12, 2009 at 11:28 AM

Libs just cannot understand that some things are static, not subject to revision, not negotiable, not rewritten to satisfy the latest whims of the masses.

The Bible. The Declaration of Independence.

Mew

acat on July 12, 2009 at 11:30 AM

Id think hed make a great Imam

William Amos on July 12, 2009 at 11:30 AM

I’m not even all that religious and I was feeling slighted. I wonder what Townsend would say if the Catholic congregations decided that instead of some social justice pap, they would rather have a devoutly religious community instead with all that could entail?

She probably attends a church where the priest is driving around in a Cadillac and living in a 10,000 square foot home, telling elitists like the Kennedy’s that whatever they want to do is condoned by the church.

Bishop on July 12, 2009 at 11:30 AM

jeff_from_mpls on July 12, 2009 at 11:28 AM

Twin bill it with ‘The Magic Christian’ and I’ll buy tickets.

Limerick on July 12, 2009 at 11:30 AM

Upon whose imprimatur does the Catholic Curch abide, that of the Pope or that of Obama?

fourdeucer on July 12, 2009 at 11:36 AM

Townsend argues that Obama is literally more Catholic than the Pope.

Good show, Kathy. That was a stunning display of ignorance (and sycophantism).

petefrt on July 12, 2009 at 11:36 AM

Been awhile since I read the book. Did Dante have a circle in hell particularly for Kennedys?

JiangxiDad on July 12, 2009 at 11:36 AM

I wish I had a subscription to Newsweek just so I could cancel it over this drive.

PatMac on July 12, 2009 at 11:36 AM

Words fail me!

katy the mean old lady on July 12, 2009 at 11:37 AM

Since Newsweek’s Evan Thomas recently declared Obama to be God, wouldn’t being Pope be a major step down for Barry?

AZCoyote on July 12, 2009 at 11:38 AM

Townsend wants a church that bends to the will of the mob, which isn’t a church at all but a social club or a political party. Let Obama remain the head of his political party, and perhaps Catholics like Townsend should pay more attention to the church’s teachings — or find a social club to join instead.

Amen

DFCtomm on July 12, 2009 at 11:38 AM

From here on out newsweek will only be used by me as (1) a poor substitute for toilet paper or (2) to line my chicken roost.

I still don’t understand how any Catholic or Christain could vote for obama. He went WAY BEYOND abortion with his advocacy of the practice of leaving newborn babies to die of dehyrdation, exposure and starvation. If I let a freaking trapped skunk die that way, the SPCA would be filing charges against me faster than you can say “jugears let babies die”

My son and I had the good fortune to be present at the Papal Address a couple of weeks ago. We were the in the second row as Pope Benedict drove by through the crowd. In terms of leadership and morality, comparing obozo to the pope is like comparing a McDonalds to the Great Pyramids (lousy analogy I know).

As far as the “Obama is more Catholic than the Pope” crap, that reminds me of some people who claim, when their dog is lapping toilet water, that the water in the bowl is cleaner than tap water.

I guess the Rum Runner, gangster, mentality and morality of old Joe Kennedy has seeped through to his offspring.

bullseye on July 12, 2009 at 11:40 AM

Obama was in Russia so I think its fair to say he would make a better communist than Putin.

William Amos on July 12, 2009 at 11:41 AM

Maybe the Swiss Guards will …. oh never mind..

bullseye on July 12, 2009 at 11:42 AM

Maybe the thinking is that if Bill Clinton can be the first black President, Obama can be the first non-Catholic Pope.

NCC on July 12, 2009 at 11:43 AM

Obama was in Russia so I think its fair to say he would make a better communist than Putin.

William Amos on July 12, 2009 at 11:41 AM

Thanks — I don’t laugh much any more and a lot of it is gallows humor. Anyway, yours is one of the best comments I’ve seen in a while. hope you don’t mind me passing it around.

bullseye on July 12, 2009 at 11:44 AM

Obama was in Russia so I think its fair to say he would make a better communist than Putin.

William Amos on July 12, 2009 at 11:41 AM

He didn’t have to go to Russia for me to think that.

thomasaur on July 12, 2009 at 11:48 AM

I’m sure Obama is wondering how he can get his fingers into the Catholic collection baskets. All in the name of economic justice, of course.

davecatbone on July 12, 2009 at 11:49 AM

A couple of months ago Rob Long wrote a parody of a Newsweek interview with Obama and his wife.

This Kennedy Townsend article on Catholocism takes Long’s parody and runs with it.

myrenovations on July 12, 2009 at 11:52 AM

I still don’t understand how any Catholic or Christain could vote for obama.
bullseye on July 12, 2009 at 11:40 AM

It is the Pelosi’s Kerry’s Kennedy’s and Father Phleigers of the world that undermine and add legitamacy to the wayward Catholics. We are fortunate that Christ is the merciful One.

fourdeucer on July 12, 2009 at 11:53 AM

Certainly one can disagree on policy and practices, as many Catholics do, but on doctrine, the church does not take polls.

And that is exactly what the left hates about it!

conservnut on July 12, 2009 at 11:59 AM

Folks… its even simpler…

Kathy believes what Obama believes, but does NOT have the Cajones to leave the church…

Thus, the Church must change… after all, she is a Kennedy.

Romeo13 on July 12, 2009 at 11:59 AM

You know. For people who claim to be “anti-dogmatic” this article is awfully dogmatic.

I think the author of this article looks at her religion as a moral code and not the worship of the one true God. It’s sad.

brotherbell on July 12, 2009 at 12:00 PM

As an American Catholic, I have one idea as to which leader represents Caesar and who represents God. Ms. Kennedy Townsend has another.

As for the truth of things, Mr. Obama was instructed by Benedict, not the other way around. We shall see whether that instruction “took” — it obviously didn’t in the case of Kennedy Townsend.

I’m amused that a Kennedy would deign to instruct on the nature of Catholicism (whose truths are universal, not American as our “instructor” seems to think).

unclesmrgol on July 12, 2009 at 12:11 PM

Faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive, able to leap tall buildings in a single bound, and now, more Catholic than the Pope.

What did America ever do to deserve The One?

Seriously.

Cicero43 on July 12, 2009 at 12:12 PM

The pope has a lot to learn about Catholic politics in America. Barack Obama can teach him.

This is, without question, the single most inane, most idiotic, most narcissistic, most intelligence-insulting, most desperately grasping at straws while uttering the last gasp statement ever penned by a supposed seasoned journalist. If I were a Catholic, I would be in an absolute pure rage by this time, while flooding Newsweek with letters demanding this idiot Kathleen Kennedy Townsend resign immediately or be fired without the right to an appeal.

Is it any wonder that Newsweek’s subscription rate has plunged to the level that makes one wonder if the magazine is now committing an environmental crime by wasting trees to get the paper to publish their buffoonish bilge?

pilamaye on July 12, 2009 at 12:14 PM

Only God can change Catholic doctrine, but as Dear Leader is The Messiah, He can change Catholic doctrine.

rbj on July 12, 2009 at 12:15 PM

Damn good post.

Gaunilon on July 12, 2009 at 12:15 PM

JiangxiDad on July 12, 2009 at 11:36 AM

Yes he did, just didn’t call the Kennedys by name.

catlady on July 12, 2009 at 12:21 PM

This article deserves every negative adjective in the dictionary, however, I want these fools to keep on writing this garbage. Fashioning this president into a higher being with superior powers unknown and never ever witnessed by mankind is a surefire guarantee that the public will try to bring him down several notches. Our society hates those that elevate themselves and if these writers can contribute to the growing dissatisfaction and ultimate demise of the freak-in-chief, I say keep typing.

sherry on July 12, 2009 at 12:21 PM

davecatbone on July 12, 2009 at 11:49 AM

Dunno if he has thought of it or can pull it off, but revoking tax-exempt status for churches would be the most direct route. Churches have at least billions of dollars worth of tax-free property.

cs89 on July 12, 2009 at 12:25 PM

What did America ever do to deserve The One?

Seriously.

Cicero43 on July 12, 2009 at 12:12 PM

We stopped educating our citizenry.

myrenovations on July 12, 2009 at 12:26 PM

This article sounds the most fundamental flaw in progessivism. They are constantly changing their moral compass to vindicate what ever idea is currently is in vogue. They do not recogize that there are certain moral, ethical and religious truths that have stood the test of time and are immutable.

The sad fact is that this government will be gone in a hundred years whatever it does to our nation, but the truths that God has given us stand the test of time. They will still be there.

catlady on July 12, 2009 at 12:27 PM

We stopped educating our citizenry.

myrenovations on July 12, 2009 at 12:26 PM

We got lazy about the education our citzenry was receiving.

catlady on July 12, 2009 at 12:28 PM

Townsend wants a church that bends to the will of the mob,

Townsend and her ilk would also like a Constitution that lives and breathes to the ever changing will of the masses. Of course by masses they mean liberals/progressives.

Like all in her clan, changing the rules when they need to protect their own law breaking and fortunes.

larvcom on July 12, 2009 at 12:32 PM

Obama would have said much smarter things from upon the Cross than Jesus did, too.
profitsbeard on July 12, 2009 at 11:19 AM

… before uttering a word, the silence was broken by the electro-mechanical whirl as two teleprompters ascended to their pre-ordained position.

ReagansRight on July 12, 2009 at 12:34 PM

This article sounds the most fundamental flaw in progressivism. They are constantly changing their moral compass to vindicate what ever idea is currently is in vogue. They do not recognize that there are certain moral, ethical and religious truths that have stood the test of time and are immutable

Can you imagine what would have happened if sea mariners hadn’t a fixed star in the sky in which to steer by?
This is the very point bu which the progressives want to take us…..into a universe where basics natural laws are forever changing.

larvcom on July 12, 2009 at 12:37 PM

Ill go along. “O” Dumbo is a good pile of poop.

Rick007 on July 12, 2009 at 12:45 PM

If Kennedys ran Catholicism, baptism would require an Oldsmobile.

Cicero43 on July 12, 2009 at 12:51 PM

Pope Obama the first has a nice ring to it.

thmcbb on July 12, 2009 at 12:52 PM

Why would Obama want to be Pope ? Isnt that a step down from Messiah ?

William Amos on July 12, 2009 at 12:57 PM

I just got back from Mass, and in reading this, my head just exploded. Now I leave it to my animated torso to finish this post….

Seriously, WTF? Two hours ago, we renewed our faith in a baptism at Mass, and nowhere do I remember saying anything close to “Do you believe in the Holy Catholic Church, the Holy Catholic Gallup Polling agency, the Global Catholic Social Consensus on Church Beliefs, and the SEIU?”

(The last bit there is a funny! Funny torso, ha ha!)

The Vatican II Church certainly involves the laity more, but the laity do not make Church policy. They fulfill Jesus’ work on Earth. By the way, I don’t recall Jesus saying, “It’s ok to kill little babies so long as you spend a few weekends at Habitat for Humanity.”

Nethicus on July 12, 2009 at 12:58 PM

I find it amusing that the author of the Newsweek article praises BO for “his notion that we should acknowledge the good faith underlying opposing viewpoints.”

In his public comments, he constantly demonizes and misrepresents the vies of his opponents. He just want them to acknowledge HIS good faith while he acts in bad faith.

OBQuiet on July 12, 2009 at 1:06 PM

The Pope is one who supports charity, is humble, and is concerned about the plight of the poor and supports life.

To date Obama has targeted the Catholic Church by reducing the amount given to charities by those who make over $250,000 per year. If there is any evidence of Obama being humble, somebody needs to find it, and make him watch it! Being humble for Obama is like garlic to Dracula. The plight of the poor is not a big deal to Obama because he removed of taxable deductions in giving to charities, and he is destroying the economy, therefore producing devastating impacts on many a charity. He is also adding to the number of the poor by that 9.5% and rising unemployment rate. All of this overlooked by Townsend.

But the most glaring aspect of asserting Obama would be a good Pope, or even remotely Catholic like is his stance on Infanticide, and his signing back into action the United States paying for abortions worldwide. The country was facing tremendous financial troubles in every arena, and Obama, upon being inaugurated, he promptly signs an Executive Order regarding the funding of abortion? Somehow I do NOT see the Pope focusing in on denying life as a priority if HE was PRESIDENT.

I strongly urge many of you to go review the speech Obama gave in Ghana after visiting Cape Coast Castle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmwUzQ7g2I8

Pay attention to how he immediately links Buchenwald to the the church above the slave room. What sort of ideology is at play here? That is some transition there. To me he tried to suggest that the Church as a whole ignored the evils of slavery, and to date is still supporting slavery. Guess he never reflected back on “history”, and ever noticed the works of William Wilberforce. I also wonder if anyone else thought these comments were odd considering he had just not 24 hours past met the Pope? I mean there seemed to be a resurrecting of sorts of the angst between Jews, and Catholics over whether, or not Catholics did enough to help Jews during WWII. He kept pounding the historical drum, but it sounded more like a history one Reverend Wright spoke of regarding slavery, and not an American history who tried to make things right, and has since the days of the Civil War strived to protect liberty for all men and women. Hello Bosnia, Iraq, Afghanistan, former Soviet block countries, etc. Was he not just in Russia? You know Cold War and all that? Oh right, he does not think America played the largest role in bringing down the U.S.S.R.! Man I have got to quit reading any “history” books!

But I forgot we now support dictators like Chavez, Zelaya, Putin, Mahmoud, and the Castro brothers. How silly of me! My how our history has changed! We go from supporting the Pope in protecting life, to destroying it, and from trying to be better Christians in caring for the least of these, to being robbed at gunpoint by the federal government therefore limiting our abilities to care for our own much less the poor.

Townsend and Newsweek, along with the media as a whole, had better watch their dances with the Devil. There is a commandment in “The Ten Commandments” which indicates there should be no other gods before God. Deifying Obama is indeed worthy of a ring of Hell in Dante’s “Inferno”, and also God’s literal Hell.

freeus on July 12, 2009 at 1:09 PM

Just Pope? Come on lady, we all know you think Obama’s more in line with the Big Guy Himself.

Grayson on July 12, 2009 at 1:20 PM

If Kennedys ran Catholicism, baptism would require an Oldsmobile.

Cicero43 on July 12, 2009 at 12:51 PM

LOL..I bet less that 20% got that one the first time they read it..LOL..excellent!

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 1:29 PM

I’m not a Catholic so I’m having a hard time deciding whether to find this comical or offensive. The Drive-Bys have gone from ‘Bush Derangement’ to ‘Obama Derangement’ pretty quickly.

MrBrowncoat on July 12, 2009 at 1:33 PM

I don’t blame this liberal writer at all for an article like this. After all liberalism is HER theology.
I blame the Pope & the Catholic Church for this article.
If they excommunicated the Kennedys along with any other pro-abortion Catholic decades ago, and reigned in 50 years of liberal priests spouting their social justice crap, there wouldn’t be a pro baby killing writing an ignorant article like this, and the Catholic Church would of been in better shape today.

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 1:33 PM

executions (which, contrary to popular belief, is not proscribed by Catholic doctrine)

But is sure as hell ain’t forbidden.

darii on July 12, 2009 at 1:35 PM

Oh, Townsend, Kennedy-Townsend, Caroline, or whatever?….. I take my Catholic dogma from the Magesterium, The Catechism and the Bible, not you or any leftist American priest. Ahhhhh I feel so much better.

MNDavenotPC on July 12, 2009 at 1:39 PM

Since Newsweek’s Evan Thomas recently declared Obama to be God, wouldn’t being Pope be a major step down for Barry?

AZCoyote on July 12, 2009 at 11:38 AM

LOL….no, part of that Messiah complex, “Perfect God Perfect Man”. Seems they do understand a little bit of catholic doctrine.

I just see false prophet.

Fighton03 on July 12, 2009 at 1:39 PM

Townsend is the product of Liberal indoctrination. The exposure of this guff in her life greatly outweighed her religious instruction. The libs control the framing of young minds from kindergarten through, to PhD degrees, in public and private schools.

ericdijon on July 12, 2009 at 1:45 PM

“I am ONE™ I transcend sainthood…and stuff.”

PC14 on July 12, 2009 at 1:46 PM

Oh, Townsend, Kennedy-Townsend, Caroline, or whatever?….. I take my Catholic dogma from the Magesterium, The Catechism and the Bible, not you or any leftist American priest. Ahhhhh I feel so much better.

MNDavenotPC on July 12, 2009 at 1:39 PM

You’d probably get better religious advice from Pete Townsend.

James on July 12, 2009 at 1:49 PM

If Kennedys ran Catholicism, baptism would require an Oldsmobile.

Cicero43 on July 12, 2009 at 12:51 PM

+1000

unclesmrgol on July 12, 2009 at 1:49 PM

If the Catholic Church ex-communicated all the pro-abortion Catholics, what would happen to their numbers and their collections?

Are you sure she even made her “First Communion” or was she just baptized Catholic as a baby?

TruthToBeTold on July 12, 2009 at 1:54 PM

If the Catholic Church ex-communicated all the pro-abortion Catholics, what would happen to their numbers and their collections?

Are you sure she even made her “First Communion” or was she just baptized Catholic as a baby?

TruthToBeTold on July 12, 2009 at 1:54 PM

Perhaps not. I wonder how many Catholics have left the church do to it’s decided “left turn” starting almost 50 years ago.

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 1:57 PM

By the way, I don’t recall Jesus saying, “It’s ok to kill little babies so long as you spend a few weekends at Habitat for Humanity.”

Nethicus on July 12, 2009 at 12:58 PM

This is the belief of every liberal Catholic, that it doesn’t matter how one behaves, or what one supports as long as one is a “good person”. They do not even think they need to ask for forgiveness for their sins as they seem to think that their desire for social justice is enough to gain them eternal glory.

The true irony here is that since Martin Luther, Catholics have been accused of believing they earn their way into heaven. True Catholicism does not teach this but then, liberal Catholics know nothing about truth or Catholicism.

Jvette on July 12, 2009 at 2:03 PM

One can agree on the dignity of human life and still disagree on issues like incarceration, executions (which, contrary to popular belief, is not proscribed by Catholic doctrine)

If not, the Church is a hair’s breadth away, here in America where people do not customarily break out of “death row”. Both incarceration and capital punishment are covered here. Since capital punishment, not incarceration, is the nit which separates most Catholics, including Ed and myself, it’s best to review the words of the the Catechism themselves:

2267 The traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude, presupposing full ascertainment of the identity and responsibility of the offender, recourse to the death penalty, when this is the only practicable way to defend the lives of human beings effectively against the aggressor.

If, instead, bloodless means are sufficient to defend against the aggressor and to protect the safety of persons, public authority should limit itself to such means, because they better correspond to the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.

Today, in fact, given the means at the State’s disposal to effectively repress crime by rendering inoffensive the one who has committed it, without depriving him definitively of the possibility of redeeming himself, cases of absolute necessity for suppression of the offender today are very rare, if not practically non-existent.

The Church’s meaning is obvious — capital punishment is unacceptable except when it is the only way to protect innocents. As is pointed out, once the aggressor is in prison and incapable of further aggression, capital punishment is unnecessary and counter to Church teaching. Such is also the concept behind legitimate defense:

2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for someone responsible for another’s life. Preserving the common good requires rendering the unjust aggressor unable to inflict harm. To this end, those holding legitimate authority have the right to repel by armed force aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their charge.

unclesmrgol on July 12, 2009 at 2:04 PM

Why bother debating executions. It does nothing but get away from the main argument that abortion is killing INNOCENT life. There’s NO question of innocence in these cases.

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 2:09 PM

Yes, Obama wants to reduce abortions…by throwing contraceptives and Plan B at our kids! That is his idea of human freedom and dignity, a far cry from our authentic dignity that the Pope sees in us.

Irenaeus on July 12, 2009 at 2:10 PM

While there still is a small percentage of “old school” Catholics, most of what’s left and dying off and what’s become the norm is the “social justice”commie Catholics that hug their baby killing DEM buddies.

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 2:16 PM

and=are

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 2:16 PM

Townsend doesn’t even attempt an original thought, much less a persuasive argument for herself, nor does she have to in order to get published. Her sole claim to fame is that she is a Kennedy. That is all she brings to the table. That is all her adherents need to flock to her.

manwithblackhat on July 12, 2009 at 2:18 PM

I hate that phrase

social justice

what the hell is that

redistribution

Exactly. I don’t understand how the Catholic Church can support ‘redistribution of wealth’ when clearly one of the main commandments is ‘THOU SHALT NOT STEAL’. Basically, ‘social justice’ or ‘redistribution of wealth’ is STEALING from rich people to give it to poor people. . . or a SIN.

And what I don’t understand too is why money (other people’s money) is so important to the Church. I’ve known some pretty miserable rich people, and I’ve known poor people who were so happy that they didn’t know they were poor.

Somehow we are to believe that Catholics are taking a moral high ground to STEAL money from one group to give to another group. . . as though that has anything at all to do with salvation.

ThackerAgency on July 12, 2009 at 2:20 PM

Kathleen who? No worries. The media in general will be remembered for falling all over themselves over who is fast becoming the most foolish man ever to occupy the White House. One can only hope that when he falls, (and he’s going to fall) he hasn’t taken the whole country down with him.

scalleywag on July 12, 2009 at 2:26 PM

The Catholic Church has become the “oppressed poor” now due to it’s many court decreed and under the table lawsuit payoffs
due to it’s 40 year policy of rotating pedophiles throughout the world.

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 2:28 PM

Obamaweek

-
nuf said…

RalphyBoy on July 12, 2009 at 2:32 PM

ThackerAgency on July 12, 2009 at 2:20 PM

As usual, you have it all wrong. The Church absolutely does not teach redistribution or the stealing from one to give to another. It is too complex to go into detail here but the upshot is this,

As an employer, one should give a fair wage in safe working conditions.

As an employee, one should give a fair effort in return for a fair wage.

As an individual, one should give voluntarily so that those who cannot provide the basic necessities of life for themselves are cared for.

Catholics who espouse using the government to “steal” through taxation with the intent to redistribute to others as a form of social justice are not practicing true Catholic doctrine.

Like many non-Catholics and too many CINO’s to count, you misrepresent Church teachings.

Jvette on July 12, 2009 at 2:32 PM

Perhaps not. I wonder how many Catholics have left the church do (sic) to it’s (sic) decided “left turn” starting almost 50 years ago.

Jeff from WI on July 12, 2009 at 1:57 PM

Due, Jeff, due.

From age to age You gather a people to Yourself, so that from east to west a perfect offering may be made to the glory of Your name…

You chose to leave, Jeff, but some of us chose otherwise — to stay with a Church which we think endeavors to remain true to the teachings of Jesus, whether these fall to the right or to the left in our fractured American political spectrum. I see 40 new adult Catholics baptised every Easter at our 11AM Mass — and about another 20 who are confirmed but not baptised (because the Church recognizes all Christian baptisms as valid). The numbers in the Church seem to be more than holding their own in this section of town.

As a condition of my staying, I try mightily to listen to the homily, to read the Bible, the Catechism, and any other theological works which can illuminate the will of God.

What Kennedy Townsend did was not a shift to the left — it is total stupidity, whereby she takes Caesar to be the God of her own personal subset of the Body. To attach that stupidity to the rest of us is disingenuous of you.

unclesmrgol on July 12, 2009 at 2:33 PM

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