9th Circuit: pharmacists must dispense morning-after pill
posted at 10:15 am on July 11, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
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The most overturned appellate court has teed up another case for the Supreme Court to consider — and likely soon. The 9th Circuit overturned an injunction in a district court case, allowing the state of Washington to force a pharmacy to stock and dispense morning-after pills, which causes the abortion of an embryo in the early days of a pregnancy. The pharmacy owners had objected, claiming that the law violated their religious practice:
Pharmacists are obliged to dispense the Plan B pill, even if they are personally opposed to the “morning after” contraceptive on religious grounds, a federal appeals court ruled Wednesday.
In a case that could affect policy across the western U.S., a supermarket pharmacy owner in Olympia, Wash., failed in a bid to block 2007 regulations that required all Washington pharmacies to stock and dispense the pills.
Family-owned Ralph’s Thriftway and two pharmacists employed elsewhere sued Washington state officials over the requirement. The plaintiffs asserted that their Christian beliefs prevented them from dispensing the pills, which can prevent implantation of a recently fertilized egg. They said that the new regulations would force them to choose between keeping their jobs and heeding their religious objections to a medication they regard as a form of abortion.
Ralph’s owners, Stormans Inc., and pharmacists Rhonda Mesler and Margo Thelen sought protection under the 1st Amendment right to free exercise of religion and won a temporary injunction from the U.S. District Court in Seattle pending trial on the constitutionality of the regulations. That order prevented state officials from penalizing pharmacists who refused to dispense Plan B as long as they referred consumers to a nearby pharmacy where it was available.
On Wednesday, a three-judge panel of the U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals lifted the injunction, saying the district court was wrong in issuing it based on an erroneous finding that the rules violated the free exercise of religion clause of the U.S. Constitution.
There have been two different issues in the legal fight over Plan B. In one group, pharmacists not working for themselves — for instance, at chain pharmacies — objected to dispensing the pill and wanted job protection despite their refusal. Those cases hardly stand up to scrutiny. The owner of the pharmacy has the right to decide on his own inventory and what to sell, and the employees of that pharmacy either should follow that policy or find a job somewhere else if it offends them. It falls into the same category as a cashier who refuses to handle meat at the checkout counter because he’s a vegetarian.
However, this is something else. The owners of the pharmacy do not want to stock the pills for their own reasons. Even apart from religious grounds, that still seems to be their decision in the marketplace. If they don’t want to sell aspirin, or Ginsu knives, or inflatable life vests for swimming pools, that should be their decision, too. If their customers object to their policies, they will find other pharmacies to patronize. The government has a public interest in telling retailers what they cannot sell for safety reasons (like dynamite, as an example), but should not force business owners to sell something they do not want to sell.
I’ll be interested in the appeal to this decision. I suspect we’ll get another 5-4 decision. I just hope that the decision will support the rights of business owners to determine for themselves the products and services they will offer.
Update: Gabriel Malor wants to emphasize that this ruling overturned the temporary injunction sought by the pharmacy, and is not a ruling on the case itself, which proceeds in district court. I believe the ruling can be appealed to attempt to reinstate the injunction, and I hope it is.
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I agree with what Glenn Reynolds once said about this topic: I’m perfectly willing to allow pharmacists choose what prescriptions they fill on grounds of personal morals, just as long as the pharmacists are willing to relinquish their legal monopoly on issuing prescriptions.
SWLiP on July 11, 2009 at 10:19 AM
Ninth
CircuitCircus.jgapinoy on July 11, 2009 at 10:20 AM
Since when did the governemnt care about what it shoudn’t be meddling with? Not since the 1930’s at least
OBQuiet on July 11, 2009 at 10:21 AM
time for a little civil disobedience!
BobH on July 11, 2009 at 10:22 AM
What was the purpose of tying the two kinds of cases together, the phramacists and the pharmacy?
myrenovations on July 11, 2009 at 10:22 AM
Exactly. I am constantly amazed at how far the government oversteps it bounds of the 10th Amendment.
Guardian on July 11, 2009 at 10:23 AM
I’m going to remind people to keep comments on topic, or they will get deleted and the user banned. Anyone who wants to contact me on other topics can use the tips e-mail.
Ed Morrissey on July 11, 2009 at 10:26 AM
Pharmacies cannot possibly stock every medicaton. They have to make decisions about what inventory they carry. Private businesses do this all the time, and this should be no different.
Who knows maybe we’re headed towards nationalizing pharmacies too – then the gov’t will really have control of our lives and health.
anne on July 11, 2009 at 10:28 AM
Think about this: What if they had been Muslim pharmacists that objected on religious grounds? Do you think they would’ve been ruled against?
rising21 on July 11, 2009 at 10:28 AM
It didn’t work out that well for eHarmony
p0s3r on July 11, 2009 at 10:29 AM
They can’t be compelled to sell any product they don’t want to. Will they next order convenience stores to sell cards and dice? Will they compel Kosher shops to sell pork?
dogsoldier on July 11, 2009 at 10:32 AM
athensboy on July 11, 2009 at 10:21 AM
Why don’t you build on Ed’s advice and just go away.
dmann on July 11, 2009 at 10:33 AM
Now picture Gov’t Health Care deciding what locals need to stocked with such “medicine”…
mjbrooks3 on July 11, 2009 at 10:36 AM
On more than one occasion, I have had to go to a second pharmacy to get a prescription filled because the first pharmacy either didn’t have it in stock or didn’t carry it at all. That happens frequently with locally owned pharmacies.
ladyingray on July 11, 2009 at 10:37 AM
I’m going to sure the next package store that doesn’t carry my brand of beer.
Mord on July 11, 2009 at 10:38 AM
Unenforceable.
“Sorry, we’re out of stock. I just sold the last box 10 min. ago.”
Techie on July 11, 2009 at 10:40 AM
The 9th Circus is all about the nanny state. You’d think those justices would have flat heads by now, given the number of times SCOTUS has walked over them. Yep another 5-4 decision coming up.
GarandFan on July 11, 2009 at 10:41 AM
I had made a bet that within one year of Obama’s election we’d have Sharia law.
I won.
Forced religion of Planned Parenthood.
jeff_from_mpls on July 11, 2009 at 10:42 AM
Though I’m anti-abortion I don’t have a problem with the morning after pill-provided it’s only used “the morning after”.
I don’t put that into the same category as abortion.
annoyinglittletwerp on July 11, 2009 at 10:44 AM
When will everyone learn that the government knows best?
DO NOT QUESTION AUTHORITY!
jukin on July 11, 2009 at 10:45 AM
Because, as we all have been taught, abortion is a right which was written into the Constitution by the Framers as the very first amendment. But not freedom of religion. The Framers were opposed to such hate speech.
Loxodonta on July 11, 2009 at 10:46 AM
Weeeellllll, that’s completely different, muslims get violent.
jukin on July 11, 2009 at 10:47 AM
So, should I be able to sue Wal-Mart for not carrying lumber or shingles in their inventory? Should I be able to sue coffee shop owners for not carrying decaffeinated coffee?
This is not a single event though, but rather a portion of the systematic effort to undermine the Christian influence in this country.
Send_Me on July 11, 2009 at 10:49 AM
My company doesn’t supply condoms, 5.56 ammo, or adult-only XXX internet access. I need a lawyer. Call me at 1-888-Vic-tims.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 10:51 AM
I agree!
Should a law be enacted, would the pharmacist be prosecuted should he be out of supply when a customer asks for a product?
maverick muse on July 11, 2009 at 10:51 AM
Obey! You can dissent, but then you do not work.
Mr. Joe on July 11, 2009 at 10:53 AM
Similar to tax cheats getting positions in Gov’t. It undermines the rule of law. Previously law-abiding people will begin to see their gov’t in a new light, and decide to disobey the law without it causing an ethical or moral conflict. There’s always an unintended consequence when someone pushes too far. Ultimately, when the gov’t loses the trust of the people, it falls.
JiangxiDad on July 11, 2009 at 10:53 AM
Obama administration + 9th Circuit = hell
maverick muse on July 11, 2009 at 10:53 AM
I have a friend who just finished law school. She says the first rule of law is to never, ever cite a case from the 9th circuit.
sammypants on July 11, 2009 at 10:54 AM
= George III
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 10:55 AM
annoyinglittletwerp at 10:44AM
Obama doesn’t put post-birth “termination” in the same category as I put abortion and infanticide. In his mind it’s nothing significant. So should he be able to force someone to kill fully-born infants? Force EVERYONE to kill fully-born infants?
Actually it’s not so far-fetched. Ace’s place links to some disturbing info about Obama’s “Science Czar” at http://zombietime.com/john_holdren/
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 10:55 AM
Question Authority bumper stickers still on cars with Obama ‘08 stickers.
maverick muse on July 11, 2009 at 10:56 AM
I doubt it. But, if the pharmacy is out and has not re-ordered in a timely manner, no court will be fooled by it.
Blake on July 11, 2009 at 10:56 AM
Well, it’s not like this isn’t happening with medical service providers already, as opposed to medical suppliers and pharmacies.
“The American College of OB/GYN, however, threw down the gauntlet in November 2007 with its Ethics Statement No. 385, which defined any OB/GYN doctor who did not perform or refer for abortion as unethical. The American Board of OB/GYN quickly followed with a new requirement that an OB/GYN doctor had to agree with the ethics of the College to pass the OB/GYN boards.”
Send_Me on July 11, 2009 at 10:56 AM
Does the pharmacy sell any kind of contraceptive drugs or devices? I would think that if they didn’t they would have a case in refusing the morning after pill if they do maybe not so much.
Besides with the new order taking over businesses I suspect they have little choice as big brother continues to tighten his grip on our lives.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 10:57 AM
What? If you sell gun locks you should be required to sell ammo too?
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 10:58 AM
Religion on its own is rarely a good constitutional claim; there usually has to be some allegation of discriminatory targeting or some speech related issue. Offhand, this doesn’t sound like either of those scenarios.
The correct result is for the State to win, since it has a right to regulate pharmacies within its jurisdiction, regardless of the wisdom of the regulations. There are many valid to make arguments against these sorts of rules, but opponents should resent them at the policy level rather than hope for the Constitution to save them.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:00 AM
If I own a company, I should be able to decide what I am going to sell as well as who I sell too. I do not feel like a family owned pharmacy should be forced to sell anything that goes against their beliefs. I think the government should stay out of private business.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:00 AM
Abortion is a RIGHT defined by the court. Being able to obtain a 2×4 is not. There is a vast difference in deigning a person their rights under the law and deigning them a 2X4.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:01 AM
The word is “present”, not “resent”.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:02 AM
so, Muslim cab drivers can deny service to somebody who has alcohol on them… but a Christian pharmacist must give day after pills regardless of religious objection….. freedom of religion for some not for most….
constitution only applies to you if your , Gay, black, muslin, illegal alien or woman – or made a contribution to the DNC.
Donut on July 11, 2009 at 11:02 AM
I have a right to keep a bear arms. Black and white in the document. Show me the morning after pill script there.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:03 AM
Their is a difference between selling condoms (which prevents conception) and selling a morning after pill. Their is absolutely no moral equivalence.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:03 AM
argh its You’re …. lazy internet typing
Donut on July 11, 2009 at 11:03 AM
What?
I have lots of gun locks and not a single one requires a bullet to work. Now if you had said, “What? If you sell guns you should be required to sell ammo too?”, I may have taken you a little more seriously.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:03 AM
jmarcure at 11:01AM
No, the right to CHOOSE abortion is declared by the court. The right to force someone else to sell an abortion is not declared.
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:04 AM
An absolutely correct statement, since the COURT rather than the Constitution that created the nationwide abortion “right”.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:04 AM
No you equated condoms with pills that kill.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:05 AM
They are not forcing them to sell the drug. What they are saying is that they will yank their licenses if they don’t sell the drug. Since, you need only a business license to sell lumber or other goods, there is no analogy.
Blake on July 11, 2009 at 11:06 AM
Send_Me at 10:56
That’s where it’s really easy to see how dangerous all these czars are. In effect, they can say who can practice business and under what terms.
The mark of the beast – without it you can’t buy and sell. It’s what this administration is into, big time.
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:06 AM
I feel like the only instance where the morning after pill should be allowed is in the case of rape. It should be allowed in a hospital setting. This week they are talking about making Tylenol a prescription drug, but a 14 year-old girl can pick up Plan B in the pharmacy along with a candy bar and a Coke? That is crazy.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:07 AM
What? If you sell gun locks you should be required to sell ammo too?
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 10:58 AM
ha
maverick muse on July 11, 2009 at 11:07 AM
I can’t but then I’m not a judge that knows how to find rights between the lines. Besides, again you use a poor example because many judges will argue that you do not have a right to bear arms and it is black and white in the document.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:07 AM
Sounds fair to me.
ernesto on July 11, 2009 at 11:10 AM
The pills in question after “Emergency Contraceptives” not as abortion pills or killing pills.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:10 AM
Even if it the Second Amendment had not been written into the Constitution, the State has the proper authority to force licensed pharmacists to sell guns if it decided to do so, even if pharmacies were run by radical pacifists. Same goes for mandating that pharmacies sell abortion pills.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:10 AM
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:07 AM
I would think any judge who argues that we do not have the right to bear arms would need to be removed from the bench. I kind of thought the 2nd Amendment took care of that issue. A religious person should not be forced to dispense or a doctor to perform a procedure which is against their beliefs.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:11 AM
Conscientious objection has been recognized since the Roman Empire, it is a foundational part of our legal tradition. Nor has it been solely limited to the taking of human life or compulsory military service. At some point, government compulsion to do things that conflict with our consciences needs to end. This is not a private employer / employee relationship as mentioned by Ed above, this is government compulsion in conflict with your moral beliefs.
Next thing you know, the government will be telling people what kind of pictures they have to take.
http://www.volokh.com/posts/1208281708.shtml
instugator on July 11, 2009 at 11:12 AM
Judge? Since when do the Bill of Rights empower government?
The contract says A…the judge says B. The judge gets a deaf ear from me.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:12 AM
If there’s a conscience-clause, will it apply to taxpayers too?
JohnJ on July 11, 2009 at 11:13 AM
The Tenth Amendment reserves the power of the Stats to do so, however, since the Constitution doesn’t specifically address this issue.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:14 AM
Didn’t this very same court just find that it was a state right and not an individual? Besides, talking gun rights is off topic.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:14 AM
Actually, jmarcure, the Tenth Amendment says that if we can’t see a power written in black and white in the Constitution, then it’s none of the federal government’s business. That power belongs to the people or the states, if to anybody.
Where does it specifically say in the Constitution that the federal government can make laws about medicine? The states, yeah – where the people have more say in the matter. But the federal government – where does the Constitution give them that power?
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:15 AM
So you think a pregnant woman can walk into any doctor’s office and force the doctor to provide her with an abortion because abortion is her RIGHT?
A woman has a right to obtain an abortion from a doctor who is willing to perform an abortion. She has no “right” to an abortion from a doctor whose religious beliefs prohibit him or her from performing abortions.
The pharmacist in question did not deny any woman the right to use the abortion pill. The pharmacist simply declined to sell the pill. A woman who wants it is free to go elsewhere to purchase it.
Doctors, and pharmacists, have RIGHTS also.
AZCoyote on July 11, 2009 at 11:15 AM
The pills in question after “Emergency Contraceptives” not as abortion pills or killing pills.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:10 AM
That is liberal speak. A contraceptive prevents the fertilization of an egg. Plan B cause a miscarriage. There is an extreme difference between the two. Plan B will be used as a way for lazy or stupid people to avoid using proactive contraception. The more people avoiding the use of condoms will result in more std’s.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:15 AM
+1
sammypants on July 11, 2009 at 11:16 AM
Since liberal democrats and leftist declared that it is a living document and liberal leftist have declared “activist” judges that make law as good.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:16 AM
From the Tenth Amendment:
“The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people. “
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:16 AM
Enjoy your Strawberry Fields.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:17 AM
Courts do not define rights. The Constitution defines them.
Send_Me on July 11, 2009 at 11:17 AM
The same place it gives them the power to do 90% of the stuff not in black and white.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:18 AM
The pharmacist should simply find another line of work and stick to his religious principles.
AnninCA on July 11, 2009 at 11:18 AM
Again, no one is forcing anyone to sell anything. They are saying they will deny a license to the pharmacy and pharmacist that refuses to sell this drug. Yes, I know it accomplishes the same thing, however, it is an important distinction that blows most of the analogies people are using away.
Blake on July 11, 2009 at 11:18 AM
It is also used in rape in cases. Especially when a date rape drug was involved, and the victim doesn’t remember what happened. I’m not making a comment on Plan B, just saying there are other reasons to use the drug then “laziness.”
sammypants on July 11, 2009 at 11:19 AM
So should the Jewish shop owner who won’t sell pork sausage.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:20 AM
An argument can be made that a carefully worded federal statute related to medicine would be a valid under the Commerce Clause.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:20 AM
I’m sure that is a profound derogatory statement referring to my life views but I don’t have a clue what it means.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:22 AM
If they can legally force someone to sell it, it doesn’t seem like much of a jump to force people to take it:
Maybe this drug will satisfy the requirements for the fertility control program that Obama’s “science czar” John Holdren used to fantasize about:
http://zombietime.com/john_holdren/
Buddahpundit on July 11, 2009 at 11:23 AM
The pharmacist should simply find another line of work and stick to his religious principles.
AnninCA on July 11, 2009 at 11:18 AM
Where does the government get the right to tell me what I must sell in my business? If others have a lack of conscience that does not mean I should have to sell my soul and sell out my personal beliefs. Government should stay out of my home and business. Liberals have no right to send religious people down the same road to hell that they seem to prefer.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:23 AM
So should the Jewish shop owner who won’t sell pork sausage.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:20 AM
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:23 AM
NorthernCross at 11:14
The Fourteenth Amendment forbids the states from making or enforcing “any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States”.
State governments can’t make or enforce laws prohibiting the free exercise of religion.
What this really comes down to is government regulation on buying and selling. The pharmacists can’t be forced to break their religion; they could always quit their job. Are federal and state governments anywhere given the right to run somebody out of business?
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:24 AM
It is also used in rape in cases. Especially when a date rape drug was involved, and the victim doesn’t remember what happened. I’m not making a comment on Plan B, just saying there are other reasons to use the drug then “laziness.”
sammypants on July 11, 2009 at 11:19 AM
Read what I read earlier. I said the only instance it should be allowed is in the hospital setting in the case of rape.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:25 AM
NorthernCross at 11:20
Is there anything that WOULDN’T be Constitutional under the Commerce Clause?
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:25 AM
read = wrote
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:25 AM
Probably.
You just don’t get it. A judge forces you to sell your car because someone else needs it. A judge forces you to not speak because someone will get their feelings hurt. The gawddamned judge can just tell folks anything they want.
Limerick on July 11, 2009 at 11:26 AM
yeah, screw $150000 in student loans and 8 years of pharmacy school, just go work for the government! or get welfare!
How about the government stay the hell out of our business? and let the pharmacist sell what they want.
Donut on July 11, 2009 at 11:26 AM
Yeah…the Founders made adequate provision in the Constitution for the gubmint to decide what’s in the ‘public interest’.
Oh wait….no they didn’t…..have you ever read the damn document? I mean read, not just sounding out the words in a civics class….
No wonder America is sliding down the crapper…
LimeyGeek on July 11, 2009 at 11:27 AM
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:18 AM
LOL. Exactly. Where exactly is that found in black and white?
This nation is hopelessly in violation of everything the Constitution stood for and said.
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:27 AM
And where would that be? Justifying one wrong with another doesn’t make sense.
But then, I’d like to know, under any Constitution in this Union, where abortion is a right. Since when was it a right for someone to kill an unwanted child? Every pro-choice/pro-abortion argument that I’ve heard stems from one of four things: 1) dependency, 2) development, 3) location, and 4) self-awareness.
Dependency: Should a person have the choice to kill a 4-year-old or an insulin-dependent person?
Development: A 2-month-old is not as developed as an 8-year-old or a 15-year-old. Should we, therefore, have the option of terminating the life of the 2-month-old?
Location: Does a person’s value change from one location to the next? From the store to the car to the workplace? Why then would we apply this standard here?
Self-awareness: Do we value a 25-year-old moreover an 8-year-old because the older is more self-aware?
Send_Me on July 11, 2009 at 11:28 AM
Indeed. A disgusting usurpation of a poorly-worded clause. To be fair, the Founders arguably never envisioned that it would be used as such a highway for Constitutional subversion.
LimeyGeek on July 11, 2009 at 11:29 AM
It wouldn’t be doing that by forcing Christian pharmacists to sell abortion pills. Anna is right, they can find another line of work. Sure it’s unfair, and it’s really really bad policy, but it’s not prohibited by the Constitution.
Unfortunately, in many cases the Constitution does not protect businesses from government intrusion. If you don’t like it, then you need to fight for an Amendment to get the result you want at the constitutional level.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:29 AM
I get it, you have just decided that you know me from my comments and you couldn’t be more wrong. But it’s understandable from my comments.
jmarcure on July 11, 2009 at 11:30 AM
So NorthernCross, do you agree then that right now that the Commerce Clause allows the government to do whatever they darn well please, as long as there is transfer of money involved?
justincase on July 11, 2009 at 11:31 AM
So the state should have the right to deny a medical license to an OB/GYN on the grounds that he or she refuses to perform abortions?
We’re not “forcing” you to perform abortions, doc, we’re just saying if you want to practice medicine, you have to perform abortions.
We’re not “forcing” you to sell abortion pills, Mr. Pharmacist, we’re just saying if you want to operate a pharmacy, you have to sell the pills.
I’m not seeing your important distinction.
AZCoyote on July 11, 2009 at 11:31 AM
dumb. the gov’t should take away his livelihood because it doesn’t like his religious principles? Take your head out of your butt.
JiangxiDad on July 11, 2009 at 11:32 AM
Just read what Justice Ginsburg said in the interview. Abortion was approved to get rid of the dependent class of certain races. That should make a liberal really happy.
TXMomof3 on July 11, 2009 at 11:32 AM
Thing is, the Constitution didn’t need to enumerate a specific power for the States. The philosophy guiding the Constitution is one of limited Federal power rather than limited State power. The Tenth Amendment is an excellent illustration of this.
NorthernCross on July 11, 2009 at 11:33 AM
These lawsuits are on their way if we stay on this path. Pharmacists being forced to sell a specific drug is a few steps from doctors having to perform the procedure or the license gets revoked. I know I’m just a fear mongering right winger, but wait a few years, the lawsuits are coming.
BakerAllie on July 11, 2009 at 11:33 AM
I’ll totally pay hotair $100 if they’ll link “ginsu knives” to one of my websites. :D
lorien1973 on July 11, 2009 at 11:33 AM
Oddly, that clause (P&I) existed before the 14th was ratified (A4:S2:C1), but for some reason, the 14th has managed to claim the credit. Go figure.
LimeyGeek on July 11, 2009 at 11:33 AM
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