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Ace’s “special comment” on Palinistas

posted at 2:15 pm on July 6, 2009 by Karl
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Edited only slightly, so there will be some profanity:

It’s this insane idea that if you want something to happen, you will also of course agree that it will happen, and if you don’t agree it will happen, obviously you don’t want it to happen.

In other words, if you’re cheering for one side, you must of course believe that side will win, and if you suggest our side won’t win, well, gee, you must be cheering against us.

It’s insane. I wanted the Giants to win against the Eagles in the playoffs, but I predicted they’d lose, because the Eagles had their number and they were coming apart at the seams. They did lose, for the reasons I guessed (I think). That did not mean I wasn’t “on their side,” I’ve been on the Giants’ side all my life.

But there is a mentality in the nutroots that if you dare to post a poll showing Republicans down and say “we’re in trouble, we need a game-changer,” well, that means you’re secretly rooting against our side.

And if you say that Fred Thompson isn’t catching on as hoped, well, you hate Fred Thomson.

And if you do not believe that Sarah Palin has some double-secret probation plan for the presidency, you must hate her too, and you’re rooting against her, and cheering for the other side.

This is fucking insane and it must stop. I will not be bullied by this ludicrous magical thinking brigade who insists that only Nice and Positive Words must be uttered or else one is contributing one’s Evil Energy to the Wrong Side.

It’s insane.

I disagree with you. I have tried to do so pleasantly but I am tired of the imputation of bad motive simply because I am more realistic and less prone to flights of hopeful fancy than you.

If you think I’m wrong, say so. I do not mind being called wrong. I do, however, greatly mind being called a traitor, of harboring a secret agenda I hide from you in order to advance the MSM’s interests, etc., and all the rest of this insane bullshit.

Someone can be wrong honestly, without the need of claiming he’s wrong dishonestly, wrong because he’s actively intending to subvert the cause (so he can of course get invited to these famous DC dinner parties, etc.)

Stop jumping to claim some one is not just wrong but actively malicious.

It’s insane. It’s fruit fucking loops. and it’s tiresome.

And I do think I am taking off the week. You guys only seem to want to talk about Sarah Palin and furthermore you only want to hear the same thing — she’s running, this is a great move, she’s now perfectly poised for the race, etc.

It’s nonsense. And I hardly need to blog about it, because you all seem to know the words to the song. So you don’t need me as part of the chorus. You can sing the same words well enough without me.

I am really tired of this relentless nonsense and occasional nastiness whenever someone is believed to have departed from the conservativey correct line.

To anticipate some of the responses that comments like this have already generated, for the purpose of this discussion, I really do not care what Ace wrote about Palin’s resignation, any more than I care about what Ed Morrissey wrote about it, any more than I care about the advice Jonah Goldberg was offering Palin before her announcement. I can disagree with any part or all of their opinions without irrationally jumping to the conclusion that they hate Palin, or have thrown in their lot with David Frum and Colin Powell.

Indeed, I can point out what I think are some of the flaws in Goldberg’s piece. He overstates how much Palin has been out of Alaska since the election, while understating the degree to which her profile these days has been dictated by David Letterman, Vanity Fair’s Todd Purdum, and disgruntled McCain campaign officials dragging her (and her daughters) into the spotlight. But consider some of the over-the-top reactions against Goldberg’s writing and person when the piece was linked here at HotAir (Obviously, not all of the critical comments were over-the-top, but if you read them all, you’ll find a fair number of them). To grasp how off-kilter some of the vitriol was, consider that Goldberg argued that Palin can match Romney’s ability to talk policy if she wants to, but Romney will never have Palin’s charisma. How that qualifies as heresy eludes me. The notion that Goldberg is somehow “blowing up the conservative movement” by stating his opinion also seems to impute to him influence far beyond that which he actually has (and I would say the same of Charles Krauthammer, let alone a handful of conservative bloggers).

As for her resignation, my analysis would be closer to that of Mark Halperin than Ace or Ed. But I can disagree with them on Palin’s future prospects while utterly agreeing with Ace’s comment about Palin’s most rabid supporters, who are probably doing her no favors. I suspect that some of the reasons the Left has a special loathing for Palin are the same reasons why some on the Right seem to have an absolutely blind love for her. Should she decide to run for president, the Left will likely enjoy the prospect of using her most devoted followers to highlight her most polarizing qualities.

Granted, the knee-jerk defense of Palin is also a product of the sheer volume and bile of the attacks on her from the Left. But the unfair attacks of the Left will not go away, so long as Palin remains in politics. Nor do those unfair attacks justify unfair attacks by Palin supporters against others on the Right who have supported Palin, or simply called the balls and strikes as they saw them. It is possible to be mistaken without being evil.

Finally, consider this from R. A. Mansour’s profile at Conservatives4Palin:

Make no mistake, the beating she took during the campaign was wounding. She’s not as confident as she once was. You can see it in the difference between her pre-campaign interviews and her post-campaign interviews. There’s a stuttering nervousness about her now. She’s trying to get back on her game.

That could be read more than one way. Presuming that Mansour did not intend to paint Palin as someone who can be beaten down by the likes of Katie Couric and Charlie Gibson, it suggests that Palin recognizes that she needs to raise her game to meet The Narrative likely to be built against her — should she seek a national leadership position. If so, Sarah Palin and Jonah Goldberg really are not all that far apart.

Addendum (Ed): Sarah Palin is not an issue.  Sarah Palin is not a political principle.  Sarah Palin is a politician.  If her supporters demand no criticism of a politician, they risk turning Palin and her supporters into nothing more than a cult of personality, the kind we derided with Barack Obama.  And it does our friends no favors if we see them going over a cliff and remain silent, or worse yet, cheer them to go faster.

This post was promoted from GreenRoom to HotAir.com.
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America, November 2008: “Alaska Governor” is SOOOO UNimportant. It’s no better than asst. chimney sweep

America, July 2009: “Alaska Governor” is THE MOST IMPORTANT JOB ON EARTH!!! The world will end without a gov!

(posted in the wrong entry, so it’s in the headlines one as well)

battleoflepanto1571 on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

If her [Palin's] supporters demand no criticism of a politician,

How many times will this strawman be offered?

People don’t have a problem with the criticism. It’s the juvenile analyses that bother people.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

Gov Palin gives us a reading how we faked ourselves when measuring progress for feminism. Feminism has not come very far and is trying one last surge. She just happens to be the target.
Feminism is both dead and a flop.

seven on July 6, 2009 at 2:18 PM

I do agree about the magical thinking that we all have to approve/agree or we’re “hurting the cause.”

That type of thinking also means unless people agree with THE most hate-filled people on a blog, they are “rightfully” driven off.

And that’s pretty silly.

AnninCA on July 6, 2009 at 2:18 PM

His first mistake is being a Giants fan. Bad move.

RWLA on July 6, 2009 at 2:19 PM

And so we see the American electorate…..polarized to the point that nothing gets done. This is a civil war of suicide. Who will kill themselves off first?

Limerick on July 6, 2009 at 2:20 PM

From one cult of personality to another

CMonster on July 6, 2009 at 2:20 PM

How many times will this strawman be offered?

People don’t have a problem with the criticism. It’s the juvenile analyses that bother people.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

Yup. Palin has MANY flaws. But her positives outweight the negatives in my mind.

How about the rino-side stop calling palin supporters “palinistas” that found a “messiah”

I could tell you 10 things wrong with palin; Obama-bots can’t tell you 1.

But we won’t stand for the lies about “OMG SHE GAVE NO REASON UPON RESIGNING!!11!!”

She did. 80% of her job as gov was appearing in court or paying lawyers hundreds a day to fight ethics complaints that are UNIQUE to alaska; some insane law that allows any “D” to sue palin for anything anytime — and she legally has to answer any charges, or appear in court. Palin’s words were “i cant do my job effectively, and alaskan government is logjammed, so i’ll step down to help alaska, and in the meantime help out the GOP in 2010″

But yes, PLEASE, keep saying her speech was “without reason” and “rambling”. I insist.

battleoflepanto1571 on July 6, 2009 at 2:21 PM

Ed–why do you and allah keep pumping the “other shoe” meme that is now thoroughly discredited. sleazy.

Also, for the pundits who pounded on Palin before and after her announcement, stop whining about how you are being treated.

james23 on July 6, 2009 at 2:21 PM

Please Palin people, Sarah knows what she is doing, nobody will work harder or smarter than her. She will be going after the head of the snake. She is already the most powerful woman in politics, just wait until she fire’s up her campaign.

Firebird on July 6, 2009 at 2:21 PM

His first mistake is being a Giants fan. Bad move.

RWLA on July 6, 2009 at 2:19 PM

She’s a Giants fan?

Okay, I’m done. No more Palin for me.

myrenovations on July 6, 2009 at 2:22 PM

Whack! Whack! Whack!
The horse isn’t dead I’m telling ya! Just lazy! I moved over a thousand comments with her just yesterday! Whack!

Rocks on July 6, 2009 at 2:22 PM

People don’t have a problem with the criticism. It’s the juvenile analyses that bother people.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

You’re still equating “juvenile” (or wrong) with some sort of malicious intent…that anyone who comes up with this “juvenile” analysis is guilty of subverting conservatism intentionally.

Thats paranoid delusion.

ernesto on July 6, 2009 at 2:22 PM

Hopefully Ace isn’t in danger of jumping off the same cliff that claimed Charles at LGF.

World B. Free on July 6, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Ace is right. any criticism of her and you are not ‘conservative’…she’s suffered more than reagan…blahblahblah..

its ridiculous. how has what she done advance the cause of conservatism??? I have not seen anyone answer this, and yet to criticize her is to be a heretic…the cult of personality…

Reagan never quit.

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Mis-read that. Ace is the Giants fan, not Palin.

Still, she is probably a closet Seahawks fan or something. That’s the shoe that will drop.

And then I’ll be done with her.

myrenovations on July 6, 2009 at 2:24 PM

Reagan never quit.

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Reagan is gone.

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:24 PM

Karl, one small correction: what Ace used was not profanity, but vulgarity.

I’d be happy to illustrate the difference between the two, if anyone needs clarification. And also, why neither is the same thing as obscenity.

Alex_SF on July 6, 2009 at 2:24 PM

I think what the message addresses is the personal attacks, which have really skyrocketed in these threads.

Disagree…but why the personal nature of some of the replies?

AnninCA on July 6, 2009 at 2:25 PM

Perhaps one can combine the MJ/Palin threads into one for those that haven’t had enough.

Jeff from WI on July 6, 2009 at 2:26 PM

Hopefully Ace isn’t in danger of jumping off the same cliff that claimed Charles at LGF.

World B. Free on July 6, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Funny. In the same thread the author of this post quotes, Ace complains about being “bullied” on his own blog and vows not to blog for a week. Hopefully he’s getting some needed RnR.

james23 on July 6, 2009 at 2:26 PM

[progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM]

+1000

It’s too bad Ed botched up this upgrade to the front page — with comments — with such a distraction to the argument Karl puts forward.

Dusty on July 6, 2009 at 2:26 PM

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:23 PM

It isn’t just Palin. It is Mitt and Huck, Fred and Tanc. It is like the long view of where we are going isn’t as important as the next three steps.

Limerick on July 6, 2009 at 2:27 PM

If you think I’m wrong, say so

You’re wrong.

And I do think I am taking off the week.

If you can’t stand the heat … .

I will not be bullied by this

But you’re taking the week off.
________________

Granted, the knee-jerk defense of Palin

Pot, kettle.

davidk on July 6, 2009 at 2:28 PM

People don’t have a problem with the criticism.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

Actually, plenty do. I don’t know if you missed them, but they’re everywhere in these Palin threads.

Firebird’s up there saying we should just trust Palin. What is that if not trying to stifle criticism of what she’s done?

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:29 PM

How Winners Think, and What Winners Say.

90,000 dollars hidden in the freezer.

Winners think, how can I spin this into a win.
Winners say that someone (righty) put the money in the freezer to entrap them.

I am sick of constructive criticism from the right. Get on board or get off.

nondhimmie on July 6, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Well written, Karl.

jediwebdude on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

Wow…

the good the bad and the pundits.

Dang.. how should I write my next blog?

How the pundits of the U.S. think of Sarah? How Sarah is making the grade? What can the prospect be in the future for Sarah and Alaska. Why the F* does anyone care what Sarah is doing now?

The items are endless…. should I tweet about it too?

Good Lord

upinak on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

battleoflepanto1571 on July 6, 2009 at 2:21 PM

I’m not even a strong supporter of hers. I have some questions about her “green” intitiatives and still wonder what her real views on amnesty are, but to see people look at her speech and skip over the most salient points just drives me nuts. And the constant bleating about “she quit this job so why wouldn’t quit another” is just insane, considering that just about every politician has done just that. I was ticked when she ran for VP without reigning her governorship – the same way that I thought that McCain and the idiot messiah and all the rest of them should have been forced to resign their positions to run, and how I think that every politician should be forced to resign their position while running for another. I always wondered how sitting politicians found the time to write books when they are being paid to do their political job. In this respect, I found Palin’s resignation (aside from the main reason that she could not be effective in it, given the outside attacks, and would seamlessly pass control onto her Lt. Gov) to be a refreshing change for the better. And, while she explained what she was moving towards afterwards, most of the, now-complaining, pundits just ignored it.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

I’m just tired of the Palin speculation.

I like her, but as Ed says, she’s just a politician. I’m waiting to see for what she does or says next, but I’m not going to second-guess her moves, as much as it passes the time.

She may or may not run for President in 2012… she may be doing something entirely different than running for office. Who knows? I don’t have an op-ed deadline to meet, or traffic to pump up on my site.

meep on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

Hopefully Ace isn’t in danger of jumping off the same cliff that claimed Charles at LGF.

Why?

Because he doesn’t want Palin to run for President?

[Edited for TOU violation.]

Charles jumped off the cliff because he never was a conservative. He’s nothing more than a fruit-loop lefty who had their world rocked after 9/11.

Now, eight years later, he’s gone back to his old ways.

Believe it or now, there ARE conservatives who don’t want Sarah Palin running for the white house. I’m one of them, and like Ace, I don’t particularly enjoy being labelled a traitor because of it.

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

Addendum (Ed): Sarah Palin is not an issue. Sarah Palin is not a political principle. Sarah Palin is a politician. If her supporters demand no criticism of a politician, they risk turning Palin and her supporters into nothing more than a cult of personality, the kind we derided with Barack Obama. And it does our friends no favors if we see them going over a cliff and remain silent, or worse yet, cheer them to go faster.

Her supporters do not demand “no criticism” of Palin. We just think yours are dead wrong.

how has what she done advance the cause of conservatism???

Have you scoured through her governing record in Alaska?

latinchic on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

It’s sort of amusing that those who criticize Sarah Palin (in whatever small or large way) are shocked and amazed when people come running to her rescue. For better or worse, she is the conservative icon right now. The endless speculation and innuendo about her resignation is nothing short of childish, bordering on the churlish.

SouthernGent on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:23 PM

It isn’t just Palin. It is Mitt and Huck, Fred and Tanc. It is like the long view of where we are going isn’t as important as the next three steps.

Limerick on July 6, 2009 at 2:27 PM

After Palin, the rest sound like characters in a Mark Twain book.

Jeff from WI on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

Also, for the pundits who pounded on Palin before and after her announcement, stop whining about how you are being treated.

james23 on July 6, 2009 at 2:21 PM

That’s definitely an irony I’ve noticed as well. She and her supporters are supposed to just sit back and take any and all criticisms of her, regardless of merit … but let someone return fire to her detractors, and suddenly they start whining about themselves being criticized.

Boo freakin’ hoo.

thirteen28 on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

Insert 68 comments from the greenroom here.

So, let’s plow some new ground shall we:

This will create an epidemic in America of that dreaded disease PDS – short for Palin Derangement Syndrome. Liberals in general and liberal feminists in particular will go nuts. They hate her, not simply because she’s pro-life; a lot of politicians are pro-life but aren’t despised the way Sarah Palin is. They hate her because she didn’t go to the “right” college. She bounced around more than a few before winding up in Idaho. They hate her because she has “too many” kids. Sophisticated women don’t have five kids and certainly don’t have children with Downs Syndrome. That hate her, in other words, because she’s like so many ordinary Americans, a group liberal elites don’t have much use for.

But hey, anything that drives liberals crazy is good with me.

It’s really hard to find the otherside of the coin in the Palin story. It took me a whole 30 seconds!

TheBigOldDog on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

Ace and Ed, master of the strawman and victimhood.

Quit whining and backpedaling.

faraway on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

People don’t have a problem with the criticism. It’s the juvenile analyses that bother people.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

Okay, what criticism of Palin has not been labeled as “juvenile analyses”?

BTW, Ace was dead on target, and shot another arrow into the back of the first one.

MadisonConservative on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

In other words, if you’re cheering for one side, you must of course believe that side will win, and if you suggest our side won’t win, well, gee, you must be cheering against us.

One exception: many conflicts are ultimately decided by the moral of the respective sides. There are quite a few examples of battles and wars lost by the side with overwhelming superiority, just because they got it in their heads that they were going to loose.
Basically, you can cause your side to lose by being overly critical of your chances of victory.

Count to 10 on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

Who do you want running and why not Palin?

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

If her supporters demand no criticism of a politician, they risk turning Palin and her supporters into nothing more than a cult of personality, the kind we derided with Barack Obama.

I agree. I also posit that all of the energy devoted to predicting her future would be better spent recruiting and supporting conservative candidates for the midterms in 2010.

Vashta.Nerada on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

Sounds like Ace quit, could not take the heat, or the criticism. I guess Ace now knows what Palin feels like.

WoosterOh on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

You’re still equating “juvenile” (or wrong) with some sort of malicious intent…

No, I’m not. Many of these pundits did poor jobs analysing the situation and the speech and they are complaining that they are being taken to task.

that anyone who comes up with this “juvenile” analysis is guilty of subverting conservatism intentionally.

Thats paranoid delusion.

ernesto on July 6, 2009 at 2:22 PM

Er … where did I say that? Please cut and paste my words that led you to this conclusion.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

People don’t have a problem with the criticism. It’s the juvenile analyses that bother people.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

Yes, attack her policies, her credentials (the real ones), but calling her baby useless, her daughters whores…is wrong.
And all conservatives, Palin supporters or not, should fight this type of personal destruction.
If it works against Palin, then it will work against any other…conservatives are too weak often to stand up to the onslaught.
Romney, Huck, Jindahl, others should all be fighting against these vicious attacks…but they are silent, hoping the same won’t happen to them, but it will.

right2bright on July 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM

Reagan is gone.

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:24 PM

and there ain’t no one even close to him out there now…

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM

MadisonConservative on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

I thought you said that you were going to ignore me?

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM

I am sick of constructive criticism from the right. Get on board or get off.

nondhimmie on July 6, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Obviously you don’t know what constructive criticism is. It comes from those who want to help you and see you succeed, i.e., those who ARE on board.

Don’t pretend you help anyone by ignoring their flaws. You’re only enabling BS, and you’re the one who should get off.

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:30 PM

You know.. I get really tired of the offensive comments.

upinak on July 6, 2009 at 2:34 PM

I agree. I also posit that all of the energy devoted to predicting her future would be better spent recruiting and supporting conservative candidates for the midterms in 2010.

Vashta.Nerada on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

Oh come on, everyone knows we must decide 2012 before the end of this coming week…

myrenovations on July 6, 2009 at 2:35 PM

Ace, Ed, and Allahpundit, you can speak your mind about Palin again just as soon as you have been through the same amount of public defamation she has. Until then you are not offering constructive criticism, you are just making a buck off her.

doriangrey on July 6, 2009 at 2:35 PM

She did. 80% of her job as gov was appearing in court or paying lawyers hundreds a day to fight ethics complaints that are UNIQUE to alaska; some insane law that allows any “D” to sue palin for anything anytime — and she legally has to answer any charges, or appear in court. Palin’s words were “i cant do my job effectively, and alaskan government is logjammed, so i’ll step down to help alaska, and in the meantime help out the GOP in 2010″

But yes, PLEASE, keep saying her speech was “without reason” and “rambling”. I insist.

battleoflepanto1571 on July 6, 2009 at 2:21 PM

Good to know.

Count to 10 on July 6, 2009 at 2:35 PM

You know.. I get really tired of the offensive comments.

upinak on July 6, 2009 at 2:34 PM

+ a very large number

Limerick on July 6, 2009 at 2:35 PM

Who do you want running and why not Palin?

Honestly, I don’t know.

I thought Duncan Hunter was good for the job, but the party didn’t think so.

It’s not that I don’t like Sarah Palin or her positions, it’s that I don’t think she’s electable – just like I didn’t think McCain was electable.

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

and there ain’t no one even close to him out there now…

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM

Well, I’d agree that Palin is not as good as Reagan but wasn’t he still a democrat at her age?

Someone still has to beat Obama. If not Palin then who?

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

Ace was dead on target, and shot another arrow into the back of the first one.

Unless Ace shot himself in the ass — not easy with an arrow.

RandyChandler on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

It isn’t just Palin. It is Mitt and Huck, Fred and Tanc. It is like the long view of where we are going isn’t as important as the next three steps.

Limerick on July 6, 2009 at 2:27 PM

yep, its not about personalities…its about the principles, and who articulates those principles, and will apply them in the most effective way to the political arena.

I don’t see doing what she has done as advancing the cause of conservatism.

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

My first reaction is to defend a fellow conservative. Others, not so much.

faraway on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

I do think people need to calm down and get some perspective on all of this. I have no problem with the devoted supporters of Palin(of whom I am one) concerned over her political future and debating whether or not this was a wise move. I have no problem with these folks taking issue with the vicious attacks by the drive-bys and what effect, if any, they may have had on her decision.

But where this is getting out of hand is when people are so enamored with Palin and the success of her political career, that they’re willing to throw the entire GOP and large factions of the conservative movement under the bus in the process. If Palin doesn’t get the nomination in 2012 for whatever reason, are her fans going to be so bitter and jaded that they turn on whoever is the nominee? Are we going to allow what almost happened to the Democrats last year with Hillary and Obama actually happen to us?

Doughboy on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

thirteen28 on July 6, 2009 at 2:31 PM

No, you don’t understand, what they are doing is called “objective realistic analysis” and anybody who supports Palin or criticizes them for focusing on Plain like MSNBC focuses on Jacko is engaged in whining. See how it works now? Okay for me, not for thee. Get with the program!

TheBigOldDog on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

It’s WAY too soon to be splitting into camps, in my opinion. She’s just positioning herself at this point. Nobody really knows what the next move is or how effective or ineffective it will be.

Time will tell. But I do understand the gist of this post, in that the idea that I have to buy ALL conservative political stances or I’m (fill-in-your-favorite insult) strikes me as very odd. It makes politics one-dimensional.

What’s the fun in that?

AnninCA on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

upinak

Care to elaborate?

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

Sounds like Ace quit, could not take the heat, or the criticism. I guess Ace now knows what Palin feels like.

WoosterOh on July 6, 2009 at 2:32 PM

When did Ace run for office?

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

Addendum (Ed):

Man, you didn’t just criticize Friday — you knee-jerked so hard you could have given someone a black eye.

After years of reading your posts here and on CHQ, I’ve come to expect better.

But then, we all make mistakes (even Sarah Palin).;)

eforhan on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

When did ACE turn into a ppuussyy Hot air blogger ?

redrock on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

Someone still has to beat Obama. If not Palin then who?

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

I don’t know. I doubt anyone on the stage now can. look at detroit, a post-apocalyptic vision of america..and yet people still vote for the same democRATs that destroyed the city…

right4life on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

Actually, plenty do. I don’t know if you missed them, but they’re everywhere in these Palin threads.

Firebird’s up there saying we should just trust Palin. What is that if not trying to stifle criticism of what she’s done?

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Anecdotes. Most of the people who have problems with what is said in the Palin blog posts, here, are just arguing that the analysis is poor and not-well-thought-out, which is true.

I mentioned various times, from the beginning, that Palin leveled some huge attacks on The Precedent and his junta, indicating where she was headed and why. It was clear and obvious, but you will have to search far and wide among the (complaining) pundits’ posts to find them even discussing that, though it was a major part of her speech.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

I don’t think she’s electable – just like I didn’t think McCain was electable.
You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

It’s entirely possible that no-one can beat Obama. She looks like the best shot to me. McCain already failed.

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

My first reaction is to defend a fellow conservative. Others, not so much.

faraway on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

That means you a whinny reactionary or something. You are supposed to join in on the kill!

TheBigOldDog on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Care to elaborate?

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

How about you go back and read what you wrote.

And think about it.

upinak on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Are we going to allow what almost happened to the Democrats last year with Hillary and Obama actually happen to us?

Doughboy on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

shhh… The Dems won.

faraway on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

When a player gets called up to the bigs, no one says that he quit on his minor league team, do they?

Fact is, Gov Palin’s term of office ended on 8/29/08 at the moment she stepped on the stage in Dayton.

She didn’t quit, her opponents made it impossible for her to stay and be an effective governor. Her agenda was blocked by a legislature that wasn’t going to let her make a name on their backs, and she was going to continue to be assaulted by phony ethics charges. There is nothing to suggest that she couldnt stay in office and simply punch the clock for the next 18 months. But why should she when all she’d have to show for it at the end would be some headaches and a massive legal bill?

As for Ace, he doesnt understand that bloggers, once they reach that top level, cease being fans and start being players. They push and shape opinion. See how Kos and HuffPo do it. Maybe Ace isn’t Eli Manning, more like Guy Whimper or Chase Blackburn, but he’s in the game. I much prefer that everyone on the team, from the first guy to the last, is united and pulling in the same direction.

News flash: If Sarah Palin succeeds, conservatism succeeds in a major, major, and lasting way. Why is one side of party so reluctant to foster that success? Give her a fair shot instead of constantly trying to run her off. If she fails, Romney is a fine fall-back, but that’s all he should ever be, a backup plan.

Nat Hound on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Oh no, the bloggers FEELINGS have been hurt.

Grow a pair bro, then get back to us. (To Ace and Ed)

Criticize her decisions all you want, it’s a free world and your (MM’s) blog.

But don’t cry when commenters criticize your analysis (premature, may I add).

omnipotent on July 6, 2009 at 2:39 PM

That means you a whinny reactionary or something. You are supposed to join in on the kill!

TheBigOldDog on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Let it whine. Sometimes it makes them stop whining in the future.

upinak on July 6, 2009 at 2:39 PM

The update from Morissey says it best.

Gaunilon on July 6, 2009 at 2:39 PM

How many times will this strawman be offered?

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM

As many times as their criticism is criticized.

Jim Treacher on July 6, 2009 at 2:40 PM

And I do think I am taking off the week. You guys only seem to want to talk about Sarah Palin and furthermore you only want to hear the same thing — she’s running, this is a great move, she’s now perfectly poised for the race, etc.

Ace isn’t fooling anybody. He’s just broke up over MJ and wanted a reason to stay glued to CNN for the coverage.

Rocks on July 6, 2009 at 2:40 PM

P.S. – Governor Palin is a noted Steeler fan.

Nat Hound on July 6, 2009 at 2:40 PM

When did Ace run for office?

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

Don’t know , but he run FROM it apparently..

the_nile on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

My first reaction is to defend a fellow conservative. Others, not so much.

faraway on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 PM

Except, of course, for the ones here on this site who happen to disagree with you.

Anecdotes.

What else am I supposed to use? I know of no stats on the issue, unless Ed’s hiding them.

I mentioned various times, from the beginning, that Palin leveled some huge attacks on The Precedent and his junta, indicating where she was headed and why. It was clear and obvious, but you will have to search far and wide among the (complaining) pundits’ posts to find them even discussing that, though it was a major part of her speech.

progressoverpeace on July 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM

It’s entirely possible that they’re dismissing them because they don’t find them relevant to the discussion. Even with that, many who are criticizing her don’t see those are legitimate reasons to stand down and have said so.

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

I don’t think Ace is a traitor, but it is annoying when some on “our side” seem to accept the premise of the left and then argue from there. They say they are being “realistic” but that of course begs the question of who’s “realism” are they basing that assessment on? Some poll run by a bunch of libs? A column from a RINO? If anything the bile from the left is a sign of Palin’s potential strength.

I think Palin’s supporters would argue that is THEY who have the numbers and THEY see her in the correct light. We know the libs and the Republican elites hate her, but we shouldn’t assume that would translate to electoral defeat.

echosyst on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

Remember, an unemployed clown just became a US Senator.

Hope is in the air.

faraway on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

I wanted the Giants to win against the Eagles in the playoffs, but I predicted they’d lose, because the Eagles had their number and they were coming apart at the seams. They did lose, for the reasons I guessed (I think). That did not mean I wasn’t “on their side,” I’ve been on the Giants’ side all my life.

Well, there’s the problem, Ace, you’re a Giants fan. Join us in the District to root for the Redskins and things might look a bit cheerier from now on out.

ieplaya on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

how has what she done advance the cause of conservatism???

Maybe because she put a spring in the steps of conservatives the last election cycle? and got at least a few of us out to vote for JohnnyMac?

Let’s face it, I would not have voted for JohnnyMac if Palin hadn’t been on the ticket.

She gave voice to us. That is what she did. Feel free to disagree, but riddle me this: who did more for conservatism? go ahead, take your time. It might take a while.

I R A Darth Aggie on July 6, 2009 at 2:42 PM

Don’t know , but he run FROM it apparently..

the_nile on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

Cause he’s taking a vacation? Was he not supposed to take one? Surely Palin took several.

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:42 PM

RON PAUL!

SARAH PALIN!

Before anyone deifies her, realize she’s a politician. That means at the end of the day she has more in common with Obama than different.

frankj on July 6, 2009 at 2:42 PM

Actually, plenty do. I don’t know if you missed them, but they’re everywhere in these Palin threads.

Firebird’s up there saying we should just trust Palin. What is that if not trying to stifle criticism of what she’s done?

[Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:29 PM]

Um, counseling good judgment and displaying temperament (in Firebird’s humble opinion)? Just a thought.

Dusty on July 6, 2009 at 2:42 PM

Ace, Ed, and Allahpundit, you can speak your mind about Palin again just as soon as you have been through the same amount of public defamation she has. Until then you are not offering constructive criticism, you are just making a buck off her.

doriangrey on July 6, 2009 at 2:35 PM

At least to his cred Ed isn’t anonymous .

the_nile on July 6, 2009 at 2:42 PM

Ace, Ed, and Allahpundit, you can speak your mind about Palin again just as soon as you have been through the same amount of public defamation she has.

However, if you want to praise her, go right ahead. We’ll deem you qualified to opine on her, as long as you promise to be laudatory.

/do I really need to?

Pablo on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

anybody who doesn’t understand what Alaskan politics is like will never understand why she resigned. If there is one thing that all of the people writing negative articles about her have in common … they don’t know anything about Alaska.

She says what she means in her resignation speech and gives the reasons for why she did what she did. You really need to take this woman’s words to heart … she is not a typical politician

joey24007 on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

I think Palin’s supporters would argue that is THEY who have the numbers and THEY see her in the correct light. We know the libs and the Republican elites hate her, but we shouldn’t assume that would translate to electoral defeat.

echosyst on July 6, 2009 at 2:41 PM

Except that it did already just eight months ago.

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

The issue with Palin and why there is so much passion about it is that the Left wing had made a decision to ‘take her out’. I don’t just mean ruin her for the 2008 election but to cancel her career.

If you let this succeed I am afraid we are just going to get a bunch of Olympia snowes and Arlen spectres running for office in the future. Afterall what is the easiest way to avoid getting ‘Palinized’ if your a would be politician.
Answer, be a Rino or Democrat.

Sort of like when the mob kills someone in public and leaves the body there for everybody to see.

kangjie on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

I’ll assume you meant the ‘n* please’ comment.

Try growing some thicker skin and a sense of humor. You don’t even know what you’re ‘offended’ at.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I11w-rl6iaY

You-Eh-Vee on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

Fine.. get banned. See if I care.. or anyone else as someone recently GOT banned due to it.

Have a nice life.

upinak on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

A great conservative website would be one devoted entirely to everyone of the dems mistakes, corruption, bonehead remarks, physical appearance, status of their bank accounts, what they drive, where they live and just an all around TMZ accounting of democrats…..Maybe then there would be less honing of the republican party by the right (?).

nondhimmie on July 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM

None of this matters right now. The next Presidential election is over 3 years away. Nothing said now will matter then.

But for the sake of playing this game I would ask, if not Palin in 2012, then who? Who has the ability to rouse the Conservative populace and get America moving in the right direction again? Who? Sanford? Pawlenty? Jindal?

That’s what I thought.

Guardian on July 6, 2009 at 2:44 PM

P.S. – Governor Palin is a noted Steeler fan.

Nat Hound on July 6, 2009 at 2:40 PM

Okay then, back on the Palin bandwagon. Of course, another cleat could drop at any second.

myrenovations on July 6, 2009 at 2:44 PM

Real Americans are Patriots fans. Patriots. Duh.

Pablo on July 6, 2009 at 2:45 PM

Ace, Ed, and Allahpundit, you can speak your mind about Palin again just as soon as you have been through the same amount of public defamation she has. Until then you are not offering constructive criticism, you are just making a buck off her.

doriangrey on July 6, 2009 at 2:35 PM

You really are making a chickenhawk argument? You’re not a conservative.

frankj on July 6, 2009 at 2:45 PM

Um, counseling good judgment and displaying temperament (in Firebird’s humble opinion)? Just a thought.

Dusty on July 6, 2009 at 2:42 PM

Maybe so, but Firebird didn’t offer anything of substance except blind faith in a woman most people only heard about for the first time less than a year ago.

Esthier on July 6, 2009 at 2:45 PM

News flash: If Sarah Palin succeeds, conservatism succeeds in a major, major, and lasting way. Why is one side of party so reluctant to foster that success? Give her a fair shot instead of constantly trying to run her off. If she fails, Romney is a fine fall-back, but that’s all he should ever be, a backup plan.

Nat Hound on July 6, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Why is necessary to bad-mouth Romney. You were doing fine until then. IMO, “If Romney succeeds, etc etc”. Most likely both Romney and Palin will run in the GOP primaries and whoever the winner is, everyone had better close ranks and support them. Otherwise it’s 8 years of Obama rather than 4.

gh on July 6, 2009 at 2:45 PM

I agree with Allah’s sentiment. I don’t detect any attempt to sink her career in the posts of the past few days. Just analysis.

I for one will wait to see what comes of Palin. Don’t think she will succeed? Fine. Think she won’t have success because she’s stooopid and a hick and a slut and whatever they say on MSNBC and the real reason we’re talking about it is because she’s all of the above? Not cool.

darii on July 6, 2009 at 2:46 PM

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