ObamaCare: $4 trillion in costs

posted at 2:05 pm on June 25, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

We warned that the Democratic Party estimates of $1 trillion in costs for ObamaCare were far too low, and now Congress has had this confirmed.  In testimony before a House subcommittee on the health-care industry on Tuesday, Dr. Stephen Parente of the University of Minnesota gave the real numbers on the cost of ObamaCare.  It’s as bad as we predicted (via Yid with Lid):

There are two things people most want to know from these proposals. One, how many uninsured will be covered? Two, what will it cost the nation in one year and in ten years?

HSI estimates, like CBO’s recent results, find there is no free lunch to expand health insurance coverage. Our early assessment of the Senate Finance committee proposal shows a 74% reduction in the uninsured with a 10 year cost of [$]2.7 trillion using public option plan modeled after the Massachusetts Connector.  We also modeled an FEHBP version of the public plan and got a cost of over [$]1.3 trillion, but with a 30% reduction in the uninsured.

The $1 trillion number doesn’t even tickle the meter, and that’s a big problem for Democrats.  They argue that the reforms will save a trillion dollars, making ObamaCare deficit-neutral over ten years, but none of the plans come in under that price.  Just to move 30% net of the uninsured onto health plans will take more that $300 billion above that ceiling, making it an addition to an already astronomical deficit pattern.

To move most of the uninsured — net, again — onto health-insurance plans, it will take more than double the cheapest version of ObamaCare.  But that’s not the final word:

CBO scored the Kennedy Bill last week at approximately a 30% reduction for 1 trillion over ten years. Using the ARCOLA model, we found nearly everyone would be covered if all elements of the Kennedy bill were enacted at a ten year cost of 4 trillion. That 4 trillion estimate over 10 years assumes a public option plan with Bronze, Silver and Gold levels in the proposed insurance exchange with a subsidy for premium support that is income-adjusted and calibrated for assistance at the Silver level. The Silver level is equivalent of PPO plan with medium levels of generosity, something with 15% coinsurance rate, manageable copays and average level of access to physicians and hospitals. We accounted for the public plan being reimbursed at 10% above Medicare reimbursement, which is also 10% below commercial insurance premiums.

Let’s break that down carefully.  What exactly does $4 trillion and a public plan buy us, besides even higher deficits over the next ten years?  A “medium” level of generosity for the Silver plan, with an “average” level of access to physicians and hospitals.  On top of that, the plan still underpays providers with even the 10% boost over Medicare payments, which no one is suggesting will remain permanent.  And that will only still cover “nearly everyone,” a measure Dr. Parente doesn’t explain in his statement.

And to answer Nate Silver, what happens to the private market when this “average” and “medium” plan gets implemented?

Because the public plan can compete with the individual and group market private sector offering, we saw a crowd out resulting from the public plan of 79 million covered lives with the majority people leaving their employer sponsored medium PPOs and HMOs.

In other words, almost a third of all covered Americans would get thrown out of their current plans and onto government-paid care.

Parente included this warning:

As a nation, we are on the verge of making multitrillion dollar gamble that more per capita health care deficit spending will make us better off as a society. We are wagering with starting bids in the trillions that excessive spending into the healthcare system accelerates breakthrough medical technologies that can eliminate whole diseases, like diabetes or Alzheimer’s, in ways similar to the innovations introduced over half a century which reduced tuberculosis from being one the leading causes of death.

It is not an unreasonable wager, since federal funding for heart disease and cancer either directly through research or indirectly through Medicare has yielded state of art medical care. But it is a wager nonetheless, and we may find our reckoning is not only with the future debt of our children, but their security where the economic crisis has brought international scrutiny upon the US from the principal purchasers of our treasuries. Furthermore, saving businesses from paying health care costs or a state government with federal intervention is simply an accounting cost shift that only saps our long term economic strength.

These numbers show that without a doubt.

Blowback

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That’s okay, Ed…we can just print up some more money and we’ll be fine.

Right?

Right?

Bob's Kid on June 25, 2009 at 2:07 PM

The general populace is too ignorant and apathetic to pay attention to these staggering numbers.

PBoilermaker on June 25, 2009 at 2:08 PM

AnnainCA says: Give me my binky!

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:08 PM

This is insane!

rplat on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

I’m sure Dianne Sawyer covered all of this last night.

myrenovations on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

Is that the same girl from the Burger King poster?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:08 PM

Heh.

portlandon on June 25, 2009 at 2:10 PM

A thought occurred to me (it happens occasionally). It’s Ironic that Obama doesn’t want to interfere with doctor when a botched abortion results in live birth but has no problem doing so in every other situation. This many is a total psycho, evil SOB.

TheBigOldDog on June 25, 2009 at 2:10 PM

They argue that the reforms will save a trillion dollars, making ObamaCare deficit-neutral over ten years

Saves who a trillion dollars?

LibTired on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

Not only does it cost over $4 trillion dollars, 30+ million people will lose their healthcare and be forced onto this sham.

Enoxo on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

How the hell did that “Y” get in there? I friggin hate typing.

TheBigOldDog on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

4 trillion is an estimate…you can double, triple, or quadruple that figure and you would still be accurate.
What gov. giveaway has ever been even near budget?

right2bright on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

Won’t be long and the American people are going to be introduced to a new number. QUADRILLION

fourdeucer on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

The BigOldDog has big fat old paws totally unsuited fro typing…

TheBigOldDog on June 25, 2009 at 2:12 PM

I’d still say that sounds way too low.

clement on June 25, 2009 at 2:12 PM

I’m sure Dianne Sawyer covered UP all of this last night.

portlandon on June 25, 2009 at 2:12 PM

Well Dr. Stephen Parente can kiss off being invited to Obama’s 4th of July hot dog party. Matter of fact, the Obamabots are probably hitting Google and Nexus right now, trying to dig up some dirt on him.

GarandFan on June 25, 2009 at 2:12 PM

Is that the same girl from the Burger King poster?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

She only got that mind blowing face expression.

the_nile on June 25, 2009 at 2:12 PM

WTF happened to the 1 trillion cost

MCW on June 25, 2009 at 2:13 PM

AnnainCA says: Give me my binky!

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:08 PM

And a Cookie!

MilSpec32 on June 25, 2009 at 2:14 PM

Won’t be long and the American people are going to be introduced to a new number. QUADRILLION

fourdeucer on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

Yes, as in “That loaf of bread will be 3 quadrillion”.

LibTired on June 25, 2009 at 2:14 PM

Best. Photo. Ever.

faraway on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Let’s see………..

Congress is exempt from the Health Care Bill……..

The Unions don’t have to pay taxes on their Health Care….

The price calculations continue to skyrocket……

And no one has time to read the bill, once again, because it has to be passed ‘today’……..

…………. I would say this is a bad idea.

Seven Percent Solution on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

In Obama math, that’s called a routine rounding number.

lawhawk on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Has anybody ever heard of the Constitution?

Why is nobody categorically stating that any attempt to enact such legislation is illegal – as in, against the law….that law being the supreme law of the land?

Rather than dancing around the ‘penumbra’ of illegality we’ve tolerated over the decades, we now have a government-wide sprint away from the Constitution towards socialistic fascism.

10th Amendment, anyone? Bueller?

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Democrats have no idea what they’ve done to us, and the economy, with their spending. I don’t think they have a clue as to actually how much $4 trillion is. They’ll just pfft, and say…let’s go for it. They don’t care who has to pay for it.

Also to note…how is this fair, to everyone, when the UAW members would be exempt from taxation, on their current health insurance plans? That’s waaaaaaaay below the belt.

capejasmine on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Wow, $4 Trill without first family coverage.

At least we know he won’t try to tax employer health benefits or raise taxes on anyone making under $250k.

EconomicNeocon on June 25, 2009 at 2:16 PM

Yes, but did he account for all the savings that the private sector will realize if they quit being silly and listen to the smarter people working for the government?

Barry and Nancy are upset with the CBO because they did not include this in their estimates. Are the “savings” included in this one?

Joe Caps on June 25, 2009 at 2:16 PM

Wait – can someone answer this?

Is the $4 trillion based on the cost for the INTENDED number of people to be covered?

Or does it include all of the people who are likely to be covered after most businesses dump their private insurance for the government option?

If it’s only the former, then has anyone calculated what it will cost when private insurers go out of business?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:17 PM

China would never renege on their agreement to keep buying our debt, they promised.

This is a colossal lie, not only healthcare but every single effin program that Ogabe and his drooling lackeys are trying to shove down our throats. This anti-American doucheball and his cranky, dufflebag spouse are raping us and no one on our side is doing a frackin’ thing to stop it.

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:17 PM

It’s so odd that the same liberals who claimed Bush’s Social Security plan (of allowing people to choose where their money goes) was too risky are also supporting Obama’s plan to rob Peter and give to Paul.

JohnJ on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

…public option plan with Bronze, Silver and Gold levels in the proposed insurance exchange.

Bronze: take 2 aspirin and call the PA in the morning if you’re not dead yet.

PattyJ on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

Turn off the spigot. Stop funding this government.

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

10th Amendment, anyone? Bueller?
LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

I’m going with the 2nd Amendment.

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

MilSpec32 on June 25, 2009 at 2:14 PM

Obamacare would cover the binky or the cookie but not both.

highhopes on June 25, 2009 at 2:19 PM

I have a very legitimate question:

How many illegal aliens will be covered by this government healthcare? How many trillions will be spend on another country’s welfare class? We are at double digit unemployment and this wet end is talking about amnesty for illegal aliens, after he pumps us on climate change, which will give temporary jobs to whom? Illegal aliens? And then, we have healthcare, for said illegal aliens, 47 million people uninsurance and illegal aliens make 60% of those 47 million. If we deported those leaches, and their leach children and reform the 14th amendment, we could handle the rest that make up twenty-somethings and give incentives and allow small businesses to buy into a pool for lower insurance rates.
But, making sense does not matter in the obama era.

HornetSting on June 25, 2009 at 2:19 PM

Gee, Obama’s credibility has been so enhanced by his Porkulus ‘pass it now or the economy tanks’ pitch, that I just have to believe his estimates over the CBO estimates…I mean, the guy is a polymath after all…if it weren’t for his brilliant economic maneuvers so far, we would be at 150% unemployment.

AUINSC on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

Wait – can someone answer this?

Is the $4 trillion based on the cost for the INTENDED number of people to be covered?

Or does it include all of the people who are likely to be covered after most businesses dump their private insurance for the government option?

If it’s only the former, then has anyone calculated what it will cost when private insurers go out of business?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:17 PM

It’s only intended people… it does not cover the 30+ million who will lose their healthcare because of it, and thus will be forced to go on it.

They don’t want to acknowledge this will happen.

Enoxo on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

4 trillion is still low. We are talking about 1/5 of the entire economy that they want control over.

I’m saying if it’s less than 1T/year, I’d be shocked.

ThackerAgency on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

Has anybody ever heard of the Constitution?

Why is nobody categorically stating that any attempt to enact such legislation is illegal – as in, against the law….that law being the supreme law of the land?

Rather than dancing around the ‘penumbra’ of illegality we’ve tolerated over the decades, we now have a government-wide sprint away from the Constitution towards socialistic fascism.

10th Amendment, anyone? Bueller?

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

I’m sorry but I believe you are roughly 150 years behind the curve. Everybody knows the 10th amendment is a joke now-a-days so nobody bothers.

It’s sad, really.

Joe Caps on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

I forget exactly who it was but there was a famous mathematician that said: “There are numbers that are too staggering for people to comprehend; and they begin at 11″.

Jed_Eckert on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

The general populace is too ignorant and apathetic to pay attention to these staggering numbers.

PBoilermaker on June 25, 2009 at 2:08 PM

I think people don’t understand the difference between a million, billion and trillion. They probably just think the spelling is different.

We should keep the units the same, i.e. talk about millions (or billions). For example $4 trillion should be referred to as 4,000 billion dollars or 4,000,000 million dollars, depending on what you are comparing it to.

Remember when Obama asked for $15 billion dollars in cuts from our $1 trillion dollar budget and bragged about it. If the comparison would have been $15 billion out of a 1,000 billion dollar budget, people would have seen immediately that it was a joke.

Gotcha on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

Now I know why he won’t release his transcripts . . . he doesn’t want it known that he has never taken a math course in his entire life. He is absolutely lost when a number exceeds the sum of his digits.

rplat on June 25, 2009 at 2:21 PM

“Trillion” should never be used. How many zeros is that? We should always use the zeros or refer to it in how many millions. Not billions that is too big. I don’t know myself how many millions is in a Trillion but we are becoming numb to Obama’s huge numbers and they just don’t compute in our brains. Other references should be made… no short hand.

petunia on June 25, 2009 at 2:21 PM

I’m going with the 2nd Amendment.

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

Didn’t anyone ever tell you that it is very bad to shoot the nice people from the gubmint?

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:22 PM

The worst of it is that even taking the $4Trillion, there will yet be nothing to show for all the higher taxes beyond more failure in government service.

Those idiots who paraded Obama’s lower tax propaganda should be tarred and feathered in effigy, then hung and burned.

maverick muse on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Math is hard!

javamartini on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

How do I get a subsidy for Presidential-level insurance?

JohnJ on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

When the liberals are done “fixing” our country’s problems, we will be so indebted to China that we be its vassal state.

Loxodonta on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Democrats have no idea what they’ve done to us, and the economy, with their spending. I don’t think they have a clue as to actually how much $4 trillion is.

capejasmine on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Democrats know, they just don’t care. The goal has always been to make everybody dependent on government for basic needs. The whole point of the public plan is to kill private insurance so that every American is forced to be in the database when they start going out after other aspects of society. For example, why not add a tax if you exceed some government weight standard?

highhopes on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Excuse me for being OT, but could everyone take a moment to sign this petition to try and stop Pelosi again?

http://www.americansolutions.com/energytax/

scalleywag on June 25, 2009 at 2:24 PM

We should keep the units the same, i.e. talk about millions (or billions). For example $4 trillion should be referred to as 4,000 billion dollars or 4,000,000 million dollars, depending on what you are comparing it to.

Many of us feel the same. So a Trillion is 1,000,000,000,000? Is that right? Or are there more?

petunia on June 25, 2009 at 2:24 PM

It’s only intended people… it does not cover the 30+ million who will lose their healthcare because of it, and thus will be forced to go on it.

They don’t want to acknowledge this will happen.

Enoxo on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

Isn’t it more like an additional 250 million who will have to go on it? I mean EVERYONE who has insurance right now. There won’t be any private insurers left, right?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:24 PM

of, you could write, call your congressman

scalleywag on June 25, 2009 at 2:24 PM

Is that the same girl from the Burger King poster?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

I thought it was Diane Sawyer.

LibTired on June 25, 2009 at 2:25 PM

What exactly does $4 trillion and a public plan buy us, besides even higher deficits over the next ten years?

Hmmmm…that’s an easy one! In addition to staggering debt for $4 trillion we’d have a health care system on par with other government run entities, like Amtrak, VA hospitals, SS, and Medicade/Medicare…in other words pray we have enough smart people in government (on both sides of the aisle) to stop this socialist disaster before it happens, or if it does pass pray you never get sick or injured!

Liberty or Death on June 25, 2009 at 2:25 PM

Isn’t it more like an additional 250 million who will have to go on it? I mean EVERYONE who has insurance right now. There won’t be any private insurers left, right?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:24 PM

Eventually, yes. The entire reason behind this is to completely destroy and remove private insurance as an option. So yes… eventually it will be the rest of the private insurance.

The 30+ million who will lose their healthcare is the immediate effect after it’s signed.

Enoxo on June 25, 2009 at 2:25 PM

Won’t be long and the American people are going to be introduced to a new number. QUADRILLION
fourdeucer on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

Won’t be long before the ‘rats simply stop counting, telling us that “it costs what it costs.”

We haven’t even fairly calculated crap and trade yet, and that too is right around the corner. There is a reckoning coming, one that is going to make the Iranian protests look like a retirement home bingo game in comparison. The collapse is going to be ugly and violent.

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:26 PM

Isn’t it more like an additional 250 million who will have to go on it? I mean EVERYONE who has insurance right now. There won’t be any private insurers left, right?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:24 PM

In a sense, this is best hope if this traitorous legislation passes.

Everybody. All of us here. Every single person must immediately dump their insurance and go with gubmint.

It’ll implode within a year. The private sector insurance will reestablish itself.

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:26 PM

When the liberals are done “fixing” our country’s problems, we will be so indebted to China that we be its vassal state.

Loxodonta on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

My family discussed this last night. We decided to give California to China. We probably wouldn’t notice the difference except we’d have to use a passport to go to Disneyland. My son and family are living in California and are visting… at first they were opposed but then…. hey trade one communist state for another…. what’s the diff?

petunia on June 25, 2009 at 2:26 PM

For example, why not add a tax if you exceed some government weight standard?

highhopes on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

That Biegel “chick” could fund ObamaCare all by herself.

LibTired on June 25, 2009 at 2:26 PM

It’s so odd that the same liberals who claimed Bush’s Social Security plan (of allowing people to choose where their money goes) was too risky are also supporting Obama’s plan to rob Peter and give to Paul.
JohnJ on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

They don’t care, as long as Paul is guaranteed to vote for them.

MilSpec32 on June 25, 2009 at 2:27 PM

Democrats have no idea what they’ve done to us, and the economy, with their spending. I don’t think they have a clue as to actually how much $4 trillion is.

capejasmine on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

I disagree. Call me a wacko conspiracy nut, if you like, but I believe they’re doing all this over-the-top spending specifically to do over-the-top spending. Their goal is to create a total meltdown, after which they can “rescue” the country by discarding the constitution and implementing a totally new radically socialist government.

That’s the Saul Alinsky, Cloward-Piven, George Soros and ACORN approach to “change.”

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:27 PM

That’s okay, Ed…we can just print up some more money and we’ll be fine.

Right?

Right?

Bob’s Kid on June 25, 2009 at 2:07 PM

The bad news is, they ran out of paper…

gridlock2 on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Didn’t anyone ever tell you that it is very bad to shoot the nice people from the gubmint?
LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:22 PM

Someone might have, yes, sadly a lifetime of shooting has damaged my hearing. Ironic, is it not?

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Is that the same girl from the Burger King poster?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

Four trillion inches is just TOO MUCH!

HornetSting on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM

There are numbers that are too staggering for people to comprehend; and they begin at 11″.

Jed_Eckert on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

The other day Hannity expressed the futility in explaining anything to a dumb mule-headed Democrat ass who claimed that our government was already in debt, so the amount of debt bears no accounting.

Obviously, a welfare recipient mentality. Work? Nope. Bad credit? Yep. Expect a bail-out? Absolutely.

maverick muse on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Someone might have, yes, sadly a lifetime of shooting has damaged my hearing. Ironic, is it not?

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM

lol

My eyesight ain’t too good in my old age….but thankfully my aim is drawn to shiny badges.

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:30 PM

So Obamacare is four times as expensive as that Godzilla-sized stimulus bill that Obama had rammed through Congress in the opening days of his Presidency, and it buys us nothing, but instead restricts us to fewer choices than we have today. Great.

Aitch748 on June 25, 2009 at 2:33 PM

Notice that those, oh so in favor of the public plan, don’t enter threads when costs are discussed.

There’s a lesson there, somewhere.

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:33 PM

Social Security was our first government ponzi scheme. This will end up being the biggest and most expensive.

Jeff from WI on June 25, 2009 at 2:35 PM

The point of this sham health care crap, and going green crap legislation, is not that they want a better country for us. They want us all impoverished. Then, they exact the REAL control over us.

capejasmine on June 25, 2009 at 2:35 PM

holy sh*t! 4 trillion dollars for a medicore plan where most people lose thier private plan? ugh this sucks. not the best way to start my day. lol. lets fight this people!!

dee150586 on June 25, 2009 at 2:36 PM

Is that the same girl from the Burger King poster?

Daggett on June 25, 2009 at 2:09 PM

That’s exactly what I thought when I saw that picture.

These people see $4 trillion price tags and don’t even bat an eye? After what we’ve spent already in this administration? It makes me want to faint.

scalleywag on June 25, 2009 at 2:36 PM

Watch for any foreign press to be asked to leave the country, once this , and the energy legislation, are passed. Then the fun begins. We get whipped, beat, and shot into submission to the pecker wood.

capejasmine on June 25, 2009 at 2:37 PM

A thought occurred to me (it happens occasionally). It’s Ironic that Obama doesn’t want to interfere with doctor when a botched abortion results in live birth but has no problem doing so in every other situation. This man is a total psycho, evil SOB.
TheBigOldDog on June 25, 2009 at 2:10 PM

It must be some inate incapacity. He has the same problem not wanting to meddle with Iran’s, um, crowd control techniques, while telling Israel how to its internal affairs.

Akzed on June 25, 2009 at 2:37 PM

When the liberals are done “fixing” our country’s problems, we will be so indebted to China that we be its vassal state.

Loxodonta on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

We’re not gonna be that fortunate- China is looking at Obama going “what the **** ?”

jjshaka on June 25, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Notice that those, oh so in favor of the public plan, don’t enter threads when costs are discussed.

There’s a lesson there, somewhere.

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:33 PM

The trolls have been scarce for about a week now. They can’t even defend this bullsh*t!

HornetSting on June 25, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Rangel said yesterday that he’s hearing the same things about OboobaCare he heard about Medicare, which was supposed to cost a few billion a year.

Uh, yeah.

Akzed on June 25, 2009 at 2:40 PM

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM
I am at the point of not just sniffing Hoppes #9, I am about to start snorting it.

fourdeucer on June 25, 2009 at 2:40 PM

The State of Texas unemployment fund is running into deficit, so the news word is to double the cost employers pay. Damn, but that really hurts small businesses especially hard, manufacturing already in a slump and employees laid off during the economic downswing that’s stuck in the mud. Legal workers will remain laid-off so much longer because of the increased expense in rehiring, whether to fund unemployment benefits or additional mandates for funding $4trillion health insurance.

maverick muse on June 25, 2009 at 2:40 PM

I’m sure we can find $4 Trillion in ‘waste’ that can offset these costs. Obama says so.

mperek on June 25, 2009 at 2:40 PM

…79 million covered lives with the majority people leaving their employer sponsored medium PPOs and HMOs.

They’re not even considering the effect on the economy once they drive private insurers out of business.

I did a quick query on health insurance providers and was frankly amazed at the numbers. There are hundreds of companies employing hundreds of thousands of people.

First, what’s the effect on the economy once these people are unemployed? Government net cost increases due to less payroll taxes received, increased payouts in unemployment and other social insurance, and now, government healthcare. The negative effect on local economies will be staggering.

Second, these companies pay in the range of a hundred billion dollars in corporate income tax per year. How will that federal revenue be replaced?

Great plan Obama. Decrease federal revenues by billions, increase gov’t spending by billions due to unemployment solely due to the desire to give everyone free healthcare by spending trillions.

BacaDog on June 25, 2009 at 2:40 PM

The Julius & Ethyl Rosenberg got executed for giving the Soviets secrets. Obama is a hero for doing more damage to America than the Rosenbergs.

Jeff from WI on June 25, 2009 at 2:43 PM

There are numbers that are too staggering for people to comprehend; and they begin at 11″.

Jed_Eckert on June 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

The other day Hannity expressed the futility in explaining anything to a dumb mule-headed Democrat ass who claimed that our government was already in debt, so the amount of debt bears no accounting.

Obviously, a welfare recipient mentality. Work? Nope. Bad credit? Yep. Expect a bail-out? Absolutely.

maverick muse on June 25, 2009 at 2:29 PM

Why would they care? They dont pay taxes.

mperek on June 25, 2009 at 2:43 PM

I’m sure we can find $4 Trillion in ‘waste’ that can offset these costs. Obama says so.

mperek on June 25, 2009 at 2:40 PM

President Clot will be able to ‘save’ 4 trillion by not adding more liberal projects into the budget – then he can pay for Obamacare with that.

See? Life’s easy when you’re a retard.

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:44 PM

10th Amendment, anyone? Bueller?
LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:15 PM

I’m going with the 2nd Amendment.

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

Given that Congress will be exempt from the plan and the unions will be exempt from taxes on health care I’m going with the 14th Amendment:

“no state shall … deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws”.

Trafalgar on June 25, 2009 at 2:44 PM

None of these projections make much sense, frankly.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:45 PM

When the liberals are done “fixing” our country’s problems, we will be so indebted to China that we be its vassal state.

Loxodonta on June 25, 2009 at 2:23 PM

This was recorded at Kiev, a Russian restaurant in Beijing.

maverick muse on June 25, 2009 at 2:45 PM

HornetSting on June 25, 2009 at 2:38 PM

Browsed Karl’s ObamaCare infomercial thread for the usual suspect?

Loxodonta on June 25, 2009 at 2:46 PM

None of these projections make much sense, frankly.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:45 PM

Simply reject the outcome out of hand because it makes you uncomfortable? Study the numbers.

maverick muse on June 25, 2009 at 2:48 PM

None of these projections make much sense, frankly.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:45 PM

And they sprang from such fertile ground….

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:48 PM

If they managed to pass this, it will take an armed revolt to overturn it. It will create a HUGE voting base for anybody that wants to keep it to campaign against people who want to end it.

You’ve seen how it destroys campaigns to even appear to threaten any Senior program, like SS or Medicare. Can you imagine, with 79 million more people on government healthcare, how hard it would be to campaign with a position of “turning healthcare back over to the private sector? You have to lie your way into office, and how are you going to get a legislative majority of people who all lied about their intentions toward healthcare to get into office so they coudl change it?

It has to be killed BEFORE it happens. After is nearly impossible. As a matter of fact, expanding it (without mentioning how much more it will cost) will become a campaign promise politicians WIN on.

PastorJon on June 25, 2009 at 2:50 PM

None of these projections make much sense, frankly.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:45 PM

If anything, they are too conservative.

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:50 PM

Seriously, CA can’t project for 6 months without being wrong.

It’s all too dependent on the economy.

So the projected costs?

It’s all just about assumptions, etc.

Too complex to be meaningful to people.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:51 PM

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:51 PM

Hopefully the following is not too complex for you:

What you are advocating is illegal

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 2:53 PM

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