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ObamaCare: $4 trillion in costs

posted at 2:05 pm on June 25, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
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We warned that the Democratic Party estimates of $1 trillion in costs for ObamaCare were far too low, and now Congress has had this confirmed.  In testimony before a House subcommittee on the health-care industry on Tuesday, Dr. Stephen Parente of the University of Minnesota gave the real numbers on the cost of ObamaCare.  It’s as bad as we predicted (via Yid with Lid):

There are two things people most want to know from these proposals. One, how many uninsured will be covered? Two, what will it cost the nation in one year and in ten years?

HSI estimates, like CBO’s recent results, find there is no free lunch to expand health insurance coverage. Our early assessment of the Senate Finance committee proposal shows a 74% reduction in the uninsured with a 10 year cost of [$]2.7 trillion using public option plan modeled after the Massachusetts Connector.  We also modeled an FEHBP version of the public plan and got a cost of over [$]1.3 trillion, but with a 30% reduction in the uninsured.

The $1 trillion number doesn’t even tickle the meter, and that’s a big problem for Democrats.  They argue that the reforms will save a trillion dollars, making ObamaCare deficit-neutral over ten years, but none of the plans come in under that price.  Just to move 30% net of the uninsured onto health plans will take more that $300 billion above that ceiling, making it an addition to an already astronomical deficit pattern.

To move most of the uninsured — net, again — onto health-insurance plans, it will take more than double the cheapest version of ObamaCare.  But that’s not the final word:

CBO scored the Kennedy Bill last week at approximately a 30% reduction for 1 trillion over ten years. Using the ARCOLA model, we found nearly everyone would be covered if all elements of the Kennedy bill were enacted at a ten year cost of 4 trillion. That 4 trillion estimate over 10 years assumes a public option plan with Bronze, Silver and Gold levels in the proposed insurance exchange with a subsidy for premium support that is income-adjusted and calibrated for assistance at the Silver level. The Silver level is equivalent of PPO plan with medium levels of generosity, something with 15% coinsurance rate, manageable copays and average level of access to physicians and hospitals. We accounted for the public plan being reimbursed at 10% above Medicare reimbursement, which is also 10% below commercial insurance premiums.

Let’s break that down carefully.  What exactly does $4 trillion and a public plan buy us, besides even higher deficits over the next ten years?  A “medium” level of generosity for the Silver plan, with an “average” level of access to physicians and hospitals.  On top of that, the plan still underpays providers with even the 10% boost over Medicare payments, which no one is suggesting will remain permanent.  And that will only still cover “nearly everyone,” a measure Dr. Parente doesn’t explain in his statement.

And to answer Nate Silver, what happens to the private market when this “average” and “medium” plan gets implemented?

Because the public plan can compete with the individual and group market private sector offering, we saw a crowd out resulting from the public plan of 79 million covered lives with the majority people leaving their employer sponsored medium PPOs and HMOs.

In other words, almost a third of all covered Americans would get thrown out of their current plans and onto government-paid care.

Parente included this warning:

As a nation, we are on the verge of making multitrillion dollar gamble that more per capita health care deficit spending will make us better off as a society. We are wagering with starting bids in the trillions that excessive spending into the healthcare system accelerates breakthrough medical technologies that can eliminate whole diseases, like diabetes or Alzheimer’s, in ways similar to the innovations introduced over half a century which reduced tuberculosis from being one the leading causes of death.

It is not an unreasonable wager, since federal funding for heart disease and cancer either directly through research or indirectly through Medicare has yielded state of art medical care. But it is a wager nonetheless, and we may find our reckoning is not only with the future debt of our children, but their security where the economic crisis has brought international scrutiny upon the US from the principal purchasers of our treasuries. Furthermore, saving businesses from paying health care costs or a state government with federal intervention is simply an accounting cost shift that only saps our long term economic strength.

These numbers show that without a doubt.


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In 2006, all US income tax paid: $1.025 trillion. ObamaCare STARTS at $4 billion for 10 years. In reality, it would blow by that number without even pausing.

Mallard T. Drake on June 25, 2009 at 3:55 PM

I’m a bit north of B’more. I hope the crabs are plentiful and heavy.

Laura in Maryland on June 25, 2009 at 3:50 PM

The crabs are great, the beer is cold and the weather’s beautiful…come on down!

Trafalgar on June 25, 2009 at 3:55 PM

AnninCA:

Although I completely disagree with your argument, I do appreciate the way you make it. Some call yo troll, but you aren’t. You are just misguided. Please continue to read HotAir, and continue to comment. We’ll get you there.

Buford Gooch on June 25, 2009 at 3:56 PM

I’ve never had a claim denied. Never. I’ve got 3 kids, one with a relatively rare condition that has required regular expensive treatment since he was born, and many many specialist visits his first few months. Never a single question about whether a treatment would be covered. I have actually changed insurance companies a few times since the affected kiddo was born, and no one ever had an issue with it.

The vast majority of Americans are satisfied with their own coverage. They are concerned about other’s perceived lack of access to care, but to say that “the mantra is deny, deny, deny” is to ignore reality.

Life is not a John Grisham novel.

DrSteve on June 25, 2009 at 3:36 PM

It must be a DrSteve novel then…everyone must have your luck and life or they’re lying.
My mother had to spend her life savings and sell stuff to get cancer treatments…not that it did any good. But I’m glad your experience has been so wonderful.
I have no idea why I’m even commenting here. The majority of people here are so partisan and base all things on just that…so much so that you’d sell your own mothers for politics. Yes, I really with all my heart believe that.

beekiller on June 25, 2009 at 3:58 PM

I joined the rebels down south

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 3:43 PM

Where about, sir? I’m in Tennessee.

ladyingray on June 25, 2009 at 3:58 PM

This Obamacare simply takes us a great leap forward to:

“Logan’s Run – CAROUSEL”

AnninCA, we club you to death first since you are so happy to volunteer yourself to support this government euthanasia.

And don’t keep thinking that the whole rest of the country is as messed up as CA, its’ not.

Quit the touchy-feely stuff and start thinking analytically and honestly for just once on this site.

Sapwolf on June 25, 2009 at 3:58 PM

Sapwolf on June 25, 2009 at 3:58 PM

I call dibbs on her organs, but Ed gets first pick or course.

Laura in Maryland on June 25, 2009 at 4:01 PM

Anni, hon. Did you go back to get more talking points from Soros? Grown ups are in the house, and we aren’t swayed by cow plops.

You may be the first casualty of methane taxes.

Laura in Maryland on June 25, 2009 at 4:03 PM

I like the idea of a barter system for medical services. New replacement windows installed for open heart surgery. Seamless aluminum gutters and flashing for a tonsillectomy.

Jeff from WI on June 25, 2009 at 4:04 PM

Trafalgar on June 25, 2009 at 3:54 PM

I’m covered by the “LimeyGeek Doesn’t Give A Shit About Your Nazi Law” Act ;)

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 4:05 PM

Jeff from WI on June 25, 2009 at 4:04 PM

How about “Sex for Surgery”? Open up a line of prostitution-driven healthcare.

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 4:08 PM

Where about, sir? I’m in Tennessee.

ladyingray on June 25, 2009 at 3:58 PM

Not too far from you ;)

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 4:08 PM

Anna:

My mother was destitute when she died and she was on Medicare when she got sick. She had a stroke and then she got cancer. Her first surgery in 1997 was $347,000. Imagine what it would be today. Before it was all said and done we had to sign her entire social security check over the nursing facility where she received 24 hour a day care. I paid for her clothes and day to day needs myself. Obama’s plan would not have made any difference for my mother. None. The point being that when people get to the point my mother was their needs are paid for. One way or another. It will never be free.

My father was in his 50s when he died of cancer in a VA hospital.

So both of my parents died slow and painful and expensive deaths. However, nothing that Obama is proposing here would have made their lives or deaths any easier.

You seem to think that if we have some kind of plan that voila! costs will go down, health care will be cheap. It won’t be. Someone will have to pay.

Terrye on June 25, 2009 at 4:08 PM

Are you complaining that the democrat $1 trillion number is wrong or the $4 trillion number? Think it’s higher than both? Lower than both? Somewhere in the middle?

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 2:53 PM

All of this is overlooking a serious problem… and that’s about the rise in the uninsured when the private insurance businesses go belly up.

It’s all a kabuki theater. I’d guess what price it would actually be… but liberty is hard to value.

I’m reminded more and more of this vid all the time.

Chaz706 on June 25, 2009 at 4:08 PM

PackerBronco on June 25, 2009 at 3:32 PM

Thank you.

txag92 on June 25, 2009 at 4:11 PM

Chaz706 on June 25, 2009 at 4:08 PM

Obama said that’d be illogical! Businesses can exist with unfair competition from the government!

lorien1973 on June 25, 2009 at 4:12 PM

In other words Ann, even people with insurance and Medicare and all the rest will have to pay. It will not be free. I know you think that if Obama passes this plan people will not have to pay for health care. That is not true. Even people with insurance go broke,happens every day.

Terrye on June 25, 2009 at 4:13 PM

The government-schooled American dumbMass sheeple don’t care what it costs, as they actually believe they are going to be getting free health care.

This idiocy is going to wipe out our nation if these people aren’t stopped.

-Dave

Dave R. on June 25, 2009 at 4:13 PM

Let’s try again:

In 2006, all US income tax paid: $1.025 trillion. ObamaCare STARTS at $4 billionTRILLION for 10 years. In reality, it would blow by that number without even pausing.

Mallard T. Drake on June 25, 2009 at 3:55 PM

Mallard T. Drake on June 25, 2009 at 4:14 PM

The truth is people with a terminal prognosis will not even get the kind of care they can get now. They will just give them morphine and send them home. Why waste the resources? Unless of course they have the money to pay for the treatment themselves somewhere else.

Terrye on June 25, 2009 at 4:19 PM

In fact I saw this at powerline:

With the advent of Obamacare, there will be a lot more of this:

President Obama suggested at a town hall event Wednesday night that one way to shave medical costs is to stop expensive and ultimately futile procedures performed on people who are about to die and don’t stand to gain from the extra care.

In a nationally televised event at the White House, Obama said families need better information so they don’t unthinkingly approve “additional tests or additional drugs that the evidence shows is not necessarily going to improve care.”

He added: “Maybe you’re better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller.”

And remember, in the words of singer/songwriter Leonard Cohen, “there ain’t no cure for love.”

I guess that means he would have just let my mother die. Why waste the money on her treatment?

Terrye on June 25, 2009 at 4:23 PM

Seriously, CA can’t project for 6 months without being wrong.

It’s all too dependent on the economy.

Too complex to be meaningful to people.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:51 PM

Ever wonder why Cali can’t project for 6 months? I grew up in NoCal (Bay Area) and I can tell you Cali having budget issues is nothing new. The Cali government has been for the most part (since I can remember) controlled by ultra-liberal dems for quite some time (even when they have a Republican governor) and their budget woes are because liberal Cali dem politicians have effectively overspent to install all of their social programs, benefits, and rights specifically for those “victims” unproductive citizens that live off the gubment dole! It sure isn’t the hard working taxpaying citizens that benefit from all these pet social programs as they don’t qualify because they ACTUALLY WORK FOR LIVING and earn too much money, yet they keep paying the price!

Now add to this the fact Cali is not a “right to work state” (like Arizona and other states are) and because of this the Cali gubment bestows lots of lavish benefits and rights to workers that love to take advantage of those rights and benefits (I’ve seen it first hand) and all these lavish benefits and rights cost money and directly impact the cost of doing business in Cali.

Then add one more factor into this equation and that is the over the top regulatory requirements the Cali gubment imposes on businesses, regulatory requirements that are always more stringent than the rest of the nation. Now when you combine all of these factors I mentioned businesses (the state’s tax base) start leaving in droves, then the productive working people of Cali (those that don’t benefit from all the nicey-nice things the Cali gubment gives away) start following the jobs and leave the state (another tax base lost) and all of this in turn dries up your tax revenues and viola you have a huge budget deficit like Cali does!

For these reasons and others is why Cali is constantly on the edge of financial ruin and can’t predict a budget let alone balance one, however this time I think they’re really up a creek without a paddle and may not recover and they have no one to blame but the ultra-liberal dems that have done nothing but drive away it’s productive tax base all in the name of giving away the farm to enable generation after generation of “victims.”

So now the federal government after increasing our debt by more than 1 trillion dollars wants to get involved in the health care business for another 4 trillion so that all of the poor “victims” of big business that are being denied health care coverage will now have it! I’ve been working since I was 13 and once I turned 18 I’ve had health insurance through my employment, that is not luck that’s working for a living and working for a company that provides health care coverage as a benefit. While it has become more and more expensive over the years I continue to pay my portion so I have health coverage when it’s needed.

Based on our government’s poor track record in managing services/programs such as Amtrak, Social Security, the VA (in particular the stellar medical services the VA provides) and Medicare/Medicaid I don’t need gubment health care, and I sure as hell don’t want it and how anyone would think a government run health care system would be better is out of their friggin mind!

A gubment run health care system will bankrupt our nation (hell SS is almost on the verge of being bankrupt) it will dramatically lower the availability and quality of health care, it will limit a person’s choice in how they manage their health care, it will be a disaster of biblical proportions and our health care system may never recover from it! But hey, it’s all good as long as all those poor “victims” that are being denied health care coverage because of the mean and greedy corporations finally get their “free” health care coverage paid for by all us working stiffs!

Seriously AnninCA, if the financial problems Cali is having isn’t proof enough that you can’t sustain a viable state/nation when you constantly give away the farm to the few at the expense of the many (those would be the hard working and productive tax contributing citizen and/or the businesses that employ them) then nothing will convince you this is a very bad idea that will in the long run destroy our health care system and seriously damage our nation economically…this fact is not too complex to understand or have meaning, at least anyone with a functioning synapse!

Liberty or Death on June 25, 2009 at 4:32 PM

The truth is people with a terminal prognosis will not even get the kind of care they can get now. They will just give them morphine and send them home. Why waste the resources? Unless of course they have the money to pay for the treatment themselves somewhere else.

Terrye on June 25, 2009 at 4:19 PM

They may get an option for doctor assisted suicide or a Do-it-youself painless suicide kit.

belad on June 25, 2009 at 4:37 PM

Seriously, CA can’t project for 6 months without being wrong.

It’s all too dependent on the economy.

So the projected costs?

It’s all just about assumptions, etc.

Too complex to be meaningful to people.

AnninCA on June 25, 2009 at 2:51 PM

The thing is, when has the government ever missed a projection where we wound up paying less?

Tonus on June 25, 2009 at 4:39 PM

Won’t be long and the American people are going to be introduced to a new number. QUADRILLION

fourdeucer on June 25, 2009 at 2:11 PM

That’s the idea. When quadrillion is the new billion, trillion becomes the new million.

jimmy2shoes on June 25, 2009 at 5:26 PM

Nobody understands what money (currency) actually is and how it functions in an economy.

It’s all just a cascade of skittles….

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 5:29 PM

It’s all just a cascade of skittles….

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 5:29 PM

do you have diff. color skittles, or do you stick to one?

JiangxiDad on June 25, 2009 at 5:32 PM

do you have diff. color skittles, or do you stick to one?

JiangxiDad on June 25, 2009 at 5:32 PM

Since they taste like chewy urinal blocks, I avoid the revolting things entirely

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 5:34 PM

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 5:34 PM

I’m partial to the gold ones these days, but à chacun ses goûts.

JiangxiDad on June 25, 2009 at 5:38 PM

Staggering numbers.

Captain America on June 25, 2009 at 5:38 PM

JiangxiDad on June 25, 2009 at 5:38 PM

I’m more of a jerky guy….heavy on the pepper

LimeyGeek on June 25, 2009 at 5:40 PM

Liberty or Death on June 25, 2009 at 4:32 PM

Well said. Absolutely on point.

Zorg on June 25, 2009 at 5:58 PM

President Obama suggested at a town hall event Wednesday night that one way to shave medical costs is to stop expensive and ultimately futile procedures performed on people who are about to die and don’t stand to gain from the extra care.

In a nationally televised event at the White House, Obama said families need better information so they don’t unthinkingly approve “additional tests or additional drugs that the evidence shows is not necessarily going to improve care.”

He added: “Maybe you’re better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller.”

Just exactly how can most intelligent President in history miss the point by a country mile? Seriously just how short-sighted is he? What if he were around on December 2, 1967 and was the one who was in charge of deciding if Barnard and Schurr could go ahead with that really expensive first heart transplant that really was likely to be futile for THAT FIRST PATIENT? Where would we be now??? Let’s for a moment go back in time about 25 years and Obama was in charge of deciding the fate of the PC industry. An IBM PC that had 2 256k floppies, no hard drive, a monochrome monitor and a dot-matrix printer was about $5,000 IN 1984 DOLLARS (~$10,000 now). What if he said it was too expensive and not all could afford them (a truism) and said we all need to use slide rules. I mean, after all, we did get Apollo 13 back. Wait, what if he were in charge of deciding about NASA spending? Get my point – things are expensive when they first come out, then they become cheaper, more efficient, and better over time (recent history: the iPhone is now $99 versus, what $499 from 3 years ago). Doesn’t the smartest man in the history, this god-man, understand this? This is just the tip of the iceberg on what will be jettisoned with Obamacare (future enhancements on insulin pumps for diabetics from Wikipedia):

• When insulin pump technology is combined with a continuous blood glucose monitoring system, the technology seems promising for real-time control of the blood sugar level. Currently there are no mature algorithms to automatically control the insulin delivery based on feedback of the blood glucose level. When the loop is closed, the system may function as an artificial pancreas.

• Insulin pumps are being used for infusing pramlintide (brand name Symlin, or synthetic amylin) with insulin for improved postprandial glycemic control compared to insulin alone.

• An insulin pump that can be surgically implanted inside the body will be available soon by Medtronic. It is the approximate size of a hockey puck, and communicates via RF to an external control. It is refilled by injection through the skin, and holds approximately 2 weeks of insulin.

I’m diabetic and these are like the feeling I had as a child on Christmas mornings.

Jed_Eckert on June 25, 2009 at 6:35 PM

I hope you remember how he said he was going to to nothing about the legal liability doctors face. So when Granny doesn’t get the care she should – guess who gets sued. Nice way to improve access for the illegals.

MidWestFarmer on June 25, 2009 at 10:53 PM

These numbers show that without a doubt.

The problem with showing liberals numbers is that they say you aren’t accounting for the “human factor,” which they equate to mean numbers don’t matter.

ConservadorRebelde on June 26, 2009 at 1:59 AM

I have no idea why I’m even commenting here. The majority of people here are so partisan and base all things on just that…so much so that you’d sell your own mothers for politics. Yes, I really with all my heart believe that.

beekiller on June 25, 2009 at 3:58 PM

I’m curious as to why you’re commenting here as well. Apparently, when the discussion does not go as you feel it should, you make crude ad-hominem insults. And you have the nerve to complain that it is others who are “so partisan.”

Tonus on June 26, 2009 at 8:13 AM

With respect to the good doctor who made that report, and to everyone else trying to reveal the truth…I fear we are too late.

I don’t know what fortune everyone else has had in trying to educate people on Obamacare, but I have accomplished ZIP. I’m lucky to get past square 1* when I publicly challenge this crap in the slightest.

*square one being parroted insults/strawmen/etc. like this response:

“Rightards are funny.

They lie that it’s going to fail without any proof it will do so. The selfish REpublican fucks who have coverage couldn’t care less about those who don’t. The fact that we waste double the money and don’t even cover everyone doesn’t matter to morons.

Hey, Republican moron, what’s the overhead on Medicare versus private care? Do you dishonest rightards even bother looking this stuff up, or do you figure just making up lies is good enough?”

Dark-Star on June 26, 2009 at 3:26 PM

is simply an accounting cost shift that only saps our long term economic strength.

This is what he wants.

GunRunner on June 26, 2009 at 4:09 PM


I’m going with the 2nd Amendment.

Bishop on June 25, 2009 at 2:18 PM

You know, I was hoping to get out of this Without using the 2nd, but that hope is getting further and further away. When they come for the “uncooperative” Doctors, It’s on.

GunRunner on June 26, 2009 at 4:19 PM

The true cost of this obamafiasco will be measured in funerals, coffins and creamations of our loved ones. All government run health care results in RATIONING.

We were just in Italy and needed a medical diagnosis quickly. I was surprised when the doctor got us into a private hospital the next day. Of course, we had to pay a couple of hundred euros for an ultrasound. I asked about their socialized medicine. The reply was “if you went to the public sector, you would have to wait a minimum of six months for the ultrasound”.

Obamamama wants to put everyone (except for the political hacks) on obamacare.

Here is a thought. How about printing up a pledge to shove in front of your congresscritters that says “I, Congressman D. Ogfart, will not accept any special health care that is only offered to members of congress and high governement officials. I will use the same health care as the rest of america”

Let’s see how many of the democrap socialist jerkwads will sign that. If they don’t then publish the list of the greedy elitist b*stards who will have a gold plated plan for their families and fatal rationing for ours.

(Guess I’m getting ever further onto “the list”)

bullseye on June 26, 2009 at 4:56 PM

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