Lieberman: We should “loudly and clearly” stand with the people of Iran
posted at 9:15 pm on June 15, 2009 by Allahpundit
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In fairness to The One, I’m sure he sympathizes with the people against the regime. It’s his moronic belief that “engagement” will get the mullahs to give up nukes that leads him to soft-pedal his criticism of their brutality. It’s a sucker’s game, though: Drudge is leading tonight with ominous warnings of “repercussions” to come from an American expert on Iran, which any of us could have predicted (and did). As Michael Totten so eloquently put it earlier today, the idea that Iran’s prepared to give up its nuclear program for any sort of concession is “delusion on stilts.” Barring an astounding sustained effort in the streets by Iran’s population, the regime will be in no mood after this to negotiate, which makes Obama’s best bet full-throated support of Mousavi and the protesters. Roll the dice, Barry. Fight now or fight later.
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integrity
rob verdi on June 15, 2009 at 9:18 PM
woot woot
Upstater85 on June 15, 2009 at 9:18 PM
Obama – Fight Never!!!!
myrenovations on June 15, 2009 at 9:18 PM
Refuse to recognize…its the right thing to do.
ernesto on June 15, 2009 at 9:18 PM
Fight now! (as if he would)
ThePrez on June 15, 2009 at 9:18 PM
Yeah, Lieberman is no conservative, but I think I could have voted for him if he promised to be a one termer…
Upstater85 on June 15, 2009 at 9:19 PM
Really? I think he sees his future.
Ronnie on June 15, 2009 at 9:19 PM
Wow… you’re giving him more credit than I am.
Upstater85 on June 15, 2009 at 9:20 PM
And I’m sure the Iranian people are gratified to know that they have his sympathy. Sympathy doesn’t do much against bullets, though.
TheQuestion on June 15, 2009 at 9:21 PM
Well, support of the protesters.
I’m not so sure any of us should be in a rush to praise or be associated with Mousavi in any way. But hopefully this movement is bigger than just him.
sandberg on June 15, 2009 at 9:21 PM
Barrack Obama has already officially voted present on this issue, please move on, nothing to see here…
doriangrey on June 15, 2009 at 9:23 PM
Enslaved. They are slaves to the regime Obama , how about helping them to freedom like Bush.
the_nile on June 15, 2009 at 9:23 PM
Are you trying to say here that Mousavi will somehow magically stop the march toward nuclear armament?
Are you trying to say here that Mousavi will somehow magically stop the march towards the elimination of Israel?
What exactly are people saying here who support Mousavi? Because Mousavi is saying he supports the Islamic Republic 100 percent and that includes the constitution which gives these Mullah’s so much power. Nothing changes with Mousavi except you get a more attractive face – who’ll still push the nuclear button on Israel. Is this what we really want?
We need these fights in Iran to go as long as possible. Be non-committal to either side – constantly paying lip service to whomever is losing. Right now I think the government is losing so we should pay lip service to them. The mullahs can easily install Mousavi and work with him – the same way they did with Rafsanjani. People seem to forget – there WAS another reformer – and I believe his record was a bit less stained with blood than Mousavi’s is.
And he didn’t do a darned thing for reform.
HondaV65 on June 15, 2009 at 9:26 PM
Totten seems to think the Khomeinists are a monolithic group. I disagree. The longer this plays out, the wider the fractures grow. And as Tapper points out, even if it makes us feel better about ourselves, full-throated support of Mousavi would only boost Ahmadinejad’s case.
I don’t think he has much say in the matter either way.
Siobhan on June 15, 2009 at 9:26 PM
Ever since 1979 we haven’t had diplomatic relations with Iran. Obama needs to call the election a fraud, as does every other democratic leader in the world. But, I am not going to hold my breath.
SC.Charlie on June 15, 2009 at 9:27 PM
Other than his own comments this evening, what evidence is there of this?
Why should we believe that Obama wants Iran to give up it’s nukes, except perhaps in exchange for Israel’s?
I suspect Obama never had any intention of fighting Iran now, or later, or ever, over its nuclear ambitions. Barry’s sights are set on Israel. Scores to settle.
JiangxiDad on June 15, 2009 at 9:28 PM
Take a good look at what is happening over there. That’s what Obama has in store for the U.S. Do as I say.
suzyk on June 15, 2009 at 9:28 PM
Lieberman spoke of supporting Radio Farda and this is what I pulled out of Wikipedia on what it is:
Radio Farda is a Persian language radio station based in Prague and Washington, D.C.[1] Supported by the U.S. government to the tune of about $7 million annually,[2] Radio Farda broadcasts political, cultural, social and art news with emphasis on Iran (Persia). The name “Farda” means “tomorrow” in Persian. Radio Farda’s website has been blocked by the Iranian government.
Radio Farda was launched in 2003 as the successor to the Voice of America’s Persian Service. Its news website was launched in 2006. As of 2006, it had ten news staff in Washington, D.C. and 28 in Prague. While it aims at providing news (and news often unavailable in Iran), it mainly provides music in an effort to reach younger audiences, which is seen as the best way to show American values to Iran where non-religious music is often banned or limited.[2]
An Iranian-American journalist working for Radio Farda, Parnaz Azima, was banned from leaving Iran after her trip to the country. Her passport was later returned to her on a 550,000 U.S. Dollar bail.
DL13 on June 15, 2009 at 9:29 PM
I tend to agree. From our standpoint, the status quo may be the best. Mousavi is no less threatening than Ahmawhatever, but he is much more intelligent. And, since nothing will change on the nuclear front, he will be more dangerous with the backing of the Mullahs and the populace.
genso on June 15, 2009 at 9:29 PM
I give the BHO “learn as you go” crew 36 hours to figure out a way to have the esteemed Senator from Connecticut arrested.
StockOption on June 15, 2009 at 9:29 PM
Might disrupt their peas-ful culture… /sarc
Upstater85 on June 15, 2009 at 9:30 PM
Thank you, Sen. Lieberman, for standing up for freedom. I’m sure some of your Democratic friends are less than pleased with you tonight.
kingsjester on June 15, 2009 at 9:32 PM
When I was a little kid growing up with air-raid sirens and duck n’ cover drills in elementary school, I used to pray to God that the nukes would come as I and my family slept so we could all die in our sleep. No dying in horror at the spectacle unfolding before us. No pain.
Then as an adult I watched the Berlin Wall come down, the USSR was no more, and the break-away Republics all around the former USSR took up democratic elections and were no longer as oppressed by the Bear as they had been. The joy I felt for that whole time frame was only slightly over-powered by the sense of relief that nuclear war wasn’t as imminent as it once was. My children could grow up in a relatively safer environment and they wouldn’t have that ominous nuclear war shadow over them constantly, as I once did.
Now, between Iran, N. Korea, Pakistan, and India (not to mention China and still Russia) I fear for my children and my grand-children as never before. I am so very sorry for them and privately saddened that they have to grow up in this time as the entire world turns a blind eye to a coming catastrophe that hasn’t been more obvious since the Cuban Missile Crisis.
As for me… I still pray for peace, and I have again taken up praying for the nukes to come as I and my family sleep. No dying in horror at the spectacle unfolding before us. No pain.
SilverStar830 on June 15, 2009 at 9:33 PM
To be clear (channeling my inner Obama) any comments I may write in support of the people of Iran has nothing to do with Mousavi.
myrenovations on June 15, 2009 at 9:33 PM
It would be more in keeping with precedent if he had some thugs vandalize Lieb’s property & then have the D-of-J drop all charges against them.
jgapinoy on June 15, 2009 at 9:34 PM
You’re right, Joe. It is too bad that your party is the place of gutlessness and appeasement.
Phil Byler on June 15, 2009 at 9:39 PM
Is Joe Lieberman going to become Obama’s Vince Foster???
doriangrey on June 15, 2009 at 9:40 PM
Fight Now and Iran without nukes or fight later an Iran with nukes you pick.
Fight now!
Burn through and break the Iranian communications black out, TV, Radio, Internet, subversion, organize the students, arm them with captured Qods force armaments, let loose the Iraqi Peshmerga in Iranian Kurdistan, Arm the Balochis, Arm the Azeris, sabotage the Gasoline storage facilities on the Persian Gulf…
That’s right off the top of my head…go! go! go!
Oh wait. We have a cowardly cretin in charge…oh well maybe the IDF will pull our chestnuts out of the fire.
elduende on June 15, 2009 at 9:40 PM
Lieberman is old-school!
Obama is new,oops I mean
idiot school!!
canopfor on June 15, 2009 at 9:42 PM
At best, Lieberman gets a gentlemen’s C. He’s wrong as often as he’s right. It’s just the times that make him look so statesmenlike. As you say, he has some awfully strange pals. Also, when he’s right on foreign policy, and takes a public stand, it seems to me that it’s often when Israel’s security is involved. That doesn’t make him wrong, just narrowly focused.
JiangxiDad on June 15, 2009 at 9:42 PM
fight now or fight later
a-a-um-er present.
SHARPTOOTH on June 15, 2009 at 9:45 PM
Senator Lieberman is one of the few (only?) Democrats who is like the traditional liberal Democrats I remember when I was young. The difference between Lieberman and most (nearly all?) other Democrats is his greater consistency and morality in general, his greater conservatism on national and international security, and moderation on the economy and the budget. This means he still differs on many things with conservatives, but wouldn’t it be wonderful to have more people like this in the “opposition” party?
This is the sort of person with whom I enjoy having a disagreement because I can learn from it. I respect such people. May I have more, please?
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 9:46 PM
Yes, true. This does makes a HUGE assumption that BHO can learn and then effectively apply what he has learned. Call me skeptical.
StockOption on June 15, 2009 at 9:46 PM
Haven’t read the book of Revelations have you…
1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. 5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. 6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double. 7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow. 8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.
9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning, 10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.
11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more: 12 The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble, 13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men. 14 And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all. 15 The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing, 16 And saying, Alas, alas that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls! 17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off, 18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city! 19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate. 20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.
doriangrey on June 15, 2009 at 9:46 PM
Presumes facts not in evidence.
MB4 on June 15, 2009 at 9:46 PM
Can’t the guy just eat his waffle?
ronsfi on June 15, 2009 at 9:47 PM
That Cairo Speech looks like amateur hour at present…
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 9:48 PM
Fat chance. He will never engage Iran with any sort of spine. He is the 21st century Jimmy Carter, and his worldview brooks no reality.
peski on June 15, 2009 at 9:48 PM
No, Barry has another option. Ignore it. If you ignore it, it didn’t happen. If it didn’t happen. No problems. If there are problems down the road, “It’s all Bush’s fault”. Simple.
GarandFan on June 15, 2009 at 9:49 PM
Funny. John Kerry weighs in:
JiangxiDad on June 15, 2009 at 9:49 PM
Well, in all honesty, he took a stronger stance in the limp wristed Cairo speech than he did today… SAD
Upstater85 on June 15, 2009 at 9:50 PM
The Obama/Clinton II (I don’t mean Hillary) administration is incapable of honest remarks. All things have to be triangulated and poll tested before a response is crafted.
With polls clearly favoring the protesters look for Obama and crew to start yapping about it.
Lieberman has no such constraints, nor did Bush for that matter. This alone assures Bush’s star rising going forward.
patrick neid on June 15, 2009 at 9:52 PM
Mr. President, the people want you to support the Iranian protesters.
Uhhh, Ummm. If I abort them, will my poll numbers go down again?
Noo..no Mr. President, I said…Aww nevermind.
the Coondawg on June 15, 2009 at 9:52 PM
Doing so doesn’t further his vision of the ME or America, so why do it?
JiangxiDad on June 15, 2009 at 9:52 PM
You’re right hadn’t read it. Thank you. Now lets see how it continues to play out.
elduende on June 15, 2009 at 9:53 PM
Anything that undermines the Achmadinejad-ist ayatollahs.
Even if we only get their slightly-less-insane religious cousins, at this point, slightly-less-insane may be all you can HOPE to CHANGE about the-country-formerly-known-as-Persia.
Obama should picture the Iranians in the streets as the demonstrators at the 1968 Chicago Democratic Convention.
Maybe then he’ll act to help them.
profitsbeard on June 15, 2009 at 9:53 PM
Oh Great Orator… the masses await.
But seriously, Mullahs might allow one more day of protests before blood spills.
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 9:54 PM
Allahpundit: Roll the dice, Barry. Fight now or fight later.
I’m not sure he has dice. And the only time he fights is when he’s fighting for himself, so…
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 9:54 PM
When I was a little kid…..
SilverStar830 on June 15,2009 at 9:33PM.
SilverStar830:
I do remember growing up,with the threat of Nuclear War,
and even though,I don’t live in America,I do live near a
shipping locks,and believed we were a target!
I have to admit,this period right now,has to be one of
the most dangerous periods of history,it is the hottest
its ever been,and I understand where your coming form!
We,are living,as far as a Nuclear Strike,the most dangerous
time ever!:)
canopfor on June 15, 2009 at 9:54 PM
Obama gives a speech on nuclear proliferation, and North Korea lights off a nuke. Obama gives a speech in Cairo about a “new diplomacy” to the Muslim world, and Iran begins to go up in flames. Seems to me that the biggest threat to global security is Obama’s teleprompter. If Obama gives a grand speech about border security and a “new era” with our “friends” to the South, then I’m going to hunker down!
Weight of Glory on June 15, 2009 at 9:55 PM
Thanks for speaking out in this manner, here and on the other thread.
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 9:56 PM
King Tut has never fought for anything that wasn’t rigged or corrupted that would ensure he would not loose……..
Seven Percent Solution on June 15, 2009 at 9:56 PM
Wow, wow, wow. Methinks Kerry has started to inhale again….puff, puff, puff, gunboat commander.
StockOption on June 15, 2009 at 9:56 PM
upstater85…
percisely my point.
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 9:56 PM
Jimmy Carter’s Playbook HAS BEEN STOLEN!
DeathtotheSwiss on June 15, 2009 at 9:59 PM
Not to threadjack but this may be Relevant To Your Interests and I’m not sure if HA has a tipline:
Jim DeMint endorses Marco Rubio
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20090615/pl_politico/23754
Siobhan on June 15, 2009 at 10:01 PM
Well,um..ah..I..have..um..spoken..ah..to..supporters..in..
ah..Tehran,and..um..i..have..ah..ah..assurances..um..that..
ACORN..is..doing..ah..a..good..job,and..ah..the..Leader..
of..ah..um..ACORN..ah..is ..um..telling me..ah..that..um..
it..should be..um..ah..two more days..to..um..shoot,um..
no..i..ah.meant..to..um..say..rap up..ah..the protests..
and ah..um..restore..democracy..um..ah..wait..I..I..ah..um
meant.ahh to say..um..restore..ah..um..the Mullahs ah..ah..
their democracy..and ah..um..um..—-(Snark).
canopfor on June 15, 2009 at 10:04 PM
My guess is that Barry is quiet because he is taking notes on how the resistance is being handled. Might come in handy.
Star20 on June 15, 2009 at 10:07 PM
I’m think more … what’s the term?
Cabaret?
Count to 10 on June 15, 2009 at 10:07 PM
I understand that Mousavi is only a “moderate” among Islamic radicals, and he would continue to be a threat to Israel, the region and the world. However, I don’t want to see thousands or tens of thousands of Iranian civilians killed to sustain the mullahs first choice for president. Instead, I would like to see if the Iranians can move toward democratic self governance with greater liberty and justice for all, even though I have great doubts that that can happen.
The issue of Iran’s nukes can be dealt with at any time that Israel feels is necessary, hopefully with American support and with as few deaths as feasible. I don’t see how remaining neutral in the face of brutality helps Iranians, Israelis, Americans or anyone else, other than serving as a signal to brutal tyrants around the world to have at it with their own citizens.
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:07 PM
Thanks for the link. And yes, HA does have a tipline. You can email them to:
tips@hotair.com
Ed and AP are really good at putting tips in the Headlines and in the main columns, so send it in.
Weight of Glory on June 15, 2009 at 10:07 PM
You do that far too well.
Who are you and what have you done with canopfor?!!!
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:09 PM
Hmmm, John McCain just now on Greta Van Sustrand called the Iranian election a disgusting fraud and said we should denounce it.
doriangrey on June 15, 2009 at 10:09 PM
Siobhan on June 15, 2009 at 10:01 PM
GN- I am backing Rubio. Thx
bazil9 on June 15, 2009 at 10:09 PM
Count to 10…
Yikes, Obama the Musical!
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 10:11 PM
You are probably right and I might be mixing Lieberman up with fond memories of my youth.
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:11 PM
Slightly OT: But very relevant.
Hitchens speaking truth to power:
http://www.slate.com/id/2220520/
elduende on June 15, 2009 at 10:12 PM
Who are you and what have you done with canopfor?!!!
Loxondonta on June 15,2009 at 10:09PM.
Loxondonta: Good evening Lox,I hope this night is finding
you well!
I have my moments of creativity,haha!:)
canopfor on June 15, 2009 at 10:13 PM
You think Letterman was bad, Matthew Yglesias is even worse…
Matthew Yglesias does some fun role playing!
Mr. Joe on June 15, 2009 at 10:14 PM
I would like to know, specifically, who is advising BHO on this Iran election…
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 10:14 PM
Bantam class.
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:16 PM
Obambi hates democracy. He’s a closet Muslim and I’m sure would hate to see the current Iranian government over-thrown. The only country he will ever be “tough” on is Israel – the only one who really deserves our help. To think that our tax dollars are going to Iran through the IMF is absolutely, completely infuriating. OBAMBI SUCKS!
johnnybgood on June 15, 2009 at 10:17 PM
But very relevant.
elduende on June 15,2009 at 10:12PM.
elduende: The End game is the Iranian Bomb!
Now that Egypt has spoken about not accepting
Isreal as a State,it is clear as a bell!
Isreal is alone!:)
canopfor on June 15, 2009 at 10:20 PM
See, I struggling with Barry being a closet Muslim… which sect does he support?
Upstater85 on June 15, 2009 at 10:22 PM
Oops,that should read,Israel!!Ugh.
canopfor on June 15, 2009 at 10:22 PM
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 10:14 PM
his mother in law.
SHARPTOOTH on June 15, 2009 at 10:24 PM
Thanks, I sent it in :)
Siobhan on June 15, 2009 at 10:26 PM
Time to jump the aisle all the way, Joe.
Hell, if Snowjob and Collins can call themselves Republicans, why not you?
SuperCool on June 15, 2009 at 10:29 PM
We need an Iranian Election Czar…
mjbrooks3 on June 15, 2009 at 10:30 PM
Hah Canopfor you beat me to it!
I’m sure glad that whole Cairo speech went over well with the Arabs, the Israelis, and the Iranians. It’s been about as well received as an Air Force One flyover of downtown NYC…bwahahahah!
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1244371100536&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
Couple that with the smackdown Merkel and Sarkozy provided bambi over Iran.
And the Gitmo releases in Bermuda and Palau fiasco…
and we have…
drip, drip, drip, Bambi’s foreign policy has officially imploded! LOL! Go Barry go! don’t change a thing moron!
elduende on June 15, 2009 at 10:30 PM
What a breath of fresh air in comparison to Obamatard’s BS response.
infidel4life on June 15, 2009 at 10:31 PM
Hmmm, That reminds me of back during 2008 when John McCain was on Greta Van Sustrand and he called Barack Obama a disgusting fraud and said we should denounce him.
Oh wait! He never did say that, did he? He said that Obama was a good man whom we didn’t have to be afraid of.
John “A diez late and a peso short” McCain.
MB4 on June 15, 2009 at 10:32 PM
Anyone up for a round of golf?
Dusty on June 15, 2009 at 10:33 PM
“In fairness to The One”
huh?? WHY???
His silence is being read, correctly, by the Mullahs that ANYTHING GOES!!
fairness to The One? How about fairness to the Iranian people???
Justrand on June 15, 2009 at 10:38 PM
The mullahs know exactly who they are dealing with in regards to Obama. The real problem is Obama doesn’t have a clue who he is dealing with. Little Kim is ecstatic. He is about to test the envelope and the repercussions could be deadly. Lets hope that we still have a country after these Chicago thugs get through with us.
volsense on June 15, 2009 at 10:40 PM
I’ve noticed, and am glad you do. Thanks.
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:42 PM
Obama should do what he always does — lie. Say one thing and do another, and then say the opposite and do what he said in the first place.
Daggett on June 15, 2009 at 10:45 PM
FIFY
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:46 PM
Hitchens as usual cuts through some BS: “Fascism at home sooner or later means fascism abroad. Face it now or fight it later. Meanwhile, give it its right name.”
Mr. Joe on June 15, 2009 at 10:48 PM
Wouldn’t the Iranian students be surprised that their biggest cheerleader in the United States government is Jewish?
Cindy Munford on June 15, 2009 at 10:48 PM
In fairness to Allahpundit,
there are simply some things that one must say.
Can I tell you what he believes? No way.
But I do so enjoy his wit.
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:52 PM
Thank you so much for that. The irony is so thick and rich and sweet.
Now I’m hungry!
Loxodonta on June 15, 2009 at 10:53 PM
Good point.
The Iranians will think fondly of this moment when they wipe Israel off the face of the earth.
Daggett on June 15, 2009 at 10:56 PM
I grilled steak and made s’mores tonight. Good stuff.
Cindy Munford on June 15, 2009 at 10:57 PM
Obama will opt to fight now. Fight Lieberman, that is.
As far as Iran goes, he’s still working on a stern-sounding speech that sounds balanced and places just enough blame on America to justify including a mild criticism of slaughtering protesters in Iran.
DrAllecon on June 15, 2009 at 11:03 PM
Another snarky comment about the destruction of Israel. Can’t this stop?
clnurnberg on June 15, 2009 at 11:15 PM
And don’t tell me what a realist you are.
clnurnberg on June 15, 2009 at 11:16 PM
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