Doctors oppose “public plan” in ObamaCare
posted at 2:15 pm on June 11, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
The AMA has a long history of supporting government-subsidized health care, but has always drawn the line at a system of socialized medicine, ie, single-payer. The current plans wending their way through the House and Senate would normally have gotten enthusiastic support from the AMA, but the association has balked at a key proposal from the administration:
As the health care debate heats up, the American Medical Association is letting Congress know that it will oppose creation of a government-sponsored insurance plan, which President Obama and many other Democrats see as an essential element of legislation to remake the health care system.
The opposition, which comes as Mr. Obama prepares to address the powerful doctors’ group on Monday in Chicago, could be a major hurdle for advocates of a public insurance plan. The A.M.A., with about 250,000 members, is America’s largest physician organization.
While committed to the goal of affordable health insurance for all, the association had said in a general statement of principles that health services should be “provided through private markets, as they are currently.” It is now reacting, for the first time, to specific legislative proposals being drafted by Congress.
The AMA wants the legislation to focus on leveraging private-market insurance instead of government-backed plans, and for good reason: they’ve dealt with Medicare. Many doctors have given up on Medicare altogether, refusing to take any new Medicare-insured patients, because Medicare doesn’t cover the costs of providing their service. Medicare is also a paperwork nightmare, as I can attest from first-hand experience. They often withdraw payments already given to doctors a year or more later over some hiccup in their internal accounting. The headaches of getting reimbursements makes Medicare business unprofitable.
However, as the New York Times’ Robert Pear reports, the public plan is the key element to ObamaCare. The White House claims that they want to use it to keep insurers “honest,” but competition and sensible regulation do that. They want to have an option to offer a loss-leader plan that will undercut the private insurers on price so that they will get forced out of the health-care sector, which will leave a single-payer plan in place by default. The AMA understands this better than anyone, and will mobilize to keep from getting locked into a Medicare nightmare with no escape.
To a certain extent, though, the AMA brought this upon themselves. Pear also reports that they broke with a trend of supporting Republicans in national elections in 2008, giving 56% of their donations to Democrats. They got the Congress and the White House they wanted, even though Obama and the Democrats made it perfectly clear how they envisioned ObamaCare. I’m glad to see the AMA fighting this, but they deserve the Captain Louis Renault Award for their shock, shock! that Democrats want to impose socialized medicine:
Well, at least they’re blowing the whistle now.
Blowback
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The list of fake veterans is amazingly long. People don’t normally challenge someone who says they’re a veteran, out of respect. And most conservatives wouldn’t think of posing as a veteran, so we don’t think to doubt such claims. Many libs hate the military, and can’t imagine why someone would claim veteran status when they’re not. But then, there’s the money. And it’s easier to be a loser when you claim veteran status, because at least then people respet you for SOMEthing.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 4:53 PM
Wow.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 4:53 PM
While it is true that most libs hate the military, I just thought I would appeal to conservatives’ compassion by noting that many homeless people are veterans.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 4:54 PM
SG – why is it greedy for a doctor to want to be paid for his labor but not greedy for some person who shows up in the ER and expects be to taken care of for free because they don’t have insurance? These people don’t offer to work for the doctor for free to compensate him for saving their lives.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 4:55 PM
I fear that greed and conservatism and hatred of the poor and dehumanization of the homeless all go hand in hand.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 4:55 PM
I know, I don’t shed tears and wail about the plight of the “homeless”.
That’s because I know that they are bums and parasites, who could actually be productive citizens who contribute something, but that they’d rather drink and drug their days away.
I believe more in them, than they do in themselves. And that is sad.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 4:55 PM
Now the ugliness of the anti-healthcare crowd rears its very disturbing, ugly head.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 4:56 PM
Where is your compassion?
Where is your empathy?
I am crying right now.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 4:56 PM
Please show us where anyone on this blog mentioned hating or dehumanizing the homeless.
Knucklehead on June 11, 2009 at 4:57 PM
Perhaps you’ve never spoken to anyone who actually worked with so-called “homeless” veterans, who tried to get them DD-214s so they could get care in a VA hospital and that the so-called “veterans” never actually served a day.
Of course they call themselves veterans, what do you expect them to do? Hold up a sign that says, “please give me money to buy liquor, I’m a hopeless drunk” and tell the truth?
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM
This is what separates the Statist trolls from everyone else – you can’t have a decent debate with these people.
You try to ask them a simple question, and they are off to the races on some irrelevant tangent.
What is wrong with having a simple discussion with people instead of spewing mindless drivel and talking points?
Chainsaw56 on June 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM
Ding! +1,000.
SouthernGal, most conservatives don’t hate anybody. But we believe in individual liberty. That means we’re all free to succeed OR fail. And conservatives generally are willing to help people who need temporary assistance. But the sympathy runs out when able-bodied leeches chose to stay in the gutter. There’s no shortage of help for people who want help. But why should I help someone who wont’ help themselves?
I used to serve food at the Salvation Army. I gave it up when I got tired of the homeless people turning up their nose at the free food provided by hard-working people who often had less on their own plates.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM
Where is your brain?
Where is your intelligence?
I am sighing right now.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 4:59 PM
Now the ugliness of the anti-healthcare crowd rears its very disturbing, ugly head.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 4:56 PM
How exactly? What is disturbing about asking a simple question? Nothing. You just can’t answer the question, so you attack the questionner.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 4:59 PM
LOL
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:00 PM
I dunno, I just find it very disturbing to dehumanize homeless people and those who find themselves in emergency rooms with no health insurance.
I think this is why healthcare must be guaranteed for all Americans — because there are greedy people out there who believe Americans should be turned away from an ER and left to die.
I believe some doctors are also like this.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:01 PM
laughter even on the internet is not an answer. You can’t think so you LOL.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:02 PM
C’mon now. You’re busy putting people in categories. People are individuals. What produces poverty? Liberal policies. Name a liberal policy, and we’ll be glad to show you empirical evidence of how that policy producers poverty and dehumanization.
How on earth does a conservative’s hard work, or even greed, cause poverty? Work creates wealth. Laziness creates poverty.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 5:03 PM
These are very simplistic and incorrect answers to a very complex problem.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:05 PM
You do realize that under current law (and it existed during the Bush Administration as well) that no one can be turned away from an emergency room.
Anyone who is “homeless” is covered by Medicaid in any case. Just another instance where they contribute nothing, yet get productive people to give them something for nothing.
But of course, we’re all heartless and greedy, because we don’t spend every waking moment caring for and crying over the plight of the sainted “homeless”.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:05 PM
Where does this happen? WORKING Americans already pay for free ER healthcare throught he mechanism of higher premiums. Hospitals are required to treat anyone in need of care, regardless of ability to pay.
If it were happening, it would be a problem. But unless you can show us a case of a poor person being refused treatment, you’re just spouting talking points.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 5:05 PM
That would have been fun exercise.
WashJeff on June 11, 2009 at 5:06 PM
Whereas “I know greed when I see it” is a very nuanced and definitive answer to the problem, I see.
Are you sure you don’t work for the Obama administration? Because that’s about the mentality we get out of them, as well. Arrogance and stupidity in action.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:07 PM
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:01 PM
Them’s fighting words. Do you know know what EMTALA stands for? Have you ever shown up in an ER and been turned away for lack of funds? Do you believe the type of person who goes into medicine because they want to help sick people, rather than business or law would ever in a million years turn someone away in an ER and leave them to die? You are sick and confused.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:07 PM
Why do you hate the minorities? The individual is the smallest minority and their rights must be protected abouve all others. That is the fundamental tenet of conservatism. Or as Obama would say, ‘the pillar that holds up the foundation.’
Socialism dimishes the rights of the individual and institutionalizes tyranny. I’m sure you don’t want to wake up every day awaiting your orders for what time you wake up, what you will eat, how much exercise you should have, what car or transport will get you to your job, what jobs is available, how much that job pays, and on and on and on. If you cannot see the slavery that is collectivism, and are not sincerely willing to see what the logical outcome of having that worldview is, then you deserve to be a nameless, faceless cog of inhumanity.
daesleeper on June 11, 2009 at 5:07 PM
Please show us where in the Constitution is says we should be guaranteed healthcare.
And when you get done with that, please show us statistics where people are turned away from ER’s to die.
Knucklehead on June 11, 2009 at 5:07 PM
That’s a law conservatives want to overturn.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:09 PM
I’m happy to go deeper. Name a greedy GOP policy, and I’ll show you how it reduces poverty. Show me a Dem policy, ANY policy, and I’ll show you how it increases poverty.
Any policy. Just name one. Simplistic and incorrect, how so? It’s easy to be “nuanced”, but the truth is pretty simple. Work produces wealth.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 5:09 PM
Really? Show us the bill. http://thomas.loc.gov/
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 5:10 PM
The above said by the person who has a blanket hatred for anyone who doesn’t share her political views and has never ever worked on behalf of the poor or homeless because she is too damn greedy!
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 5:10 PM
Right there where it says “a right to privacy”.
Don’t worry, liberal judges will hallucinate one into the Constitution.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:11 PM
Poverty increased during the Reagan and Bush administrations.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:11 PM
Give us proof of where the conservatives want to overturn that law.
Links please. Either put up or shut up.
Knucklehead on June 11, 2009 at 5:12 PM
I hope so!
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:12 PM
I have a feeling that many conservatives would rather undocumented Americans are turned away from the ER if it meant that white taxpayers would have to pay for them.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:12 PM
Perhaps, but it’s quite evident that stupidity is skyrocketing during the Obama Administration.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:13 PM
Just so you know, when a sentence ends with “?” symbol, it’s a QUESTION.
[Oh no! Scare quotes around the ? Symbol, OMG, I'm demonizing punctuation symbols!!!]
Chainsaw56 on June 11, 2009 at 5:13 PM
Ahhhh…..I see, throw out the race card as a last resort. You would make Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton proud.
Knucklehead on June 11, 2009 at 5:15 PM
I’m all for it as long as SouthernGal’s from Israel are forced to scrub out their bedpans. I mean, it’s just the compassionate and empathetic thing to do, don’t you agree?
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:15 PM
What is an “undocumented American”? Would that be someone who can’t produce a birth certificate yet claims to be born in America?
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:16 PM
Someone asked a question, I answered it.
You know conservatives want to ban undocumented Americans from being allowed to be admitted to ERs in a medical emergency.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:18 PM
Yes.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:18 PM
Yeah. The problem with debating liberals is that you never get into specifics, because they don’t have any. Take the “training for green jobs” canard.
Ok, let’s say you’re in Cleveland, and you’ve gotten 2 weeks of training in building wind turbines. Now what? You need to find a wind turbine manufacturer willing to hire you. And since you can’t sell your house, you need to find one IN CLEVELAND. Or drive a long way, on high-priced gas created by our lack of domestic oil production.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 5:18 PM
It’s someone who isn’t “greedy” and the proof of that is, that they allow other people to provide them with everything they need to live, while contributing nothing to society.
Very simple.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:19 PM
What’s the point of this lying troll but to run up thread counts? It certainly isn’t the same as unique hits, so I don’t see how it benefits HotAir.
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 5:19 PM
Shouldn’t you be reporting for bedpan duty? C’mon, they’re piling up.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:20 PM
I think I will offer docs continuing education in carbon trading. that is where the money is limotless. No litigation and CO2 is invisible.
Just a little reality therapy for the Doc haters. Every time a surgeon sees and operates on an aids infected patient, his own life is at risk. A doc can get aids from a patient. pick up a dirty needle, slip or whatever. A democrat can’t get aids from his keyboard or from watching Oprah.
seven on June 11, 2009 at 5:21 PM
You mean like our dear leader? I will have to start calling him an undocumented American.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:23 PM
Nobody’s stopping you.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:25 PM
…or hepatitis or swine flue or a myriad other infectious diseases…but after all who cares about those greedy doctors anyway, they’re only in it for the money…
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:29 PM
Hey what do you think of Michelle Malkin? Tell us what you really think?
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 5:29 PM
Well, they need to just suck it up and risk their lives, don’t they?
Say the online purveyors of “compassion” and “empathy” from their comfy sofas.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:32 PM
Is she the woman who stalked and harassed a family that was advocating for social justice and healthcare reform?
If so, I think you know my opinion of this woman. :)
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:35 PM
Boo. Freakin’. Hoo.
Suck it up.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:35 PM
Translation: Extortion/shake down scheme.
Again, shouldn’t you be scrubbing bed pans down by the ER? Where is your empathy and compassion?
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:36 PM
+1000
Callie C. on June 11, 2009 at 5:38 PM
Guys? You’re not making any progress, and she’s having fun. Why not starve her of attention instead? Maybe she’ll go away.
…unless, that is, you’re having fun poking at her…
ElvenPhoenix on June 11, 2009 at 5:38 PM
So how do you plan on enforcing your non-greed vision on the rest of us?
Are you going to farm that out too?
What is it about you compassionate leftists that you can’t do any actual work yourselves, but you have a vision where the rest of us will just slave our lives away?
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:39 PM
I’m just a little mouse in a room full of elephants. All I gotta do is mention words like greed, empathy, and compassion and they run around in a stampede.
It is great.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:40 PM
I really want Bawny Fwank and Pelosi and Obama to make my healthcare decisions for my family.
elduende on June 11, 2009 at 5:40 PM
Progress? Has anything productive ever come out of an internet comment thread?
I’m just killing time, toying with this endearing dope. It’s like a cat playing with a ball of yarn.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:40 PM
Why would you ever accuse Michelle Malkin of stalking?
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 5:41 PM
I read in Newsweek that she stalked some family because they dared to support healthcare.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:43 PM
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:45 PM
More like a cat playing with a mouse, don’t you think?
ElvenPhoenix on June 11, 2009 at 5:45 PM
Well, there’s one person in this country who still reads Newsweek and who actually believes what’s “reported” in it. You learn something new every day.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:46 PM
In all seriousness, there are many physicians who dedicate their lives to caring for the poor and who are poor as a result. They are living saints.
But to expect to build an entire healthcare system on the belief that living saints can care for a nation of 300+ million, is sheer lunacy.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:48 PM
Naive, or just plain stupid and in denial? The local newspaper here (city of 750,000 people & on the Mexican border), has pro-Obama care readers who write letters to the editor all the time. The most ridiculous one I’ve read; that all of us against Obama’s healthcare plan are wrong, his plan is not socialized medicine, it won’t be provided by the government, but by private entities. Boy, does Obama ever have these people fooled! Who the heck do they think is going to run it? As long as the American people remain so ignorant, our government will be able to call all the shots.
Susanboo on June 11, 2009 at 5:49 PM
I appreciate your heart for the poor/needy. Where we differ is on how best to help them.
And I’ll wager my family gives more to charity, and lives at a lower standard of living, than yours.
jazz_piano on June 11, 2009 at 5:49 PM
Exactly what did specifically do for Newsweek and you to claim that she stalked some family because they dared to support healthcare?
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 5:49 PM
No fair.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:50 PM
That didn’t come out right.
Specifically, what did she do for Newsweek and you to claim that she stalked some family because they dared to support healthcare?
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 5:50 PM
She went to a family’s house and yelled at them etc for supporting healthcare.
SouthernGal on June 11, 2009 at 5:51 PM
Really? Could you provide a link to that article? That’d be over the line, if it were true. But without reading the article and checking some facts, I’m inclined to doubt it.
hawksruleva on June 11, 2009 at 5:52 PM
Wow! A lot of trolls sure signed on to comment on HA this last time they opened it up.
Susanboo on June 11, 2009 at 5:52 PM
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:48 PM
I certainly don’t disagree with you. Especially with respect to the size of our country, which the proponents of single payer always forget when comparing us to other countries that have single payer.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:52 PM
I’m sure “supporting healthcare” in the brain that is SouthernGal’s, is what would be to normal people, “campaigning for Group A to be forced to provide goods and services to Group B”.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:54 PM
P.S. Something I don’t get about those (mostly lefties) who make the most noise about helping the poor:
Why is their focus almost always on the ‘poor’ here, most of whom would be middle class by world standards, instead of on the poorest of the poor dying of disease and malnutrition in other countries?
jazz_piano on June 11, 2009 at 5:55 PM
They also conveniently forget that our federal government makes a complete botch of everything that they touch and that Congress is particular is famous for politicizing programs.
Do we really want illnesses to be treated based on what special interest group has the most clout? Because that’s where we’re headed.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 5:56 PM
Sick and confused, and unfortunately there is no known cure.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 5:57 PM
jazz_piano
They don’t actually want to help the poor, they want the government, i.e. taxpayers, to help the poor. If it comes out of their pockets, forget about it.
txmomof6 on June 11, 2009 at 6:01 PM
For people so concerned about the poor, I notice that they seem to spend a tremendous amount of time online, not doing a damned thing to “help” them.
NoDonkey on June 11, 2009 at 6:01 PM
Well, of course–it’s the greedy rich people and evil corporations who should be helping (through sky-high taxes), not little ol’ me.
jazz_piano on June 11, 2009 at 6:07 PM
They don’t really have the neurons to do anything significant. However, anybody could work in a soup kitchen, so you’re right.
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 6:08 PM
Proof please. Link to the article please.
Knucklehead on June 11, 2009 at 6:16 PM
Seems that SouthernGal is allergic to logic, facts and links but I think this is what she’s talking about.
http://michellemalkin.com/2007/10/17/newsweek-goes-nutroots/
Reid/Pelosi wanted to use Graeme Frost as a posterchild for SCHIP, and Michelle actually had the Malkins to ask a few questions about the family’s income, assets etc. and whether they were actually “the poor” who needed healthcare assistance.
Not quite a Prop 8 type of “donate and I’ll publish your info/ostracize you” kind of campaign, but the libs run with what they can dig up.
cs89 on June 11, 2009 at 6:29 PM
Sen. Grassley, told Andrea Mitchell today that he was against the public health insurance option because…
What does that say about the present health care system in America? If more than 75% of the people are supposedly satisfied with the insurance they now have; why would so many leave it for a public option?
Has it come down to purely a pocket book issue?
Geezer on June 11, 2009 at 6:35 PM
The government broke health care to begin with. Politicians (especially the Corrupt Corporatist Clowns in the 111th CONgress) are the last people I want “fixing it.”
How Government Solved the Health Care Crisis
Medical Insurance that Worked — Until Government “Fixed” It :
Know what else? Harry Truman insisted any government health care plan should be optional for patients, doctors and hospitals, and that maintaining free-market medicine was essential. The Democrats today do not want either, no matter how they’re spinning it. They will kill off private insurance and free-market health care because nothing can compete with the government’s endless resources or its ability to make laws to benefit the gov’t option in order to harm the private option.
Put everyone not covered on Medicare already and be done with it.
Rae on June 11, 2009 at 6:45 PM
SouthernGal is at the HA frontier of pioneering the most entertaining idiocy on the board.
getalife and strangelet were mere mild predecessors.
HA should send them all, but SG (the not Gent version) monetary rewards for increasing traffic and for concurrent free entertainment.
The rest of you, stop paying taxes – this is where they’re going, into complete ciphers, with their chief at the pinnacle.
Schadenfreude on June 11, 2009 at 6:46 PM
The Ronin Edge on June 11, 2009 at 6:43 PM
Apparently the trolls drive up comments, so the mods are incredibly patient with them. Only a few hotbutton phrases seem to get them ejected.
Of course, if long-term commenters complain in the comments, AP hyperventilates in his Twitter feed. He’s had a couple of interesting “HotAir Comment of the Day” tweets lately.
He can run the site however he wants to. My only advice is- If multiple commenters talk about how you are unbalanced on a particular topic (Palin, anyone?) or that troll infestations make the site less enjoyable, he might want to consider the possibility that some of them are right.
FWIW.
cs89 on June 11, 2009 at 6:51 PM
Don’t trouble yourselves with Southern Gal…she’s 100% troll…ignore her long enough, she’ll rant, rave, lose her mind, and get the ban hammer…
…at least, that’s my plan.
ladyingray on June 11, 2009 at 6:53 PM
She’s crying one moment and laughing out loud the next. She’s obviously bi-polar.
Puddleglum on June 11, 2009 at 7:05 PM
So sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but getalife is back with a new name “gotmylifeback”
-)
Knucklehead on June 11, 2009 at 7:11 PM
Uh oh. Under ObamaCare those with a chronic mental illness are euthanized to keep costs down. Well, she kept yapping about being a patriotic American and not greedy, so she shouldn’t complain about taking one for the team.
Blake on June 11, 2009 at 7:22 PM
Rae on June 11, 2009 at 6:45 PM
So what you’re saying Rae is, that the government broke the private medical coops…
Yesterday they decreed legal minimums and today they are attempting to impose legal maximums.
That’s the absolute epitome of all governmental interventionist irony.
Geezer on June 11, 2009 at 7:30 PM
What libs like SG fail to realize is that greed is a part of human nature. It cannot be legislated away. One does not have to be wealthy to be greedy either. The able-bodied that live on the dole when they could work are just as greedy as the white collar embezzler. They both want something for nothing. And ironically, libs are big fans of socialism which is a system based on greed and envy of one’s neighbor. Socialism breeds a society of dependence and stifles independence and creativity. It’s destroyed Africa & South America and now the libs want to force on the American people. They’ll never learn.
drflykilla on June 11, 2009 at 7:34 PM
Conservative understand greed isn’t going away, so they use it to motivate people to be more productive.
Liberals understand greed and know that class warfare is a way to get votes.
pedestrian on June 11, 2009 at 7:42 PM
;-)
Puddleglum on June 11, 2009 at 7:57 PM
drflykilla on June 11, 2009 at 7:34 PM
Yep. Part of the Founders’ genius was recognizing human frailty and working around it. Checks and balances, etc.
Worked pretty well so far. We’ll see if Obama is able to pull of his “benevolent dictator” schtick.
cs89 on June 11, 2009 at 8:26 PM
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