Matthews on Palin: It’s “paranoid” to think big government leads to controlling the people

posted at 7:45 pm on June 5, 2009 by Allahpundit

Yeah, seriously. When has that ever happened? Eight years of leftist caterwauling about the coming Bush dictatorship was not, of course, “fear, fear, fear,” but simply prudent, responsible small-R republicanism in response to an expansion of executive power. Now we’ve got a liberal nationalizing major banks and the American auto industry, with health care on the way, and the thought that this might mean a heavier federal hand over the population is an idea worthy of the X-Files. The tax burden alone to pay off our astronomical debt will mean significantly less freedom over how we spend our income; pile on green regulations and the inevitable rationing of medical care to handle demand and you’re well into European “third way” territory. Is that “control” enough for you, Chris?

I honestly wonder how to explain his incredulity here at such a basic economic point. Is it dishonest propaganda for The One? Honest spinning because he believes Obama’s intentions are good, notwithstanding the various reports we’ve had of him strong-arming executives and creditors of failing companies? Or is it sheer contempt for Palin blinding him to the merits of her point? I have a crazy hunch that if an anti-war kook like Ron Paul made the same libertarian argument, Matty would find it perfectly agreeable.

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Look how much the Iraqi insurgents are costing us with jury-rigged bombs and whatever guns they can smuggle in – most of which are cheap clone crap?

Actually, they are getting a lot of relatively new weaponry from Iran and occasionally Syria.

18-1 on June 5, 2009 at 9:53 PM

Wait a second. I thought Palin was done, toast, damaged beyond repair, an afterthought. Why are Politico and MSDNC covering this supposed nobody like she’s someone important??

Erich66 on June 5, 2009 at 9:54 PM

From his point of view he’s correct. I believe the MSM thinks THEY control us.

Look around you. Pick up any newspaper and read the headlines. Isn’t it coming? Isn’t it here? Every single thing I told you? Isn’t Europe swallowed already and we’re stumbling on to follow? Everything I said is contained in a single word–collectivism. And isn’t that the god of our century? To act together. To think–together. To feel–together. To unite, to agree, to obey. To obey, to serve, to sacrifice. Divide and conquer–first. But then–unite and rule. We’ve discovered that one at last. Remember the Roman Emperor who said he wished humanity had a single neck so he could cut it? People have laughed at him for centuries. But we’ll have the last laugh. We’ve accomplished what he couldn’t accomplish. We’ve taught men to unite. This makes one neck ready for one leash. We found the magic word. Collectivism. Look at Europe, you fool. Can’t you see past the guff and recognize the essence? One country is dedicated to the proposition that man has no rights, that the collective is all. The individual held as evil, the mass–as God, No motive and no virtue permitted–except that of service to the proletariat. That’s one version. Here’s another. A country dedicated to the proposition that man has no rights, that the State is all. The individual held as evil, the race–as God. No motive and no virtue permitted–except that of service to the race. Am I raving or is this the cold reality of two continents already? Watch the pincer movement. If you’re sick of one version, we push you into the other. We get you coming and going. We’ve closed the doors. We’ve fixed the coin. Heads–collectivism, and tails–collectivism. Fight the doctrine which slaughters the individual with a doctrine which slaughters the individual. Give up your soul to a council–or give it up to a leader. But give it up, give it up, give it up. My technique, Peter. Offer poison as food and poison as antidote. Go fancy on the trimmings, but hang on to the main objective. Give the fools a choice, let them have their fun–but don’t forget the only purpose you have to accomplish. Kill the individual. Kill man’s soul. The rest will follow automatically. ~ Ellsworth Monkton Toohey

BrideOfRove on June 5, 2009 at 9:55 PM

Eh. Earlier I was reading about this nazi school in Zakopane, Poland. It was how to be sadistic cruel to Jews before you kill them school. They would ship in children from Auschwitz because they like to practice their shooting on moving targets. There is no end to the cruelty of those people.

And to add insult to injury, the few that were brought to justice were released almost immediately from prison.

Blake on June 5, 2009 at 9:55 PM

Actually, they are getting a lot of relatively new weaponry from Iran and occasionally Syria.

18-1 on June 5, 2009 at 9:53 PM

Did not know that…yikes. The answer of course would be to blast those Iranian camel jockeys into the Stone Age – but our forces are already badly overextended, and national willpower is fading fast. D**n it. As if I hadn’t seen enough bad news lately.

Dark-Star on June 5, 2009 at 9:58 PM

The only rational explanation for the media’s obsession with the Church of Obama must be closely related to the “Battered Wife Syndrome”, where no matter how bad it gets, even when the wife beater is in the back of the police car, the wife screams at the police “He didn’t mean to hurt me….don’t take him away!…I love him!!!! I’m sorry I called the police when you were beating the crap out of me…I know you did it because you love me…..”

Does anything else explain it?

BobMbx on June 5, 2009 at 9:49 PM

I think it’s simply because they are statists who’ve been chomping at the bit ever since 1994, and they feel that it’s now or never.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 10:04 PM

I fear Matthews is simply being disingenuous. His political views require people to be controlled. But to get people to accept control without a fight, you have to convince them that’s not what is being attempted.

J.E. Dyer on June 5, 2009 at 10:06 PM

It would appear that Matthews is paranoid of Palin.

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 10:10 PM

Matthews is so laughable I don’t even bother taking his comments seriously anymore.

Ryan Gandy on June 5, 2009 at 10:10 PM

Yeah, seriously. When has that ever happened? Eight years of leftist caterwauling about the coming Bush dictatorship was not, of course, “fear, fear, fear,” but simply prudent, responsible small-R republicanism in response to an expansion of executive power. Now we’ve got a liberal nationalizing major banks and the American auto industry, with health care on the way, and the thought that this might mean a heavier federal hand over the population is an idea worthy of the X-Files. The tax burden alone to pay off our astronomical debt will mean significantly less freedom over how we spend our income; pile on green regulations and the inevitable rationing of medical care to handle demand and you’re well into European “third way” territory. Is that “control” enough for you, Chris?

Great post, AP.

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 10:12 PM

dishonest propaganda for The One?

Fear. I think Matthews is absolutely petrifed of someone like Palin. It’s more than Palin–it’s the idea of someone like her. He’s a NE, middle-class Democrat who finally sees himself as an insider, but he KNOWS the strength of the popular appeal of someone like Palin.

BuckeyeSam on June 5, 2009 at 10:12 PM

You know Chris Matthews should change his name to Joseph Goebbels because he is already acting like the Minister of Propaganda

Dreadnought223 on June 5, 2009 at 9:45 PM

If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.
- Joseph Goebbels

MB4 on June 5, 2009 at 10:14 PM

Here’s an experiment I’ve tried more than once with colleagues and an in-law or two:

(1) Find a 9-11 conspiracy theorist.

(2) Without exceptions, if you suggest to them that elected officials promote programs that foster dependency to create an interested and motivated constituency for themselves, and Government union members promote the expansion of programs that employ their fellow members, and then show them the cold hard facts of things like AFSCME member contributions to Democrats, they look at you like you have two heads. That is simply too much for them to swallow.

Don’t try this too often, especially if there are recently sharpened knives in the kitchen.

DrSteve on June 5, 2009 at 10:14 PM

Eight years of leftist caterwauling about the coming Bush dictatorship was not, of course, “fear, fear, fear,”

It took us about 2-3 years to really kick the paranoia into high gear. You guys on the other hand have been screeching “fascism” since day 1. Pace yourselves.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Think of the press as a great keyboard on which the government can play.
- Joseph Goebbels

MB4 on June 5, 2009 at 10:16 PM

Fear. I think Matthews is absolutely petrifed of someone like Palin. It’s more than Palin–it’s the idea of someone like her. He’s a NE, middle-class Democrat who finally sees himself as an insider, but he KNOWS the strength of the popular appeal of someone like Palin.

BuckeyeSam on June 5, 2009 at 10:12 PM

I think so too, coupled with the fear that they’ve already used up all their ammo on her. In a lot of ways, the overkill has made her bulletproof.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 10:18 PM

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 10:04 PM

I like Rush Limbaugh’s explanation of how the Democratic Party and the MSM can go along with Obama’s socialism, statism and Fascism.

Emotionally and psychologically I can’t completely wrap myself around the concept but intellectually I know it exists and that it must be dealt with in the utmost seriousness.

Why as you say ‘the statists have been chomping at the bit since 1994′ also defies logic?

Why is America such an awful country? Can ‘inherited’ guilt cause millions of Americans to commit self-immolation and betray their country in the same breath? How in America could a cult-like figure emerge as one did in Germany in 1933? How did America become so Narcissistic? Why is individual freedom, individual responsibility and individual initiative and free enterprise loathed as much by the Far Left as Americans hated the Japanese after Pearl Harbor?

technopeasant on June 5, 2009 at 10:19 PM

It took us about 2-3 years to really kick the paranoia into high gear. You guys on the other hand have been screeching “fascism” since day 1. Pace yourselves.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Riiiiight. I remember hearing “President Select” in December 2000.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 10:20 PM

It took us about 2-3 years to really kick the paranoia into high gear. You guys on the other hand have been screeching “fascism” since day 1. Pace yourselves.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Hey, we’re the ones that know the definitions and history.

So, if we were “screaming” fascism on day 1 (of Obama), then I’d say we might have some history behind us.

BTW… we were already tooting the horn with Bush/McCain slow road to fascism…

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 10:26 PM

Think of the press as a great keyboard on which the government can play.
- Joseph Goebbels

MB4 on June 5, 2009 at 10:16 PM

Since Matthews is part of the state-controlled media, it’s obvious that he would make such a statement. Of course, Palin is dead right, and Matthews is dead wrong.

BottomLine5 on June 5, 2009 at 10:26 PM

It took us about 2-3 years to really kick the paranoia into high gear. You guys on the other hand have been screeching “fascism” since day 1. Pace yourselves.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Actually, crr6, we’re not starting with the disadvantage of having no basis for our concerns. Much of what Obama does fits the definition of fascism perfectly.

J.E. Dyer on June 5, 2009 at 10:28 PM

The irony here being that Matthews himself is TOTALLY controlled by the current government.

I’d say Palin should issue a public rebuttal to Tingles telling him that when it comes to big government controlling people, Tingles has no further to look than the closest mirror, but, being that he’s Big 0′s most faithful whore in the media, why bother giving him the attention?

SuperCool on June 5, 2009 at 10:35 PM

The irony here being that Matthews himself is TOTALLY controlled by the current government.

I’d say Palin should issue a public rebuttal to Tingles telling him that when it comes to big government controlling people, Tingles has no further to look than the closest mirror, but, being that he’s Big 0’s most faithful whore in the media, why bother giving him the attention?

SuperCool on June 5, 2009 at 10:35 PM

Or better yet, they could have a debate.

I’m thinking Matthews will have to start reading his history books.

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 10:38 PM

The great irony of MSNBC is this: In their push to be ultra-liberal, Pro-Obama…. they have reduced their viewership to the hard left loons…. So when Matthews/Olberman/Maddow/etc rail on people like Sarah,Rush,etc. the only people listening are people pre-disposed to vote for Socialists anyhow….

In other words, by moving to the far left as a network, they have marginalized their effectiveness as a media outlet.

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 10:43 PM

Here’s a simple fact: the majority agrees with Sarah Palin. The majority disagrees with Obama’s and the Democrats’ agenda. So simple, it seems to fly above the heads of the powers-that-be in the GOP.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 10:50 PM

Matthews is a pawn and makes me nauseous, along with the rest of the msm.

DougDavis on June 5, 2009 at 10:53 PM

Riiiiight. I remember hearing “President Select” in December 2000.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 10:20 PM

From some random guy on the street? You have major commentators from your side foaming at the mouth and it’s been less than 6 months. “President Select” is quite a bit different from “ZOMG Obama is a fascist who is destroying America faster than Al-Qaeda!!!111!!”.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:02 PM

Palin couldn’t even get Alaska Republicans to come to her aid. Until she does that, its going to be impossible for her to get any traction if she runs.

Speedwagon82 on June 5, 2009 at 11:06 PM

“President Select” is quite a bit different from “ZOMG Obama is a fascist who is destroying America faster than Al-Qaeda!!!111!!”.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:02 PM

Bush didn’t take office nationalizing banks and auto companies and chirping about “remaking the country”, either.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:08 PM

From some random guy on the street? You have major commentators from your side foaming at the mouth and it’s been less than 6 months. “President Select” is quite a bit different from “ZOMG Obama is a fascist who is destroying America faster than Al-Qaeda!!!111!!”.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:02 PM

Again, you might want to read up on your history…

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 11:14 PM

Palin couldn’t even get Alaska Republicans to come to her aid. Until she does that, its going to be impossible for her to get any traction if she runs.

Speedwagon82 on June 5, 2009 at 11:06 PM

Nor can just about any other GOP politician. The GOP is fecklessness personified right now. “Traction” comes from enunciating principles and forming a consistent opposition, not from trying to get the state-run media to love you.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:16 PM

I honestly wonder how to explain his incredulity here at such a basic economic point.

HE’S A PARTISAN IDIOT.

Jim Treacher on June 5, 2009 at 11:17 PM

He has a terminal case of PDS. Its incurable. She could discover the cure to all cancer, and he would find some way to hate her for it.

juliesa on June 5, 2009 at 11:19 PM

Bush didn’t take office nationalizing banks and auto companies and chirping about “remaking the country”, either.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:08 PM

Well, if it’s any consolation, I now understand how maddening it was to try to reason with the “Bush is a fascist” types. So thanks for that.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:21 PM

As I understand it, the Alaska GOP, on average, is just like the National GOP, on average… they are more interested in reaping the benefits of power than acting upon conservative credentials.

I have been thinking about this a lot over the past 6 months (regarding the fight between the GOP establishment and conservatives)…. It is my opinion that the ONLY way true conservatives will ever take back the GOP is to win a massive GRASSROOTS national election. This is why I am so hopeful with Sarah Palin. She is the type that could lead a grassroots campaign… I can’t think of anyone else that can (although I am sure there are some that haven’t risen to national prominence yet).

Screw the GOP. Screw the establishment. Take it straight to the people.

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 11:21 PM

Bush didn’t take office nationalizing banks and auto companies and chirping about “remaking the country”, either.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:08 PM

Well, if it’s any consolation, I now understand how maddening it was to try to reason with the “Bush is a fascist” types. So thanks for that.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:21 PM

OK, well what policies did fascist Bush unveil in his first 5 months in office that got things going? Tax cuts?

Come on. The moonbats despised Bush from the first for “stealing” the election.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:25 PM

Again, you might want to read up on your history…

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 11:14 PM

ZOMG but with Bush there were so many historic signs of fascism!
Nationalism, disdain for human rights, obsession with national security, scapegoating, disdain for intellectuals, corruption annnnnnd fraudulent elections! Read up on YOUR history dude!!1!!

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:25 PM

OK, well what policies did fascist Bush unveil in his first 5 months in office that got things going? Tax cuts?

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:25 PM

Somewhat of a fair point.
The “fascism” shrieking seems to kick in after aggressive responses to national crises. Bush’s dealt with national security. Obama’s crisis is an economic one.

But to agree with that point you’d have to admit that the cries of fascism from both sides are hysterical and hyperbolic. I have a feeling you can’t do that.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:32 PM

ZOMG but with Bush there were so many historic signs of fascism!
Nationalism, disdain for human rights, obsession with national security, scapegoating, disdain for intellectuals, corruption annnnnnd fraudulent elections! Read up on YOUR history dude!!1!!

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:25 PM

Nationalism? Well, if Bush was guilty of this, then Obama is just as guilty. Yes, this tends to be a strong fascist tendency/tool

Disdain for Human Rights? Well, that’s one way of saying it.

Disdain for Intellectuals? That is not purely fascist in nature. Again, most of the fascist movements in Europe USED intellectuals. Mussolini himself was very admired by many intellectuals. So even if Bush despised intellectuals, I don’t see how this makes him a fascist.

Corruption is not intrinsically fascist. Most forms of large government are corrupt.

Finally, did I not mention that many on the right were tooting the horn that McCain/Bush Republicanism could lead to fascism??? That said, I never recall Bush offering the “Third Way.” So I will only concede that some of Bush’s policies may have lead to fascism, but he himself was no fascist – or at “best” a horrible one.

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 11:32 PM

But to agree with that point you’d have to admit that the cries of fascism from both sides are hysterical and hyperbolic. I have a feeling you can’t do that.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:32 PM

Again, Obama (not his critics) is the one talking about a Third Way.

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 11:33 PM

Nationalism, disdain for human rights, obsession with national security, scapegoating, disdain for intellectuals, corruption annnnnnd fraudulent elections! Read up on YOUR history dude!!1!!

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:25 PM

One at a time:
“Nationalism”? Any specific instances you have in mind?
“disdain for human rights”…you mean those policies Obama has chosen for the most part to keep in place?
“obsession with national security”…ditto
“scapegoating”…yeah, only Bush was guilty of that…
“disdain for intellectuals”…the guy is an Ivy Leaguer, like Obama. Again, any specific examples?
“corruption”…my, can’t get much dirtier than the current set of Democrats.
“fraudulent elections”…did ACORN help Bush get elected?

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:34 PM

ZOMG but with Bush there were so many historic signs of fascism!
Nationalism, disdain for human rights, obsession with national security, scapegoating, disdain for intellectuals, corruption annnnnnd fraudulent elections! Read up on YOUR history dude!!1!!

Most of this really isn’t true at all… even if it were, it doesn’t define Fascism. Clearly, you have no idea what fascism is.

Fascism is basically corporatism and nationalism. It also requires single party authoritarian rule.

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 11:34 PM

If anything Bush at the beginning was left of center especially with No Child Left Behind and his emphasis on compassionate conservatism. He definitely was not showing any Fascist tendencies.

technopeasant on June 5, 2009 at 11:37 PM

The “fascism” shrieking seems to kick in after aggressive responses to national crises. Bush’s dealt with national security. Obama’s crisis is an economic one.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:32 PM

Well, there are crises and there are crises. The options aren’t that wide-ranging when 3,000 of your citizens are killed at one whack. A failing auto-maker though doesn’t mean Obama has to become de facto CEO of GM.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:38 PM

ZOMG but with Bush there were so many historic signs of fascism!
Nationalism, disdain for human rights, obsession with national security, scapegoating, disdain for intellectuals, corruption annnnnnd fraudulent elections! Read up on YOUR history dude!!1!!

Wow, what drugs were you taking at the time?

Unlike President 4th Trimester Abortions, President Bush was known for his concern for human rights, cleaned up much of the business corruption that had been allowed to run rife in the preceding decade, and managed to maintain decorum in the face of Gore’s attempted coup.

The man had his faults, but you’ve yet to hit on any of them.

Now, with President 4TA, not only is he engaged in the same sort of crony socialism fascism approves of, not only has he already shown a distain for the traditions of the republic, not only has he appointed more czars then the Russian Empire, and not only has he shown a remarkable distain for the value of human life, but his basic philosophy is descended from progressivism – which was the American version of fascism.

18-1 on June 5, 2009 at 11:39 PM

Most of this really isn’t true at all… even if it were, it doesn’t define Fascism. Clearly, you have no idea what fascism is.

Fascism is basically corporatism and nationalism. It also requires single party authoritarian rule.

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 11:34 PM

I agree with you. I was just mocking the hysterics of the “Obama is a fascist” crowd, and pointing out that both sides try to justify their insanity by pointing out vague historical similarities between real fascist regimes and the presidential administration which they despise.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:39 PM

Matter of fact, here is a good example of fascism. Economic fascism is supposed to be implicit control of industry, as opposed to Socialism’s outright ownership of industry.

I would argue that the whole GM mess is Fascism. The Federal Government receives a majority stake in GM, but pledges to remain “behind the scenes” as far as decision making goes. At the same time, they place cronies in positions of importance (UAW), government officials in charge of overseeing the process (31 yr old kid, czar, or whatever), and pass laws to direct the general path of the business (raising CAFE standards). The whole “goal” is for GM to emerge from bankruptcy as a “healthy” private company, but in reality it will be a shell company for the US Government. Fascism.

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 11:40 PM

I have a feeling you can’t do that.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:32 PM

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:38 PM

I would be disappointed if I had been remotely optimistic to begin with.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:42 PM

I was just mocking the hysterics of the “Obama is a fascist” crowd, and pointing out that both sides try to justify their insanity by pointing out vague historical similarities between real fascist regimes and the presidential administration which they despise.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:39 PM

OK, if you don’t like the historical references, then why do him and Hillary get all wet in the pants because of the American Progressive Movement? Either they don’t know jack sh*t about it, or they embrace these ideas.

Upstater85 on June 5, 2009 at 11:45 PM

Matter of fact, here is a good example of fascism. Economic fascism is supposed to be implicit control of industry, as opposed to Socialism’s outright ownership of industry.

I would argue that the whole GM mess is Fascism. The Federal Government receives a majority stake in GM, but pledges to remain “behind the scenes” as far as decision making goes. At the same time, they place cronies in positions of importance (UAW), government officials in charge of overseeing the process (31 yr old kid, czar, or whatever), and pass laws to direct the general path of the business (raising CAFE standards). The whole “goal” is for GM to emerge from bankruptcy as a “healthy” private company, but in reality it will be a shell company for the US Government. Fascism.

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 11:40 PM

I would also like to add that you should notice who the loser is in the outcome. The private sector entities that held the most “power” in GM (the bondholders) got the rawest of raw deals. 200+ years of contract law thrown out the window in favor of government influence.

Capitalism – Ownership would default to the lenders (bondholderS)

Socialism – Government would explicitly take it over and its day to day business.

Fascism – Implicit interference of government into the private sector to re-direct the goals/agendas of the industry to be in-line with that of the government (i.e. what Obama just did)

The difference between the lefties crying Fascism at Bush and the righties crying Fascism at Obama is this…. There are actual concrete examples of Obama’s Fascism (such as… GM)

BPD on June 5, 2009 at 11:48 PM

I think Matthews HIV/AIDS infetion has finally reached the dementia stage.

bill30097 on June 5, 2009 at 11:51 PM

But to agree with that point you’d have to admit that the cries of fascism from both sides are hysterical and hyperbolic. I have a feeling you can’t do that.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:32 PM

Yeah, some of those cries are hyperbolic and hysterical. But the foundations for a more purely theoretical fascism are much more characteristic of the Obama administration than Bush.

The fact is, the cult of personality and the automaton-like devotion of what is now state-run media is creepy beyond words. The hysteria and hyperbole is more an expression of worry about what comes after. With the left-wingers and their hatred of Bush, it was simply because they felt their lefty messiah at the moment (Gore) had been cheated.

ddrintn on June 5, 2009 at 11:52 PM

Is it dishonest propaganda for The One?

I could not help but think of this upon reading that question:

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/mark-finkelstein/2008/11/06/odd-job-matthews-says-his-role-make-obama-presidency-success

And for those of you discussing fascism as a system in economics, here’s something of interest:

Where socialism sought totalitarian control of a society’s economic processes through direct state operation of the means of production, fascism sought that control indirectly, through domination of nominally private owners. Where socialism nationalized property explicitly, fascism did so implicitly, by requiring owners to use their property in the “national interest”—that is, as the autocratic authority conceived it. (Nevertheless, a few industries were operated by the state.) Where socialism abolished all market relations outright, fascism left the appearance of market relations while planning all economic activities. Where socialism abolished money and prices, fascism controlled the monetary system and set all prices and wages politically. In doing all this, fascism denatured the marketplace. Entrepreneurship was abolished. State ministries, rather than consumers, determined what was produced and under what conditions.

Fascism is to be distinguished from interventionism, or the mixed economy. Interventionism seeks to guide the market process, not eliminate it, as fascism did. Minimum-wage and antitrust laws, though they regulate the free market, are a far cry from multiyear plans from the Ministry of Economics.

Under fascism, the state, through official cartels, controlled all aspects of manufacturing, commerce, finance, and agriculture. Planning boards set product lines, production levels, prices, wages, working conditions, and the size of firms. Licensing was ubiquitous; no economic activity could be undertaken without government permission. Levels of consumption were dictated by the state, and “excess” incomes had to be surrendered as taxes or “loans.”

http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/Fascism.html

Apply it to both and see what happens.

anuts on June 5, 2009 at 11:56 PM

MSNBC = More Stupid Nitwits Broadcasting Crapola

DL13 on June 5, 2009 at 11:58 PM

I love it. It’s fearmongering when conservatives point out what has happened in other countries that have walked down this same economic path, but it’s just responsible representation when dems call republicans racists and are pushing for a return of Jim Crow laws, or that they want to starve the elderly and little children.

Wingo on June 6, 2009 at 12:09 AM

Chris? What are you still doing at 30 Rockefeller? Shouldn’t you be at 1600 Pennsylvania under a desk?

OneGyT on June 6, 2009 at 12:20 AM

It took us about 2-3 years to really kick the paranoia into high gear.

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Yep, the 1960′s were a crazy time for everybody.

TMK on June 6, 2009 at 12:52 AM

Is it true that Pooptech died of old age?

Well, Obamacare would have iced him off anyway.

Let’s all post resumes in tribute to the goofball.

Sapwolf on June 6, 2009 at 1:01 AM

Another false proclamation from state run media. What a shocker, the state run media thinks that bloated government of good.

Geochelone on June 6, 2009 at 1:01 AM

ZOMG but with Bush there were so many historic signs of fascism!
Nationalism, disdain for human rights, obsession with national security, scapegoating, disdain for intellectuals, corruption annnnnnd fraudulent elections! Read up on YOUR history dude!!1!!

crr6 on June 5, 2009 at 11:25 PM

Spoken by someone who has a very tenuous grasp of history.
I’m sure your argument (such as it is) could be easily turned around and used against any president.

Taking them in order and applying them to BO: Suddenly deciding that wearing a lapel pin is a great idea, supporting the murder of babies as they are being born, using “warrantless wiretaps” to a greater extent than ever before, incessant yammering about the mess he inherited, disregarding the warnings of economists at the CBO (and for that matter, the pointy-headed “pull the troops immediately” crowd), associations with Rahm/Blago & getting a house from Tony Rezko, and looking the other way while ACORN and the Black Panthers make a mockery of election law.

*yawn*

Too easy. Study actual history and come back when you can make more than a superficial observation.

landshark on June 6, 2009 at 1:22 AM

Is it true that Pooptech died of old age?

Sapwolf on June 6, 2009 at 1:01 AM

No he pulled a David Carradine.

Geochelone on June 6, 2009 at 1:26 AM

Sarah Palin is correct. The more government expands it’s role in society the more it controls people.

I live in Australia and have first-hand experience of this.

Under universal health care you will be told which doctor to see and which doctor can carry out medical procedures.

If you are unemployed you have to get a bureacrats permission to see the employment agency of your choice.

There are even noises that Australia’s universal health care will be curtailed and generous welfare system scaled back.

It is just sad that no one in the Obama administration knows or even cares about what they are intending to do is bound to fail.

Crux Australis on June 6, 2009 at 1:36 AM

Chrissy needs Palin to keep the heat off Barry. Fan those flames, Chrissy, fan them well. Your career depends on it.

Limerick on June 6, 2009 at 2:29 AM

Tweety Matthews is a throwback chauvinistic azz clown for state run media. He dyes his hair yellow, that is why his staff calls him teewty behind his back. Even they don’t respect him, and they are on the payroll. They are paid to pretend that they respect him when in reality they don’t.

Chrissy has a hissy fit every time Sarah gets any airtime. Sarah is 100 times the man that Tweety Matthews is.

He couldn’t field dress a chocolate mousse.

Geochelone on June 6, 2009 at 5:24 AM

“Fear, Fear, Fear!”…. Yeah that’s right. C’mon Chris admit you and the Left do fear Palin. That is why you spend so much time trying to tear her down. Otherwise you would ignore her.

Ridicule is one of Alinsky’s Main Rules. You are trying to “Alinsky” Palin but it won’t work this time around. Too many of us are catching on. ;D

sarahpalinfan99 on June 6, 2009 at 6:02 AM

Thanks but I don’t want to watch an MSNBC clip just not interested. Otherwise I would turn them on my TV set, and I don’t. I haven’t watched those media circus clowns since Imus was fired in back in April 2007. Media Matters for America attacked Tucker Carlson, he was able to send them a message through MSNBC…doesn’t that tell anyone anything? This isn’t a reputable source for news or anything else. It’s nothing more than a George Soros funded propaganda outlet.

Dr Evil on June 6, 2009 at 7:38 AM

Gee Chrissy – It wasn’t so paranoid last year.

RobCon on June 6, 2009 at 8:05 AM

Speaking of the Devil look what GE is doing to Nielsen blacklisting them. GE with Immelt at the helm not bring anything good to light.

http://insidecablenews.wordpress.com/2009/06/05/ge-blacklisting-nielsen-business-media-over-hollywood-reporter-story/

Dr Evil on June 6, 2009 at 8:09 AM

When you think that Matthews is dumber than a rock, he removes all doubt that there are depths of incompetence even a rock cannot sink too. This guy is not worth the flush of a toilet.

volsense on June 6, 2009 at 8:14 AM

I think he was born under a rock.

It’s nothing more than a George Soros funded propaganda outlet.

Dr Evil on June 6, 2009 at 7:38 AM

And I think that’s the God’s honest truth.

scalleywag on June 6, 2009 at 8:32 AM

I never click on Matthews or Uberdouche. Once a tool always a tool. He acts like a paranoid little school girl. I heard he wears bladder control garments so he doesn’t wet himself talking about Barry.

Geochelone on June 6, 2009 at 9:18 AM

Some men want to be controlled… It’s a sexual thing. Hence the trill up the leg statement.

RalphyBoy on June 6, 2009 at 9:22 AM

trill thrill…

RalphyBoy on June 6, 2009 at 9:23 AM

Did not know that…yikes. The answer of course would be to blast those Iranian camel jockeys into the Stone Age – but our forces are already badly overextended, and national willpower is fading fast. D**n it. As if I hadn’t seen enough bad news lately.

Dark-Star on June 5, 2009 at 9:58 PM

Ironically, the Iranians already are in the Stone Age in many ways. They’re kind of like Fred Flintstone meets George Jetson. They have nukes, but their women wear burkas. They have nukes, but their population is largely illiterate. They have nukes, but they can’t supply electricity to a major portion of their country. They’re kind of like Mongo in “Blazing Saddles”: If you shoot them, you’ll just make them mad.

College Prof on June 6, 2009 at 9:34 AM

No, Matthews is part of the dillusional people on the earth in the last days. The Bible states what we are seeing in the Obama sweeping cult in II Thess. 2

5Don’t you remember that when I was with you I used to tell you these things? 6And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time. 7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. 8And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. 9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

It is a worldwide phenominon and sadly our teachers union educated generation in America today have been prepared (brainwashed) for the lawless One. They and their media allies are willingly swallowing all this hook, line and sinker.

wepeople on June 6, 2009 at 9:35 AM

I honestly wonder how to explain his incredulity here at such a basic economic point.

Logic is not part of the equation. It is all about personality. He worships the cult of Obama so anything he does is for the good. Anyone who is critical of teh One, is a nut.

bitsy on June 6, 2009 at 9:50 AM

Chris? What are you still doing at 30 Rockefeller? Shouldn’t you be at 1600 Pennsylvania under a desk?

OneGyT on June 6, 2009 at 12:20 AM

Bwahahahaha!!! Love that. This is why I love Mathews Mocking threads. It’s true AND funny. Methews has turned himself into a joke and I for one am all for making the most of it. When historians write about the Obama years, Mathews will make the editors cut for the most idiotic example of a reporter losing his mind like he somehow saw Krishna descend or Jesus return – only x-rated.

BrideOfRove on June 6, 2009 at 9:55 AM

Amazing how the left can not admit to themselves their leadership will sell them out the minute it becomes advantageous for them.

Look at history, understand it, and avoid letting it happen again is the responsible thing to do.

MSGTAS on June 6, 2009 at 10:03 AM

Matthews. Credibilty equal to Herr Olbergoebbels on the same “government news tool”. If history repeats itself, and we are going through a “French Revolution”, these two will have “E” tickets for the Guillotine. Vive America!!!!

adamsmith on June 6, 2009 at 10:07 AM

As with the Harrison Ford thread….just wait. When something bad comes up, that will directly affect the media, or each of them individually, they will cry out, about the injustices of it, and their anger that it’s being foisted apon them.

capejasmine on June 6, 2009 at 10:31 AM

Everyone can see
what’s goin’ on
they laugh ’cause they know they’re untouchable
not because what I said was wrong
whatever it may bring
I will live by my own policies
I will sleep with a clear conscience
I will sleep in peace

Maybe it sounds mean
but I really don’t think so
you asked for the truth and I told you
through their own words
they will be exposed
they’ve got a severe case of
the emperor’s new clothes.

Sinead’s a kook, but she had some good songs. ;)

ddrintn on June 6, 2009 at 10:58 AM

So Creamy Chris is going with the idea that the lie is so outrageous you must be an idiot…..

Kinda like german’s in the 40′s whispering….” i hear lil Adolph is kill n millions of those jews”….

You must be crazy…. yada yada

roflmao

donabernathy on June 6, 2009 at 11:20 AM

Chris? What are you still doing at 30 Rockefeller? Shouldn’t you be at 1600 Pennsylvania under a desk?

OneGyT on June 6, 2009 at 12:20 AM

Brian Williams is already “under the desk.”

bw222 on June 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM

Hmmm…and the historical advocacy of smaller government by Republicans somehow equated to Fascism.

That’s rather odd.

Dr. ZhivBlago on June 6, 2009 at 12:18 PM

bw222 on June 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM

Maybe the staff of MSNBC should just move their office there. I’m sure Barack wouldn’t mind them all taking turns.

OneGyT on June 6, 2009 at 12:28 PM

Was GB controlled by three overt commies?
George Soros and the Sander’s and all their tentacles control Hussein.

nondhimmie on June 6, 2009 at 12:36 PM

Big government has only ever led to controlling people. Show me an example otherwise, Chris Matthews.

t.ferg on June 6, 2009 at 1:16 PM

Matthews on Palin: It’s “paranoid” to think big government leads to controlling the people

Is there anyway Pissy-Crissy-Butt-plug can be stuffed into an envelope, and mailed to some God forsaken island where we NEVER have to hear his whining?

byteshredder on June 6, 2009 at 8:07 PM

Some day we are going to find Crissy hanging in a closet with rope around his pp.

Geochelone on June 7, 2009 at 12:21 AM

Matthews keeps reinforcing the fact that if it wasn’t for Olberman, he would be the dumbest SOB on the planet. Liberalism is a progressive mental disorder and he’s in the advanced stages. If it wasn’t for his immediate family, his ratings would not exist. He’s just another Soros lapdog being used as a cheap tool.

volsense on June 7, 2009 at 5:48 PM

Chris? What are you still doing at 30 Rockefeller? Shouldn’t you be at 1600 Pennsylvania under a desk?

OneGyT on June 6, 2009 at 12:20 AM
Brian Williams is already “under the desk.”

bw222

Tag team…or is that “gag” team? They do love some Obameat.

SKYFOX on June 8, 2009 at 7:49 AM

I nominate Matthews for the Walter Duranty award in useful idiot “journalism”.

RadClown on June 16, 2009 at 12:27 PM

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