(2) In this case the editor is actually correct: Obama is not actually pro-abortion. He doesn’t care one way or the other (see “pay grade”), and he just does whatever advances his own political career. He has portrayed himself as pro-abortion to get support from Naral, Planned Parenthood, and the abortion industry. But I guarantee you that if a pro-life org had a lot of taxpayer funding and political clout, Obama would start to sound pro-life.

We must include that harmful and never sufficiently denounced freedom to publish any writings whatever and disseminate them to the people, which some dare to demand and promote with so great a clamor. We are horrified to see what monstrous doctrines and prodigious errors are disseminated far and wide in countless books, pamphlets, and other writings which, though small in weight, are very great in malice.

Oh yeah… and “liberty of conscience” for everyone is an “absurd and erroneous proposition.”

mankai on May 22, 2009 at 1:40 PM

You appear to me to be on a mission, to put the Pope and the Catholic Church in the worst possible light. You sight excerpts of documents many times out of context to prove a fraudulent point, that is where I find you at times cross the line into anti-Catholicism.
The Pope has no immediate need to speak out at this time, personally on this article. He may choose a Bishop to deliver any message he may have and there may now be private communications taking place. It is no big secret that the Vatican has communication problems.

clarifides on May 22, 2009 at 1:32 PM

If the ND situation is such an obvious call for real Catholics… why is the Pope silent? Is he drawing on that “2000 years of wisdom” (the vast majority of which we are not allowed to quote lest we be labeled a “catholic basher”) before opining? In the meantime, can we blast him as a coward for not speaking up before BHO spoke?

mankai on May 22, 2009 at 1:15 PM

unfortunatley (so far) one RC doesn’t share that opinion of the man or the article… his name is Benedict, I think

You know the mind of the Pope?? If you are trying to attribute this article to Pope Benedict, you fail miserably. Your quotes from the Vatican, are as the newspaper should be, however this is not always the case when dealing with human beings. It may or may not be that the editor, Giovanni Maria Vian is liberal, under his direction he has ruffled many feathers. In time we will see how the Pope deals with this. The Church is very patient and takes it’s time in dealing with wayward Catholics.

Giovanni Maria Vian : Appointed September 29, 2007
Perhaps he came highly recommended, no worries he can always appoint a new one

clarifides on May 22, 2009 at 11:46 AM

That’s your opinion… just as the comments in regard to the editorial are merely the opinions of the RCs here… unfortunatley (so far) one RC doesn’t share that opinion of the man or the article… his name is Benedict, I think.

So should I trust his opinion or yours as to what the “Catholic” position is? I put this question to Laura Ingraham as well… SHE may not consider ND (Georgetown, etc.) “Catholic”, but her opinion is meaningless so long as the one committed with the powers of Christ himself considers ND “Catholic.”

I can only conclude (from the majority of opinions expressed at HA over the last week or so) that Benedict is a “cafeteria Catholic” who “probably only attends mass twice a year.”

No need for your last comment, it is untrue and disparaging of the Church and it’s members.

Tell that to John Adams.

And do I need to quote the disparaging things the Popes and Councils have said about non-Catholics for the last 1500 years? I don’t think HA has the bandwidth to handle it.

http://www.blackgenocide.org/

mankai on May 22, 2009 at 11:43 AM

Nuance ?? Perhaps it is just reading comprehension, grammar and understanding the language usage of the era in which it was written.
No need for your last comment, it is untrue and disparaging of the Church and it’s members.

mankai on May 22, 2009 at 11:09 AM

who was chosen last October by Pope Benedict XVI

Giovanni Maria Vian : Appointed September 29, 2007
Perhaps he came highly recommended, no worries he can always appoint a new one

clarifides on May 22, 2009 at 11:27 AM

Nuance…

Explain it away… there are many more references I could post, but you’d just explain those away as well. Pope after Pope, Council after Council… just nuanced away.

The point in the quote in regard to Christ’s “power” is that the Pope claims that Christ “committed” these powers to him.

The RCC was, is, and ever-shall-be a threat to the Republic.

Well, you ignored “sweet Christ on earth”…

I see this as term of endearment.

He that reigneth on high, to whom is given all power in heaven and earth

This is in reference to Jesus Christ

New editor in November 2007

clarifides on May 22, 2009 at 10:49 AM

‘the Pope’s newspaper’ will be more airy and readable,” said Giovanni Maria Vian, who was chosen last October by Pope Benedict XVI to become the new editor of the newspaper.

Vian, a 53-year-old historian, said he had been asked by Pope Benedict to open up the newspaper to the voices of women and to non-Catholics.

But in Rome the newspaper is seen as representing the “mind” of the Holy See.

I guess Benedict is just another Cafeteria Catholic! No real Catholic would have chosen Vian or suffered his brazen anti-Catholicism.

mankai on May 22, 2009 at 10:42 AM

New editor in November 2007

The quote you have is by Pope John XXIII, there have been changes since then.

Yes, John XXIII (the 2nd one, btw)… The links I provided are to vatican.va and it is they who provide the quote. It is at vatican.va where you may see that the paper is listed as the official news service of the vatican.

And from 2006:

But over time the newspaper took on a more objective and pastoral stance, and today it prides itself in “presenting the genuine face of the church and the ideals of freedom,” said Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, the Vatican’s secretary of state.

L’Osservatore Romano became “an instrument for spreading the teachings of the successor of Peter and for information about church events,” he said in an Oct. 24 [2006] speech inaugurating a new exhibit dedicated to the founding and history of the newspaper…

“When the pope takes a position, that is our official position which we go with and follow,” he said.

Notice it does not say that “we are God” or that “we are equal to God”

Well, you ignored “sweet Christ on earth”… but be that as it may… claiming the powers of God on earth is tantamount to claiming an authority equal to God. I try to only use catholic sources…

He that reigneth on high, to whom is given all power in heaven and earth, has committed one holy Catholic and apostolic Church, outside of which there is no salvation, to one alone upon earth, namely to Peter, the first of the apostles, and to Peter’s successor, the pope of Rome, to be by him governed in fullness of power. Him alone He has made ruler over all peoples and kingdoms, to pull up, destroy, scatter, disperse, plant and build, so that he may preserve His faithful people (knit together with the girdle of charity) in the unity of the Spirit and present them safe and spotless to their Saviour. – Pope Pius V

“It is a much more serious thing to offend the divine majesty than to offend the temporal power. – Innocent III

mankai on May 22, 2009 at 9:48 AM

The quote you have is by Pope John XXIII, there have been changes since then. The official section of the paper is “Nostre informazione” (“Our News”) that includes papal speeches, writings, etc.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/434172/LOsservatore-Romano

We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty…
mankai on May 22, 2009 at 9:15 AM

Notice it does not say that “we are God” or that “we are equal to God” It says that we hold the place of God on earth. To “hold the place of” means one is a “representative of”. We are all ambassadors of Christ on this planet and thus we all hold the place of God on this earth.
In the same encyclical the following paragraph reads:

Now, as all salvation comes from Jesus Christ–for there is no other Name under Heaven given to men whereby we must be saved–Our ardent desire is that the most Holy Name of Jesus should rapidly pervade and fill every land.

The past 100 years have made this newspaper not only a witness to but also a maker of history: since, strictly bound to the Apostolic See by the very proximity of its location and diligently following its Magisterium, in furthering Christ’s kingdom on earth it has continuously provided what is highly esteemed by the Catholic faithful and all honest persons…

As there is a difference between the Vatican and the newspaper published in the Vatican

Let’s examine this constant charge…

http://www.vatican.va/index.htm

http://www.vatican.va/news_services/or/home_eng.html

Official newspaper of the Vatican.

Now, should use the “not a real, mass-attending Catholic” canard against Benedict or Vian next?

For the life of me, I cannot understand why anyone would be a Catholic…so many other Christian religions have not crossed that social liberal line that Catholics want to.

right2bright on May 22, 2009 at 8:48 AM

As there is a difference between the Vatican and the newspaper published in the Vatican, so there is a difference between the Catholic Church and many Catholics.

As an adult, I chose to be a Catholic. I am traditional in my religious beliefs and orthodox in my practice. My Catholic faith informs my politics. But my conservative politics also led me to the Catholic Church.

Talk with traditional Catholics. You will find you have differences on faith and politics, but you will also share many political positions. Traditional Catholics have been and will be allies with many other conservative groups. So, let’s try to sift the wheat from the chaff.

But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty…

That’s the “royal WE” of Leo XIII.

http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13praec.htm