Video: Border Patrol tasers pastor at traffic stop
posted at 10:11 am on May 18, 2009 by Allahpundit
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The first video’s a month old and a minor viral hit online, the second one — showing the incident described in the first — is brand new. Why would the BP be so impatient with a stopped driver as to get rough after just a few minutes? Well, turns out it wasn’t just a few minutes: According to Fox Phoenix, it was a “standoff” that lasted for more than an hour. As for the taser, the Phoenix New Times weighs pros and cons:
At first glance, the use of the Taser seems to violate a policy adopted by most Valley police agencies. When Tasers were first introduced, police used them against suspects who simply refused to obey orders or resisted arrest not by force, but by sitting down or pulling away from an officer’s grabbing hands. Such use was later prohibited in most agencies when police realized Tasers could potentially be harmful to some suspects.
However, the DPS could probably make the case that Anderson was a threat to officer safety because he had control of his vehicle. Once the agents and officers decided to pull him out of the car (a questionable decision, itself), they must have decided to Tase him right away to prevent the possibility of the vehicle driving off with an officer stuck in the window.
Anderson claims he was repeatedly Tasered even after being dragged from his car, but that’s not shown on his video.
I think it might depend on whether he had the keys in the ignition at the time. If so, the fear that he’d try to take off after they broke the windows is reasonable; if not, not so much.
Update: I meant to mention — this didn’t happen on the border. Anderson was driving east from San Diego to Phoenix. What was the BP doing there?
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michaelo on May 18, 2009 at 10:14 AM
A pre emptive strike. He needed the tasar so that he wouldn’t think of something stupid to do.
seven on May 18, 2009 at 10:14 AM
el patrolero bordero….tasering the people Americans won’t tase…
sven10077 on May 18, 2009 at 10:14 AM
I have been through scores of legal check points in my life time. I just answer their questions, comply with their reasonable requests and pass on through. Never spent more than a few minutes at a single stop. Maybe I’m doing something wrong?
watson007 on May 18, 2009 at 10:15 AM
Don’t taz me, Bor Patrol!
eforhan on May 18, 2009 at 10:17 AM
Those silly Americans….they need to learn they can’t just come and go without papers or even so much as a “by your leave.”
lm10001 on May 18, 2009 at 10:17 AM
After listening for 10 seconds, it’s obvious that this guy is refusing a police officer’s order. In this case bad things are guaranteed to happen. Dumbass.
perroviejo on May 18, 2009 at 10:17 AM
Hmmm… and I’ll bet not too many Me-hee-can drug smugglers get tazed.
ErinF on May 18, 2009 at 10:18 AM
Don’t taze me, my son!
Squarestate on May 18, 2009 at 10:18 AM
Why, oh why, do some people become total idiots like this at traffic stops. If this pastor would have just done as the officer told him, and simply get out of the car, he would have been on his was in a matter of minutes. But nooooo, he’s gotta act like he wrote the Constitution or something.
My sympathy level for people who jump up on their soapbox and mouth off to a cop about “rights” is about a zero.
JetBoy on May 18, 2009 at 10:21 AM
Hmm. I’m 45 seconds into the first video and I’m already favoring the cops here.
mcg on May 18, 2009 at 10:21 AM
Well, let me rephrase that. I’m not sure I’m favoring the cops, but I’m certainly lacking sympathy for this dude.
mcg on May 18, 2009 at 10:21 AM
it’s kind of a metaphor for donks, power, and morals….
we’d send the guy to prison for zapping an illegal, the donks blanche at rough work on radical islamists but dream of torturing “wingnuts”….
donks=misplaced ball syndrome
sven10077 on May 18, 2009 at 10:22 AM
The police don’t get to dictate the law. A cop’s gotta have a stated reason for bringing someone in. “Not listening” doesn’t count all on its own. And if a cop wants to force someone out of a car, how bout they grow a pair and do it the old fashioned way, with bare hands?
ernesto on May 18, 2009 at 10:22 AM
The border patrol agents had info(bad or good) and asked him to step out(not on the clip). They said he’s under arrest. He was being a complete ass and wouldn’t get out of the vehicle. Tasering was completely justified especially since it’s on the border. I don’t care if he’s a pastor or not since drug dealers like to dress up as one to get through easier. He should have just got out and not argued. But that’d been the smart thing.
scrubbiedude on May 18, 2009 at 10:24 AM
What’s so controversial? I’m a Christian and I can think of more than a few pastors I’d like to taser.
Daggett on May 18, 2009 at 10:26 AM
Nope.
Because what’s most idiotic is when some guy starts mouthing off about what police can or cannot do to a cop during a traffic stop like this. One does not have the right to argue with the police officer. If one believes they are wronged, take it up with the judge in court.
JetBoy on May 18, 2009 at 10:26 AM
You what? He deserved it. Why does he suddenly turn into Alan Dershowitz and Larry Spence and telling the police their job. Just do what the cop orders and take names and badge numbers….period.
BTW…nice squeal and musical interlude. This jerk is having the time of his life.
Let the 15 minutes of fame clock begin.
RobCon on May 18, 2009 at 10:26 AM
Arguing with cops never seems to work out well, does it?
mojo on May 18, 2009 at 10:27 AM
i really don’t feel sorry for him. WHY would he not let them search his car? it was between getting arrested and them searching my car…. well they’d be all up in that car.
Between getting window smashed and tazed…. well they would just be living in the back seat.
Another case of “don’t be a dumbass” and you wont get beaten by cops. You got bloody because of the broken glass… due to you not getting out of the car….. grats on the stitches and hope they made you pay for them.
Donut on May 18, 2009 at 10:27 AM
ernesto,
You are correct but thats for the courts to decide not a citizen on the street.
EricPWJohnson on May 18, 2009 at 10:27 AM
I saw that news report and thought the guy’s protest was ridiculous. He was clearly playing on the fact that he’s a “good boy” type, except he isn’t.
AnninCA on May 18, 2009 at 10:27 AM
I wonder if he was on the DHS list!
canopfor on May 18, 2009 at 10:28 AM
I have been conditioned to comply with whatever law enforcement authorities ask of me.
I fear jail. I fear getting tazed. I fear getting shot.
Comply and then fight it later.
myrenovations on May 18, 2009 at 10:29 AM
The thug cops. A beating is not required after tasing someone.
This man may have a bumper sticker he is not telling us about and fits the Napalitano “profile”. As a Baptist, he is most likely against abortion.
seven on May 18, 2009 at 10:29 AM
Word. You know how many tickets I’ve gotten out of just because I shut up and was honest?
“Do you know why I pulled you over?”
“Yes.”
People play dumb, and that pisses cops off.
blatantblue on May 18, 2009 at 10:30 AM
Yeah when a guy starts rolling up his windows and quoting the constitution – once it goes past 5 minutes – these things never end well
EricPWJohnson on May 18, 2009 at 10:30 AM
I’d like to comment but it is “beyond my pay grade.”
Mr_Magoo on May 18, 2009 at 10:30 AM
“What have you got to hide?”
Cute. There’s this thing called the Fourth Amendment. “I don’t consent to any searches” is a powerful phrase. He should have handled it better, though. Get out of the car, lock it, tell them you don’t consent. Then, if they break their way in, they’re in trouble.
MadisonConservative on May 18, 2009 at 10:32 AM
I’ve always found that most people who have physical confrontations with the police are those who stall, stonewall, whine, play dumb, complain, and resist at every moment.
blatantblue on May 18, 2009 at 10:32 AM
If there was nothing in the trunk but tools then just get out and show them.
Now you have scars to show for your trouble – dumbass…
You have no case.
izoneguy on May 18, 2009 at 10:32 AM
Government employees? You’re conditioned to comply with whatever they say?
Hm.
MadisonConservative on May 18, 2009 at 10:33 AM
ernesto, what part of law enforcement do you fail to understand?
dmann on May 18, 2009 at 10:34 AM
ernesto on May 18, 2009 at 10:22 AM
AND ernesto get is wrong again!
Hey everyone big hand for Ernesto!
Failure to follow police instructions is a crime.
Impeding a police investigation…also a crime
Resisting arrest yep that’s a crime
Pretty dumb to piss off people who are armed when you are not and have the force of the law on their side, but there are plenty of people trying to select themselves out of the gene pool.
LincolntheHun on May 18, 2009 at 10:34 AM
Come on, he was a Baptist. Who doesn’t want to taze a Baptist? Did you ever hear their sermons.
MDWNJ on May 18, 2009 at 10:35 AM
In on first page.
He must be a right-wing extremist.
ballz2wallz on May 18, 2009 at 10:35 AM
Very left-wing publication. Take anything they say with a grain of salt.
jgapinoy on May 18, 2009 at 10:35 AM
A citizen has an obligation under the law to comply with LE instructions. You can disagree, etc., but at the time a cop is trying to get you to comply with something is not the time to make your point.
Make it after, either with an attorney, or after things have calmed down a bit with all parties involved.
People seem to think that if they are innocent, then the cops have no right to take you into custody. This is true, but at a deeper level: Responding officers are the first response to an incident. They are not an investigating agency. They are interested in defalting or de-escalating circumstances and sorting things out. Sometimes this means getting cuffed by the cops until things can get worked out. Cops aren’t the bad guys.
I know this doesn’t always work out. But in most videaos and instances I’ve seen and experienced where people shout “brutality” they were the instigaters of the incident themselves. Had they complied with instructions, there would have been no escalation.
Yes, sometimes people run into “bad cops” or cops get into a power trip, but those incidents are few and far between.
I can’t see either of the videos, so I hope I didn’t stray to far from the topic at hand.
catmman on May 18, 2009 at 10:35 AM
How come these tazered guys always seem to have a camcorder with them?
Caper29 on May 18, 2009 at 10:35 AM
Hmmm officers on a power trip vs whiney punk needlessly attempting to prove some sort of constitutional point while flaunting a rejection for any authority figure. Why do these senarios always end with bloody faces? I just don’t get it.
Zetterson on May 18, 2009 at 10:36 AM
Saw the video a month ago, and found myself very sympathetic to the pastor. But I’m very leery, and I generally trust cops. Don’t know if the guy is really a minister, or just a liberal trouble-maker, so I am measuring my comments carefully.
That said, it certainly looks like the BP is out of control and heavy-handed.
Jaibones on May 18, 2009 at 10:37 AM
Seven
If the Right Reverend is from the ABC-American Baptist Church-he’s a raging liberal…which would explain the trouble he got himself into.
The ABC’s are right up the with the UCC, ELCA, PCUSA, and the United Methodists in being to the left of Stalin.
annoyinglittletwerp on May 18, 2009 at 10:37 AM
“I have a right to be unccoperative with law enforcement officers.”
Is probably now a hero in some corners on the right. Shame.
Akzed on May 18, 2009 at 10:37 AM
Bing
Jaibones on May 18, 2009 at 10:37 AM
+1
MadisonConservative on May 18, 2009 at 10:38 AM
“Your under arrest”. The dog is none of your business. They gave you a direct order. No debate. End of story.
Tell it to the judge after that Padre.
I am with the cops. When they say your under arrest and you refuse orders you are resisting arrest.
God bless the cops for dealing with hysterical drama divas like this guy along with truely dangerous criminals.
Moral of the story. Cooperate with the police, take badge numbers and report any abuse later to a judge.
You wake up idiot!
RobCon on May 18, 2009 at 10:38 AM
This preacher is a victim of his own actions. Sympathy for something this moroinic when the world is full of injustice for far less reasons only suggests that there are two sides of most stories, when in cases like this, they’re not. This guy reinforces negativity rowards Christians by being a preacher and refusing to comply with the simplest of requests by the authorities checking for drugs at a checkpoint. The question is, why did he incite this action for no reason whatsoever?
volsense on May 18, 2009 at 10:39 AM
And if a cop wants to force someone out of a car, how bout they grow a pair and do it the old fashioned way, with bare hands?
ernesto on May 18, 2009 at 10:22 AM
Sure, I can go hands on and do it the old fashioned way instead of letting you ride the lightning. You will be much more injured when it’s over.
Dukeboy01 on May 18, 2009 at 10:39 AM
Yep. Dude could have defended his rights without getting tazered if he just refused the search and shut up. It would then be on the cop to come up with probable cause and build the case. The pastor was looking for a fight.
Spectreman on May 18, 2009 at 10:39 AM
You try tasing this Baptist and I’ll retaliate with my .38 snubby.
ladyingray on May 18, 2009 at 10:40 AM
When they have guns or announce that they are from the IRS, then yes.
myrenovations on May 18, 2009 at 10:40 AM
First off the 4th amendment protects against Unreasonable search and seizure not “warrantless” searches.
Second the police gave him a lawful order which he refused to obey. Based on the dogs reaction they had probable cause to search the vehicle.
The whole thing could have been avoided if he had just complied with the officers from the beginning.
And Ernesto yes refusing to obey a lawful order is a reason to be arrested
JKotthoff on May 18, 2009 at 10:40 AM
A few thoughts, sure the guy was not smart to smart off. 2nd, what if he had been a plumber? Would the headline be “Border Patrol tasers plumber at a traffic stop”?
3rd, maybe he was smuggling in Bibles to Amerikkka?
kirkill on May 18, 2009 at 10:41 AM
There doesn’t seem to be enough information available to form a good opinion.
Where was the stop (ON the border, NEAR the border, in the general vicinity of the border)?
Was the request to search the vehicle before or after the “pastor” refused to answer the questions?
That said, I have absolutely NO sympathy for the “pastor” who seemed to have been LOOKING to provoke an incident.
I mean, why not answer the questions?
Why not allow the police to search the vehicle? Was he hiding something?
Why sit in your car for 75 minutes? Why didn’t he call a lawyer or regular police while he was “holed up” in his car?
And whatever empathy he might have had from me as a “pastor”, he lost with this: “Anderson says he is planning to sue.”
Religious_Zealot on May 18, 2009 at 10:41 AM
Really. His getting tazed is no doubt a sign that we’re in “the last days.”
Akzed on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
You just get better and better
blatantblue on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
I’m a pastor… but that title means exactly nothing, legally. There is no standard that may be objectively and universally enforced in this country as to just who qualifies.
The tradition of my church dictates a serious post graduate seminary program (we’re talking about another four years after earning one’s bachelors degree to earn a terminal professional degree), then the endorsement of the faculty, and of the men serving as pastors, a call issued by a congregation to serve as their pastor, and then the rite of ordination.
I cringe when I see self-appointed, untrained, uneducated clowns who couldn’t work their way through an English translation of the Bible, much less the Hebrew and Greek (both languages were prerequisites for entry to my seminary program), who feel themselves entitled to any sort of nonsense and extreme of behaviour.
Please don’t confuse the idiocies of those make-it-up-as-you-go-along types with those who are pastors according to the traditional standards of those denominations who highly value the Word and the intellectual, spiritual, and emotional formation of their ministers.
Scribbler on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
Haha. Note to self, don’t taze ladyingray.
MDWNJ on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
Ditto. I was pulled over more times than I can count when I was going to U of Md., and then living in Alexandria for a couple years. I know full well it was because I had Conn. plates on my car. The first time me and my buddy from NY got pulled over by campus police (he had NY plates) the first words out of the cop’s mouth were “You New Yorkers come down here and you think you own the place!”
And my dad is a retired cop. As a kid, I always used to ask “Can a cop do this, or that, or this…” and my dad’s words were always the same: “A police officer can do whatever he wants to do.”
Granted, that’s not entirely true…but he can ruin your night, if you let him.
Peeps need to understand, when you’re pulled over or stopped at a checkpoint, keep your mouth shut, and only answer the officer’s questions. And fer cripes sake, if he asks you “How much did you have to drink tonight?” then he’s already smelled it on your breath, and don’t say what everyone says: “I had two beers”. It’s always “two”.
But same…for all the times I was pulled over, I only ever got one speeding ticket. Every other time, after a couple minutes, I was on my way.
JetBoy on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
Here’s my contribution.
Preist mouths off to cop. Priest gets tazed. End of story, not the end of the world.
Good luck on that 1000 comments!
UltimateBob on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
However, I will show you this taser.
Uniblogger on May 18, 2009 at 10:42 AM
I can’t watch the videos right now, but I do want to help us reach our stated goal of 1000 comments. Tazed, lol.
Ars Moriendi on May 18, 2009 at 10:43 AM
Yep! I rolled through an empty four way stop where I used to live one day, and this cop was RIGHT THERE. So, I just pulled right over, she didn’t have to put on any horn or signal.
She came up, I said I rolled through, then she let me go and said:
“Next time you stop at this four way, I f*cking run around here.”
As she walked away, I looked at her booty and said to myself:
“Yea — you do run..” MM!!
blatantblue on May 18, 2009 at 10:44 AM
Well, of course he’s going to say that! After all, he is your dad first, cop second. :-)
What he was really saying was, “A police officer can do whatever he wants to do… to his son.”
UltimateBob on May 18, 2009 at 10:45 AM
ernesto on May 18, 2009 at 10:22 AM
Have you ever been drug out of a car? You would not reccomend that if you had.
I have had to drag a few people out of vehicles at check points, and it always a pain and involves a lot of cuts scrapes and wrenched joints. Oh yea and did I mention it get everyone keyed up? I would have preferred to just shoot the idiot but some one insists we play nice with our “allies”.
LincolntheHun on May 18, 2009 at 10:45 AM
Good sheep. Baa for me.
MadisonConservative on May 18, 2009 at 10:46 AM
IF what the police officer has to say in the second video is accurate, this is an easy one – the cop’s right.
The standard for arrest is NOT beyond a reasonable doubt but simply whether or not the officer has reasonable suspicion. If the dog has pointed out his car as carrying drugs, reasonable suspicion exists. At that point, it’s the cop’s right to arrest you and your legal obligation to follow the lawful orders of a police officer acting within his duty.
No, you do NOT get to request that the evidence be shown to you. That will happen, if at all, in a courtroom. No, you do not get to talk to your lawyer then.
We have a person (or supporters) with a martyr complex (Be Still My Soul? Really?) who, IF what the cop said on his own video that the dogs has pointed out that his car has drugs in it is accurate (at least that the dog pointed it out, at this point the existence of the drugs is irrelevant), is most certainly at fault.
I’ve seen a few “near misses” here on Hot Air, but this one is pretty cut and dry.
ChePibe on May 18, 2009 at 10:47 AM
Waterboarding terrorists not okay… tasering Christians okay…
Lions at the Coliseum; news at 11:00.
IntheNet on May 18, 2009 at 10:47 AM
Dude, don’t taze my face!
The guy should have just gotten out of the car.
forest on May 18, 2009 at 10:48 AM
So that’s what you sound like when getting tased? Man, pretty humiliating.
Remind me never to get tased so my friends can say “You sounded like a little girl.”
Bishop on May 18, 2009 at 10:48 AM
Baa.
myrenovations on May 18, 2009 at 10:48 AM
Blatant Blue now regrets reading this comment while drinking coffee
blatantblue on May 18, 2009 at 10:49 AM
Where is Nancy the Liar to protest the torturing of a citizen by federal agent? Chirp Chirp. We can’t squirt water up a terrorists nose, but yes we can taser suspects at makeshift border crossings?
Not making a judgement yet. Usually, the police, especially with cameras rolling, are fairly restrained. There’s a big peice of this story still missing–the police (or Border Patrol)report.
That all said, this pastor was begging for it. Now he’s a star.
Western_Civ on May 18, 2009 at 10:49 AM
How many times do we watch some video of some punk getting pulled out of their car or tazed or arrested simply because they decided that they had some inalienable right to say “no” to a police command.
Be polite.
Answer the questions quickly and honestly.
Don’t try to be a constitutional lawyer.
It’s pretty simple.
Religious_Zealot on May 18, 2009 at 10:50 AM
Its not worth any where near 1,000 comments…
As a christian, he should know better than to SEEK conflict that does not unnecessarily compromise ones principles.
singlemalt_18 on May 18, 2009 at 10:50 AM
Indeed. Too much Churches R Us going on around here.
Akzed on May 18, 2009 at 10:51 AM
What I have to assume is that this guy’s argumentative behavior, from the cop’s perspective, set off red flags. He refused to meet them half way on anything they requested. I’m not a scholar of the law so I’m not sure what actual rights to privacy we have at security checkpoints. Is it like the airport with random bag searches in which case we regard granny with a walker as equally threatening as 22 yr old Muhammed? If so, chalk up our refusal to racially profile as one more reason this situation could have been avoided entirely. This preacher did not fit the profile of on who dabbles in drug, weapons or human trafficing. He simply strikes me as the pastor of one of those churches with a rainbow flag hanging over the front entrance. From where I’m sitting, the cops had no real reason to suspect this man, nor did this man have any reason to refuse to comply with the cops requests.
Zetterson on May 18, 2009 at 10:51 AM
Ya, I mean, we all know the Constitution is now null and void. Just comply with the authorities every command, law be damned!
TheBigOldDog on May 18, 2009 at 10:51 AM
Are you sure this guy was a US Border Patrol Agent? His uniform looked gray to me.
glockman on May 18, 2009 at 10:51 AM
There’s a checkpoint on the I-10 between SD and Phoenix. There’s another on the I-5 at Camp Pendleton.
Mazztek on May 18, 2009 at 10:52 AM
Refusing to consent to a search and not giving up your right to do so is “trying to be a constitutional lawyer”?
Wow.
I’m not saying the pastor wasn’t a douche, but still, wow. Especially coming from a conservative.
MadisonConservative on May 18, 2009 at 10:53 AM
I’m guessing the policy is to get the people out of the car before digging around looking for drugs. How long can the police or border patrol hold someone if the drug dog signals on a car, but they can’t find any drugs? I assume they would run the dogs through again as soon as they got him out of the car to try to pinpoint the location of the scent?
forest on May 18, 2009 at 10:53 AM
Seriously? What about this officer’s order was unconstitutional?
Akzed on May 18, 2009 at 10:53 AM
When the trooper said, “We now have probable cause”, it was Game Over. Even if you dispute that there is probable cause, you are then required to comply. Take it up with a civil rights lawyer later. I would rather have played it that way and when the car came up clean, said, “Don’t you think your “dog” needs some retraining? Do I get my apology now or do I have to wait until after I file my complaint?”
Apart from that, if he was, in fact, over-tased AND mocked, then there is additional room for legal argument on his side. What did the trooper that mocked him have to say when the car came up clean?
GISAP on May 18, 2009 at 10:54 AM
That baptist “pastor” must have missed this part in his Bible:
(Romans 13:1-5)
Religious_Zealot on May 18, 2009 at 10:54 AM
Oh, and all of the Constitutional scholars out there, including the jackass pastor, pulling their hair out and squawking about the 4th Amendment need to Google “Border search exemption” and “United States vs. Montoya de Hernandez.”
Short version: Border patrol doesn’t probable cause to search your shit at the border. They just need reasonable suspicion, which I’m sure any BP agent who’s been out of the training academy for over a week can articulate in spades.
Dukeboy01 on May 18, 2009 at 10:54 AM
We need people like him willing to take a beating to protect us all or we’ll just give away our rights completely.
I have no doubt they lied about the dog, and if they didn’t then dogs are not reliable enough to be considered probable cause.
TheBigOldDog on May 18, 2009 at 10:55 AM
You realize the guy wasn’t at the border right?
TheBigOldDog on May 18, 2009 at 10:56 AM
Excuse me but when the dog alerted on the Pastor’s vehicle the police had probable cause to detain him and search his vehicle. They are not going to allow him to proceed and he refused their request to step out of his car so it could be searched. Complain later.
skatz51 on May 18, 2009 at 10:56 AM
Brave new world indeed.
daesleeper on May 18, 2009 at 10:57 AM
Meh. Pastor, bricklayer, or candlestick maker. The man’s occupation means very little.
Do what the police ask you to do and 99% of the time you’ll come out OK. Especially if you’re not guilty of anything.
Fish on May 18, 2009 at 10:57 AM
1) That post was a general post about how things generally go. I saw similar things as a teacher – kids who couldn’t tell you how many amendments there are to the constitution were then telling me they had some “right” to not do their homework.
2) Specifically, if the officer’s story is right and a dog “hit” on his car, then the 4th Amendment doesn’t apply.
3) I also generally believe that people should actually KNOW the constitution before they start arguing with police over the “constitutionality” of what the police are trying to do.
Religious_Zealot on May 18, 2009 at 10:58 AM
Hassling American citizens and conditioning us for “Your papers, please.”
Rae on May 18, 2009 at 10:58 AM
So, all they have to do is bring a drug dog near the car, and as long as they say he reacted, they can search?
Interesting, and highly questionable.
MadisonConservative on May 18, 2009 at 10:59 AM
He must learn to respect their AUTHO RI TIE!
faol on May 18, 2009 at 10:59 AM
They made the decision that this guy needed to be looked at, who’s opinion is it that the decision to take him out of his car was questionable? When he refused should they have said ok and waived him on?
So the agents should have crawled into the car to wrestle with a suspect who wasn’t cooperating?
If this went on for an hour and they guy was correct, that he didn’t do anything wrong in the first place, then what was he trying to accomplish by dragging it out for an hour? Get out of the car, bitch about it, ask for badge numbers and then go home and have a beer to calm down. The guy was looking for trouble and he got it. My bet is that if this lasted an hour these guys did things by the book, whether or not the guy was hiding something. They didn’t overreact, they talked things out and did what they had to.
peacenprosperity on May 18, 2009 at 11:00 AM
You’re wrong. Once a LEO engages you in a traffic stop, you are in his custody. Your failure to cooperate or obey an order at the scene qualifies you for further detention or actions.
bloviator on May 18, 2009 at 11:00 AM
Gee I wonder if you’d consider that applicable in Saudi Arabia or Nazi Germany.
Wake up people. You have rights against living in a police State. If police have probable cause that’s one thing, but they have no right to stop you within the borders of your own country and beat the sh!t out of you simply because you refuse to voluntarily give up your constitutional rights.
You let them get away with this sh!t and it won’t be long before they are breaking down your door because you’re on Auntie Janet’s little list and may legally own a gun you are unwilling to give up voluntarily.
TheBigOldDog on May 18, 2009 at 11:00 AM
I think all of this can be resolved by waterboarding the dog who obviously thought it would be hilarious to provide the cops with false intelligence.
Zetterson on May 18, 2009 at 11:01 AM
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