Social Security already running red; Update: Going bad faster than trustees admit

posted at 8:44 am on May 13, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

The big story for the day will probably be the new report that Social Security will start running in the red in 2016.  The stories will include talk of a “trust fund” as well, as does the Washington Post:

Specifically, the trustees’ report predicts that the trust fund from which Social Security payments are made will be unable to pay retirees full benefits by 2037, four years earlier than forecast a year ago. In particular, the trustees single out the financial weakness of the part of the program that subsidizes disabled Americans, saying that fund will run out of money in 2020.

Only three times in the past 15 years have the trustees predicted that Social Security would run out of money sooner than previously expected. Last year, they forecast no change from the 2007 prediction, and in 2007, they predicted that the fund would last a year longer than they had previously thought.

Yesterday’s report also said the Social Security trust fund will begin to spend more money than it takes in through tax revenue in 2016, one year sooner than predicted a year ago.

There is no trust fund.  Social Security surpluses have always been used by the federal government for general-fund allotments, replaced essentially by IOUs.  This became an issue in the 2000 presidential election, when Al Gore talked about a “lockbox” to keep Congress out of the surpluses.  The “trust fund” consists of bonds, not cash, and they have to be redeemed by the US government, which already runs massive deficits.

For the second piece of bad news, the report is wrong in the timing as well.  They claim that outlays will exceed receipts for the first time in 2016.  Unfortunately, that’s already the case.  In February, as the Treasury’s own website makes clear, we took in $54.5 billion and paid out $55.7 billion, for a deficit of $1.25 billion.  In March that recovered to gain a $2.7 billion profit, but the first red ink has already been spilled, and it’s not going to stay black again for very long.

What does that mean for the US?  I’ll have more later this morning.

Update: Chuck Blahous has more bad news:

  • More than 3/4 of this year’s previously-projected Social Security surplus appears to be gone.
  • Annual shortfalls are more likely to arrive still sooner than later – even than the now-worsened Intermediate projection.
  • The single-year deterioration in the 2009 report is historic by any standard.  Very few previous annual updates have showed a worsening of this magnitude, and those were often a result of changes in methodologies or assumptions.  The current worsening is a real one, not a methodological one.
  • Policy makers’ options for closing the shortfall are becoming even more tightly constrained.
  • Updated data are now wholly discrediting previous claims that the Trustees had been exaggerating the program’s shortfall.

He has much more at the link.

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Comment pages: 1 2

Odd… I thought the Dems said social security was fine.

jeffn21 on May 13, 2009 at 8:46 AM

They ought to make folks who get elected pass an elementary math test. That would weed out most of them – starting with Obama.

beatcanvas on May 13, 2009 at 8:49 AM

Soon, retiring will refer to a slave labor position at a rundown Detroit auto factory.

Shy Guy on May 13, 2009 at 8:49 AM

Not only is Obama pitting rich against poor, next he will pit young against old with a vengeance. Your retirement and quality of life is directly proportional to what the government does today. And right now it is not looking very good for anyone. (Except for his highness the ZERO)

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 8:52 AM

What fascinated me was the fact that tax cheat Gietner and the other “trustees” were full of gloom about the bottom line but not one of the bastards or the filthy liar in the White House has put forth any thoughts about how to fix the problem. The timing was off but GWB, at least, proposed privitization. All the filthy liar and his henchmen can do is state the obvious.

highhopes on May 13, 2009 at 8:52 AM

Question – what interest rate is the government assuming that it will pay itself? I seem to recall 7%, but I can’t confirm that.

steveegg on May 13, 2009 at 8:52 AM

Maybe this will all go away if the Dems stand around patting the head of that FDR statue. Like they did when they told Bush it didn’t need fixing.

Maquis on May 13, 2009 at 8:52 AM

Soon, retiring will refer to a slave labor position at a rundown Detroit auto factory.

Shy Guy on May 13, 2009 at 8:49 AM

I liked the comment that things are so bad the US government will soon be a pension plan with an army. As I posted above, what is really sad is that the filthy liar and his people are unwilling to provide any leadership on this issue.

highhopes on May 13, 2009 at 8:53 AM

NEWSFLASH!!!!!!!

OBAMA TO COMBINE SOCIAL SECURITY, MEDICARE AND NATIONALIZED HEALTH CARE INTO ONE PROGRAM. THAT PROGRAM TO BE CALLED….

LOGAN’S RUN

lm10001 on May 13, 2009 at 8:54 AM

Maybe this will all go away if the Dems stand around patting the head of that FDR statue. Like they did when they told Bush it didn’t need fixing.

Maquis on May 13, 2009 at 8:52 AM

That’s so old school. These days the high priests of the administration simply sacrifice a fatted calf to Obama- their new god.

highhopes on May 13, 2009 at 8:54 AM

Ed, thanks for covering this. Most politically aware conservatives, meaning most Hotair.com readers, know Social Security is ponzi scheme collapsing of its own weight. They probably know there is no actual trust fund with money in it. What they may not fully realize is that the government is losing control of the bond market. The FED is engaged in quantitative easing (buying Treasuries) in an attempt–per Ben Bernanke–to cap yields. The problem is that yields have now risen above where they were when Helicopter Ben announced the program.

Per data released yesterday, tax receipts in April were off 35% over last year, and corporate income taxes are off a whopping 43.1%. So at the same time Obongo is world history’s largest spending binge, the government receipts are down AND their ability to issue debt at reasonable rates is on the wane. Soon our government may just have to live within its means by necessity. They will do ANYTHING to keep the merry-go-round spinning, so they are very dangerous right now.

flyfisher on May 13, 2009 at 8:55 AM

Let’s start up some more of these great things FDR started for us…

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 8:56 AM

I’m shocked! Wow, I guess George Bush left us in a bigger mess than even Obama thought. One more horrible thing The Great Leader inherited.

JeffinOrlando on May 13, 2009 at 8:57 AM

No need to worry… don’t you understand that if we develop “green” energy resources, AND fix our “broken” health care system, then we are all going to live happily ever after?

singlemalt_18 on May 13, 2009 at 8:57 AM

I’ll bet the answer to this problem is raising taxes.

I mean, this is just a guess and pure speculation, but I would be willing to bet that the answer is raising taxes.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 8:57 AM

Let’s start up some more of these great things FDR started for us…

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 8:56 AM

Now, now! Let’s not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Shy Guy on May 13, 2009 at 8:58 AM

In a CNN poll – 51% of people are depending upon Social Security for their retirement. Newsflash – if any of you 51% voted for Obama & democrats then you need a reality check.

Question:
Which Political Party took Social Security from the Independent ‘Trust Fund’ and put it into the General Fund so that Congress could spend it?

Answer:
It was Lyndon B. Johnson (Democrat,Term of Office: November 22,1963 to January 20, 1969) and the democratically Controlled House and Senate.

Question:
Which Political Party eliminated the income tax Deduction for Social Security (FICA) withholding?

Answer:
The Democratic Party.

Question:
Which Political Party started taxing Social Security annuities?

Answer:
The Democratic Party, with Albert Arnold Gore, Jr. (Al Gore) [Vice President Term of Office: January 10, 1993 to January 20, 2001] casting the ‘tie-breaking’ deciding vote as President of the Senate, while he was Vice President of the US ….

Question:
Which Political Party decided to start giving Annuity payments to immigrants?

ANSWER:
That’s right! JAMES EARL CARTER, JR. (jIMMY CARTER) (DEMOCRAT, TERM OF OFFICE: JANUARY 20, 1977 TO JANUARY 20, 1981 AND THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.
IMMIGRANTS MOVED INTO THIS COUNTRY, AND AT AGE 65, BEGAN TO RECEIVE SOCIAL SECURITY PAYMENTS: THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY GAVE THESE PAYMENTS TO THEM, EVEN THOUGH THEY NEVER

PAID A DIME INTO IT!

Then, after violating the original contract (FICA), the Democrats turn around and tell you that the Republicans want to take your Social Security away!

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:01 AM

Pfffft. Just print up some more money. What could go wrong?

Daggett on May 13, 2009 at 9:06 AM

I’ll bet the answer to this problem is raising taxes.

I mean, this is just a guess and pure speculation, but I would be willing to bet that the answer is raising taxes.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 8:57 AM

It’ll be raising taxes and means-testing social security benefits. So you’ll end up paying more and getting absolutely nothing for it.

There’ll be hell to pay for that, so my prediction is that in order to win political approval the bill will also RAISE social security benefits without raising taxes for a particular class of people so that the Dems can buy off enough votes from the winners under the revised plan to defeat everyone else.

Thus when the firestorm hits, the Dems will claim that they are revising social security to improve benefits, while opponents to their plan want to use social security to give money to the undeserving rich.

PackerBronco on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

America held hostage now.A Gummint held accountable to No One…Promises broken…OBAMA Nation…Debt that will burden Generations…the Constitution & Bill of Rights trashed…

Keep That in your thoughts today and remember what You had, the American Dream…that went away…

old trooper2 on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

lm10001 on May 13, 2009 at 8:54 AM

Comment of the Day™

steveegg on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

The Treasury also ran a deficit in April for the first time in 26 years!

How can this not be scaring the crap out of people?

rockmom on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:01 AM

Oh wow. Good information.

ladyingray on May 13, 2009 at 9:09 AM

Then, after violating the original contract (FICA), the Democrats turn around and tell you that the Republicans want to take your Social Security away!

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:01 AM

Poor Carter… No New Deal, No Great Society… just immediate failure (instead of failure that lasted/is lasting decades…)

Ehhh which is worse?

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:13 AM

How can this not be scaring the crap out of people?

rockmom on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

Because most people don’t know about it.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 9:14 AM

February 2009 is not the first time the total fund ran negative – a quick run of random months reveals that it went negative in August, October, and November of 2008.

The significance of those months, as well as February 2009, is that those of us who pay quarterly taxes don’t pay taxes those months. Some do pay in March, which explains the net-positive.

steveegg on May 13, 2009 at 9:15 AM

The Unicorn ate my homework!

TexasJew on May 13, 2009 at 9:15 AM

Gee, I seem to recall a certain former President wanting to tackle this very serious issue just a few short years ago. But we were told by the Left that all was fine with it and that the Bush admin just hated old people.

As Obama’s beloved Rev. Wright would say, looks like their chickens are coming home to roost.

changer1701 on May 13, 2009 at 9:15 AM

We probably also have about 30 million more recipients about to enter the system who have paid squat into it. Defy the laws of physics and probably you die. Defy the laws of economics and we all probably will die.

hip shot on May 13, 2009 at 9:15 AM

Don’t worry. It’s all part of the plan.

You see, Social Security isn’t the problem. People living too long is the problem.

Once our Brave New World health care system is in place, the government can help see to it that no one lives longer than is necessary for the greater good. Once you’re old and retired and no longer a producer (and not a very high consumer either), there’s really not much reason to keep you around.

Get rid of a good portion of those baby boomers that are about to retire and Abracadabra! Social security is fixed!

JadeNYU on May 13, 2009 at 9:16 AM

Because most people don’t know about it.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 9:14 AM

Further, what’s worse… This program failing or it failing after Obama “tries” 10 times to fix it?

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:16 AM

IIRC, didn’t the Repubs lose the Senate in the 1980s for bringing up soc sec reform? Like 1986? Then old people said in 1996 “I’m not voting for Dole — he wants to take away my Social Security!”. And then Bush II brought it up most recently. Demagogued every time by the Dems. Irresponsible.

The USSR basically just cracked up. Could that happen to the US soon? The entitlement systems can no longer be sustained. Something has to give, in a big way.

Paul-Cincy on May 13, 2009 at 9:17 AM

There is no trust fund. Social Security surpluses have always been used by the federal government for general-fund allotments, replaced essentially by IOUs. This became an issue in the 2000 presidential election, when Al Gore talked about a “lockbox” to keep Congress out of the surpluses. The “trust fund” consists of bonds, not cash, and they have to be redeemed by the US government, which already runs massive deficits.

You are being far too kind to the operators of this Madoff scheme. The Treasuries aren’t IOUs, they’re reminder slips that the money has already been spent. You can’t write an IOU to yourself.

Ted Torgerson on May 13, 2009 at 9:17 AM

Doesn’t need fixed, and it is fine just the way it is if you greedy Rethuglicans would stop raiding it for wars….

//donk

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:18 AM

IIRC, didn’t the Repubs lose the Senate in the 1980s for bringing up soc sec reform? Like 1986? Then old people said in 1996 “I’m not voting for Dole — he wants to take away my Social Security!”. And then Bush II brought it up most recently. Demagogued every time by the Dems. Irresponsible.

The USSR basically just cracked up. Could that happen to the US soon? The entitlement systems can no longer be sustained. Something has to give, in a big way.

Paul-Cincy on May 13, 2009 at 9:17 AM

Everyone must sacrifice something to Teh One ///sarc

Yeah, something is going to have to give, but it’s going to be painful and people won’t like it.

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:18 AM

Doesn’t need fixed, and it is fine just the way it is if you greedy Rethuglicans would stop raiding it for wars….

//donk

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:18 AM

*snort*

At least when the Donks dipped into it, it was for important things like giving heart attacks to elderly people in NYC via Scare Force One… ///s

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:19 AM

How can this not be scaring the crap out of people?

rockmom on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

3/4 of this country are ignorant, obtuse, and lazy.

csdeven on May 13, 2009 at 9:20 AM

Retire? I’m 44 and I’ve never thought that I would be able to retire. Going back 20+ years it was clear that Social Security was nothing but a vote buying Ponzi scheme.

rbj on May 13, 2009 at 9:21 AM

*snort*

At least when the Donks dipped into it, it was for important things like giving heart attacks to elderly people in NYC via Scare Force One… ///s

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:19 AM

I may have to go back to linking in all seriousness….it’s like this…the “trust fund” has been raided consistently since inception under the Fine Donk Regent to “fund wars”…the mule hypocrisy knows no bounds.

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:22 AM

In the end, we are going to end up having to contribute to SS and then set our own money aside for our own retirements (mine is like 40+ years away – ahhhh!)

Tis the price we must pay for letting progressives touch things.

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:23 AM

This is scaring the crap out of me and not because I care about SS or Medicaid/Medicare (the CBS report yesterday said that Medicaid will run out of money before Social Security, could someone address that?)
It is scaring me because I know that the only way these idiots know to solve this is to tax. My bills are ouutrageous, taxes and utilities, and I am scared shitless because I have no more money to give for their failed, idiotic economic disasters.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:23 AM

the mule hypocrisy knows no bounds.

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:22 AM

Can you imagine Bawney restraining himself? No, I didn’t say putting himself in restraints…

Eh, this is so depressing, one only wants to make light of it because the “remedy” is not going to be pretty.

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:25 AM

and I am scared shitless because I have no more money to give for their failed, idiotic economic disasters.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:23 AM

I’m willing to bet that the government can find some more of your money to take. You may think you are out of money, but they are much more creative in their thinking.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 9:26 AM

This is scaring the crap out of me and not because I care about SS or Medicaid/Medicare (the CBS report yesterday said that Medicaid will run out of money before Social Security, could someone address that?)
It is scaring me because I know that the only way these idiots know to solve this is to tax. My bills are ouutrageous, taxes and utilities, and I am scared shitless because I have no more money to give for their failed, idiotic economic disasters.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:23 AM

well in all candor U85 is right, our generation has the duty to be responsible since the boomers cannot be…

1)get ready to go expat and build skills that are portable and in demand internationally

2) build a rocket ship and go to a “new world” like the EUtopians who yearned simply to keep what was theirs did

3) pray there is a peaceful split between the red and blue states

4) vote and organize the GOP into a lean fiscally mean force

a few of those choices are more realistic than others

*wink

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:27 AM

Yep, my 401k’s next. But the jokes on them, they should have taken it when it was worth something.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:27 AM

It is scaring me because I know that the only way these idiots know to solve this is to tax. My bills are ouutrageous, taxes and utilities, and I am scared shitless because I have no more money to give for their failed, idiotic economic disasters.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:23 AM

One part of the solution (and it’s not a fair one) is to tell people that can support themselves without SS that they cannot draw from more than they put in (maybe even less…) – then, shut down SS for younger generations.

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:28 AM

Kids- this gets even more dangerous as there are at least two SCOTUS decisions clearly stating that there is no, repeat NO contract between the American contributors of FICA and the SS Admin. In other words, we are screwed should the Congress decide to do so!
And this is the warning before the intergenerational civil war.

Amendment X on May 13, 2009 at 9:28 AM

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:01 AM

Thanks for your input. These people have been lying to us and stealing our money for years, and getting away with it. I think the basic problem with social security is that people who never paid into it are living on it right now.

scalleywag on May 13, 2009 at 9:28 AM

Kids- this gets even more dangerous as there are at least two SCOTUS decisions clearly stating that there is no, repeat NO contract between the American contributors of FICA and the SS Admin. In other words, we are screwed should the Congress decide to do so!
And this is the warning before the intergenerational civil war.

Amendment X on May 13, 2009 at 9:28 AM

indeed…the paranoid in me says this is why the boomers are busy indoctrinating generation X’s kids in collectivism…

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:29 AM

Kids- this gets even more dangerous as there are at least two SCOTUS decisions clearly stating that there is no, repeat NO contract between the American contributors of FICA and the SS Admin. In other words, we are screwed should the Congress decide to do so!
And this is the warning before the intergenerational civil war.

Amendment X on May 13, 2009 at 9:28 AM

We are and have already been screwed…

Must move on and come up with ideas to help the problem – but never forget how this all started.

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:30 AM

Eh, this is so depressing, one only wants to make light of it because the “remedy” is not going to be pretty.

Upstater85 on May 13, 2009 at 9:25 AM

I’m with you…and I am getting an ulcer too.

OT:
Good job last night Ed. Wish you had more time for questions.
It was good to see Norm there. Bennett, Prager and Hewitt were great.

mnmom on May 13, 2009 at 9:32 AM

Seriously, this is why the Tea Parties should NOT be taken over by politicians of any sort. The protests about spending are going to get increasingly louder. You can not and should not cloud the issue with partisan politics, because in the end, politicians and their self centered exclusive club in Congress is part of the problem.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:33 AM

Our Social Security

Franklin Roosevelt, a Democrat, introduced the Social Security (FICA) Program. He promised:

1.) That participation in the Program would be completely voluntary,

2.) That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their annual incomes into the Program,

3.) That the money the participants elected to put into the Program would be deductible from their income for tax purposes each year,

4.) That the money the participants put into the Independent “Trust Fund” rather than into the General Operating Fund, and therefore, would only be used to fund the Social Security Retirement Program, and no other Government program, and,

5.) That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income.

Since many of us have paid into FICA for years and are now receiving a Social Security check every month — and then finding that we are getting taxed on 85% of the money we paid to the Federal government to “put away” — you may be interested in the following:

————————————————————-

Q: Which Political Party took Social Security from the Independent “Trust Fund” and put it into the General fund so that Congress could spend it?

A: It was Lyndon Johnson and the democratically controlled House and Senate.

——————————————————————–

Q: Which Political Party eliminated the income tax deduction for Social Security (FICA) withholding?

A: The Democratic Party.

———————————————————————–

Q: Which Political Party started taxing Social Security annuities?

A: The Democratic Party, with Al Gore casting the “tie-breaking” deciding vote as President of the Senate, while he was Vice President of the US.

——————————————————————-

Q: Which Political Party decided to start giving annuity payments to immigrants?

AND MY FAVORITE:

A: That’s right!

Jimmy Carter and the Democratic Party. immigrants moved into this country, and at age 65, began to receive Social Security payments! The Democratic Party gave these payments to them, even though they never paid a dime into it!

————– ————————– ——————————

Then, after violating the original contract (FICA), the Democrats turn around and tell you that the Republicans want to take your Social Security away!

And the worst part about it is uninformed citizens believe it! (And now they don’t want most retirees to share in the rebates to help the economy!)

If enough people receive this, maybe a seed of awareness will be planted and maybe changes will evolve. Maybe not, some Democrats are awfully sure of what isn’t so.

But it’s worth a try. How many people can YOU send this to?

Actions speak louder than bumper stickers.

AND CONGRESS GIVES THEMSELVES 100% RETIREMENT FOR ONLY SERVING ONE TERM!!!

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
-Thomas Jefferson

xler8bmw on May 13, 2009 at 9:36 AM

We probably also have about 30 million more recipients about to enter the system who have paid squat into it.

hip shot on May 13, 2009 at 9:15 AM

That’s really an ignorant statement.

The millions of baby boomers, like myself, who are about to enter “the system”, have paid more than our share into the SS system. My contributions paid for my grandparents, who contributed virtually nothing into the system. My contributions paid for my parents, who left the work force in the early 1980′s, and who also paid a miniscule amount into the system. Both my grandparents and parents got back 10-20 fold what they contributed.

Now, as for us baby boomers about to get our due rewards from the gubmint. I have personally paid a small fortune into SS, started working when I was 12 years old, and later in life ran my own business for over 25 years. I will never, ever, get back the amount of money I put into the system. I will never have the money for myself, or to pass on to my children, had I been able to opt out of this archaic, crumbling pyramid scheme run by the government and choose my own investment vehicle for my retirement. But I saw the painting on the wall many years ago, and did initiate saving in my own individual retirement account so I would not have to depend on the gubmint. Chances are, this same gubmint will find a way to get it’s greedy little hands on my personal savings for retirement. That’s when I’ll come out, guns a blazing.

So you can shove your snarky little comment where the sun doesn’t shine, my naive little friend. I paid plenty. As did millions of other baby boomers, who I proudly speak for as well.

fogw on May 13, 2009 at 9:36 AM

How can this not be scaring the crap out of people?

rockmom on May 13, 2009 at 9:08 AM

Because most people don’t know about it.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 9:14 AM

Even if you printed out this information in BLACK & WHITE and posted a flyer on every car you see that has an Obama bumper sticker they would not believe it. The hip young liberal NEVER thinks about the future. They just don’t care. They want free tunes for their iPods. Even OLD liberals don’t care because they have lived under the false promises of the democrats for decades. If you ever watch shows where they have conservatives vs. liberals it is just mind boggling what the liberals believe. I really believe it will take a NEW great depression and violence in the streets before anything ever gets turned around. If Americans were left to their own devices they would be able to not only survive but thrive. The oppression and reaching of the Federal government has gotten out of hand.

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:39 AM

So you can shove your snarky little comment where the sun doesn’t shine, my naive little friend. I paid plenty. As did millions of other baby boomers, who I proudly speak for as well.

fogw on May 13, 2009 at 9:36 AM

Heh…..

“right” your generation destroyed marriage, destroyed the perception of the US being a power with patience and resolve, turned the drug culture from a national shame to a national pastime and have spent the nation into oblivion….

but on the plus side one of your acid freaks rendered Sesame Street….

you’ll have to show my started work at 14 and paid in his whole working life to get ZERO back when he “retires” at age 80 butt how ANY rate of return is less than “zero”….

HAND Boomer, HAND

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:40 AM

The baby boomers paid plenty. The problem is that the generation following is not going to support you like you supported those before you.

This dinosaur should have died a long time ago but for some reason the Dems only believe in Evolution when it involves bashing Christians.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:40 AM

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:01 AM

xler8bmw on May 13, 2009 at 9:36 AM

I beat you by 35 min!!! Does not hurt to keep pounding this in however!!!

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:41 AM

Dow 8,335.38 -83.39 (-0.99%)
NASDAQ 1,697.06 -18.86 (-1.10%)
S&P 894.46 -13.89 (-1.53%)

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:41 AM

The baby boomers paid plenty. The problem is that the generation following is not going to support you like you supported those before you.

This dinosaur should have died a long time ago but for some reason the Dems only believe in Evolution when it involves bashing Christians.

ORconservative on May 13, 2009 at 9:40 AM

The Boomers KNEW they’d break the backs of their kids and grandkids with their numbers….sensible people saw this coming back in the ’60s.

Look at the number of boomers paying in for each person “taking” versus what the boomers think their split should be….

13 to 1 versus 3 to 1 ain’t gonna be pretty.

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:43 AM

fogw on May 13, 2009 at 9:36 AM

hip shot may have been talking about illegal immigrants becoming citizens and getting into the system, not baby boomers.

BadgerHawk on May 13, 2009 at 9:44 AM

but on the plus side one of your acid freaks rendered Sesame Street….
sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:40 AM

This would only count as a “plus” if it were not on Public Broadcasting.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 9:44 AM

Boy on milk carton still missing after 30 years

That is the CNN headline!!

This is the problem….The CNN headline should be:

“Social Security bankrupt, your retirement (what retirement?)
is screwed. FICA taxes to be raised by Obama administration
to pay for more “stimulus”.

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:46 AM

I’m shocked! Wow, I guess George Bush left us in a bigger mess than even Obama thought. One more horrible thing The Great Leader inherited.

JeffinOrlando on May 13, 2009 at 8:57 AM

So Jeff if:

There is no trust fund. Social Security surpluses have always been used by the federal government for general-fund allotments, replaced essentially by IOUs. This became an issue in the 2000 presidential election, when Al Gore talked about a “lockbox” to keep Congress out of the surpluses.

So how in the hell is this GWB fault? I would think even liberal goomba could figure out the 2000 presidential election was before GWB was elected. It’s the fault of the politicians from both sides! At least GWB tried to come up with a fix rather than standing around with his head up his Obama.

VikingGoneWild on May 13, 2009 at 9:46 AM

Well its only going to get worse with all the Baby Boomers starting to retire and wanting to leach off the Social security and public health care systems as much as possible.

The problem is that as the boomers retire the tax base will shrink due to the resulting decline in the number of people in the workforce.

In a strange way if you look at this from a distance it almost looks like progressive boomers are trying to push through polices like Universal Health care and Amnesty because ultimately it will benefit them in their retirement. IE universal health care to pay for all their expensive medical treatments in old age and a horde of newly naturalized illegal immigrants to tax so that Government can pay for it.

Dreadnought223 on May 13, 2009 at 9:48 AM

So how in the hell is this GWB fault? I would think even liberal goomba could figure out the 2000 presidential election was before GWB was elected. It’s the fault of the politicians from both sides! At least GWB tried to come up with a fix rather than standing around with his head up his Obama.

VikingGoneWild on May 13, 2009 at 9:46 AM

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:01 AM

It is not Bush’s fault. This can be laid right at the democrats feet.
The democrats are morally & fiscally bankrupt – this is the message that conservatives MUST ram home.

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:51 AM

And Charlie Crist still supported porkulus. I will believe the Republican party when it opposes Democrats and supports conservatives. Until then, my wallet is shut.

Marco 2010.

Angry Dumbo on May 13, 2009 at 9:51 AM

Heh…..

“right” your generation destroyed marriage, destroyed the perception of the US being a power with patience and resolve, turned the drug culture from a national shame to a national pastime and have spent the nation into oblivion….

but on the plus side one of your acid freaks rendered Sesame Street….

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 9:40 AM

Thanks. Another ignorant f*ck who paints the baby boomers with a broad brush. Hop on board the dumbass express, pal.

FYI, I didn’t have anything to do with destroying marriage. I am married myself with three fine sons, all of which I put through college. One’s a navy seal, one works in the financial industry, the other in computer software.

Served my country too, asswipe. Six years humping ammo in an artilley outfit. I served my country, have you, you little twerp?

Never used a drug either. I used to spit on hippies when they started parading down the street protesting our involvement in Vietnam.

And for most of my life it was the Democrat party who spent our country into “oblivion”. And never once in my life did I vote for one of them.

You are way off base with your comment. Many, and I do mean many, baby boomers led hardworking lives, taught their children morals, paid into the system. Sorry if you think they are all leftover pot smokers from the 70′s. Not everyone is like your parents.

fogw on May 13, 2009 at 9:53 AM

In a strange way if you look at this from a distance it almost looks like progressive boomers are trying to push through polices like Universal Health care and Amnesty because ultimately it will benefit them in their retirement. IE universal health care to pay for all their expensive medical treatments in old age and a horde of newly naturalized illegal immigrants to tax so that Government can pay for it.

Dreadnought223 on May 13, 2009 at 9:48 AM

The democrats are pushing for it now because this is all they got left in the closet. And what is ironic – if they do get Universal Health care and Amnesty
passed – it might get them re-elected for awhile until the wheels fall off.
They are driving sideways on two wheels now. Universal Health care and Amnesty will do NOTHING but bankrupt America sooner rather than later.
I say get on with it….take everything and give it all away to those who do not work for it. The resulting civil war will be on the democrats heads.

izoneguy on May 13, 2009 at 9:55 AM

NEWSFLASH!!!!!!!

OBAMA TO COMBINE SOCIAL SECURITY, MEDICARE AND NATIONALIZED HEALTH CARE INTO ONE PROGRAM. THAT PROGRAM TO BE CALLED….

LOGAN’S RUN

lm10001 on May 13, 2009 at 8:54 AM

RENEW!!! RENEW!!!

Spectreman on May 13, 2009 at 9:55 AM

Social Security was never intended to be the total retirement program. It was intended as a SUPPLEMENT to an individual retirement plan constructed by the INDIVIDUAL.

It’s incumbent on said individual to provide for their retirement–NOT the government. Unfortunately, SS has become the plan for many, mostly because of ignorance.

I’m retired, and SS plays no part in our income stream, though I do feel some empathy for those who rely on it for income. I’d actually be amenable to having a check for just what I’VE contributed personally and let the gov’t have their contribution, to do whatever with.

Irrespective, it’s gonna be a hell of a mess to rectify.

irongrampa on May 13, 2009 at 9:56 AM

The Pinnochio Presidente and his Merry band of leftist, socialist Congress critters and Senate scum will MEANS TEST social security and medicare in an attempt to FIX the system.

In fact this is only their way of following the Socialist playbook and spreading the wealth.

Thus those of us who have forgone new autos every year, not purchased homes that took all of our income to pay for and saved and invested for our retirement will be screwed so the professional baby makin, pants draggin, drugged up porch sitters of New Orleans, Detroit, Chitown, Philadelphia, Baltimore, and any other inner city cesspool where Dems rule and work is an option will have a retirement equal to my own.

Everyone poor and dependent on the Pinnochio Presidente and his Merry band of Dem scumbags. Thanks 51% of America!

dhunter on May 13, 2009 at 10:01 AM

Not to worry, this will all change be fixed after the census.

(my own FIFY)

nolapol on May 13, 2009 at 10:03 AM

Oh, cr_p. Can we have some good news somewhere on this site, Ed?

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:06 AM

Over at DU (I held my nose, curious what the far left would have to say about this), they basically have 2 arguments: A) this is all lies by the mainstream conservative media and B) just remove “the cap” and the problem is solved.

Not sure what they mean by “the cap”. Somebody please explain why this wouldn’t work (I assume), so I’m prepared for my next argument.

playblu on May 13, 2009 at 10:10 AM

Oh, cr_p. Can we have some good news somewhere on this site, Ed?

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:06 AM

Get Quote

Index Last Change
Dow 8,314.2 -104.57 (-1.24%)
NASDAQ 1,685.39 -30.53 (-1.78%)
S&P 890.76 -17.59 (-1.94%)

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:11 AM

Not sure what they mean by “the cap”. Somebody please explain why this wouldn’t work (I assume), so I’m prepared for my next argument.

playblu on May 13, 2009 at 10:10 AM

There is a Maximum amount of Social Security tax one pays per year….

currently the cap is about 90,000 so a business maxes out on their portion of the Ponzi scheme there as does the sucker erm “employee”…..

now in removing the “cap” you increase cost to business at the same time Ogabe wants to play games with capping salary….

make sense?

No but what in their playbook does?

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:14 AM

Not sure what they mean by “the cap”. Somebody please explain why this wouldn’t work (I assume), so I’m prepared for my next argument.

playblu on May 13, 2009 at 10:10 AM

In a nutshell:

The cap on the level of wages that are taken for social security. People who make under the cap pay on each and every dollar. People who make above the cap only pay on the dollars below the cap.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 10:17 AM

The United States has been turned upside down. Amazing how quickly a democarat liberal can wipe out 300 years of achievement.

saiga on May 13, 2009 at 10:18 AM

Oh, cr_p. Can we have some good news somewhere on this site, Ed?

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:06 AM

Get Quote

Index Last Change
Dow 8,314.2 -104.57 (-1.24%)
NASDAQ 1,685.39 -30.53 (-1.78%)
S&P 890.76 -17.59 (-1.94%)

The good news being I no longer have funds invested?

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:18 AM

In a nutshell:

The cap on the level of wages that are taken for social security. People who make under the cap pay on each and every dollar. People who make above the cap only pay on the dollars below the cap.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 10:17 AM

right but realistically what they are trying to argue is that by removing the cap they will magically “fix” the system the thing is that the increased financial burden on companies will hurt our competitiveness when it is already shot, and it further points out the inherent theft the system represents.

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:19 AM

It took years for Stalin and Hitler to wipe out their countries. It’s looking like Obama will beat them both.

saiga on May 13, 2009 at 10:20 AM

I see to recall an article yesterday about the new rationed health care that Obama is planning for us.

They are no longer going to give health care to those who have outlived their usefullness.

Maybe that is how Obama plans to save Social Security. Let the old die off.

MarkTheGreat on May 13, 2009 at 10:20 AM

The good news being I no longer have funds invested?

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:18 AM

invest in steel…

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:21 AM

Democrats are notoriously bad at math.

kirkill on May 13, 2009 at 10:23 AM

Maybe that is how Obama plans to save Social Security. Let the old die off.

MarkTheGreat on May 13, 2009 at 10:20 AM

Oh yeah, eugenics is a HUGE part of the Democrat platform. As Hugh Hewitt coined it “Obamatoriums”.

kirkill on May 13, 2009 at 10:24 AM

right but realistically what they are trying to argue is that by removing the cap they will magically “fix” the system the thing is that the increased financial burden on companies will hurt our competitiveness when it is already shot, and it further points out the inherent theft the system represents.

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:19 AM

Agreed.

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 10:24 AM

and a horde of newly naturalized illegal immigrants to tax so that Government can pay for it.

Dreadnought223 on May 13, 2009 at 9:48 AM

That might make sense if the illegal aliens were all (or even mostly) highly-skilled and/or highly-educated workers. But we know that’s not the case. Most of the illegal aliens currently in the country (and the millions more who will come in anticipation of the next amnesty) are poorly-educated, low or no-skill, non-English-speaking individuals, many of whom have brought multiple non-working family members along with them. They already receive far more in government services than any taxes they pay into the system, and that will only change for the worse once they are given legal status, because they will then officially be eligible for welfare, unemployment, food stamps, Medicaid, and all the other “free” aid available to the poor.

AZCoyote on May 13, 2009 at 10:26 AM

invest in steel…

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:21 AM

Okay, I’ll bite. Why? U.S. Steel down. China Steel up.

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:28 AM

Okay, I’ll bite. Why? U.S. Steel down. China Steel up.

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:28 AM

Steel preshaped into right angles….

the donks CANNOT resist their urges and the last time they did their thing prices went up 300%

sven10077 on May 13, 2009 at 10:31 AM

Okay, I’ll bite. Why? U.S. Steel down. China Steel up.

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:28 AM

Pitch Forks?

WashJeff on May 13, 2009 at 10:31 AM

Okay, I’ll bite. Why? U.S. Steel down. China Steel up.

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:28 AM

China is going to need lots of steel to build lots of McDonalds restaurants since they are more credit worthy than the US government?

myrenovations on May 13, 2009 at 10:38 AM

Pitch Forks?

WashJeff on May 13, 2009 at 10:31 AM

You got that right.

publiuspen on May 13, 2009 at 10:44 AM

This is an article I wrote on ModCon and it is exactly what Obamageddon is going to do!

Obama’s War Against The Elderly

Ok, I am now convinced Obama is the Messiah and he is the second coming of Christ. Christ could heal the lepers, walk on water and turn water into wine. Our new Messiah, it seems, is no less powerful. He has the power to say who gets a home, a job, who lives and who dies. Obama has expanded his reach and has now waged war against the elderly in our Country with his deceptively named stimulus (spending) plan to save Americans that can’t save themselves.

His plan has all of the makings of a classic Hollywood horror movie complete with an introduction of its characters, a plot and an ending. In this case, the horror movie is Obama’s creation of our very own socialist healthcare program. Truly horrifying!

Let’s meet the cast. First, we have the new healthcare czar and the 21st century Information Technology communication. Regardless of how one feels about the plan to computerize our healthcare communications, a shiver should go up every spine. When the federal government says they will pay for this technology out of our taxes, one has to wonder about the real motivation. The government never pays for anything unless they have a stake in the process.

We’ve met the lead in this movie, now on to the plot. We now have our HAL 2001 and the federal government has invested (with our money) the communications they need to implement the long arm of the government into our personal medical files. Why? Because now the federal government will be paying for our healthcare (out of our money) and as Obama said in his first press conference “There’s No Such Thing as a Free Lunch”. He campaigned on the assurance that ANYONE that already has insurance wouldn’t be affected and yet that is most assuredly not what the bill says.

Our new healthcare czar’s job will be to determine who lives and who dies all on our own dime. Let’s look at two patients, patient A (70 years old) and patient B (45 years old) go into the hospital for bypass surgery. Our new czar will determine by age and cost which has more efficacy. HHHHMMMM, I believe patient B has won this by a furlong.

Are you covering your eyes yet????

We arrive at the ending of our bad horror movie. Obama and his followers have decided that it is not efficient to provide care for patient A because of the cost and life expectancy. Per Sen. John Fleming (R) LA, the new legislation in this fear mongering stimulus (spending) bill states “At what point IN LIFE they receive certain treatments and what is acceptable and not acceptable for payment”. This is decided by our healthcare czar from our medical records, records the federal government now controls.

The moral of the horror movie: Our government has taken on the sheen of very injustices our Founding Fathers fought to destroy. We have laws that have been enacted under our constitution to prevent this from happening. The 1st, 4th, and 5th amendments are for the rights of privacy which will be grossly destroyed by allowing the federal government to have access to our medical records. Under the 14th amendment, we have the 1964 Civil Rights Act that provides us as a people that “NO state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of the citizens of the United States [or] deprive ANY person of LIFE, LIBERTY or PROPERTY without due process [or] deny to any person within it’s jurisdiction the ‘Equal Protection’ of the laws.” And yet it seems that this new bill to commit genocide against our elderly by deciding who lives and who dies. Discrimination starts when you don’t abide by the very principles of our Civil Rights to prevent discrimination based on a person’s Race, Sex, Religion, Age, Previous Conditions of Servitude, Physical Limitation and National Origin.

This is a complete violation of everything America stands for and the Human Rights we seek to protect around the world.

One must ask, what powers under our constitutional branches provide Obama and his followers to decide this when it goes against every principle of our nation? Could this be foreshadowing to the ultimate horror movie ending and a tactic to lower our Social Security benefits by killing off our elderly? If you’re elderly or have elderly parents you may want to STOP and think a moment about the implications of this legislation, that was slipped into the stimulus bill under the cover of darkness by the very people we elect to protect us! Scary indeed!

xler8bmw on May 13, 2009 at 10:44 AM

Uuuuhhhh.

I’m certainly not as smart as the POTUS, but it occurs to me that when you throw millions of people out of work, the FICA receipts would go down, wouldn’t they.

And when you allow millions of people in the country illegally to be paid under the table, the FICA receipts would go down, wouldn’t they?

And when you add thousands of federal jobs that aren’t in the SSN system, the FICA receipts would go down, wouldn’t they?

And when you allow millions of people to scam the SSI system for “social justice”, the FICA expenses would go up, wouldn’t they?

So, I’m just a dumb guy out here in the sticks, not a really brilliant Harvard-trained constitutional lawyer who has made millions without ever holding a real job, but somehow, I’m not shocked by this.

notagool on May 13, 2009 at 10:50 AM

Over at DU (I held my nose, curious what the far left would have to say about this), they basically have 2 arguments: A) this is all lies by the mainstream conservative media and B) just remove “the cap” and the problem is solved.

Not sure what they mean by “the cap”. Somebody please explain why this wouldn’t work (I assume), so I’m prepared for my next argument.

playblu on May 13, 2009 at 10:10 AM

To actually answer why removing the cap (which would represent a $1.3 trillion tax increase in the first 10 years), I refer you to this 2005 paper from the Cato Institute. Short answer – all that additional money would only provide a couple years of solvency because the liability far outstrips the additional money that would come in.

For a real-world example, look at Medicare. The cap was raised above what the Social Security cap was in 1990 (from $51,300 to $120,000) and eliminated entirely in 1993. However, it is already paying out more than it takes in.

steveegg on May 13, 2009 at 10:59 AM

Does Al Gore still have his lock box?

portlandon on May 13, 2009 at 11:15 AM

NEWSFLASH!!!!!!!

OBAMA TO COMBINE SOCIAL SECURITY, MEDICARE AND NATIONALIZED HEALTH CARE INTO ONE PROGRAM. THAT PROGRAM TO BE CALLED….

LOGAN’S RUN

lm10001 on May 13, 2009 at 8:54 AM

Reuse, Recycle, Renew!

- The Cat

MirCat on May 13, 2009 at 11:31 AM

Comment pages: 1 2