Obama admin memo: Greenhouse gas limits will hurt economy
posted at 12:25 pm on May 12, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
Jake Tapper reports on the discovery of an internal EPA memo that admits what everyone knows about cap-and-trade systems and regulation of CO2. The memo advises the White House that any attempt to regulate output of CO2 in energy production will likely have “serious economic consequences,” an admission that will boost criticism of the EPA’s proposed regulation of the industry:
Advice in an Obama administration interagency review memo to the Environmental Protection Agency warns that government regulation of greenhouse gases under the Clean Air Act (CAA) will hurt the economy, and questions whether such a “precautionary” move would too expansively open up the door for government regulation.
“Making the decision to regulate CO2 under the CAA for the first time is likely to have serious economic consequences for regulated entities throughout the U.S. economy, including small businesses and small communities,” says one comment in the memo, which was officially sent by the White House’s Office of Management and Budget. “Should EPA later extend this finding to stationary sources, small businesses and institutions would be subject to costly regulatory programs such as New Source Review.” …
On April 17, Obama’s EPA Administrator, Lisa Jackson, issued a proposed “endangerment finding,” which would likely mean the EPA would regulate greenhouse gases — carbon dioxide, methane, nitrous oxide, hydrofluorocarbons, perfluorocarbons, and sulfur hexafluoride, treated as a group as an air pollutant — through the Clean Air Act.
The White House has not yet decided to go forward with the finding. There is a 60-day comment period following the finding. As part of this process, the Obama administration requested comment from various departments and agencies on the endangerment finding, which is where the memo came from.
The White House may not have officially decided to go ahead with the finding, but they’ve sent every possible hint that they will. When asked, the White House responds that they want Congress to act via legislation as their first choice, but that hardly closes the door on EPA action by fiat. If the treatment of Chrysler senior creditors proves anything, it’s that this administration will not hesitate to use any power, legitimate or not, to pursue its policy options and desire for directed outcomes.
This memo destroys the argument made by Obama often over the last two years that cap-and-trade would wind up being an economic boon. Obama had argued that a renewed emphasis on green energy production would be akin to landing on the moon, a big government program that boosted employment in pursuit of an ambitious goal. The difference between the two is that the space program didn’t impose massive burdens on the airline industry to pay for it, or on the auto industry, or Amtrak.










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…and the sky is blue…
tommylotto on May 12, 2009 at 12:28 PM
NO SHIT!!!!
izoneguy on May 12, 2009 at 12:28 PM
No BullSh/t Barry.
RobCon on May 12, 2009 at 12:29 PM
What’s even worse, CO2 is a major by product in the production of fermentation.
Yeast+sugar=alcohol+CO2
Beer and Wine prices will go through the roof!!!
Cap n Trade. Making the rich poor and the poor poorer.
loudmouth883 on May 12, 2009 at 12:30 PM
During the campaign, 0-bama said that under his administration coal-fired electrical plant operators would go bankrupt. Nothing’s changed.
Cicero43 on May 12, 2009 at 12:30 PM
Is it Friday evening already?
LibTired on May 12, 2009 at 12:30 PM
Somebody get me a coffee.
Or a beer.
loudmouth883 on May 12, 2009 at 12:32 PM
This is all true, but Obama needs the money from cap and trade to finance his radical proposals. He doesn’t care if it destroys the economy. He cares about labor unions and healthcare and that is about it.
bopbottle on May 12, 2009 at 12:33 PM
Cap-N-Trade is the Al Gore loons equivalent of the Aztec’s human sacrifices to appease the gods. That’s about it.
MB4 on May 12, 2009 at 12:33 PM
I am shocked, SHOCKED, to find gambling in here
Defector01 on May 12, 2009 at 12:34 PM
Obama also knows that higher taxes do not necessarily mean more revenue for the government. But he still supports it as a fundamental issue of fairness.
It’s all about control, plain and simple. Facts be damned.
Don’t let anything get in the way of a good crisis.
BardMan on May 12, 2009 at 12:35 PM
Fixed it for Ed. He left off part of Obama’s quote. Trying to make him look dishonest.
WashJeff on May 12, 2009 at 12:35 PM
Get your Carbon emmission card everyone! Your Fart is now concidered a Hazard via the Clean Air Act!
upinak on May 12, 2009 at 12:36 PM
I’m currently drilling a well to get as much CO2 out there as possible. We simply can’t run this country on crappy little wind turbines, like it was Rwanda. We may have a dumbass President who pretends to be smart to fool all the Leftwing rubes, but you can’t fool Mother Thermodynamics..
We need lots of grease to keep America moving along.
And, as a final thrill, I’m going to drive my wonderful Hummer out to the wellsite tomorrow. Oh, the joy!
Take it from our green leafy friends: the more CO2, the better..
TexasJew on May 12, 2009 at 12:37 PM
Hilarious.
Scott P on May 12, 2009 at 12:37 PM
Tax and ration greenhouse gases will hurt the economy.
Rationing health care will hurt people, and the economy, mostly granny and gramps.
What’s not to like about Obammunism.
tarpon on May 12, 2009 at 12:37 PM
But if your goal is to destroy the economy…
Akzed on May 12, 2009 at 12:37 PM
One reason these eco-Marxists are in such a hurry is that the public is catching on to their scam and the fact that the planet seems to now be cooling. Heck it’s the middle of May and it’s only 70 degrees here in Arkansas.
If they wait too long the public will be informed enough such that this kind of legislation will never pass.
It’s really disgusting that our “representatives” have to push legislation under cover of darkness lest We the People find out and stop them.
DerKrieger on May 12, 2009 at 12:38 PM
Gotta hand it to Jake Tapper!
RushBaby on May 12, 2009 at 12:38 PM
So many Wells, so little time!
upinak on May 12, 2009 at 12:39 PM
Isn’t the puppy cute? Oh, and Michelle’s arms are amazing, aren’t they?
GO JAKE TAPPER !!!
stenwin77 on May 12, 2009 at 12:39 PM
At least they’re asking the right questions, but I doubt they’ll come up with the right answers. CO2 controls drain wealth from the economy and risks an overburdening federal government? Weren’t those two of Obama’s primary goals?
Socratease on May 12, 2009 at 12:39 PM
This is just one giant con job. The amount of money and power that comes with the Great Global Warming Swindle provides the rationale for implementing programs that do not do what they are intended to do. There is nothing in the end of this green movement but limited freedom and a very rich, super-elite government protected class.
Weebork on May 12, 2009 at 12:40 PM
Moon landing?
Far more akin to the building of the pyramids.
MB4 on May 12, 2009 at 12:42 PM
New Obama program: Crap and Trade
Daggett on May 12, 2009 at 12:42 PM
Mother Thermodynamics for the win!
Weebork on May 12, 2009 at 12:43 PM
So the “Cap-and-money-back” re-branding isn’t going to be a go after all?
hoosiermama on May 12, 2009 at 12:44 PM
I just wanna know where my new Methane holding tank back pack is. Youknow the ones that were designed for cows!
It will probably be the new Alternative Energy scheme… save yourself, collect your methane, power your house via yourself.
Makes life a little more interesting when you actually have to work up a fart to heat your water to take a shower.
upinak on May 12, 2009 at 12:45 PM
Didn’t Obama already admit, in some interview during the campaign that the press withheld, that his green proposals were going to wreak havoc on the economy? He knows this already…he’s already had the memo and decided to ignore it.
AUINSC on May 12, 2009 at 12:49 PM
It gives a whole new meaning to making bubbles in the bathtub.
Daggett on May 12, 2009 at 12:52 PM
An economic boom? Oh please, it’s another way to lob a tax at people without admitting it.
AnninCA on May 12, 2009 at 12:54 PM
Of course he knows this. Seriously, doesn’t anyone else think he’s deliberately trashing the economy (and our national defense)? Am I the only one who thinks this is his calculated goal and not some accident or act of stupidity?
Daggett on May 12, 2009 at 12:54 PM
You get the gold star for today.
CDeb on May 12, 2009 at 12:55 PM
The Obama administration doesn’t care. Even Geithner says they are trying to prevent no more booms. They don’t want the economy to grow.
deidre on May 12, 2009 at 12:56 PM
This is going to make the cost of living skyrocket. How are the unemployed supposed to afford this?
Hey Barry – SQUEEZE THIS TURNIP!
Blacksmith on May 12, 2009 at 1:00 PM
Cap and trade may wreck the economy, but 0-bama has great pecs. And a puppy.
Cicero43 on May 12, 2009 at 1:01 PM
The difference between green energy and the moonshot is that we knew the moonshot was technically feasible. It was really done mostly with tech and theories that were developed years before JFK made his pronouncement. The trick was figuring out the details and hitting the deadline. The big problem with green energy is that no one knows if it can do the job. Wind, solar, and tidal energy are largely unreliable means of powering a grid. They work great for individual buildings but not for powering cities. The only two green energy concepts that can power a grid are nuclear and hydro. And the greens won’t tolerate either. This is like Kennedy approaching the boys at NASA and saying: “I want to go to the moon, but I don’t want to use a rocket. Can you research and develop a way of building a road there so I can drive?” Mr. Obama, if you want green energy, fire up the nukes and start pouring concrete. Otherwise, you are relying on fairy dust and hokum to power America. And that is the greatest danger that you and your cult present to the American way of life.
fleiter on May 12, 2009 at 1:02 PM
Further evidence that Dear Leader’s actions harming the US economy are intentional, not incompetence.
rbj on May 12, 2009 at 1:03 PM
Obozo is going to ram all of this crap down our throats before the 2010 elections.
txag92 on May 12, 2009 at 1:05 PM
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/05/12/report-obama-administration-slashes-chrysler-ad-budget-by-50/
OT:
The President cuts Chrysler ad budget in half.
I’m seeing some headlines that I never expected to see in my lifetime.
Asher on May 12, 2009 at 1:06 PM
No, making everyone poor but the bureaucrats and their friends in industry. Cap and trade is institutionalized corruption with the bureaucrats running everything from the top.
spmat on May 12, 2009 at 1:07 PM
Obozo is going to ram all of this crap down our throats before the 2010 elections.
txag92 on May 12, 2009 at 1:05 PM
He may try, but it won’t work.
Take it from a teasip – there ain’t no more money!
We’re flat broke and our mommy (China) is getting ready to take away our car keys.
No bucks, no Buck Rogers, as they say..
TexasJew on May 12, 2009 at 1:09 PM
Andrew Wilkow has been making a big deal, rightfully so, about GE’s relationship with Obama because of Obama’s naitonal health care plan and GE’s new e-Health program. Seems Daschle is on the board of the new GE unit.
But, and I wish Wilkow would discuss this too, GE is also iin bed with Obama on energy because GE is this country’s largest manufacturer of wind turbines so they will benefit handsomely from Cap & Trade mandates on renewables.
GE is the ultimate crony capitalist.
DerKrieger on May 12, 2009 at 1:09 PM
What a disgrace!!!!!!!!! How long do you think Government Motors will actually last?
deidre on May 12, 2009 at 1:12 PM
Tapper’s going to need some bodyguards.
Attila (Pillage Idiot) on May 12, 2009 at 1:16 PM
It’s nice having an intellectual in the Whitehouse.
gwelf on May 12, 2009 at 1:17 PM
i’m just waiting until the “real samrt” people in the room in government understands that all CO2 laws can and will be used against humans since they produce CO2 with every breath
unseen on May 12, 2009 at 1:19 PM
Casting virgins into the volcano, modern remix.
Count to 10 on May 12, 2009 at 1:22 PM
It’s not about the economy. It’s about equality of misery.
TexAz on May 12, 2009 at 1:23 PM
I’d like to see anyone prove that the moon program produced any jobs. Much less more jobs than the taxes to support it destroyed.
MarkTheGreat on May 12, 2009 at 1:23 PM
There’s a shocker. Too bad the AGW theory is based on junk science.
Rae on May 12, 2009 at 1:24 PM
You’re going to see a lot more like this. This is all part of the plan.
Daggett on May 12, 2009 at 1:24 PM
Obama espoused that he didn’t like being involved in the private sector. He didn’t want to control banks, or auto manufacturing, yet here we are. He’s in deep, and had every intention of doing just what has happened.
This cap, and trade crap is no different. He’ll find a way, and I’m starting to suspect, that racism plays a part. For all the racism spewed at conservatives, or those who don’t agree with Obama’s policies, perhaps the same can be said for the opposing opinions. They won’t stop him, because he’s black, and should be afforded every opportunity, to force his will on others.
Just my opinion, but it seems oddly strange, that a lot of Obama’s policies, will kill this country, and not one Democrat stands up publicly, and says…STOP!!!!!
There was nothing wrong with giving him a chance, but now is the time to stop this. Do they care more about Obama, or the citizens, they are supposed to be representing? I already know the answer, and I am damn sure going to make sure all of my elected officials know how I feel about it!
capejasmine on May 12, 2009 at 1:25 PM
The Beattles complained that The Taxman would tax the air you breathe. Comrade Obama is going one better – by taxing the air you exhale!
lonesomecharlie on May 12, 2009 at 1:26 PM
Touting “green jobs” for economic development is a cynical deception.
• How much does each of these new “green jobs” cost us, the taxpayers? We hear it’s over $700,000 per job. How much more per job is this cost than the cost per job of, say, traditional energy job-creation projects? Counting operational (not temporary/construction) jobs, that would be …500% more? 1000% more? More than 1000%?
• How many jobs does each “green job” destroy, and does this not cause a net LOSS in jobs in our economy, rather than a net increase? How many jobs are destroyed for each “green job” created? Recent research shows that it runs about 2.2-3.9 jobs lost for each 1.0 job created. So for every 1000 “green jobs” you create, you destroy 2,200-3,900 jobs. Good work, Barry.
• How much will this “green energy” increase our utility bills over today’s bills, through such market intrusions as the RPS (Renewable Portfolio Standard) and cap-and -trade? Responsible projections show an increase of over 50%. So if my heating bill, for example, is 3,000/year now, I can expect a heating bill of almost $5,000/year soon? Good work, Mr. President.
Other projections show Obama’s ideological tax, his global warming tax, the so-called cap-and-trade tax, will add over $3000/year per household just for openers.
It’s only common sense: You can’t legislate government mandates out ahead of the technology without crashing our economy and wrecking the lives of hundreds of millions of Americans, especially in this fragile economy.
Especially now with growing disenchantment over global warmism, does Obama actually expect Americans to endure such needless hardship without returning a crushing political backlash in coming elections?
See, for example,
The Senate-Passed Energy Bill Will Hurt Consumers and Taxpayers Without Solving the Energy Problem by the Heritage Foundation
petefrt on May 12, 2009 at 1:35 PM
Fresh off the wire:
Obama Administration Trying To Rename Cap And Trade
Absolutely hilarious… if it weren’t so dispicable. Let’s just change the name, then they will “buy it”.
SkinnerVic on May 12, 2009 at 1:39 PM
shocking.
The cap & trade plan is a net revenue GENERATOR for the budget. Where do you think it gets that money? From businesses.
But this info uses economy. The media, I think now prefers to look at the nation as a whole, including the government. Looked at that way, cap & trade will help government, at least in the short run.
hawksruleva on May 12, 2009 at 1:40 PM
Barry: “Let them eat caca.”
Vashta.Nerada on May 12, 2009 at 1:41 PM
Boondoggle.
Terrye on May 12, 2009 at 1:45 PM
Crap-and-trade is just another scam for taxing the public. It’ll destroy the economy. I guess the bright side is it’ll destroy the Democrat Party in the process.
And BTW on the subject of taxes, it looks like they’re going after taxes on sodas again. Only this time they’re including virtually every kind of flavored drink.
Doughboy on May 12, 2009 at 1:46 PM
They did leave off one very major greenhouse gas off that list… water vapor
Canadian Imperialist Running Dog on May 12, 2009 at 1:47 PM
Just like the blow hards screaming about global warming. Global warming isn’t working, so they chose climate change, as their new rallying cry. Even though, they know, and admitted they know the earth is cooling.
Al Gore, GE, and the ilk, stand to make billions, and will say, and do anything, to get us to swallow this horse pill.
capejasmine on May 12, 2009 at 1:48 PM
Maybe he should try slashing his own damn budget.
ladyingray on May 12, 2009 at 1:49 PM
I don’t know about any moon landing. What I do know is that Obamas going to be looking to raise taxes out Uranus.
TrickyDick on May 12, 2009 at 1:50 PM
Yep, and as Glenn Beck pointed out this morning, GE/Immelt is sucking off not just one gubmit teat, but two. Not just the green energy teat, but also socialized health care.
petefrt on May 12, 2009 at 1:56 PM
I just farted. How much tax would I owe for that?
The Monster on May 12, 2009 at 2:05 PM
The new focus group-tested term is “new clean jobs.” It scored very high. It’s what “cap and trade” will soon be called. Watch for it in the MSM near you!
Akzed on May 12, 2009 at 2:06 PM
first it is pork spending
Then pork flu
Now brace for a tax on pork and beans.
The retards in the epa will have a tough day collecting a carbon tax from California for forrest fires.
The statists will have unfair taxation. The dirty secret is running cars on ethanol will be double taxation.
seven on May 12, 2009 at 2:10 PM
Just to add a little spice to mix. Is anyone aware of what the groom of the shotgun wedding of Chrysler&Fiat deal has been up to the past few years? According to Der Speigel the Italian mob has been laundering their cash through a partnership with Fiat erecting windmills in southern Italy. The windmills are only marginally operational after billions down the rat-hole.
Could it be just a coincidence? Chicago gangsters + UAW + Chrysler, brought together at gunpoint with the Mafia + Fiat + and another worthless venture in “green” Energy? I mean really the similarities are just too striking!
Archimedes on May 12, 2009 at 2:12 PM
Have you seen the ad on tv, with an elderly gent. Dressed like a working joe, talking about clean jobs, and clean energy. Espousing to how great it’s going to be, and how the greedy oil men are raking in the profits, by pricing gas so high.
How many times are they going to throw that myth out there? Oil companies don’t set the price at the pump, and they STILL want to use that, as a weapon. Sheesh!
capejasmine on May 12, 2009 at 2:25 PM
coincidence
UAW….Chicago/Detroit Mafia
Fiat…La Cosa Nostra
Chrysler…Fiat
GM…UAW…Government intervention…
President….Chicago thug
Prez’s top consiglierie…Chicago thug
I know…it’s all moonbat stuff
what if Death Star Cheney is right
What if this thugocracy is looting the USA
What if….
Y’all know anything about how Chicago works
I’m just plain ole nutty today
Oh…canceling program to have our nukes tested
Oh…program/bill to not have ANY coal plants built forever
Oh…canceling all money for Nevada nuclear waste site…thus killing nuclear power…
I have a tremendous headache
Oh look….a cute puppy
JJKRN on May 12, 2009 at 2:30 PM
“I don’t stand with them,” -Hussein Obooba.
Soon he’s going to drop all pretense and just start referring to his political adversaries as the bourgeoisie.
Akzed on May 12, 2009 at 2:31 PM
The Beatles also wrote the following, in “Hey Jude”:
“So don’t you know that it’s a fool
Who plays it cool,
By making his world a little colder.”
Barack Obama: The Fool on the (Capitol) Hill.
Steve Z on May 12, 2009 at 2:47 PM
Assholes already raised the beer taxes.
FlyoverJ-HawkFan on May 12, 2009 at 2:50 PM
Funny but sad. Co2 is the vehicle for carbon life forms on the planet. We are carbon life forms. Trees need it to live. etc…..However, my farts don’t stink, they save trees. Blame the clouds, it’s the clouds faults since they account for 95% of the greenhouse gases.
FlyoverJ-HawkFan on May 12, 2009 at 2:54 PM
Weird, this would be a wonderful attack from strangelet. But since I tried to confirm the suspicions that she is a Brit, she hasn’t responded in 2 hours.
FlyoverJ-HawkFan on May 12, 2009 at 2:56 PM
You’re wrong. Your so called facts don’t account for the power to be generated by unicorn flatulence.
Physics Geek on May 12, 2009 at 3:14 PM
Bet it won’t stop Ostupid from keeping the thermostat at 82 in the winter, and 68 in the summer, at the White House.
capejasmine on May 12, 2009 at 3:19 PM
Can you say HOME BREW? The govt is forcing us all to become criminals. Grow tobacco and roll our own cigs, cook our beer, cheat on our taxes, keep illegal guns, black market sugar and greasy donuts, on and on. Everybody take a year off and pay no taxes, feds disappear, problem solved.
Kissmygrits on May 12, 2009 at 3:27 PM
Which is a joke, because on the time scales invloved, climate has NEVER been stable. The whole planet goes through huge geologic changes, and its climate changes with it. Hey Al – You want to stop climate change? Tell me how you propose to arrest plate tectonics and regulate the output of the Sun, and then I might start listening. When I get done laughing first.
What I’ve always wondered, though, are a couple of details. If having a frozen icepack at the Arctic is such a great idea, what are those polar bears and seals and the like supposed to eat? There’s very little edible vegetation up there, even for the herbivores. Fish don’t live long in solid ice, either. So what to the fuzzy-wuzzy crowd think will keep their mascots from ending up as frozen corpsicles?
The other question is, did these people even pass their
collegehigh-schoolmiddle-school science classes? Water expands when freezing into ice, and shrinks when it melts. So you can melt the ice caps all you want, sea level should only go down (yes, I know, there’s salt in seawater, as well as other trace elements. There’s even enough uranium to make mining almost obsolete. But there’s not enough other junk to change the basic structure of water vs ice).Blacksmith on May 12, 2009 at 3:48 PM
Obambi seeks to destroy capitalism in every way he can…this is just one of them.
Army Brat on May 12, 2009 at 3:49 PM
Excellent point! The whole “CO2 causes global warming” argument is based on the fact that CO2 absorbs infrared waves reflected from the earth very well over a narrow band of wavelengths, roughly from 14 to 16 microns. Water vapor, whose concentration in the air is 10 to 100 times higher than that of CO2, absorbs over the entire infrared spectrum. Nobody can seriously limit water vapor emissions when 70%+ of the earth’s surface is covered with water!
From a heat-absorption point of view, man-made CO2 emissions only account for about 0.03% of the total infrared heat-trapping effect (without which the oceans would freeze), so that trying to limit CO2 emissions is like using a sledgehammer of solid gold to kill a fly on the elephant of the water-vapor effect.
In reality, global climate is driven much more by sunspots (warming), volcanic eruptions (cooling), and El Nino (mixed regional effects) than by CO2 content, and mankind cannot alter the first three variables. Although CO2 levels continue to rise in the atmosphere, global temperatures have cooled since 1998, and the cooling trend has accelerated since 2006.
But don’t bother cap-and-traders with the facts! Their computer models say that high CO2 levels will cause sea levels to rise 60 cm (about 2 feet) in 100 years, and that would be so horrible that we need to cripple the entire world economy to prevent it! (Wouldn’t it be cheaper to build sea walls two feet high over the next century?). The best weather-forecasting models diverge from eventual reality after about 5 DAYS–how can anyone believe predictions from a computer model for 100 YEARS from now?
I attended a meeting of the Boston chapter of the American Institute of Chemical Engineers last Thursday, where a panel of “experts” were blatantly pushing cap-and-trade, and asking people from deep-blue MA to call midwestern Senators from “greedy” coal states to back cap-and-trade, despite its horrific impact on local economies. But, when questioned, the “experts” had no real plan for encouraging nuclear power plants (which do not emit CO2), and said that taxing CO2 emissions would send money to the U.S. Treasury “instead of” sending hundreds of billions of dollars to overseas oil sheiks.
But wait a minute! The United States only gets about 3% of its electricity from oil, so that cap-and-trade on power companies would have little effect on oil imports, most of which are used for transportation and home heating. Do they plan to impose a “cap” on CO2 emissions from cars and home heating, or the equivalent of rationing fuel? I could just imagine, every December, the Government telling people, sorry, you’ve used up your CO2 quota for this year–you’re not allowed to drive to the mall to go
ChristmasWinter Solstice Holiday shopping, and you can’t heat your home during the snowstorm, to prevent global warming!They also said that “peak oil production” would probably occur around 2030, after which oil supplies would decline. But when I suggested the use of shale oil to push that date farther into the future, to buy time for developing alternative energy (and reduce oil payments to foreign governments), they said that using shale oil would cook the planet for our children!
Have any of these people bothered to do some simple math? It is estimated that there are about a trillion barrels of shale oil under the Rockies, enough to eliminate America’s oil imports for about 200 years. Assuming that shale oil weighs 8 pounds/gallon, burning this much shale oil would produce about 480 gigatonnes of CO2 in 200 years, or about 2.4 gigatonnes per year, which is about 10% of world’s current emission rate of CO2. Since the shale oil would displace consumption of imported oil from foreign countries, the net effect would be less than 10%. How is an additional 10% of less of CO2 going to “cook” the planet?
But the “experts” lecturing us engineers rely on IPCC predictions–the same people that write the conclusions to their reports before examining the data. They tell us that open water absorbs more heat than sea ice, but they don’t say that melting SEA ice doesn’t raise sea levels, because floating ice displaces its weight in water! Have any of these “experts” looked at weather data from far-north stations near large bodies of water, which get more snow in autumn (with open water nearby) than in midwinter or early spring, when the water is frozen? Extend that north to Greenland, and open water along the coast increases summer snowfall on the interior ice cap, at over 2,000 meters altitude and below freezing all zummer. Greenland ice may melt along the edges, but it’s getting THICKER in the interior!
But this is what we’re up against–”experts” who conveniently cherry-pick data for their own agenda, who try to lure gullible young engineers into lobbying midwestern Senators to killing their states’ economy with cap-and-trade, and a few subsidized “green” industries get rich, everybody else gets MUCH poorer, and the earth may be 0.001 degree cooler, until a sunspot rears its ugly head.
To stop “global warming”, cooler HEADS must prevail.
Steve Z on May 12, 2009 at 3:56 PM
And as Bill O’Reilly has pointed out many times, GE/Immelt also does business with Iran, which is developing nuclear energy
to threaten Israel and Europebecause they can’t refine their own oil.Steve Z on May 12, 2009 at 4:05 PM
The people: Ohhh nooooo. It will kill the economy!
The White House memo: Ohhh nooooo. It will kill the economy!
Obama: “Everybody is going to have to sacrifice.”
kens on May 12, 2009 at 4:34 PM
Every time I hear this glowbull worming nonsense I have to ask one question of the ‘believers’… Where were the great lakes 10k years ago?? Where where the Pocono Mountains???
Answer – They were covered under ice sheets two freaking miles thick.. About 10 miles outside Philly PA, you will find huge grey boulders left by the last ice age about 15k years ago… THE ICE WAS ALL THE WAY TO PHILLY..
Actually this ice has been melting for the last 90 thousand freaking years….. Even the jug eared jackass and Owlgore should be able to spot a trend there. BTW – mankind has been around 30k years or so and recorded history only goes back about 5k years. The industrial age is measured in only a few hundreds of years… IOW, man has not caused all that freaking ice to melt.
So?? Follow question for OWL BOre… “DOn’t you see the trend moron??… a trend that has existed well before many had any capability of influencing things”
BTW – I wonder if AP was having some fun with the pic. About half the ‘scary smoke’ is nothing more than water vapor from reactor cooling towers.
These morons are going to send humanity back into the dark ages…
bullseye on May 12, 2009 at 6:06 PM
I believe that in the commie utopia that preceeded our commie utopia, the soviets had a word that if I recall was Nichevo or something like that. It meant ‘on the left’ or the black market society. The only way you survived was to constantly game the system.
OTOH, Michelle o will still be able to buy here size 15 500 dollar sneakers any time she wants at the Government store
bullseye on May 12, 2009 at 6:10 PM
Yea! And when is New York and D.C going to put a tax on steam emissions? That’s what’s in the picture for this article!
Cybergeezer on May 12, 2009 at 6:39 PM
Yea! And when is New York and D.C going to put a tax on steam emissions? That’s what’s in the picture for this article!
Cybergeezer on May 12, 2009 at 6:39 PM
Someone better pull the fuses from the printing presses over at Treasury, too.
VelvetElvis on May 12, 2009 at 7:33 PM
Ya think?
When I see news stories on affordable solar panels for $20000 that end with the reality that you and I are chipping in the other $25000 I know we are being hosed.
Jamson64 on May 12, 2009 at 7:41 PM
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