The Marriage Encounter retreat
posted at 9:00 am on April 25, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
I’ll be away for the weekend, helping to run a Marriage Encounter retreat, in which the First Mate and I help other couples strengthen their relationships. We’ve been doing this for ten years with Twin Cities Marriage Encounter, a tremendous organization, and we’re privileged to serve on their board as the president couple. It gives us an opportunity to build our community, as strong marriages mean strong families, and strong families create strong communities.
This past week, I’ve talked about the upcoming weekend during my daily shows in order to get people interested in it. I thought for today I’d share part of one of the talks I’ll give over the next two days as both a taste of the weekend, and to underscore why the First Mate and I chose this together as our hobby. It’s called “Crisis and Statistics,” and the numbers are stunning.
We don’t include this to scare you, but we want to give you an accurate picture of the state of marriage in today’s world. The National Marriage Project at Rutgers University report in 2001 describes a social institution under siege, and its updated statistics in 2008 clearly showed that things are getting worse. Not only did the marriage rate drop by almost half from 1960 to 2007, but also the percentage of divorced adults has skyrocketed. The percentage of divorced adult women in the US went from 2.6% in 1960 to 11% in 2007, and for men, it went from 1.8% to 8.6%. Both numbers are all-time highs.
In 2006, 64% of high-school boys and 58% of high school girls believed that living together is good practice for marriage. Cohabitation has increased in this period from 439,000 people to well over 6 million, despite evidence that couples who cohabitate are more likely to divorce. Fifty-two percent say that they see so few successful marriages that it causes them to question marriage as “a way of life.”
Marriages are less happy today than in past decades, and the damage that divorce does to children has created a vicious cycle of pessimistic expectations. From 1976 to 2004, the percentage of high-school girls who said that childbirth out of wedlock is worthwhile rose from 33 to 56 percent. Is this surprising? It shouldn’t be; an amazing 26% of American children live with a single parent. The percentage of births to unwed mothers has increased from 5.3% in 1960 to 38.5% in 2006, more than a seven hundred percent increase.
What has caused this seismic shift in our culture? For many Americans, the pursuit of individual fulfillment and individual happiness has become an obsession, almost a religion in itself. Values, once deeply held, that stressed family and community now seem hopelessly outdated. “Until death do us part” has been replaced by “as long as I’m happy”. Couples seem to be marrying for better, richer, and in health … and conveniently forgetting the other half of the vows. In fact, a few years ago, Fox reported that people have begun actually changing the vows to reflect that. A friend of ours speaks of a magazine article about a London jeweler who makes wedding bands that don’t go all the way around the finger. The message is that there is always a way out – if you’re not happy.
The First Mate has a great suggestion: try taking a walk through a local cemetery. Read the inscriptions on the markers or headstones. You won’t find any that say: “Drove a really cool car.” “She visited the French Riviera.” “His suits were all tailor-made.” “Got broadband Internet connections before everyone else on his block.” You’re going to see what people will really remember you for: “Beloved husband.” “Devoted wife.” “Loving father and mother.”
It’s all about building families, and that starts with the marriage.
That’s why we put our time and our money into Marriage Encounter. If you’d like to support this non-profit organization with a tax-deductible donation, please use the PayPal button provided. If you’d like to attend a Twin Cities Marriage Encounter, visit our website to schedule a weekend. It’s a great investment in the most important relationship in your life.
Blowback
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Did you mean to reply to someone else? I made no mention of gays or “personal failures” in my posting. My posting had nothing to do with why marriages fail. It was a response to Liberty Girl’s request for a non-religious explanation/defense of the system of one man, one woman.
??
Pythagoras on April 25, 2009 at 6:57 PM
I agree, ma’am
But……the problem with divorce stats is that they inter alia cannot include ‘those who do not marry’. Whites get married more than Blacks, ergo have higher divorce stats.
The Proof in this Pudding is the out–of-wedlock stats, which are significantly higher for Blacks than Whites
Janos Hunyadi on April 25, 2009 at 7:00 PM
How is a straight person turning to gay relationships for self-gratification?
ckoeber on April 25, 2009 at 7:04 PM
I think if you look at the cultures of each of those in the breakdown you will see some reasons. You also need to look at the number of marriages in each case. With the Hispanic – most of the first and second generation still see divorce as taboo and will look the other way at “affairs” to prevent divorce.
The same is true of Asians because of the strong family traditions. With the Black and White you see the American “culture war of the 60′s” in full force. Many blacks don’t bother with marriage – especially in the inner city/hip hop culture. With the whites it has become a very selfish – I don’t want to do the work to make it work thing. It’s just too easy to leave and find someone new. You see this among the high divorce rate on second, third, fourth, etc. marriages – especially with the Hollywood influence.
Of course these are only generalizations and there are many great marriages in all cultures.
Corsair on April 25, 2009 at 7:07 PM
More people to sleep with?
Corsair on April 25, 2009 at 7:08 PM
I think it is even harder when both parents work outside the home. Two things happen, either they work different shifts and never see each other, or they both come home at the end of the day tired yet someone has to attend to the evening chores, dinner, baths, homework etc….
One of the things I always tell my husband when he sometimes regrets that I have not earned money for the past 20 years is that if I had been working outside, I probably would have left a long time ago. Too many women have two jobs… outside and in the home and it can be a marriage killer.
Jvette on April 25, 2009 at 7:09 PM
11% of women are divorced, 8.6% of men. Hmm. Implications are that 2.4% of these women chose to marry a previously divorced man, thus making the recidivism rate among divorced men who remarry 28%.
With that thought in mind, we have that statistics is the most subjective science in the world.
unclesmrgol on April 25, 2009 at 7:17 PM
“straight” is a misnomer here, but the act you are describing (bi-sexuality) is one way AIDS got loose in the straight female population in America.
unclesmrgol on April 25, 2009 at 7:19 PM
Yes, yes. Valid points. Though, I think two parents working is much more difficult for the children. The couple at least understand that there will be together time at some point, and can cope with deferring togetherness. However, kids need constant attention and supervision. Growing up I saw a few kids who were left by their parents to figure out too much on their own. In some cases the lack of direction was very detrimental to their later lives.
dedalus on April 25, 2009 at 7:24 PM
Absolutely. My black co-worker was extremely upset at his daughter when she shacked up with her boyfriend. He told her she ought to think about marriage, and she said “Marriage? That’s a white thing!”, He said in return, “Look at your mother and me, who’ve been married over 20 years — are we white?” His daughter went on to have a kid out of wedlock, and then decided the kid was interfering with her lifestyle and abandoned her, so my co-worker and his wife are raising their granddaughter as their own daughter. When tax time rolled around, they declared their granddaughter to be their dependent, only to discover that the father (who isn’t having anything to do with his child, economically or otherwise) had also declared the child as his dependent…
Of course, given the welfare the Democrats provide to single mothers, there’s a very good economic reason for a cultural bent against marriage — the guy gets to keep his money, and the woman gets money from the state. So even if they live together, there’s a penalty to declaring a marriage… Such is the cost of “freedom”.
unclesmrgol on April 25, 2009 at 7:31 PM
I have been with the same man for 20 years next February. I am also a man. Call it what you want; domestic partnership, civil unions, “marriage”, or whatever. It is just as hard, just as wonderful, and just as legitimage as any other union. I really wish we could move beyond the “marriage” label and realize that couples are couples. I understand the difficulty of the “marriage” term, but what am I in?
sdillard on April 25, 2009 at 7:35 PM
I thought most states had a requirement that the biological father pay child support. In the scenario you describe I think the grandparents could have the state require both the parents to pay them for supporting the child.
dedalus on April 25, 2009 at 7:40 PM
but what am I in?
You’re in a homosexual partnership–not quite the same as marriage, as the two of you can’t produce any children and you two can’t “become one flesh” in the normal way.
Sorry, but you’re not “married.”
Homosexuals just can’t marry each other biologically speaking.
And on an emotional level, would you be willing to go to a “marriage” encounter weekend to work on anything besides the sexual side of your partnership?
The lion’s share of homosexuals would not.
Jenfidel on April 25, 2009 at 7:43 PM
Do you just want the State to decide, regulate and control everything?
Jenfidel on April 25, 2009 at 7:45 PM
I’m not so sure that your claim that parents understand and are willing to defer togetherness. Lots of marriages break up because there is not enough attention paid to each other.
A wise person once told me that if you can survive children life will be good again but I see more and more people divorcing in later years once the kids are grown. When the children have gone, they find they have nothing in common and nothing to talk about.
The whole family suffers when work takes too much time away from it. I know not all women, or men could do as I have done, but I know that it has greatly benefited my own family.
Jvette on April 25, 2009 at 7:50 PM
No one said anything about heterosexuals turning to homosexual relationships.
Did someone hit a nerve?
Jenfidel on April 25, 2009 at 7:53 PM
Marriage encounter workshop have been around a long time to help couples who want to strengthen their marital relationships…
I can’t believe that the Gaystapo/homosexual “marriage” posse won’t leave even this thread–which couldn’t possibly pertain to them in the least–alone.
(Well, yes, I can believe it, because 1.) they love it here at HA and 2.) they can’t stop pushing for same sex “marriage” for a minute.)
Disgusting, trying to make something sickening out of a wholesome pursuit.
Hope you’re proud of yourselves!
Jenfidel on April 25, 2009 at 7:57 PM
Well, I’m off to play BUNCO! Wish me luck! Have a great evening everyone.
Jvette on April 25, 2009 at 8:05 PM
It’s not marriage, so, no.
Mommypundit on April 25, 2009 at 8:13 PM
I’ve been to at least a hundred sermons & seminars on marriage, & I have not found that bias at all.
jgapinoy on April 25, 2009 at 8:26 PM
I doubt that with more single women out there straight men are turning to each other.
ckoeber on April 25, 2009 at 8:27 PM
So the polygamous, incestuous, & inter-species marriages would be OK, too. Exclusive romance, check. Household, check.
jgapinoy on April 25, 2009 at 8:28 PM
Maybe. We would need some research done (maybe it has been done already) to back that up.
ckoeber on April 25, 2009 at 8:29 PM
Good job Ed. Thank you.
Bobbertsan on April 25, 2009 at 9:15 PM
Jenfidel, you’re a fundamentalist jackass.
dakine on April 25, 2009 at 9:26 PM
Nope, she just states the truth. Guess you aren’t used to that. Sorry.
Marriage is, by natural law, between a man and a woman. End of story.
Homosexual union is something else entirely. I will not characterize it in any way, except to say that it is unequivocally NOT marriage.
And of course, jackasses can’t type, so I guess you’re off base there, too.
tcn on April 25, 2009 at 10:00 PM
God bless you, Ed, for this work of mercy. I know marriages are saved by this program.
tcn on April 25, 2009 at 10:01 PM
If the biological father has money, that would be nice. I’m not privy to every aspect of this case, but my friend did mention that the kid took the deduction even though he didn’t need it.
unclesmrgol on April 25, 2009 at 10:06 PM
Looks like y-not shot down your hope that whites were the stable core of society….
but of course your comeack is
I don’t see you providing any “stats” but that is pretty par for the course for you — insult, rumour and innuendo, but no factual support.
You sound like Howard Dean
Bradky on April 25, 2009 at 11:25 PM
If you want to reduce the rate of divorce, marriage encounter is just treating the symptom… To reduce the rate of divorce, you need to make it less egregiously profitable for the women who file the vast majority of divorces, who walk away with the assets, and the kids and the house, and make a slave for life out of the husband via alimony and child support.
Divorce is all about the huge profit that women can make from walking away from a relationship instead of working on it. Working on relationships is hard, and if women can choose to enjoy financial security without that trouble and work, they will, and the statistics show that they do. The evidence is in the numbers.
Wanna fix it? Stop the systematic financial pillaging of men. Nothing else is going to stop it.
ANV on April 25, 2009 at 11:37 PM
LOL back to the 1900′s with the lot of them…
Links that back up your laughable assertion please!
Bradky on April 26, 2009 at 12:02 AM
We’ve been married 31 years, 6 months & 6 days today (we were high school sweethearts) We attended our FIRST Marriage Encounter weekend in 1982 (in NJ) & have gone back for 2 more since.
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There is nothing like it when it comes to giving you the tools to enrich your marriage. It is a very private experience; no one outside of the 3 team couples share with the group. Attendees (individual couples) aren’t required to share with anyone but their spouse.
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We were also a team couple for ENGAGED ENCOUNTER – for couples about to marry. A truly wonderful way to START a marriage!
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I just want to make the point that this program EXISTS in EVERY STATE and is part of “WORLDWIDE MARRIAGE ENCOUNTER“ So anyone who would like to “make a good marriage into a great marriage” check out the above link.
NightmareOnKStreet on April 26, 2009 at 12:04 AM
My parents celebrate their 58th wedding anniversary Tuesday, 4/28 … and my eldest daughter is getting married the same day.
Hope exists.
Darleen on April 26, 2009 at 12:24 AM
ANV on April 25, 2009 at 11:37 PM
oh lord how wrong you are
Darleen on April 26, 2009 at 12:25 AM
Dude, I can only assume you’re speaking from experience.
You must be fairly wealthy and you married a horrible woman! (So, she went for the gold…)
Usually, you hear about women being left with the kids and no money by men for a younger woman…
It is normally the women who do most of the emotional work in a marriage, but that being said, it’s not as if the woman (even greedy bee-otches like your ex) don’t contribute anything to the marriage;
they have the children, keep the house and do give their men whatever love and companionship they can.
You made it sound as if all wives just stand still sucking up cash like oxygen.
You have a very slanted view of a very unhappy marital life.
You’ll continue to meet nasty women with that kind of attitude and your life will suck due to your bitterness, materiality and blame.
Time to step back and rethink the problem.
Jenfidel on April 26, 2009 at 1:16 AM
How wonderful!
You’ve all been greatly blessed!
Thanks for sharing.
Jenfidel on April 26, 2009 at 1:17 AM
FIFY. We believe marriage was instituted at the very dawn of man with the 1st couple, Adam and Eve. Exactly how long ago that was is immaterial.
Alternatives to God DOES EQUAL regression (sin), and warped thot processes.
Bingo! Postmodernism Liberty
As our Founding Fathers noted, “… We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,…”
Seems to me LG wants a country where their imagined “Creator” permits alternatives to traditional marriage. Such countries do exist, but those regimes are predicated on the notion that the people serve the State and not the other way around. So much for liberty there.
AH_C on April 26, 2009 at 2:23 AM
Take out the sacrament and the Vow becomes a Deal
This is what I see with young people who have rejected the Bible. Some have invented a new god, a greater power who agrees with them on just about everything.
They want the dress, the flowers, the party, but no vows. They are making agreements with escape clauses.
The Party, I mean the Wedding is all about them. No awe. No accountability in the next world. The mate is like a purchase. If you get a lemon, you get rid of it, although most of the young women understand it is useful to keep the male around to make children, because the child support is easier to set up with the contract in place, and a house and car to inherit. Then you dump him.
I heard someone ask a young lady, how is the marriage (of two weeks). Answer, ‘boring. It was good at first.’ Week 1? She said it was just like her last marriage
More than once I have asked myself why they bother but the answer is the Party
Faith elevates. Lack of Faith diminishes
My local paper once interviewed couples married fifty years or more. They turned out to all be religious. Asked if they would have stayed together if it was not part of their faith, they agreed it would have been hard to stay together without it
Everyone has a bad part. You throw away the bad part and you also lose the good. Nothing more precious that a couple who shared many many years. They earned the good part
entagor on April 26, 2009 at 4:51 AM
All the lamenting about the decline of marriage is understandable. At the same time you have to remember certain things, which I’m sure most sensible people do…
- You can’t legislate or require people to marry or stick with marriage regardless of the results of splitting. If you force a couple to stay together it would undoubtedly result in a worse catastrophe than divorce.
- Society has lost it’s way morally, for the most part, and it’s getting worse. It’s very difficult to reverse because amoral people will not teach children moral behavior and lifestyle. Morality is a dying beast, but in a free society you have to let it die if it’s going to die. You can’t legislate it back to health.
These things can be traced quite easily to the moral corruption the liberalism has provided and has been force fed in schools since the early 70′s.
What exactly the liberals had in mind I don’t know, you can only guess the worst. A free society does not have to be amoral, but this is the way they chose to push the country.
Grats to the libs, may they all rot in whatever hell will take them.
Spiritk9 on April 26, 2009 at 6:36 AM
If I could link my parent’s marriage and subsequent divorce I would, it’s evidence of this for sure. My father dutifully paid the child support which was set to a ridiculous level, barely leaving him enough to survive….
after my mother got the house, the business they had bought 2 years earlier, Canadian property…basically everything. Is it any wonder there’s a lack of trust now?
Hey Paul McCartney, have you learned what a PRENUP is yet?
Spiritk9 on April 26, 2009 at 6:43 AM
Ha! The same goes the other way, a man will behave like his dad.
My grandmother taught her daughters to observe how their boyfriends treat their mothers as a clue to how they’d be treated in marriage.
maverick muse on April 26, 2009 at 11:20 AM
from the fundamental jackass
maverick muse on April 26, 2009 at 11:23 AM
Jenfidel, do you subscribe to rumor or do you speak from literary research and experience?
maverick muse on April 26, 2009 at 11:28 AM
Been married over 50 years and don’t regret a moment of it. Don’t want to imply that I feel sorry for divorced folks because I know that divorce is the best option in some cases. But, I hope that their futures hold the same joy and sense of fulfillment that comes from a long and successful marriage. Little in life is its equal.
jeanie on April 26, 2009 at 12:13 PM
Or maybe divorced men are so miserable that they die off at a higher rate! (So spaketh a wife!) ;-)
I think it’s sad what’s happening with marriages. Personally, I don’t think there’s a one-size-fits-all solution either in terms of how to best prepare for marriage or how to keep one intact. I think the expectations two people have going into a marriage are probably the major determining factor for the marriage’s success. If one person is getting married because it’s “time” to “settle down” and another is getting married for some other reason, then you can definitely run into problems.
Y-not on April 26, 2009 at 1:23 PM
Seems to me you can draw a few conclusions from the charts linked to by Ed:
1. Since we threw God out of our schools in the ’50′s and ’60′s our standards have declined. No wonder then, that as these children grow up, they value marriage less. Hey, it’s the me generation.
2. Ann Coulter is absolutely right about single mothers raising kids. Compare white families with two parents vs. black families. The libs have tricked the black community. The single mother raising a family generally cannot do it as successfully. The results speak for themselves.
3. (Not from the data, but from observation): Ed, your work with Marriage Encounter is very helpful to marriages. We, too, have been involved in attending and holding marriage retreats with other organizations and we have heard the testimonies of couples who were going to divorce, but now have strong, healthy marriages. Part of that goes back to my point #1: when you put God back into the equation, people start getting it right. Marriage was God’s idea and He will help any couple that truly desires Him to.
Christian Conservative on April 26, 2009 at 4:28 PM
One other thought: Maybe I missed it, but I didn’t see any data talking about the high divorce rate among those who cohabitate before marriage. Those who cohabitate as a precursor to marriage are hurting their chances for a successful marriage according to previous data I’ve seen.
When I married my wife, we went on a wonderful honeymoon. Got room service every day, danced, walked on the beach together and couldn’t stay away from each other. We’ve been married for twenty years now and are truly blessed to be together. At the same time we got married, a co-worker who had lived with her boyfriend for years got married. Her honeymoon was a cruise, and she came back raving about the French guy who shared their table. We’ve been moved apart, and I pray she and her husband are still married, but I was struck by the difference in our honeymoons.
Christian Conservative on April 26, 2009 at 4:37 PM
..and the other 50% end in death.
Nathan_OH on April 26, 2009 at 9:08 PM
Unless you’re Mormon.
chansen9 on April 26, 2009 at 10:34 PM
In regards to what? Marriage and divorce?
I generally speak from both.
Jenfidel on April 26, 2009 at 11:58 PM
maverick muse, I try never to subscribe to rumor.
(What intelligent, thoughtful person would do that?)
Jenfidel on April 27, 2009 at 12:01 AM
wtf is wrong- been trying to post a comment for 2 days – 10 times and it won’t take it- but then it tells me “it looks like you posted a duplicate comment” WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS THREAD???????????????
NightmareOnKStreet on April 27, 2009 at 12:40 AM
For some reason, my comment has been blocked the past 11 times I tried to post it & then tells me it is a duplicate when I try to repost it… I’ll try again…)
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We’ve been married 31 years, 6 months & 6 days today… We attended our FIRST Marriage Encounter weekend in 1982 (in NJ) & have gone back for 2 more since…
NightmareOnKStreet on April 26, 2009 at 12:04 AM
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Oops, the link I left before was only for Catholic Marriage Encounter. Here’s the link for non-denominational Marriage Encounter.
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If your marriage is in trouble, Marriage Encounter is not for you, but here is a link for “Retrouvaille” – a program for troubled marriages.
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NightmareOnKStreet on April 27, 2009 at 12:45 AM
For some reason, my comment has been blocked the past 13 times I tried to post the links for other Marriage Enconter programs not necessarily the one Ed wants you to make a donation thru paypal to… and that really sucks!
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Oops, the link I left before was only for Catholic Marriage Encounter. Here’s the link for non-denominational Marriage Encounter.
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If your marriage is in trouble, Marriage Encounter is not for you, but here is a link for “Retrouvaille” – a program for troubled marriages.
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And last, but not least, if you’d like to give a great engagement gift, it costs around $175-$300 PER COUPLE for an Engaged Encounter Weekend
[If you put more than one link in a post, it's going to get caught in our spam filters no matter how many times you repost it. Wait for one of us to clear it out of moderation rather than repost it 12 more times. Retrouvaille is a wonderful program for marriages in deep crisis, and the Catholic version of ME is a very good program, too! -- Ed]
NightmareOnKStreet on April 27, 2009 at 12:49 AM
The links are preventing me from posting- I guess Ed only wants you to donate to his Marriage Encounter in MN or wherever so just go to http://www.marriage-encounter.org/%22%3E%3Cstrong%3Enon-denominational
And http://www.retrouvaille.org/%22%3E%3Cem%3E%3Cstrong%3ERetrouvaille%3C/strong%3E%3C/a for trouble marriages…
And last but not least for Engaged Encounter Weekend: http://engagedencounter.org/default.asp%22%3E%3Cstrong%3EEngaged It would make a perfect engagement gift (about $175-$300 PER COUPLE FOR THE WEEKEND!!
NightmareOnKStreet on April 27, 2009 at 12:56 AM
I tend to oppose state-mandated child-support for men who are not married. Definitely oppose it as a percentage of their income.
My point was that it exists. In this case who should be held accountable for paying the child’s expenses? I’d contend that the parents should carry more of the financial load than the grandparents.
dedalus on April 27, 2009 at 2:06 PM
Exclusiveness would rule out polygamy.
Inability to be party to a contract would eliminate non-humans.
dedalus on April 27, 2009 at 2:10 PM
I note some harsh words and implications above about me, and although I don’t want to encourage troll-like behavior, sometimes people just don’t know the facts. So here is the requested link discussing relative rates of divorce filing by gender. I suggest a quick read of these stats too. For a brief, effective non-footnoted summary though, I recommend S is for Storm Warning, that explains what is happening in a much more picturesque way.
Am I rich? Yes: in my marriage to my beautiful, intelligent and giving wife. Essentially all the *money* I earn goes to my high-earning, high-rolling ex. I am nowhere near alone in this situation. Other studies show that the vast majority of ‘deadbeat dads’ are unemployed and unable to find work, but also unable to get any kind of adjustment in their garnishments.
So again, I say; ‘wanna reduce the rate of divorce? Make it less of a guaranteed sinecure for the ex-wives who file the majority of divorces.’ That and making joint custody the default custody arrangement would make a serious dent in the divorce rate.
ANV on April 27, 2009 at 2:39 PM
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