Liberal infiltrates Falwell’s school, shocked to find Christians “normal”

posted at 7:25 pm on April 22, 2009 by Allahpundit

I’m not sure whether to laugh at him for being surprised, sneer at him for treating Christians as if they’re some lost civilization worthy of anthropological study, or congratulate him for what seems to have been a genuinely earnest effort to understand. It’s like that ABC set-up to “prove” that sports fans are homophobic — but in a good way.

He was determined to not mock the school, thinking it would be too easy — and unfair. He aimed to immerse himself in the culture, examine what conservative Christians believe and see if he could find some common ground. He had less weighty questions too: How did they spend Friday nights? Did they use Facebook? Did they go on dates? Did they watch “Gossip Girl?”…

He lined up a publisher — Grand Central Publishing — and arrived at the Lynchburg campus prepared for “hostile ideologues who spent all their time plotting abortion clinic protests and sewing Hillary Clinton voodoo dolls.”

Instead, he found that “not only are they not that, but they’re rigorously normal.”…

A roommate he depicts as aggressively anti-gay — all names are changed in the book — is an outcast on the hall, not a role model.

How earnest was he?

Once ambivalent about faith, Roose now prays to God regularly — for his own well-being and on behalf of others. He said he owns several translations of the Bible and has recently been rereading meditations from the letters of John on using love and compassion to solve cultural conflicts.

He’s even considering joining a church.

He interviewed Falwell before he died, too, again in what sounds like good faith. It’s actually a brilliant idea for a book: No matter which way the experiment turned out, he knew he had a built-in audience waiting for him. If Liberty turned out to be as grotesque as the left’s caricature of it, the nutroots would have snapped it up. As it is, he’ll end up on Hannity’s show talking about how believers are people too. Well played, sir.


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Yeah, saw this earlier today, I give the guy props for opening his mind a bit. Such a welcome change from most on the Left.

John the Libertarian on April 22, 2009 at 7:30 PM

From:

He was determined to not mock the school, thinking it would be too easy

To:

He’s even considering joining a church.

Hmmmm. Some heads on the left are going to explode.

progressoverpeace on April 22, 2009 at 7:31 PM

It would have sold better if he hadn’t found the students to be “normal”.

How long until someone says that he was brainwashed like “Jesus Camp”?

myrenovations on April 22, 2009 at 7:32 PM

many Christians are very nice people despite what the left says, shocker!

rob verdi on April 22, 2009 at 7:33 PM

Was there mist? I’m curious. It always seems so critical in these scenarios.

TheUnrepentantGeek on April 22, 2009 at 7:33 PM

He’ll never have a career in journalism for going out and reporting events instead of tainting them with bias.

Nethicus on April 22, 2009 at 7:34 PM

Fabulous.

Laura on April 22, 2009 at 7:34 PM

Hmmmm. Some heads on the left are going to explode.

progressoverpeace on April 22, 2009 at 7:31 PM

Na, they’ll just claim he is a phony or is simply brainwashed. They won’t learn anything from his experience.

TheBigOldDog on April 22, 2009 at 7:35 PM

I had to branch out and include these people that I just really had no exposure to.

Kudos to him for exposing himself to alternative views – not exactly par for the course among young libs these days.

Laura on April 22, 2009 at 7:36 PM

Excellent. Now if we can only get people like Chris Hitchens to stop expecting Christians to get violent over his bus posters, we may be getting somewhere in terms of having non-Christians accept that Christians are people too.

Gaunilon on April 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM

OT: Turn on C-SPAN now!!!!

Reps. Carter, Brady, Bachmann and other on the House floor discussing Napolitano, DHS, States’ rights, Obama brownshirts…….

Meat sooooooooooo red it’s still twitching.

Bachmann openly called for hearings over “right-wing extremism” and Napolitano’s resignation!!

Dr.Cwac.Cwac on April 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM

Instead, he found that “not only are they not that, but they’re rigorously normal.”…

These… Christians in the mist!

rihar on April 22, 2009 at 7:41 PM

What a nice story.

mr.blacksheep on April 22, 2009 at 7:41 PM

Isn’t that how these things usually go? Liberals with massive pre-conceived stereotypes spend some time with conservatives and find out they’re not racist, hateful or any of the other things they previously thought they were.

BadgerHawk on April 22, 2009 at 7:43 PM

How did they spend Friday nights? Did they use Facebook? Did they go on dates? Did they watch “Gossip Girl?”…

Wow! This makes us Christians sound like a bunch of mindless drones from The Collective who shut down on Friday night to regenerate.

Jerk.

madmonkphotog on April 22, 2009 at 7:47 PM

OT – Drudge has a link to GE cutting off the microphones on shareholders at its annual meeting.

BadgerHawk on April 22, 2009 at 7:48 PM

This is good press? More like damning through faint praise.

spmat on April 22, 2009 at 7:48 PM

Dr.Cwac.Cwac on April 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM

Thanks, Doc… GO BURGESS (R-Texas)
MEAT !!

pambi on April 22, 2009 at 7:48 PM

if we can only get people like Chris Hitchens to stop expecting Christians to get violent …
Gaunilon on April 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM

They have mouths, but they do not speak; They have eyes, but they do not see;

They have ears, but they do not hear, Nor is there any breath at all in their mouths.

TheBigOldDog on April 22, 2009 at 7:49 PM

All the things that convinced him Christians (should read evangelical Christians) are normal are things that Liberty University supposedly rejects. Don’t get me wrong, I think that’s great, I just don’t get why Falwell Christians should feel vindicated by this.

RightOFLeft on April 22, 2009 at 7:49 PM

OT – Drudge has a link to GE cutting off the microphones on shareholders at its annual meeting.

BadgerHawk on April 22, 2009 at 7:48 PM

Bring back Neutron Jack!

TheBigOldDog on April 22, 2009 at 7:50 PM

So – you don’t have to cheat, be cunning or underhanded, have false pretenses and motives to successfully develop meaningful relationships?

ericdijon on April 22, 2009 at 7:51 PM

Nice story. And I say the sentiment goes for all of Lynchburg (VA). I was there last week, it’s just a nice town full of genuinely good people.

LastRick on April 22, 2009 at 7:55 PM

GE cutting off the microphones on shareholders at its annual meeting.

In related news, GE shareholders were found to be participants of the non-existent tea parties and so were ignored as swollen-limbic raaaacists

John the Libertarian on April 22, 2009 at 7:55 PM

Couple of years ago “Soulforce” went on a bus tour of Christian Colleges trying to challenge them on gay rights. One stop was Lee University (Cleveland, TN), and the bus was vandalized (painted).

The Lee students helped them clean it up.

cs89 on April 22, 2009 at 8:00 PM

That people in our country have to find out the hard way that us Christians are not only ‘normal’ (whatever that is) but intelligent and compassionate too says a lot about the secular nature of our society.

docdave on April 22, 2009 at 8:02 PM

Not a fan of Liberty.

so, eh…

Mommypundit on April 22, 2009 at 8:03 PM

I meant the college.

ha.

Mommypundit on April 22, 2009 at 8:03 PM

Reminds me of the Muslims who were “testing” Bible-belt Alabamans to see how prejudiced they were…only to find out how nice they were.

jgapinoy on April 22, 2009 at 8:05 PM

myrenovations on April 22, 2009 at 7:32 PM

My first thought also.

Cindy Munford on April 22, 2009 at 8:05 PM

Not a fan of Liberty.

I’m a fan of Liberty.
The late Jerry Falwell holds the record for being the nicest, sweetest, kindest guy who was publicly perceived as being mean.

jgapinoy on April 22, 2009 at 8:07 PM

If this was his first exposure to Christianty or church, then I feel extremely sorry for him.

How is it that his ‘Quaker’ parents failed to teach him this? Or has Quaker become just another term for secular liberal humanists?

Siddhartha Vicious on April 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM

Well played, sir.

Yes, an honest liberal. Hard to find these days.

jgapinoy on April 22, 2009 at 8:09 PM

All the things that convinced him Christians (should read evangelical Christians) are normal are things that Liberty University supposedly rejects. Don’t get me wrong, I think that’s great, I just don’t get why Falwell Christians should feel vindicated by this.

RightOFLeft on April 22, 2009 at 7:49 PM

Because to be a “Falwell Christian”, whatever that means, is to be painted in a ghastly light of bloody Crusaders wishing to rampage the country and turn America into a Christian oligarchy, in which every facet of life is controlled.

I’m not a “Falwell Christian”, whatever that means, but I am a Christian, and I have no compunction whatsoever to control anyone, but play for the day that minds and hearts are changed, that people no longer hate one another, and that the sactity and sacredness of each individual soul is recognized and respected.

itsspideyman on April 22, 2009 at 8:11 PM

pray for the day

itsspideyman on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

Instead of looking at others searching for lies, he looked at himself and found his truth.

canditaylor68 on April 22, 2009 at 8:16 PM

Allapundit, thanks for posting this. It makes a great story with a good ending. Even if Kevin Roose never becomes politically conservative or even moderate, he at least has a better appreciation that we conservatives are not evil.

He grappled with guilt during the entire project…

This seems an unusual personality trait in contemporary culture. Perhaps this explains his ability to see beyond his prejudices.

Loxodonta on April 22, 2009 at 8:16 PM

People simply HAVEN’T been paying attention. The contrast between the hateful militant left and Christians COULD NOT have been MORE STARK than what we witnessed with the exchange between P-rez and Ms. Prejean this week. P-rez was calling her a b*tch and a c*nt — meanwhile, Ms.Prejean was telling P-rez that she loved him and that she would pray for him.

My collie says:

Christians are WAY better than “normal”. Christians are the the salt of the earth — the children of God. So what are we supposed to call the hate and intolerance exhibited by people like P-rez? Could it be that P-rez and his ilk are the ones that are truly “abby normal”?

Seems to me, you’d have to be completely opaque/blind/oblivious NOT to know that Christians are “normal”.

CyberCipher on April 22, 2009 at 8:19 PM

According to the story he was “infuriated” when someone suggested that the Columbine deaths paled in comparison to the amount of abortions that have taken place in this country.

Glad to see he got a good experience, but his reaction is just one example that there’s a long way to go before the pro-choice crowd really understands the other side of the argument.

And before anyone accuses the pro-lifers of the same thing…yes, we know. Choice, choice, choice. We get it…freedom of choice is good. And it would be a perfectly good argument if we were talking about elective surgery or drug legalization instead of a human life.

TheMightyMonarch on April 22, 2009 at 8:21 PM

ahhh, that story feels good to read.

AbaddonsReign on April 22, 2009 at 8:23 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

Well…

A few studies have indicated physical gratification is enhanced in a stable, long-term relationship with a trusted partner.

Life can be even more enjoyable without mind-altering chemicals and their accompanying side effects. (Ever had a close encounter with “meth-mouth?”)

You’ve apparently been underexposed to the breadth of religious music, to include expression in all practically all contemporary styles.

What are we missing again?

cs89 on April 22, 2009 at 8:23 PM

We knew he was a spy, so we waited until he wasn’t around to shed our human skins, bathe in our regular mixture of goat’s blood and cheeze whiz and then eat our fill of deep-fried baby kittens. He was never the wiser.

Daggett on April 22, 2009 at 8:25 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

Done the sex (one night stand variety, not long term monogamous version) & drugs route. Glad I got out with no STDs and no stint in rehab. You can either get out of it or it’ll get you. Besides, getting older gives you different challenges. Still like that old time rock and roll. And I only go to church for weddings and funerals. Most Christians I know might not approve of certain things for themselves or view something as a sin, but do not want to use the power of the State to force others to conform to their views. Unlike the Taliban or the Left.

rbj on April 22, 2009 at 8:27 PM

itsspideyman on April 22, 2009 at 8:11 PM

Would you prefer “fundamentalist?” Liberty University represents only one strain of Christianity. For lack of a better term, I’m calling it Falwell Christianity.

RightOFLeft on April 22, 2009 at 8:31 PM

What are we missing again?

cs89 on April 22, 2009 at 8:23 PM

From a former Rock Star, with all that that implies, and a born again Christian. Not one (redacted) thing…

doriangrey on April 22, 2009 at 8:32 PM

“As a responsible American citizen, I couldn’t just ignore the fact that there are a lot of Christian college students out there,” said Roose, 21, now a Brown senior. “If I wanted my education to be well-rounded, I had to branch out and include these people that I just really had no exposure to.”

I’m sorry, but did you grow up in a cave? You’ve never been exposed to one of around 85% of the country? Even in a liberal enclave, there’s really no chance you could have never had any “exposure” to “these people” unless you live a sheltered life, most likely in an underground bunker.

TheBlueSite on April 22, 2009 at 8:34 PM

I’m happy that he had a change of heart. Going to a christian school “Was it a christian school?” to try and mock the kids there and ends up liking them. God works in mysterious ways :)

FontanaConservative on April 22, 2009 at 8:34 PM

Some of Christianity’s greatest ambassadors were once highly critical of the faith, a tradition begun with the Apostle Paul (AP).

Who knows, Allahpundit (AP), maybe you’re next?

cackcon on April 22, 2009 at 8:35 PM

Because to be a “Falwell Christian”, whatever that means, is to be painted in a ghastly light of bloody Crusaders wishing to rampage the country and turn America into a Christian oligarchy, in which every facet of life is controlled.

So it turns out that, not only do they not want to impose their Christian values on the country, they don’t want to impose their Christian values on themselves (I don’t blame them).

RightOFLeft on April 22, 2009 at 8:36 PM

The caricature is so imbedded into the media monologue it will take more than a single book to point out that it is the left that is intolerant much more so than the christian right.

Grunt on April 22, 2009 at 8:37 PM

if we can only get people like Chris Hitchens to stop expecting Christians to get violent …
Gaunilon on April 22, 2009 at 7:37 PM

That would require Hitchens to drop that whole brain dead drunkard deal he’s got going on. I still don’t get the conservatives that like this drunkard.

TheBlueSite on April 22, 2009 at 8:37 PM

Shhhh, let’s not give out too much detail to the MSM and wannabe journalists.

(They might find out about the virgin offering/toga-clad Bacchanal/bingo/and bake sale going on over at the church hall.)

Projection. Something the Left has spent decades trying to master.

coldwarrior on April 22, 2009 at 8:46 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

Most christians have had some sort of experience with all of these things and the experiences they have had have either given them a better insight into their own humanness, or increased their faith. Thats not exclusively a choice, sometimes both happens.

canditaylor68 on April 22, 2009 at 8:48 PM

Biggest problem with this guy, he’s completely dishonest about his venture. If the story is accurate (along with his own quote), he’s trying to claim he just wanted to give an honest opinion of people he’d somehow never been exposed to. He was just trying to get a full education, he said. BUT, from this below, we know that’s a lie:

He was determined to not mock the school, thinking it would be too easy — and unfair. He aimed to immerse himself in the culture, examine what conservative Christians believe and see if he could find some common ground. He had less weighty questions too: How did they spend Friday nights? Did they use Facebook? Did they go on dates? Did they watch “Gossip Girl?”

It wasn’t an easy transition. Premarital sex is an obvious no-no at Liberty. So are smoking and drinking. Cursing is also banned, so he prepared by reading the Christian self-help book, “30 Days to Taming Your Tongue.”

He lined up a publisher — Grand Central Publishing — and arrived at the Lynchburg campus prepared for “hostile ideologues who spent all their time plotting abortion clinic protests and sewing Hillary Clinton voodoo dolls.”

He specifically says that mocking them would be too easy. Why? If he was trying to go in with an open mind, he would have never thought it easy to mock them, and he surely wouldn’t have expected his insane invective as to what he would experience while there. He went in to find things to use against them. He’d lie and claim he was one of them, sharing their values, but then he’d get them to say bad things and attack them with it in the book. Don’t give us this BS about wanting to have a complete education!

TheBlueSite on April 22, 2009 at 8:49 PM

I hate these kind of “investigations”. However, at least the young man came away having learned something positive about those he disagrees with. I disagree with Falwell et al but they’re not the spawn of Satan for crying out loud!!!

JohnAGJ on April 22, 2009 at 8:55 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

I’ve read your posts for a long time, and thought you simply don’t have anything to offer.

I have to amend my thought to include that you are very tacky, too.

kakypat on April 22, 2009 at 8:56 PM

As the wife of a Liberty prof, I’m not surprised at all that someone would come here with an idea about what Liberty is about and came away with a different impression. We’ve been here for about 4 years and love it. Coming from the Chicago area, it was a huge change, but it’s a whole lot of fun.

Oh, and Falwell was one of the funniest, most self-deprecating guys you’d ever meet. I don’t think I’ve ever been in a church that laughed (and still does) so much.

acleaver on April 22, 2009 at 9:08 PM

I’m a born again Christian myself who has heard all sorts of crap about Liberty from fellow Baptists, so I actually read this book(I work in a library and checked it out when we received it).

Roose was feeling guilty the entire time, since he didn’t want to be exposed for the liar he was. Before he left, he had a friend who was a Christian who told him to go from Brown and take steps up to Liberty, not go from extreme left to nearly extreme right all at once. He did have an mostly open mind though. He told his dorm mates that he was an Evangelical Christian, but wasn’t all that versed in the Bible. He found the “rebel” guys in his dorm and hung out with them, so he didn’t actually hang out with totally dedicated Christians, just the ones who constantly broke the rules. Roose managed to get himself in Thomas Roads’ Choir, listened to Falwell sermons, did everything he was “supposed” to do, and all he got out of it was a prayer life? He even said most of the Christians at Liberty didn’t make him want to convert and most of them were intolerant towards gays. He even felt guilty about lying to Falwell with that interview only after Falwell died, because that would’ve exposed Roose to the national media too soon for the book to have been published.

I learned nothing new about Liberty or Falwell, since I’m kind of part of that culture. It always surprises me that people think all Christians are intolerant. Well, if the Miss USA Pageant is any indication, isn’t it more like the Left is really the intolerant ones?

cebj25 on April 22, 2009 at 9:11 PM

May your good deed (in posting this) come back to you. Atheists could use some positive PR as well.

John on April 22, 2009 at 9:15 PM

Not a fan of Liberty.

so, eh…

Mommypundit on April 22, 2009 at 8:03 PM

Ohh man, mommypundit. That breaks my heart. That’s where both my wife and I went. It’s a great school, and I can promise you every caricature about Liberty is not true. I enjoyed this story a lot.

Weight of Glory on April 22, 2009 at 9:21 PM

Oh, and for those who think that there’s no sex and no drugs there…dude…where there are college kids there’s sex and drugs. My wife’s roommate would strip in Roanoke on the weekends. And my roommate, his senior year, got into drugs heavily, and blew his graduation. Also the school is very tolerant in terms of dealing with this sort of stuff.

Weight of Glory on April 22, 2009 at 9:25 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

Sex-check, got three kids
Drugs-check, took an Aleve last week
Rock and Roll-check, Thousand Foot Krutch rules!

jimmy2shoes on April 22, 2009 at 9:38 PM

Sex-check, got three kids
Drugs-check, took an Aleve last week
Rock and Roll-check, Thousand Foot Krutch rules!

jimmy2shoes on April 22, 2009 at 9:38 PM

getalife prefers the Rock-n-Roll that O listens to… Oh wait… Earth Wind and Fire? Yeah, stick it to the Man getalife…

Upstater85 on April 22, 2009 at 9:46 PM

My husband is a graduate of Liberty (they affectionately call themselves “Jerry’s kids”), and aside from the fact that he doesn’t use profanity, is active in our church, tithes, loves his wife (me) deeply, and believes in Jesus as his Savior, he’s as normal as anyone else. He has a good job, loves a good joke, enjoys good food and close friends, and he’s a Facebook fan (his goal is to have a friend in each of the 50, not 57, states).

By the way, getalife, we have great sex and we both like rock and roll, but alas don’t do drugs (although I did in college, but he never has). Do we have sex outside our marriage? No. He knows that I advocate legalizing marijuana, but he loves me anyway. We sing in our church choir, but we love all kinds of music, including rock. Try not to speak unless you know what you’re talking about.

College Prof on April 22, 2009 at 9:52 PM

CyberCipher on April 22, 2009 at 8:19 PM

Well said, as usual, brother. And pet the collie for me.

By the way. One added blessing of being a church-going Christian. You might find a wonderful girlfriend, like I have. Christians aren’t perfect, just forgiven.

kingsjester on April 22, 2009 at 9:55 PM

I just drove by Liberty for the first time in years Easter weekend. (I went to boarding school my senior year in Lynchburgh and am very familiar with the school). It is truly AMAZING how large that University has become. They went from a small campus to an exploding place!

They have rules like no co-ed dorms. No holding hands, dress codes, no PDA and such. . . but the young people there are so full of joy and life and happiness.

I know that, and I know this. . . and this is one of the reasons I was so angry at the hate spewed about Falwell when he died. Falwell did nothing but good for the entire world and community. He left a legacy at Thomas Road Baptist and Liberty University that is unrivaled.

Christians and Christianity are awesome. I just wish the whole world would understand that. If the entire world were Christian, the world would be a better place. You can’t say that about many other religions or concepts.

I am glad that they’ll have a legitimate story about Falwell’s legacy that isn’t stained by the militant gay movement. Thanks for posting this AP.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:06 PM

It’s a great school, and I can promise you every caricature about Liberty is not true…Oh, and for those who think that there’s no sex and no drugs there…dude…where there are college kids there’s sex and drugs. My wife’s roommate would strip in Roanoke on the weekends. And my roommate, his senior year, got into drugs heavily, and blew his graduation. Also the school is very tolerant in terms of dealing with this sort of stuff.

Oh wow, sounds like the perfect Christian education every parent would want for their child.

NeverLiberal on April 22, 2009 at 10:08 PM

Oh wow, sounds like the perfect Christian education every parent would want for their child.

NeverLiberal on April 22, 2009 at 10:08 PM

Yes it is. If you keep your head on straight, there are wonderful opportunities to make some great and lasting Christian friendships. Some really great speakers come for convocation and chapel, and the professors view their vocation as a ministry. Many of the Profs. left philosophy positions from UVA to come to Liberty. They took a pay cut, but said that they wouldn’t change a thing. It’s a great campus. Shoot, they don’t even require you to wear dress pants, dress shirt, and tie anymore! Man, I hated that! Oh and about the examples I cited, for every one of them there are 100 that stay away from that stuff.

Weight of Glory on April 22, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Shoot, they don’t even require you to wear dress pants, dress shirt, and tie anymore!

WOW! They might even have co-ed dorms now. It was founded in 1972. I was there in 1990. I imagine 20 years on they have relaxed some of the rules. They have definitely grown. I was really shocked! Pleasantly surprised. Actually when I was there I was wondering if it would survive. They might have had like 4 or 5 dorms and that was the whole campus or something. Well done Falwell, well done.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:18 PM

Instead, he found that “not only are they not that, but they’re rigorously normal.”…

He met students who use Bible class to score dates, apply to top law schools and fret about their futures, and who enjoy gossip, hip-hop and R-rated movies — albeit in a locked dorm room.

A roommate he depicts as aggressively anti-gay — all names are changed in the book — is an outcast on the hall, not a role model.

So in other words, they’re just like the world. And we’re supposed to be thrilled about this? They gossip (slander)just like everyone else, watch the same trashy movies, listen to the same trashy, worldly music, and hold the same liberal views on marriage. And for this, the so-called conservative Christians here at hotair applaud and hold their heads up high. “Yeah! We’re not freaks, we’re just like the world! The liberals accept us!” And we wonder why conservatism is so badly losing the culture war…

This is not good news. This is depressing news.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:19 PM

RightOFLeft on April 22, 2009 at 8:31 PM

There is only one Christianity, not many “strains.” Whether Falwell’s Christianity was/is true Christianity is up for debate (I would say it is not), but there is no doubt that there is only one Christianity.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:22 PM

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:19 PM

I think people are relieved it isn’t another national publication celebrating Falwell’s death and cursing Christians as a whole. Believe me, the Liberty experience is vastly different than most colleges.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:24 PM

There is only one Christianity, not many “strains.” Whether Falwell’s Christianity was/is true Christianity is up for debate (I would say it is not), but there is no doubt that there is only one Christianity.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:22 PM

At the risk of being labeled a ‘bigot’, are you a Catholic by any stretch of the imagination?

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:25 PM

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:18 PM

You went to LU too! Sweet! Class of 2001. They stopped the shirt and tie rule right after I graduated, and Demoss hall was under construction. Now, from what I’ve seen in my Liberty Journal, they have a whole rec. center, indoor swimming, ice rink, theater, and so on. My wife and I would like to get back there, but we keep having kids. Freaking kids.

Weight of Glory on April 22, 2009 at 10:30 PM

At the risk of being labeled a ‘bigot’, are you a Catholic by any stretch of the imagination?

No, I’m not Catholic. I’m reformed Protestant.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:32 PM

NO, I didn’t go to LU. I went to a small Episcopal school there VES for my senior year. After my road trip to New York et al my junior year, my parents thought I was a problem kid so they sent me to boarding school.

Funny thing. . . I was a straight laced kid (other than my itch to road trip on a whim) until I went to boarding school. It was the first time I ever saw and did drugs. But I knew Liberty and the bald hill (which no longer stands out due to the development of the school). I went to wrestling camp at LU when I was a sophomore in hs though.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:34 PM

No, I’m not Catholic. I’m reformed Protestant.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:32 PM

OK, I apologize to the world for my assumption. It made an ass out of me (stop the presses!)

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:35 PM

Believe me, the Liberty experience is vastly different than most colleges.

From the sound of it, that’s not very comforting. They don’t sound all that different to me.

I don’t mean to pick on Falwell’s Liberty exclusively. Just about every “Christian” university these days is no better.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:36 PM

It’s a great school, and I can promise you every caricature about Liberty is not true…
Oh wow, sounds like the perfect Christian education every parent would want for their child.

NeverLiberal on April 22, 2009 at 10:08 PM

AWESOMESAUCE!!
Please oh please send ALL your kids there and stop trying to force IDT crapology into our secular unis.
Send them to Oral Roberts and BYU too!!!

strangelet on April 22, 2009 at 10:38 PM

OK, I apologize to the world for my assumption. It made an ass out of me (stop the presses!)

No need to apologize. You were just asking a question. If such a thing puts one in danger of being labeled a bigot, perhaps the real conservatives here should find another place to hang out.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:38 PM

But I knew Liberty and the bald hill (which no longer stands out due to the development of the school). I went to wrestling camp at LU when I was a sophomore in hs though.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:34 PM

Oooh, bald mt. There are a lot of memories there! Heh. But yeah, I’m not even sure what’s left of the mt. with all the building and such.

Weight of Glory on April 22, 2009 at 10:38 PM

Like I said in an earlier post, I’m a Christian and I used to make fun of the rules there for being so strict. Seriously, they had a rule where you COULD NOT HOLD HANDS with someone of the opposite sex.

Can you imagine getting in trouble for that in college? Seriously, that would get you in TROUBLE. Different sexes in dorms was a definite NO NO. Again, not something you would find at a secular school. It may be relaxed now, but I wouldn’t question their Christianity. They love Jesus.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:40 PM

When did being a Christian become so weird and vile? I am saying this as a person who isn’t even that religious (I’m one of those C&E Catholics). It’s like I have woken up on Mars. I guess being a Texan, I really don’t get the northeastern psyche. Up is down, and Christians are evil. Scary.

shannonkelly on April 22, 2009 at 10:47 PM

No sex, drugs and rock and roll.

No way.

getalife on April 22, 2009 at 8:12 PM

Because those things bring meaning to life, right?

Grow up.

spmat on April 22, 2009 at 10:53 PM

Seriously, they had a rule where you COULD NOT HOLD HANDS with someone of the opposite sex.

Sounds like a good rule to me. If that makes me a prude so be it.

It may be relaxed now, but I wouldn’t question their Christianity. They love Jesus.

I don’t doubt that. And I never intended to question their Christianity per se. When you run large schools like these that are full of fallen human beings, at least half of which (and I’m being generous here) aren’t even regenerated, you’re going to have unrighteousness, even with lots of rules. It’s just the nature of the beast. I think these universities/seminaries mean well, but I wonder just how biblical the idea of such institutions really are.

What I’m upset with isn’t so much the rampant sin that’s supposedly being practiced there, but the openness of it all. For example, watching a trashy R-rated movie in secret and feeling guilty about it is one thing, doing so publicly without shame is quite another. And it really doesn’t say much for the overall Christian culture of the school.

This type of thing should not be looked up at as if it’s a good thing, as if being seen as “rigorously normal” by the fallen world is something we should be pround about. That’s what I’ve seen from quite few hotair commenters. And it’s depressing.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:58 PM

Christians are who make the country tick. See where the best communities are in America and you’ll find thriving churches there.

I was disgusted that Miss California’s answer that marriage should be between a man and a woman (duh!) was in any way controversial. Why should one particular sin be elevated to the status of a day at Disneyland and its own parade?

Mojave Mark on April 22, 2009 at 10:59 PM

they wouldn’t show a trashy R rated movie at Liberty. Believe me they have curfew at 12:30 (I just looked at the current rules of conduct there now). If you want to party, you don’t go to LU. NO alcohol or tobacco allowed on campus period. LU is different, but the kids are awesome!

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 11:04 PM

Carefull AP, this infection could spread. OH CRAPPPP!!! And you touched this thread.

If you hear a knock at the door, but you don’t see anyone there….

Just kidding AP. How does something like this story affect your perceptions of us believers, I am curious to know.

44Magnum on April 22, 2009 at 11:08 PM

My youngest sister is pretty religous and I couldn’t tear her away from Gossip girl. I think it’s filth and mundane, but she loves it.

Daemonocracy on April 22, 2009 at 11:30 PM

It’s amazing how many people have strong opinions on things they know nothing about.

BD57 on April 22, 2009 at 11:37 PM

Was this on The Onion?

angryed on April 22, 2009 at 11:49 PM

I’ve had a bit of a reversed role in my charity work in Africa. Nearly everyone I dealt with in this country on the work is pretty liberal; in doing so, I learned to respect many of then (it doesn’t prevent them with disagreeing with the ‘token secular Neanderthal’, as I call myself :)).

However, I have found there are two kind of liberals, just as there are conservatives: the coffeehouse kind and the action kind. You’ll see the coffeehouse liberal in Africa; generally, for a two week charity tour and you never see them again, as they move on to another issue, now confident they ‘know’ Africa. The action liberal is the one who spends summer after summer there, living at the orphanages and doing a lot of good work. The really great ones are often Peace Corps volunteers, spending a minimum of two years at it. You can disagree with these folks on policy, but you have to respect their dedication for doing right.

They are equally matched by the religious conservatives, who also often walk the walk in country. In the hands-on charity world in Africa, secular conservatives like myself are the real rarity.

michaelo on April 23, 2009 at 12:01 AM

Wow. We have been found acceptable by the lefty representative of a sad and broken world.

What an honor.

29Victor on April 23, 2009 at 12:02 AM

Ha, that’s pretty cool.

jonezee on April 23, 2009 at 12:43 AM

No, I’m not Catholic. I’m reformed Protestant.

2Brave2Bscared on April 22, 2009 at 10:32 PM

Perhaps you should do some unbiased research on the many, many flaws of Calvinism before you start declaring your way to be correct. Might want to start with the Anglican skew of the KJV, and follow with the unscriptural nature of man-made creeds.

TMK on April 23, 2009 at 12:58 AM

WOW! They might even have co-ed dorms now. It was founded in 1972. I was there in 1990. I imagine 20 years on they have relaxed some of the rules. They have definitely grown. I was really shocked! Pleasantly surprised. Actually when I was there I was wondering if it would survive. They might have had like 4 or 5 dorms and that was the whole campus or something. Well done Falwell, well done.

ThackerAgency on April 22, 2009 at 10:18 PM

I graduate in May from Liberty.

School has over 12k undergrad on campus and quickly expanding. As for the dress code…well, it’s pretty much non-existent for girls since guys still have to wear collared shirts to class. Haha.

Yeah, Jerry Jr.’s done a good job with what Dr. Falwell left. I’m going to miss it.

Oh, and that guy’s book? The local Barnes and Noble sold out of it in 2 days. :)

hockey2k5 on April 23, 2009 at 1:17 AM

Testimony of a “normal” Christian:

” When I left Springfield I asked the people to pray
for me. I was not a Christian. When I buried my son,
the severest trial of my life, I was not a Christian. But
when I went to Gettysburg, and saw the graves of
thousands of our soldiers, I then and there consecrated
myself to Christ. Yes, I do love Jesus.”

President Abraham Lincoln

Source:

The Lincoln memorial: album-immortelles (1882)
Author: Oldroyd, Osborn H. (Osborn Hamiline), 1842-1930, ed; Lincoln, Abraham, 1809-1865; Simpson, Matthew, bp., 1811-1844. [from old catalog]; Arnold, Isaac Newton, 1815-1884. [from old catalog]
Subject: Lincoln, Abraham, 1809-1865
Publisher: New York, G. W. Carleton & co.; [etc., etc.]
Possible copyright status: NOT_IN_COPYRIGHT
Language: English
Call number: 6367199
Digitizing sponsor: Sloan Foundation
Book contributor: The Library of Congress
Collection: americana
Scanfactors: 6

SheetAnchor on April 23, 2009 at 1:49 AM

Reminds me of a story about a leftist, possibly lesbian, who looked boyish enough to sneak into a Promise Keepers rally. Her intent was to report back on the homophobic, misogynist Christian men that took part of the gatherings. Instead she found out that they really are sincere believers that spent the time learning about and praising God and not decrying homosexuals and women. It wasn’t quite what she was expecting.

Mallard T. Drake on April 23, 2009 at 2:07 AM

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