Pollution controls caused Arctic ice melt: NASA
posted at 12:18 pm on April 9, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
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People have blamed the retreat of ice in the Arctic on carbon-dioxide driven global warming. However, new research at NASA suggests that environmental intervention in the 1970s could bear most of the blame. The elimination of aerosol particle emissions have removed a cooling element for the northern hemisphere, which has reduced a natural balance in the climate on the effect of human activities:
New research from NASA suggests that the Arctic warming trend seen in recent decades has indeed resulted from human activities: but not, as is widely assumed at present, those leading to carbon dioxide emissions. Rather, Arctic warming has been caused in large part by laws introduced to improve air quality and fight acid rain.
Dr Drew Shindell of NASA’s Goddard Institute of Space Studies has led a new study which indicates that much of the general upward trend in temperatures since the 1970s – particularly in the Arctic – may have resulted from changes in levels of solid “aerosol” particles in the atmosphere, rather than elevated CO2. Arctic temperatures are of particular concern to those worried about the effects of global warming, as a melting of the ice cap could lead to disastrous rises in sea level – of a sort which might burst the Thames Barrier and flood London, for instance.
Shindell’s research indicates that, ironically, much of the rise in polar temperature seen over the last few decades may have resulted from US and European restrictions on sulphur emissions. According to NASA:
Sulfates, which come primarily from the burning of coal and oil, scatter incoming solar radiation and have a net cooling effect on climate. Over the past three decades, the United States and European countries have passed a series of laws that have reduced sulfate emissions by 50 percent. While improving air quality and aiding public health, the result has been less atmospheric cooling from sulfates.
On NASA’s site, Shindell continues:
In the modeling experiment, Shindell and colleagues compiled detailed, quantitative information about the relative roles of various components of the climate system, such as solar variations, volcanic events, and changes in greenhouse gas levels. They then ran through various scenarios of how temperatures would change as the levels of ozone and aerosols — including sulfates and black carbon — varied in different regions of the world. Finally, they teased out the amount of warming that could be attributed to different climate variables. Aerosols loomed large.
The regions of Earth that showed the strongest responses to aerosols in the model are the same regions that have witnessed the greatest real-world temperature increases since 1976. The Arctic region has seen its surface air temperatures increase by 1.5 C (2.7 F) since the mid-1970s. In the Antarctic, where aerosols play less of a role, the surface air temperature has increased about 0.35 C (0.6 F).
That makes sense, Shindell explained, because of the Arctic’s proximity to North America and Europe. The two highly industrialized regions have produced most of the world’s aerosol emissions over the last century, and some of those aerosols drift northward and collect in the Arctic. Precipitation, which normally flushes aerosols out of the atmosphere, is minimal there, so the particles remain in the air longer and have a stronger impact than in other parts of the world.
Now we have a counterargument to cap-and-trade! Rather than pursue ridiculous and economically disastrous emission controls on naturally-occurring carbon dioxide, we can simply stop imposing aerosol controls. That would cost less and have more impact on the problem that climate-change activists claim to want to solve.
However, there are two things wrong with that argument. First, the modeling is as much unproven as is the CO2-climate-change models are. The latter completely missed the cooling trend of the last few years, which calls into question their entire premise. Until the modeling proves itself, the science remains unsettled — as it must for people attempting to extrapolate the future by looking at only the last few hundred years on a planet billions of years old.
Second, and probably more important, most of the activists are less concerned about actual climate change than they are about having an excuse to nationalize energy production, along with everything else. They stopped listening to “science” a long time ago, as soon as they heard enough to justify confiscatory government policies, and have tried to quash all other lines of inquiry with the same enthusiasm as the medieval Inquisitions, and with the same motivation — power. Don’t expect them to listen to NASA when the agency refutes part of their argument now.
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FIFY.
Snowed In on April 9, 2009 at 12:21 PM
Yeah. Someone is looking to be replaced at NASA.
lorien1973 on April 9, 2009 at 12:21 PM
Al Gore’s take: “My mind is made up – don’t confuse me with the facts. Besides, I’m making a rather handsome living selling these carbon credits.”
cpodug on April 9, 2009 at 12:23 PM
well, that destroys a fundamental aspect of the warming argument, if its true. We can’t disclaim and claim any report for political reasons, that’s the left’s tactic. View this with skepticism but don’t discount it, if its true, well that could change some equations.
rob verdi on April 9, 2009 at 12:23 PM
Time to bring back Aqua Net and VO5 in aerosol cans!
carbon_footprint on April 9, 2009 at 12:24 PM
There’s one big problem with assuming that the environmental laws of the late 70’s had anything to do with climate change.
Those laws only affected the US of A.
When you compare the hemispheres, either north vs. south, or east vs. west, you can’t find any differences.
The article makes the claim that the drop in aerosols caused the northern hemisphere to heat up more than the southern hemisphere.
Actual data, from the real world (as opposed to the fantasy world of models) do not show such a difference.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:24 PM
I have to add that the increase in aerosols from China and India over the last few decades is much greater than the decrease in aerosols from the US.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:25 PM
FIFY
AubieJon on April 9, 2009 at 12:25 PM
See Dr Richard Lindzen from MIT.
Unfortunatley he is intelligent, a denier of “man made global warming” and has the data to prove it.
Odie1941 on April 9, 2009 at 12:25 PM
I love the next page:
“Did Chinese Coal Save us?”
rob verdi on April 9, 2009 at 12:25 PM
They really should start watching How the Earth was Made.
Fascinating show.
becki51758 on April 9, 2009 at 12:26 PM
right, because the HotAir approved conventional wisdom trusts scientist…
ernesto on April 9, 2009 at 12:26 PM
I have a different view. Many deniers will grab a hold of this story and say, “gotcha!” Many commentators on this thread will say something witty before I can hit submit. Consider this, though, if you accept this argument, you are on the path to accepting that we humans can dramatically alter our climate.
Can we effect our environment on a local scale, sure. For example, we clean up the lakes and all of sudden more lake grass appears. But one a global scale, count me out.
WashJeff on April 9, 2009 at 12:27 PM
Agreed, tune in each night/week – fascinating stuff.
Odie1941 on April 9, 2009 at 12:27 PM
hey! Obama wants to control the weather! He will save us all!
/sarc
becki51758 on April 9, 2009 at 12:27 PM
FIFY.
29Victor on April 9, 2009 at 12:28 PM
The show on the tsunamis was an eye opener.
becki51758 on April 9, 2009 at 12:29 PM
We need to bring back real pollution to fight fantasy pollution.
zmdavid on April 9, 2009 at 12:30 PM
Just stop trying to interfere. Nothing good can come of it and we will only shovel billions down a rat hole.
SKYFOX on April 9, 2009 at 12:30 PM
What the chances are that someone out there is still trying to find a study to justify their global cooling ‘theories’ of the 70’s and 80’s?
Freddy on April 9, 2009 at 12:31 PM
Where did you get the notion that we don’t trust scientists?
I trust the thousands of scientists, who using real world data and real world experiments have shown that the catastrophic AGW alarmists do not have a scientific leg to stand on.
I do not trust the scientists who use discredited models to try and show something that the real world data refutes.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:32 PM
Someone has their thinking cap on today.
lorien1973 on April 9, 2009 at 12:32 PM
Makes me want to go out and buy three cows and put in an outhouse in the back yard.
MarkABinVA on April 9, 2009 at 12:33 PM
I received this weather report at work yesterday about the coming hurricane season. Pay particular attention to the bolded part of the paragraph:
Hurricane Season Forecast – Colorado State University’s Tropical Meteorology Project released their 2009 Hurricane Season Forecast yesterday. They are currently predicting an average season, with 14 named storms, 6 hurricanes, and 2 intense hurricanes (Category 3 or above). They based this prediction on historical averages and the expectation that current weak La Niña conditions would transition to neutral and perhaps weak El Niño conditions by this year’s hurricane season. If El Niño conditions develop for this year’s hurricane season, it would tend to increase levels of vertical wind shear and decrease levels of Atlantic hurricane activity. Another reason for their forecast reduction is due to anomalous cooling of sea surface temperatures in the tropical Atlantic.
DerKrieger on April 9, 2009 at 12:35 PM
The problems with NASA – the problems I can only guess are what cause folks on here to snipe at NASA – can be traced back to whenever the goverment stopped funding science for the sake of science and started funding science in return for political bragging points.
AubieJon on April 9, 2009 at 12:36 PM
Because scientists deserve to be trusted. They’re scientists! Science! Who can understand the arcane mysteries of their strange and wonderful “research studies” and “journal articles?”
I mean, it’s not as if we mere mortals possess the incredibly rare capability to parse logical statements and crunch data in the widely available Statistical Analysis Toolpack built right into Excel. That would be insane! We must rely upon the revelation of our high priests of Science! Testable hypotheses? BAH! It’s far too complex to possibly understand!
Scientists are purely objective! They have no interest whatsoever in influencing the success and acceptance of theories they spend large portions of their life advancing. Grant money is nothing but a means to an end to the true scientist! Politics never find their way into the lab!
/
TheUnrepentantGeek on April 9, 2009 at 12:37 PM
***
More BAD SCIENCE FROM NASA. A lot of the hysteria that caused changes in types of Freon use were due to bad sensors on one high altitude U2 flight.
***
Then we get information that sea ice and temperature estimates were wrong due to problems in the measurement system calibrations.
***
Why would we trust in getting better information now?
***
John Bibb
***
rocketman on April 9, 2009 at 12:39 PM
That’s all he really has, is snark. It’s so typical anymore with the little one-liners . He’s getting very weak here and he knows it. Go back to the DNC and be honest and let them know you failed here, ernesto. There will be future “assignments” for you, I’m sure.
MarkABinVA on April 9, 2009 at 12:39 PM
LOL … getting funnier by the day.
tarpon on April 9, 2009 at 12:39 PM
Environmentalists are KILLING POLAR BEARS!!!!! GORE LIED BEARS DIED!!!!!
marklmail on April 9, 2009 at 12:39 PM
If the atmosphere were a 100 story building, CO2 would be the linoleum on the lobby floor, by comparison.
The main problem with this piece is that it attempts to show that mankind can influence climate, which is a joke.
Question: What ended the last Ice Age? And the one before that?
Akzed on April 9, 2009 at 12:41 PM
Operative word “anomalous”…
There are studies that claim the hurricane season of the Gulf region is directly attributed to the sand storm activity in Africa.
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LQ284197.htm
Odie1941 on April 9, 2009 at 12:41 PM
Put duct tape on Al Gore’s mouth and we’d probably enter another ice age. What do scientist at NASA know anyway compared to the Goreacle, The Dixie Chicks and the Democrats in Washington?
orlandocajun on April 9, 2009 at 12:41 PM
FIFY.
jgapinoy on April 9, 2009 at 12:43 PM
What it comes down to is that everyone has a theory about climate change…………..no one knows for real what the heck is going to happen. My current theory is that the earth is overdo for a polar flip, the south pole going north pole and vice versa. Does anyone have a clue how to stop that when it happens?
SC.Charlie on April 9, 2009 at 12:43 PM
In the 1970s the big scare was the coming Ice Age all caused by pollution.
albill on April 9, 2009 at 12:44 PM
Doesn’t one even need to graduate from grade school to get a job as a journalist? Is Archimedes only for post-graduate students in the physical sciences now?
DarkCurrent on April 9, 2009 at 12:44 PM
Why does it always have to be policy or the lack of it that has influenced some giganto geographic happening?
What do these idiots think the Earth did before we came along with our big important “policies”? Schmucks.
LibTired on April 9, 2009 at 12:44 PM
You have to love this! Man usually tries to alter mother nature and it always ends up blowing up. Wasn’t it decided after the Valdez oil spill that the “clean up” did more environmental damage than the oil spill?
bopbottle on April 9, 2009 at 12:44 PM
Actually, the cooling trend was attributed to China’s unprecedented growth of black carbon emissions. From the Reg article:
BelchSpeak on April 9, 2009 at 12:45 PM
Heat caused Arctic ice melt.
That is a factual statement, and the only one that ought to have come out of NASA. How much heat, how the differentials have changed, etc. Hard data. Let someone else troll it for socio-political implications.
spmat on April 9, 2009 at 12:45 PM
Anyone read/see the Gary Larson book There’s a hair in my dirt?
Within the story a nature-loving ditsy blonde tries to help a turtle by throwing it back into its pond. It turned out that the turtle was really a tortoise that drowned to death by her good intentions.
This NASA report reminded me of it.
shick on April 9, 2009 at 12:45 PM
Hmmm, yesterday Obama decides that he will cool the planet by spewing particulates into the atmosphere. Today, NASA reports they have cast their eyes on their wonderful crystal computer model and finds the lack of particulates in the atmosphere has caused the change in temperatures.
I question the timing for another curious case of 200 nearly identical MSM headines so soon after the last one.
Dusty on April 9, 2009 at 12:47 PM
bring back the acid rain! geez.
sesquipedalian on April 9, 2009 at 12:48 PM
I have a message for the global warming alarmists:
It’s the sun, stupid. It’s what heats the earth. More sun activity, more heat. Less sun activity, less heat.
Leave it to the hubris of man to claim to be responsible for the climatic changes on earth when, in their finite and illogical logic, they cannot even reproduce known climatic changes in a computer model. “We postulate; therefore, it is.”
pfff.
Tennman on April 9, 2009 at 12:48 PM
Obingo wants to block the sun rays! NASA is going to think of what they can do to block the rays. This could really devastate technology as well. Maybe we can get lucky and they will wipe out all of the Government data and the Bank data? /sarc!
sheebe on April 9, 2009 at 12:49 PM
They just told us a few months ago that Mars’ warm period was caused by sulfur. Now they want to put sulfur in Earth’s atmosphere to bring about…cooling.
Any cognitive dissonance yet, ernesto?
Buddahpundit on April 9, 2009 at 12:49 PM
CO2 does have an affect on the climate. If there were no CO2 in the atmosphere, the world would be several of degrees colder than it is today.
The problem with all greenhouse gases (GHGs, is that their affect is logarithmic. That is each doubling of the concentration has half the impact of the previous doubling.
About 90% of the energy that can be blocked by CO2, is blocked with a CO2 concentration of 50ppm.
100ppm gets you to 95%.
200ppm gets you to 97.5%
400ppm gets you to 98.75%.
Currently the wold’s CO2 concentration is around 280ppm.
Two other facts. In the past, CO2 concentrations have been as high as 6000ppm. That’s right, 6000ppm.
All of today’s plants evolved when the CO2 concentrations were between 4000ppm and 6000ppm.
Depending on the plant type, photosynthesis stops when CO2 concentrations get down to between 100 and 150ppm.
In the last 10 million years, CO2 levels have dropped from 4000ppm to about 250ppm before the industrial revolution started pushing it back up again.
That’s getting dangerously close to CO2 starvation levels for most plants.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:50 PM
Let me add a secondary source (primary being the Sun), the Earth’s core. The volume of magma that is near the surface flucuates. The heat this generates can easily effect ocean currents, ice melting, and wind patterns on this planet.
WashJeff on April 9, 2009 at 12:52 PM
When you combine a graph of solar activity (via the best proxy, sun spots) and the state of the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO) and you get a graph that perfectly matches the temperature record over the last several hundred years.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:52 PM
There was an article posted yesterday about an ice shelf breaking of from Antarctica that had the warmies panties all in bunch. I found a related article that said there was an undersea volcano in close proximity to that broken off ice shelf and that volcano was in the “ring of fire” and was currently active. The warmies want to blame mankind.
DerKrieger on April 9, 2009 at 12:53 PM
If we could open a hole over DC and let that glorious Sun radation blanket DC.
WashJeff on April 9, 2009 at 12:54 PM
The “Green” movement wants to kill all the green plant life. That’s why they should be renamed the “brown” movement.
zmdavid on April 9, 2009 at 12:55 PM
There is one inescapable fact that this story proves:
The debate is NOT over!
Are you listening algore?
redshirt on April 9, 2009 at 12:55 PM
I did like this small piece on propaganda idiocy, though. If the melting of the Arctic ice cap could do such a thing, wouldn’t we see some partial evidence of that — like some partially disastrous rises or, as in 2007, a semi-disastrous rise — every single summer when the ice caps melts?
Dusty on April 9, 2009 at 12:56 PM
Everything in Woody Allen’s movie Sleeper is coming true LOL!
TheBigOldDog on April 9, 2009 at 12:57 PM
Sorry, but it is not a factual statement.
The loss in arctic ice from 2 years ago was caused when changes in ocean and atmospheric circulation patterns cased the arctic ice to flow out the gap between Iceland and Greendland. Normally the circulation patterns push the ice either directly onto land, or towards the gap between Alaska and Russia, which is much, much smaller.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:57 PM
Do you have to work at being ignorant, or does it just come naturally.
Acid rain was allegedly caused by coal plants releasing sulfur into the atmosphere.
Aerosols allegedly were destroying the ozone layer.
Of course both myths have been completely debunked, but who cares, it was the thought that counted.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 12:59 PM
Exactly my thought!
It’s playing their game by their rules. However, I wouldn’t mind hearing them wiggle their way out of it …
eforhan on April 9, 2009 at 1:00 PM
And may I add, we don’t believe in scientist who get their funding, that is basically there sole income, from groups with a specific agenda…for instance, infamous Dr. James Hansen. A scientist whore…
right2bright on April 9, 2009 at 1:00 PM
All this brouhaha about global warming stems from the belief that atmospheric carbon dioxide controls temperature. Analysis of geologic data (before the data from Greenland and Antartic ice caps were available) showed that CO2 levels and temperature tracked very closely with volcanic rock formation. Once the ice cap data was analysed, it showed that temperature and CO2 levels still tracked closely but without the volcanic activity. Everyone just assumed that CO2 controlled temperature. But, if that is the case, why haven’t temperatures jumped radically since the beginning of the 19th century? CO2 levels have increased by 50 percent but the temp has only increased 0.75 degrees, they should have gone up a lot more. What these morons won’t consider is that respiration from living organisms produces 80 percent of atmospheric CO2. Warmer temps mean more life. Viola, anyone with a brain should see that increased atmospheric CO2 levels is an effect – not a cause – of temperature increases.
lonesomecharlie on April 9, 2009 at 1:00 PM
Along with the bigger fraud of unproductive “alternative” energy, all this means is that we’re just going to use more and more fossil fuels.
I love it!
TexasJew on April 9, 2009 at 1:00 PM
If the earth’s core were to completely cold, the earth would only cool down by a few tenths of a degree. At most.
Yes, the core is hot, but the amount of heat escaping is miniscule compared to the surface area of the planet.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:01 PM
This statement is so fertile with irony, I just had a lymphatic eversion.
TMK on April 9, 2009 at 1:02 PM
Real scientists don’t require trust.
zmdavid on April 9, 2009 at 1:02 PM
That ice sheet is also located on the Antarctic penninsula, which is the only part of that continent that is warming. (Due to changes in the ocean currents.) The rest of Antarctica has been cooling for over two decades.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:02 PM
WOO HOO! Rock on TJ, Rock on!
upinak on April 9, 2009 at 1:02 PM
Bhhhhaaaaawwwwaaahhhhhhh…….
So the environmental nutroots are to blame for global warming!!
Those bastards – I knew it…..
Get rid of the nutroots & Al Gore – end to global warming – problem solved!!
Now send me that check for $10 Billion!!!
izoneguy on April 9, 2009 at 1:03 PM
Dumbest comment ever.
If the earth’s core were “cold” we wouldn’t exist, nor would earth as we know it.
Odie1941 on April 9, 2009 at 1:04 PM
Save us, Mt. Redoubt!
innominatus on April 9, 2009 at 1:05 PM
I wouldn’t go that far. For example, scientists who’s work is funded by the Diabetes Foundation do very good work.
I would say that scientists who’s work is funded by an advocacy group need to have the work examined with a finer tooth comb than normal, but leave it at that.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:05 PM
lonesomecharlie on April 9, 2009 at 1:00 PM
Beyond that, analysis of those same ice cores has shown that CO2 trails changes in temperature, by around 900 years.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:06 PM
Mark, you should have linked Watts Up With That on the coincidence (?) between the PDO and solar cycles.
As regards particulates, there’s another funny lurking out there.
Using fuel generates sulfur emissions in the form of sulfur dioxide (SO2), which combines with atmospheric moisture to produce sulfurous acid (SO3) and is then oxidized by solar energy to produce sulfuric acid (SO4). Sulfuric acid is acidic (well, duh) and therefore you get acid rain.
Once upon a time we had a lot of cement plants also belching out particulates. The emissions from cement plants are largely calcium compounds, which are basic. When a base combines with an acid, the result (to a first approximation) is neutral; this is called “buffering”. So the cement plants were canceling out the power plants, and we got hazy skies and neutral precipitation. Those were low-hanging fruit; the emissions are relatively easy to eliminate with fairly simple (if expensive, alas) filters.
Elimination of cement plant emissions coincided with the ramp-up of the installation of catalytic reactors (”converters”, bah) in cars. Catalytic reactors guarantee that any sulfur in the fuel will be converted to SO2 and spewed out the tail pipe. So we were simultaneously adding more acid and removing the buffering. Cute, eh?
Regards,
Ric
warlocketx on April 9, 2009 at 1:08 PM
Models based on fudge factors.
Completely useless.
Will someone please bring back the peer review process?!
Badger40 on April 9, 2009 at 1:08 PM
Yes, the core is hot, but the amount of heat escaping is miniscule compared to the surface area of the planet.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:01 PM
But the outgassing of greenhouse (primarily steam – water being over 99% of true greenhouse gases) and other gases at the plate margins and volcanic belts is huge – far more than anything our puny gasoline and diesel motors put out.
Between that, the sun, and the huge additional amount of oceanic contributions to our atmosphere, including over 95% of all CO2 emissions, this anthropogenic global warming scam is comical.
It’s sort of the new cargo cult for the 21st century!
TexasJew on April 9, 2009 at 1:08 PM
Do you even read the stuff you respond to? My comment was regarding another posters claim that changes in the heat flux were sufficient to change the temperature of the climate. It had no purpose beyond that. If you insist on trying to read more into it than that, then I might recommend several good self help clinics.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:09 PM
Inconvenient Truths
marklmail on April 9, 2009 at 1:10 PM
warlocketx on April 9, 2009 at 1:08 PM
My company server has blocked WattsUpWithThat. I’m in communication with our Admin to try and find out why.
MarkTheGreat on April 9, 2009 at 1:10 PM
hahahahahahaha
scalleywag on April 9, 2009 at 1:10 PM
Their work is also verifiable in an observable amount of time. They don’t tell us that they have a solution until they actually do.
thomasaur on April 9, 2009 at 1:12 PM
Already covered in the sci-fi book Fallen Angelsby Larry Niven and Gerry Pournelle.
pseudonominus on April 9, 2009 at 1:12 PM
Reminds me of the ban on DDT.
Funny how millions of people dying from Malaria each year is nothing compared to a few birds’ brittle egg shells (& it was not that bad & only in some species as far as I am aware).
Certainly not bad enough to condemn millions to death.
Badger40 on April 9, 2009 at 1:13 PM
Look at that name, remember that name…because this may be the last you ever see of him again.
Dr. Shindell, who could be called Dr. Irony, has crossed the line, the left will destroy him.
He has been at the forefront of open information, where he details some of the problems, and how we got to where we are by not allowing his and other studies to be presented. They were “stonewalled” by political appointees.
Here
right2bright on April 9, 2009 at 1:14 PM
I think the Republican “Leadership” should sponsor a bill that quite reasonably refocuses NASA’s programs onto SPACE and SPACE ISSUES rather than Earth sciences, which belong at NOAA. They should enlist NOAA as an ally to “increase” their influence by carving off the global warming stuff from NASA and giving it to NOAA. This would effectively reduce the number of chattering political voices supporting AGW theory and eliminate one of the “pressure” points exploited by the global warming crowd upon US policy makers.
This would also get NASA back into the space biz. NASA saw the handwriting on the wall under Clinton and “greened” itself through a global warming focus that has diluted their usefulness and led to the deaths of 7 astronauts on the Columbia after they replaced the *proven* insulating foam on the ET with a CFC “green” version that could not stand up to launch pressures…a large chunk of the “green” foam broke off and shattered so many thermal protection tiles that Columbia fireballed upon re-entry.
Get NASA out of Global Warming, and back to Space.
EasyEight on April 9, 2009 at 1:15 PM
So… according to this study we need to convince polar bears to use freon air-conditioners? Or perhaps we could just send the polar bears a few cases of hairspray.
Is this science or fashion advice? Stylish–you know.
petunia on April 9, 2009 at 1:16 PM
I am sorry, your follow up trumped the original comment.
Not only is your premise akin to an amoeba, but your grammar is stellar…
Odie1941 on April 9, 2009 at 1:16 PM
What retreat of the Arctic ice?
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/04/09/wuwt-ice-survey-shows-thickening-arctic-ice/#more-6910
jukin on April 9, 2009 at 1:16 PM
It galls me that we all pay more for anything with freon because of this junk science. Freon was cheap and the environmentalist wackos caused it to be replaced with stuff that was very expensive. Companies like Dupont resisted at first, but then figured out they could make more money by coming up with a substitute that was patentable and more expensive. So they joined the environmentalist bandwagon, which served the other purpose of getting Greenpeace off their back.
Similar story with DDT. Rachel Carson is to blame for millions of deaths of human beings in Africa from malaria to save the bald eagle.
Apple growers lost millions of dollars in one season because the Environmental Defense Fund lied about Alar, even getting actress Meryl Streep to testify to Congress (figure that one out!) It was determined to be full of untruths, yet the media still quote the Environmental Defense Fund like they are objective and honest.
And then there is the spotted owl, the snail darter, and all the other junk the environmentalist have saddled us with.
It’s not about the environment, folks, and it’s not even about the money anymore. It’s about power and control.
Christian Conservative on April 9, 2009 at 1:18 PM
That was the problem the “peers” were not allowing open review of scientific papers.
You can have all the “peer” review, but if their “superior” peers don’t okay it, it sits.
right2bright on April 9, 2009 at 1:19 PM
CFCs have zero relation to “acid rain”.
On a related note: did anybody else get exposed to videos in school talking about the horrible future we’d all be experiencing due to “acid rain”? I did. By now we were supposed to be having days where we simply couldn’t venture outside when it rained. Clearly the mighty EPA saved us all. Either that, or it was a bunch of nonsense. I can’t quite figure out which is more likely to be the case.
strictnein on April 9, 2009 at 1:19 PM
Diabetes so far hasn’t turned into politics… if and when it does then it can no longer be trusted. When you mix science and political power… or anything with political power you have to always be on guard.
petunia on April 9, 2009 at 1:19 PM
#1 Mammoth farts?
#2 Sumatra Supervolcano?
Badger40 on April 9, 2009 at 1:20 PM
and this gem…
right2bright on April 9, 2009 at 1:21 PM
Oh Heaven help us! Someone called the grammer police again!
petunia on April 9, 2009 at 1:21 PM
Which reminds me-
We need to overhaul the def of who is a ‘peer’.
Badger40 on April 9, 2009 at 1:21 PM
Yeah, that guy took your comment to an extreme. My opinion is that the magma fluctuations are not directly changing the temperatures we experience in the climate, but how the climate gets “stirred.”
For example, more magma closer to the surace of the artic may cause a slight rise in the ocean temperature (and by rise I am talking in tenths of a degree) and ground temperature. This will help, a little, to melt ice in the artic and Greenland ice sheets. The cold fresh water mixes with the ocean water and alters ocean currents. Thus, changing our climate.
Sun, though, is a the primary driver by far.
WashJeff on April 9, 2009 at 1:23 PM
Notice that the article on the NASA report came from a UK paper. Again, the best press in America isn’t in America.
hawksruleva on April 9, 2009 at 1:23 PM
For this, Dr. Shindell will be awarded an extended sabbatical from his NASA job and a ten-year scholarship in patriotic science at the People’s Re-education Camp.
petefrt on April 9, 2009 at 1:23 PM
In theory, reality and theory are the same. In reality, they are different. — [can't remember who said it]
threeCents on April 9, 2009 at 1:23 PM
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