Gulp: Analysis shows Toomey challenge to Specter will move Senate left
posted at 6:30 pm on April 7, 2009 by Allahpundit
Jay Cost does some back-of-the-envelope math. How does having a bona fide conservative in the race make the Senate more Democratic probability-wise? Simple: In a blue-purple state like Pennsylvania, Toomey’s a much harder sale in the general election than the incumbent Specter is. If, as seems likely, he knocks Specter off in the primary, the Dems will be staring at a fairly easy pick-up, especially if The One descends from Mt. Olympus to do some campaigning for the nominee. We’ve gamed this out before but follow the link and check Cost’s assumptions. Is it time for the blogosphere to catch … Spectermania?
One thing to bear in mind as you mull: It’s not worth fretting overly much about the Democrats getting to 60 because of this, as that already seems assured by the fact that Bunning’s a dead man walking in Kentucky. Here’s Specter on MSNBC this morning proving how worried he is already about Toomey by, er, comparing him to the people at AIG who received bonuses. Skip ahead to the end for that or else watch from the beginning to hear him explain how Obama’s not seeking nuclear disarmament even though The One explicitly called for “a world without nuclear weapons” in Prague. If you figure out what he means when he says reducing our stockpile would be helpful somehow while rogue states are building nukes of their own, shoot us an e-mail. I’d love to know.
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Apologetic California on April 7, 2009 at 6:36 PM
Keep Specter on his toes. The most important votes are going to come in the next few months and very few after that.
Apologetic California on April 7, 2009 at 6:37 PM
PA sucks. That’s all I’m saying.
ErinF on April 7, 2009 at 6:39 PM
Specter loses the Primary,
changesadmits he’s always been a Democrat at heart and wins the General Election. Specter keeps his seat and becomes Chairman of some Committee, Democrat Part solidifies its control. Done deal.A good Congresstitute always gives the ‘John’ a good time.
SeniorD on April 7, 2009 at 6:39 PM
Hell no. If the people of PA want a left of center Senator then let them have him. Let Minnesota have Franken and be done with it give ‘em 60 and watch them drive the country off a cliff. I want Republicans to not have anything to do with the coming currency crisis/inflationary depression. Let the country feel the wrath of unfettered Democrat rule and be done with it. The GOP can sort out its ranks remove the RINO’s and be ready for REAL conservative governance
Sidenote: I think the litmus test for conservatives is their willingness to honestly address the excesses of the past. The babyboomers role of voting in a way to encourage bigger and biger promises from government related to Social Security and Medicare. And leveling with the nation. Social Security and Medicare in their current form are unsustainable and must be cut.
Theworldisnotenough on April 7, 2009 at 6:40 PM
Does it matter much if it is a liberal dem or a liberal repub voting for cloture on every sh*tty bill that comes down the pike? We get the same result, so kick the bastage out!
innominatus on April 7, 2009 at 6:41 PM
How much compromise of conservative principles should those of us on the right stand just to play number games in the case of Specter? Conversely, how much effort should we put into keeping a walking gaffe machine like Bunning who is very likely a dead man walking? He’s one of my senators and the man is a fool. A dedicated conservative, to be sure, but still a fool that is entirely too vulnerable to a blue- dog challenge by Lt. Governor Dan Mongiardo. Mongiardo’s a cradle- robbing, Medicare cheating douchbag, but he’s not as addled as Bunning appears to be.
Dukeboy01 on April 7, 2009 at 6:42 PM
I’m pretty sure Dkos would rather have a Dem over ‘liberal’ Republican Specter. Do you want to make Markass Moulitsass happy? Thought so.
Apologetic California on April 7, 2009 at 6:43 PM
The Pubs are so dead. Man, they are dead men walking.
True_King on April 7, 2009 at 6:44 PM
HOGWASH
thmcbb on April 7, 2009 at 6:46 PM
The Republicans are the reason why were in this. What are you talking about?
True_King on April 7, 2009 at 6:46 PM
Uh… we’re talking 2010, right? What’s the chance the Republicans aren’t going to be picking up some seats from Obama fatigue? Even with a total screw up as president, it’s possible the economy will eventually turn around, but I doubt Obama will be riding that in 2010 with how he’s been so far.
frankj on April 7, 2009 at 6:46 PM
That Bunning link won’t load for me, but judging from the link title I’m guessing it’s not good.
BadgerHawk on April 7, 2009 at 6:46 PM
I pray that by 2010, there will be so many pissed of Americans that they totally clean house…………..
Seven Percent Solution on April 7, 2009 at 6:48 PM
PA has elected conservatives before remember Rick Santorum? Santorum was elected during the Clinton years under circumstances very much like I expect we will see in 2010. I can tell you I can’t vote for Specter again and I know I am not alone. We can definitely take the House in 10 and I think we can pick up a couple in the Senate. Specter is not a make or break, no way.
msmveritas on April 7, 2009 at 6:48 PM
Out with Specter, in with Toomey. I will bet Obama will be so disastrous for Pennsylvanians, that they will go for Toomey. The liberals already control congress and the senate, as well as the White House. I am sure with Obama’s policies on cap and trade as well as this recession extending far beyond this year, there will be a huge backlash and Toomey will get through. Republicans had enough with Specter.
Also, is Lynn Swann running for governor in Pennsylvania? I think he’ll definitely win this time.
jencab on April 7, 2009 at 6:49 PM
I don’t think Cost’s math works here because he’s not factoring in turnout.
Specter may be more popular overall than either Toomey or his Democratic opponent, but that matters little. Democrats aren’t going to vote for Specter, especially when Obama gets involved in the race, and Republicans aren’t going to turn out for Specter.
We’ve seen this in many races now when the Republicans nominate a moderate. Low turnout within his or her party, no votes from the other, as much as the other party may think he or her “ain’t too bad…for a Republican, I mean.”
I would argue that it would be better to go for a Rovian strategy of energizing the Republican base with Conservative candidate.
DarkKnight3565 on April 7, 2009 at 6:50 PM
Isn’t there any possibility of picking up say… Dobbs seat in Conn. the recent appointment to the Colorado seat, and the best prize of all- Reid’s seat in Nevada?
Sackett on April 7, 2009 at 6:55 PM
It can come down to the purple Philly suburbs, which are somewhat diverse, but probably have a lot of middle class voters who might be socially liberal, but fiscally conservative. And by 2010, they might be feeling or seeing the tax bite from Arlen’s votes. Central PA votes red, and Pittsburgh, Philly, and Scranton, blue.
Arlen only barely won over Toomey before because both Bush and Santorum endorsed him. He has neither now, and Santorum has publicly criticized him (Specter didn’t do squat for Santorum in 2006, for one reason).
Arlen starts acting conservative about a year before the election, and then veers left when re-electd. One wild card is his health. He’s going to be 80, and has had two bouts of cancer (lymphoma, I think) plus a brain tumor that was removed years ago.
Wethal on April 7, 2009 at 6:55 PM
Huh? When did Rove turn out the base with a CONSERVATIVE candidate?
True_King on April 7, 2009 at 6:56 PM
Allah – go back in your hole. You are so wrong. A “conservative” can win in PA. They simply have to be conservative and believe in being conservative. At least the people will know what they mean and what they can expect. You are a running scared numb nut, Allah.
suzyk on April 7, 2009 at 6:56 PM
Bunning probably won’t get the chance to run again. There will be another Republican who will run and probably win in a deep red state like KY.
Chris Dodd is toast. Harry Reid will get beat if the RNC can find anyone decent in NV.
I’m expecting the Republicans to pick up 2 or 3 seats in the senate under normal circumstances, and more if the Obama Administration continues to melt down and prove its incompetency to the electorate.
doug1981 on April 7, 2009 at 6:57 PM
Or there is a national backlash against Dems a la ’94 and we get a true conservative Senator versus a Rhino…at least for 6 years.
aigle on April 7, 2009 at 6:59 PM
It really depends on who the Dems nominate, too. 2010 is the year we elect a new governor. The front-runner would appear to be the AG Corbett. Don’t know who the Dems have (Rendell can’t run again). A strong GOP ticket can help with turnout. Not having to hold one’s nose and vote for Arlen could be an energizing reason for GOP conservative turnout.
And if the Dem has to support Obama’s tax and spend policies, he/she could be at a disadvantage with Independents.
Wethal on April 7, 2009 at 7:00 PM
You can argue Bush was not a conservative and that is probably true but you will get no where especially in PA with a Libertarian or some third party candidate. The past is past, no reason we can’t do better with strong conservative candidates in the future.
msmveritas on April 7, 2009 at 7:02 PM
Ah what’s the effin difference? The democratic senate will still get to shove their agenda down our throats. The difference is, without Specter, republicans will not be blamed for it. The democrats can own ALL of it. EVERY failure will be on Obama/Reid/Pelosi’s hands.
HornetSting on April 7, 2009 at 7:02 PM
And that is the dumbest, most ill informed statement I’ve seen on these boards lately.
rplat on April 7, 2009 at 7:03 PM
So, Toomey shouldn’t run on conservative values? Yeah, that’s what we’re getting at here.
SouthernGent on April 7, 2009 at 7:03 PM
True_KIng:
No, the Republicans are not the reason we are in this.
I know there are Democrats and Paulbots who like to tell themselves this, but it is crap.
I was a realtor back in the 90s when Clinton started pushing this whole loans for everybody thing. I can remember Bush actually making some noise about it over the years. In fact in 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 he brought up reforms that were never passed until the meltdown in September 2008.
I have even heard people try to blame Gramm, because of that Gramm-Blilely-Leach bill passed in 1999. It passed with only 8 votes against it and Clinton signed it.
Did the Republicans do enough to stop all this? No, but then again the Democrats went out of their way to make it happen and the American people did their part too.
Terrye on April 7, 2009 at 7:04 PM
The thing that could throw a permanent wrench in that idea is shamnesty. If obama/reid/pelosi find a way (and they WILL) to allow the
cockroachesMe-hee-can migrants to vote, the American electorate will be forever leftward. The dimrats are counting on shamnesty passing before the next election in 2010.ErinF on April 7, 2009 at 7:04 PM
msm:
I think True_King’s idea of a conservative candidate is someone who could never win an election in the United States.
Terrye on April 7, 2009 at 7:06 PM
The states on either coast can’t produce nor contain any true conservatives. Like McVain, this independent thinking doesn’t work when one is supposed to be part of a team.
The GOP is killing itself, intentionally, as each member tries to stand out.
madmonkphotog on April 7, 2009 at 7:09 PM
My thought is that Toomey will provoke strong resistance and voter turnout around Philadelplhia and Pittsburgh and would have to make up for it in the rest of the state. I’m not sure how he will pull it off.
I would find it hard to vote for Toomey, though to block Obama, I’d do about anything. I’d even vote for Rick Santorum.
thuja on April 7, 2009 at 7:10 PM
I would rather have Toomey beat Specter in the primaries and risk a loss in the general election than have to spend another six years dealing with Specter.
He’s not worth it anymore. And it might be good to see how many votes a conservative can pull of in that state at this point.
myrenovations on April 7, 2009 at 7:16 PM
It will move the Senate left, but it will move the GOP right, which in the long term is better for America.
Republicans will never be able to convince the country that they’ve changed and are conservatives again with people like Specter at the front of the party.
Nessuno on April 7, 2009 at 7:17 PM
I can’t believe any true conservative will hesitate for one minute to get rid of this back-stabbing S.O.B. It’s time for the “Scotsman” to go!
RMR on April 7, 2009 at 7:20 PM
Let Spector go. The loss is worth it. America wants to learn the hard way so let them. Some folks have to be mugged to wake up.
Newagegop on April 7, 2009 at 7:20 PM
If Toomey loses the General and Bunning does too, so be it.
America is ready for more change.
Apparently.
artist on April 7, 2009 at 7:23 PM
I’m guessing a “moderate” Toomey would still lose. I think the message in this is that when you’re fighting an uphill battle you need to hang on to your incumbents (as long as they’re sure wins).
Also, the libs couldn’t pull this off in blue connecticut with Lamont, why would it work in purple(ish) pennsylvania for the conservatives?
egads on April 7, 2009 at 7:25 PM
RINOs must become extinct. If a Demo wins, then the people get a true indication of who’s in charge and can deal with the consequences. When a RINO is sitting in the seat, the people become confused and blame the RINOs party. Let Specter just go away. The people need a choice of a conservative or a socialist. Clear choices. No more muddy thinking. Bye, bye Specter. There are consequences.
Dandapani on April 7, 2009 at 7:27 PM
Let the Dems have the seat. The American people deserve exactly what they’re going to vote for. Screw ‘em.
Mark V. on April 7, 2009 at 7:32 PM
Kick this bum out PA!!!! He needs to pay for his disloyalty!
Winebabe on April 7, 2009 at 7:37 PM
Gotta update the voting trends in PA a bit. The heavily populated areas outside Philly used to be extremely conservative, but have been shifting more Democrat recently. Western Pennsylvania used to be solidly USW-Democrat, but has been trending solidly more conservative, especially in presidential races. It’s one of the few areas of the country where McCain did better than Bush did 4 and 8 years ago. McCain won every county except Erie and Allgheny, and Allegheny was not a blowout by big city standards.
Overall though, with the Philly burbs no longer solid, and the medium sized cities going increasingly liberal, the conservative trend in W-PA is getting more than washed out.
forest on April 7, 2009 at 7:39 PM
I think you’re right, what is the point of finding someone to run who will only end up giving Dems bigger leads. I want Pelosi gone as much or more as I want Obama out. Dems aren’t going to vote for Specter, the recent PA polls show both sides think it is time for him to go. Toomey has a shot but a third party candidate hands it to the Dems.
msmveritas on April 7, 2009 at 7:40 PM
It all depends on a whole lotta stuff you can’t predict right now, but I don’t think Toomey is as screwz0red as Jay Cost thinks.
There may be an anti-Democrat backlash come 2010. Even the Democrats are moving up their agenda in fear of this.
Sekhmet on April 7, 2009 at 7:50 PM
Dont forget the Dodd has a challenger. Im hopeful they throw a lot of those bums out.
becki51758 on April 7, 2009 at 7:53 PM
Your hypothesis might make sense if the election was being held tomorrow. Between now and November, 2010, twenty lifetimes will have come and gone.
Jdripper on April 7, 2009 at 7:55 PM
By that logic, we should try to oust Specter and get a Republican nominee who’s way further to the left and supports Obama much more obsequiously. ‘Cause that way we’d be POSITIVE to beat the tar out of any Democrat candidate.
It’s funny, I’ve heard this same argument used to support a more-moderate version of John McCain about 500 times now. And it sounds dumber every time. How is that even possible?
logis on April 7, 2009 at 8:06 PM
What’s the difference between Specter and a Democrat?
<crickets>
Unless it’s Murtha, who cares?
Kafir on April 7, 2009 at 8:06 PM
No.
I know full well that a Democrat will likely pick up the seat. But that’s not the point.
The point being, of course, that Specter is virtually the same as a Democrat, except on RARE occasions when he remembers he’s supposed to throw Republicans a bone and side with them on an (unimportant) issue. And his treachery has been put up with for too long.
One way or the other, I think this is Specter’s LAST term in office, and good riddance.
Vyce on April 7, 2009 at 8:11 PM
By November of 2010, the ONLY thing that will matter in any election is who voted for “The Failout.”
logis on April 7, 2009 at 8:11 PM
Toomey or a Democrat….what’s the problem?
Moderates and Centrist Republicans will need to face the fact that elections are more difficult to win from the center. The game that the centrist must play is to sway the far right to vote for them and then suffer years of being a RINO. As the Liberals have been showing us for *years*, you start from the far left, and move center when necessary. It is amazing to me that moderates continue to espouse a centrist stance while continually losing ground.
Republicans need to stand on the far right and only move to the center as needed. PLEASE, learn from our recent history. The reason it appears that the country is moving to the left-center is because fewer conservatives will vote when faced with voting for a un-principled conservative.
This country is religious and right-center. Run as a principled conservative and win the center over with the history and logic of conservativism (which is proven to work).
Give Specter the boot. If Specter wins the (R) primary, you might as well be voting for a Democrat.
Geministorm on April 7, 2009 at 8:16 PM
I don’t see any difference between Sepcter and Casey, it’s not like a very liberal Democrat will win PA anyways, we’d get someone who may be even more to the right on some issues than Specter is.
Bottom line though, Republicans need to nominate conservatives, that is the best way for the to win elections. Electing people who would have the “best” chace to win blows up in our faces like Dole and McCain did.
cadams on April 7, 2009 at 8:19 PM
As a resident of pa. i have to honestly say I dont care if the seat goes to the dems. I have had it with the spinelessness in the party “leadership”. He has to go. Plain and simple.
jesterstear on April 7, 2009 at 8:21 PM
Don’t worry about Specter – take him out – take him out.
“The One” will have too much campaigning to do next year to be much effective anywhere.
Democrats are going to be in trouble next year.
HondaV65 on April 7, 2009 at 8:25 PM
Agreed, and a FIFY for good measure.
DannoJyd on April 7, 2009 at 8:35 PM
If it’s a good year for Rs due to anti-Dem backlash, then throw the calculations out the window. If it’s a bad year for Rs, we’re going to have a lot worse problems than one RINO seat in PA.
Specter’s got to go. He’s not the only one. It’s going to take a clear and powerful message, a unified effort, to stop Obamanomics or, if it can’t be stopped, to undue the damage.
NOTE to rockmom: It’s worth looking at the history of Gramm-Leach-Bliley – what the Dems demanded in exchange for their support: that participating institutions pass a CRA test.
CK MacLeod on April 7, 2009 at 9:08 PM
Don’t worry about Toomey.
McSpecter (he who embraces Scottish law) doesn’t look so good.
I don’t think he’ll make it to run in 2010.
Jenfidel on April 7, 2009 at 9:23 PM
Not a chance no matter what. Toomey has a real chance- he would have were it not for Bush.
Dodd is a goner so there’s some comfort.
drjohn on April 7, 2009 at 9:43 PM
John Murtha’s brainddead supporters will vote for whoever promises the most pork i.e. the Democrat.
Speedwagon82 on April 7, 2009 at 10:25 PM
How can you improve the IQ of the Republicans and the Democrats both, in a single move?
Register Arlen Specter as a Democrat.
rogersnowden on April 7, 2009 at 10:28 PM
So what? Specter is a democrat anyway. He’s worse than a democrat because he can stab republicans in the eye when they count on him. If PA wants two dems in the Senate, then fine. At least with a real democrat you know what to expect. It’s time for Specter to go home and contemplate the “magic bullet” from the Kennedy assassination for the rest of his life.
kens on April 7, 2009 at 11:25 PM
Vote for Toomey. The Democrat probably isn’t paying his/her taxes.
NellE on April 7, 2009 at 11:47 PM
Amen and in other states as well. Principles matter.
Christian Conservative on April 8, 2009 at 1:50 AM
Politics is a lot like stock markets. To make money, one mist buy when everyone else is selling and sell when everyone else is buying. Right now you, the MSM and every “expert” is buying Dems and selling Reps. Which means it is assured that Dems will crash and burn in the not too distant future.
angryed on April 8, 2009 at 8:08 AM
1) If Obama is as big a disaster as most of us suspect, Republican prospects, even in a state like Pennsylvannia improve dramatically.
2) Going from RINO Specter to a real Democrat (assuming the worst happens) will move the Senate to the left. But the movement will be so small that most people won’t be able to see it.
3) If we aren’t willing to take chances, we will never advance.
4) Having Specter gives the Democrats the chance to claim that their bile is bi-partisan. Replacing Specter with a real Democrat helps to remove that cover.
MarkTheGreat on April 8, 2009 at 8:31 AM
The Senate seat is not the only factor here. An energized base, that actually turns up at the polls, will help other Republican candidates, in the House races and in statewide and local races.
MarkTheGreat on April 8, 2009 at 8:35 AM
“Toomey’s a much harder sale in the general election than the incumbent Specter is”
Obviously. How stupid do you have to be not to be able to figure that out? Sure, we’ll put Toomey — who I really admire — on the ticket, and as a result, lose the election.
But hey, it doesn’t matter if we lose even more seats in Congress as long as we GET THE RINOS OUT!!!!!!!!! right, Einsteins?
rightwingprof on April 8, 2009 at 10:11 AM
Judging from today’s headlines the above is hogwash. There is a lot of time between now and 2010. This country is going down the tubes faster than I ever imagined. There is a lot of bad stuff headed our way. The Democrats can’t handle it. We are not safe, even in our own houses. People are getting pissed off. This isn’t the America we are used to having.
BetseyRoss on April 8, 2009 at 11:02 AM
Oh boy.
Aronne on April 8, 2009 at 6:10 PM
What
Ever.
It would be better to have a Democrat than to have a Democrat that calls himself a Republican. Oust Specter, my Pennsylvanian friends.
Kevin M on April 9, 2009 at 10:22 AM