UN panel passes the religious-defamation resolution

posted at 2:17 pm on March 27, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

The UN Human Rights Council has passed the resolution calling for an end to critcism of religion around the world.  Actually, to be fair, that’s not entirely accurate.  They want an end to criticism of one particular religion — and we all know which religion that will be:

The U.N.’s top human-rights body approved a proposal by Muslims nations Thursday urging passage of laws around the world to protect religion from criticism.

The proposal put forward by Pakistan on behalf of Islamic countries — with the backing of Belarus and Venezuela — had drawn strong criticism from free-speech campaigners and liberal democracies.

A simple majority of 23 members of the 47-nation Human Rights Council voted in favor of the resolution. Eleven nations, mostly Western, opposed the resolution, and 13 countries abstained. …

Opponents of the resolution included Canada, all European Union countries, Switzerland, Ukraine and Chile.

“It is individuals who have rights and not religions,” Canadian diplomat Terry Cormier said.

India, which normally votes along with the council’s majority of developing nations, abstained in protest at the fact that Islam was the only religion specifically named as deserving protection.

I wrote about this earlier in the month, so this resolution comes as no shock to Hot Air readers.  Nor should its passage surprise anyone who has kept abreast of the UN’s efforts on “human rights”.  The HRC and its predecessor have obsessed themselves with anti-Israel and pro-Islam initiatives, and have made a mockery of efforts to oppose racism at its Durban conferences.

Cormier provided one of the few voices of sanity at the HRC.  As I noted on March 3rd:

Where does this stop?  Will the UN next declare monarchy as a protected class of beliefs, about which criticism should be treated as a hate crime?  Fascism?  White supremacy?  How about American exceptionalism?  What about Hinduism, a polytheistic belief system that Islam frequently and bitterly criticizes? …

The notion that ideas and belief systems have “rights” goes against every step towards liberty that mankind has taken.  Individuals have rights; ideas and belief systems have values and policies that should remain open for debate, criticism, satire, and ridicule.  Without that essential freedom, people will fall under the thrall of whatever belief system or ideology can exert the most force over them — a strategy practically designed by and for the radical Islamist extremists to whom the UN panders in this declaration.

This also gives us another reason to oppose initiatives like Kyoto and Copenhagen.  Along with endemic corruption and a chronic lack of accountability, the UN’s values are flat-out antithetical to America’s.  We value individual rights and free speech, and the rights of people to speak trump the nonexistent right to be free from offense — as they must, if we value free speech at all.  Pakistan and the other Islamic nations want to silence the opposition to Islam.  They’re not interested in “human rights” in the sense that Westerners see them (as individually based).

The resolution carries little effect, but it reveals the wide chasm between the West and those who hate freedom and liberty.  The latter won at the HRC, but they can only beat us here if we let them.

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Comment pages: 1 2 3 4

yeah so? thats all ya got? you atheists are a dumb lot.

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 4:45 PM

Oh there are lots of quotes that demean women in the bible. Don’t kid yourself, but back to this arc story.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:46 PM

in his care

You keep attributing acts of God to Noah.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:47 PM

Ok so your still trying to say that he traveled the world collecting every animal, no matter how small, obscure, or rare. Animals that humans didn’t even know existed. Somehow transported them all back onto his ship and none of them died in his care.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:45 PM

I don’t believe that story literally at all. From my religious upbringing at home and Catholic schools, it was more of a moral lesson in loyalty, even if it meant being all alone.

blatantblue on March 27, 2009 at 4:47 PM

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 3:33 PM

I like that.

Archie Noble on March 27, 2009 at 4:47 PM

Leave Terry alone.
He must already feel bad enough about being a purposeless, futile mass of evolved accidental molecules.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:49 PM

There is no “Ecclesiasticus” and your paraphras is nowhere in the Bible Terry

sweetcake on March 27, 2009 at 4:46 PM

Yeah there is. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecclesiastes

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:50 PM

Why the heck is Belarus in the UN? We should be boycotting those little tyrannical Statists.

Glenn Jericho on March 27, 2009 at 4:50 PM

accidental

Science is wonderful.
First, Pastuer proves that live cannot arise from non-living matter. Then, Terry & MB4 insist that it did.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:50 PM

As I urged in another thread:

Let us get the US out of the UN and the UN out of the US.

Christian Conservative on March 27, 2009 at 4:51 PM

Terry, Ecclesiates only has 12 chapters, airhead.

sweetcake on March 27, 2009 at 4:51 PM

…but maybe it didn’t. Maybe Martians “seeded” life here, as prominent evolutionists tell us. But who seeded the Martians?

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:52 PM

Science is wonderful.
First, Pastuer proves that live cannot arise from non-living matter. Then, Terry & MB4 insist that it did.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:50 PM

I never said science was. But your “organized” religion is a bunch of BS

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:55 PM

Terry, you have no idea what my “organized” religion is.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:58 PM

I’m beginning to understand why L. Ron Hubbard took up Robert A. Heinlein’s barroom bet that he could start his own religion. Money, power, political influence, control of others…

Crusty on March 27, 2009 at 4:59 PM

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:58 PM

You have no idea what logic or childrens stories are.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:59 PM

Terry, here is my “organized religion”:

1) Nineteen pagan Roman historians referred to Jesus Christ as a contemporary teacher, as did three non-Christian Jewish historians.
2) None of them refuted the fact that he was executed for his teaching.
3) His disciples taught that they saw him rise from the dead.
4) Most of those witnesses were put to death for their teaching. Why would someone die for what they know is a lie?
5) If the Romans or the Jewish leaders had the body of a dead Jesus, they would have displayed it and stopped this “cult” from spreading “lies”.
Happy upcoming Resurrection Day!

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 5:00 PM

I’m beginning to understand why L. Ron Hubbard took up Robert A. Heinlein’s barroom bet that he could start his own religion. Money, power, political influence, control of others…

Crusty on March 27, 2009 at 4:59 PM

Exactly. I almost wish I could have live 2000 years ago so I could beat Christ to the punch, but from the looks of things I don’t have to go back in time to create a following.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:01 PM

Terry, here is my “organized religion”, continued:
I know God is real.
By the thousands of prophecies in the Bible that have been fulfilled.
By the power of the Bible to discern the thoughts of our hearts and to transform our lives.
By the wisdom of the Bible, which is the biggest influence upon Western Civilization and the cornerstone for the greatest nation in history.
By the truth of the Bible, which has persuaded the hardest of skeptics who have dared to examine it.
By the way God’s Spirit has spoken to my heart exactly what I needed to hear, when I needed to hear it, for almost thirty years.
By the miracles of healing I’ve received.
By the testimony of the eyewitnesses of the resurrection of Christ, who were willing to die for their faith (if it was a lie, why would they die?).
And by this:
Jesus claimed to be the Lord, the source of life, the only way to Heaven. Either he is or he isn’t. If he isn’t, either he knew it (he’s a liar) or he didn’t (he’s a lunatic).
So he has to be either Lord, liar, or lunatic.
His words inspired ten of his closest friends to lay down their lives for him. His words have been universally acclaimed as the wisest ever recorded. His words have inspired many millions–from self-righteous moralists to serial murderers–to change their ways and follow him.
Lunatic? Come on.
He accepted the arrest, the whipping, the fists, the interrogations, the crown of thorns, the crowd’s scorn, and the cross without changing his story.
Liar? Get real.
Jesus is Lord.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 5:02 PM

4) Most of those witnesses were put to death for their teaching. Why would someone die for what they know is a lie?

I’m sorry I had a chuckle at this one. World Trade Center anybody?

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:03 PM

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:01 PM

Then create a following. Get people to be willing to die for testifying that you rose from the dead & ascended to Heaven.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 5:04 PM

What a fun way to spend my lunch break. Later, guys.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 5:04 PM

By the miracles of healing I’ve received.

You’ve received a miracle of healing? Why is it a miracle if someone recovers from something people often recover from? How come nobody ever recovers from a severed limb? How come it never grows back?

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:05 PM

Terry’s Bible has a book of Eccesiasticus with 18 chapters. He’s just a liar as well as ignorant.

sweetcake on March 27, 2009 at 5:07 PM

Thats seems kind of cruel and unusual of God, to not just heal randomly, but to randomly heal certain ailments. Oh cancer recovery is a miracle, but nobody ever has a miracle limb reappearance.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:08 PM

Terry’s Bible has a book of Eccesiasticus with 18 chapters. He’s just a liar as well as ignorant.

sweetcake on March 27, 2009 at 5:07 PM

Its an awesome bible. It combines your human bible with the one of the devil. Psssh, its called a spelling error you twat.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:10 PM

Psssh, the real Ecclesiastes only has 12 chapters so to quote one with 18 makes you the twat

sweetcake on March 27, 2009 at 5:16 PM

I don’t have a religion, and frankly, I don’t care what your religion is. I do care if that religion invokes you to kill me, and I do care if said religion tries to gag me. Religion, club, gang, organization or clique, I don’t care what you call it. Keep your paws and ritual laws off of me.

oakpack on March 27, 2009 at 5:21 PM

Shouldn’t you be off somewhere calling people ugly and decrying white women as inferior to black women?

MadisonConservative on March 27, 2009 at 4:45 PM

why? when its more fun making you look stupid, not that you need any help you piece of trash.

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 5:23 PM

Ok so your still trying to say that he traveled the world collecting every animal, no matter how small, obscure, or rare. Animals that humans didn’t even know existed. Somehow transported them all back onto his ship and none of them died in his care.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:45 PM

I’m trying to say you’re stupid…but you prove it with every post.

moron.

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 5:26 PM

4) Most of those witnesses were put to death for their teaching. Why would someone die for what they know is a lie?
I’m sorry I had a chuckle at this one. World Trade Center anybody?

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:03 PM

huh? so all those people who died on that day died for their believe in the twin towers…duhhhhhhhh

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 5:27 PM

why? when its more fun making you look stupid, not that you need any help you piece of trash.

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 5:23 PM

How Christian of you!

blatantblue on March 27, 2009 at 5:49 PM

There’s only one religion that’s gone around the world killing people violently and brutally in the name of God the past couple o’ centuries, and if you think if you atheists on the board think that’s Christianity and your doing some public service by trying warn people that ‘The Christians are coming, The Christians are coming!’ you’d better wake up.

The Muslims are already here.

As far as I’m aware, there isn’t one documented case of an organized Christian terror group blowing up skyscrapers, holding hostages, or taking over sections of cities and massacring large numbers of civilians.

But hey, I could be wrong about that. Maybe I just don’t read the newspapers enough.

manofaiki on March 27, 2009 at 5:52 PM

PS – when the UN passes a resolution like this covering Judaism I’ll take those pricks seriously.

NEXT!

manofaiki on March 27, 2009 at 5:53 PM

Islam Blows!

ronsfi on March 27, 2009 at 5:53 PM

How Christian of you!

blatantblue on March 27, 2009 at 5:49 PM

Hardly. That’s why he’s nothing but a racist little hypocrite.

MadisonConservative on March 27, 2009 at 6:00 PM

It’s time to kick the UN out of the US and stop funding this worthless organization.

Disturb the Universe on March 27, 2009 at 6:06 PM

I don’t think that Islam the religion is any more batsh*t crazy than Christianity, if you actually read the text.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 3:56 PM

Well, yah actually it is, and while most of the violence in the Bible is descriptive, most in the Koran is prescriptive. Christ preached love, Mohammad hate. Christ was good, kind of like Mother Terasa, Mohammad was evil, kind of like Hitler and a child molester rolled into one.

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 6:35 PM

Mohammad was evil, kind of like Hitler and a child molester and Vlad the Impaler rolled into one. I am also sure that Mohammad had very bad dog breath.

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 6:37 PM

LOL…

Typical HotAirHeads, fighting Islam with books instead of bullets.

Limerick on March 27, 2009 at 3:54 PM

Hence it happened that all the armed prophets conquered, all the unarmed perished.
- Niccolo Machiavelli

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 6:42 PM

How Christian of you!

blatantblue on March 27, 2009 at 5:49 PM

the truth usually is.

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 6:48 PM

Hardly. That’s why he’s nothing but a racist little hypocrite.

MadisonConservative on March 27, 2009 at 6:00 PM

tell me, are you as fat as you are stupid?

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 6:49 PM

eff the UN.

bluelightbrigade on March 27, 2009 at 6:52 PM

Didn’t God say, “for I am the Alpha and Omega…”

Liberty or Death on March 27, 2009 at 4:04 PM

God identifies Himself as the Lord God Almighty via the Hebrew Aleph/Tav which corresponds to the Greek Alpha/Omega.

semloh on March 27, 2009 at 6:54 PM

Science is wonderful.
First, Pastuer proves that live cannot arise from non-living matter. Then, Terry & MB4 insist that it did.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 4:50 PM

Are you talking about Darwin and his theory of evolution? I don’t think he picked up at that early a stage. Actually I am more of a Punctuated Equilibrium kind of guy myself.

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 7:03 PM

Now let’s see these UN bureaucrats/cubicle jockeys try to enforce that resolution with the individual or average American citizen.

I sincerely HOPE that the powder-blue helmet “folks” realize that they’re gonna get their asses handed to them if they try to. Ok, not sincerely. But don’t say we didn’t warn you.

Teddy on March 27, 2009 at 7:07 PM

whereas evolution is nothing more than an atheist fairy tale.

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 4:26 PM

Are you implying that Pope John Paul II was really an atheist?

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 7:09 PM

right4life on March 27, 2009 at 6:49 PM

I hope every true Christian person here resents this little puke representing their number. I know better, but many don’t.

MadisonConservative on March 27, 2009 at 7:10 PM

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 7:09 PM

Heh! wrong4life…

ronsfi on March 27, 2009 at 7:10 PM

Now let’s see these UN bureaucrats/cubicle jockeys try to enforce that resolution with the individual or average American citizen.

I sincerely HOPE that the powder-blue helmet “folks” realize that they’re gonna get their asses handed to them if they try to. Ok, not sincerely. But don’t say we didn’t warn you.

Teddy on March 27, 2009 at 7:07 PM

The UN’s purpose is to encourage member nations to incorporate this resolution into their laws. They don’t have to send in blue helmets to enforce it – just convince Congress to pass something similar for domestic consumption.

aengus on March 27, 2009 at 7:11 PM

LOL…

Typical HotAirHeads, fighting Islam with books instead of bullets.

Limerick on March 27, 2009 at 3:54 PM

Ahh the scum floats to the surface. Even I, an Atheist who despises Islam, can recognize the goodness inherent in the vast majority of Muslim Believers. That you would so flippantly advocate murder of these loving, decent people shows you to be no better than the Jihadis. Go back to your hole.

ronsfi on March 27, 2009 at 7:16 PM

In a major statement of the Roman Catholic Church’s position on the theory of evolution, Pope John Paul II has proclaimed that the theory is “more than just a hypothesis” and that evolution is compatible with Christian faith. In a written message to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, the pope said the theory of evolution has been buttressed by scientific studies and discoveries since Charles Darwin. “It is indeed remarkable that this theory has progressively taken root in the minds of researchers following a series of discoveries made in different spheres of knowledge”‘, the pope said in his message Wednesday. “The convergence, neither sought nor provoked, of results of studies undertaken independently from each other constitutes, in itself, a significant argument in favor of this theory“.

The Pope’s message went much further in accepting the theory of evolution as a valid explanation of the development of life on Earth, with one major exception: the human soul. “If the human body has its origin in living material which preexists it, the spiritual soul is immediately created by God”, the Pope said.
- Chicago Tribune (10/25/96)

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 7:21 PM

aengus on March 27, 2009 at 7:11 PM

I know that. But if this Congress passes something similar to it for domestic consumption with the clock ticking towards 10′ and 12′, I figure we don’t have much to worry about.

We can always ignore the resolution after that fact. Wth is the UN going to do? Write us angry letters? Fine us – money they’ll never see? Leave The U.S.? Oh My! We can’t have That, now can we?

Teddy on March 27, 2009 at 7:30 PM

So, if Islam cannot be criticized, it must be perfect – right?

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 7:43 PM

Ok people.

Here we go. Somehow I knew that someone in this thread would start the “Christianity” bashing, and trying to equate it to islam.

But lets get the record straight. The record clearly shows us in the book of Acts, just what it is that the early patriarchs believed. Their works were not of the sword as moohammad and the followers of mohammad’s religious system. History.

Man, always screws up God’s system. Always has and always will. Man is imperfect. Man creates his own religious system in many different forms. Whether it’s darwinism, denomination, or any other form of belief system.

The true Messiah was the Light that brought forth the Truth. As HE Himself stated His purpose to Pilot eg. John 18:36-38 There is no doubt that Pilot was not jesting as there was many forms of “man’s religion” in the Roman empire.

The fact of the matter is this, I brush my teeth with my worst enemy every morning. I look into the mirror and see my worst enemy’s face everyday. And upon my death, I will have to face the Judge and give account for my life.

All of you will have to do the same whether you believe in a Judge or not. My Judge is He who was dead, and yet lives again. (Saying “my” denotes ownership.)

So for all those in here who are fighting for “Christianity”, remember what the Lord has taught us.

For those of you who do not hear, so be it. This is expected of you. And the rest of this world is no different. The UN is no different.

AlreadyKnownAs on March 27, 2009 at 7:45 PM

Has there always been a feud between MadisonConservative and right4life?

I’m still a little new here.

FontanaConservative on March 27, 2009 at 7:48 PM

I am urging all blaspheming Zionist and Christian forces who are working against the Islamic Holy Forces of Allah, blah, blah, blah,… attempt to resists the Islamic blah, blah, blah…cannot speak out against the Holy Koran or against Mohammad, blah, blah, blah or in any way speak or act against the Islamic Holy Forces of Allah. blah, blah, blah.

The more I read rants like this, the more I understand Christianity. I have read that since “good” Muslims bang their heads on the floor repeatedly five times a day, they develop a callus or “mark” on the forehead. And of course, there’s that cute habit of hacking off the heads of anyone who questions their cult. And I thought, “Hey! Self! Remember in The Revelation To John of Jesus The Christ? You know, the last book of the Bible? Along about chapter 20, verse 4, when John records the words, “And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of the testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark upon their forehead…” And I thought, hey, that beast is Satan! That’s who those people worship! Now THAT makes sense.

oldleprechaun on March 27, 2009 at 8:05 PM

Ahh the scum floats to the surface. Even I, an Atheist who despises Islam, can recognize the goodness inherent in the vast majority of Muslim Believers. That you would so flippantly advocate murder of these loving, decent people shows you to be no better than the Jihadis. Go back to your hole.

ronsfi on March 27, 2009 at 7:16 PMAhh the scum floats to the surface. Even I, an Atheist who despises Islam, can recognize the goodness inherent in the vast majority of Muslim Believers. That you would so flippantly advocate murder of these loving, decent people shows you to be no better than the Jihadis. Go back to your hole.

ronsfi on March 27, 2009 at 7:16 PM

No, ronsfi, it’s atheists like you who don’t get it. Religions claim certain things are true. Islam commands evil from its followers, and Islam has no humane intelligentsia to moderate its message–unlike Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, and Buddhism. There are literally zero moderate Sunni and Shia muslims who are religious leaders. To believe in Islam is to be as bad as a Nazi. In fact, it is to be worse than a Nazi, since the Nazi weren’t in favor of raping little girls like Islam is.

thuja on March 27, 2009 at 8:15 PM

There is no “Ecclesiasticus” and your paraphras is nowhere in the Bible Terry

sweetcake on March 27, 2009 at 4:46 PM

I was not part of this discussion, take no side, and don’t know why it came up — but sweetcake is incorrect. Ecclesiasticus is one of the intertestamental books, what Protestants call the Apocrypha. It was written sometime between the close of the Old Testament writings (shortly after the return of the Babylonian captives to Jerusalem, somewhere around 500 BC) and the opening of the New Testament period, around 40 AD.

Terry is also incorrect, as “Ecclesiastes” and “Ecclesiasticus” are not the same book. Ecclesiastes falls among the wisdom literature of the Old Testament, and tradition assigns its authorship to Solomon.

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:15 PM

Has there always been a feud between MadisonConservative and right4life?

I’m still a little new here.

FontanaConservative on March 27, 2009 at 7:48 PM

Of course not!

It’s right4life versus everyone else.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:21 PM

Oh and BTW AP, can I still get the mohammad Teddy Bear on sale this year?

AlreadyKnownAs on March 27, 2009 at 8:21 PM

4) Most of those witnesses were put to death for their teaching. Why would someone die for what they know is a lie?
I’m sorry I had a chuckle at this one. World Trade Center anybody?

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:03 PM

Terry, you missed his point. The guys who took down the WTC fully believed what they were doing was the will of God, and would usher them into paradise. You and I might say we know they were wrong, but they believed it.

What right4 was saying was that they would not have done that if they knew perfectly well that Islam had no truth. And likewise, the Apostles, who all (except for one) died for proclaiming their faith, would not have done so if they knew they’d made it up. I know if *I* were in on a scheme to lie and create a religion, after about the 3rd of the founders had been torn limb from limb for proclaiming the gospel, I’d be thinking about abandoning my role in the little scheme, and after the 4th or 5th, I’d definitely have gone back to fishing — assuming I wasn’t one of the martyrs already.

And that’s just one of several things about the Apostles that make no sense if they made up their accounts. Others include the details of the accounts themselves, which are just all wrong for Jews attempting to persuade other Jews, or for subjects of Rome hoping to avoid being arrested and murdered by the Romans.

The point is that the historical behavior of the Apostles requires a serious impact event to explain it — an event that cements them into their conviction, like, you know, their leader being resurrected from the dead.

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:28 PM

Oh cancer recovery is a miracle, but nobody ever has a miracle limb reappearance.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:08 PM

You’re sure? I’ve actually heard of miracles like that. I’ve also heard plausible explanations within Christian theology why such miracles would seem rarer than others.

And why does it matter? How many miracles do you need to see before you acknowledge that supernatural events are possible? Explain your logic if your answer to this question is greater than 1. (IF the logical claim is “No A is B,” then it only takes one instance of A=B to falsify the claim.)

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:32 PM

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:28 PM

Change “knew” for “thought”, and it will make more sense.

Belief is a terrible ailment.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:32 PM

I never said science was. But your “organized” religion is a bunch of BS

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:55 PM

Right. And it was a group of people, slinging that “bs” that recently saved my wife’s life (at the Jasper Baptist Medical Center). How come there are no “Atheist Memorial Medical centers? Or any type of “atheist” charity at all? Could it be because you are mostly a bunch of self-centered, self-righteous jerks? (And yes AP, I mean him. Whatever your faults, you’re not a jerk.)

You people have nothing to live for, and no point to your life at all. Enjoy.

Squiggy on March 27, 2009 at 8:33 PM

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 5:03 PM

Simply,
–apostles say they saw Jesus rise from the dead & ascend into Heaven
–11 apostles are arrested for preaching this
–all continue to tell this story until they’re killed, one by one, though changing their story could’ve saved their lives
–Christianity spreads like wildfire because they see how these guys really love people & believe in their God as if it was all real.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 8:35 PM

1. (IF the logical claim is “No A is B,” then it only takes one instance of A=B to falsify the claim.)

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:32 PM

A cannot equal B – ever. They are, by definition, two distinct properties.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:35 PM

“atheist” charity

Indeed, tens of thousands of Christians have left the comfort of the US to live in third-world nations to serve humanity. How many atheists have done that?
Look how many Christians adopt children, including healthy & some very handicapped.
Look how much Christians give to the poor compared to atheists.
It’s because we know that there’s a God in Heaven who guides, blesses, & will reward our deeds.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 8:39 PM

Belief is a terrible ailment.

I’d say,
Belief is a life-changing, soul-saving, joy-giving, purpose-finding blessing.

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 8:41 PM

A cannot equal B – ever. They are, by definition, two distinct properties.

4 = 2 + 2

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 8:41 PM

How many miracles do you need to see before you acknowledge that supernatural events are possible?

Exactly. The greatest miracle worker of all (Jesus) told some of those who witnessed his miracles (the Pharisees),
“How can you believe, when you receive glory from one another, & you do not seek the glory that comes from God?”

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 8:45 PM

A cannot equal B – ever. They are, by definition, two distinct properties.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:35 PM

Huh???

You’re going to have to explain what you mean, because I was just quoting stuff from the first day of Logic 101. If I read you correctly, then the statement “All A is B” is always false, regardless of the assigned meaning of A or B. How is logic even possible if this is so?

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:53 PM

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 8:53 PM

Because, if A = B, then B = A. Therefore A and B are the same. Therefore two definitions are not applicable. To denote A and B is to denote a difference in property.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:59 PM

4 = 2 + 2

jgapinoy on March 27, 2009 at 8:41 PM

C = A + A.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 9:00 PM

What over 50 years of determined state effort to control, weaken and destroy Christianity gets you:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/article5960010.ece

100,000,000 Christians in China now OUTNUMBER the 74,000,000 Chinese Communist Party.

Nice going, retards!

People who think the West is going secular once they finally drive the final stake into the heart of Christianity are fooling themselves.

If the Chinese and the Russians couldn’t root out religious belief in over half a century of committed fanaticism on the subject, what hope do you have?

manofaiki on March 27, 2009 at 9:07 PM

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:21 PM
Ah I see, carry on.

FontanaConservative on March 27, 2009 at 9:24 PM

Hmmm …

Al Queda and Islamo Fascism sucks!

Am I in violation of a UN Resolution?

Hehehehe … I anxiously await sanctions.

I have nothing to fear … Sadaam Hussien, Ackmadunajad, Kimmie I’m Ill point the way for dealing with the UN!

HondaV65 on March 27, 2009 at 9:31 PM

Because, if A = B, then B = A. Therefore A and B are the same. Therefore two definitions are not applicable. To denote A and B is to denote a difference in property.

OldEnglish on March 27, 2009 at 8:59 PM

Um… perhaps my notation was unorthodox. What I meant was “some A is B,” or “all A is B.” In order to falsify the proposition “no A is B,” one need produce only 1 instance where A is B.

Example. If one says “No Republicans are human,” one need only produce a single Republican who is also human in order to falsify the proposition.

This is so basic that I’m wondering why we have to bother with this.

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 10:04 PM

I don’t believe that story literally at all. From my religious upbringing at home and Catholic schools, it was more of a moral lesson in loyalty, even if it meant being all alone.

blatantblue on March 27, 2009 at 4:47 PM

Well, I don’t think catholics take much of any of the bible seriously, do they? “We don’t worship other gods, we venerate them.” A religion of wordplay.

TTheoLogan on March 27, 2009 at 10:48 PM

The sad thing with this whole issue is it’s going to be used to persecute non-muslims and those who leave Islam.

Thanks UN!

TTheoLogan on March 27, 2009 at 10:52 PM

The sad thing with this whole issue is it’s going to be used to persecute non-muslims and those who leave Islam.

TTheoLogan on March 27, 2009 at 10:52 PM

You didn’t mention any muslim who wants to moderate Islam so that it is a religion with which the rest of us can live. Instead, the UN wants us to “live” with the status quo where the muslims punish or kill any moderate.

thuja on March 27, 2009 at 11:25 PM

Lots of Christian bashing here. Sounds like those leftist sites or most universities.

Johan Klaus on March 28, 2009 at 12:30 AM

Example. If one says “No Republicans are human,” one need only produce a single Republican who is also human in order to falsify the proposition.

This is so basic that I’m wondering why we have to bother with this.

philwynk on March 27, 2009 at 10:04 PM

Two different properties.

OldEnglish on March 28, 2009 at 4:54 AM

thuja on March 27, 2009 at 8:15 PM

Pathetic.

ronsfi on March 28, 2009 at 4:55 AM

Omar the tentmaker?

RealDemocrat on March 28, 2009 at 10:46 AM

I hope every true Christian person here resents this little puke representing their number. I know better, but many don’t.

MadisonConservative on March 27, 2009 at 7:10 PM

better to be an imperfect representative of christianity, than a PERFECT example of evil, banality and stupidity.

bet you’re as hideous on the outside as you are on the inside.

right4life on March 28, 2009 at 11:55 AM

Are you implying that Pope John Paul II was really an atheist?

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 7:09 PM

catholocism believes in a theistic evolution…which isn’t what evolution is.

evolution is totally atheistic, as its followers…even MILLER, that patron saint of evolution admits…

Darwin knew that accepting his theory required believing in philosophical materialism, the conviction that matter is the stuff of all existence and that all mental and spiritual phenomena are its by-products. Darwinian evolution was not only purposeless but also heartless–a process in which the rigors of nature ruthlessly eliminate the unfit. Suddenly, humanity was reduced to just one more species in a world that cared nothing for us. The great human mind was no more than a mass of evolving neurons. Worst of all, there was no divine plan to guide us.” (Biology: Discovering Life, by Joseph S. Levine & Kenneth R. Miller (1st edition, D.C. Heath and Co., 1992), pg. 152; emphasis in original)

right4life on March 28, 2009 at 11:58 AM

Heh! wrong4life…

ronsfi on March 27, 2009 at 7:10 PM

heh meh

right4life on March 28, 2009 at 12:00 PM

Has there always been a feud between MadisonConservative and right4life?

I’m still a little new here.

FontanaConservative on March 27, 2009 at 7:48 PM

yeah madisonwacko (he’s not conservative) is a pompous little fool who doesn’t take well to being made a fool out of. he’s faux conservative, and when called on it he gets real upset, and his fat little jowls quiver and his face turns red.

especially over the issue of gay marriage…he’s a typical fascist brown shirt that wants to impose it upon the rest of us, and silence any who dare disagree…

madisonfascist is more like it..

right4life on March 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM

Actually I am more of a Punctuated Equilibrium kind of guy myself.

MB4 on March 27, 2009 at 7:03 PM

you’re admitting there is no fossil evidence for evolution…and there isn’t any. punctuated equilibirum, biological big bang…in other words, creation.

although punctuated equilibrium is part of evoluiton, it basically states evolution happened REAL fast…too fast for fossils…basically a miracle.

right4life on March 28, 2009 at 12:13 PM

Akzed, thank you for the answer and information, but the “now go away” comment was not needed as I was merely stating what I thought would bolster your assertions and asking if I was correct in my quote, I wasn’t questioning your knowledge or saying you were wrong, quite the contrary.

Liberty or Death on March 27, 2009 at 4:28 PM

Sorry Liberty, but that was directed at Terry Atheist, not you. I told him I would answer five allegations of contrdictions in the Bible, then ignore him.

Akzed on March 28, 2009 at 4:16 PM

Oh there are lots of quotes that demean women in the bible.

Terry Silver on March 27, 2009 at 4:46 PM

Prithee one citation.

AH_C on March 28, 2009 at 5:19 PM

{5 minutes into the future}
.
{a knock-knock-knock at the doors of all who posted on this topic}
.
.
.
you answer the door to your home…..3 men with blue helmets appear…”sir, please come with me, you are under arrest for breaking UN Human Rights Council Order No. 431260!”
.

JeffVader on March 30, 2009 at 3:28 AM

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