Police video shows disturbing response to teen assault, plus poll
posted at 2:17 pm on March 1, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
Any of us who have parented teenagers know how frustrating they can be, and one has to imagine that police officers know that better than most. Most of the time, they react better than Deputy Paul Schene did in this video, after a 15-year-old girl responded to a demand that she remove her shoes by flipping one at Schene. He then charged into the cell and now faces criminal prosecution (via QandO):
The video shows Schene and Brunner as they escorted the girl into the holding cell. Schene had asked her to remove her basketball shoes, and, as she slipped out of her left shoe, she appeared to kick it at Schene.
Schene then lunged through the door and kicked her, striking either her stomach or upper thigh area, court documents say. He pushed her against a corner wall before flinging her to the floor by her hair. He then squatted down on her and made “two overhead strikes,” although it’s unclear where the blows landed.
The detective who reviewed the video said it appeared Schene and Brunner had the girl under control when Schene struck her. Schene, who is 6 feet 2 and weighs 195 pounds, did not explain his action to investigators, court documents say.
He and the girl exchanged words. Brunner said she was “real lippy” after being informed she was under arrest and called them “fat pigs.”
The Sheriff’s Office policy manual says deputies should use physical or deadly force only when “necessary to effect an arrest, to defend themselves or others from violence, or to otherwise accomplish police duties according to law.”
Normally, we give police a lot of leeway to control violent or obstructive arrestees, and for good reason. It’s dangerous to second-guess how an officer reacts in two ways. First, in many instances, we don’t get a chance to see the larger context, in which an officer may see a threat not depicted in later exploration of video clips. Second, it pressures law-enforcement personnel to act too passively in situations requiring greater control, leading to dangerous and even deadly incidents.
In this case, though, it’s difficult to see any context in which Schene could justify his actions. Presumably, the teen had already been searched for weapons and was in fairly firm custody at the jail. She committed an assault by flipping the shoe at Schene (and battery if she actually hit him), but she represented no threat at all, nor were there any threats in the vicinity of the secure detention facility. Even before he punched her in the head twice, Schene used an excessive level of force clearly intended for punitive action rather than to secure the girl.
The defense did not want the video released before the trial because it would “inflame public opinion”. I’d guess that would be the case, but the video is publicly owned by the Seattle taxpayers who paid for it. Would the police have released it if the video showed Schene properly reacting to a real threat? I’m betting yes.
What do Hot Air readers think? Did Schene overreact, and does he deserve prosecution?
Blowback
Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.
Trackbacks/Pings
Trackback URL
Comments
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 5 … 7 Next »
I’m embarrassed by the conservatives who have a knee-jerk reaction to defend a cop no matter what. Obviously the girl had an attitude, & just as obviously the cop viciously overreacted with brutality.
jgapinoy on March 1, 2009 at 4:36 PM
Be serious. Kicking a shoe off is not assault. Pummeling a girl to near unconsciousness and dragging her by her hair is assault, battery, brutality, and should be a felony.
Why are people saying that the cop might possibly be fired, but DEFINITELY not prosecuted? Don’t the laws apply to police as well? Why does he get a pass? What are you afraid of?
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 4:40 PM
I’m nasty when people get in my face, or when lefty trolls come to parlay, or when people sit on this site and whine about being on this site. I’m no angel to those who like to push me, that’s for sure. The rest of the time I offer my opinion to the pot, and attempt actual debate and discussion.
You on the other hand, are regularly bullying, insulting, browbeating and condescending. I don’t see you post another way. In other words, you are the textual equivalent of the cop in the video: beating people up for flicking a shoe in your direction. Like I say, consistent.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 4:40 PM
FTFY. You obviously believe any response is justifiable as long as the po wittle officer is diswespected.
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 4:40 PM
The cop needs to be fired and that girl is lucky to be alive.
A series of blows delivered to the head (especially when the head is resting against a concrete floor) can kill.
Mike Honcho on March 1, 2009 at 4:41 PM
You know what I think is a real police brutality. It’s the way cops treat the guy after a long car chase. They obviously enjoyed it, but they toss the guy around like a sack of rotten potatoes. Don’t most cops join the force in the hopes of car chases, because that’s the most appeal aspect of the job to me. It’s like beating up your girlfriend after great sex.
DFCtomm on March 1, 2009 at 4:42 PM
Amen. Half the time, I’m wondering if those so-called “conservatives” who always defend police brutality are just trolls or something. If they are conservatives, they’re not using their brains, that’s for sure, but are merely emoting. That’s why I want to know what they’re afraid of. People shouldn’t be so quick to defend the cops.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 4:42 PM
And I’m embarrassed by anyone who has a knee-jerk reaction to convict a cop no matter what. And for the reasons I’ve already stated, you have no idea if the police officer “viciously overreacted with brutality.” But, since you insist he did, what were the juvenile’s injuries?
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 4:42 PM
You bore the hell out of me. You are constantly trying to pick fights with me or other people here. You are best ignored.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 4:44 PM
I didn’t go through all 2+ pages of the thread, but just want to say if that were my daughter then Schene would be shopping for a doctor with a very liberal attitude toward narcotics-based painkillers.
Schene needs to find a new line of work after he serves a prison sentence for assault.
JohnTant on March 1, 2009 at 4:45 PM
The I don’t know why people are getting upset about the second officer. Was he supposed to jump his partner, arrest him for brutality and let the girl escape out the cell door?
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 4:45 PM
Right. People who disagree with you are one, not conservatives, and two, trolls. And you accuse others of not using their brains???
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 4:46 PM
If this had happened to my daughter she would have gotten an ass-whuppin’ from me but the cop had better give his soul to the Lord ’cause his ass is mine!!!!!
thomasaur on March 1, 2009 at 4:47 PM
Let’s get this straight:
I’ve been a policeman for 30 years. People say asinine things all the time. Rule number one: you don’t let the morons get to you. If an officer has to beat up a person who is already in custody and in a jail cell just because he/she “said something” the officer didn’t like, that officer has no business being a cop. An offender’s “speech” may be offensive, but it’s also not resistance or any other threat to the officer. You don’t exact revenge for mere words that offend you, which is what happened here.
Last time I looked (and I still look pretty often) the job description says nothing about meting out punishment, making your fists, stick, or gun have the “last word,” or otherwise making up for getting beat up in the schoolyard years ago. There’s simply no room for thugs in police work.
As for the poll, I didn’t take it because I resent the “police brutality” label on what would have been my choice, but this guy should be fired, charged and convicted.
n0doz on March 1, 2009 at 4:47 PM
A good ass kickin never hurt anybody, but I despise any man who strikes a woman.
Mike Honcho, love it.
ambuldog on March 1, 2009 at 4:47 PM
Blake, are you so deluded that you can’t see what is clearly in this video? The officer slammed her head against the wall, then the floor, then punched her twice, then dragged her out of the room by her hair. If that’s not an injury, nothing is. That’s the reality. Deal with it.
Is there ever a situation where you won’t defend the cop? If so, please enlighten me. So far, you appear to justify all sorts of stuff that would even shock the North Koreans. For the record, this is America, not Stalist Russia. Juries convict people after a fair trial in which they are presumed innocent. Cops are not judges, juries, and executioners. Last time I checked.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 4:49 PM
Which is exactly why you will probably never be in this situation. I suspect the girls home life is a wreck, and if she makes anything of herself at all it will be a testament to her, and not her parents.
DFCtomm on March 1, 2009 at 4:49 PM
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 4:40 PM.
What’s the topic? I see 3 “Yous” in the above.
BowHuntingTexas on March 1, 2009 at 4:49 PM
What could she have possibly said to have deserved the beating se got?
So I can beat my wife or daughter if they lip off to me as long as I don’t leave any bad bruises?
Tomblvd on March 1, 2009 at 4:50 PM
As one of those people let me say I freely admit I don’t know what the partner is supposed to do in those situations, but I’m sure it’s not “nothing.” Since there’s no audio, I should probably reserve judgment. If Brunner is even saying Schene’s name repeatedly in a firm manner, as if trying to snap him out of it, he’s in far better shape than Schene.
DrSteve on March 1, 2009 at 4:51 PM
Fine. You’re the expert, then. Please explain to everyone how this cop’s actions were justified, given that he could’ve just closed the door. Why was it necessary to slam her head not once, into the wall, not twice, into the floor, but 4 times, by punching her an additional 2 times? Why was it necessary, and indeed, a reasonable use of force to drag her out of the room by her hair?
I’m sure a jury would be very interested to hear your opinion.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 4:51 PM
The really sad thing here is that we have a 15 year old criminal that is probably going to get away with what she did with a nice payout.
Nice going officer.
Tomblvd on March 1, 2009 at 4:52 PM
Not politically correct but I take a certain pleasure in watching a fifteen year old car thief with no manners or respect for the law get a wake up call. Kids know that they can get away with anything these days, which is why they behave so badly. I’m a teacher and kids will say and do anything in a classroom now because they know there will be no repercussions. I all for taking the power back from snot-nosed, ignorant disrespectful kids and I’m all for doing it with an iron fist.
pleaseandthankyou on March 1, 2009 at 4:53 PM
That will happen again, and again, and again, the more that idiots defend this cop. Don’t want criminals to get large payouts? Then don’t defend brutal cops.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 4:53 PM
The inevitable topic was always going to be those who, without fetter, heartily defended this valiant cops’ actions against this clearly homicidal teen siren attempting to flick their shins to death.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 4:54 PM
There’s what was “actually” happening. The police officer was scared not only for his and his partner’s lives, he was concerned that the girl was suicidal and was checking to see if she had a razor blade on her.
Move on. Nothing to see here.
davidk on March 1, 2009 at 4:55 PM
Bully and coward. Fire and prosecute.
Mason on March 1, 2009 at 4:56 PM
QFT.
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 4:56 PM
To save her, he had to nearly beat her to death? Yeah, I’m sure a jury will believe that. Officer McFriendly, brutally making sure you don’t kill yourself.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 4:56 PM
Both cops should be fired.
Police have a duty to serve and protect,, as the old motto goes. Would be interesting to know what oath they take, if any. This woman was assaulted in full view of the other officer, and he did nothing to assist her. They both should be brought up on charges! They both should be fired.
An officers responsibility is to serve and protect the public,,, not cover for his buddy.
This is pure brutality. This girl was already in a holding cell. She was already restrained. Imagine if this video did not exist. Would we ever know? She could have been killed.
Her word against theirs.
I am a big supporter of police. They have one of the toughest jobs in the world. But this kind of thing can never be tolerated.
JellyToast on March 1, 2009 at 4:57 PM
What happened? Still fuming over a speeding ticket you got 30 years ago? You’re the one who is deluded, pal. You apparently see what is not in the video.
Uh, dumbass, since this is America, police officers have constitutional rights, too. You are the one who wants to deny this officer the right to a fair trial without hearing any evidence. And, no, there is a lot that is not in the tape, can not be visualized in the tape, and is not illegal even though you, in all your police and legal expertise have pronounced illegal. Will you be testifying as an expert at trial? lol!
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 4:57 PM
Answer by question.
FAIL.
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 4:58 PM
Didn’t Dave Chapelle do an entire public service video on how not to get beat up by the cops? Obviously this girl was not a Chapelle fan.
The cop definitely went too far in subduing her. And she obviously has a little too much teen angst or whatever they are calling it these days. Put the cop on a probationary period and watch him, if he does anything at all out of line, can his butt. As for the girl, depending on what she was arrested for, drop the charges and let her go with a valuable life lesson…yes she has freedom of speech and can say pretty much anything to anybody…but sometimes it’s a whole lot wiser to keep that smart mouth shut.
BadMojo on March 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM
Right. And using his fist to beat on her was ummm…a method of heavily patting her down? Grabbing her by the hair and putting her on the ground was checking to make sure no razors were hidden in her scalp?
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM
You’re a sly one davidk, I think, truth is we get so many wacky posts on AP’s little “blue bomb” videos that I can’t for sure tell if it’s sarcasm.
DFCtomm on March 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM
You’re not wrong. I misinterpreted a post once and was bullied. Even after apologizing for my confusion, no let up. I steer away. I am chicken.
Cindy Munford on March 1, 2009 at 5:00 PM
…and he says I’m the one picking fights with people.
Heh.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:00 PM
So what should he have done?
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:00 PM
I see. And the valuable life lesson is…cops are thugs with hair-trigger tempers and you have no recourse if one of them beats you needlessly?
Brilliant.
/s
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 5:00 PM
Patience. Eventually they go too far, like the cop. Then action is taken.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:01 PM
That was Chris Rock. “How Not To Get Your Ass Beat By Police”.
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:01 PM
Dude! He starts by kicking her and follows up with a punch to the face. When in custody you are completely at the mercy of the guards. Any abuse should be punished to the full extent and outright assault should be no exception. The second guard should be prosecuted as well for not intervening in the brutal assault of a child in his charge. DISGUSTING!
ronsfi on March 1, 2009 at 5:01 PM
This police officer was way over the line. I think he needs to be prosecuted and certainly removed from the force.
Cindy Munford on March 1, 2009 at 5:02 PM
Remember the good old days when you saw a cop car and smiled and waved rather than cringed and felt your spine tingle?
Nope, I don’t either.
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 5:03 PM
What in the video did I not see? I’ll review it for you: I saw her kick her shoe off in his direction, which touched him. I saw that the force she used to kick the shoe off was extremely light. Her arms were crossed, and she was proceeding to take off the other shoe when she was suddenly manhandled by the cop, slammed against the back wall, slammed to the floor, pinned down, punched once, punched again, and then dragged to her feet by her hair.
Now, what did I miss that you see?
Uh, dumbass, since this is America, police officers have constitutional rights, too. You are the one who wants to deny this officer the right to a fair trial without hearing any evidence. And, no, there is a lot that is not in the tape, can not be visualized in the tape, and is not illegal even though you, in all your police and legal expertise have pronounced illegal. Will you be testifying as an expert at trial? lol!
Where did I say he doesn’t deserve a trial? I said his actions were obviously illegal. Go ahead, give him a trial. Any jury in the world will convict. I don’t fear that at all. Let him try to explain himself. Let him say he was insulted. Let him say spin and excuse and say whatever he wants. The evidence is overwhelming.
Do you think society would be better off of this cop’s actions not only didn’t go unpunished, but were praised? Should he get a medal for this?
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:03 PM
Dear Sydney,
Thanks for the lecture. I hate criminals. I also hate people like yourself who defend the rights of criminals over and above the rights of victims. You are correct that this is technically against the law but I still hate criminals and I take great pleasure in watching them get their ass kicked. So I say Bravo to the officer. If I found that girl stealing my car I would have given her the same treatment. Or worse.
pleaseandthankyou on March 1, 2009 at 5:04 PM
As I already said, jerkoff, I am not an expert in police use of force and neither are you and others. I do know from experience that tapes of this nature can be deceptive and if it goes to trial, they will call a use of force expert. It’s questionable that her head was slammed against anything. It is questionable that she was punched. It’s questionable if he used unapproved police procedures. But who am I to argue with someone as delusional and hates the police as much as you? Unlike you and others, I am more than happy to wait for the trial. You, otoh, already have the rope and tree picked out.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 5:05 PM
It was indeed sarcasm.
Just use “Find on this page …” with my name to see how I really feel.
(Blake, you’re a doofus.)
davidk on March 1, 2009 at 5:05 PM
No I was thinking more along the lines of not walking down the road in a bad part of town screaming racial epithets and expecting to not get your arse kicked or worse.
Or possible flipping the bird to that cop pulling radar duty on the side of the road and yelling PIG, and expecting not to get pulled over and hassled.
Or to look to the very near future…to criticize Barry O’s policies and not expect to be sent to reeducation camp!
/s (hopefully the tag wasn’t necessary)
BadMojo on March 1, 2009 at 5:05 PM
If the cop did something against the law, then he’s a criminal. So why don’t you hate him?
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:05 PM
I have three daughters and a stepdaughter. I completely understand how this happened. They sure know how to push your buttons. It takes maturity and self discipline not to lash out against their nasty little provocations–the kind of maturity and self discipline a parent or a law enforcement officer is expected to have as a condition of their authority.
This officer crossed a line. That line is more starkly apparent to the police than it is to any other group of people, because they deal with it every day and are schooled extensively on where that line is. That fact makes it less forgivable, not more, for a policeman to resort to unwarranted violence.
He needs to be fire, prosecuted, and prevented from ever working a job that gives him authority over others again. He doesn’t need to be a teacher or a rent-a-cop or even a crossing guard. He also needs to learn a little lesson from a real cop about why he shouldn’t have done that.
Immolate on March 1, 2009 at 5:06 PM
T
I thank you for the correction good sir!
BadMojo on March 1, 2009 at 5:07 PM
Sure, fifty years ago, when I was five.
Cindy Munford on March 1, 2009 at 5:07 PM
Some questions are too stupid to answer.
LOSER.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 5:08 PM
Umm, maybe serve and protect the little girl? Just a thought.
davidk on March 1, 2009 at 5:09 PM
Very well said!!!
What also is the definition of reasonable force??? A small teenage girl put in a cell, told to remove her shoes and complies by flipping them off through the small opening in the door,,, possibly hits and officer,, possibly not. We do not know. Were these officers threatened??? I agree,, all they had to do to further restrain her and protect themselves was shut the door!!
This beating was nothing more than punishment!! They could have written up another citation for assault of an officer if they had wanted to. The beating was not about getting her under control,, it was about punishing her!!
JellyToast on March 1, 2009 at 5:09 PM
I think the doofuses are those of you who are willing to convict this police officer without substantial evidence. And don’t tell me about the damn tape. As I said over and over again, unless you can blow up the tape and put it in slo-mo and have a police use of force expert testify as to what happened, you don’t know what the hell you are talking about. Not that it stops most people here.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 5:11 PM
I still smile at cops and wave. I’m glad they’re there.
progressoverpeace on March 1, 2009 at 5:11 PM
I have to apologize. I just realized that Ed posted this blue bomb and not AP. I am a bit surprised. Cudos to you Ed way stir the pot on a sleepy Sunday.
DFCtomm on March 1, 2009 at 5:13 PM
I’m not so sure. Did you read the article posted on the Goldwater thread by Jenfidel: The Jacksonian Tradition?
This quote stood out:
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:14 PM
Listen to yourself: hate, hate, hate. You are mastered by Hate. Don’t you think you’d be better off if you let it go? Wouldn’t you rather have justice, instead of vengeance?
This is what I’m getting at by asking what people who defend the cops are afraid of. You are practically screaming your fear that society will be overrun by criminals. It won’t. Don’t be a coward. The protections we give to criminals are there for a reason. If you don’t understand that, then you need to do a little more reading and a lot less emoting.
Of course I don’t like people who break the law. And I know plenty about that. I’ve had a gun put in my face by a gangbanger, who was trying to impress his friends. My stuff has been stolen too, and my aunt was killed by a drunk driver. This is not about liking crime or criminals, it’s about respect for the law.
The officer is not above the law, period.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:14 PM
Actually the license plate on my motorcycle reads “PIG”.
Never had a cop give me any trouble, and have had quite a few give me grin and a thumbs up. Of course maybe they thought I was an off duty cop…dang pigs! ;)
BadMojo on March 1, 2009 at 5:15 PM
No I mean what specifically should he have done? Should he have jumped his partner right away? Slam the door shut first? Arrested him after the subject was handcuffed?
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:16 PM
Honestly, I do. I remember when it stopped, too. I was walking home from school in maybe 8th grade. We split off at a corner, and from a distance of about 20 feet, we flipped each other off. I heard a squad car squawk, and the car pulled into a driveway, cutting me off on the sidewalk.
I had never had a record with the police except for the one time I turned in a wallet full of money that I found, as well as one time my life was threatened by a couple of guys 5 years and 50+ pounds bigger than me.
He bawled me out for flipping off my friend, and stated he was thinking of giving me a ticket for indecent exposure. I wasn’t smart, I wasn’t insolent. He didn’t lay a hand on me, but he kept me from going anywhere. Confused as hell, and seeing that he wasn’t going to get the fight out of me that I think he wanted, he gave up and left, with a warning to watch myself.
I still don’t see the majority of cops as bad, and in general I dislike people that do. However, I know that there is a pretty big minority of them that are bitter power-trippers.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:17 PM
“DON’T CONFUSE ME WITH THE FACTS DAMMIT!”
Blake, I suppose in your possible world, pulling up a handcuffed girl by her hair could be interpreted as an act of kindness, but not in my world.
I’m all for a trial by this man’s peers. And with you on the jury. That bully thug had better hope a forensic film expert can see something on that film I’m not seeing.
davidk on March 1, 2009 at 5:19 PM
I knew that question would be coming. The answer is that I don’t believe in moral relativism. That’s the same argument as the one that says the United States are terrorists just like real terrorists because we have to go to war against them to stop them from committing acts of terror. I believe in good guys and bad guys. For the most part, cops are the good guys, and car thiefs and thugs are the bad guys. Those who draw moral equivalency are contributing to a culture of weakness and appeasement.
pleaseandthankyou on March 1, 2009 at 5:20 PM
These spoiled little brats, let them eat a few knuckles and they will learn that you respect authority…I did raise two teenagers, and they would have never done anything even remotely like that…they learned real quick the consequences of being a “smart-ass”.
Honor students, law review, attorneys…and respectful citizens. Respectful for the cleaning women in the office, to the president of the company.
Ask them, they would tell you, to disrespect authority like that, was like committing suicide…I would have let them rot in jail till they learned the “rules”…respect first and foremost, and hold your tongue and attitude.
And they are forever grateful for the lessons…respect baby, if not, then pay you “takes your chances”.
right2bright on March 1, 2009 at 5:22 PM
He doesn’t. I just don’t think he should lose his career to some b!tch. If he got disciplined, but no charges, it’d teach her not to mouth off to cops.
I was arrested and later let go without any charges being pressed. Not once did I say a nasty word to the cops. I just said, “I’ll deal with this issue in court.”
Tim Burton on March 1, 2009 at 5:23 PM
If a regular guy, and not a cop, had done what the cop did to that girl, you’d see it as a crime. When the cop does it, you don’t.
I don’t think you understand what moral relativism is, because that attitude makes you a moral relativist.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:23 PM
If you’re so interested in a use of force expert, perhaps you should listen to judges who have written opinions when the use of force is NOT appropriate. Here’s an opinion, for starters. Westlaw, Lexis, Google, Findlaw, etc. are your friend.
You seem to assume that an expert’s opinion at trial is determinative. I assure you, it’s not. An expert who cannot provide a reason for an opinion will be dismissed and his status as an expert revoked. Even if an expert has a reason for his opinion, a jury is free to accept or reject it as they see fit, and determine his credibility just as they would any other piece of evidence. It is permissible and appropriate for juries to give more weight to evidence they determine credible (such as a videotape) than evidence they might not determine credible (like an expert).
That’s democracy. Deal with it.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:24 PM
I agree.
The cop in the above video is not included in that most part. He is in the small part that are criminals who abuse the power given to them by us, the citizens.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:24 PM
Your kneejerk namecalling directed at anyone who disagrees with you speaks volumes about your lack of character and self control.
You’re an internet warrior, probably sitting in your mom’s basement, all too tough when you don’t have to face the people you wantonly insult and bully.
In other words, human debris.
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 5:25 PM
I apologize for the rudeness toward you.
That is a really tough situation to be in. The first thing he could have done is place himself between the bully and the victim.
I’ve done that a few times and it has always defused the conflict. I’m not saying it would always, but it’s worked for me.
davidk on March 1, 2009 at 5:26 PM
Me, too, & when I encounter one face-to-face, I thank him for his service. So I don’t have an ax to grind against police in general.
But the thug on this video needs to be prosecuted.
jgapinoy on March 1, 2009 at 5:26 PM
Thank you.
Fair enough.
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:27 PM
Sydney,
Like it or not your attitude facilitates and leads to more crime. IMHO. By the way, I’m not saying that the cop should be above the law. I’m just saying that I enjoy watching that girl-thug get some payback. He was finally speaking in a language she could understand.
pleaseandthankyou on March 1, 2009 at 5:29 PM
The cop in that video should consider himself lucky if all he looses is his job and not his freedom behind bars as well.
Yakko77 on March 1, 2009 at 5:30 PM
Normally, I give cops the benefit of the doubt until all the information comes out.However, what this guy did was way, waaaaaaaaaay over the line.
That shoe was no threat to that cop, and I am assuming she was not armed.
I think he should go straight to prison.
-Dave
Dave R. on March 1, 2009 at 5:31 PM
My God, you’re sick.
fossten on March 1, 2009 at 5:31 PM
I believe in good guys and bad guys too. But apparently in your world, you think that there’s no such thing as a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Life isn’t as simple as that. There are such things as BAD COPS. They have to be punished. It’s the highest value to uphold the law, and goodness and decency, by punishing those who violate their sworn oath to uphold it by becoming the criminals that they’re supposed to oppose.
This isn’t a case of people saying “cops are just the same as criminals.” This is a case where people are saying “this cop is definitely a criminal.”
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:32 PM
This would not have been appropriate in this situation, but sometimes humor helps.
Once, when I was a schoolbus driver, I had this big high school football player get in my face. I said, “Well, we can get it in right here. Then you can tell your friends how an old man kicked your ass or how you kicked an old man’s ass. Either way, it’s not much to brag about to your friends.”
The snicker from the other students took the wind out of his sails.
davidk on March 1, 2009 at 5:36 PM
It has long been my opinion that people who rush to the ‘police brutality’ judgement should be placed in charge of policing their own neighborhoods.
The girl was no lady, no one knows what happened before the cops retaliated, and it certainly doesn’t appear that they did any real harm.
Schene has yet to be proven overzealous to me but then again I’m a real American who believes in any persons innocence without solid proof of guilt.
DannoJyd on March 1, 2009 at 5:37 PM
My attitude punishes all the guilty. Yours excuses vengeance, and encourages people taking the law into their own hands (again, this cop is not a judge, jury and executioner). I think that your attitude leads to more crime, frankly.
Payback? For what? For her attitude? You want people beaten for that?
Why? How do you know so much about this girl that you’re HAPPY about a brutal attack that occurred when she was completely helpless? What is wrong with you? Are you a sadist?
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:38 PM
Here is the Chris Rock sketch with a strong profanity warning:
How Not To Get Your Ass Kicked By The Police
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:38 PM
Heh!
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:38 PM
Well, maybe at some point,, as he watched his buddy grab the victim by her hair, slam her head against the wall and then throw her to the floor and pound her on the head a few times,,, maybe at some point,, realizing it would have taken a little courage,,, but perhaps somewhere there he could have said something like,,, ohh, I don’t know,, like “STOP!” Maybe he could have reached out and put his hand on the assaulting officers shoulder,, or grabbed his arm and made some kind of attempt to intervene. Since the victim’s face was smashed into the wall and floor,, she never would have noticed the other officer intervening,, so therefor it would have been,, you know,, discreet!!
I ask,, how far along should another officer go before intervening???? When a citizen is assaulted by an officer of the law,, when an officer abuses their authority in the presence of other officers,, at what point should another officer have to take responsibility to intervene on behalf of the victim????? Where can a victim turn when the criminal is a police officer and the crime is being committed in full view of other officers?????
Would it have been OK for this other officer to just watch and assist had the assaulting officer pulled out his night stick and beat her over the head until skull cracked opened and her brains exploded????
Police are under a lot of needless pressure today. They have to keep arresting the same crooks over and over due to a liberal justice system. Most are under paid. They have a very dangerous and stressful job. I personally believe they should have more authority than they do.
But for all the problems they face, all the dangers and stress,,, it will never be enough to justify brutalizing and beating a 15 year old girl for casually flipping a sneaker out her cell door.
JellyToast on March 1, 2009 at 5:39 PM
You appear to have missed the obvious: Having reviewed the video several times at various speeds and considered the testimony of the witnesses as the videotape was reviewed at trial, we find the video does not unambiguously indicate knee strikes against the driver’s head.
But, they are not yours.
It’s determinative over your opinion. And since police procedures are backed up by written records, policies, manuals, etc., yeah, I think they are pretty much determinative. If a DA argues that the defendant did not follow police procedures when the evidence is that he clearly did, any conviction will be overturned.
No, that’s appellate law. Stay away from it. You are as out to lunch on that as you are as to police procedures and use of force cases.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 5:41 PM
You shouldn’t ask that question on this blog. God knows that there are morons here who’d defend even that. Because “she deserved it” or something stupid like that.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:42 PM
Yeah, I don’t see how having a shoe kicked at you can justify this, and considering the perp was already in the cell.
aikidoka on March 1, 2009 at 5:43 PM
No, I wouldn’t see it as a crime. I see it as a girl going to school on how not to provoke a regular guy who is twice her size. And if she stole the regular guy’s car, and got caught by the regular guy…all bets are off. Only crime I see is the one that started it all. Lesson #1: Don’t steal cars. Lesson #2 Don’t mouth off to a guy who can kick your ass. These are good lessons.
Moral relativism is taking the stance that brutality is never justified, no matter what the circumstances. If you take the good guys power away to dish out some punishment them you have emboldened the criminals to commit more crime. That’s why you have police chases that last 3 hours through the streets of LA. Criminals taking the good guys for a 3 hour ride, for all the world to see on national TV. It’s pathetic. Those car chases should be over in 30 seconds. You’ld see a lot less of them. That’s how it works. Speak their language.
pleaseandthankyou on March 1, 2009 at 5:44 PM
(rolls eyes)…
We find the initial shove of the driver was unnecessary and provocative. We also find Peterson made at least one knee strike against the driver’s head during the incident.
The Cedar Rapids Police Department’s training provides for a continuum of types of force which may be used depending on the circumstances. The use of a knee strike falls in the “active countermeasures” section of the “intermediate level compliance” in types of force. The head and neck are included in “no strike zones,” reserved for higher levels of force because of the danger of severe injury or death. Iowa Code section 804.8 allows an officer to use “any force which the peace officer reasonably believes to be necessary to effect the arrest or to defend any person from bodily harm while making the arrest.” This is an objective standard. Chelf v. Civil Serv. Comm’n, 515 N.W.2d 353, 356 (Iowa Ct. App. 1994). We conclude the force used by Peterson in the incident was excessive and constituted misconduct. In arriving at this conclusion, we have given more weight to the testimony of the two officers at the scene than to Peterson’s changing accounts of the incident.
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:44 PM
If you and others can’t take it, don’t dish it out. Or, at least have the decency to not whine about it.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 5:47 PM
You seem to assume that police procedures state that officers are permitted to strike helplessly restrained individuals twice with clenched fists. I’d love to see a policy that say that’s permitted.
As I said, the evidence here is overwhelming.
Why is it terrible if you’re wrong? You keep fighting and fighting over this cop, like you’re his brother or something. What will you lose if he’s convicted and sent away? Your attitude indicates you’d think the jury would’ve gotten it wrong. So I don’t think you’re so keen on trials and justice. You want your results, don’t you? You want him to walk free, don’t you? Why?
Sydney Carton on March 1, 2009 at 5:48 PM
I’ll agree. On the other hand, show this video around and wise-ass kids might change how they deal with cops…
TinMan13 on March 1, 2009 at 5:49 PM
Don’t you know? Why, you certasinly do not and that is why you shouldn’t judge without all of the facts.
IMHO, a few well placed hits can do wonders for changing the attitude of ignorant people, teens included, and it isn’t as if she was beaten senseless … This time!
DannoJyd on March 1, 2009 at 5:49 PM
Exactly. When a regular person does it, you see it as a crime. When a cop does it, you see it as not a crime.
That’s moral relativism, bud. Crime is crime, no matter who does it.
That’s also a pretty sick abdication to authority you’re promoting, I have to say.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:49 PM
Boy, you sure seem to be fighting a lot of people. I thought I was the one starting fights.
MadisonConservative on March 1, 2009 at 5:50 PM
Eyeroll yourself. I didn’t think you were intelligent enough to understand the issue. And you didn’t disappoint me, either.
Blake on March 1, 2009 at 5:50 PM
I’m not trying to justify it. I just think it might be problematic for the second cop to intervene before the suspect had been handcuffed. The two fisted punches to the head of the handcuffed suspect were gratuitous in the extreme.
aengus on March 1, 2009 at 5:52 PM
SPI reports the girl in question was the passenger. However, she was also related to the owner of the car. Siblings?
Anyway, read the articles in the local paper about Schene’s overall behavior in the incident, and look at the extended video. He knocked the wind out of her and told the EMS dudes it was a “panic attack.”
DrSteve on March 1, 2009 at 5:54 PM
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 5 … 7 Next »