Should the Pope deny communion to Pelosi for being pro-choice?
posted at 3:08 pm on February 17, 2009 by Allahpundit
Some Catholics say yes, most — I assume — would say no. It’s a pointless debate since it’ll never happen, but intriguing insofar as the weight of authority does seem to be on the side of denial.
As LifeNews.com reported, Pelosi, one of the top pro-abortion Catholics in elected office in the United States, will meet with Pope on Wednesday…
Jeff Jones, of the Catholic web site Pewsitter, is organizing the petition “requesting the Catholic Bishops of the United States to withhold Communion from her and other prominent Catholics in public life that obstinately persist in their dissent from Catholic teaching on serious moral issues.”…
Jones says Church teachings call Catholics like him to action.
“Most Catholics don’t know that in addition to Canon 915, Canon law also compels Catholics to take action,” Jones says. He says Canon 212 S3 requires lay Catholics to urge Church leaders to action.
Here’s Canon 915, withholding communion from those “obstinately persevering in manifest grave sin.” The defense, presumably, is that participating in abortion might be a sin but merely supporting laws that legalize the practice doesn’t quite rise to that level. The Pope’s been cool to that argument in the past, declaring in 2007 that Catholic legislators should take care to base their laws on “values grounded in human nature,” which includes respect for life, and then upping the ante a few months later by endorsing the excommunication of leftist Mexican parliamentarians for passing an abortion law. The Vatican quickly and quietly cleaned up the latter remarks to make his approval more ambiguous, though, which demonstrates how reluctant Benedict is to push his rhetoric beyond the mere hortatory. If he makes an example of Pelosi, he’ll alienate Catholic Democrats (and their donations) and touch off a global panic about Catholic politicians having to take their marching orders from Rome. Which is why, I suspect, the worst she’ll have to suffer during their tete a tete is a vague lecture on the importance of informing law with morality.
Look at it this way: If he had some huge problem with her, he wouldn’t be giving her an audience. Exit question: Doesn’t the Gospel according to St. Nancy explicitly endorse abortion?
Update (Ed): I’d say that the Pope should deny her communion, for reasons I’ve outlined in several posts over the last few months. It’s pretty difficult to reconcile paragraphs 2271-4 and 2322 of the catechism with Pelosi’s support of abortion rights, especially 2272:
Formal cooperation in an abortion constitutes a grave offense. The Church attaches the canonical penalty of excommunication to this crime against human life. “A person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae,”77 “by the very commission of the offense,”78 and subject to the conditions provided by Canon Law.79 The Church does not thereby intend to restrict the scope of mercy. Rather, she makes clear the gravity of the crime committed, the irreparable harm done to the innocent who is put to death, as well as to the parents and the whole of society.
Excommunication means, quite literally, “no communion”. The question will be whether the Pope considers Pelosi’s push for abortion rights “formal cooperation”, an interpretation increasingly popular with American bishops tired of Catholics supporting abortions. If he doesn’t, the Pope will send a signal that participating in the legalization of abortion carries no consequences, an odd signal for this Pope in particular to send.
Blowback
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Jenfidel:
You’re funny!
IntheNet on February 17, 2009 at 3:38 PM
Wow, a catholic basher. I assume you have those who are Jew, or Luthern, or other.
Stop… you are a man, not God and you have nothing to say to me.
upinak on February 17, 2009 at 3:38 PM
Dear Pope,
Pelosi is very bad for the American people, both the born and unborn. Please, Please keep her there for the next 20 years until she’s had a chance to repent.
Love,
TN Mom
TN Mom on February 17, 2009 at 3:38 PM
The Catholic Church gave up on the Inquisition centuries ago. Were it still going on, I know The Harpy Harridan would make a great victim.
SeniorD on February 17, 2009 at 3:38 PM
THeo, who said anything about “moral authority”. The RCC, as a private organization can determine how they react and treat a member of their organization. Right or wrong, it is their right.
What does “moral authority” have to do with it?
Marking Time on February 17, 2009 at 3:39 PM
Pelosi’s Doctor should deny her Botox as well
jp on February 17, 2009 at 3:39 PM
I don’t care what the Catholic pope does about this or almost any other thing.
It’s not like he matters to me.
SarahW on February 17, 2009 at 3:39 PM
http://pewforum.org/news/display.php?NewsID=16664
Right here, it’s split evenly, which is still pretty bad:
http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0805226.htm
But, of course, Obama claims to be pro-life, just like every other pro-abortion politician, saying, “we want to make abortion less common.” But, considering their 100% NARAL rating, I have the feeling they are being disingenuous.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:40 PM
TTheo is a Catholic hating reject. Probably hates the JUICE too.
Ugh.
Allah.. good post, though. To bad it has to go this way.
upinak on February 17, 2009 at 3:40 PM
I’m not sure what would freak me out more, a wide-eyed Nan or a wrinkled Nan. Ugh…
genso on February 17, 2009 at 3:40 PM
I think the Catholic church has a complete right to decide their doctrinal issues. I’m just saying the idea that this denies a person entrance to heaven is laudable.
But, at least they are bringing back indulgences, as a post on here indicated recently, so I guess they can get to heaven another way.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:41 PM
Yeah, I get labeled a “Catholic Basher” because I actually quote the Catholic Church’s official dogmas, decrees and doctrines.
What I have posted so far that is so offensive to you?
Apparently, since none of us here is God, you are wasting your time reading any posts. I am not offering my “opinion” of what Rome teaches, I quote their own words (directly or in paraphrase). If doing that is akin to “bashing” them… well, that’s simply insane.
mankai on February 17, 2009 at 3:41 PM
Good points.
It’s different for Protestants. Most churches I’ve been to have “quality control” only by keep communion just to members, but some open them up to everyone.
Though I do wonder, if it’s true that Democrats who vote for pro-choicers can risk excommunication, why wouldn’t it be applied to Pelosi as well?
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 3:41 PM
I don’t believe in kicking someone out of their religion but he should ask her to repent before she takes communion ever again. I think you must come to the table with a pure heart, even if only for the moment. If she takes it with no absolution, she’s just eating bread and drinking wine anyway.
How about a trillion Hail Marys to absolve her of her sins? lol
Elektra on February 17, 2009 at 3:42 PM
Maybe I’m on huffpost after all. Upinak, did you happen to get this tactic from the proposition 8 opponents? Anyone who disagrees is a hater, and they must be attacked, right?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:42 PM
Actually most Catholics say yes. For those who do not take Catholicism seriously it probably seems inane. But if you are not going to take your religion seriously (ala Ms Pelosi) why bother to belong. Worse yet why claim to be an ardent adherent (as she does) when you publicly support policy that is in direct opposition to one your relgions main teachings? Oh wait, I forgot principles are transistory things.
pgrossjr on February 17, 2009 at 3:42 PM
Probably the best we can hope for is some remedial catechism training since it is clear she’s forgotten any she had as a child.
I don’t know if the Pope routinely offers communion to political heads that visit him but since she’s so ignorant about Catholic positions she should pass on it anyway.
katiejane on February 17, 2009 at 3:42 PM
Yep, its put up or shut up time.
darclon on February 17, 2009 at 3:43 PM
Where did you get that information? Denial of the Eucharist isn’t denial to Heaven. Only God can do that…
JetBoy on February 17, 2009 at 3:43 PM
I’m not sure he will deny her communion – even though, if he had any balls, he would. She should be excommunicated.
AubieJon on February 17, 2009 at 3:43 PM
Woops, that should be “laughable.” But it’s actually plain sad.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:43 PM
Speaking of Botox, is it just me, or does San Fran Nan look like Michael Jackson? I believe they have the same profile, must have used the same doc for all that cosmetic surgery!
Susanboo on February 17, 2009 at 3:44 PM
Or his vicar/representative on earth, the pope, and those under him, right?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:44 PM
Ahhh turning this around isn’t helping you there. Just admit you don’t care for Religon of any kind and move your happy ass on down the line.
Even Allah gave you crap and the man is not a religous guy. That to me speaks volumes concerning you.
Have a great, Religous Bashing Day, TTheo. Aren’t you glad you are in a country that lets you do this?
upinak on February 17, 2009 at 3:44 PM
No. God is God.
Abby Adams on February 17, 2009 at 3:45 PM
I say he should wait until she gets to the front of the line, then deny her. That would be sweet.
Vashta.Nerada on February 17, 2009 at 3:45 PM
Allah, you don’t get it. Jesus dined with the tax collector and he became a disciple. I can only hope that the Pope sees meeting with Pelosi as an opportunity to help her see the wrong in what she does. On the other hand, I think she will burn in hell one day for all the abortions she has enabled. I personally think they should excommunicate her ass and hold her up as an example of everything a Catholic should not be. But then again, that’s just me. And yes, the Gospel according to Nancy does indeed endorse abortion.
bloggless on February 17, 2009 at 3:45 PM
So if just voting for a pro-Choice candidate makes one “unworthy” for communion… how could actually being that candidate not warrant the same end?
mankai on February 17, 2009 at 3:46 PM
I think what really scares you is the fact that people ARE standing up for morality..and it’s about time.
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 3:46 PM
AllahPundit seems to still think that “Allah” is exclusive to Muslims, and doesn’t realize his name is blasphemous to arab Christians, so his opinion doesn’t mean much.
So let me get this straight, if I disagree with the Catholic church, I’m against all religions?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Guys, can we stop insulting her looks. She’s no Palin, but she’s not ugly. And especially in this thread, it’s inappropriate.
Surely being insulting to others is also considered a sin that should be confessed before communion.
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 3:46 PM
http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=8746
Before he became Pope Benedict XVI, Cardinal Ratzinger offered some guidance on this matter in a memorandum to the USCCB task force.6 While we await a possible post-synodal papal document, it is reasonable to assume that Ratzinger’s guidance as Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF) provides the framework for interpreting synod proposition 46, which states that bishops should exercise fortitude and prudence regarding the reception of the Eucharist by Catholic politicians who promote laws that violate the true good of persons.7 On this matter, three of Cardinal Ratzinger’s points are particularly instructive:
4. Apart from an individual’s judgment about his worthiness to present himself to receive the Holy Eucharist, the minister of Holy Communion may find himself in the situation where he must refuse to distribute Holy Communion to someone, such as in cases of a declared excommunication, a declared interdict or an obstinate persistence in manifest grave sin (cf. Canon 915).
5. Regarding the grave sin of abortion or euthanasia, when a person’s formal cooperation becomes manifest (understood, in the case of a Catholic politician, as his consistently campaigning and voting for permissive abortion and euthanasia laws), his pastor should meet with him, instructing him about the Church’s teaching, informing him that he is not to present himself for Holy Communion until he brings to an end the objective situation of sin and warning him that he will otherwise be denied the Eucharist.
6. When “these precautionary measures have not had their effect or [when] they were not possible,” and the person in question, with obstinate persistence, still presents himself to receive the Holy Eucharist, “the minister of Holy Communion must refuse to distribute it” (cf. Pontifical Council for Legislative Texts declaration “Holy Communion and Divorced, Civilly Remarried Catholics” [2000], nn. 3_4). This decision, properly speaking, is not a sanction or a penalty. Nor is the minister of Holy Communion passing judgment on the person’s subjective guilt but rather is reacting to the person’s public unworthiness to receive Holy Communion due to an objective situation of sin.8
brianjt0308 on February 17, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Yeah, they definitely stood up in November when they elected the most pro-abortion president ever.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:47 PM
It really isn’t a question of whether the Pope should excommunicate her or any other Catholic who supports, assists in, or facilitates abortion. By the act of doing any of those things, a Catholic automatically excommunicates themselves. Going to confession with one’s fingers crossed and with no intention of repenting or changing one’s ways does not give you a “free pass”…you have to actually mean it and actually try to change. Bottom line is that the Pope should deny her communion because she has already excommunicated herself.
Trafalgar on February 17, 2009 at 3:47 PM
VP,
That is a great book. I especially love the part where Scott talks about when he made the ‘mistake’ of quietly attending the Mass in the basement of the college he was teaching.
Everything in the Mass is grounded in Scripture, and he felt a strong urge to stand up during the Mass and announce in-Mass commentary of each part and the Scriptures it was grounded in like some guy working the World Series for Fox.
Wonderful story.
Sapwolf on February 17, 2009 at 3:47 PM
I think that the Pope should have Pelosi scrubbing floors and doing that work of Mother Theresa. But that work is above her pay grade… literally….
CynicalOptimist on February 17, 2009 at 3:47 PM
Yeah, the catholic church is scriptural by saying they alone can interpret scripture, add to it, and disregard portions of it, because they alone represent Christ on earth.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
There are about a Trillion reasons other than pro choice that the Pope should cite when denying this bitch the gift of communion
Viper1 on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
What??
Man, where do you get your info?
JetBoy on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
Well, if there is a definitive proof that she is not covering up molesters of young boys then obviously she has no place in the Church.
I say, go ahead.
radiofreevillage on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
Like i said i am not catholic, i really don’t know how that works. but i will tell you this, it does not matter how man judges you but how GOD judges you. I will trust GODs judgement before any man.
It is better to take refuge in the Lord than to trust in man. Psalm 118:8
Be_Aware on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
Actually, it’s even better than that. Jesus himself had communion with Judas, even knowing the entire time what was in his heart.
I would think it’s only truly harmful to Pelosi to go through with this if her heart isn’t right.
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
I’m sure AP is not familiar with the fact that the current pope said all other churches are false churches, either. AP, wouldn’t that be considered bashing?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
Some days I hate this comment thing
Viper1 on February 17, 2009 at 3:48 PM
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Go get a life.
bloggless on February 17, 2009 at 3:49 PM
Uhh, did you watch Fox news when the pope came to america recently? A priest, bishop or cardinal they were interviewing(I forget which), clearly said “The pope is the vicar of Christ”
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:50 PM
You’re a pip.
Show us where he said that…
JetBoy on February 17, 2009 at 3:50 PM
The pope should publicly excommunicate Pelosi during her audience with him and then as she and her group leaves the Vatican should have some of its best Swiss guards take Pelosi out through an unfortunate “accident”.
Grow some balls Vatican!!!!!!!!!
TheMightyQuinn on February 17, 2009 at 3:50 PM
You must be an all or nothing guy..only roughly half the country voted for him…
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 3:51 PM
At a minimum he should tell her privately that she is forbidden to take communion. If she wishes to disobey or to make the order public it is on her head. This should be a very sobering though for even a nominal believer. Momento mori.
Mason on February 17, 2009 at 3:51 PM
Just so you don’t misinterpret my disgust. Nasty spends a lot of money on the appearance crap, so she gets what she gets. She just saddled me, my kids and my grandkids with a boat load of debt. She gets what she gets.
bloggless on February 17, 2009 at 3:51 PM
I am Catholic and Nazi Pelosi should NOT RECEIVE COMMUNION…
Pmb09 on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
Like Allah said..this guys a bomb thrower..no substance to back himself
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
Please everyone, just ignore TTheologan. He has no idea what he’s talking about regarding the teachings or the principles of the Catholic church and, while his willingness to display his ignorance is good for a laugh for a little while, it’s become boring very quickly.
Trafalgar on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
So you see nothing wrong with insulting her over nothing more than her looks even though you think the Pope should be trying to save her.
Got it. I won’t bother with you again. Insult away and don’t let anyone tell you that Jesus doesn’t like it.
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
Esthier, I appreciate your comments. I don’t agree with anything Pelosi stands for but to condemn her physical appearance is going too far.
sherry on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
So how exactly does “Vicar of Christ” translate to “has the power to deny access to Heaven”?
You’re ignorance of the Catholic Church is astounding. Whatever, I give up. Carry on.
JetBoy on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
I know the Church is all for forgiveness and reaching out to the stray sheep, but sometimes you gotta make an example outta someone. The bishops don’t seem to be so reluctant to call out conservative politicians, but they get all reticent about libs. Maybe its because conservatives don’t usually stray into excommunicable offenses its easier to throw ‘em a smack or something.
Iblis on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,288841,00.html
Come on Jetboy, have you been living under a rock?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
Mememto mori, sorry.
Mason on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
There are no words to describe how awful this POS woman is. What a disgrace. We have got to send her packin in Nov. 2010.
Winebabe on February 17, 2009 at 3:35 PM
This is what scares me with people on here, acting as though they are the true representatives of morality.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:35 PM
Where exactly did Winebabe (great name, BTW) espouse her representation of moral authority? She could be asserting that Pelosi is a horrible speaker, a fascist, stupid, niave, liberal, dumb, pathetic, conniving, back-stabbing or horror of horrors, an actual Pile of Sh*t! Which is what she said! Duh?
JAM on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
VOTER FRAUD!!!!!!!
bloggless on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
Dude…Lighten up.
Sometimes you have to understand that matters of faith are held more close to the vest, and simply are not “negotiable”. People react to you the way they do because you attacked a religion, based on YOUR OWN perceptions. Anyone can disagree with a doctrine, but we walk on shaky ground when we condemn an entire religious belief. Those who observe that belief may undoubtedly be offended. Then again…They may not.
Either way – your posts are running together.
Maybe you’ve not spoken to the actual topic? Should the pope deny communion to Pelosi for being pro-choice?
Many people have answered without engaging in religious bashing or attacking. Why can’t you?
Talismen on February 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM
There’s nothing to misinterpret.
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 3:53 PM
Really? Its quite entertaining, actually. I always thought that belief in God was a personal decision. Faith between one person and his/her God. It makes little difference to me what others think or say. But it is amusing that others have so much anxiety about it. Is it because they are insecure in their beliefs?
genso on February 17, 2009 at 3:53 PM
Pelosi should be kicked out of the church.
Balderdash! Spanking a child doesn’t work well if the child is kept out of the room. Now she is on his home field. Considering PeLousy’s past comments concerning Church Doctrine, I hope the Pope tells her off good. He probably won’t though.
DannoJyd on February 17, 2009 at 3:53 PM
Yes.
The Ugly American on February 17, 2009 at 3:53 PM
Jetboy, are you seriously going to sit there and say that it has not been catholic doctrine for ages that there is no salvation outside of the catholic church? Perhaps they watered it down in vatican 2, but are you serious?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:54 PM
Before or after she melts from the holy water being thrown on her? IMHO I’d excommunicate her heretical teaching butt. But that is just me. I expect because shes so high profile and the membership has dwindled so terribly -it wont be done.
canditaylor68 on February 17, 2009 at 3:54 PM
IMHO, the Pope should not have scheduled the meeting.
He (and the Church) take away nothing, Pelosi and the Administration will not be changing their policies or speaking points anytime in the near future. Pelosi is on record as believing that population control is good economic policy.
However Pelosi will be able to tout the Audience to her constituents. Without a direct statement condemning her, she will be able to infer that she has the Vatican’s approval of her positions on Church Teachings.
2nd Ammendment Mother on February 17, 2009 at 3:54 PM
Yes, Mrs. Finklestein.
AubieJon on February 17, 2009 at 3:55 PM
Lighten up about what? I’m pretty relaxed right now. My point is that AP is not really that familiar with religions or other cultures, so he’s not an authority on these things.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:55 PM
Oh I forgot..okay..without the Acorn vote..ahhh..only 1/4 voted for him!!
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 3:55 PM
There are a lot more if you want them.
mankai on February 17, 2009 at 3:55 PM
Talismen, what I think is that the pope and nancy pelosi should both become Christians.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
And you are?
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
First of all TTheoLogan those 2 links are about the same Knights of Columbus commissioned poll. A good one for a change in that they actually differentiate between practicing and non practicing Catholics. All polled were self identified. Even with this the poll only showed an even split.
Where is this majority you mentioned?
Rocks on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
Religion and a bunch of FNG’s this should be enlightening and fun.
thomasaur on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
Why you little……
:) Thanks for the scolding. We need to persuade these heretics to come back to the flock, and the first step is for us to confess first our own sins and then reach out. Pelosi has to figure that her position is not the strongest going to see the Pontif. Let’s pray that she has a change of heart.
Sapwolf on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
Apparently enough to know that “Allah” is not exclusive to Islam, which AP and it seems many others on here are not.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
I’m sure a more learned, and better practicing Catholic than I could clarify this, but couldn’t she avoid any problems through the Sacrament of Reconciliation, prior to her audience with the Pope?
Sure, only God would know if in her heart she were truly contrite. But as far as the Church is concerned, she would be free of sin, at least up to receiving communion.
Or, no?
Goody2Shoes on February 17, 2009 at 3:56 PM
LOL Someone ask TTheo how he feels about Judism? I bet you will see the true colors coming out on that one too.
upinak on February 17, 2009 at 3:57 PM
Personally, I think the Pope should perform a Exorcism
Political Chef on February 17, 2009 at 3:57 PM
“Heretics…” I do love hearing words like that from catholics.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:57 PM
No he shouldn’t but he will, because frankly he’s just another politician.
rplat on February 17, 2009 at 3:57 PM
What is Judism?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:58 PM
Not sure about Jetboy, but I will seriously tell you that the Catholic church recognizes other faiths and churches and accepts their doctrines
Trafalgar on February 17, 2009 at 3:58 PM
And I think the judge of just who is Christian and who isn’t…..Isn’t you.
Talismen on February 17, 2009 at 3:58 PM
Umm Heretic is derived from Greek… look it up.
upinak on February 17, 2009 at 3:58 PM
Really?
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,288841,00.html
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 3:59 PM
Yes! Yes! Yes! Nancy P should not be allowed to receive communion and she should be excommunicated. I am surprised the Pope is even meeting with her….
vitaatcaritas on February 17, 2009 at 3:59 PM
Hey pot, my name’s kettle.
Discovering Google and Wikipedia doesn’t make you a Catholic theologian or historian.
darclon on February 17, 2009 at 3:59 PM
Of course, but they asked me what the pope and pelosi should do. Or are you like upinak and believe I shouldn’t express a differing opinion?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 4:00 PM
Ok? My point is that Catholics used to burn people alive who they deemed heretics, and certainly would nowadays if they had the power to do so.
Having worked with a persecuted religious group in a catholic country, I’m pretty familiar with what they do when they have power.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 4:01 PM
Does the molesting of children and subsequent cover up make you one?
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 4:02 PM
Thanks. I didn’t think I was completely alone here. It just seems odd that on a thread where some want her denied communion so many are doing things that would makes themselves no ready to receive communion.
Esthier on February 17, 2009 at 4:02 PM
So do you think that “Allah”, as used by Muslims and “El Shaddai” are one in the same?
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 4:02 PM
I just called you out you dim witted anal sack.
You don’t even know what Heretic comes from. You don’t know crap about Catholism and you don’t understand any religon based off of Catholism. I.E. you don’t know you head from a hole in the ground.
Look it UP! How hard is it for you to supposedly know something if you don’t know it to begin with. STFU!
upinak on February 17, 2009 at 4:03 PM
So do you think that “Allah”, as used by Muslims and “El Shaddai” are one in the same?
Wileygrl3 on February 17, 2009 at 4:02 PM
Wiley, talk to an Arab Christian sometime and ask them what their word for God is.
El Shaddai is Hebrew, btw.
TTheoLogan on February 17, 2009 at 4:03 PM
As a Catholic, I consider the practice of mass infanticide (abortion) to be a more pervasive and more egregious sin than even slavery or the Holocaust. It has certainly resulted in more deaths. I also believe that the Church has an obligation to fight abortion as ferociously as possible, even if it means loosing money and/or congregants. The Catholic Church could end the practice of abortion today if it took a forceful enough stand against it and took a step back from its opposition to birth control. The lack of courage on the part of the Church can only result in many millions more killed as well as years of asking for forgiveness as it has in the past when the Church refused to take a strong enough stand. Everyone who is pro-”choice” should be denied Communion…especially Nancy Pelosi!
davenp35 on February 17, 2009 at 4:03 PM
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