Breaking: Senate centrists reach deal on stimulus? Video: 30% chance we’ll get it wrong, says Biden; Update: Spending cuts to be reinstated? Update: Kennedy flying in for vote
posted at 5:46 pm on February 6, 2009 by Allahpundit
A group of Senate moderates working on an amendment to cut up to $100 billion in spending from the economic stimulus package have completed a tentative proposal that will be presented to Senate Democrats at a 5:30 p.m. caucus meeting, Senate Budget Chairman Kent Conrad told reporters. “There is a proposal that is sufficiently fleshed out and we will have a caucus and discuss it,” Conrad said after emerging from talks in Senate Majority Leader Reid’s office. Democrats hope the proposal, developed by Sens. Susan Collins, R-Maine, and Ben Nelson, R-Neb. [SIC], will attract several GOP supporters and be acceptable to all Democrats, which would allow for passage of the plan as early as tonight.
Prediction time: How many Republicans vote yes?
Update: AP says the final price tag would be $780 billion.
Update: Cowards:
Reid suggested to reporters that he had two GOP backers for the bill but needed at least one more because neither wants to be the crucial 60th vote if all 58 members of the Democratic caucus support Obama.
Mel Martinez is also in the mix with Collins, Snowe, and Specter, but he’s unlikely.
Update: Under other circumstances this would get its own post but it’s essential context for this thread. It’s the Sex Panther stimulus!
Update: So narrow is the margin here that Democrats expect Teddy will have to be roused from his sickbed to cast the 60th vote for cloture. He’s in Florida right now, so if that’s true, the roll won’t come tonight.
Update: What a scam. Carl Levin says that the money being yanked out now to get the bill through the Senate might very well be reinserted during the conference committee with the House.
Update: CNN says the vote is expected tonight, and Teddy’s expected to be there.
Blowback
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At this point I tend to think of it as another head on a pike.
Limerick on February 7, 2009 at 2:05 AM
Listen you barbaric Briton, head on a pike could be construed as a demeaning sexist remark that may offend Bwaney Fwank.
dmann on February 7, 2009 at 2:14 AM
I don’t see anything that you posted that I would disagree with. I might not have said it properly, but what I meant was that we as a country have been through much worse. We overcame those, and we can overcome this. I agree with you that we have not seen this kind of major theft before. Obama will not be President for life.
I’m not paranoid and I have been paying complete attention. The light I see was the fire that was lit under their butts. I pray we keep it burning all the way through the weekend and on towards 2010.
Jesse on February 7, 2009 at 2:14 AM
At least the dust is settling as to when “rich” begins.
For a single person, rich begins at $70K, and for a couple, rich begins at $140K.
unclesmrgol on February 7, 2009 at 2:40 AM
All of these grabs at power: executive orders damn near every day, this spending bill, taking over the census, tax cheats in his cabinet, etc. He will set himself up as a dictator before too long. And another thing, these people all took an oath to protect the constitution and the country from foreign forces and within. Who is going to stop ‘em?
cjs1943 on February 7, 2009 at 2:50 AM
Well I must get to bed. I hope all of you try to have a wonderful weekend. This fight is never ending, but you warriors need rest too. So try to relax and have a little fun. The battle will begin again soon enough.
Jesse on February 7, 2009 at 2:54 AM
I feel the same way.
Alana on February 7, 2009 at 2:58 AM
You and I and every other freedom-loving American with the guts to stand and say “No.”
jdawg on February 7, 2009 at 3:32 AM
The ONLY public non-partisan consensus during the POTUS campaign was for TAX CUTS!
Whenever Congress bundles everything together to accomplish COMPREHENSIVE efforts, it is the worst legislative catastrophe.
Ask Obama to specify what’s in his package. He only knows what he’s told to say, which stand to take. He has not even read his proposed legislation.
Any POTUS demanding that the nation sign a bad contract before reading it, and demanding that no one ask questions, and denies historical, natural, devastating results of recorded government intervention should be impeached.
Congress: Deliver Tax Cuts. Spare Us The Debt.
maverick muse on February 7, 2009 at 6:26 AM
The Audacity of Fraud, Obama.
maverick muse on February 7, 2009 at 6:27 AM
I’ve only been up for twenty minutes, having gone up to watch movies with daughter at 8:00 – I couldn’t take it anymore. I dreamt of zombies all night, showing up in Washington to vote in the Senate. Is TK still even coherent enough to vote? I now have visions a la “Weekend at Bernie’s – the Washington Adventure”.
I wouldn’t put it past them to have a dead guy vote.
gopmom on February 7, 2009 at 6:50 AM
Flying Ted Kennedy in smells of desperation. Shouldnt ole Ted retire. geesh..
becki51758 on February 7, 2009 at 7:02 AM
becki51758 on February 7, 2009 at 7:02 AM
Can’t he wants a state funeral with as much pomp as his brothers.
red131 on February 7, 2009 at 7:14 AM
Damn the graveyard crew around here is freaky. How many calls for armed revolution where there? Intense. He’s just a Dem. For all the derision of the HopeNChange cult, seems alot of people around here have bought into the opposite side, the Obama = antichrist cult. Calm yourselves.
DeathToMediaHacks on February 7, 2009 at 7:26 AM
DeathToMediaHacks on February 7, 2009 at 7:26 AM
Go back to the rock you crawled out from under.
red131 on February 7, 2009 at 7:41 AM
“It will not be six months before the world tests Barack Obama like they did John Kennedy. The world is looking…. Watch, we’re gonna have an international crisis, a generated crisis, to test the mettle of this guy….
I can give you at least four or five scenarios from where it might originate… And he’s gonna need help. And the kind of help he’s gonna need is, he’s gonna need you – not financially to help him – we’re gonna need you to use your influence, your influence within the community, to stand with him. Because it’s not gonna be apparent initially, it’s not gonna be apparent that we’re right.”
- V.P. Biden, Oct 19, 08
How about domestic “tests”? Should we expect the same?
Send_Me on February 7, 2009 at 7:48 AM
I speak of the establishment elected Republicans like Crist from Florida, Mel Martinez, Schwartzenneger, etc. I wasn’t referring to the regular voter. I was referring to the Senators, Rep’s, and Governors.
True_King on February 7, 2009 at 7:51 AM
Woo hoo!! I’m rich. And my 3rd grade teacher said I’d never amount to anything.
angryed on February 7, 2009 at 8:12 AM
How dumb is Barack Obama?
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2009/02/022760.php
Next time the MSM tells us that a certain person is “brilliant”; well you know the words…
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 8:16 AM
I am encouraged as well. I look forward to both the Providential judgement that will fall upon the willing servants, and to the peaceful uprising and reestablishment of the republic. It will probably start in Texas.
True_King on February 7, 2009 at 8:19 AM
One things for sure folks; Obama owns this POS scam bill. This is how the headline reads at Yahoo News…
• Obama’s economic recovery plan on track in Senate.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 8:23 AM
Would it be of any use to continue emailing and phoning, asking these bozos to change their minds?
misslizzi on February 7, 2009 at 8:28 AM
Just before the TARP vote I recall seeing Diane Feinstein being interviewed on CNBC or Fox Business, one of the two. The host asked her what the ratio of calls against and in favor of TARP were. She said her office had received about 60K calls, of which less than 1K were in favor of the bill. Right after she said that, she said it was imperative that the bill pass as quickly as possible.
So draw your own conclusions as to whether or not calling any of these idiots makes a difference.
angryed on February 7, 2009 at 8:33 AM
DeathToMediaHacks on February 7, 2009 at 7:26 AM
The vibe you obviously fear is real Hack. As the dummy with ears double’s down with the piglet from California, taking American freedom’s and liberties away from the people and making big brother more and more powerful… The people are going to fight back against those who put us in this position. That’s what humans do when what’s theirs is no longer theirs, they lash out at the thieves.
So brace yourself Hack, fighting in the streets will be coming to a town near you soon. It’s already started here in my area. Liberals thumbing their noses at anybody willing to pay attention, marked by the Obama bumper sticker on their car. “Hey ass-wipes, we won and you lost, now take your medicine while we show you how to run this country!” Those people are starting to get a taste of what a fist sandwich tastes like, and plenty more to come as Obama and the piglet shove Socialism down our throats. Yes folks, the Liberal twits who voted these criminals into office will soon be trying all means possible to get those bumper stickers off their cars!
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 8:35 AM
“…governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed;
that whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends,
it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it,
and to institute new government,
laying its foundation on such principles,
and organizing its powers in such form,
as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.”-Thomas Jefferson
Written over 230 years ago but so true for this time in our nations history. Is it to late to start a new government? This dictatorship thing Obomba is doing is not working out.
0321_GUY on February 7, 2009 at 8:37 AM
Yes, let’s thaw the frozen head of Ted Kennedy and fly it in for a vote on the stimulus bill.
…and misslizzi it ain’t over until it passes. E-mail and phone away. I just emailed Collins, Snowe, and Specter again urging them to oppose Obama all the way.
Obama speaking at that Democrat tax-payer funded retreat was another telling sign of the left’s hypocrisy. There the Obamonkey is telling us that spending IS stimulus. Come on now! They are one in the same!
I guess all that talk about Bush’s spending – er excuse me, stimulating the economy – was just a bunch of Hot Air from the left.
Exit question: With the first stimulus package that President Bush authorized I got a check for $600. With this bigger stimulus Obama has decreed I don’t hear a damn word about ME getting a check.
WTF is up with that?
Mr Purple on February 7, 2009 at 8:38 AM
I, for the life of me, cannot figure out how some average joes can support this bill. Ask the average voter to point to the provision in the bill that is actually going to benefit them. They wouldn’t be able to because there is nothing in this bill to help the average joe. How can they think getting an extra $20 a paycheck is going to make life joyful and comfortable.
I am just shocked that so few can have total control over so much money. I think our founding fathers were trying to prevent this but our elected officials somehow found a loophole.
willt73 on February 7, 2009 at 8:38 AM
Good morning comrades! How are you all enjoying this wonderful morning in the good ol’ Socialist US of A?
nickj116 on February 7, 2009 at 8:46 AM
When you call or write or email your Sens & Congs, I suggest gently reminding them that you do not intend to support anyone that votes for this bailout. its all about re-election.
kelley in virginia on February 7, 2009 at 8:46 AM
My son (college student) just told me that many of his class mates who got caught up in the “hopenchange” bullshit, are now having buyers remorse big time. Mr ears has only been in office a couple of weeks, and he’s losing that “lovin feeling” with those easily brainwashed already. I told my son to tell his mates to get all things Obama off their cars and clothing immediately, and swear they didn’t vote for him.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 8:55 AM
Keemo, where’s your son go to college? I’m at the UW, and I think a vast majority of my fellow classmates still have Hopenchange fever.
nickj116 on February 7, 2009 at 8:56 AM
nickj116 on February 7, 2009 at 8:56 AM
MSU-Bozeman, Mt.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 8:59 AM
I mean the bill passed in the House, despite the Republicans all voting against it.
ddrintn on February 7, 2009 at 9:00 AM
Which do you like most; communism or socialism?
Johan Klaus on February 7, 2009 at 9:03 AM
Fox News website is reporting the vote may not come till Tuesday. There’s still time for the garbage to stink bad enough for some people to back away from it. The support for it is too thin for me to consider it a done deal.
backwoods conservative on February 7, 2009 at 9:05 AM
FWIW: from NRO, one of the contributors made of list of what got reduced or cut. I think much of his list represents reductions of spending because he distinguishes things that got eliminated. Happily, the “neighborhood stabilization activities” [read "ACORN subsidy"] appears to have been eliminated entirely. As well it should.
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=NDgwZjVmNGNiNWFhNGQwMTI3MTMxZDNhODFmMzg5MWI=
BuckeyeSam on February 7, 2009 at 9:09 AM
then after the Senate votes for it, the House & Senate must then negotiate to come up with bill that they all agree on. so we have a small window of opportunity. threaten votes because that is all these politicians care about.
kelley in virginia on February 7, 2009 at 9:10 AM
One dynamic that is becoming clear to most Americans; California % Chicago politics are now dominating the rule. Just how bad this dynamic is and has been for far too long, will now be on display for all to see.
I begged those in my family that remain in California, to get out of there a few years back. A few years back they could have sold out with some equity in tact. Now they are stuck, as their homes are not worth what they paid. As the economy gets worse and worse, the politicians continue to do what Liberals only know how to do “raise existing taxes” and invent new taxes that further destroy the middle class.
Buckle down the hatches friends, tighten up the boot straps, and protect what’s yours. Obama and the piglet will do much damage to our lives in the short term, but the country will survive this onslaught of Socialism. Liberals will suffer the consequences for generations to come. This power play will effect the entire population in a very negative way.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 9:14 AM
Doesn’t matter what is “cut”, it could be put back in during Conference.
artist on February 7, 2009 at 9:15 AM
More than that, due to Collins and Snowe, I will no longer do business with anyone based in Maine, like LLBean.
Josiah on February 7, 2009 at 9:17 AM
thomasaur on February 7, 2009 at 9:18 AM
As of midnight Friday Reid (Senate Majority leader) said (CSPAN2),
He believes that approximately 5:30 pm Monday the senate will vote cloture. There is a budgetary point of order….that requires 60 votes…so if he has 60 votes…
the bill will immediately go to conference.
. . .
(footnote)
After reconciling the bill in conference committee, both bodies vote the bill again, but has anyone ever heard of a bill being rejected after conference?
Question: Even with 3 republicans, it sounds like Reid lacks 60 votes with some democrats still not ready to vote for the bill. Anyone know who those democrats are, why they are not ready to vote for the bill?
Skandia Recluse on February 7, 2009 at 9:21 AM
So long as there is one penny going to ACORN, or restricts recipients based on their race, this bill is unacceptable.
POX on their family’s, shoes thrown at their heads, spit in their eyes, no froth in their lattes.
Alden Pyle on February 7, 2009 at 9:22 AM
thomasaur on February 7, 2009 at 9:18 AM
Indeed.
artist on February 7, 2009 at 9:25 AM
This is so depressing. Why are Spectre, Collins and Snowe doing this? Is Maine so left minded that they, (Collins and Snowe) are able to be re-elected by the left?
anniekc on February 7, 2009 at 9:26 AM
FIFY
If you don’t agree then think about what they will come for right after they have taken away the the First Admendment.
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 9:32 AM
Just a reminder of the hypocrisy that exists with our government… Rules, Laws, and other such things are for the citizens and not the politicians.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090206/D965NUO81.html
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 9:33 AM
LMAO! Yes we are very scared of your threats through the computer screen. We’re also impressed by your willingness to punch someone in the mouth for having a different political ideology as you. And I might add if there IS some kind of a fistfight going down count me on the side of the supposed “lowlifes” and “thugs” in the “ghetto” who you all think delivered Obama to the nation, they tend to be scrappy and have had to get through a few fights in their day. Hilarious man, truly.
DeathToMediaHacks on February 7, 2009 at 9:39 AM
Wonder what Hugh Hewitt would say about Specter and Collins. He’s gone on record many times saying how much better it is to elect and re-elect Republicans (even if they’re moderate) than to elect Democrats, but at the same time, he hates this stimulus package. If I lived in Penn., I know I’d have a real tough time voting for Specter in 2010.
nickj116 on February 7, 2009 at 9:41 AM
Count on it commie.
thomasaur on February 7, 2009 at 9:42 AM
DeathToMediaHack, why do you even bother dude? I mean, you have every right to be here, but why bother?
nickj116 on February 7, 2009 at 9:43 AM
“Lowlifes” and “thugs” in the “ghetto”? We don’t have to throw fists. All we have to do is cut off funding.
ddrintn on February 7, 2009 at 9:44 AM
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 9:32 AM
The Liberal plan of attack seems to begin with the taxation of guns and ammo… I just spent money I didn’t want to on a couple of rifle’s and one more shot-gun; loaded up on ammo. I’m not expecting a civil war or anything like that, I simply wanted to get my two boys their deer guns before the price goes off the planet, and my wife needed a shot gun for bird hunting. I’m of the Ted Nugent ideology; kill it and grill it! One things for sure, I need to feed my family while Bamby and Piglet are busy making all of us middle class workers beg for food.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 9:44 AM
A lot of lefties can’t bear the thought that someone may hold views different from their own.
ddrintn on February 7, 2009 at 9:45 AM
Here is an ironic posibility.
The unemployment numbers will most likely continue to rise well into the fall of this year. If one looks at the demographics of the Obama supporters, i.e. age, location, education levels and union membership, there is a very high probability that the largest percentage of people standing in the unemployment lines will be Obamaites.
I wonder how that one will be spun. What? His spending bill didn’t save them? What!!! His spening bill put some of their employers out of business? WHAT!!! Their employers moved off-shore! Can’t be. Cannot be. Bush-Cheney-Rove MUST be stopped!
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 9:46 AM
Lol, from Mark Hemingway over at The Corner:
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=MTE2OGU1ODY0ZGI5MDY3YmE1OTAzNWY4OGM4NjAwZTQ=
Does Anyone Know How Big the Stimulus Is? [Mark Hemingway]
From a Senate source:
Sen. Reid: “Keep in mind, it’s approaching a trillion dollars.”
NYT: even the senators behind the compromise were uncertain of the number.
Roll Call: The uncertainty made it difficult to predict whether the final bill would be approximately $780 billion or $826 billion.
Fox News: about $811 billion in spending and tax cuts
AP: Democrats put the cost of the measure at $780 billion…Republican critics said that the price tag was actually higher…Official cost figures were not yet available.
AFP: The bill’s supporters noted that its price tag would be far smaller than the 937 billion dollars… Details were elusive… Republicans said their calculations put the new bill at roughly 830 billion dollars
LAT: a price tag of about $780 billion under the compromise deal, though the final figure was unclear.
Bloomberg: Democrats said the Senate plan totaled $780 billion while Republicans said that didn’t include the cost of additions made on the Senate floor including tax cuts aimed at helping the housing and auto industries.
Politico: While details are still incomplete, it appears the package, as initially brought to the Senate floor, will be scaled back…the total bill then would be in the range of $800 billion.
Reuters: Democratic senators agreed on Friday on a scaled-back $780 billion fiscal stimulus package
CQ: The deal would reduce the cost of the base bill by about $100 billion, to $780 billion, but this does not include spending and tax provisions added to the bill during Senate debate, according aides and senators. When those amendment are added in, Republican aides argued, the bill’s price tag is $827 billion.
Hill: a $780 billion economic stimulus plan
nickj116 on February 7, 2009 at 9:49 AM
One large geographic area area of Maine is red. That would be north and west of Bangor I guess.
But remember, Maine in particular, but NE in general, have the highest white populations. According to a Jan. 1, 2008 census release, Maine’s white pop., non-hispanic, is a staggering 96%. I think this even beats Vermont! If the issue of white guilt exists, it will exist in Maine. And the pop. is largely working-class I think, so there is the traditional affinity with the Dem. party. For these reasons, I think it’s why Maine would choose a liberal Republican or conservative Dem. Put the Mainiacs in another state where the social/racial/political tensions are palpable, and they’d prob. vote differently is my guess.
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 9:49 AM
While you’re laughing your ass off Hack, the rest of the country is tiring quickly of the thumb in the chest delivered by Bamby “I won, and you lost”, which has been taken up by Liberals now as a theme. Thumping a person in the chest has it’s way of provoking a good ol’ fashioned fist fight.
I’ve been working construction for my life time Hack. Personally, I do quite well when thumped in the chest.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 9:50 AM
It goes without saying that you are a friend to minorities and all the disadvantaged victims of the white power structure. When the revolution comes, you will end up on top where you belong.
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 9:54 AM
The spin is going to be that this bill SAVED 3 million jobs. Joe Sestak was already out yesterday at a forum in PA saying this – we need this bill or else unemployment will go to 12%. Of course, that can never be proved nor disproved. So if unemployment peaks at around 8% this year and then starts going down as credit markets resume functioning and businesses have the capital to start expanding – which would have happened anyway – we will see Obama and his Amen chorus taking complete credit for it.
rockmom on February 7, 2009 at 9:55 AM
Scare tactics (propaganda at its best) is being used to make U.S. see socialism as the solution to all of out problems.
Can Socialism exist without government involvement? If so, we can be on the recovery because we did it ourselves.
MSGTAS on February 7, 2009 at 9:58 AM
Here’s the Inquirer story on Specter’s role:
Stimulus deal ‘best we can do’
rockmom on February 7, 2009 at 10:03 AM
Parts of the bill “give me heartburn,” Specter said.
Throw his ass out in 2010.
artist on February 7, 2009 at 10:05 AM
Crap sandwiches have a tendency to do that.
thomasaur on February 7, 2009 at 10:07 AM
Wasn’t it George Bush who allowed this worm to live, when he had the chance to destroy him?
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 10:11 AM
Pork, with lots of fat, tends to do that when ingested.
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 10:13 AM
Spector’s politically “toast” for his actions with this porkulus sham of a scam… Collins and Snowe were already toast. In fact, if I’m not mistaken, Collins had that “tingling feeling” running up her leg when thinking about Bamby.
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 10:16 AM
I guess I should have thought as much! Thanks for that.
misslizzi on February 7, 2009 at 10:18 AM
Unfortunately they know where, and probably to whom, those guns were sold.
Spend a little more money down the road and pick up a few used bargains from the private market.
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 10:19 AM
Yes JD, you would be correct… Love Bush for his commitment to protecting our homeland while killing hundreds of thousands of really evil people who wished to kill my children; hate Bush for his Liberal spending while growing the federal branch of the government, and for the faith he put in people who were not deserving!
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 10:20 AM
No, they DID NOT! They put their own self-interest ahead of the nation’s.
DrStock on February 7, 2009 at 10:21 AM
It will be put back in during conference. All of it will be put back in. Call those Repub’s that signed on to this abortion.
True_King on February 7, 2009 at 10:21 AM
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 10:19 AM
Been doing some of that also Yoop… Great advise though!
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 10:22 AM
DeathToMediaHacks on February 7, 2009 at 9:39 AM
Let’s see, been some 45 minutes since the Hack came through; about time for another drive-by…
Keemo on February 7, 2009 at 10:24 AM
Can pressure be put on the Republic Senate leadership to kick those who vote for this out of the caucus? if nothing else it might deprive Obama of official republican cover on this fiasco. Perhaps we need to start lighting up McConnell’s phone lines.
neuquenguy on February 7, 2009 at 10:25 AM
I,m just wondering what it would be like now if last year Pres Bush had told his Tres.Sec. to go fly a kite.We are not going down the road of having the Gov. bail out and take over banks and other privite Buss.Would it be a lot diff. now if Bush had come out and said if companys,Banks and auto makers run there Buss. right with out to much Gov.red tape they can be sucessful in america if not they should fail.That is the American way.Not just no on tarp 1 but hell no.
thmcbb on February 7, 2009 at 10:25 AM
Not sure. Certainly, Paulson didn’t do with TARP what he said he was going to.
Maybe this would have been more of a typical recession than what we are now being told. Maybe because the locus of the problem was in the financial community, the powerful interests on Wall Street (through Paulson??) exaggerated the problem wildly in order to be bailed out. Maybe the economy would have just plodded along a bottom for a year or so and then picked-up on it’s own. Very possibly, in hindsight.
But that begs the next question. Isn’t there a very real possibility that after the interventions we’ve already made, and the money we’ve already spent (much of it possibly lost), that the best thing to do right now is NOTHING more? Let’s not do squat for six months to a year and see what develops. But the liberals will lose their chance to re-distribute at least half a trillion dollars. I think at this point that’s all this “stimulus” is really about.
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 10:38 AM
Specter will not suffer from this. Obama carried PA by 10 points. He is not stupid. There is at least $22 billion in the bill for Pennsylvania, and not much of it is pork. I’m sure the DNC ads were already written if Specter voted against it. Now, the media in PA will hail him as a hero who put his country first.
rockmom on February 7, 2009 at 10:38 AM
Obama was in VA and he’s headed to townhall meetings in IN and FL.
See the electoral significance in this?
Um, where are the conservative activists?
Urging phone calls and emails is nice but…
how about calling for us to shut down the Congress and US Mint?
How about calling for tens of thousands to shut down Obama’s townhall meetings?
Oh, right.
We’ll just continue to be reactionary.
And we sit here and wonder why we keep losing.
artist on February 7, 2009 at 10:41 AM
You just know that if dingy Harry was in McConnell’s position he would have no trouble whipping Specter, Collins and Snowe into compliance. He would tell them that anyone who voted against his wishes will be out of caucus, out of any committee and can forget about any democratic support for re-election. In fact, that is probably what he did to get no defections among his 58 senators. republican leadership just doesn’t have the youknowwhat to do that.
neuquenguy on February 7, 2009 at 10:43 AM
I think it is a VERY legitimate option. Remember, the unemployment rate in 1993 when Bill Clinton took over was actually a bit higher than it is now. Clinton also sought a stimulus bill but could not get the votes for it. By the end of 1993 the recovery was well under way and obviously so.
Unemployment and other economic factors were considerably worse in 1981 when Reagan took over, and he did not get his economic plan passed until July. In fact, he didn’t even introduce it until March. And he gave Congress plenty of time to chew on it, and he met with leaders of both parties many times in the White House while it was being debated. THAT is what a real leader does.
This is NOT an emergency, it is a sharp downturn but not our of the realm of previous ones. It is a gross orgy of spending, and nothing more.
rockmom on February 7, 2009 at 10:44 AM
What if 46% of the nation decided they were not going to be slaves to the state for the rest of their natural lives?
What would that look like?
Are there enough prisons to hold even 20 million revolutionaries?
This is the beginning os something very big and very ugly but it is coming.
At what point do the masses end polite and civil discourse and truly revolt so as to cause the powers that be take real notice?
When?
katy on February 7, 2009 at 10:45 AM
At what point do the masses end polite and civil discourse and truly revolt so as to cause the powers that be take real notice?
When?
katy on February 7, 2009
That is the $827 billion dollar question.
Where is the country’s tipping point?
Personally, I’ve reached mine.
Our political process is on life-support.
artist on February 7, 2009 at 10:47 AM
The debate was politics as usual along party lines. The bipartisan rhetoric is a political strategy. Vitter had an amendment for no money for acorn. Thune had one for the money going to the people. Quite the spectacle but the Senate is the same ole Senate corrupted by lobbyists.
I wonder if our government has reached its borrowing limit and what will happen with Afghanistan?
Going to be a very bad year.
getalife on February 7, 2009 at 10:50 AM
I went over to DailyKooks and there guys are hysterical! They really believe that Obama has set the perfect trap for Republicans and they stepped right in it by not supporting the Bill. If its going to save the world, why do you cae about what R’s think? Better to get the credit yourself..right? If the Republican party wants to make a comeback, the better be 100% against this garbage.
lostinjrz on February 7, 2009 at 10:52 AM
Even if it was once an emergency, the emergency part seems to have passed. The patient needs some rest and watching to recover, but I fear he’s going to get more surgery. That could be real risky in his presently weakened position.
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 10:52 AM
Raum Emmanuel has already told us that a crisis is too big an opportunity to waste. We will be in one fictional emergency after another, each one leading to a “rescue” like this which needs to be passed in a few days before even more daunting consequences manifest. I don’t know how long this strategy will work, but so far so good for them.
neuquenguy on February 7, 2009 at 10:53 AM
I thought when Putin pressured Kyrgystan (spelling?) to throw us out of the airbase we now use there, he was telling Obama to butt out and that Russia was reasserting it’s influence in Afghanistan.
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 10:55 AM
It is time to consider the Icelandic option. I smell angst in the air.
How many others have reached their tipping point?
Will we take the pre World Trade Center tower 1 & 2 approach to a hijacking or a /Shanksville/Let’s Roll approach.
katy on February 7, 2009 at 10:56 AM
Real key is to fix the things the Government broke in the first place, which led to the meltdown…
Like… oh… Mark to Market?
Isn’t is amusing that they announced they were suspending that rule, on the same day the stimulus was supposed to pass?
I remember taking, and writing, about this rule when this whole mess started… and yet they FINALLY do somthing constructive about it? IE, fixing the problem instead of just throwing money at it?
They still have not fixed mortgage rules… they have not bought up the bad debt like TARP was supposed to… All they’ve done is give money to a bunch of people who got us into this mess in the first place… and given PROMOTIONS to people who were supposedly the guardians of the economy who failed (Geithner)…
Epic… Epic… Fail.
Romeo13 on February 7, 2009 at 10:57 AM
Hopefully Rush can cause some ruckus when he returns on Monday. One thing I can’t understand is why the media picks-up on what he says, when they ignore all other opposition opinions. But they do, so let’s hope he starts spoofing and ridiculing the never-ending “emergencies.”
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 10:57 AM
It took a 50% devaluation in their currency to do that. Also, many many Icelanders have mortgages in foreign currencies. That was inexcusably dumb! When/if you seriously feel it in your wallet, you’ll see some action. I think human nature usually is to wait until the very last second before acting.
JiangxiDad on February 7, 2009 at 11:00 AM
Hogzilla Lives
forest on February 7, 2009 at 11:11 AM
I agree that humna nature waits till the last second to react to crisis.
The only thing that makes me think America will have less patience and a more aggressive reaction is our history, our greater sense of liberty than most nations, our threatened standard of (higher) living, our guns, our heritage.
Am I off base?
katy on February 7, 2009 at 11:12 AM
Speaking of Rush, I hope he is all over one item, if it can be confirmed.
Late last night, or early this morning, I heard someone on Fox News say that Obama had called Collins, Snow and Specter to “thank them for doing their ‘patriotic duty’ “.
If this is true then Obama has just labeled all of us who oppose the Stimulus Bill as unpatriotic. That should go over real well.
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 11:13 AM
Are you old enough to remember the tax revolt in California in 1978? Pennsylvania voters revolted two years ago after a midnight pay raise, and threw out 20 legislators and a state Supreme Court justice.
It CAN happen here. The worst thing we can all do is throw up our hands.
rockmom on February 7, 2009 at 11:13 AM
Influence. Do you feel your calls/letters to The Senate & House being ignored? If they won’t listen to the voters, perhaps they will listen to their campaign contributers.
Contact the major contributors to Susan Collins campaign. If you do business with them, let them know their support of Ms. Collins and her agenda are incongruous with your financial decisions. She can go beg her third largest contributor Wish List to make up the revenue loss. They seem to be writing the agenda for her & Olympia Snowe anyway.
Difficult economic times call for thoughtful decisions. It is your choice which businesses receive your hard earned cash. Choose wisely.
batterup on February 7, 2009 at 11:17 AM
OT:
Ping Rockmom.
Just wondering: are you into rock & roll, are you a rock & mineral collector, or are you the *rock* that holds the family together?
Either way, keep pitching: you’re in the strike zone. :-)
Yoop on February 7, 2009 at 11:20 AM
Interesting idea…
We need a website which shows which COMPANIES are supporting these politicians.
These Pols get millions a year from companies… time to start a real revolt, and not buy their products.
Key is that it needs organization.
Romeo13 on February 7, 2009 at 11:24 AM
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