Video: Labor officials can’t explain why they need to dump the secret ballot
posted at 1:35 pm on February 5, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
Ed Frank got a chance to ask John Sweeney, president of the AFL-CIO, a couple of questions about the Employee Free Choice Act at a rally for the Card Check legislation yesterday, as well as another union official. The rally talked endlessly about how Card Check would protect workers and allow employees to form unions, but Ed never got an explanation of how the secret ballot manifests itself as an unfair labor practice. He didn’t get any clarification from his interviews, either:
Organized labor claims that secret-ballot elections lead to intimidation by employers, but if 90% of workers signed cards when confronted by union organizers in dark parking lots or in vacant break rooms and then only a very slim majority actually voted to unionize when those union operatives couldn’t see their votes, doesn’t that prove that union intimidation is much worse than employer intimidation?
We asked that simple question to two union officials at the rally, including AFL-CIO President John Sweeney. Not surprisingly, neither were really able to answer the question.
In fact, Ed’s logic seems unassailable. If union activists get 90% of workers to sign these cards but can’t get a majority in a secret ballot — in which neither the union nor the employer knows how each individual voted — the problem of intimidation appears to occur more on the union side than the employer side. The two officials start blathering on about access to information, but clearly the union gets plenty of access if they get 90% of the workers to sign cards.
The unions want Card Check not because they want to end intimidation, but because they want to rely on it.









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Oy? Is anyone surprised?
Starlink on February 5, 2009 at 1:36 PM
No brainer. Why it has to be explained is a symptom of our PC, cultural stupidity.
Badger40 on February 5, 2009 at 1:36 PM
And if the unions do it, why not American voters every election cycle?
Bishop on February 5, 2009 at 1:38 PM
If we can’t see your vote, how will we know whose legs to break?
scrubjay on February 5, 2009 at 1:38 PM
Even McGovern is against Card Check. What more needs to be said?
BuckeyeSam on February 5, 2009 at 1:39 PM
My guess is that their explanation, if they were to honest (uh-um), of because we want the good old “Chicago {anyone we know from the Chi-Town
MobPolitical Machine Serving in High Office} – Capone tactics of fear and public humiliation” would not sway many workers?Just a guess.
Branch Rickey on February 5, 2009 at 1:41 PM
Swine. Utter swine.
MadisonConservative on February 5, 2009 at 1:41 PM
Allow me. Because we as Union Leaders want more unions.
I want to know who votes which way. (Following me so far?)
When we fail to pass a unionization vote, we’ll know who to strong arm.
When they pass unionization we can more easily get rid of the dissenters or at the very least ensure they do not rise to any prominence withion the organization.
signed…
Ghost of Jimmy Hoffa
hawkdriver on February 5, 2009 at 1:43 PM
We all know why hey want to do away with a secret ballot. No sense anyone pretending otherwise.
MB4 on February 5, 2009 at 1:43 PM
If the ballot’s secret, how can anyone intimidate anyone over it? It’s all secret!
progressoverpeace on February 5, 2009 at 1:45 PM
And why are they spending all that money to run ads for the stupid thing? It is such a no brainer, that if it passes into law, we are in big trouble…but then we already knew that.
kirkill on February 5, 2009 at 1:46 PM
I don’t understand what all of the hubub is about. Those who vote in totalitarian systems are always proud to publicize the fact that they voted for the tyrant in question. It showed their loyalty to the tyrant, and it kept them from going to the gulag, or concentration camp, or from getting a bullet to the base of the skull.
Union officials only want to make sure that everybody is loyal, and voting in the manner that they are required. I’m aghast that there is anything wrong with that.
:O/
OhEssYouCowboys on February 5, 2009 at 1:47 PM
If they’re just looking for transparency, (I love that term now) how about we vote to demand every union labor negotiation and or meeting be conducted in an open forum in front of news cameras. Because hey…, well…, I don’t know why hey…, but dammit, just because!
hawkdriver on February 5, 2009 at 1:49 PM
Yes, that would have been the honest answer. I have not watched the video, but I’m betting he didn’t give the honest answer.
Maxx on February 5, 2009 at 1:50 PM
Oh yes, the good old days of union organizing. The sabotage of company equipment, union thugs giving a trouble maker a beat down, the fire bombings, the mob hits, pension funds being looted.
Oh how I miss those good old days.
Skandia Recluse on February 5, 2009 at 1:51 PM
Here I go-opening the door to criticism again.
At my tiny school there is no pressure to be an NEA or NDEA member on the outside.
But the pressure lies in the fact that if we want to be involved in collective bargaining, you HAVE to be a member of an education organization, like NDEA or NEA.
We have a local organization, but to be a member of that you have to be an NDEA member. And when you become an NDEA member, you are automatically an NEA member.
This has to change.
This is still pressure to be unionized.
Badger40 on February 5, 2009 at 1:51 PM
I like that!
progressoverpeace on February 5, 2009 at 1:52 PM
The Left never liked elections to begin with. It’s far too messy and uncertain to have all that power in the masses. First step, union elections. Next step, political elections.
rbj on February 5, 2009 at 1:56 PM
Simple explanation. The Dems promised this to the unions. Heck, even Sec. of Labor Solis was an officer of a lobbying group that lobbied Congress for it!
This is the single biggest assault on our inherent freedoms that I am aware of. I’m ready to revolt on this one.
DrStock on February 5, 2009 at 1:57 PM
Management fires organizers inbetween the card check and the actual election. Why on earth the President of the AFL-CIO couldn’t relay a really simple, true and easy to convey point like that is beyond me. I really doubt this source, it’s the number one labor talking point on the issue, seriously it is. Maybe if they would let the election happen the day following the certification of cards both sides would accept the outcome.
DeathToMediaHacks on February 5, 2009 at 1:59 PM
You lost me Hack. Pretend I’m an old Army guy and only know what I know about unions from True Crime Magazines and run that point past me again. Seriously!
hawkdriver on February 5, 2009 at 2:04 PM
I mean, seriously make your point again. I’m not being obtuse, I didn’t understand what you meant.
hawkdriver on February 5, 2009 at 2:05 PM
The only response is to boycott all union labor possible.
Of course we can’t boycott our woefully overfunded/underperforming public schools.
But we can boycott Ford, GM and Chrysler until the UAW is but a distant memory.
Unions are corrupt and incompetent. Why pay twice as much for half the job?
NoDonkey on February 5, 2009 at 2:06 PM
I loathe these people. The entire premise that an employer can be forced to unionize, with the only alternative being to shut down his business, is horrendous (and dare I say it, un-American) to begin with.
A very instructive collection of items about Sweeney(and comrades like Hilda Solis) can be found here.
Buy Danish on February 5, 2009 at 2:10 PM
The way we need to destroy unions is figure out laws to enable workers greater mobility and thus more employee choice. Unions only make sense for workers who lack the ability to change jobs.
thuja on February 5, 2009 at 2:14 PM
Hacks – here’s an example of how to make sense in a few short words.
DarkCurrent on February 5, 2009 at 2:15 PM
Because nothing says un-American like a secret ballot!
Rae on February 5, 2009 at 2:20 PM
I was a union member for 10 years. I would shut down my business before allowing my employees to unionize.
kahall on February 5, 2009 at 2:21 PM
This is nothing but a giant protection racket.
My people left Sicily because of this crap two generations ago. When was the last time anyone held Sicily out as a shining example of freedom and economic prosperity?
patriette on February 5, 2009 at 2:24 PM
If the economy is so bad, and people are losing jobs, and companies will be closing down, what the hell are these idiots needed for. To negotiate with the unemployment office? What a bunch of jackasses…….
clinker46 on February 5, 2009 at 2:25 PM
Why won’t he explain?
Here’s some hints:
Plants – Honda, Toyota, Nissan, etc.
States – Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, Kentucky, Texas, etc.
Vashta.Nerada on February 5, 2009 at 2:27 PM
Alright, I’m going to swing at this speculation. How often, Ed, does this happen? How often does it happen the other way? With no statistics to back this up, the logic is unassailable in that situation only, not across the board, as you suggest. Yes, I’m, sure it happens and a secret vote is the best protection for both parties. I see no good argument for card check, but this argument against it is weak.
JeffWeimer on February 5, 2009 at 2:28 PM
The way that guy asks a question is just awful and gives a complete open field for an evasive answer. Keep it simple stupid! He can’t seem to get his thoughts in order before asking the question. It’s very painful to watch an excellent opportunity to put a complete douchebag on the spot get spoiled.
epluribusunum on February 5, 2009 at 2:32 PM
Union labor will never be able to compete in a global economy and the woefully unqualified Obama got a slap in the face from Europe and the developing world regarding the Democrat’s usual protectionist racket.
Real “change” would include abolishing antiquated unions.
Unions perhaps were needed when employees were interchangable during the Industrial Revolution.
Today, successful businesses realize that they must cultivate and attract skilled workers. Unions are unnecessary and destructive.
NoDonkey on February 5, 2009 at 2:33 PM
The way we need to destroy unions is figure out laws to enable workers greater mobility and thus more employee choice. Unions only make sense for workers who lack the ability
to change jobs.thuja on February 5, 2009 at 2:14 PM
FIFY!
We don’t need more laws. Unions made sense 50-60 years ago before we had safety standards, child labor laws, OSHA, ambulance chasers, and world media to spotlight problems. UAW folks are free to ditch their union jobs and work at foreign auto makers’ plants in the south with good wages, benefits, lower cost of living, and more job security. Union goons just want to ride the gravy train, even at the cost of derailing it.
Laura in Maryland on February 5, 2009 at 2:33 PM
Tomorrows Headline”
BLOGGER ED FRANK MISSING
Sweeney – No Comment
TugboatPhil on February 5, 2009 at 2:40 PM
No prob. So, let’s say you work at Walmart and you decide you want to be unionized. Currently the law says you have to get enough signatures and you have to have the secret ballot election 90 days after enough cards are assigned. What everyone misses about the card check law is not that people don’t want a secret ballot, they don’t want the 90 days. Why? Because unions don’t spring out of nowhere in workplaces that are openly hostile to unionization. It takes a dedicated set of union organizers who also have to employed at that place of business to have enough access to workers to make the case for unionization. So currently what tends to happen is management will discover the main folks behind the union push and then after all the cards have been signed, fire all of those who were the main union organizers. They can do this of course because even though the cards are all signed, there’s no actual union yet. Once those folks are fired it sends a strong signal to the other workers that union = lose your job. It’s intimidation from the other side.
The solution is that the election, secret or not, should occur with 48 hours of cards being signed, that way there isn’t that drag for workers to be intimidated. And anyone who truly felt intimidated by union organizers (though I’m not really sure what they would do) could still vote against the union.
DeathToMediaHacks on February 5, 2009 at 2:46 PM
There was a time when unions served a purpose.
That time has gone.
notagool on February 5, 2009 at 3:02 PM
Unions are dangerous and need to be stopped
jonezee on February 5, 2009 at 3:02 PM
This thugs are why I have a picture of Henry Clay Frick on my office door.
PimFortuynsGhost on February 5, 2009 at 3:07 PM
These guys also never explain why, if card check is superior to a secret ballot, they won’t allow workers to use it to get rid of a union, or change unions.
Mike Antonucci on February 5, 2009 at 3:21 PM
Thank you Hack for that well sorted explaination. It’s what I thought you were trying to say the first time. Much more clear now.
I do appreciate you taking the time, but I’m afraid I’m still at the same point and opinion I was in my first two smnarky posts on this subject. That works boths ways. It’s human nature. If open ballots allow the union to know who voted against them in a shop that was unionized, those people are open season and fair game. At that point, the company even has a hard time protecting them. Unions, I agree were one time very necessary, but they need to evolvee into a more business friendly and less corrupt and less leftist, (I’m sorry) entity.
hawkdriver on February 5, 2009 at 3:55 PM
snarky and evolve…
damn I’m stoopid
hawkdriver on February 5, 2009 at 3:57 PM
I’ve been involved in four union secret ballot elections, and none have unionized the workplace. All have been fair. I know as a fact that the union is drooling over this legislation. I also suspect that one of the reasons is because all the people who voted in past elections will once again think that the cards indicate they are interested in a vote, rather than being their actual vote. This misunderstanding will be easy to exploit, and I suspect that many union reps will forget to explain that the card that used to show interest is now in fact your vote.
shibumi on February 5, 2009 at 4:11 PM
I was in a union and was laid off
so the secret ballots didnt help much anyway
But i then went to a NON union plant and the very first thing i was shown was an Anti union video..
Because the management didnt want the union in their either.
So in effect both sides are wrong..
I walked out of there anyway after 4 days (they were idiots and didnt know what the hell they were doing)..
oh and let me tell you it is such a wonderful feeling..
hehe..
But i digress..
anyway the secret ballots should remain secret..
because it at least gives some security to the person
considering the option..
I KNOW that if you had 3 union guys all standing there
watching and then reading your ballot
with no guarantee of privacy some would be intimidated by the union to vote yes..
But whats worse is..
suppose the vote fails..
NOW you have management who knows who voted for what
and guess what..
your ass now belongs to them..
sorry this is a blanant attempt by the unions and management to initimidate the workers..
NOPE
Go suck an egg.
jcila on February 5, 2009 at 4:12 PM
I wonder how many union activists have gone into the private sector, started their own business, and unionized.
I’m betting the number is zero. Working for non-profits or advocacy groups doesn’t count.
Buy Danish on February 5, 2009 at 5:11 PM
Yes, I remember the union “goon squads” in Detroit going around breaking the legs of workers who wouldn’t join. I remember working on the GM assembly line and having a large chunk of my paycheck involuntarily deducted and sent to the union only to be laid off a short time later. By all means, let’s return to the good ol’ days.
NNtrancer on February 5, 2009 at 6:38 PM
The card is a nice thing you sign because you don’t want to stand in the way of democracy, or because you personally don’t want to diss the person asking. It’s like those ballot initiatives here in California — you sign it in a supermarket parking lot, and then, when you have a chance to read the fine print, you vote against it.
“Free Choice” isn’t a secret ballot — it’s a public ballot, and that’s something we in America do only with juries, not with elections.
unclesmrgol on February 5, 2009 at 6:42 PM
Or it would if he could spit out a simple question. Good God.
Jaibones on February 5, 2009 at 9:55 PM
Awesome question. I have a shorter one: I wonder how many union activists have gone into the private sector, started their own business?
Jaibones on February 5, 2009 at 9:56 PM
Hey! These Union thugs voted for Obama, and with it they voted for Card Check.
Live with it!
DannoJyd on February 5, 2009 at 11:36 PM
Ah duon’t wannbeee like de French
Kini on February 6, 2009 at 1:01 AM
video removed
Dollayo on February 6, 2009 at 1:18 AM
Employers are just angry to see their own tactic used against them, in the form of a law. They have already swiss-cheesed the “secret ballot” into a “secret-if-you-vote-no” ballot.
Employers already can and will.
They have no issue with:
• Stuffing ballots by flooding it with no-vote hires
• Sinking the area that is being unionized to kill off support.
• Provoking a violation (ala Vance International)
• Pull known supporters into meetings with the intent of intimidation
• Using inconsistent application of company policy to remove supporters
sethstorm on February 6, 2009 at 8:25 AM
sethstorm on February 6, 2009 at 8:25 AM
Prove it.
Since we already know you’re reading skills are at what, a fifth grade level, I’ll type really slowly for you to understand:
Acceptable sources are from nonpartisan third parties. Thus, no Union Thug newsletters or leftist hate media are acceptable (Nation, Progressive, Socialist Worker, Tyranny Now! w/ Amy Goodman, etc.).
PimFortuynsGhost on February 6, 2009 at 9:02 AM
Talk to the lawyers who pursue those labor-relations cases.
If you really want impartial legal records, then go look at Lexis-Nexis for all you care.
sethstorm on February 6, 2009 at 1:46 PM
sethstorm on February 6, 2009 at 1:46 PM
No evidence. Why am I not surprised?
PimFortuynsGhost on February 6, 2009 at 2:24 PM
No evidence you would want to accept or pursue.
sethstorm on February 6, 2009 at 3:01 PM
we need members because union membership is dying…
But we need to know who is in favor!
hmmmm…let’s call it what it is: THE WORKER INTIMIDATION ACT!
too strong?
well how do we mask our true agenda?
Black Adam on February 6, 2009 at 4:46 PM