Minnesota to expand nanny state to smoking drivers

posted at 12:48 pm on January 29, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

Minnesota’s DFL legislators will introduce a bill banning smoking in private cars while children ride as passengers.  The bill’s advocates point to the risk from second-hand smoke and increased health costs for support, and claim a precedent with prior seat-belt and child-restraint regulations.  However, that mixes apples and oranges in an attempt to obscure the impulse to penalize adults for politically incorrect choices:

Minnesota has banned smoking in workplaces, bars and restaurants. Some suburban communities have banned smoking in parks, and university campuses are taking up the fight, too.

Now, under a bill expected to be introduced today at the state Capitol, lawmakers will consider extending that prohibition to your ride.

Backed by the same groups that helped enact the statewide ban on smoking in bars and restaurants, the new bill would prohibit smoking in cars when children are present.

The analogies to seat belts and child retraints are irrelevant.  Since the state “owns” the roads and highways, it has the right to set safety standards that relate directly to driving safety, not general health concerns.  Seat belts and child restraints prevent injuries in accidents, not arguable risks of cancer decades down the road, so to speak.  Restrictions on cell-phone usage also fall under the same immediate safety issue; states didn’t start banning the use of cell phones while driving because of rumors about brain cancer.

Nor do they pretend any different:

“I’m a mom. I’m a grandma. There’s no safe level of secondhand smoke for kids, especially in the closed environment of a car,” Pappas said.

Studies have shown that even with a window rolled down, it takes mere seconds of a lit cigarette for the air quality inside a vehicle to vastly exceed the levels deemed too hazardous to breathe by the Environmental Protection Agency.

Pappas may be a mom and a grandma, but she’s not my mom, and neither is the state of Minnesota.  I don’t smoke, and even when I did I rarely smoked in my car because I didn’t like the smell buildup cars get from smoking.  Even so, I grew up with plenty of second-hand smoke from family members — and so did generations of Americans.  Child mortality rates remained very low, and longevity increased significantly during this period.    Before the state imposes its choices over those of free citizens, it had better show a substantial state interest other than an overgrown nosebone.

Oh, wait … Pappas and her allies already have one:

The U.S. Surgeon General has determined there is no safe level of exposure to secondhand smoke. In children, it has been linked to everything from ear infections to sudden infant death syndrome. …

“Ear infections and asthma — we see far too many cases of those,” Sloan said.

It’s the health-cost rationale.  Since the state pays medical bills, it has the right to dictate your choices, which is the danger than universal health care systems present to individual liberty.  And Pappas and the legislature won’t stop at the cars, either.  They’re also drafting legislation to bar foster parents from smoking around their wards regardless of where it occurs.  That would effectively bounce all of the smokers out of the program, even though Minnesota doesn’t have enough qualified foster homes for the demand we already have.  Now the legislature wants to create an artificial shortage on top of that, all because they don’t like smoking.

I don’t like smoking, either.  I think it’s a stupid habit, and I thought it was stupid enough to finally quit when I got married.  If no one can prove that second-hand smoke stunted the longevity of American life over the last several decades — and they can’t — I’m not about to argue that it’s good for anyone, children included.  But government doesn’t exist to determine our personal choices or protect us from our own stupidity, especially by making those choices criminal.

Update: I completely forgot to link back to my radio partner Mitch Berg on this post; be sure to read his take.  As for the hysteric in the comments who called smoking around children “child abuse”, a hell of a lot of us must be past victims of abuse, then.  What else is abuse?  Forcing children to grow up in Los Angeles?  R-rated movies?  Time outs?  Puh-leeeze.

Blowback

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porno, sex, drugs, violence, your child is removed. You do NOT have the final say as to what happens in your home to your child.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:42 PM

Connect the dots on how that is like smoking in a car.
It seems to be a false comparison imo.

Itchee Dryback on January 29, 2009 at 1:45 PM

Yup.. I hate it when smokers make me a smoker by second hand smoke in public place. I more than hate it. I want to take that cancer stick and shove it where the sun doesn’t shine.

However, in their homes, their cars, private businesses not smart enough to see the problem of how much non-smoker’s hate it.. they should be able to smoke there without the nanny state getting involved. That even includes having kids in the car.

Noelie on January 29, 2009 at 1:45 PM

That’s terrifying.

It’s terrifying that anyone would find that terrifying. If you are doing any of those things, you are in a bit of trouble.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:46 PM

Just because government agencies don’t follow our constitution doesn’t mean I have to play along.

Vashta.Nerada on January 29, 2009 at 1:43 PM

BTW, around here, abusive CPS agents are routinely escorted off of private property by the citizens, as is proper. You’d be surprized at what you don’t have to put up with, as long as you are prepared to fight for your rights.

Vashta.Nerada on January 29, 2009 at 1:46 PM

If liberals really understood science like they tell us they do then they’d develop a plight that would strike tobacco plants killing them off. Ya know, go to the root of the problem.

Of course it would mutate killing off all our corn, soybean, and broccoli plants. But at least they would have saved out potbellied bodies from starvation.

And speaking of potbellies, why are the same people that want to ban smoking tobacco because it kills you are for legalizing marijuana? As well as heroin and cocaine that kill you up good.

- The Cat

P.S. And who’s going to be the ones laughing when they learn that cigarette smoke wards off zombies. Think about it, in any movie has anyone been killed by a zombie while smoking?

MirCat on January 29, 2009 at 1:47 PM

It’s terrifying that anyone would find that terrifying. If you are doing any of those things, you are in a bit of trouble.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:46 PM

Let me guess, you’re an Obama cultist.

rbj on January 29, 2009 at 1:47 PM

Gee, doesn’t it make you all wonder how people over 60 got to be over 60? I mean billions of them. How could that happen when government wasn’t involved. We need to call Mulder and Scully.

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 1:48 PM

It’s terrifying that anyone would find that terrifying.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:46 PM

It is terrifying that you believe and accept that all parenting is completely under the supervision and approval of the state, and that in fact Americans do not have the final say on how they parent, what goes on in their home, and how their child is raised.

Your acceptance of that surrenders the minds of future generations to government, and places the state in a position of more power, when it should have less.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 1:48 PM

I can’t get past that photo of the Amy Winehouse Wanna Be.

sherry on January 29, 2009 at 12:57 PM

That’s the actual Winehouse a few pounds of heroin ago.

baldilocks on January 29, 2009 at 1:48 PM

Bloomington,In already has it,..no smoking near stores, in jail, in cars while riding with children.

christene on January 29, 2009 at 12:59 PM

Has Bloomington seen a decrease in health costs yet?

Has there been a net increase in expenditure to implement and enforce these things that you know of?

Itchee Dryback on January 29, 2009 at 1:49 PM

Wave goodbye to individual liberty ladies and gentleman. You are no longer allowed to make any decisions without consulting your government first.

baxtrice on January 29, 2009 at 1:49 PM

I say let the kiddies smoke all they want.

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 1:49 PM

I want no I demand that ALL LIBERALS
and DEMOCRATS address the REAL heal issue facing our nation

The spread of AIDS..
I demand all
GAY BARS, Bathhouses, Gay clubs be closed down..
Because it causes AIDS..

I mean 20 million dead isnt enought yet?
but democrats are worried about smokers who die 50 thousand per year and contribute to their tax base?

Sheesh i mean 20 million cost almost 1 trillion dollars in 10 years..

So just using logic aids costs 100 times what smokers do..

jcila on January 29, 2009 at 1:49 PM

Once you bring a child into this world, your freedom basically ends. As it should. Stop being concerned with your rights and more concerned with your kids, raising them right, protecting them, providing for them, and you will be a good parent and an asset to society. Your rights are secondary for a number of years. That may shock and abhor some people.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

If you are not giving your child proper nutrition for normal growth and development, yes it is child abuse.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:43 PM

Being overweight doesn’t count.

What you’re talking about is malnutrition, which again is normally in the form of not being fed enough, not, not being fed adequately.

Esthier on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

It’s terrifying that anyone would find that terrifying. If you are doing any of those things, you are in a bit of trouble.

Someone better call the cops on me; yesterday I dropped an F-bomb in front of the kids, last week I allowed my son to watch the violent movie ‘Transformers’ and in my monthly issue of ‘National Geographic’ I’m fairly certain there is a photo of a topless African woman.

Yeah yeah, murder, rape, arson, burglary….big deal, we need to concentrate the limited law enforcement resources on the important stuff.

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

You do NOT have the final say as to what happens in your home to your child.
keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:42 PM

Tell that to MY stretchmarks, MY bills that pay for said home, MY sleepless nights when said child is vomiting all over the carpet, MY answers to the phone calls when said child is not behaving as the little angel I hoped they would be, MY…well, you get the picture, I hope.

pcbedamned on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

As it should. Stop being concerned with your rights and more concerned with your kids, raising them right

Define “right”.

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 1:51 PM

Welcome to Ontario… where bad ideas never die.

Canadian Imperialist Running Dog on January 29, 2009 at 1:51 PM

Once you bring a child into this world, your freedom basically ends.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

I think you have other issues besides not understanding the proper role of government.

Vashta.Nerada on January 29, 2009 at 1:51 PM

Once you bring a child into this world, your freedom basically ends. As it should. Stop being concerned with your rights…

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

You’re a disgrace to this country. An utter disgrace.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 1:51 PM

I guess the state should punish you if you take your kids to McDonald’s.

I guess the state should punish you if you let them watch frightening movies.

I guess the state should punish you if you don’t make your children exercise daily.

I guess the state should punish you if you teach your kids “harmful ideas”.

I guess the state should punish you if you train your kids not to trust the state.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 1:24 PM

You may be being ironic … but in at least half the examples you cite, somebody has actually already TRIED to legislate against that behavior.

It is fascism. No joke. And well-meaning but horribly confused folks like “keep the change” are the fuel that powers the engine of fascism.

Thus it has always been. In every case in history, the first step – the worst step, in hindsight – was the government stepping in to protect citizenry from itself.

Professor Blather on January 29, 2009 at 1:52 PM

Let me guess, you’re an Obama cultist.

LOL. Please note my moniker. You obviously have not been on this site for long. My hatred for Obama has some limits. I hate him for reasons justified, not some misplaced nutty paranoia about smoker’s rights.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:52 PM

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

This is beyond stupid. You don’t stop being a citizen. And again, how are parents to protect their children from the pollution generated by the other cars on the road? Should parents who open their car windows in heavy traffic be fined?

What about parents who let their kids watch TV instead of making them stupid or go outside? Where does the government intervention stop?

Let me guess, you’re an Obama cultist.

rbj on January 29, 2009 at 1:47 PM

That’s an easy one. He’s projecting, because really, he does need the government telling him how to raise any children he might have.

Esthier on January 29, 2009 at 1:53 PM

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

Well what do you say to all the parents that smoked with there kids in the car, and have had healthy fine kids, grow up to be healthy fine adults. Should they be fined? is there a statue of limitations? are they child abusers? People have smoked with kids in there cars for ages, but all of a sudden its child abuse. Oh the humanity!

MDWNJ on January 29, 2009 at 1:54 PM

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:52 PM

Not liking taxes is hardly proof of much. Loving nanny state is Obama 101.

Esthier on January 29, 2009 at 1:54 PM

I wish the government would stop smoking regulations and just allow me to beat the living crap out of anyone who smokes in my close proximity instead.

Darth Executor on January 29, 2009 at 1:27 PM

As long as they get to shoot you….deal! Disclaimer: I stopped smoking over a year ago.

baldilocks on January 29, 2009 at 1:55 PM

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:52 PM

You’re not an Obama cultist. You simply have a serious child fetish. It’s sadly all too popular in this country. Instead of raising children, people like you worship them. The words “It’s for the children” define you, and those four words are the most dangerous words in this country, because any politician can use them and sucker people like you into giving up your rights.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 1:55 PM

Maryland is already working on this, see SB 288, “Vehicle Laws – Prohibition Against Smoking in Vehicle Containing Young Child”

The Maryland House also has a bill to require helmets for horse riders.

Diane C. Russell on January 29, 2009 at 1:55 PM

We can’t send 10 million illegals packing but we damn sure can send 50 million parents to jail.

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 1:56 PM

People have smoked with kids in there cars for ages, but all of a sudden its child abuse. Oh the humanity!

MDWNJ on January 29, 2009 at 1:54 PM

Yes, because any tar put into lungs doesn’t automatically stay there a person’s entire life unless the tar is replenished. It’s ridiculous to assume it does.

But really, if they’re going to keep pushing this, they should simply outlaw it.

Esthier on January 29, 2009 at 1:56 PM

Well what do you say to all the parents that smoked with there kids in the car, and have had healthy fine kids, grow up to be healthy fine adults.

Use the same argument for porno, drugs, sexual abuse. Should we let those parents off the hook?

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:56 PM

You obviously have not been on this site for long. My hatred for Obama has some limits. I hate him for reasons justified, not some misplaced nutty paranoia about smoker’s rights.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:52 PM

I’ve been around since Captain’s Quarterly started. So stuff it and stuff your destruction of other peoples’ rights in the name of the children. You and Dear Leader both want a paternalistic state that doles out whatever few precious rights we have. My rights do not come from the state.

rbj on January 29, 2009 at 1:57 PM

Reminds me of that old Steve Martin joke:

“Hey, you mind if I smoooooooooooooooooooooke?”

“No, you mind if I fart?”

pilamaye on January 29, 2009 at 1:57 PM

Esthier on January 29, 2009 at 1:56 PM

Bingo! But they cant, where would they get the taxes to make up for it.

MDWNJ on January 29, 2009 at 1:57 PM

I can see the Hitler Youth, the Young Pioneers and the Little Octobrists turning their parents in, by first advising their public school Commissars.

Orwell, you magnificent bastard, I read your book!

OhEssYouCowboys on January 29, 2009 at 1:58 PM

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 1:55 P

If all you can do in these threads is become hostile, angry, and start using epitaphs, get off hotair. You have a tendency to get personal rather than stick to the issue. I have noticed this on many other threads.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:59 PM

If I catch my neighbors laying fertilizer on their lawns this spring, I’m making a few citizens arrests; have they not taken the time to see what those chemicals can do to a person?

Ditto for not picking up the dog crap from their yards. Why, a barefoot child might step in that poop and contract an e-coli infection.

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 1:59 PM

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:56 PM

Dude,porn, drugs, sex abuse, the same as smoking in a car. Your kidding right.

MDWNJ on January 29, 2009 at 1:59 PM

Welcome to Ontario… where bad ideas never die.
Canadian Imperialist Running Dog on January 29, 2009 at 1:51 PM

Not until we can get rid of Toronto…

pcbedamned on January 29, 2009 at 2:00 PM

If all you can do in these threads is become hostile, angry, and start using epitaphs, get off hotair. You have a tendency to get personal rather than stick to the issue. I have noticed this on many other threads.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:59 PM

Epitaphs? I don’t see any gravestones, so I’m not sure what you’re talking about…

Oh, and to your ordering me to leave this website, um, no. I realize you seem to have a serious craving for making other people do what you want, but try again.

Again, you’re a child fetishist, and you’re willing to sign away yours and every other American’s rights because some politician told you it was “for the children”.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:02 PM

Once you bring a child into this world, your freedom basically ends. As it should. Stop being concerned with your rights and more concerned with your kids, raising them right, protecting them, providing for them, and you will be a good parent and an asset to society. Your rights are secondary for a number of years. That may shock and abhor some people.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

May “abhor” some people? Your grammar matches your logic, my confused young friend.

But I’ll throw you a bone: I actually largely agree with what you just wrote. When you have children, they should indeed become the focus of you life; your interests should indeed become secondary.

But what you’re missing here is that you owe that devotion to your child … to your spouse … to your family … perhaps to your God … not to the GOVERNMENT.

I suspect everyone here agrees with the basic point that parents should protect their children and sacrifice for their children.

The point they are making, and you are missing, is that it is not the nanny state’s job to make decisions regarding how best to accomplish that. More to the point, and the reason people are agog at your silliness, is that once you let the state make such intimate, personal choices – there will be no end in sight.

Try spanking your child in public these days. Forget spanking, just discipline a neighbor child causing problems, like everyone in your neighborhood once did if you’re over the age of 30. Let your child read the Bible in the wrong place. Let your child voice the wrong flavor of political opinion. And watch what happens. Parents – and all of us – are losing our rights every day.

Hence, the reaction here. Make no mistake: a parent smoking with their kid in the car, deserves a roundhouse kick to the head. There are a lot of bad parents doing a lot of stupid things, and a lot of them need some head-kicking.

But letting the government take all our freedoms to correct the idiocy of a few … that’s where you part ways clearly with all clear thinkers, and leap right to the far-left liberalism lunacy.

I’m not sure how you don’t see this point. It’s pretty basic.

Professor Blather on January 29, 2009 at 2:04 PM

Ok, I give in to the libtards.

We need procreation laws. You smoke? No hoochie-goochie for you!

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:05 PM

Smoking in a closed area with a child is wrong. This is not a road safety issue. This is a child abuse issue that occurs on the road. The state is not saying you can’t smoke in your car. The state doesn’t care if you live or die from smoking. But they have a duty to protect those who, as the abortion crowd likes to say, “can’t speak for themselves”. Funny, as soon as the kid is born, you are no longer interested in speaking for the kid. lol.

We are speaking for the children. I know it s hard for someone like you to comprehend, but we think FREEDOM is a bit more important.

I hate smoking around me. I really hate how rude I think smokers are to assume I want their habit, even second hand.

However that is for me to be concerned with and not the government.

Can’t you get that part?

Noelie on January 29, 2009 at 2:06 PM

Epitaphs? I don’t see any gravestones, so I’m not sure what you’re talking about…

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:02 PM

English may be a second language for KeepTheChange. Alternatively, he just ain’t that bright.

Use the same argument for porno, drugs, sexual abuse. Should we let those parents off the hook?

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:56 PM

And we have an answer! The correct response was: not that bright.

Please, in the name of Obama himself, tell me that you did not just compare smoking in the car with child-rape. Please. Tell me you didn’t make that analogy.

Professor Blather on January 29, 2009 at 2:07 PM

A mother can’t smoke with her children in her car? It’s the woman’s body, she has the right to choose!!

Grafted on January 29, 2009 at 2:07 PM

The most ironic thing in the concept of “it’s for the children”? The more we do ‘for the children’, the worse ‘the children’ seem to become…

pcbedamned on January 29, 2009 at 2:07 PM

Serving in the military is hazardous to your health also. I suggest we ban that too.

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:08 PM

Please, in the name of Obama himself, tell me that you did not just compare smoking in the car with child-rape. Please. Tell me you didn’t make that analogy.

Professor Blather on January 29, 2009 at 2:07 PM

Oh, no. He didn…he didn…he did no…

Okay, yeah, he just compared having sex with a child to smoking around them.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:09 PM

Oh, and to your ordering me to leave this website, um, no. I realize you seem to have a serious craving for making other people do what you want, but try again.

I’m not ordering you to do anything. How can I? I suggested that perhaps these forums are not right for you considering what I have seen in the past. For some people, these discussions make them angry, and then it is all downhill from there.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 2:11 PM

You’re a disgrace to this country. An utter disgrace.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 1:51 PM

Succinctly put.

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 2:11 PM

If the parents are not giving their child proper nutrition, yes. In fact, that is already a long time precedent for child abuse. If you feed your child nothing but junk, it could, or will effect the child’s health. The state can remove the child from the home for a myriad of reasons. Second hand smoke is no more obtuse a reason than nutrition.

Don’t confuse the smoker’s rights issue with this. A smoker’s right ends where someone else’s nose begins. Especially the nose of a child. Just because it happens to be your child does it give you the right to abuse the kid.

And what if something you do is something a twit like yourself thinks of as abuse?

WHO DECIDES and where does it stop? Why can’t you get this concept?

Noelie on January 29, 2009 at 2:12 PM

I’m not ordering you to do anything. How can I? I suggested that perhaps these forums are not right for you…

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 2:11 PM

get off hotair.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:59 PM

Uh huh.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:12 PM

I keep beer in the fridge and scotch behind the bar.

Ruh roe…

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 2:13 PM

If all you can do in these threads is become hostile, angry, and start using epitaphs, get off hotair. You have a tendency to get personal rather than stick to the issue. I have noticed this on many other threads.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:59 PM

HotAir is about conservatives who believe in FREEDOM.. I believe you would be more at home at the Kos kids place or huffpo, so honestly, you should be the one to voluntarily leave.

Noelie on January 29, 2009 at 2:14 PM

For some people, these discussions make them angry, and then it is all downhill from there.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 2:11 PM

Damn straight, skippy. Removing common sense and installing government overlords has a tendency to do that.

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Damn straight, skippy. Removing common sense and installing government overlords has a tendency to do that.

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Yeah, along with telling people to stop being concerned with their rights, and that they do not have final say about what goes on in their homes or how they raise their kids. Tends to get the hackles up a bit.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:16 PM

Keep the change,

Are you a parent?

Mr. D on January 29, 2009 at 2:16 PM

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:15 PM

Well, I’m glad you agree, skippy. lol. But it is sad when a few ideological malcontents behave that way. DKOS has that reputation, but we see it here too. Unfortunately, they are the most vocal and the most prolific posters so their voice gets heard most almost to the point of making it into an echo chamber.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 2:18 PM

I doubt it. My mother never smoked at home until she got married. Her sister’s husband didn’t smoke either. My point was that plenty of people get lung cancer who have never smoked or been exposed to second-hand smoke.

IrishEi on January 29, 2009 at 1:35 PM

I got it, I was just being a wise guy…

right2bright on January 29, 2009 at 2:18 PM

keep the change

Time out for you…or do you prefer the 1,2,3 Magic method?!?

pcbedamned on January 29, 2009 at 2:19 PM

I keep beer in the fridge and scotch behind the bar.

Ruh roe…

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 2:13 PM

I teach my kids to juggle bullets – rimfire, of course – to enhance their concentration.

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 2:21 PM

So if Barry lights up in Limo One will Michelle turn him over to CPS?

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:23 PM

Once you bring a child into this world, your freedom basically ends. As it should. Stop being concerned with your rights…

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:50 PM

A truer statement never posted, absolutely brilliant….naw, I’m kidding, it actually is a pretty foolish statement.
Having a child is when freedom really began for me, when I knew then I had others besides myself to take care of, protect, defend…when you have a child the fight for freedom is given a whole new meaning…the left considers children a burden, I consider it an honor…the left considers children expendable…I consider them invaluable…take a some freedom from me, and I will discuss it with you, take if from my children, and I will fight you to the death.
Our nation was built on people coming here for a “better life” not for them, but for their children.
You should spend a little time, and get your priorities in line…or you will continue to lose your and your children’s freedoms.

right2bright on January 29, 2009 at 2:26 PM

Well, I should have been dead over 45 years ago. Walked into my grandparents’ house two or three times a week with a haze of smoke rolling out the door (my grandfather smoked, my grandmother had asthma and SHE outlived HIM by 14 years). My dad smoked, and my first stepmother had a 4 1/2 (yes, you read it right) pack a day habit.

Me? Never smoked (watching grandpa die when you’re 15 kind of kills the inclination). Also, the smell of stale tobacco smoke turns my stomach.

But if smokers want to smoke, as long as they don’t blow it in my face it doesn’t bother me a bit. If a bar or restaurant want to cater to smokers, more power to them. I don’t have to go to that particular place. It’s called personal choice and freedom, two words that are becoming rare these days.

God help us all.

Sarah2053 on January 29, 2009 at 2:27 PM

Minnesota my former state has really slipped down the liberal rathole. But what else would you expect from a state that would elect a half baked comedian as one of its senators.

docdave on January 29, 2009 at 2:27 PM

ideological malcontents

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 2:18 PM

Hm. So a person informing others that breeding ends your rights is not an ideological malcontent?

Kay.

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:28 PM

We can thank Hollywood for fostering the idea the smoking is cool. Look at the movies made in the 40′s to the 70′s. Every hero smoked. They foisted it off on the American public. Both my parents smoked and our car reaked of smoke, but during this time, our life expectancy continued to increase.
I am not a smoker, but I really take issue with the “Public Service” ads that insist that 2nd hand smoke is so deadly! I have yet to see any true double-blind studies that supports that “fact”. If anyone knows of any, please post.
I think it is another liberal lie.

Christian Conservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:30 PM

All young boys should smoke to help them develop manly voices

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 2:31 PM

We are definitely the nanny state (not as bad as NYC). I expect these idiots will not stop until is illegal to eat fast food, or drink a soda (pop) in front of your children.

Dasher on January 29, 2009 at 2:34 PM

Say goodbye to campfires, bonfires, leaf fires…my God, who knew that making smores over the fire would doom our kids to lung cancer and heart disease?

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 2:35 PM

Bishop on January 29, 2009 at 2:35 PM

Guess I’ll have to keep the unicorn off the BBQ too.

Limerick on January 29, 2009 at 2:37 PM

Dasher on January 29, 2009 at 2:34 PM

Can I cuss in front of my kids? How else will they learn how to deal with politicians and telemarketers?

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 2:39 PM

We already have this law in CA – and my family pays its own health care costs. So tell me again why I have to submit to this law?

ElRonaldo on January 29, 2009 at 2:39 PM

And speaking of potbellies, why are the same people that want to ban smoking tobacco because it kills you are for legalizing marijuana? As well as heroin and cocaine that kill you up good.

- The Cat

You know what’s as bad as liberal nanny-statism? Overreaching generalizations.

You talk about “the same people” wanting to ban smoking but legalize pot, heroin and cocaine. I’ve never heard the three linked in such a manner outside of your comment. Perhaps there is a type of person about which this is true, but to speak of “the same people” puts you in that same category.

yesterday I dropped an F-bomb in front of the kids

Your kids must have been proud. At least their teachers will know from whom they learned it when they repeat it.

***
If smoking cigarettes in the same car should be illegal then talking to one’s own kids about God should be too. Both preclude the kids’ (falsely perceived) rights of free will.

The only rights you have as a kid in my family is to sit at the Kid Table for Thanksgiving and Christmas. Oh yeah, you have the right to be silent, anything you say can and will be used against you in the court of parental doom.

The Race Card on January 29, 2009 at 2:39 PM

So tell me again why I have to submit to this law?

ElRonaldo on January 29, 2009 at 2:39 PM

Because if you don’t mindlessly obey your masters, you are a bad American.

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 2:40 PM

You know what’s as bad as liberal nanny-statism? Overreaching generalizations.

You write, as you prove it to be true.

Esthier on January 29, 2009 at 2:43 PM

Even so, I grew up with plenty of second-hand smoke from family members — and so did generations of Americans.

Me too and look what happen, we both ended up conservative and religious. I’d bet a lot of conservatives grew up around smoking but not liberals I’d wager. Liberals grew up eating veggies, no smoking, no drinking, no playing dangerous games, no religion, no cowboy and indigenous people and they now rule the world.

jmarcure on January 29, 2009 at 2:58 PM

Has President The One come out of the closet about smoking yet?…doesn’t He have two small children?…anyone wish to comment about that?…hmmm?…

ocbrat on January 29, 2009 at 3:06 PM

keep the change -

The argument that parents with children in their cars shouldn’t smoke is based on the belief that doing so may cause health problems for the child in the future, correct?

Well, since you support this infringement on the rights of adults, do us all a favor: go find us the statistics that show the number of children who were killed by second-hand smoke in the past year. Then, go find us the statistics that show the number of children who were killed in car accidents in the past year. Which number do you want to bet is higher?

Now, since the evidence would suggest that a child’s chance of dying in a car accident is a much higher than his or her chances of dying from second-hand smoke inhalation, doesn’t your logic dictate that there’s an even more pressing need for outlawing the transportation of children in cars?

rvastar on January 29, 2009 at 3:06 PM

All Hail Obama! All Hail the State!

Bevan on January 29, 2009 at 3:20 PM

MadisonConservative on January 29, 2009 at 2:46 PM

LOLZ

LimeyGeek on January 29, 2009 at 3:23 PM

I’m willing to bet that Keep The Change has never been a parent.

You see, keep the change, those of us who have actually had the experience of being responsible for a child understand that it is a balancing act, choosing one set of risks over another.

You may not like second hand smoke. Someone else may consider lunch meats with nitrites and nitrates to be carcinogenic. Still someone else may consider childhood vaccinations to cause autism.

Pray tell us. You want criminal sanctions for smoking in the presence of children. What about those parents that refuse to vaccinate their kids? If I smoke in front of my children, I’m not putting anyone else’s kids at risk. If I don’t vaccinate my child, I’m potentially exposing thousands of children to life threatening infections.

So, Keep the Change, will you force parents to vaccinate?

rokemronnie on January 29, 2009 at 3:26 PM

I think vegans should be ordered to eat good wholesome animal protein, too, as long as we’re micromanaging health habits. And I bet lots of Jews don’t get anywhere near the government’s MDR of pork sausage. :|

TV spreads the gospel of politically correct thought and the vast retarded multitudes not only accept it, but think that it was their own idea to start with. Smoking is a paltry health risk compared to exposure to media waves. The country would be a much better place if everyone smashed their TV sets, even if they took up smoking like Humphery Bogart.

Venusian Visitor on January 29, 2009 at 3:27 PM

Me too and look what happen, we both ended up conservative and religious. I’d bet a lot of conservatives grew up around smoking but not liberals I’d wager. Liberals grew up eating veggies, no smoking, no drinking, no playing dangerous games, no religion, no cowboy and indigenous people and they now rule the world.

jmarcure on January 29, 2009 at 2:58 PM

Of course! This is all a subtle, but brilliant plan to rid the U.S.A. of conservatives.

My dad was a cigar smoker when I was 11 years old. I hated the smell but I’m a conservative too. If he never smoked, I bet I’d be a liberal. Perish the thought. Thanks Dad.

Andy in Agoura Hills on January 29, 2009 at 3:29 PM

Reading this thread reveals to me that too many are missing the principal (social engineering) and hanging up on the particular (smoking in a closed environment). Easy enough to do, but I think y’all would do well NOT to forget this IS social engineering of the worst sort. Slippery slope and all that.

Just my 2 cents.

irongrampa on January 29, 2009 at 3:35 PM

How did we survive?

Oldnuke on January 29, 2009 at 3:51 PM

No, you’re not. Expose your kid to porno, sex, drugs, violence, your child is removed. You do NOT have the final say as to what happens in your home to your child.

keep the change on January 29, 2009 at 1:42 PM

Heh. Heh. Heh. My kids are exposed to violence, I let them watch cartoons. They’ve also been exposed to drugs, in fact, I’ve been known to give them some Motrin from time to time (only when they really need it, though). As to sex and porn, well, there was that time when we forgot to lock the door and Sophie walked in on us. She also has been know to rifle through drawers where she does not belong. She’ll be in therapy when she’s older, I’m sure of it.

So come, take my kids away, please. We’re doing horrible things to them, and that’s not even getting into the drinking of alcohol (wine), leaving them alone at times (I need to shower), or the gratuatous profanity we use around them (frakkity frak frak). Or, you could butt the hell out of our lives, and nanny state your own damn household. Because if you want to hear about real abuse, we can go down that road, and believe me when I say it doesn’t involve anything I’ve stated so far.

Anna on January 29, 2009 at 3:54 PM

The only rights you have as a kid in my family is to sit at the Kid Table for Thanksgiving and Christmas. Oh yeah, you have the right to be silent, anything you say can and will be used against you in the court of parental doom.

The Race Card on January 29, 2009 at 2:39 PM

Same in this family. Oh, and the right to choose which corner to stand in for your punishment.

Anna on January 29, 2009 at 3:55 PM

What’s up Prof. Blather?? ~B (polipundit? how is that old site anyway?)

Brian on January 29, 2009 at 3:57 PM

Could be wrong but thought that MA had that law too.

jeanie on January 29, 2009 at 4:01 PM

If you don’t agree, you support child abuse.

lorien1973 on January 29, 2009 at 1:14 PM

Plus, the government must go into every house twice a day and make sure that there are no kids in harms way.

Johan Klaus on January 29, 2009 at 4:02 PM

Just outlaw SMOKING in MN. Then whine and cry when they lose the tax money

originalpechanga on January 29, 2009 at 4:23 PM

Same in this family. Oh, and the right to choose which corner to stand in for your punishment.

Anna on January 29, 2009 at 3:55 PM

The line in my father’s family was “children are seen…and not heard.”

BuckeyeSam on January 29, 2009 at 4:27 PM

keep the change,

You’re right — morally speaking — that parents should want to do everything properly for their children. But as matters of law enforcement priority and abuse of power, these things should not be legislated. Just because something is right doesn’t mean government should force people to do it.

Beagle on January 29, 2009 at 4:36 PM

That picture of Amy………

………… is smokin’!

Seven Percent Solution on January 29, 2009 at 4:37 PM

rokemronnie

Still someone else may consider childhood vaccinations to cause autism.

Or sudden death by seizure, which happened to our first born son three and a half days after DTAP.

Don’t get me started. I’ll only say this: the dangers of vaccines are carefully covered up from EMS level to the special federal court for vaccination “injuries”. The “Blue Wall of Silence” is nothing compared to this.

But hey, certain PJM bloggers (not HA) have linked to people who called us “sociopaths” for not sacrificing our next son to the big corporate pharma gods. OK one more thing, if vaccines actually work, how does our choice endanger vaccinated children?

Hmmmmmmm….?

Beagle on January 29, 2009 at 4:41 PM

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