Done: Obama signs order closing Gitmo within a year; Update: McCain, Graham support

posted at 1:00 pm on January 22, 2009 by Allahpundit

Just one of four you’ll see executed here; the second ends enhanced interrogations by the CIA. Note the third, though, establishing a task force to review all detention policies and procedures. If that “classified loophole” ends up being quietly carved out later, I assume that’s where it’ll come from.

WaPo’s touting its new poll showing that 53 percent support closing the prison, a perilously slim majority for so momentous a decision. Gallup, in fact, finds that 45 percent support keeping it open compared to just 35 percent who want it closed; among independents it’s 48 and 32, respectively. The stakes for Obama from Bush speechwriter Marc Thiessen:

During the campaign, Obama described the techniques used to prevent these attacks as “torture.” He promised that if elected, he would “have the Army Field Manual govern interrogation techniques for all United States Government personnel and contractors.” If he follows through, he will effectively kill a program that stopped al-Qaeda from launching another Sept. 11-style attack. It was easy for Obama the candidate to criticize the CIA program. But as president, what will he do when the next senior al-Qaeda leader — with actionable intelligence on plots to strike our homeland — is captured and refuses to talk? Will the president allow the CIA to question this terrorist using enhanced interrogation techniques? If Obama refuses and our country is attacked, he will bear responsibility.

Well, no, Al Qaeda will bear responsibility, a point to which the left will suddenly awaken after blaming Bush for every IED that went off in Iraq. But not everyone will see it that way, and they won’t all be Republicans: Remember, even a progressive as enlightened as Madam Speaker was cool with “torture” after 9/11.


Update: Right out of the chute, cover from Maverick and his crony-in-chief.

“We support President Obama’s decision to close the prison at Guantanamo, reaffirm America’s adherence to the Geneva Conventions, and begin a process that will, we hope, lead to the resolution of all cases of Guantanamo detainees,” McCain and Graham said in a statement…

“Present at Guantanamo are a number of detainees who have been cleared for release but have found no foreign country willing to accept them,” the senators said. “Other detainees have been deemed too dangerous for release, but the sensitive nature of the evidence makes prosecution difficult. The military’s proper role in processing detainees held on the battlefield at Bagram, Afghanistan, and other military prisons around the world must be defended, but that is left unresolved. Also unresolved is the type of judicial process that would replace the military commissions. We believe the military commissions should have been allowed to continue their work.”


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We both know you voted for Paris Hilton, though. You dog.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:02 PM

What can I say, she’s totally hawt. Her energy policy was solid, too.

BadgerHawk on January 22, 2009 at 3:05 PM

DeweyWins on January 22, 2009 at 3:05 PM

I was pretty sure that’s what you meant, it’s just a bad subject to mess up phrasing on. Sorry if I accused you of anything unfairly.

BadgerHawk on January 22, 2009 at 3:06 PM

You wanted McCain to lose…

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:01 PM

Please stop lying about me.

I didn’t want McCain to win. However, I wanted Obama to win even less. So I voted for McCain. What you wanted.

Yes, I told people they could vote third party. Was I wrong? I’m pretty sure we have the freedom to vote however we want. Yes, I said McCain sucked, because of his positions on issues, and his being the most liberal-friendly Republican in congress. None of which, by the way, were lies.

That’s why I voted for McCain. What you wanted. The least you could do is stop lying about a guy who did what you demanded.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:07 PM

To rephrase – What will Barry say if a released detainee takes part in a terrorist attack ?

DeweyWins on January 22, 2009 at 3:05 PM

I hope the first words are “I’m sorry” followed by, “I’m resigning.”

But then, I really hope nothing happens. He knows everything he needs to know right now. Surely that knowledge has made an impact.

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 3:10 PM

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 2:47 PM

Too bad we can’t bet on this. I could use the money.

Hello BD.

I think I will go with McCain on this one because he knows about torture.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 2:49 PM

Hi Getalife!

I know about torture too. Its called, “liberalism”. The psychological, physical, and economic effects of liberal policies on our individual and collective psyche are deep, long lasting and far more damaging than water boarding. Indeed, if we could turn the clock back to, say, before the Community Reinvestment Act ultimately forced banks to lower their underwriting standards, I’d volunteer to be water-boarded just so I could get my house value and retirement account above water.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 3:10 PM

“Um, Greg, what does this order say again?”

forest on January 22, 2009 at 3:12 PM

Ahhh YeeAAAA!!!!

Nothing like waking up to a blissfully ignorant Sept.10th.
mindset.

All these liberal policies of wanting to maintain the moral high ground worked so well during the Carter and Clinton Administrations.

Nothing like shooting down policies that have been extremely successful just to be loved by the rest of the world.

And look at how much the rest of the world is willing to pull their weight now that the Messiah is President:

Have you met the French, Mr. Obama?
Wed, 01/21/2009 – 10:58am
http://drezner.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2009/01/21/have_you_met_the_french_mr_obama

God bless France. You knew, once Obama was sworn in, that Paris would welcome the new president with open arms and not get all passive-aggressive-y ike they always frequently occasionally do.

What’s that? There’s a Reuters story about this?
France will reject any immediate request by US president Barack Obama for reinforcements to Afghanistan because it has already deployed enough troops, French Defence Minister Herve Morin said on Wednesday.

[A] Harris poll for the FT shows that clear majorities of people in the UK, France, Italy and Germany believe that their governments must not send more forces to Afghanistan, irrespective of demands that the new American head of state might make.

None of these countries use “hating Bush” as the reason they won’t pull their weight,they think they have done enough.
“Yes we Can”

No need to worry,liberals tell us “there is no terrorist threat”.

Baxter Greene on January 22, 2009 at 3:13 PM

Well BD,

You know I am a proud Independent that knows both parties suk but am cheering on our new leadership. Being a “real American” thinking “country first”, if you will.

I see a civil war brewing in your party. The extreme right of Hannity and Rush cheering for our country to fail against the moderates led by McCain cheering for our country to recover and succeed.

Which side are you on BD?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM

I hope the first words are “I’m sorry” followed by, “I’m resigning.”

Exactly my thoughts.

Of course that would be if he had any genuine character or sorrow.

DeweyWins on January 22, 2009 at 3:18 PM

However, I wanted Obama to win even less.

Oh, I SEE NOW! This was all your master plan, to explain to us all the negatives about McCain, after the republican primary and when the only option was down to two people … and you constantly harped on what you didn’t like about McCain, offering people here all the alternatives to McCain … was your cunning plan to defeat Obama.

You are more of a political genius than Karl Rove, Madison Conservative!!!!!!!/

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:18 PM

Yes, that thunderous noise you heard as Prez Obamessiah signed these orders was the hearty round of applause from terrorists abound the world even as they laughed their asses off at America. If we’re lucky, though, maybe Bin Laden died laughing.

JayVee on January 22, 2009 at 3:20 PM

McCain and Graham agree…no surprise there. There was never a difference between McCain and Obama. We were screwed either way. I can’t wait to see what Obama does with the terrorists. I’m betting that they’ll get detained somewhere else…maybe in Murtha’s garage.

orlandocajun on January 22, 2009 at 3:22 PM

1. I’m with Badgerhawk.

2. This is nothing more than symbolism over substance. Gitmo became a symbol of the supposed excesses of the Bush administration in the War on Terror. Note the marked lack of substance about what to do next. It’s probably an easy decision to make, since the most negative possible results are vague and nebulous, and if an American dies because of it, we probably deserve it for being so wrong and evil as a country .

In any case, aren’t these people, responsible for killing Americans on the USS Cole, on 9/11, and on the fields of Afghanistan and Iraq and captured by our military, entitled to the full benefit of US constitutional protection? It’s only right, after all. They need to have due process, and if they need to be released due to a technicality, then that’s just the right thing to do, right? I mean, we waterboarded KSM, and that’s against our law and other treaties, so any confession he gave is tainted and he should be set free, right?

I predict much fewer captures by the military, they’ll shot them out of hand. It’s just easier than mirandizing them on the battlefield. And then treating them with US civilian law rather than the UCMJ. Which, ironically, has better protections for the accused than a US military member gets. It’s all just absurd.

JeffWeimer on January 22, 2009 at 3:24 PM

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM

Nothing short of a “lie”.

Hannity just interviewed Limbaugh and he stated if he governed like Reagan he would cheer him on. He said those things that he wanted to do that were bad for the country like restrictions of free market and free speech and open voting for unions and so on were the things he wanted him to fail at.

You Liberals must really fear those two because there is such an effort to discredit them and turn the party against them.

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 3:24 PM

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:18 PM

When all you think about is how I attacked McCain, and completely ignore my numerous beefs and concerns with Obama that I regularly aired, I’m sure you can come up with that demented little idea.

Did you even bother to read my posts if they weren’t attacking McCain? My guess is no. Selective vision, selective memory, selective arguments. They’re all part of being a McCain worshipper, which you must be given that you took my talking about them personally, and never denied that you were one.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:25 PM

No, McCain and Graham agreed with Obama?
Is that a pink collar on McCain’s lapdog, Graham?

I called the White House comment line to give Obama some advice on where to stash the terrorists….in his old neighbhorhood.
It seems they don’t mind terrorists being housed next to them…bill ayers.
It is shut down. I guess Obama doesn’t want anyone to get in the way of his ‘agenda’.

2010 can’t come fast enough for Arizona. Unfortunately, uninformed S. Carolinians didn’t act fast enough to oust Graham and install a conservative.

I pray for our great nation.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:26 PM

1. I’m with Badgerhawk.

JeffWeimer on January 22, 2009 at 3:24 PM

You are wise beyond your years.

BadgerHawk on January 22, 2009 at 3:27 PM

Baxter Greene on January 22, 2009 at 3:13 PM

Ah, all that “restoration of our standing in the world” is really paying dividends, isn’t it?

JeffWeimer on January 22, 2009 at 3:27 PM

the world never wanted to fight the war on terror…they wanted lip service. I always hear about the 90% who supported Bush…Right. What were they going to say. As long as no one gets hurt.

There is a reality that comes with being a human being…why is that so hard to understan.

tomas on January 22, 2009 at 3:30 PM

Ah, all that “restoration of our standing in the world” is really paying dividends, isn’t it?

JeffWeimer on January 22, 2009 at 3:27 PM

We are all ‘citizens of the world’ with Obama’s presidency.
I wonder how hard the world will be laughing at our government’s idiocy when a nuclear bomb goes off in New York City and it was found that one of Obama’s precious angels at Gitmo was involved?

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:30 PM

Gitmo is not effective anymore.
The terrorist don’t fear it.

The CIA needs to work more on pre-intelligence information, not torture after the fact. Especially people who think they are going to enter Allah’s paradise because of their attacks against the U.S. and her allies.

And many Muslims feel that finally have one of their own in the White House. No matter how many times I tell him that Obama is Christian, they disagree.

I know many here are breaking on McCain, but I don’t seee any Republicans getting ready to stand up against Obama. So many are feeling the fever of Hopenchange. There is no one standing up for the conservative movement in D.C. because Bush killed it like he did the economy.

Are the Republicans about to become the Democrats of 2003? Perhaps.

stefystef on January 22, 2009 at 3:31 PM

Dammit, I do get tired of hearing how Conservatives are going to ruin crap by not supporting Obama. The success of this country doesn’t just depend on getting out of economic bad times. When I say I don’t want OB to succeed I mean….

Keep my right to bear arms (now in question)
Keep Talk Radios right to free speech (now in question)
Keep a persons right to vote secretly at work (now in question)
Stop supporting murder industries like Planned Parenthood with our tax dollars
Fight the GWOT in a serious manner where we can still win.
Stop socializing the private sector.
The list goes on.

Wanting the country to succeed is more than our damn 401Ks.

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 3:31 PM

McCain and Graham just cemented for all time their now always to be remembered reputations of being two of the biggest Democrat butt-kissing, appeasement appealing, spineless, gutless self-congratulatory legend-in-their-own-feeble-minds RINOs to ever disgrace the chambers of the Senate.

pilamaye on January 22, 2009 at 3:32 PM

Of course that would be if he had any genuine character or sorrow.

DeweyWins on January 22, 2009 at 3:18 PM

Good point.

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 3:32 PM

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:25 PM

what’s the point of attacking McCain? I mean, what did you hope to accomplish while you were doing this before the election?

Do you know who decides elections? Not democrats. Not republicans. After the democrats vote for the democrat, and the republicans (usually … at least they used to) vote for the republican, then the election is decided by the moderates in the middle.

Can you imagine someone coming to this site, and reading people here arguing that McCain sucks and they hate him? What is that person to think? If they would then go to a liberal website, and read about how wonderful the democrat choice was, then they might think that there’s no point to vote for the republican – their own people are divided as to whether to even vote for him in the first place. Why should they vote for him, while the other people are providing examples as to why to vote for their democrat choice.

Again – what you did here, was to the delight of the democrats. That’s what they wanted to see here – our own ‘operation chaos’ to rival any disgruntled hillary supporters.

Do you know what they thought of me? They HATED ME. Because I advocated *gasp!* supporting the republican, like they hoped would lost. And you were making them grin from ear to ear, as you provided your daily ‘McCain sucks’ to everyone who would listen. If you honestly don’t understand the results of your actions – the consequences of your behavior, then you really do have a problem with your ability to understand the most basic of cognitive function of understanding.

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:34 PM

McCain and Graham just cemented for all time their now always to be remembered reputations of being two of the biggest Democrat butt-kissing, appeasement appealing, spineless, gutless self-congratulatory legend-in-their-own-feeble-minds RINOs to ever disgrace the chambers of the Senate.

pilamaye on January 22, 2009 at 3:32 PM

+100.

Has McCain or Graham opposed dear leader on ANYTHING since he was elected president?
I’d say no.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:36 PM

Which side are you on BD?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM

Your feverish claim that Rush wants the country to fail does not dignify a response.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 3:38 PM

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:34 PM

Wise, I have a question.

Has John McCain opposed ANYTHING that Obama has done in the past couple of days?
If I am not mistaken, McCain ALSO wanted to close Gitmo.

I have to say, I’m glad McCain lost. I will admit it because I fear that McCain would have implemented the same agenda that Obama has done in the past few days….
and will continue to do, on topics like global warming, trade, amnesty, drilling for oil….

I’m glad a democrat will be blamed for all of the ruin that is about to commence.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:40 PM

Are the Republicans about to become the Democrats of 2003? Perhaps.

stefystef on January 22, 2009 at 3:31 PM

Fine so long as we can make it to 2006.

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 3:40 PM

I don’t listen to him BD but let me know when he starts cheering for our new leadership will ya?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:41 PM

Whats the problem with Gitmo? Is it a psychological thing or what, because I really don’t get what the big deal is.

Itchee Dryback on January 22, 2009 at 3:42 PM

Which side are you on BD?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM
Your feverish claim that Rush wants the country to fail does not dignify a response.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 3:38 PM

Rush said that he hopes OBAMA fails, because he agenda will cause failure to the America we know. If dear leader’s agenda is carried out, we will be a mere shadow of what we once were.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:42 PM

the election is decided by the moderates in the middle.

And in 2008, they voted for 0bama.

Why should they vote for him, while the other people are providing examples as to why to vote for their democrat choice.

It was McCain’s job to make the case to vote for him and he never did it.
Thus, he lost.
And he was so like the Democrat candidate on so many issues, that a good deal of the Conservative base stayed home.

And you were making them grin from ear to ear, as you provided your daily ‘McCain sucks’ to everyone who would listen.

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:34 PM

Don’t blame it on Madison–McCain did suck.
I tried and tried and tried to “love” him, even in spite of his record and his pathetic campaign.
Sarah was the only reason I could tolerate him at all.
The man behaved as if he wanted to lose the election. Really.
The only surprise was that he didn’t lose bigger, but, of course, that’s because of Sarah Palin and also, because 0bama was a bad candidate, too.

Jenfidel on January 22, 2009 at 3:43 PM

I don’t listen to him BD but let me know when he starts cheering for our new leadership will ya?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:41 PM

And yet you feel compelled to discuss him as though you have? Hardly surprising. Ignorance is of course bliss.

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 3:43 PM

I don’t listen to him BD but let me know when he starts cheering for our new leadership will ya?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:41 PM

My point exactly. You say he and Hannity are going to destroy the Republican Party but you don’t even listen to him.

In the words of ElRushbo himself…

Seminar Caller!

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 3:43 PM

I don’t listen to him BD but let me know when he starts cheering for our new leadership will ya?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:41 PM

Then you don’t have a clue, you are like the MSM, taking bits and pieces and spinning it.

And as far as Rush cheering for our ‘new leadership’?

It will NEVER happen because Rush loves his country too much to cheer for dear leader’s agenda

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:45 PM

what’s the point of attacking McCain? I mean, what did you hope to accomplish while you were doing this before the election?

wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:34 PM

I hoped to accomplish contributing my opinions to a community on a website that was filled with people who were going to vote for McCain anyway. You seem to think that my bringing up McCain’s liberal tendencies was going to sway the masses, and take all of Rush’s listeners off to Obamaland.

If a person comes to this website, they’re likely conservative already. With hundreds of commenters on this site, why in the hell do you think my voice would eclipse everyone else’s? Even if my voice was the center of attention, which it’s not, that voice was also loathing and excoriating Obama on a regular basis, admitting that it was probably going to vote for McCain in the end, and showing a renewed interest in the Republican ticket when Sarah Palin was added.

I don’t excuse the disagreements I have with any politician just because they’re the lesser evil. Nor should you. I hold every politician, regardless of party or ideology, accountable for their actions and statements. When a candidate sucks, either because they hang around with terrorists and black supremacists, or because they try to destroy our borders and cripple our free speech for the sake of elections, I call them out. I don’t give a damn what letter comes after their name.

The bottom line is, I’m just a commenter on a conservative website. So are you. What I say here is, for the most part, inconsequential. I realize that. You, apparently, do not.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:46 PM

Whats the problem with Gitmo? Is it a psychological thing or what, because I really don’t get what the big deal is.

Itchee Dryback on January 22, 2009 at 3:42 PM

I’ll bet a lot of small business owners that cannot afford health insurance because they can’t get into a large ‘pool’ would LOVE the type of healthcare these sh*tbag terrorists enjoy in Club Gitmo.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:47 PM

I don’t listen to him BD but let me know when he starts cheering for our new leadership will ya?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:41 PM

Typical. Thanks for admitting you don’t know wtf you’re talking about when it comes to Rush

Oh, and please advise when you ever “cheered” Bush.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 3:47 PM

By the way, wise_man…you are defending McCain.

McCain agrees with Obama.

So, effectively, you’re defending Obama.

How have you had the gall to accuse others of being Obama supporters?

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:48 PM

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:48 PM

Error. Error. Does not compute. Reboot program ‘Loving John McCain’.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:52 PM

what’s the point of attacking McCain? I mean, what did you hope to accomplish while you were doing this before the election?

Do you know who decides elections? Not democrats. Not republicans. After the democrats vote for the democrat, and the republicans (usually … at least they used to) vote for the republican, then the election is decided by the moderates in the middle.
wise_man on January 22, 2009 at 3:34 PM

wise_man, but moderates do not vote for candidates who look at them and tell them, “I’m one of you”. Moderates are swayed by the candidate who best articulates their right wing or left wing postion. Reagan did not win over such vast amounts of moderates by showing them how moderate he was. He won them over because he could eloquently and simply explain what the conservative position was and why they should agree with it. A good candidate convinces moderate voters to come to them.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 3:53 PM

I watched the Hannity clip. Calm down dittoheads. They both are just highly paid entertainers spewing their opinions.

I find it amusing they are dissenting against their party.

But really amusing people take them seriously.

Perhaps they should run for office and take that paycut but seriously doubt they will.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

Reagan did not win over such vast amounts of moderates by showing them how moderate he was. He won them over because he could eloquently and simply explain what the conservative position was and why they should agree with it. A good candidate convinces moderate voters to come to them.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 3:53 PM

Bing.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 3:56 PM

I see a civil war brewing in your party. The extreme right of Hannity and Rush cheering for our country to fail against the moderates led by McCain cheering for our country to recover and succeed.

Which side are you on BD?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM

Neither of those men want our country to fail–it’s 0bama they want to fail because it’s his Leftist/Marxist/Socialist policies that will destroy the country if they are implemented, like this “Close Gitmo” plan.
He’s practically inviting the Islamist terrorists to attack us with the added bonus that they won’t be held accountable if they do.
I’ve listened to Rush every weekday for 17 years–he’d never “cheer” for our country to fail. Never.

Jenfidel on January 22, 2009 at 3:56 PM

I find it amusing they are dissenting against their party.

But really amusing people take them seriously.

Perhaps they should run for office and take that paycut but seriously doubt they will.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

What are you talking about?
Do you even know?

Jenfidel on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

So, Wise Man. Has Juan McVain opposed Obama on anything since the election?

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:45 PM

Amen HS, there’s not a media figure I listen to that provides a more positive assessment of this great country and it’s people. I really feel uplifted on many of the subjects he discusses where he stresses the origins and base of our greatness. He just doesn’t believe that it’s greatness is based in Liberalism. He is hard on and rants about the things that are bad for this country.

But here’s something I consider the standing irony of this new century so far. While my unit was deployed Liberals defined the new patriot as one who sat back here in The States and protested the war and called their military stupid and murderers, (Murtha, Kerry, Durban)and other worse things. There was no mention in their ranks about supporting the administration to support the war to ultimately support the troops. No, they said being asses and ending the war by any means was the only way to support us and secretly wished for high casualty rates to get the negative press they needed. They used the dead as a yard marker to prove it was going the way they said (and secretly wanted). After The Surge, they simply stopped reporting Iraq and moved to trying prove Afghanistan was being lost. Liberals wanted us to lose the war.

So… tell me freaking supporting a bad president with almost no ideas that I support for the sake of national unity now isn’t ironic?

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

Reagan did not win over such vast amounts of moderates by showing them how moderate he was. He won them over because he could eloquently and simply explain what the conservative position was and why they should agree with it. A good candidate convinces moderate voters to come to them.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 3:53 PM

How many states was it that he won in 84? My memory is so short. It seemed like more than a few…

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

And you are a ‘proud’ independent, which to me says, you are the parents that don’t want to keep score, you give trophies to everyone, you eliminate grades to not hurt little Johnny’s grades.
You know what, this is our country and our leadership that we are talking about here. You need to finally find who you are and make an effin’ decision. Wishy washy, mushy middle is crap.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

I watched the Hannity clip. Calm down dittoheads. They both are just highly paid entertainers spewing their opinions.

I find it amusing they are dissenting against their party.

But really amusing people take them seriously.

Perhaps they should run for office and take that paycut but seriously doubt they will.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

So the legitimacy of an argument is not measured by how right or how wrong that particular argument is. You believe an argument does not rise to the level of legitimacy until it is flowing from the lips of a real politician. Interesting. So why are we discussing this again?

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 3:59 PM

So, Wise Man. Has Juan McVain opposed Obama on anything since the election?

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

I already asked wise that question. Not sure where he went…

Maybe he pulled a ‘chocolate city’ Nagin. Hinding under his desk.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 3:59 PM

I watched the Hannity clip.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

So you watched one clip from one guy you were mocking. That suddenly makes you not ignorant of what you’re discussing?

And seriously, no one believes that you’re really an independent. That’s such a tired line used to try and make your point seem more relevant than it actually is.

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 3:59 PM

and begin a process that will, we hope, lead to the resolution of all cases of Guantanamo detainees,

John McCain(R D) and Lindsey Graham(R D) plus the DemCong…Perfect Together!

belad on January 22, 2009 at 4:00 PM

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

I am a Conservative before I am a Republican.

You must be easily amused. Play with string much?

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 4:00 PM

I see a civil war brewing in your party. The extreme right of Hannity and Rush cheering for our country to fail against the moderates led by McCain cheering for our country to recover and succeed.

Which side are you on BD?

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM

They want Obama’s socialist agenda to fail. Juan and the RINO’s are not opposing it.Now you tell us, what side are you on?

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:01 PM

How many states was it that he won in 84? My memory is so short. It seemed like more than a few…

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:58 PM

My memory is a little fuzzy too. I believe it was somewhere in the vacinity of – all of them.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 4:02 PM

I find it amusing they are dissenting against their party.
getalife on January 22, 2009 at 3:55 PM

Dissent is amusing? Or is it amusing because you think the majority of Republicans are weasely “moderates” who are swayed by the dangerous ideas people like you promote? Or is it amusing because you are so accustomed to walking in lockstep with Democrats who do not tolerate dissent?

Anyway, you fail to understand a fundamental concept:

Conservatives are not wedded to the Republican Party.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 4:03 PM

Thanks HS. Still trying to figure out what his agenda is in defending Juan’s actions.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:03 PM

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 3:59 PM

I question getalife’s real identity. I think Olbermann got lost on his way to kos.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:04 PM

Conservatives are not wedded to the Republican Party.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 4:03 PM

The latter is, however, dead without the former.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 4:05 PM

Thanks HS. Still trying to figure out what his agenda is in defending Juan’s actions.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:03 PM

He tried to deny it a couple of weeks ago, now he is full on McCain again.
I think he secretly wishes he was McCain’s lapdog, he’d have to oust Graham first, though.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:05 PM

We’re all gonna die…

JAM on January 22, 2009 at 4:06 PM

The latter is, however, dead without the former.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 4:05 PM

Damn, I’m agreeing with Madison again. Time to go maybe.

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 4:06 PM

We’re all gonna die…

JAM on January 22, 2009 at 4:06 PM

Take a deep breath. Now, do a shot of Jager, grab a bowl of popcorn and join the fun.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:07 PM

We’re all gonna die…

JAM on January 22, 2009 at 4:06 PM

I have to admit, that would qualify, in my mind, as the worst case senario.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 4:08 PM

Sadly, many more Americans will have to die needlessly in attacks on our home soil before the left decides to get a clue about what Islam really wants.

Not to worry. It’s just Americans. Principles regarding how to treat murderers nicely is much more important than American lives.

Rejoice if you get to die for this! Be grateful if they are moved into your back yard, so you can show how tolerant you’re being, you know, just before you’re blown to smithereens.

Alana on January 22, 2009 at 4:09 PM

You believe an argument does not rise to the level of legitimacy until it is flowing from the lips of a real politician. Interesting.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 3:59 PM

Getalife may not actually need a President. This might suffice.

Buy Danish on January 22, 2009 at 4:10 PM

Damn it, i knew dissent was gonna be outlawed these next 4 years, it was patriotic to dissent the last eight years, but now it is meanspirited, why am i always late to the party?

MDWNJ on January 22, 2009 at 4:10 PM

I said I am a proud Independent that knows both parties suk.

Now, I read BD say “Conservatives are not wedded to the Republican Party.”

That is Independent my friends.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM

I agree, WE ARE ALL GONNA D – I – E

….or maybe just AP in NYC

jp on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM

Damn it, i knew dissent was gonna be outlawed these next 4 years, it was patriotic to dissent the last eight years, but now it is meanspirited, why am i always late to the party?

MDWNJ on January 22, 2009 at 4:10 PM

Wait until it becomes a felony to dissent dear leader’s agenda.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM

MDWNJ on January 22, 2009 at 4:10 PM

Tell me about it. Watch for any new war protesting. It was actually Bush protesting. To the military’s peril. We might still be able to count on Cindy Sheehan and Nick Bergs Dad.

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 4:13 PM

OT

I’ve got a great idea for a cool comic book… what do you think? “the grumpy old vet and the gay side-kick”

gatorboy on January 22, 2009 at 4:14 PM

Speaking of dissenting…
Did the open borders/amnesty lobby march on Washington, D.C. yesterday, or has dear leader given them the thumbs up that their agenda will be carried out?

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:15 PM

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM

I call BS. You’re no more an Independant than I am a Liberal. You’re a Moby. And a damn Liberal one.

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 4:15 PM

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM
I call BS. You’re no more an Independant than I am a Liberal. You’re a Moby. And a damn Liberal one.

hawkdriver on January 22, 2009 at 4:15 PM

Seconded.

‘My friends’….if I hear that ONE MORE TIME, my head will explode.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:18 PM

That is Independent my friends.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM

Actually, it’s merely explaining what the terms are, friend. Conservative and Liberal are not political parties. They are political ideologies, and they most frequently line up with Republicans and Democrats respectively, but that doesn’t make them Republicans or Democrats.

Esthier on January 22, 2009 at 4:18 PM

OT

I’ve got a great idea for a cool comic book… what do you think? “the grumpy old vet and the gay side-kick”

gatorboy on January 22, 2009 at 4:14 PM

Great concept, it needs a ‘catchy’ name, though.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:18 PM

He tried to deny it a couple of weeks ago, now he is full on McCain again.
I think he secretly wishes he was McCain’s lapdog, he’d have to oust Graham first, though.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:05 PM

So sad. Backing a guy out to destroy the Republican party and the conservative movement. I voted for the scumbag only because of Sarah but seeing him in action now, I feel dirty.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:18 PM

So sad. Backing a guy out to destroy the Republican party and the conservative movement. I voted for the scumbag only because of Sarah but seeing him in action now, I feel dirty.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:18 PM

I ONLY voted because of the ‘Cuda. I had to take a couple of shots and then after the ‘act’, I had to take a shower and take another two shots.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:20 PM

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:15 PM

Im sure he sent a memo to those nitwits telling them to stay at home and stay warm, cause he was going to open those borders wider than Barney Frank and…..oh never mind.

MDWNJ on January 22, 2009 at 4:21 PM

I said I am a proud Independent that knows both parties suk.

Now, I read BD say “Conservatives are not wedded to the Republican Party.”

That is Independent my friends.

getalife on January 22, 2009 at 4:12 PM

So conservatives are independents? But independents are not necessarily conservatives? A voter only loses his independence at the moment he/she decides to make use of the vehicle that provides the most direct route to the advancement of their genuine political philosophy otherwise known as a party?

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 4:21 PM

So conservatives are independents? But independents are not necessarily conservatives? A voter only loses his independence at the moment he/she decides to make use of the vehicle that provides the most direct route to the advancement of their genuine political philosophy otherwise known as a party?

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 4:21 PM

I’m having flashbacks of my S.A.T.’s.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:22 PM

I ONLY voted because of the ‘Cuda. I had to take a couple of shots and then after the ‘act’, I had to take a shower and take another two shots.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:20 PM

I feel your pain. Hopefully in 2010 we can clean some of the garbage out and get some real conservative leadership. Its sad when even Newt is enthralled with Obama.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:22 PM

HornetSting

Ever since I watched him sign it this morning, I’ve had to take many deep breaths. The Army Field Manual ONLY! Good Lord! It’s five o’clock somewhere…

JAM on January 22, 2009 at 4:24 PM

I feel your pain. Hopefully in 2010 we can clean some of the garbage out and get some real conservative leadership. Its sad when even Newt is enthralled with Obama.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:22 PM

It’s gonna get ugly in 2010 for the RINOS. I have been disappointed in Newt lately, he’s spending too much time in Washington, D.C., I guess.
We have to wait until 2014 for Graham, but I think once the maverick is ousted, hopefully, his ‘power’ will dwindle and he will shut up like he told us ‘racists’ to shut up on the amnesty deal.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:26 PM

1. What’s a moby?

2. You WILL die for this! It’s your patriotic duty!

(I just love that line of thinking.)

Alana on January 22, 2009 at 4:27 PM

McCain and Graham are certainly presenting themselves more liberal than conservative. I am truly disappointed that more GOP members are not taking a stronger, more vocal stance on issues like this one.

mindhacker on January 22, 2009 at 4:28 PM

HornetSting

Ever since I watched him sign it this morning, I’ve had to take many deep breaths. The Army Field Manual ONLY! Good Lord! It’s five o’clock somewhere…

JAM on January 22, 2009 at 4:24 PM

Stay strong. dear leader cannot take our strength away.
I think we need to crash some D.C. phone lines again and let our elected officials know we are NOT happy. I believe most Americans are horrified, those that are not sitting on their couches eagerly awaiting the next season of American Idol, at the fact that these pigs, sorry porky, are coming to America.
It is a sad day, but it will hopefully strengthen our fight for 2010 and 2012.
And WHEN one of these pigs carry out a terrorist attack, we will not allow the MSM to lie…the truth will be blared for all to see.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:29 PM

It’s gonna get ugly in 2010 for the RINOS. I have been disappointed in Newt lately, he’s spending too much time in Washington, D.C., I guess.
We have to wait until 2014 for Graham, but I think once the maverick is ousted, hopefully, his ‘power’ will dwindle and he will shut up like he told us ‘racists’ to shut up on the amnesty deal.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:26 PM

What will Lindsey do without Juan???? Sad its going to take 6 years to weed them all out. I used to buy into the support what you have but no more. Its what got us where we are. Just hope Obama doesnt irreversible damage as we take back our country to the ideas of our forefathers.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:30 PM

What will Lindsey do without Juan???? Sad its going to take 6 years to weed them all out. I used to buy into the support what you have but no more. Its what got us where we are. Just hope Obama doesnt irreversible damage as we take back our country to the ideas of our forefathers.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:30 PM

Oh, I believe Lindsay will carry on the agenda of his hero like an obedient lapdog until South Carolina kicks him out on his arse.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:33 PM

I’m having flashbacks of my S.A.T.’s.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:22 PM

Ha! I guess its kind of ironic then because one of my first political lessons of my life came about the day I was going to take my SATs. I remember a bunch of people protesting outside, ranting and raving about how the test was biased against minorities. I couldn’t help but be confused by their stupidity. I thought to myself, why should certain races be held to different standards? If the tests were designed in such a way as to predict the competence of a human being’s ability to succeed at college isn’t the skin color of the test taker irrelevent? It was then that I realized that there are actually a lot of people out there who believe stuff like that and they identify one another by name. They call themselves liberals. That was a defining moment for me. I was not a liberal. And now liberals control the country. Oh crap.

Zetterson on January 22, 2009 at 4:33 PM

Oh, I believe Lindsay will carry on the agenda of his hero like an obedient lapdog until South Carolina kicks him out on his arse.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:33 PM

Make sure to keep DeMint. He seems to be one of the few good ones left.

Elric66 on January 22, 2009 at 4:34 PM

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 3:48 PM

Hm. Wonder where he went.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 4:35 PM

Hm. Wonder where he went.

MadisonConservative on January 22, 2009 at 4:35 PM

There’s probably a ‘McCain love in’ at the college or something.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:36 PM

Found him, there’s a thread about McCain’s daughter….let’s go torture him, uh, tickle him. Don’t want to go to jail.

HornetSting on January 22, 2009 at 4:39 PM

Political showmanship must stop when lives are at stake. There is no reason to do this so publicly…even if you do it…don’t do in such a public way that diminishes what has been accomplished. He is only making his job harder.

tomas on January 22, 2009 at 4:41 PM

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