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Mother of kid named after Hitler: It’s just a name. Oh, and also, Hitler was a hero.

posted at 5:18 pm on January 21, 2009 by Allahpundit
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Via Breitbart, dad’s been stupidly insisting for months that they chose names like “Aryan Nation” for their kids simply to be different, notwithstanding the amazing coincidence that their house is littered with swastikas. Here’s another amazing coincidence: Turns out mom got hold of a baby book somewhere that casts Hitler as an “old German hero” who, and I quote, “helped Germany defeat in World War II.”

Still no word on why the state took the kids, but after watching this I’m wondering if it’s a basic competence issue.


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Comment pages: 1 2

Mandatory sterilization for cretins.

LimeyGeek on January 21, 2009 at 5:21 PM

I remember when my daughter was born we had to get permission to name her from the Czech “office of names” because the name we chose wasn’t on the Czech name calendar. I was offended by having some bureaucrat tell what I could name my child, and didn’t take kindly to their explanation that it was to prevent “abuse.”

But now I wonder.

SWLiP on January 21, 2009 at 5:22 PM

Turns out mom got hold of a baby book somewhere that casts Hitler as an “old German hero” who, and I quote, “helped Germany defeat in World War II.”

Should’ve stayed away from Der Fuhrer Discount Book Emporium.

amerpundit on January 21, 2009 at 5:23 PM

“Actually, we found their names in baby books.”

Mein Kampf? Hell of a place to find baby names.

drjohn on January 21, 2009 at 5:24 PM

I’ll name my child “Coitus Interruptus” for the delightful irony and whistful coffeet-able conversation.

LimeyGeek on January 21, 2009 at 5:24 PM

f that, no more people named Mohamed , or Hussein since they both have killed hundreds of thousands!

Donut on January 21, 2009 at 5:25 PM

A Fascist complaining about a government controlling their lives. I smell irony.

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:25 PM

As much as i think these two parents are bat shit crazy. Does the government have the right to come in and takes kids just cause of there names. If thats the reason they took them.

MDWNJ on January 21, 2009 at 5:26 PM

Gee, I wonder how she feels about calling him “Judas Iscariot”

ToddonCapeCod on January 21, 2009 at 5:26 PM

Eh. Kids get named after terrorists their parents idolize every day and no one gets as upset as they are with these knuckleheads.

Blake on January 21, 2009 at 5:27 PM

Amazingly unattractive woman, inside and out.

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:27 PM

I’m gonna name my child “erectile dysfunction” and see if that affects his life in any way. I’ll call him Ed.

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:27 PM

I don’t know what to say but feel i should say something.

Jay on January 21, 2009 at 5:27 PM

By the way, I want to see the book that contains “Aryan Nation” as a child’s name.

amerpundit on January 21, 2009 at 5:28 PM

how do i defeat in wwii?

eh on January 21, 2009 at 5:28 PM

Who knows, Adolf Hitler Jr. may in the end become the first Aryan-American President.

Aristotle on January 21, 2009 at 5:28 PM

I’m gonna name my next kid “Free Beer” to ensure he/she is welcomed everywhere they go.

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:29 PM

That’s right… politically incorrect thought is grounds for taking your children away…

Skywise on January 21, 2009 at 5:29 PM

How about “Richard Fromage”?

LimeyGeek on January 21, 2009 at 5:30 PM

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:29 PM

People will think he’s begging for it. Not offering it.

My last name is ass-wee-pay !

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:31 PM

i am afraid to respond, the office of govt. blogging and statmenet responces, is monitoring this thread

custer on January 21, 2009 at 5:32 PM

Didn’t I recently see a bunch of supporters for Hamas in the United States carrying around signs praising Hitler for killing Jews…………..?

……………….. when are their children going to be taken away?

Seven Percent Solution on January 21, 2009 at 5:32 PM

i think hitler is a pretty cool guy. eh helped germiny defeat in wwii and doesn’t afraid of anything.

eh on January 21, 2009 at 5:33 PM

Come on people. Do you really want a couple of Nazi lovers to be raising kids? I didn’t think so.

SoulGlo on January 21, 2009 at 5:34 PM

So, okay. Just change the kid’s name to Farfour and then move to Gaza City.

J.J. Sefton on January 21, 2009 at 5:34 PM

hitler was just mis-understood. like the palestinian guy’s sign said – he wanted to kill the juice. He was allergic to citrus products. His underlings were just too stupid to realize what he meant.

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:35 PM

Beastly broad and the husband looked like a damn hippie. Sterilize them both and for good measure send them to Club Gitmo for an indefinite vacation.

Mooseman on January 21, 2009 at 5:35 PM

I wouldn’t amount the worship of a guy that slaughtered millions of people to simply being “politically incorrect”, but there’s obviously a concern about the government being able to seize your children because they disagree with what you teach them. It’s a bad precedent to set for a government that takes a mile when given an inch.

amerpundit on January 21, 2009 at 5:35 PM

Didn’t I recently see a bunch of supporters for Hamas in the United States carrying around signs praising Hitler for killing Jews…………..?

……………….. when are their children going to be taken away?

Seven Percent Solution on January 21, 2009 at 5:32 PM

Now THAT’S a good idea. And confiscate the korans while you’re at it.

J.J. Sefton on January 21, 2009 at 5:35 PM

Turns out mom got hold of a baby book somewhere that casts Hitler as an “old German hero” who, and I quote, “helped Germany defeat in World War II.”

WOW! I know there are many ignorant people in this world but these “parents” take the proverbial “fruitcake” when it comes to ignorant! I put their logic and reasoning ability right up there with the left-tard kool-aid drinkers!

Liberty or Death on January 21, 2009 at 5:37 PM

I wouldn’t amount the worship of a guy that slaughtered millions of people to simply being “politically incorrect”, but there’s obviously a concern about the government being able to seize your children because they disagree with what you teach them. It’s a bad precedent to set for a government that takes a mile when given an inch.

amerpundit on January 21, 2009 at 5:35 PM

Well, we don’t know the official reason yet, though. If that is the reason, then I agree. It’s an horrible abuse of government power. I suspect that a family this messed up is messed up in other ways. They probably didn’t have to look too hard for a legitimate reason to take them.

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:39 PM

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:39 PM

I think it crossed the line when they’d sent the children over to the jewish neighbor’s house – with cookies that said “death to you”

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:41 PM

Poor kid…..he cant even pick his parents!

grapeknutz on January 21, 2009 at 5:41 PM

Hold it, I’m kind of slow sometimes. Does this woman think that hitler’s Germany actually won WWII?

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:41 PM

I don’t like the idea of those fruits raising kids, but I even less like the idea that the government can take away kids on bogus charges.

pedestrian on January 21, 2009 at 5:42 PM

Well i guess the first strike against them is they are from NJ…i mean who would want to live in that craphole anyway.

MDWNJ on January 21, 2009 at 5:42 PM

Regardless of what they named their child or who they love or hate, I don’t think its right to take their kids becuase of their beliefs.

Vincenzo on January 21, 2009 at 5:45 PM

I’m gonna name my child “erectile dysfunction” and see if that affects his life in any way. I’ll call him Ed.

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:27 PM

Quote of the Day!

Rogue on January 21, 2009 at 5:46 PM

Hold it, I’m kind of slow sometimes. Does this woman think that hitler’s Germany actually won WWII?

redshirt on January 21, 2009 at 5:41 PM

I’m abit confused also. I’m not sure if this idiot is saying that Germany won WWII or that Hitler was a war hero that helped defeat Germany?

Either way, stupid is as stupid says!

Liberty or Death on January 21, 2009 at 5:46 PM

The official reason is that they did not remove them for their names. And, they can’t remove the kids because the parents are neo-nazis.

There has been a long line of USSC cases protecting the privacy and self determination of families. The Due Process Clause of the 14th Amendment protects personal decisions relating to marriage, procreation, contraception, family relationships, child rearing, and education. Also, most state constitutions have a right to privacy clause and all have a due process clause. And, all state codes have statutes protecting the right to privacy of families. Then there is the First Amendment protection of political speech and association.

Blake on January 21, 2009 at 5:49 PM

I’ll name my child “Coitus Interruptus” for the delightful irony and whistful coffeet-able conversation.

LimeyGeek on January 21, 2009 at 5:24 PM

Heh, good one! Yep, those pesky kids are good at interrupting those close moments aren’t they…

Liberty or Death on January 21, 2009 at 5:51 PM

Mandatory sterilization for cretins.

LimeyGeek on January 21, 2009 at 5:21 PM

There’s some horrible irony in suggesting that, you know.

MadisonConservative on January 21, 2009 at 5:52 PM

Obama should intervene on the parents’ behalf, just for the fun of making them permanently indebted to their new black savior!

abobo on January 21, 2009 at 5:52 PM

Nobody would be saying a thing if they’d named the kid Joseph Stalin or Fidel Castro.

Percy_Peabody on January 21, 2009 at 5:53 PM

This is just going to be Elian Gonzales all over again. Poor little Hitler is going to get shipped off to Cuba.

frankj on January 21, 2009 at 5:54 PM

All those hitler lovers look alike

Locrian on January 21, 2009 at 5:54 PM

Obama should intervene on the parents’ behalf, just for the fun of making them permanently indebted to their new black savior!

abobo on January 21, 2009 at 5:52 PM

Heh, now that would be priceless!

Liberty or Death on January 21, 2009 at 5:54 PM

We named our band “Closed For Repairs” but in every place we played, we couldn’t get a crowd.

mankai on January 21, 2009 at 5:55 PM

I GOT IT.

SHE HATES JEWS.

BUT LADIES AND GENTLEMAN, THIS IS STILL AMERICA….and if she wanted to name them something idiotic, SHE IS FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE TO DO IT.

AND YOU ALL HAD BETTER BE DAMN GALD SHE STILL CAN.

NUT JOB, sure, but a FREE nut job.

Y’all are missing the point.

seejanemom on January 21, 2009 at 5:56 PM

That’d be GLAD….

typos get worse when I am on a tear….

seejanemom on January 21, 2009 at 5:57 PM

All those hitler lovers look alike

Locrian on January 21, 2009 at 5:54 PM

ha!

eh on January 21, 2009 at 5:57 PM

Again the government is over reaching here. Being different is no reason to take people kids away. I thought electing the ONE was going to fix all of these issues?

Kjeil on January 21, 2009 at 6:02 PM

Y’all are missing the point.

seejanemom on January 21, 2009 at 5:56 PM

No, I don’t think anyone is. Most people agree with the point you’ve just made. Still, even she doesn’t know why the kids were taken.

Esthier on January 21, 2009 at 6:03 PM

Hitler a hero?

Okay, by that standard…

Prez Obama is inarticulate.
Sen. McCain is a coward.
Gov’r Palin is coldhearted.
Rudy Giuliani is weak and a socialite.

I hope you get it…

HotAirJosef on January 21, 2009 at 6:04 PM

This is such a strange family with twisted morals, pathetic parenting skills and a perverse devotion to the most vile man in history. You take all that, add in a random murder and you have a Law and Order episode being written right now.

sherry on January 21, 2009 at 6:06 PM

I will donate a dollar to send the entire family to iran. The little iran worm has some sort of problem with the Jews.
L

letget on January 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM

Scumbags will be scumbags. I see little difference between these idiots and most other leftists.

nelsonknows on January 21, 2009 at 6:11 PM

I’m gonna name my child “erectile dysfunction” and see if that affects his life in any way. I’ll call him Ed.

Hey, the good Captain Morrissey might just keelhaul you for that one.

PA Cat on January 21, 2009 at 6:14 PM

All those hitler lovers look alike

Locrian on January 21, 2009 at 5:54 PM

Truth be told, lots of unabashed Hitler loving Jew haters don’t look anything like this family.
But it’s always fun to sensationalize bigoted whites-everyone jumps on that bandwagon. But when it’s a Muslim marching in a pro-Palestine march with swastikas and “death to Jew” signs, well, than, that’s a whole different story. Much more nuanced, that.
And the children that attend, carrying those same signs and their clothes splattered with mock blood, oh, that’s just a cultural thing.
How come no one is taking those kids, most likely named after the pedophile Muhammad, away from those parents?
Govt wouldn’t touch that.

Since when does the government have the right to make these sort of judgments and take children away from their parents?

CarolynM on January 21, 2009 at 6:14 PM

Media attention. Some folks will do anything for it. They’re hoping for a book deal and then do the talk show circuit, where they will claim total innocense. Hell, it worked for Ayers.

scalleywag on January 21, 2009 at 6:15 PM

I should have named my first kid “whiskey nut” but common sense….and my wife prevailed.

Bfunky292 on January 21, 2009 at 6:16 PM

Nobody would be saying a thing if they’d named the kid Joseph Stalin or Fidel Castro.

Percy_Peabody on January 21, 2009 at 5:53 PM

Or Che. I wonder how many little Che’s there are.

scalleywag on January 21, 2009 at 6:18 PM

I say there must be another reason the kids were taken. Any parent who would be so callous as to name their child this has got to have some other issues as well. Maybe they’re methheads or something.

scalleywag on January 21, 2009 at 6:20 PM

Actually Hitler DID defeat Germany in WWII. He directed resources that he could have used to win the war, toward exterminating Jews. If he had been smarter Germany probably would have won. But I doubt that’s what she meant.

When they came for the nazis I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a nazi……….

deewhybee on January 21, 2009 at 6:20 PM

Well…..

Im offended by our new President. B. Hussein.

Saddam Hussein killed tons of people. You dems are SO offensive to elect a Hussein to Office.

JihadKiller1s1k on January 21, 2009 at 6:26 PM

I say there must be another reason the kids were taken. Any parent who would be so callous as to name their child this has got to have some other issues as well. Maybe they’re methheads or something.

scalleywag on January 21, 2009 at 6:20 PM

That woman is too meaty to be a methhead.

Disturb the Universe on January 21, 2009 at 6:29 PM

My husband has friends that wanted to name their kids Ricin and Sarin (or however they’re spelled). They’re unable to have kids, so it didn’t happen. If you didn’t know ricin and sarin were deadly, they’d make pretty names.

Parents should be able to name their kids what they want, within reason. No profanities, no symbols or numerals (pronunciation issues), but other than that, it’s up to them. If my neighbor’s kid was named Hitler, I’d avoid them and discourage my children from befriending them, but ultimately, I would be thankful we live in a free speech country. My neighbor would have the right to worship Nazis, and I’m going to be okay with that. After all, I might be doing something they find objectionable.

Anna on January 21, 2009 at 6:30 PM

Isn’t Freedom in America Great! But Freedom also means any racist idiot can get himself 15 minutes of fame. Just look at who is occupying the oval office. You have to take it, warts and all.

Zorg on January 21, 2009 at 6:32 PM

Again the government is over reaching here. Being different is no reason to take people kids away.

Kjeil on January 21, 2009 at 6:02 PM

How can the government be over reaching when the state publicly and emphatically stated that they did not remove the kids because of their names and where our constitution protects people’s political beliefs, no matter how stupid those beliefs are?

Blake on January 21, 2009 at 6:39 PM

“Do you really want a couple of Nazi lovers to be raising kids? I didn’t think so”

Since when is it appropriate for the government to determine whether or not children could stay with their parents based on the government’s approval of the parent’s political beliefs, however reprehensible?

CPS operates with very few checks and balances, and while I don’t like this couple’s belief’s, I can easily believe CPS stepped in with no other issue than their vile politics.

And that’s more vile than their politics.

DeputyHeadmistress on January 21, 2009 at 6:41 PM

I think it’s time to thin the herd. Let’s come up with a list of qualifications.

stonemeister on January 21, 2009 at 6:45 PM

Saw this great comment on a different site:

So if the State takes your children away if you name them after a mass murderer that wished to exterminate all of the Jews, where do they plan on storing all of the children named “Mohammad” in New Jersey?

beachgirlusa on January 21, 2009 at 6:46 PM

Where are all the lawyers? Surely the ACLU would want to jump on this one – or some ambulance chaser for some face time on camera.

Since when do little things like names make an attorney cringe?

tru2tx on January 21, 2009 at 6:51 PM

Why not saddle them with a name like “Giant Turd Burger”, that’s different too!!!

Morons, Hitler helped Germany in WW2

HarryStar on January 21, 2009 at 7:19 PM

A Fascist complaining about a government controlling their lives. I smell irony.

lorien1973 on January 21, 2009 at 5:25 PM

If I remember correctly, the Germans were Socialist. The Italians were the Fascist.

Johan Klaus on January 21, 2009 at 7:20 PM

No, I don’t think anyone is. Most people agree with the point you’ve just made. Still, even she doesn’t know why the kids were taken.

Esthier on January 21, 2009 at 6:03 PM

You are right…I reread the tenor of the comments…but as always, there are the boobs ***ahemalahahem*** who only see it as BADBADBAD. ;)

seejanemom on January 21, 2009 at 7:25 PM

They should have named them, Meine Eltern sind dumm Kopf.

Johan Klaus on January 21, 2009 at 7:25 PM

How can the government be over reaching when the state publicly and emphatically stated that they did not remove the kids because of their names and where our constitution protects people’s political beliefs, no matter how stupid those beliefs are?

CPS has a long history of lying about why they take kids. And CPS doesn’t view itself as limited by the constitution, either.

DeputyHeadmistress on January 21, 2009 at 7:26 PM

So if the State takes your children away if you name them after a mass murderer that wished to exterminate all of the Jews, where do they plan on storing all of the children named “Mohammad” in New Jersey?

beachgirlusa on January 21, 2009 at 6:46 PM

NICELY DONE!!!!!!!!! A “10″ FOR THE CHICK IN THE BIKINI!!!!!

seejanemom on January 21, 2009 at 7:26 PM

Well…..

Im offended by our new President. B. Hussein.

Saddam Hussein killed tons of people. You dems are SO offensive to elect a Hussein to Office.

JihadKiller1s1k on January 21, 2009 at 6:26 PM

Just how stupid are you? The name Hussein was popular before Saddam. It’s still common, just like Mohammad. Not to mention, Obama was born damn near 50 years ago before America first went to war with Iraq. Perhaps you just don’t like Arab sounding names.

These people are free to name their kids whatever they choose. I don’t think the state can take your kids because of their names. These people have more nuts in their squirrel hole than we know about.

***
@seejanemom
I have kids. I would not feel free if the state took my kids. They aren’t as free as you contend.

The Race Card on January 21, 2009 at 7:28 PM

Well at least those parents didn’t name their kids “Bush” or “Republican” That could get them the death penalty.

rbj on January 21, 2009 at 7:29 PM

So if the State takes your children away if you name them after a mass murderer that wished to exterminate all of the Jews, where do they plan on storing all of the children named “Mohammad” in New Jersey?

beachgirlusa on January 21, 2009 at 6:46 PM

I agree with your general point. But I don’t see where it’s been established that is why this family had their kids taken? Do you think you are the only person to make this argument. There is likely some other reason (on paper) even if the impetus was the news stories about their names.

The Race Card on January 21, 2009 at 7:30 PM

Adolph is a popular Spanish name – Adolfo. So is Jesus.

I went to school with a Che. Hell, I have a friend of 20 years named Elvis.

A rose by any other name would smell like controversy.

The Race Card on January 21, 2009 at 7:35 PM

These people are the Master Race? Good Lord.

packsoldier on January 21, 2009 at 7:53 PM

They should have named them, Meine Eltern sind dumm Kopf.

Johan Klaus on January 21, 2009 at 7:25 PM

I would have used ScheissKopf(en?), but heh. + 1

Anna on January 21, 2009 at 7:55 PM

I guess the state could force ABORTION on people this dumb./sar

RalphyBoy on January 21, 2009 at 7:56 PM

She’s a moron but, in America, you can name your kids anything you want. If its a crime then we need to call child protective services on everyone that named their kid “Shaquitta”, Jewlyawnique or BonQuiQui. BTW, they would have to seize every D-bag celebrity’s kid. (example: “Kal-El” – Nicolas Cage)

These people are stupid but not criminals and certainly do not deserve to have their kids taken away on the basis of their names.

Claypigeon on January 21, 2009 at 7:59 PM

I’m thinking the kids were taken away because there is something mentally wrong with this woman. And her husband. Seriously, what is up with this interview?

And I’m calling BS on the police telling her there were no signs of abuse on the kids.

mjk on January 21, 2009 at 8:04 PM

Is it really true that I can name my child anything I want? Can I name him Fuck Jews Smith? Nigger Lover Jones? Really?

Someone said “no profanities.” Well, why not? Either I can name my kid whatever I want, or I cannot. And if I cannot, then you are conceding that we can place rules on what someone names kids; we’re just quibbling on what those rules should be. The way I see it, if any content-based name restrictions are acceptable, then these sorry excuses for parents ought to be on the wrong side of them. But don’t go throwing out technicalities like “profanity” without real justification.

Spanking is acceptable (at least for now), but beating your kids severely isn’t, even if they ultimately heal completely (physically). Like it or not, as a society we have accepted that CPS is owed a certain amount of discretion, a certain amount of judgement. Yes they should err on the side of parental freedom when there is a gray area. And certainly, when it comes to naming a child, far far more discretion should be given than when it comes to judging physical abuse.

But I guess I’m not convinced yet. One easy case for me are the made-up meaningless names. I’ve got no problem with them. I mean, I think they’re dumb, yeah, but I can’t see restricting them. But I don’t know, I think someone could convince me that naming a white kid Nigger Lover Jones crosses some sort of line to abuse. Try me.

mcg on January 21, 2009 at 8:24 PM

I’m waiting for someone to name their kid Satan.

johnnyU on January 21, 2009 at 8:27 PM

I’m waiting for someone to name their kid Satan.

johnnyU on January 21, 2009 at 8:27 PM

I actually know of a family who named their two kids:
1. Satan
2. Lucifer

Guess what? DFS/CPS took those kids away too.

mjk on January 21, 2009 at 8:41 PM

You’re kidding me! Where was this at?

newton on January 21, 2009 at 9:42 PM

Oh, damn! I actually meant this:

I actually know of a family who named their two kids:
1. Satan
2. Lucifer

Guess what? DFS/CPS took those kids away too.

mjk on January 21, 2009 at 8:41 PM

You’re kidding me! Where was this at?

newton on January 21, 2009 at 9:42 PM

That’s the mom?

No offense to the hosts of HA but that “gal” looks like Ed’s brother.

highhopes on January 21, 2009 at 9:49 PM

The state should have no right to take her children away just because of what their parents chose to name them. As stupid as it seems to me to name your kid Adolf Hitler, or genghis kaun, or Joseph Stalin, or Osama Bin Laden, or Barrack Obama, it’s not a crime. Give the woman back her children!! She should sue the state for unlawfully taking her children away and I have to tell you, if I were put on a jury, I would have to give her the win.

Dollayo on January 21, 2009 at 10:00 PM

You’re kidding me! Where was this at?

Colorado. And yeah, they were mentally not all there.

mjk on January 21, 2009 at 10:15 PM

I guess I should change my mind about naming my future son Joseph Stalin, huh? I thought it had a nice ring to it.

Grafted on January 21, 2009 at 10:31 PM

Mandatory sterilization for cretins.

LimeyGeek on January 21, 2009 at 5:21 PM

I am the farthest thing from an apologist for these STUPID parents, but it is hard to legislate stupidity out of a person and did you realize that you statement above could easily be attributed to Hitler…isn’t that the same type of stuff he threw out against the Jews to make people hate? Just asking. Sterilazation should only be consider as punishment for Rapists and child molestors, captital punishment for murders.

RedLizard64 on January 21, 2009 at 11:01 PM

Those parents are idiots. They say Hitler was a hero and are willing to sing his praises by naming their poor son after him.

Maybe they should have taken their time, long before naming the poor kid, and tried to find out about der Fuhrer’s last-known great-nephews, the sons of William Patrick Hitler, all of whom live here in these United States (In fact, they live in the NY/NJ/CT area.) If those three (a fourth brother died a long time ago) were as proud as those idiot parents of their “great”-uncle, they would have NOT changed their names, lived lives of complete anonymity, and just about pledged themselves to make their cursed bloodline extinct from the human race. (As in, no sex, no marriage, no children. Period.) All of these brothers were born and grew up here, with the Baby Boomers. And all are ashamed of their cursed past.

As for me, I will always respect their anonymity, because they are pursuing a rather noble cause, for the sake of humanity. Now, those guys are not idiots.

Unlike the parents of that poor little boy.

newton on January 21, 2009 at 11:37 PM

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