Six more pardon days left for Bush
posted at 9:50 am on January 14, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
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Byron York checks his calendar and wonders when George Bush will use his pardon power to grant clemency to Scooter Libby. Bush has until the morning of January 20th to issue any executive grants of pardon or commutation, and thus far, he hasn’t shown much inclination to change the conservative approach he’s taken over the last eight years. Can we expect a Clintonesque flurry of last-minute actions, or has Bush done all he plans?
The president has less than a week left to pardon Libby, whose jail sentence Bush commuted in 2007. (Libby still paid a $250,000 fine.) But even though it’s the president’s power alone to pardon, all eyes are on Vice President Cheney, Libby’s old boss. People who paid close attention to the case are looking for any sort of signal from Cheney that something is up, and they’re getting nothing. “I’ve seen the VP recently, and he doesn’t talk about this stuff — never would,” says the first Libby ally. “But we all assume — ‘we’ meaning people who know the case and who know Scooter — that the VP has interceded with the president and made his pitch. It would be irrational not to assume that.” …
The Iran-Contra pardons, to which Love referred, came on Christmas Eve, 1992, when George H. W. Bush, then just a few weeks from leaving office, pardoned former Defense Secretary Caspar Weinberger, former National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane, former top CIA official Clair George, and four others involved in the Iran-Contra affair. Bush made clear that he was trying to right a political wrong. “The prosecutions of the individuals I am pardoning represent what I believe is a profoundly troubling development in the political and legal climate of our country: the criminalization of policy differences,” the president wrote in an impassioned pardon statement. “These differences should be addressed in the political arena, without the Damocles sword of criminality hanging over the heads of some of the combatants.”
The question now, for Libby and his supporters, is whether George W. Bush will follow his father’s example. Even though words are few, emotions are quite intense. “If it doesn’t happen, I’m afraid the president’s legacy on this will be one that is pretty ugly,” says the first Libby ally quoted in this story. “This guy took a bullet for the White House, in an absolutely outrageous, unfounded prosecution by an out-of-control prosecutor. For the president not to recognize that fact, and not to pardon Scooter Libby at this point, would be viewed as disgraceful.”
It’s possible that the Blagojevich scandal may have put a commutation for Libby out of reach. Without a doubt, a pardon would be seen as a slap at Patrick Fitzgerald, and Bush may want to avoid that at such a politically sensitive moment in Illinois. Also, significant differences exist between the 1992 situation and Libby’s predicament. Bush 41 pardoned the people in the Iran-Contra probe for charges that resulted directly from policy, while Libby got convicted of obstruction of justice and perjury. Fitzgerald never did bring charges against anyone else, which makes the “political” accusation much less convincing.
One point worth noting: Libby has not applied for a pardon. At all. Apparently, Libby and his supporters expect Bush to grant the pardon without a request, which seems like a foolish way to approach this. It gives Bush an easy out by saying that he assumed Libby didn’t want the pardon at all.
Other potential pardon recipients await as well, especially Ignacio Ramos and Jose Compean. Many on the Right want the two Border Patrol agents pardoned, or at least given commutations. Bush has not given any indication that he will grant any sort of clemency to the two agents, which has some immigration-enforcement advocates upset. Andy McCarthy has written extensively on the issues surrounding their conviction and has argued repeatedly that they do not deserve clemency.
Pardons and clemency rarely go to the innocent, however. Occasionally, an executive will use that power to address an injustice that the courts are too slow to remedy. For the most part, though, clemency gets used to clear the records of people who have already served their time and repaid their communities or have at least acknowledged the error of their ways — or in some cases, to make a political point. Bush has been slow to use that power for any of those purposes during his administration. I wouldn’t expect him to change now, even with a deadline fast approaching.
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Madoff?
molonlabe28 on January 14, 2009 at 9:56 AM
Just for fun, Bush should pardon Charles Manson, have Chuck back in circulation on the streets of Hollywood.
He might get all those self-important “movie stars” to finally shut up if they had to spend time worrying about having their heads hacked off after the reconstituted Manson Family busts through the door.
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 9:56 AM
Libby, great, but there are just two that I am interested in…just two Americans serving their country who were railroaded into jail.
Imagine shooting an illegal invader, drug dealer, in the butt, and ending up in jail.
right2bright on January 14, 2009 at 9:56 AM
Something tells me he’ll do it.
artist on January 14, 2009 at 9:56 AM
Do you know what bothers me about your post?…I kind of like it, I got a tingling feeling up my leg…
right2bright on January 14, 2009 at 9:58 AM
He sure as heck BETTER. And Scooter, too. All railroaded.
Warner Todd Huston on January 14, 2009 at 10:00 AM
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 9:56 AM
After all, he was just a misunderstood songwriter who was really into the later Beatles stuff. /sarc
kingsjester on January 14, 2009 at 10:00 AM
done
Wade on January 14, 2009 at 10:02 AM
They obviously messed with the wrong cartel. Do you presume there are no ‘Gringo’ cartels?
mustang1 on January 14, 2009 at 10:06 AM
The real question for me is whether Bush will pardon people involved in Gitmo and warrantless wiretapping. I believe that Bush should absolutely do that. The Republican Party is effectively dead as a major national party due, in part, to Bush’s actions and inactions in office. The least Bush could do now is allow Republican staffers and non-partisan military and intelligence folks to live out their lives in the private sector in peace.
Outlander on January 14, 2009 at 10:06 AM
I’m an ardent supporter of President Bush’s, but if he fails to pradon the two Border Agents I will be very heartbroken. These two men deserve a Nations thanks, not prison. Until we wake up and fight back, we are doomed…
Mark Garnett on January 14, 2009 at 10:07 AM
I do not understnd how he can NOT do this! It defies logic.
katy on January 14, 2009 at 10:09 AM
The agents were actually going against the established government policy of looking the other way.
Johan Klaus on January 14, 2009 at 10:09 AM
Campean & Ramos
rbj on January 14, 2009 at 10:10 AM
Sounds like a darn good plan to me!
becki51758 on January 14, 2009 at 10:11 AM
As a two-time voter for Bush, his legacy will be defined, in my mind, by his decision on the border agents. Regardless of the good that he’s done, you don’t persecute Americans and let a drug smuggler run free and get a star on the walk of fame. If he doesn’t pardon them, I’ll file his presidential legacy with Jimmy Carter’s.
orlandocajun on January 14, 2009 at 10:11 AM
Campean & Ramos
Johan Klaus on January 14, 2009 at 10:12 AM
Libby yes, and he could fire Fitzgerald for that on the way out the door except for the Blago mess that has come up.
jp on January 14, 2009 at 10:13 AM
Campean & Ramos
Viper1 on January 14, 2009 at 10:13 AM
I don’t know, see the Andrew McCarthy pieced linked above.
jp on January 14, 2009 at 10:14 AM
Campean and Ramos won’t get pardons.. They were being very exclusive to those people we need in the republican party..
/sarc
DaveC on January 14, 2009 at 10:14 AM
That’s a good post, I had to read it twice…
right2bright on January 14, 2009 at 10:14 AM
Pardon Ramos and Compean. That’s wishful thinking, because he won’t…:(
The Dean on January 14, 2009 at 10:15 AM
I would put money on Madoff before Campean and Ramos.
I am doubting Libby will get a pardon either.
Mr. Joe on January 14, 2009 at 10:16 AM
I don’t care what Andy McCarthy says. I’ve had enough of these cosmopolitan conservatives…
The Dean on January 14, 2009 at 10:17 AM
Let the rich, well-connected white people start an orderly line up outside the White House and wait their turn.
Presidential pardons are bullsh*t. Always have been, always will be.
Dave Rywall on January 14, 2009 at 10:20 AM
Allah P. must have a different definition of ‘wise man’ than I do..
DaveC on January 14, 2009 at 10:23 AM
After all, he was just a misunderstood songwriter who was really into the later Beatles stuff. /sarc
kingsjester on January 14, 2009 at 10:00 AM
As Sam Kinnison said, Manson might as well have blamed “The Monkeys”.
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 10:23 AM
^^^^
forgot the link
DaveC on January 14, 2009 at 10:24 AM
Good thing your opinion really matters.
thomasaur on January 14, 2009 at 10:25 AM
Good thing your opinion really matters.
thomasaur on January 14, 2009 at 10:25 AM
——-
You are entirely correct, anonymous web board poster.
Dave Rywall on January 14, 2009 at 10:29 AM
Who cares what Andy McCarthy says? I’ve heard Rep. Dana Rohrabacher and others I respect speak passionately in defense of Ramos and Compean. Rep. Rohrabacher and his staff have dedicated a lot of time and energy investigating their case and they have concluded Ramos and Compean deserve their freedom. If you have taken more than a cursory look at that case you know there was something wrong with that prosecution. I believe George Bush and his old buddy US Attorney Johnny Sutton have some explaining to do. There is much more to this case than meets the eye. I don’t accept anything the prosecution has said at face value.
flyfisher on January 14, 2009 at 10:29 AM
That is how you got released… isn’t it DryWALL?
katy on January 14, 2009 at 10:29 AM
Dave, aren’t you a Canadian?
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 10:32 AM
Dave, aren’t you a Canadian?
That explains the hemp-smelling tuque he always wears.
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 10:39 AM
I don’t know if this will come up on Hannity, Imus is going to be on Hannity tonight and tomorrow.
http://imustimes.wordpress.com/2009/01/14/imus-grants-hannity-interview/
Imus did support John McCain, during the Presidential Campaign. Has John McCain commented on the lack of pardons for the Border Agents?
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/imus-to-appear-on-hannity-there-will-be.html
Dr Evil on January 14, 2009 at 10:40 AM
After dealing with the justice system, with a family member, I am inclined to agree with you.
Johan Klaus on January 14, 2009 at 10:41 AM
I don’t mind that so much. I just wonder why he’s always here commenting on internal US affairs while Canada needs his attention.
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 10:41 AM
It’s because Canada is really irrelevant, and as goes the US, so goes Canada…well, except Canada has more conservative leaders at this time. But the Pendulum swings…
kirkill on January 14, 2009 at 10:44 AM
Free Ramos & Campean
kirkill on January 14, 2009 at 10:45 AM
The Peoples Utopian Paradise of Canada.
Johan Klaus on January 14, 2009 at 10:45 AM
Free Ramos & Campean, Free Ramos & Campean, Free Ramos & Campean………
Johan Klaus on January 14, 2009 at 10:47 AM
I don’t mind that so much. I just wonder why he’s always here commenting on internal US affairs while Canada needs his attention.
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 10:41 AM
Maybe because they know him up there.
kingsjester on January 14, 2009 at 10:48 AM
+1
melda on January 14, 2009 at 10:50 AM
They’re just 8 years behind and 4 years ahead.
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 10:57 AM
I am a lawyer who entered law school with noble notions of justice. But when first confronted with the realities of our judicial system in the late 80’s and early 90’s, my Atticus Finch idealism gave way to skepticism and cynicism. It’s sad to discover for yourself that the emperor has no clothes.
flyfisher on January 14, 2009 at 10:57 AM
And those of us here in Crook County Illinois are patiently waiting to see if Bush will pardon our other Governor, George Ryan.
We are sick to death of listening to “Mrs. Ryan” whining and begging to let her poor hubby out cause she’s so lonely.
Knucklehead on January 14, 2009 at 10:57 AM
I guess I’ll have to be the fly in the ointment for Ramos and Compean. The problem isn’t that they shot an illegal alien, the problem is that they failed to follow policy and tried to cover it up.
The conservative 5th Circuit upheld the convictions, so the problem wasn’t Sutton.
You’ll just have to excuse me. I have a problem when I see conservatives demanding freedom for a couple of dirty law enforcement officers who didn’t to their job and tried to hide it.
6 Q. Now, let me show you Government’s Exhibit 75. Do you
7 recognize that? Is this part of your firearms policy manual?
8 A. Yes, sir.
9 Q. And I’m referring you to page 21 of 64, Number 2 on that
10 page. Doesn’t it tell you that you’re required to report a
11 shooting within one hour?
12 A. Yes, sir.
13 Q. And you knew that it was your responsibility, correct?
14 A. Yes, sir.
15 Q. And you didn’t do that, did you?
16 A. No, sir.
17 Q. And, in fact, 29 days passed before anyone knew that you
18 had shot. Is that true, sir?
19 A. Yes, sir.
**************
25 Q. And you did not tell — you had two supervisors there at
1 the scene, right?
2 A. Right.
3 Q. And you didn’t tell either of them, according to the
4 policy, that you discharged your firearm?
5 A. No.
6 Q. And neither did Mr. Compean?
7 A. No.
8 Q. If you had, one of these thick reports would have been
9 generated, right?
10 A. I guess so.
****************
3 Q. Okay. This is what the firearms policy calls a reportable
4 shooting, correct?
5 A. I believe so.
6 Q. Well, you taught it for five years. If you don’t remember,
7 I can give you the policy to refresh your memory.
8 A. Yes, ma’am.
9 Q. It is a reportable shooting?
10 A. Yes, ma’am.
11 Q. And when there’s a reportable shooting, the first thing
12 you’re supposed to do is secure the scene, correct?
13 A. I believe so.
14 Q. You didn’t secure the scene?
15 A. No.
Commute? I wouldn’t have a problem with that. Pardon? Hell no.
Those two should never be in law enforcement of any kind again.
.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 10:59 AM
-1
What is it that is so difficult here to be able not to lie about the facts of this case?
wise_man on January 14, 2009 at 11:00 AM
It’s because Canada is really irrelevant, and as goes the US, so goes Canada
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 10:41 AM
I will give Canada one thing, they all but told the UN Human Rights Council (*snort*) to pound sand up their crack during the council’s attempt to condemn Israel, and they did so completely alone.
Well, two things: Their boys can really fight.
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 11:02 AM
It’s been a while since I’ve heard and read the details of their case. But if memory serves their supervisors had a hand in the way they acted. Also, is failure to follow policy guidelines a crime?
I wouldn’t mind if their sentences were commuted. But to leave them in prison when murderers and violent felons get less time is immoral.
flyfisher on January 14, 2009 at 11:06 AM
What is it that is so difficult here to be able not to lie about the facts of this case?
Uhhh, he wasn’t lying.
The drug smuggler was convicted for a later drug smuggling incident which occurred after he was given his get out of jail free card for testifying against the Border Patrol agents.
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 11:06 AM
flyfisher on January 14, 2009 at 11:06 AM
1) Read the trial transcripts. Wayyyy too much misinformation going on about those two.
2) If the Left is to be criticized by the Right for its Moral Relativism, what does that say about us when we do it?
.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 11:09 AM
No disrespect for Canada intended on my part (the quote appearing above my name in your post wasn’t actually my words).
I just wonder why Dave seems to think his views of American internal politics are of much interest to Americans while Canada so clearly needs his intellectual horsepower applied to its own issues.
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 11:14 AM
Sutton has said he prosecuted them for failing to file written reports. Yet according to World Net Daily, “A DHS investigative report written April 12, 2005, that documented seven additional Border Patrol agents and two supervisors were present at the scene of the shooting for which Ramos and Compean are imprisoned. The memo stated these agents and supervisors “assisted in destroying evidence of the shooting, and/or knew/heard about the shooting.” The memo also states all the agents and supervisors on the scene were equally guilty for not filing a written report. Question: Why didn’t Sutton prosecute any of these additional seven agents and two supervisors who were present on the scene of the Davila drug smuggling incident?”
Plus, it’s been widely reported that Sutton’s office withheld evidence. I don’t care what the trial transcript says, something was rotten in that prosecution.
flyfisher on January 14, 2009 at 11:14 AM
Agree
crash72 on January 14, 2009 at 11:17 AM
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 11:14 AM
Yeah, sorry about that, somehow I managed to mix your name with someone else’s words. My PC and I are sometimes at odds with one another.
Bishop on January 14, 2009 at 11:26 AM
I will never forgive him if he doesn’t.
PattyJ on January 14, 2009 at 11:31 AM
Like i have said before Bush will not pardon these 2 men just because it would make his good friend Johnny Sutton look bad.He has said as much before.This is ashame but we all know that when it comes to choosing between ileagls Mexicans and Americans Bush will come down on there side ever time.It does not matter to Bush that they shot a drug dealer scum bag.Bush beleaves Mexicans frist ever one else get in line.
thmcbb on January 14, 2009 at 11:37 AM
There aren’t too many people as conservative as I am, but I have to weigh in on GT’s side on this one. I don’t have much of a problem with commuting their sentences. While I don’t profess to be a legal expert, it sure seems that they received sentences disproportional to the actual crime. However, I have a real problem with those who think that they should receive full pardons. Do we really want the POTUS to send a message that it’s OK for law enforcement personnel to cover up a crime?
President Bush has used his pardons judiciously at this point. Personally, I think Scooter Libby deserves one more than anyone after being railroaded by a guy who knew who leaked Valerie Plame’s name two days into the investigation.
RedinPDRM on January 14, 2009 at 11:40 AM
I don’t mind that so much. I just wonder why he’s always here commenting on internal US affairs while Canada needs his attention.
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 10:41 AM
——-
Yeah, if there’s one thing that Americans never do, it’s comment on other countries’ internal affairs. Thanks for the laugh.
Dave Rywall on January 14, 2009 at 11:41 AM
I don’t much. Here I am sitting in the PRC for years and I almost never comment on the PRC’s internal affairs, certainly not on a local website ;-)
DarkCurrent on January 14, 2009 at 11:47 AM
Perhaps he’ll get a last-second pardon or will have to face what any other citizen will face – a record.
Save it for the two border patrol agents.
sethstorm on January 14, 2009 at 11:48 AM
Good thinking DC. : – O
thomasaur on January 14, 2009 at 11:49 AM
GWB, sir please pardon Chuck Berry.
pabarge on January 14, 2009 at 11:55 AM
Because it just bore repeating.
DeathToMediaHacks on January 14, 2009 at 11:56 AM
I’m afraid to read the commentary but I’ll say the obvious: Dubya ain’t gonna undo the hard work of his good buddy, Johnny Sutton. Why? Because Ramos and Compean are the sacrificial lambs for the preservation of the open border policy. We can’t have border agents doing their job when the ‘gov’t’ has made it ‘clear’ thru http://www.spp.gov (The Security Prosperity Partnership) that it intends to merge Canada, the Late Great USA and Meheeco; ‘one border is easier to protect than 3–and America’s life span is over, our sovereignty is coming down! The NAFTA Superhighway is real–check it.
All this is a ‘conspiracy theory’ only to those who refuse to see the truth…and it is horrifying. Kiss our country goodbye, I have.
God bless Ramos, Compean and their families.
Christine on January 14, 2009 at 12:01 PM
GWB could regain some credibility if he would pardon these two. This is utter garbage.
The criminal returned after he testified against the two agents, after he received free medical care to be arrested again for drug smuggling.
Can someone please explain to me what border security means in this country?
nor on January 14, 2009 at 12:09 PM
Just DO it – nike
CynicalOptimist on January 14, 2009 at 12:25 PM
Two things:
1.) It’s Ramos and COMPEAN, not campean, not campeon.
2.) It’s an insane world we live in when the drug smuggler that Ramos and Compean shot gets LESS prison time than the two BP agents who were doing their jobs. The smuggler was given limited land use immunity in order to testify against the two BP agents after he was shot. Mind you, that was AFTER he tried to smuggle in 700 lbs of marijuana. THEN, after the trial, he went back to Mexico, where he AGAIN tried to smuggle in 700 MORE lbs over the border.
It’s just wrong.
nickj116 on January 14, 2009 at 12:36 PM
Agreed. But they shouldn’t be in JAIL either!! Free Ramos and Campean! Remember that under our leftist judicial system, the jury couldn’t even be told that the guy they shot was a drug smuggler! They always side with the perps instead of the enforcers.
Christian Conservative on January 14, 2009 at 12:37 PM
“thus far, he hasn’t shown much inclination to change the conservative approach he’s taken over the last eight years.”
Got to be the only area that he has taken a “conservative” approach.
America1st on January 14, 2009 at 12:47 PM
Christian Conservative on January 14, 2009 at 12:37 PM
Should any law enforcement officer be jailed for an unjustified shooting? I think so.
Stop and think about it for a moment. Seriously.
If Ramos and Compean felt their action (shooting a fleeing suspect in direct violation of BP regulation) was justified, why did they cover it up by not securing the scene, picking up the shell casings and failing to report the shooting as required for 29 days (their on admission in court)?
These two swore to uphold the law. Instead, they decided to take the law into their own hands. Do we as Conservatives really want to defend that?
As to the terms of the sentencing, it was due to the Conservative-backed idea of “Minimum Sentencing”. We can argue about the fairness of the sentencing until the cows come home, but the law is the law and we supported it before Ramos and Compean got stupid. Now, because of our own hypocritical Moral Relativism, we don’t like “Minimum Sentencing” quite so much.
And that leads me to another question. If the sentencing is unfair, have either Duncan Hunter or Dana Rohrabacher put forth a bill to revisit Minimum Sentencing since R&C’s imprisonment? I don’t know which is why I’m asking. If not, why not?
.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 12:57 PM
That was the 1st thing I thought of.
Where is your sense of justice & right over wrong Mr. President Bush?!
Badger40 on January 14, 2009 at 1:07 PM
I doubt he will. W. is very bitter with the opposition he received from conservatives regarding immigration enforcement (and his unwillingness to do so unless dragged into it kicking and screaming). He’s going to let Ramos and Compean rot in jail as a big “F-ck You!” to those that opposed his dream of a nation full of people who came here illegally.
thirteen28 on January 14, 2009 at 1:12 PM
I think Bush would have pardoned the agents if he had come to the conclusion that there was a lot of gray in this case, but I think Bush has come to realize that this was a complete railroading and when Ramos and Compean get out there will be a lawsuit.
Sutton, McCarthy, and many other Bush allies are praying that the agents never see the light of day because they will be in court and soon thereafter be ruined when justice finally prevails. Bush will let them rot because he knows they are innocent, not in spite of it.
Buddahpundit on January 14, 2009 at 1:19 PM
How were they railroaded? As several people have pointed out, the problem was more the cover up than the original shooting.
That said, I do think it would be nice if Bush commuted their sentences and that they not work in any kind of law enforcement ever again.
califcon on January 14, 2009 at 1:43 PM
Their real problem was the coverup. No one is saying that they were guiltless, but under the circumstances they already have served the jail time they should. It’s time to pardon them!
Christian Conservative on January 14, 2009 at 1:47 PM
“uh, boss, those 15 loud bangs you just heard was the discharging of firearms”.
They all knew that guns were fired and they all knew that all evidence that would clear the agents just dropped off the face of the earth known as the Rio Grande.
What is also indisputable is that Ramos and Compean ( and perhaps their families ) would have been murdered by the cartel if they had filed a report. The smuggler’s cousin, Border Agent Rene Sanchez, tried to find a report of the incident so he could relay the names to the “hunting party” that the prosecution admits was formed immediately after the incident.
Buddahpundit on January 14, 2009 at 1:53 PM
You sit out on the southern border and do the jobs that these agents do and then you come back play Monday morning quarterback.
Border Patrol Agents are shot at, they have rocks thrown at them, and they still sit on an X and protect you from the danger that comes from our southern border.
Border Patrol Agents go up against drug cartels that out gun them with automatic weapons.
Border Patrol Agents do this with no thanks from either politcal party that call them racists, the general public that call them Nazis, and our justice system that call them criminals.
They have little support from Washington, but they do their job anyway.
They protect our border, day and night, so that your family can be safe from drug cartels and criminal illegal aliens.
They do this and they do make mistakes sometimes, like Ramos and Compean, because if they make the wrong move, they can be killed.
They want to come home to their families safe, so they shot a drug smuggler. We SHOULD give them a medal.
I’m glad that you feel big enough to say Bush should give them a pardon. You have no clue.
HornetSting on January 14, 2009 at 2:01 PM
Well, we have to protect your country, you pussy! That’s why we have to meddle.
Get a military and then you come back and comment, drywall.
HornetSting on January 14, 2009 at 2:04 PM
Buddahpundit on January 14, 2009 at 1:53 PM
You’re assuming that the supervisors were there on the scene or within audible range at the time R & C discharged their weapons. If you’ll check the court transcripts, I think you’ll find that the supervisors weren’t anywhere near the area at the time of the shooting.
Again, read the court transcripts. Especially Ramos’ and Compean’s own testimony. They hung themselves.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 2:34 PM
Oops…clicked “enter” too soon.
Its interesting that the other 9633+ border patrol agents don’t have a problem filing reports. Does this mean that Ramos and Compean were a special case?
.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 2:38 PM
Allow me to give you some info….a few years ago, the cartels put a $200,000 bounty on BP Agent’s heads. Four of our friends were threatened by a cartel head over a small about of cocaine that was seized and had to move in the middle of the night. There is still a bounty on BP Agent’s and other law enforcement’s heads for shooting a white supremecist…..it does happen. Go to the southern border and see for yourself. It’s a war zone. Study the Zetas….they are darlings.
HornetSting on January 14, 2009 at 2:45 PM
GT on January 14, 2009 at 2:34 PM
I have read the transcripts and all other related materials that aren’t still sealed 3 years after the incident. They haven’t even made the ballistics report public, just the initial bullet report. There is trial testimony that is still redacted, for that matter.
Buddahpundit on January 14, 2009 at 3:15 PM
Buddahpundit on January 14, 2009 at 3:15 PM
Ummm…no. You can find all 18 volumes as well as Vasquez’s testimony here. If you have the time, please show me where they were redacted.
As for the ballistic reports, it was stupid of Ramos to agree before trial that the bullet in question came from his gun.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 3:42 PM
Compean and Ramos have been used by anti-illegal immigration groups to champion their cause. I got news for you…Right Cause…wrong figureheads…These two BP Agents screwed up, and yes, they belong in prison for what they did. Mayboe not 10 years, but prison nonetheless for lying about the incident, then covering it up…
Pardons are for those who have either served their time or to those who have come completely clean with their involvement in the crime and thereafter throw themselves on the mercy of the President to EARN a pardon.
And b4 I catch crap: I am a current Federal Law enforcement officer (12 years experience), firearms and defensive tactics instructor, former Border Patrol, so yes, I believe that I have some background from where to speak on this issue…unlike most on this thread.
CapitalistPig on January 14, 2009 at 3:53 PM
Still doesn’t give anyone in Federal Law Enforcement the right to shoot someone, cover up the incident, get rid of the evidence, lie about it…
I get so sick of hearing that these 2 were “just doing their jobs” Not once in my time as a Fed LEO have I been taught to do any of the things these two did that day.
CapitalistPig on January 14, 2009 at 3:58 PM
I totally agree. I have been involved in a letter writing campaign to that end.
Glynn on January 14, 2009 at 4:08 PM
What they deserve is the shame that comes when you disgrace the uniform.
CapitalistPig on January 14, 2009 at 4:26 PM
Ummm…no. You can find all 18 volumes as well as Vasquez’s testimony here. If you have the time, please show me where they were redacted.
As for the ballistic reports, it was stupid of Ramos to agree before trial that the bullet in question came from his gun.
GT on January 14, 2009 at 3:42 PM
The details of the immunity agreement. The entire Blanchette testimony in Volume 14. Davila’s criminal history.
They had an excuse for some of the material that was sealed from public view when the transcripts were released because they were conveniently dragging out the all-time longest investigation of a routine narcotics bust. That case has been prosecuted now though so there is no excuse for these details still being sealed.
Buddahpundit on January 14, 2009 at 4:28 PM
Can Bush give out 12 million pardons?
And if he has to put names on them, will he have to use their real ones or any of their aliases?
- The Cat
MirCat on January 14, 2009 at 4:43 PM
P.S. Maybe an enterprising sheriff could put out a notice that this is happening and that illegals have to apply for it. Talk about getting a list with addresses :)
- The Cat
MirCat on January 14, 2009 at 4:45 PM
GT on January 14, 2009 at 10:59 AM
I know what the trial transcript says..but I am positive I read somewhere that the supervisers knew and basically told the agents don’t worry about it…no harm, no foul…How could the supervisors NOT know…you know supervision? When I was in the military you were taught not to be the senior man with a secret…everyone knew and a consensus of weather or not a policy was violated came out of it…but in any case the senior guys were always fired for things so high-profile…how can our system be so SCREWED up that the supervisor have no responsibility? We have the same thing of Marines being sent to Court Marshall because they were following orders of the President and their chain of command just like they swore to do…except for aggregious departure from rules the senior guys should be held accountable first…analogy…Everyone knows not to dump hazardous materials down the drain. The leadership proves they trained the person in the proper methods and practices and that a policy climate mitigated against the rebellious action, the LONE military person took in dumping the stuff…now you can go after the individual…But if I am not mistaken Navy policy is …if a guy does that and goes to the brig the commanding officer is still liable for fines!
RedLizard64 on January 14, 2009 at 4:47 PM
Ditto
RedLizard64 on January 14, 2009 at 4:48 PM
Well then GWB will go down in history as the antagonist…His well-to-do life style has insulated him from what we have to face in the streets. I still admire the amn on many accounts but he needs a good dose of his own medicine (I do not wish ill on him or anyone) but, I fuigure that if he was in a car wreck and had to spend three months in the hospital after being hit by a drunl illegal alien…he “might” see things differently.
RedLizard64 on January 14, 2009 at 4:55 PM
Maybe you could do use a favor and psot a link to how many reports invlving a chase, drug, or firearms discharge have been filed by those 9000+ plus other guys…I don’t know put I’d put even money that it doesn’t happen too often because instead of inforcing immigration laws they are enforcing presidential policy that runs 180 degrees contrary to LAW…as others have rested their cases on.
RedLizard64 on January 14, 2009 at 4:58 PM
Outlander
“The real question for me is whether Bush will pardon people involved in Gitmo and warrantless wiretapping. I believe that Bush should absolutely do that.
The Republican Party is effectively dead as a major national party due, in part, to Bush’s actions and inactions in office. The least Bush could do now is allow Republican staffers and non-partisan military and intelligence folks to live out their lives in the private sector in peace”
In order to get a Pardon or Clemency, someone needs to have committee or be charged with some kinda crime.
REAL charges, as in an actually court case.
Pathetic, Spineless, Gutless, Gutter Snipes don’t count.
Its been an amazing 8 years. The first “Impeach Bush” petition was started on January 18 2001 (Yes 3 days BEFORE Bush took office!)
http://www.uexpress.com/tedrall/?uc_full_date=20010118
IMPEACH BUSH
By Ted Rall | Jan 18, 2001 | 788 words, 0 images
Let the Long National Nightmare Begin Anew!
NEW YORK — It’s not just Clinton — the vast majority of Americans believe that Bush lost the 2000 election. Democrats and other garden-variety malcontents have already entered into a tacit agreement to consider W. the leader of a coup rather than a legitimately elected president. Democratic congressmen will fight tooth and nail to block every Bush appointee and every Bush bill they can. Rancor, bitterness and gridlock promise to rule Washington for the next four years, causing untold millions more American citizens to view their government and their political system with apathetic disgust
DSchoen on January 14, 2009 at 5:44 PM
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