Ah, but they’re the French Foreign Legion. They’re not French, so the Frenchies don’t mind spending their lives.

HondaV65 on January 12, 2009 at 2:04 PM

There’s a lot of ‘myth & romance’ surrounding the Legion too.

No I fully understand that many in the French Foriegn Legion are actually Frenchmen (for instance, all Commissioned Officers of the Legion are Frenchmen). However – they do not comprise the majority of the Legion.

It is interesting to me that the French are one of the few countries who do this. The U.S. has accepted foriegn nationals in the past – for instance Fillipinos – but that “list” of forien nationals has always been small and those foriengn nationals were integrated into our own units.

The French however – openly recruit from just about any nationality – and these legionaires are given “anonymity” – which encourages a certain sort of individual to sign on. The kind of individual who is “disposable” – or one that no one really cares about if he gets blown up in some unpopular military adventure. And if you look at the way the Legion has been employed over the years – you’ll find them in the middle of every unpopular military action France has ever gotten involved in.

This is NOT a coincidence.

I think you overestimate the effect of our casualties. The real downturn in public opinion came during the bad years in Iraq, 04-06, when the endless atrocities in Iraq against Iraqis decided many people’s opinions on the war. Although people are extremely proud of our soldiers – much, much more so than before these wars – we accept casualties as inevitable in war. It causes a lot of sadness, but the arguments in the UK are more about the causes of the war, whether it was necessary, and whether we were lied to.

As for Muslims, I think that if we had a democratic government many would be lynched. The fact that the government seems on their side is due to the fact they’re socialists and therefore PC. As soon as the Conservatives get in, things will change.

HondaV65 on January 12, 2009 at 1:47 PM

You misunderstand the Legion. It is not comprised of only foreigners. It was developed to allow foreigners an opportunity to serve France and (perhaps) become French citizens. There are plenty of Frenchmen in the Legion – probably more than the ‘official’ stats, as you can enlist under an assumed identity/nationality.

The Legion represents France in everything it does.

Admittedly, they are not without flaws.

Jaibones on January 12, 2009 at 1:41 PM

I’ll not cast the first stone….

It’s so easy to look at Red Ken the butt-boy of London, and hear the Londonistan stories and read the court decisions that sound like something Columbia sophomores would think up, and believe that Britain has turned into a worthless shithole.

But underneath all that crap is still the country that essentially birthed western democratic thought, and the desire for true freedom. They are our societal ancestors, and have been a uniquely great people.

Admittedly, they are not without flaws.

Strangely, both the British and American officers give high praise to the French. The French actually will fight like mad dogs, they say.

Please excuse me if I trust them rather than you…

By definition, legionaires aren’t French. They are paid by the French, but they aren’t French.

MarkTheGreat on January 12, 2009 at 11:54 AM

No. It is very much a part of the French military, with plenty of French servicemen.

The French Foreign Legion has a very interesting history.
Not a bad summary

unclesmrgol on January 12, 2009 at 11:52 AM

Well said.

Clearly you haven’t met any legionnaires…

LimeyGeek on January 12, 2009 at 11:51 AM

By definition, legionaires aren’t French. They are paid by the French, but they aren’t French.

If the politicians no longer have the will to deploy the military, it does not matter how well the two militaries work together.

That fact will become more apparent in the coming months here in the USA as well, as politics begins to trump everything militarily wise.

To paraphase, I’d rather have an ill equipped Brit soldier beside me than a fully equipped Frenchie behind me.

Zorg on January 12, 2009 at 11:43 AM

Clearly you haven’t met any legionnaires…

When yer wounded and dyin’ on Afghanistan’s plain
And the women come out to cut up what remains
Just roll on yer rifle and blow out yer brains
And go to your Gawd like a sojer

Rudyard Kipling

The “Thin Red Line” stands as strong as it did during Kipling’s time. God bless the British soldier.

Going into Iraq and Afghanistan, the Brits and Americans had different ways of doing things due to their past experiences – the Brits were particularly informed by their time in Northern Ireland. Both had some good ideas and some not-so-good ones, and both have learned from each other, and from their mistakes.

The biggest political problem for the Brits was that while Bush stuck to his guns, Blair was a lame duck at the time things were going badly, and his successor, Brown, wanted out of Iraq, so there was no effective leadership. For the time being Brown remains committed to Afghanistan.

What happens next depends largely on Obama, and I’m worried. Given that he can’t afford, or will renege on, most of his domestic promises to the left, he may decide to throw his devotees a bone in the form of going soft on Afghanistan.

Like me, my brother is a huge admirer of Bush and his vision, and although he wears the British uniform he signed up as much for the US as he did for the UK. He is more than a little concerned about what the Obama strategy will be.