UN spokesman: IDF admitted there were no mortars fired from shelled UN school

posted at 3:39 pm on January 10, 2009 by Allahpundit

Not only hasn’t the IDF made this admission to anyone else that I can find, but Israel’s ambassador to Austria insisted just yesterday that there was a Hamas weapons depot under the school.

Then again, would a UN spokesman lie this blatantly? Errr, let me rephrase: Would a UN spokesman lie this blatantly on the record, as a named source?

Hmmm.

UNRWA spokesman Chris Gunness told Haaretz yesterday that the army had conceded wrongdoing.

“In briefings senior [Israel Defense Forces] officers conducted for foreign diplomats, they admitted the shelling to which IDF forces in Jabalya were responding did not originate from the school,” Gunness said. “The IDF admitted in that briefing that the attack on the UN site was unintentional.”

He noted that all the footage released by the IDF of militants firing from inside the school was from 2007 and not from the incident itself.

“There are no up-to-date photos,” Gunness said. “In 2007, we abandoned the site and only then did the militants take it over.”

Two Hamas operatives were among the dead at the school, although conceivably they were unarmed. Two locals told the AP they saw four jihadis fire mortars from a nearby street and then run away when an Israeli shell landed close by; it was allegedly the next volley of three shells that hit the school and did the damage. Maybe the IDF misjudged the mortar battery’s position? Let me know if you see any details about this elsewhere; all I can find at the UNRWA site is this barebones press release.

Here’s an IDF video bulletin on the incident from a few days ago. Meanwhile, both the Standard and the Independent are reporting that Condi wanted to vote for the UN ceasefire resolution but was ordered by Bush to abstain at the last minute. Exit question: Anyone else actually looking forward to Hillary as secretary of state at this point?


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“There are no up-to-date photos,” Gunness said. “In 2007, we abandoned the site and only then did the militants take it over.”

Uhhh… so he ADMITS that the militants took over the site? That the UN abandoned it 2 years ago?

So, was it even still a school?

Romeo13 on January 10, 2009 at 3:44 PM

Exit question: Anyone else actually looking forward to Hillary as secretary of state at this point?

Suha Arafat-kissing Shrillary will be no different from Condi. And the idiot messiah’s Rice, who will be moved up to SecState, eventually, will be even worse than Bush’s Rice.

I don’t know why anyone thinks that Shrillary is any friend of Israel, or that she even has a clue about geopolitics, in general. She’s not and she doesn’t.

progressoverpeace on January 10, 2009 at 3:45 PM

ugh…

Still, I have a hard time believing anything the UN says. They are so bias in this conflict. I’ll wait for the IDF to finish their investigation before I believe what transpired.

Lance Murdock on January 10, 2009 at 3:46 PM

It is my understanding–and I may be wrong–that Israeli, like the U.S. Russia, and other military powers, uses counter-battery radar.

It catches shells as they are launched, does the math on the flight path to see where it originates, and then spits out the coordinates of the launch site in GPS format to friendly artillery. If all goes well and the systems are tightly integrated, they can have counter-fire raining down on the launch position within a minute.

There is always room for error, of course, when men and machines are involved, but I somehow doubt all those “innocent civilians” were spectators at a soccer game, and Gazans have been known to stand around dumbly and watch as their gunmen unwisely attack Israelis.

Bob Owens on January 10, 2009 at 3:52 PM

All this worry over this one incident that likely was justified and so little about those innocents targeted by the Jihadis.

Jamson64 on January 10, 2009 at 3:53 PM

UNRWA is the un agency which exists solely to assist thje plais.

no other group has such an arrangement.

unrwa is totally onthe enemy’s side.

“The official web site for UNRWA is prepared and maintained
by the Public Information Office, UNRWA Headquarters, Gaza.
For comments and suggestions please contact webmaster: Kamal Badran”

reliapundit on January 10, 2009 at 3:59 PM

Errr, let me rephrase: Would a UN spokesman lie this blatantly on the record, as a named source?

Yes. See, e.g., IPCC on “climate change”

rbj on January 10, 2009 at 3:59 PM

This doesn’t pass the smell test.

hillbillyjim on January 10, 2009 at 4:00 PM

I haven’t seen anything about this incident, but the IDF are insisting that the UN aid workers were attacked by gunfire from Gaza, not by them and most certainly not by tank shells.

Alas, I don’t believe a word out of the UN anymore.

I think Condi has been an absolute disaster for Israel, and I have no doubt whatsoever that the Obama administration, whoever is SecState, will be even worse. No one in the world, not even America, is willing to allow Israel to win their fight against terror. The hypocrisy of America in this is deeply disturbing to me. But I think Israel knows that she stands alone, and always has.

ProfessorMiao on January 10, 2009 at 4:02 PM

Lying liars and the lies that they tell

blatantblue on January 10, 2009 at 4:04 PM

This doesn’t pass the smell test.

hillbillyjim on January 10, 2009 at 4:00 PM

It smells sea-kitten.

the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 4:05 PM

Guiness also said afterwards, “That video by the journalist about the two kids killed by the missile on the rooftop? Totally real.”

Nethicus on January 10, 2009 at 4:05 PM

It seems to be an incredibly dangerous precedent that absolutely no “collateral damage” is allowed during combat. To expect that targeting will be 100% accurate would have the effect of paralyzing the forces of any life respecting country. This is one of the effects of “shock and awe”. We have the ability to target so well that mistakes are not acceptable by the public.
Our enemies, it would seem, are not held to the same standard.

redshirt on January 10, 2009 at 4:10 PM

On the plus side, these “militant youths” in Gaza are starting to desert.

wccawa on January 10, 2009 at 4:11 PM

This guy has been crying, “Wolf!” for some time now: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7726943.stm

MCPO Airdale on January 10, 2009 at 4:20 PM

rbj on January 10, 2009 at 3:59 PM

+1

jimmy the notable on January 10, 2009 at 4:21 PM

“There are no up-to-date photos,” Gunness said. “In 2007, we abandoned the site and only then did the militants take it over.”

The UNRWA is now demanding an objective investigation into whether the school shelling constituted a violation of international humanitarian law, and if so, that those responsible stand trial.

If the site was abandoned by the UN and the UN itself understood it to be controlled by militants, how can the UN claim that it’s shelling is a violation of international humanitarian law?

Infidoll on January 10, 2009 at 4:22 PM

The UN does seem to have a certain blindness toward the local hired help.

unclesmrgol on January 10, 2009 at 4:13 PM

” While the coalition has hinted that the United Nations had refused its offer for providing security, Secretary General Kofi Annan has said it was the duty of the coalition to do so. ”

Those UNwise idiots.

the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 4:24 PM

It seems to be an incredibly dangerous precedent that absolutely no “collateral damage” is allowed during combat. To expect that targeting will be 100% accurate would have the effect of paralyzing the forces of any life respecting country. This is one of the effects of “shock and awe”. We have the ability to target so well that mistakes are not acceptable by the public.
Our enemies, it would seem, are not held to the same standard.

redshirt on January 10, 2009 at 4:10 PM

Especially when you fight terrorist with the aim of about 100% “collateral damage”.

But the Geneva convention blames the part that puts civilians close to a military target.

the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 4:27 PM

No sympathy for the people who like to call themselves the Palestinians whatsoever. These idiots continually fire rockets into Israeli civilian locations even when they are supposedly in a “cease-fire”. If militant groups from Mexico started firing rockets into Texas cities, say El Paso…I can guarantee that even if the federal government did nothing to stop it, we would. Israel needs to make it so painful and expensive for these idiots to continue their terrorist attacks that no one in Gaza or any other area around Israel will ever consider doing it again. It seems to me that the world has forgotten what the purpose of warfare is…kill so many of the enemy, destroy so much of their infrastructure that the enemy gives up completely. In a situation where the enemy is made up of civilian combatants/terrorists that means doing so much damage that the civilians who are not involved in the terror attacks decide to turn on the ones who are and put a stop to it themselves. Lobbing a few missiles and calling it a day does not resolve a conflict…especially if you don’t target things that cause serious pain and suffering to the enemy. Ask Clinton about that strategy. Personally I’m sick and tired of how the rest of the world seems to always blame Israel for these problems yet don’t seem to want to allow Israel the same right to defense that they themselves would claim in the same situation. You want peace in the middle east? Turn loose a modern Patton with a sufficient force and orders to either subdue and civilize the inhabitants or ensure they no longer have the capacity or will to make war against anyone…ever. Then again, I’m an onry old fart who still believes that the US is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

BadMojo on January 10, 2009 at 4:36 PM

Ever since the U.N. reported that the spread of AIDS was just as prominent in heterosexuals as it was in the homosexual community I’ve refused to believe anything coming from that corrupt political body.

Always consider the source.

DannoJyd on January 10, 2009 at 4:38 PM

The hypocrisy of America in this is deeply disturbing to me. But I think Israel knows that she stands alone, and always has.

Stands alone? Where did Israel get all the weapons from? How much money do we send there annually, again? I wish my government would leave me alone if that’s how it’s defined.

angelat0763 on January 10, 2009 at 4:44 PM

Exit Q? Don’t worry about Hillary at state. The American policy for the middle east, Muslims and Islam are in the same hands that Bush entrusted them to, the Saudi’s. Huma Abedin won’t let Hill stray far from the Saudi program.

BL@KBIRD on January 10, 2009 at 4:51 PM

Especially when you fight terrorist with the aim of about 100% “collateral damage”.

But the Geneva convention blames the part that puts civilians close to a military target.

the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 4:27 PM

As I’ve said before, in other threads…

One aspect of philisophical blindness we have… the US has pushed the meme that we wage war on governments, to punish that government, and will not take it has nothing to do with the People of said country…

And yet… Hamas was VOTED in by these folks, just like the Iranian Government is voted in… how can we NOT hold the citizens of a country responsible for their governments actions, while all the time pushing Democracy down everyones throats?

If there is no consequence to the citizens of a country for their vote, then there is no reason NOT to vote these idiots into power, and retain them there… kinda like we have in the US right now… we are seeing the fruits of a Democracy when you do not hold the People responsible for their votes…

Its one reason the founding Fathers built a REPUBLIC, not a Democracy.

Romeo13 on January 10, 2009 at 4:54 PM

Romeo13 on January 10, 2009 at 4:54 PM

Well said!

BadMojo on January 10, 2009 at 5:00 PM

United Nations Religious Wacko Association.

Can’t be any worse than the rapists in the blue helmets.

BKennedy on January 10, 2009 at 5:00 PM

Waiting for the IDF to say “yes” or “no.” Don’t believe the UN since Arafat was given an opportunity to speak and berate Israel to the cheers of the jackholes in the UN General Assembly.

“In 2007, we abandoned the site and only then did the militants take it over.”

Speaking of jackholes, does this guy own one of them things called a calendar? It is 2009, moron. What the h*ll do you think those “militants” have been doing in the fricking school? Making playdough? Moron.

mjk on January 10, 2009 at 5:09 PM

UN spokesman = LIAR

JustTruth101 on January 10, 2009 at 5:25 PM

Allah, I haven’t seen that claim anywhere else. There is plenty of proof, however, that the UN lies about Israel. The UN is complicit in the kidnapping of an Israeli soldier. The UN is complicit in the use of UN ambulances to transport terrorists and weapons. The UN has Hamas members on its payroll and knows it.

I think he’s lying.

Meryl Yourish on January 10, 2009 at 5:54 PM

UN-faithful, UN-trustworthy, UN-ethical, UN-worthy of our support, UN-less we are led by UN-comprehending naifs.

Uh-oh.

drunyan8315 on January 10, 2009 at 5:55 PM

I smell sea kittens too. But you never know, the IDF might have screwed up. It happens in war. I hope that is not the case, but I am sure the press will be more than faaaaairrr about it.

Mr. Joe on January 10, 2009 at 5:56 PM

And of course the UN never makes a mistake.

Mr. Joe on January 10, 2009 at 5:57 PM

It’s probably as good a time as any to link to this year old video where a Hamas representative admits to using children, women, and the elderly as human shields, and states, “we desire death, as you desire life”.

Apparently desiring death is more desirable than actually dying.

Buy Danish on January 10, 2009 at 6:08 PM

I smell sea kittens too. But you never know, the IDF might have screwed up. It happens in war. I hope that is not the case, but I am sure the press will be more than faaaaairrr about it.

Mr. Joe on January 10, 2009 at 5:56 PM

They don’t blame israel screwing things up , UN says they target civilians intentionally.

the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 6:11 PM

It’s probably as good a time as any to link to this year old video where a Hamas representative admits to using children, women, and the elderly as human shields, and states, “we desire death, as you desire life”.

Apparently desiring death is more desirable than actually dying.

Buy Danish on January 10, 2009 at 6:08 PM

I don’t get how we can be in conflict with these guys , we also desire their death.

the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 6:16 PM

Especially when you fight terrorist with the aim of about 100% “collateral damage”.

[the_nile on January 10, 2009 at 4:27 PM]

What, exactly, constitutes 100% collateral damage? Obliteration of the universe, maybe?

Dusty on January 10, 2009 at 6:27 PM

What,the UN has a school!

canopfor on January 10, 2009 at 6:38 PM

What, exactly, constitutes 100% collateral damage? Obliteration of the universe, maybe?

Dusty on January 10, 2009 at 6:27 PM

No, I think it means damage for the sake of damage, whether civilian or military.

ddrintn on January 10, 2009 at 6:49 PM

Nothing the UN says is true. They are nothing but liars, thugs and thieves. This Global Warming fraud scheme. To take money from us and give to other Countries. If other Countries don’t comply with the UN, they get fined heavy. All a lie, to blind us. Make us think the end is near. Now Congress is trying to put together a stimulus package. Why them? They are no experts, and if they do have degrees, sure could have fooled me. Don’t surprise me that they lied. They are good at that and the Media.

sheebe on January 10, 2009 at 6:55 PM

Exit question:

Either HilRod will be a Margeret Thatcher,

which I sincerely doubt,but It’s more likely

HilRod will be a Madeline Albright!
—————————————

How about this,how about some form of Military experience
would be nice in a Secretaty of State!

Was Hillary even in Girl Guides?

At the rate that the jihady goons are trying to eliminate Israel,and so far,the Liberals of Team Hopey are unleashing the best and brightest among them,like liberal talking point operative Leon Panetta as CIA Head,and Dr.Gupta as
Surgeon General!

And of course their all political appointments,with zero
experience,and typical of a Liberal Administration during
times of War!

Oh thats right!

The liberals are only at War with the Republicans,

And hopefully,not at the expense of Israel!!

canopfor on January 10, 2009 at 7:01 PM

BKennedy on January 10, 2009 at 5:00 PM

Not wanting to defend the U.N. in any way, but it wasn’t the “blue helmets”, it was the scumbags under said helmets. They behave in such a manner – regardless of uniform.

OldEnglish on January 10, 2009 at 7:44 PM

I love hypocritical mullahs…hehe

Lance Murdock on January 10, 2009 at 8:02 PM

I haven’t seen anything about this incident, but the IDF are insisting that the UN aid workers were attacked by gunfire from Gaza, not by them and most certainly not by tank shells.

ProfessorMiao on January 10, 2009 at 4:02 PM

Maybe the terrorist fired the mortar straight up.

Johan Klaus on January 10, 2009 at 8:32 PM

Oh puh-leeze. The UN assists HAMAS to kill Jews. They’re not even neutral. The UN also claimed recently that the Israelis killed the driver of an aid truck. This was blatantly false and the TZAHAL (IDF) just release a report saying that their investigation indicates HAMAS likely killed the driver. But it wasn’t the IDF. Fvck the UN.

Andy in Agoura Hills on January 10, 2009 at 8:55 PM

What,the UN has a school!

canopfor on January 10, 2009 at 6:38 PM

Of course they have a school. Where else can you possibly learn to:
1. Undermine the Oil for Food thing
2. Rape women
3. Sell children into slavery
4. Demand sexual favors for food and aid
5. Lie about the Jews and blame them for everything
6. Prop up brutal regimes such as Iran, Iraq and the Palestinian Authority
7. etc, etc, etc

Gotta go to school for that stuff, man.

mjk on January 10, 2009 at 8:57 PM

4. Demand sexual favors for food and aid

mjk on January 10, 2009 at 8:57 PM

No, no. UN workers don’t demand sex for food and aid, they just recommend donations of sex for food and aid. This is the same sort of deal when you go into a museum and must “donate” to get in (though they won’t let you in if you don’t make at least the “recommended donation”). The lefties are great at this stuff.

BTW, up is down.

progressoverpeace on January 10, 2009 at 9:23 PM

At some point, if the liberal democracies are to be respected, they will have to show themselves still capable of terrifying rapacity and still capable of taking what they need. If the Israelis were to rip up this Hamas hovel, take it for themselves, move into it, that spectacular example would make them respected. And if they were then to start fvcking, in twenty year’s time, the IDF would have many more of what it will need most.

Kralizec on January 11, 2009 at 12:35 AM