Video: The Oscar Grant shooting
posted at 12:45 pm on January 9, 2009 by Allahpundit
Share on Facebook | regular view
Three clips, the first a TV news report so you’ll have an idea of what happened and then two different close-ups via cell phone. The shooting comes at 1:15 of the second video and 2:55 of the third. In brief: It’s early New Year’s Day, there’s a fight on the Oakland subway, the transit cops come and pull a few men aside, one of whom is Grant. He ends up sitting against a wall, then two cops maneuver him face down, presumably to cuff him. There’s a slight struggle, whereupon one of them stands, pulls his pistol — and fires, sending his colleagues backpedaling in shock. Look closely in the second clip and you’ll see that even Mehserle, the cop who pulled the trigger, seems surprised. The theory is that he meant to grab his taser and wasn’t paying attention, but (a) the gun’s in his hand for a second or two before he shoots and (b) the other cop appears to still be holding Grant down. Wouldn’t that have transferred the zap from the taser into his body?
The bullet went through Grant’s back, bounced off the floor, and ended up in his lung. He died a few hours later. There have been demonstrations ever since, with Mehserle first being put on paid leave and then quitting the force on Wednesday. It happened in full view of dozens of people, obviously, so it’s hard to believe it was deliberate, but all I can come up with by way of explanation is that he had some sort of brain freeze.
You’re watching a man die here so please observe this, your official content warning. Exit question for our police readers: Have you ever absentmindedly reached for your taser and grabbed your pistol instead? If so, don’t they feel sufficiently different in your hand that you’d know instantly? Are the two weapons even on the same side of your belt?
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Blowback
Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.
Trackbacks/Pings
Trackback URL
Comments
Comment pages: « Previous 1 ... 4 5 6
What evidence do you have of that? Firearms and ammo sales are up.
baldilocks on January 10, 2009 at 2:59 PM
Not unless the other officer either got A. hit by the leads, B. touched the leads after they hit the suspect, or C. touched the suspect between the two points where the leads struck.
Part of my taser training included holding someone up who was being tased and I didnt feel a thing.
And yes, you are not supposed to wear your taser on the same side as your gun.
SnakeintheGrass on January 10, 2009 at 3:35 PM
You misquoted my quote. It was:
While it is clearly not lost to portions of our society, there are other portions where it clearly is. (e.g. Katrina masses waiting for the gov to take care of them, every gun law in existence, and every time someone protects themselves with force they are labeled a vigilante.)
However, you are correct that I should have not made a sweeping statement such as that. I should have said that too many in our present society do not want to take responsibility for themselves, to include protecting themselves. Thankfully, there are some that still do. Those people are causing* the increase in firearms sales as you pointed out.
* Speculation and panic buying excluded.
cryptojunkie on January 10, 2009 at 3:42 PM
Man that shot was totally unnecessary. People who complain about taser guns, need to shut their cake-holes. Or else its back to the gun treatment like this poor guy. Hopefully this cop gets sentenced to some hard time.
Kyah on January 10, 2009 at 3:47 PM
Actually, I haven’t had a speeding citation in going on 10 years. If my headlight blows out while I’m driving, you know, I’m sorry but I didn’t see it. A warning would be nice. Not another f***ing tax. The missing front tag was 8 years ago, and I’d moved from a state where front tags were NOT required. So I deserve to be treated like a criminal.
And Bronze, I know you don’t care about my tale of woe. Your attitude and actions, and those of your buddies in blue, have turned this law-abiding, contributing citizen from a stalwart supporter of the police, into someone who views you all as just another armed gang, acting under the imprimatur of state authority, who get off on abusing your authority. What was the phrase used in “The Departed”? “The dirtbag air of entitlement” I think it was.
Not that it will break your heart, but please tell your pals to STOP CALLING ME for the Policeman’s Benevolent Fund, etc. I stopped giving a few years ago.
quikstrike98 on January 10, 2009 at 5:21 PM
As for “Let a criminal live with me”…have you ever lived with a bipolar manic depressive? Have you ever lived with an abusive spouse? Mine was already borderline when I met her, I loved her anyway, she got a hysterectomy, early menopause, and went off the deep end. I’m 6′0″, 195 lbs, former Marine….and I never hit her BACK. She wanted poor little bro to live with her because he got his license revoked due to DUI. I was trying to hold something together that had been miserable for 2 years already. The arguments that ensued over his staying with us weren’t worth the broken plates, the screaming, or the black eyes. Yeah, as I said when the altercation occured I’d already closed on a new house to stay in. Maybe the cops need to check up on who they’re dealing with. A simple call requesting background on my bro in law, and on me, would have turned up something rather striking: I have NO RECORD. AT ALL. He….uh, DOES. In spades.
Masochist that I am, I actually stay in touch with the ex wife now. She’s much easier to deal with when I only see her every few months. We actually have drinks occasionally. She has a new boyfriend, and he’s welcome to her issues. And yes, one night over cocktails the subject came up and she said, “You know, you’re right. You never hit me back. And I deserved it. That’s a credit to you.”
And there I was, trying to find a hotel at 11 at night, with the clothes on my back, having narrowly escaped imprisonment and unemployment thanks to your buddies who couldn’t make a basic radio call to find out who the Hell they were dealing with.
quikstrike98 on January 10, 2009 at 5:35 PM
You know, as a Sergeant of Marines, I learned the basic skill of tactfully, politely telling an officer NO, or “You’re wrong, sir”.
I don’t want or expect my ass to be kissed. I want to be treated with the SAME respect I offer to any police officer going about his duties, unless for some bizarre reason I’m caught in the process of committing some heinous felony (not something I’m habituated to). Basic courtesy goes a long f***ing way. Apparently cops don’t think they need to exercise it. They’ve got a badge and a gun, haven’t gotten laid in a couple weeks, and need a citizen to take it out on with abusive, overbearing attitude.
quikstrike98 on January 10, 2009 at 5:52 PM
It is possible the officer grabbed his firearm instead of his TAZER. Under high stress the body undergoes various physiological changes, one of which is blood flows away from the organs (brain included) and to the muscles. You become faster and stronger, but cognitive and memory function is reduced drastically. In the confusion of a high stress incident it’s quite possible the officer, via muscle memory, went for his firearm instead of his TAZER without realizing he went for the wrong weapon.
Allah, I’d strongly suggest interviewing Bruce Sidle; he’s a renowned expert on use of force/high stress incidents, and can explain this phenomena FAR better then I, or probably anyone else here.
wolfva on January 10, 2009 at 6:31 PM
well, i never claimed to be a vet. ever. and as far as being a “liberal”, i have no interest in disputing this. we know now from the declarations of palin0crats that everyone from w.f. buckley to goldwater to david horowitz are “liberals” so, objectively their compases are off, not mine. the accusation is non-falsifiable non-responsive, so i don’t have to consider it – if i’m a “liberal” by the lights of palin-worshippers and hannitybots, fine. it’s like being called a “racist” by some liberal.
all i know is that someone who responds to an incident in which an unarmed civilian is pinned to the ground by two cops while a third executes him by shrieking,”how dare you criticize the police!” is an authoritarian. i’m led to believe that the “conservative” opposition to totalitarianism of palin-worshippers is not based on first-principles, but a received paradigm of american nationalism. if they were born into soviet russia, they would not be Solzhenitsyns, they’d be supporters of the police-state apparatus.
eh on January 10, 2009 at 6:48 PM
i’ll add into the pool. i get pulled over for making a right turn at a stop sign. i am as polite. he writes the ticket and i accept it. only after i’ve allowed the man to do his job and i am in possession of the traffic citation do i ask where the stop sign was. he tells me it was at the foot of the block i had just turned onto.
when i crane my head out the window to look down the block to seewhat stop sign i had just been cited for disregarding, the cop reels back and reaches for his weapon.
eh on January 10, 2009 at 6:58 PM
how did we ever get along without the police before they were instituted?
AZ_Redneck on January 10, 2009 at 8:27 PM
i wouldn’t recommend holding your breath.
AZ_Redneck on January 10, 2009 at 8:29 PM
What is the source of that quote?
Johan Klaus on January 10, 2009 at 8:45 PM
it’s a paraphrase. don’t be an ass.
some specific examples pulled randomly from the first page of comments:
“What a bunch of ingrates in that crowd. Such lovely American citizens.”
“They have a hard job full of rules & PC crap.
I think it would be very easy in that situation to mistake one weapon for another.
When was the last time you were afraid fro your life? What did you do to defend yourself?
How clearly were you thinking at the time?”
“It’s probably the Mumia Abu-Jamal syndrome.”
“It’s strange that with a lot of these shootings and cases of “police brutality,” the events stem from people NOT DOING WHAT THEY ARE TOLD; from people refusing to subdue.”
“Cops have to make split second decisions, and they put their lives on the line every day to protect you and me. They lose them sometimes, too. When the cops stop you, you lose your Constitutional rights for the moment. You are in a police state. Act like it!”
“Doesn’t pass the “looks” test for you, eh? And you know for certain that the guy was posing no threat, eh? In other words, it doesn’t “look” like the valid police shootings your’e used to on NYPD Blue, Hawaii Five-O and Cagney and Lacey? Please, reserve your judgement based on a grainy video. Violence never looks the way it does on TV and in movies. Perhaps the officer (wrongly) perceived that Grant was going for a weapon. Tragic mistake, but a mistake nonetheless, made in a split second of indecision and wrong thinking….
Let’s get to the facts before making judgements, what do you say?”
eh on January 10, 2009 at 9:16 PM
lemme just return to that last one for a sec:
good f**king lord.
who am i going to believe? you, or my lyin’ eyes?
“it doesn’t “look” like the valid police shootings your’e used to on NYPD Blue, Hawaii Five-O and Cagney and Lacey? Please, reserve your judgement based on a grainy video. Violence never looks the way it does on TV and in movies.”
no, you’re right. in the movies, the bad guys are always in a group, brandishing and firing weapons on a solitary officer who yet manages to pick them all off. this makes the cop character look heroic.
apparently in real life, real heroism is popping a guy in the back while two other cops hold him down.
quite a mistake. the tenability of “wrongly perceiving” that someone is reaching for a weapon while their being held face-down on the concrete by two cops is roughly on the order of “wrongly perceiving” that a care in in park while it’s speeding down the highway.
right. how unreasonable of me. well let’s roll up our sleeves and get to the business of “getting the facts”. but therein lies the dillema: how can we know what really happened there without, i dunno, multiple video recordings of the incident from different angles?
eh on January 10, 2009 at 9:36 PM
“care in in park” = “car is in park”
eh on January 10, 2009 at 9:37 PM
I wont want watch the video, but seriously this is why people hate cops.
crabtree on January 11, 2009 at 12:50 AM
Brain fart. Plain and simple. The guy didn’t mean any harm because he shot past one of his friends/co-workers and clearly was disturbed by what he did. Maybe he thought he grabbed his tazer, maybe he was going through the motions of some video game, maybe he was thinking about a doughnut, who knows.
It’s sad, it’s unfortunate, it’s unforgivable, but if you have hundreds of thousands of arrests across the country you’re going to have one like this where somebody just has a brain fart. He should be punished, but no need to riot.
popularpeoplesfront on January 11, 2009 at 1:26 AM
So asking a question is being an ass?
Johan Klaus on January 11, 2009 at 2:13 AM
QS98,
Maybe I was being too rude to you. If so, I apologize. You came off as some honest citizens do: cop-haters.
As a former Marine, you know that there are some Marines that should be, just as there are cops that shouldn’t be. Sorry that you got treated the way did. 9 times out of 10 MOST cops do what they’re supposed to do and 9 times out of 10 that’s also the right thing. Life isn’t perfect and life isn’t always fair. It sounds like the cops that you dealt with were either lazy or poorly trained. There’s no reason for either. Don’t let your couple bad experiences taint the way the other 90% of cops that are doing it right.
There’s always that 10%. Remember that?
Semper Fi!
thebronze on January 11, 2009 at 2:46 AM
Hot Air should do cop threads like this more often. It quickly exposes the cop hating trolls who hide amongst us. Conservatives love and respect out troops whether they be soldiers or cops. The Loony Left hates them with an insane passion.
Guardian on January 11, 2009 at 10:27 AM
Regardless of some of the obvious plants that are trolling this blog, anytime someone tells me they don’t trust cops I agree with them to an extent.
But, let’s see. Who do I trust more to protect me in a subway car that has an unruly mob of thugs in it? A cop or any of the following?:
* DailyKOS follower
* Journalist
* Politician
* Used car salesperson
* Lawyer
* Doctor
* Grandma or Grandpa
* Construction worker
* Garbage collector
* Plumber
If I had to rely on any, or an army of all of, the top 6 to protect me I’d be dead for sure. I’d have a fighting chance with any of the last 4 but I’d prefer a cop to any of them as well.
The following is a dialog of a cop hater in his New York flat talking to another similar minded cop hater as they watch the cop killing video on TV:
“I hate cops. They’re fascists pigs! They should all be tried for war crimes and sent to Guantanamo for punishment and reprogramming and…”
Just then Bart and his friend are startled by sound of a loud crash and breaking glass.
“Oh my God! Someone trying to break into the back door of the apartment Bart! Call 911!!!”
Dorks. Every one of them.
watson007 on January 11, 2009 at 12:25 PM
Reserving judgment…
It certainly did look like the officer was shocked by his own actions, and the situation is definitely not the most likely time for a cop to just shoot someone. It wouldn’t make any sense that he was taking out his sidearm to ensure he was ready to increase force – mostly because he was still standing over the guy. Guns lose a lot of their effectiveness if you’re close enough to grab or standing over someone. Based on that I would say he probably didn’t mean to draw his weapon, but if that’s the case then this is one hell of a mistake.
That said, if a military member in a combat zone has an accidental discharge they are subject to a lot of discipline…even if the round is discharged into a clearing barrel. I would expect police officers to be held to at least as high a standard as a PFC in the Marine Corps and I’ve seen people lose rank and spend time in restriction because they didn’t have positive control over their weapon.
Bottom line: That police officer probably made a horrendous mistake, but he is fully responsible for his actions. This guy’s actions don’t change that things like this don’t happen every day. For the most part, cops do a damn good job even though they’re outgunned, underpaid, and overworked.
blankminde on January 11, 2009 at 12:37 PM
Just as Obama has restored the reputation of America, so too shall Paul Blart, Mallcop for the boys in blue.
pc on January 11, 2009 at 1:02 PM
Stop hyperventilating for a minute please. There are a very small number of no knock incidents. But on the obverse, how many cops lives have been save and how many bad guys put away because of them? More than the number of accidents most likely.
And although the SCOTUS has stated that police are not required to protect us, the vast majority of cops are good, decent people who would do whatever they needed to to save an innocent.
BierManVA on January 11, 2009 at 2:53 PM
It doesn’t expose cop hating trolls anymore than it shows blind loyalty from some regardless of how stupid, arrogant – and deadly those in law enforcement can be.
The requirements that exist for those starting in law enforcement are a joke. They still protect each other regardless of what laws and regulations are broken. It’s a joke. And for you to put the thought out there that police should not be held to a higher standard, God forbid any standard at all, and that those that criticize them for it are cop hating trolls – God help you if you ever find yourself on the wrong side of the law as they see it.
JeffinOrlando on January 11, 2009 at 4:12 PM
Or as however they find most convenient. My experience with two different girlfriends who had stalkers, as well as my own personal experience, plus talking to a female cop sister of a g/f, confirms that cops aren’t necessarily interested in seeing justice done. They want the problem to go away. You may be right, you may be the good guy, but if locking you up makes the problem go away and reduces paperwork, enjoy the baloney sandwiches. They’ll laugh about you over a beer after shift.
quikstrike98 on January 11, 2009 at 5:24 PM
No, people hate cops because they hate being told they are wrong. When ever someone tells me about how some cop was wrong about blah blah blah I always take it with a grain of salt. You can never make your determination with just one side of the story.
Hell, I have had plenty of complaints on me. It is usually someone saying I was rude to them on a traffic stop (the most common complaint I think we get). I have yet to be repremanded because *SUPRISE!* people exagerate or flat out lie because they dont think they should have gotten a ticket.
Seriously, people must forget we have dashboard cameras. I sure as hell never forget, which is why I am always polite and buisness like at the start of what ever I do. I dont get “mean” until I am pushed.
Does that mean all cops are like that? No. Just like any job there are people who shouldnt be there. I could actually name a couple of people in my own department who need to find a new proffession.
That being said, judging by his reaction in this video, it was probably an accidental discharge. But if that is the case he should have said so. Resigning and lawyering up without making any type of statment is wrong way to go.
SnakeintheGrass on January 11, 2009 at 6:19 PM
Seriously? They have you running around with the saftey on your weapon off? That’s definalty not the policy of our locals.
boomer on January 11, 2009 at 6:32 PM
Its called cocked and locked. With a good retention holster and proper training (finger off the trigger unless you are activly shooting!) the manuel saftey isnt really needed. I carry a Glock and the only external saftey on it is on the trigger, which is deactivated when you pull it.
SnakeintheGrass on January 11, 2009 at 6:40 PM
Yeah, that was my bad. I confused you with the other pro-criminal poster in this thread.
And if the “Solzhenitsyns” took power in Russia, they wouldn’t have a police force?
There is a small percentage of bad cops in the US. 99% of those bad cops are Democrat types with the typical criminal impulses of your common Democrat. Those who you refer to as “authoritarian” would love to purge them from the force.
Buddahpundit on January 12, 2009 at 4:37 AM
Boy you sure have drunk deep of the koolaid. Bad=Democrat, bad Cop=Democrat cop..
No I would say “Jack booted thug” applies to about 20% of most police forces and if you ask them they will tell you they are “conservative”.
Bradky on January 12, 2009 at 6:01 AM
Just some thoughts on police.
I want very high standards for police recruits and even higher standards for uniformed officers. They are the lions at the gate; the visible (if mostly symbolic) barrier against the evil nasties that would do harm to others. It is imperative that the majority of the populace have confidence in the honesty, professionalism and competence of those officers. High standards do not guarantee that, but they help to narrow the field. If those high standards require higher pay scales, OK. Most citizens that I know will pony up for that, IF they are assured that those tax dollars are going to that end and not into major perks for the mayor and his cronies.
It is the nature of news that “if it bleeds, it leads”. Bad behavior by one officer taints the image of all while the extra efforts of most officers goes unnoticed. Not fair, but true. One “aw, sh*t” cancels out a thousand “attaboys”.
I really believe we get the level of behavior we expect in families and in society. If we are willing to accept less than the best, that’s what we will get every time. If we demand high standards, good people will rise to them and the bad ones will be rooted out. The fly in the ointment is union involvement. Unions enforce a mediocrity that is counter to those standards.
This is why elections matter. When we value pretty faces and flowery speeches over leadership, we devalue everything those politicians have charge over, including public safety.
SKYFOX on January 12, 2009 at 6:17 AM
It “appears” to the untrained eye that this ONE Officer has make a horrible mistake OR has shot this man in a cold blooded execution. I stress this ONE Officer because I have been around and involved with Police Officers in both Houston, Texas and New Jersey. I have found the vast majority to be in the “job” for all the right reasons. I do feel bad for this young man who, at the present, “seems” to have been killed for no reason. I want to hear more, but I will say that the violence in Okland is NOT the correct responce. Crowds rioting has never solved an issue, it only makes the rift between the “good cops” and the radicals more explosive. In this ONE case, it looks pretty clear that this man died at the hands of either a CRIMINAL or a IDIOT. Blanket statements about ALL police or cops is not propper, nor is the stupid riots… But hey, it’s Okland and overrun with crazed gangs, minorities looking to sue and radical sports wack jobs who riot over a sporting event.
Mark Garnett on January 12, 2009 at 10:30 AM
As much as I respect all who wear a uniform for any of the various public services, this calls out for some serious cosequences. There may be many and sundry excuses to be offered in defense of this officer, but they are just excuses. Even if this person didn’t intend to use deadly force, they did. There is a price to be paid every single time that happens. I expect to see this person answer for what they have done. They better hire a great lawyer, and have a blind jury who can’t see what I just saw.
bigskinny on January 12, 2009 at 11:02 AM
Spot on posts eh. However, you’re not going to get much traction around here as you know. There are far more fundamentalists and authoritarians around these parts than there are true conservatives. Sad, but true.
dakine on January 12, 2009 at 1:35 PM
The vast majority of cops who go to jail end up there by engaging in activities that have nothing to with jack booted thuginess. They are usually busted engaging in typical Democrat behavior.
It would be irrational to point to an incident of a cop stealing drugs from the evidence room and selling it on the street and calling it typical cop behavior. It’s even more irrational to point to this incident, assume some sort of jack booted intent, and call it typical cop behavior.
Buddahpundit on January 12, 2009 at 5:52 PM
Comment pages: « Previous 1 ... 4 5 6