Video: Israel attacking Hamas’ infrastructure of power

posted at 8:12 am on December 29, 2008 by Ed Morrissey

NBC reports on the strategy employed by Israel in its response to a week of attacks from Hamas in Gaza. Instead of attacking Gaza’s infrastructure in general, Israel has selected its targets more precisely to humble Hamas:


The only way Israel will gain from this war will be if they can separate Hamas from its support base in Gaza. Attacking Gaza on a wide scale would bind the people to Hamas in the long and short run, but if they can eliminate the power structures of Hamas without too much collateral damage, they could weaken Hamas in the long run. I think everyone recognizes that an attack in the short run will still generate feelings of unity and support for Hamas, which means that Israel is taking the longer vision with this.

This also creates a financial problem for Hamas. Islamic University, its governing installations, and its other offices will all have to be rebuilt in the middle of a siege brought on by Hamas themselves. They need this infrastructure to undergird their power, but if they take resources needed by Gazans to survive to rebuild it, that will make them even more unpopular. With Egypt already blaming Hamas for the war and Mahmoud Abbas’ Fatah an available option, Gazans may not stick with Hamas for much longer — or so the Israelis must hope.

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Comment pages: 1 2

they need to just fire rocket after rocket…in an unsopisticated way.

tomas on December 29, 2008 at 8:16 AM

hmm..I didnt hear any totals of the dead in Israel from the missiles lobbed into their country by Hamas.

Go Israel!

becki51758 on December 29, 2008 at 8:19 AM

To be humbled is to recognize one’s errors. Terrorists are incapable of such discernment. Israel will fail – again.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 8:20 AM

The only way Israel will gain from this war …bla…bla… bla.. which means that Israel is taking the longer vision with this.

I have come to the sad conclusion that wars are caused by newsmen. Very bored and stupid newsmen who really don’t care about anything except getting in front of the camera.

Tommy_G on December 29, 2008 at 8:20 AM

The stupid Israelis are bringing about the rule of “peaceful” Fatah terrorists, who have murdered much more Jews than the Hamas. Idiots.

Aristotle on December 29, 2008 at 8:21 AM

Egypt’s understanding of Israel’s frustration with Hamas might change if they have to open up the border to fleeing civilians should a ground war open up.

Also, 18% civilian casualties won’t really drive a wedge between Hamas and the larger population of Gaza.

Nice to see Hamas numbers getting reduced but unintended consequences tend to hallmark these escalations. Meanwhile, the rockets are still being launched.

lexhamfox on December 29, 2008 at 8:22 AM

Israel should retaliate immediately after each rocket or mortar shell is fired instead of waiting so long to make their presence felt. This had emboldened Hamas, bringing more shellings. Terrorists only understand force; never diplomacy, unless it is the kind of entitlements that the UN gives.

DL13 on December 29, 2008 at 8:23 AM

Hamas, whose charter specifically calls for the destruction of the state of Israel, is listed as a terrorist organization by the United States, Canada, Japan, Australia, the United Kingdon and the European Union and is banned in Jordan.

From 2000 to 2004, Hamas was responsible for killing nearly 400 Israelis and wounding more than 2,000 in 425 attacks, according to the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

From 2001 through May 2008, Hamas launched more than 3,000 Qassam rockets and 2,500 mortar attacks against Israeli targets.

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 8:24 AM

I don’t know, Ed…the Israelis seem to be ramping up for a ground offensive, which by its nature wouldn’t be a precision attack on Hamas’ infrastructure.

flipflop on December 29, 2008 at 8:26 AM

hmm..I didnt hear any totals of the dead in Israel from the missiles lobbed into their country by Hamas.

Go Israel!

becki51758 on December 29, 2008 at 8:19 AM

In fact all you see on the media left controlled press is the staged ambulance run and delivery’s on Hamas side of the fence! NICE job PMSNBC!!!!!!

grapeknutz on December 29, 2008 at 8:27 AM

Luckily, Ahmadinejad is busy celebrating Christmas. Otherwise, this could get worse.

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 8:28 AM

From 2001 through May 2008, Hamas launched more than 3,000 Qassam rockets and 2,500 mortar attacks against Israeli targets.

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 8:24 AM

hmm..I didnt hear any totals of the dead in Israel from the missiles lobbed into their country by Hamas.

Go Israel!

becki51758 on December 29, 2008 at 8:19 AM

In the last three days two have dies within Israel from the rockets. Several Palestinians have also been killed by rocket fire within Gaza.

Have a look at these detailed statistics for both sides since 2000.

lexhamfox on December 29, 2008 at 8:32 AM

so what if the population turns on Hamas, they still have their guns which are the real basis of their power.

rob verdi on December 29, 2008 at 8:38 AM

lexhamfox on December 29, 2008 at 8:33 AM

Statistics are irrelevant. War is not, or should not be, blow for blow.

The only point of relevance is: who’s right, and who’s wrong? The wrong one is the attacker.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 8:38 AM

If only we could have coronated Obama immediately after the election – none of this bloodshed would be necessary!

Grafted on December 29, 2008 at 8:40 AM

The wrong one is the attacker.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 8:38 AM

grin

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 8:43 AM

The wrong one is the attacker.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 8:38 AM

grin

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 8:43 AM

Er … let me rephrase that …

The attacker is in the wrong.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 8:48 AM

The only way Israel will gain from this war will be if they can separate Hamas from its support base in Gaza.

Sorry, but this is just incorrect. The problem is not Hamas. The problem is the Palestinian people. There were many decades of these same problems, before Hamas even existed.

It may not be pretty, but that’s how it is.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 8:51 AM

You don’t play tit for tat in war. You go in until the other side no longer has the will to fight and you destroy their means for waging war. Hamas has continued to fire rockets into Israel, even during the “ceasefire”; Israel should go in and crush Hamas. And if the the Hamas terrorists hide behind women and children, they should be held accountable for civilian deaths, not Israel.

rbj on December 29, 2008 at 8:53 AM

go israel!

Viper1 on December 29, 2008 at 8:57 AM

I was trying to point out the glaring omission of a few facts from NBC’s reporting. The sympathy they show towards terrorists is so obvious.

becki51758 on December 29, 2008 at 8:58 AM

“Precision” requires very deep thorough intel. Israel in the last few days has expelled years of intelligence work and effort. Israel needs to do the dam thing and finish Hamas off. These air attacks and years of intel have enabled Hamas to be spun but it wont last forever and it will require ground troops to take full advantage and cripple Hamas.

Hamas will not bow or be punked down they are a honor people and would rather die.

C-Low on December 29, 2008 at 8:59 AM

Er … let me rephrase that …

The attacker is in the wrong.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 8:48 AM

Wasn’t grinning at your grammar. I thought you were cleverly pointing out that the MSM knows that the identity of the attacker lies in the eye of the beholder, and that they intend to do the beholden for us.

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 9:03 AM

Now its Hamas what happened to the Hezbo’s? Not to worry though Hamas will call a cease fire as soon as they run out of rockets.

sonnyspats1 on December 29, 2008 at 9:04 AM

Hamas will not bow or be punked down they are a honor people and would rather die.

C-Low on December 29, 2008 at 8:59 AM

Then by all means send them (hamas) to allah!

Alex Martinez on December 29, 2008 at 9:07 AM

Then by all means send them (hamas) to allah!

Alex Martinez on December 29, 2008 at 9:07 AM

With percision. lol

Alex Martinez on December 29, 2008 at 9:08 AM

The problem I have with this story is that is comes by way of MSNBC, which has never (to my knowledge)reported the basic facts, while letting the people decide. Everything coming from the studios of NBC has an agenda. NBC doesn’t deserve to be quoted, or used as an example of reliable sourcing in any way-shape-form…..

Israel has a plan, and I can only hope they get the job done this time around. Enough with allowing rockets & suicide bombers to kill innocent Israeli citizens.

Keemo on December 29, 2008 at 9:09 AM

Luckily, Ahmadinejad is busy celebrating Christmas. Otherwise, this could get worse.

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 8:28 AM

good one…

right4life on December 29, 2008 at 9:10 AM

RBJ–I agree.

The crappy thing about all of this is (dare I say this?) ISLAM.
Islam is the problem. Same issue, different cover-sheet, different place. We can say, “Look, eventually, the rest of the (muslim) population will come around and distance themselves from Hamas (or any other terror organization) but, the fact remains, Islam is the common denominator and their worldview is FUNDAMENTALLY flawed. When one follows the belief system to it’s eventual end, it leads to suicide bombings, second class citizenry for women, theocratic tyranny, forced conversions and death to all except adherents. Those who choose the more moderate route are NOT following the Koran to its fullest measure. Islam is a death cult and actions against against these sects or states are futile in its end, as you can see it crops up in Western, free nations as well. It is the cult itself and the only cure is total marginalization or abolition, which we can never do.

I see nothing of redeeming value of this “faith.” There is no peace but through subjugation and the reason why we search in vain for those who might speak against this nightmare is not because of fear…it is mostly because THEY BELIEVE IT TO BE TRUE, whether they strap the bombs on their bodies or not. And whatever death the west or Israel causes only exacerbates this belief and the perception of the Great Satan and pig Israel. Then, if you do hear someone speaking against terrorism in Islam, one has to wonder if they are telling the truth since their religion even ALLOWS for deception to win others. Tell me I am wrong. I would like to be.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:12 AM

JiangxiDad on December 29, 2008 at 9:03 AM

You give me waaay too much credit. I’m just a simple man. :)

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:17 AM

Every time a missile is launched into Israel, two should immediately be launched back! Every time, without exception. We would never tolerate one missile attack on the US and Israel should not be expected to either! And Israel actually sends food, water and medical supplies to these people!

sabbott on December 29, 2008 at 9:20 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:12 AM

If we could find a way to separate Islam’s corporeal policy from their spiritual belief system, then we could proscribe the terrorism more effectively.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:22 AM

If we could find a way to separate Islam’s corporeal policy from their spiritual belief system, then we could proscribe the terrorism more effectively.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:22 AM

What do you mean? How would that work out?

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:24 AM

The problem is much deeper than just islam. The problem (this part of it) is with arab culture.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:25 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:24 AM

Basically. they can believe whatever they like, just as long as they are not allowed to do anything about it, to our detriment.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:33 AM

The problem is much deeper than just islam. The problem (this part of it) is with arab culture.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:25 AM

Islam IS Arab culture.

Harpazo on December 29, 2008 at 9:34 AM

The problem (this part of it) is with arab culture.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:25 AM

I reiterate, this occurs in Western societies where Islam is followed to the fullest measure. It is the religion and the religion creates the culture.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:35 AM

the religion creates the culture.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Sorry, I don’t agree. The Arab culture existed long before 622 AD.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:38 AM

Basically. they can believe whatever they like, just as long as they are not allowed to do anything about it, to our detriment.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:33 AM

Well, the problem is the theocratic nature of their faith. It is structured as a wholistic worldview, political structure notwithstanding. I maintain that it is impossible to separate the religion from the state and sects and terror. we have tried/been trying/will try. It will not succeed if history is any indicator.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:38 AM

Islam IS Arab culture.

Harpazo on December 29, 2008 at 9:34 AM

I reiterate, this occurs in Western societies where Islam is followed to the fullest measure. It is the religion and the religion creates the culture.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Yes, islam is a big problem, in and of itself, but when it comes to arab societies, arab culture is an even bigger problem. It is true that islam is nothing more than the formalization fo desert, arab culture, but when you have an arab socitey, they live that culture, anyway, aside from the islamic components. Palestinian terrorism used to be very secular. Islam only scratches the surface of problems with arab societies.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:39 AM

Sorry, I don’t agree. The Arab culture existed long before 622 AD.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:38 AM

When it was Hebraic? Kidding. What are you talking about? Nomadic tribes? Bedouins? I mean, what are you trying to preserve here? Give me examples of pristine Arabic culture.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:40 AM

After watching the Arab world demonstrations against Isreals counter attacks,I can only come to one conclusion the Islamic facist/religion(if you can call it that) is one of total hate, it seems they always have to hate or kill people just to have a reason to exist. They don’t care who they kill or maim and until the Arab world wakes up to this fact nothing will change,we welcome them into our country and neighbourhoods they refuse to assimilate and we have to accomadate their needs, what other immigrants have we done that for. God help us

concernedsenior on December 29, 2008 at 9:41 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:40 AM

I think OldEnglish’s point is that arab behavior didn’t change too radically with the advent of islam. It was pretty much the same 2000 years ago as it is today.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

but when it comes to arab societies, arab culture is an even bigger problem. It is true that islam is nothing more than the formalization fo desert, arab culture, but when you have an arab socitey, they live that culture, anyway, aside from the islamic components. Palestinian terrorism used to be very secular. Islam only scratches the surface of problems with arab societies.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:39 AM

Can you tell me what “arabic culture” looked like before the Islamic formalization, as you called it? Either it was better or worse before Islam or Islam has been a force for good within this “culture.” If the culture began prior to Islam, it must be either very noteworthy to want to preserve or revert back to it, or, it must not be of much value if it is indistinguishable from islam.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

the religion creates the culture.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Sorry, I don’t agree. The Arab culture existed long before 622 AD.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:38 AM

I understood mommypundit to mean that the religion recreates some semblance of Arab culture within the Islamic community even though the people concerned are not Arabs by birth or located anywhere that might be called Arab lands.

YiZhangZhe on December 29, 2008 at 9:45 AM

Ahh, I love the smell of burning jihadi’s in the morning.

Smells like………….VICTORY!

conservnut on December 29, 2008 at 9:46 AM

the religion creates the culture.
Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Sorry, I don’t agree. The Arab culture existed long before 622 AD.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:38 AM

I understood mommypundit to mean that the religion recreates some semblance of Arab culture within the Islamic community even though the people concerned are not Arabs by birth or located anywhere that might be called Arab lands.

YiZhangZhe on December 29, 2008 at 9:46 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:12 AM

Actualy…. Israel is blowing it by bowing to the American ideal that citizens are no longer to be held accountable for their leadership… an idea that came out of the horrors of WWII.

We no longer wage war on a country… but its leaders… we even say so… so there is now no longer any reason for those citizens to CHANGE leaders.

Its a philisophical oxymoronic ideal… we say that we are for Democracy, where citizens CHOOSE their leaders, but then when those leaders take them to war, we don’t hold those same citizens accountable for their choices.

We, and Israel, need to take the gloves off and make WAR terrible once again… because it is now too easy for a states citizens to support War policies, without real consequence to their lifestyle and country.

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:46 AM

But…but…but, Islam is a religion of peace. Don’t you understand? It is the followers of Christ who are the infidels. Haven’t you seen all the Christian Terrorists running around in the world? /sarc

By the way, OldEnglish, most of the Conservatives who comment here are not simple people. They are intelligent Americans who express their opinions in their own unique styles. As opposed to Shipley and the other Trolls, who wake up with a false sense of superiority each day and proclaim Convervatives’ stupidity and Liberals’ superiority.

They usually are outdebated by Conservatives on this site and start attacking ad hominem or change the focus of their arguement mid-thought.

This is a great website to be able to comment on and we value opinions like yours.

kingsjester on December 29, 2008 at 9:47 AM

Did someone say something about a “Gaza Parking Lot”?

dalec on December 29, 2008 at 9:47 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:40 AM

I think OldEnglish’s point is that arab behavior didn’t change too radically with the advent of islam. It was pretty much the same 2000 years ago as it is today.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

I’m not trying to be argumentative…I do want to know what arabic culture looked like prior to Islam. My point is that Islam is so thoroughly embedded within this “culture” that it either does not exist, was not noteworthy, and/or irrelevant given the nature of the fight. It has to be a real distinguishable, marked difference to make this an even remotely winnable fight. Otherwise, really, you either wipe them all out and start over, or we live only to contain it. It’s downright impossible.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

Can you tell me what “arabic culture” looked like before the Islamic formalization, as you called it?

It was the same before and after. The “formalization” that I was talking about is the fact that islam is, essentially, a formalization of arab culture (not the other way around). Islam served to spread arab culture to others.

Either it was better or worse before Islam or Islam has been a force for good within this “culture.”

No. It was the same. Arabs just got richer with the conquests of the islamic Empire. But the arabs never changed.

If the culture began prior to Islam, it must be either very noteworthy to want to preserve or revert back to it, or, it must not be of much value if it is indistinguishable from islam.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Cultures just are. Arabs have been living in the desert for a long time and had a whole set of rules they had built to maintain their societies. The problem is that rules for scratching out a meager existence in the desert don’t translate well to modern society – not even to agrarian society. This is why islam drags other cultures down. But the arabs are still where they started, culturally.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

dalec on December 29, 2008 at 9:47 AM

Hey, maybe Cat Stevens could work the Ticket Booth. He’s not doing anything.

kingsjester on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

The simple problem is that Jews exist and Arabs don’t want them to. That’s it in a nut shell.

dalec on December 29, 2008 at 9:50 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Actualy, prior to Islam, the Arab world was a forward thinking area…

Math, science, building… heck, the first written LAWS came from that area of the world… not to mention three Major religions…

But Post Mohamed (Shoes be thrown at his head) the area hasn’t produced much except War…

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:52 AM

Actualy…. Israel is blowing it by bowing to the American ideal that citizens are no longer to be held accountable for their leadership… an idea that came out of the horrors of WWII.

We no longer wage war on a country… but its leaders… we even say so… so there is now no longer any reason for those citizens to CHANGE leaders.

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:46 AM

BINGO!

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:52 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:38 AM

You are probably quite correct in your assertion vis-a-vis an Islamic change of attitude. I should have been more clear in saying that we need to separate the two, and stop pussyfooting around for fear of insulting their faith.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:56 AM

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:52 AM

The great bulk of those weren’t arabs. Even after the rise of the Islamic Empire, most of the advancements were non-arab.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:57 AM

Don’t worry – Paulson will decide that Hamas is “too big too fail”, to justify a few billion in TARPcrap funds.

corona on December 29, 2008 at 9:57 AM

Cultures just are. Arabs have been living in the desert for a long time and had a whole set of rules they had built to maintain their societies. The problem is that rules for scratching out a meager existence in the desert don’t translate well to modern society – not even to agrarian society. This is why islam drags other cultures down. But the arabs are still where they started, culturally.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

I agree. Islam is a blend of geopolitical, eschatological, sociological philosophy. It has a remarkably coherent structure for all of life and beyond. Thus, when one follows it to its conclusion, it certainly does not exclude terrorism from the mix. It might appear modern but only because the weapons have become more sophisticated. The ideology is flawed and, again, if this is embedded within the culture…no, if in fact Islam simply solidified the culture, yet, both are disabling the people from progress (in just basic ways) then both arabic culture and Islam are obsolete but operating as a cancer in the world.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:59 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:40 AM

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Quite so. Your post of 9.49 AM says it well, PoP.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:00 AM

I think Islam needs to undergo a Reformation. Pre-Reformation Christianity did have a corrupt Church (Indulgences) and was violent (Inquisitions, forced conversions, witch burnings), and was part of the State, but now it is more enlightened and doesn’t do such things any more.

rbj on December 29, 2008 at 10:00 AM

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

Interesting…. Iraq was not a desert… it was a very fertile region before “climate change” happened (dam Hamurabi and his SUV!!!)… back when it was known as the cradle of civilisation…

Hmmmm… so… Islam was formulated in the 7th century… but the medival warming period was really just starting about then… so most of the Mideast was not desert then… but seemed to “spread” (North) over the next few centuries as the Mid East climate warmed…

Gonna have to give this idea some thought…

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 10:01 AM

mommypundit
I understand what you are saying, it is very hard to separate the Arab world and Muslim world as they are so intertwined, but I do believe these people have hated each other (tribes) for thousands of years and now having access to millions of more people to hate and murder suits their agenda perfectly. God Save America.

concernedsenior on December 29, 2008 at 10:02 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:59 AM

I agree … except for the “solidified” part. I wasn’t saying that islam soidified arab culture, only that it packaged it for export to others, without having any huge effect on arab culture, itself. But, other than that, I am with the rest of what you said.

progressoverpeace on December 29, 2008 at 10:02 AM

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Actualy, prior to Islam, the Arab world was a forward thinking area…

Math, science, building… heck, the first written LAWS came from that area of the world… not to mention three Major religions…

But Post Mohamed (Shoes be thrown at his head) the area hasn’t produced much except War…

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:52 AM

Right, which is why I said, “How? Was it hebraic?” I was only half joking. Perhaps we’d be better served by saying Middle East culture? I certainly know that from this spot we have seen many great achievements. But, I’d also add that we have had many notable achievements from other cultures as well…and if another “culture” was causing meyhem well beyond the borders of its nation and beyond the good in it’s distant history, I’d say the same thing. As it is, Islam owns this culture, drives this culture, speaks for this culture. It is virtually impossible to bifurcate the cult from the culture.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 10:05 AM

You are probably quite correct in your assertion vis-a-vis an Islamic change of attitude. I should have been more clear in saying that we need to separate the two, and stop pussyfooting around for fear of insulting their faith.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 9:56 AM

At the end of WWII… we OUTLAWED the Shinto religion in Japan as part of the occupation. Worked pretty darn well then…

Modern philosophy has taken the “Freedom of Relgion” meme too far (IMO).

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 10:06 AM

Thomas Jefferson saw the threat of Islam back in his day. Too bad today’s leaders in the USA do not.

oops…I’ll change that to Democratic leaders in the USA.

becki51758 on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 AM

It was about time Israel fought back against HAMAS. The sad thing about this whole episode is that this operation finally took place because of Israel’s schedule elections in February. If only Israel’s politicians cared more about their citizens rather than who can fight the hardest to drum up the most votes.

I just hope they wipe out all of HAMAS leadership in Gaza and than go after HAMAS leadership in Syria.

Lance Murdock on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 AM

YiZhangZhe on December 29, 2008 at 9:46 AM

Change “recreate” to “reinforce” and I would agree. The fundamentalist style of Islam has taken hold in those places where such behaviour was already common to that people.

Compare it with Socialism, where some have embraced it more strongly than others.

My point about the Arabs is that Mohammed and his scribes knew their people, and played on their existing customs.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:10 AM

Lance Murdock on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 AM

Maybe our election schedule had something to do with it as well. Israeli intelligence may know more about our POTUS- Elect’s feelings toward their country than the average American does.

kingsjester on December 29, 2008 at 10:11 AM

The UN’s Solution given to Israel:

For every rocket they shoot, shoot a rocket at the moon.

clover_dave on December 29, 2008 at 10:11 AM

It was about time Israel fought back against HAMAS. The sad thing about this whole episode is that this operation finally took place because of Israel’s schedule elections in February. If only Israel’s politicians cared more about their citizens rather than who can fight the hardest to drum up the most votes.

Lance Murdock on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 AM

Actualy, I think the timing has as much to do with America, as with their own elections.

Bush? You know which way he will jump on a question involving terrorists…

Obama? He is an unknown, and unknowable, quantity… he changes positions with the wind… and so is an undependable ally.

They HAD to start now if they wanted any type of American support (or even for America to stay neutral, who knows what Barrak Hussein will do once in office).

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 10:12 AM

kingsjester on December 29, 2008 at 9:47 AM

I’m not blushing, really. It’s hot down here. (Australia) :)

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:13 AM

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:13 AM

Good on ‘ya, Mate.

Hey Romeo, great minds, huh?

Don’t worry, Gang, Shipley to tell us we are all ignorant in 5…4…3

kingsjester on December 29, 2008 at 10:15 AM

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:46 AM

Why do some people insist upon reality? you’ve just burst someone’s bubble. :)

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:15 AM

Ultimately, I worry for little Israel in this fight. For them, it has always been containment and necessary defense at all times..and they are a pluralistic society!!!! It has nothing to do with Jew versus Muslim…it is about basic human dignity, flowing FROM a judeo-ethic. So, to defend the Arabic aggression as some marginalized group by the press is shocking. I will never, ever get this.

above all, we have to understand this clearly. the fight came to us long before 911 and it was chock full of religious/ideological overtones. What to do?

(This isn’t directed at anyone…just what I struggle with.)

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 10:15 AM

Otherwise, really, you either wipe them all out and start over, or we live only to contain it. It’s downright impossible.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

Now, that’s what I call an inconvenient truth.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:19 AM

Otherwise, really, you either wipe them all out and start over, or we live only to contain it. It’s downright impossible.

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM

Now, that’s what I call an inconvenient truth.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:19 AM

heh. :o)

Mommypundit on December 29, 2008 at 10:21 AM

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 9:52 AM

Moors and Persians, mainly. Not the type who now live in luxury through no effort of their own.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:22 AM

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 10:06 AM

Very good point. Problem is, Shinto was a religion that was integral with one state – Japan. Islam is everywhere – unfortunately.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:29 AM

Why do some people insist upon reality? you’ve just burst someone’s bubble. :)

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:15 AM

LOL… yeah, part of my current line of thought on Western culture… and how it will destroy itself.

In the early 1900′s, our culture started to morph. Being independent and self reliant, and responsible for oneself, started to take a back seat in America. It was even reflected in Christianity with the “change” in emphasis from works, to salvation…

The people elected representative who would promise to take care of them, and NOT hold them responsible for their own failings (Social Security? Income Tax redistribution?).

So, if we are not going to hold OURSELVES responsible, how in the heck can we hold citizens of ANOTHER country responsible for their actions?

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 10:31 AM

Romeo13 on December 29, 2008 at 10:12 AM
Lance Murdock on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 AM

Maybe, but these rockets have been falling down on Southern Israel for over a year now. HAMAS had been breaking the “cease-fire” on a daily basis. The only reason why I think they choose this weekend b/c it is between Christmas and the New Year where most people aren’t paying attention to the news.

On that note Olmert is a slime ball and his only reason to fight back is to help his party that’s it.

Lance Murdock on December 29, 2008 at 10:42 AM

kingsjester on December 29, 2008 at 10:11 AM

Maybe, but these rockets have been falling down on Southern Israel for over a year now. HAMAS had been breaking the “cease-fire” on a daily basis. The only reason why I think they choose this weekend b/c it is between Christmas and the New Year where most people aren’t paying attention to the news.

On that note Olmert is a slime ball and his only reason to fight back is to help his party that’s it.

Lance Murdock on December 29, 2008 at 10:43 AM

Hamas will not bow or be punked down they are a honor people and would rather die.

C-Low on December 29, 2008 at 8:59 AM

Then by all means send them (hamas) to allah!

Alex Martinez on December 29, 2008 at 9:07 AM

AGREED 100% – Just stating the obvious that the pansies like Olmert cannot seem to understand. You cannot threaten people who see salvation as dying while trying to kill you. All you can do is kill that person before they get into a position to kill or hurt you.

Sabbot has the right idea and the path to peace if Israel ever gets a leader with the sack to initiate it. Ole school and to hell with the PC BS. When the paleo’s launch rockets fire back 10 fold into the village, town, whatever that the missiles came from (YES KILL “INNOCENTS”). The Paleo’s talk of killing jews embargo them raze their power stations their hospitals, schools (if they choose war show them what it is to live in a state of war). The paleo’s launch suicide bombers then for every Israeli killed cede 10 square miles of paleo territory (start with the border areas and make that border clean and defensible).

The Paleo’s believe they are at the bottom and Israel doesn’t have the heart to do any worse so what do they got to lose by continuing war? Once the Paleo’s understand the little they have will be lost if they don’t choose peace then peace will be had.

Israel tried the pansy way now its time for Israel to try the way of the ole (the one that works). Lay down absolute unconditional surrender with borders wherever they are at time of surrender as the marker. Start and continue war keep the paleo’s in a state of horror, make the guy on the street’s life unbearable.

“Surrender and get peace/life, or choose resistance and be killed, or driven away” should be the Israeli motto.

C-Low on December 29, 2008 at 10:51 AM

Hamas is fighting the same war for every other arab nation obfuscating there own repression. Today it is Iran…tomorrow it will be someone else. They know what they are doing and I don’t feel sorry for them, but they keep throwing their lot in with the wrong team. I can’t believe so many people fall for this over and over.

The Press does cause wars as was said earlier.

tomas on December 29, 2008 at 10:54 AM

This is what happens when you send Katyusha rockets 25 miles onto Israel townships. Israel has shown amazing restraint up to now.

Hamas got their war and now they have to deal with it.

One observation; I notice how the world press is leaning their editorial bias against Israel. When Hamas was shooting dozens of rockets into Israeli towns in the past weeks there was little to none condemnation from Reuters etc.

FireBlogger on December 29, 2008 at 11:11 AM

if the the Hamas terrorists hide behind women and children, they should be held accountable for civilian deaths, not Israel.

rbj on December 29, 2008 at 8:53 AM

In a world where the press is the institution that holds people or nations accountable, that will never happen because the press is in the tank for Hamas.

ProfessorMiao on December 29, 2008 at 11:42 AM

I want green helmet guy.

kurtzz3 on December 29, 2008 at 11:42 AM

http://www.btselem.org/English/Statistics/Casualties.asp
lexhamfox on December 29, 2008 at 8:33 AM

Take a good look at the statistics. Click on the numbers. Look at the situation surrounding the death of these poor” people

Yitzchokm on December 29, 2008 at 11:42 AM

hmm..I didnt hear any totals of the dead in Israel from the missiles lobbed into their country by Hamas.

That’s because up until yesterday it was 0. Now it is 1. It’s hard to kill people with homemade bottle rockets.

The press reports that Israel has been planning the invasion of the Gaza strip for 6 months. This is hardly retaliatory for the firing that began when the truce expired.

I hope they all kill each other and we can be rid of all of them.

angelat0763 on December 29, 2008 at 12:23 PM

I notice how the world press is leaning their editorial bias against Israel.

Funny. I noticed that the BBC quickly changed a headline from “Israel Attacks Palestinian University” to “Israel Strikes Key Hamas Offices” and moved the University attack down to the last paragraph.

angelat0763 on December 29, 2008 at 12:26 PM

… My point about the Arabs is that Mohammed and his scribes knew their people, and played on their existing customs.

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:10 AM

And is well illustrated to be the current underlying cultural status quo in incidents such as this.

batterup on December 29, 2008 at 12:26 PM

. Hamas has continued to fire rockets into Israel, even during the “ceasefire”;

And Israel blocked food and medicine into Gaza, essentially turning it into 1 big concentration camp. (Ah, the irony.)

I hope they nuke each other into oblivion so the rest of us can go on with out lives.

angelat0763 on December 29, 2008 at 12:29 PM

They are going to be very efficient and thorough in gaza because this will be practice for southern lebanon. They are not going to screw up twice.

peacenprosperity on December 29, 2008 at 12:31 PM

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