Quote of the day

posted at 10:00 pm on December 29, 2008 by Allahpundit

“The study also found that, five years after taking a virginity pledge, more than 80 percent of pledgers denied ever making such a promise. ‘This high rate of disaffiliation may imply that nearly all virginity pledgers view pledges as nonbinding,’ Rosenbaum said.”

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Comment pages: 1 2

A pledge without accountability is worthless…

right2bright on December 29, 2008 at 10:02 PM

Heck in that case, I pledge to support BHO 100% in the next 4 years!!

Canon on December 29, 2008 at 10:03 PM

But did they have sex?

goat on December 29, 2008 at 10:05 PM

I lost my virginity after church choir practice when I was 15.

It was a female choir member my age, not any abuse or anything else.

Mr. Joe on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 PM

If you think THAT is remarkable, what about the Cipher in Chief that is about to take an oath to preserve, protect, and defend the constitution of the United States (on January 20th)?

My collie says:

Talk about non-binding disaffiliation.

CyberCipher on December 29, 2008 at 10:08 PM

I remember the “study” a couple years ago that found that fetuses don’t feel pain during the abortion process.

Too bad one of those conducting the study was on a PP board in the central/northern CA area.

Whoops.

artist on December 29, 2008 at 10:10 PM

This just goes to prove my theory: sex is awesome.

As soon as you can make keeping a virginity pledge more awesome than sex, it’ll start working.

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:11 PM

“When pledgers fell off the wagon, they fell off hard,” he said…

hehe

JetBoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:12 PM

Mr. Joe on December 29, 2008 at 10:07 PM

So, you went from soprano to bass?

OldEnglish on December 29, 2008 at 10:12 PM

“It all depends on what the defenition of “is” is……”

Seven Percent Solution on December 29, 2008 at 10:17 PM

justfinethanks

Have you read Blue Like Jazz? I’m not sure I’d endorse it, but the author mentions somewhere in it that he had the thought that if he could just find some way to make Christianity cool, there would be more converts.

(For more information on cool->popular, see Barack Obama.)

kc8ukw on December 29, 2008 at 10:20 PM

Can we have a study on how many liberals conduct academic/professional studies?

Let me guess, their biases don’t affect their work.

Just like liberals in the classroom and journalism.

Control the major institutions and you control the masses.

artist on December 29, 2008 at 10:22 PM

From heritage.org:

Abstinence education programs are effective in reducing teen sexual activity, and they dramatically reduce out-of-wedlock childbearing.

…and they cite the studies disproving the sexpert’s propaganda.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:22 PM

“nearly all virginity pledgers view pledges as nonbinding”

Kinda like liberals intent to be law-abiding.

They observe the law faithfully.

Except when they don’t feel like it.

notagool on December 29, 2008 at 10:24 PM

“Previous studies found that pledgers were more likely to delay having sex than non-pledgers,” said study author Janet E. Rosenbaum, a post doctoral fellow at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. “I used the same data as previous studies but a different statistical method.”

This method allowed Rosenbaum to compare those who had taken a virginity pledge with similar teens who hadn’t taken a pledge but were likely to delay having sex, she said. She added that she didn’t include teens who were unlikely to take a pledge.

That says it all.
Church kids who hadn’t pledged vs. church kids who had?

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:25 PM

artist on December 29, 2008 at 10:22 PM

When you are a liberal democrat…………… you are never taken off the public payroll.

………. you have to find some way to justify your existence, why not conduct a study of the vagina’s of teenagers?

Seven Percent Solution on December 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM

Did you know that 93% of all statistics are made up, and have no bearing on reality?

Kevin M on December 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM

Did you know that 93% of all statistics are made up, and have no bearing on reality?

Hmmm…I think you made that up.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:28 PM

42.5% of people don’t believe it.

Kevin M on December 29, 2008 at 10:28 PM

As a 20 year old male college student (and a proud virgin), I can tell you it’s all based on how maturely you handle your social life.

If you’re willing to throw your academics, future careers, and future marriage (singular) out the window for an over-active social life, chances are you will eventually find yourself in a compromising position with the opposite sex.

HYTEAndy on December 29, 2008 at 10:29 PM

That says it all.
Church kids who hadn’t pledged vs. church kids who had?

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:25 PM

Yeah, they were testing to see if a pledge matters. I suspect they don’t simply because kids who take them were pushed into it by their parents, who would be better served teaching their kids discipline instead so they can actually resist the urge when they get at that point in their life.

Darth Executor on December 29, 2008 at 10:29 PM

What exactly makes this red meat?

Kjeil on December 29, 2008 at 10:30 PM

Wonderful, another threat that will probably descend into Christian-bashing. Thanks, Allahpundit.

jimmy the notable on December 29, 2008 at 10:30 PM

“The notion that it has to be either a virginity pledge or encouraging teens to have sex is a false dichotomy,” Albert added. “There is a public consensus in this country to encourage teens to delay sex, but also provide them with information about contraception.”

Sensible.

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

Wonderful, another threat that will probably descend into Christian-bashing. Thanks, Allahpundit.

That’s what pays the bills at HA–getting conservatives to fight each other.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

Kjeil on December 29, 2008 at 10:30 PM

Red meat brings all the dregs of hot air looking for a fight into the comments section. This gives him a few hundred comments which compensate nicely for his lack of you know what.

Darth Executor on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

That’s what pays the bills at HA–getting conservatives to fight each other.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

Nah, it’s an ego thing. If he wanted money he wouldn’t start fights. That just wastes bandwidth. He’d try to get people to click on ads.

Darth Executor on December 29, 2008 at 10:33 PM

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

But this study had nothing to do with contraception, as I showed at 10:25.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:33 PM

‘This high rate of disaffiliation may imply that nearly all virginity pledgers view pledges as nonbinding,’ Rosenbaum said.”

In other words, there’s no controlling legal authority … thank you Al Gore.

Tony737 on December 29, 2008 at 10:34 PM

That’s what pays the bills at HA–getting conservatives to fight each other.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

It sure does, you delusional sky superman worshipping unreasonable overly pious Christian.

/s

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:35 PM

Bill Clinton was seen sniffing around the study………

Seven Percent Solution on December 29, 2008 at 10:35 PM

He’d try to get people to click on ads.

Just in case AP saw that comment & is mad at me, I do click on ads (really!)…especially if it’s a left-of-center sponsor.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:36 PM

Sensible.

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM

Perhaps we should give instruction in the care and use of sterilizing needles for drug use.

Maybe even give away clean needles at taxpayer expense.

Obviously because teens will do what teens will do.

Sensible.

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 10:36 PM

Anything is better than yet another The Princess Senator thread.

pedestrian on December 29, 2008 at 10:36 PM

Wonderful, another threat that will probably descend into Christian-bashing. Thanks, Allahpundit.

jimmy the notable on December 29, 2008 at 10:30 PM

Stop the hypocrisy and we’ll stop the bashing!

Noneya on December 29, 2008 at 10:37 PM

This high rate of disaffiliation may imply that nearly all virginity pledgers view pledges as nonbinding,’ Rosenbaum said.”

Yeah I take mine back. ;-)

conservnut on December 29, 2008 at 10:38 PM

Perhaps we should give instruction in the care and use of sterilizing needles for drug use.

Maybe even give away clean needles at taxpayer expense.

Obviously because teens will do what teens will do.

Sensible.

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 10:36 PM

If only there had been an 11th commandment, something like “thou shalt not use specious analogies.”

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 10:41 PM

Perhaps we should give instruction in the care and use of sterilizing needles for drug use.

Maybe even give away clean needles at taxpayer expense.

Obviously because teens will do what teens will do.

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 10:36 PM

If every human being had bags of drugs that dangled from their body, and it is was something that ninety nine percent of the population will use at some point in their life, and people started getting the biological compulsion to use said drugs when they become a teenager, I’d agree with this plan.

Comparing sex with drugs is a false equivalence. Sex is built into what it means to be human, and if teens don’t understand it, they will use it dangerously.

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM

But this study had nothing to do with contraception, as I showed at 10:25.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:33 PM

If you read the whole article, she mentions that abstinence programs tend to ignore safe sex education (hence the name, ‘abstinence only’), and also that the pledge-takers were somewhat less likely to use condoms.

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM

Sex is built into what it means to be human
justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM

But you can live a rich, full life without sex, as I did for 30 yrs before getting married.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:49 PM

Look,if there’s going to be any
kind of pledges,how about

the “Pledge of Allegiance”!

There,now, let the Liberals
whine about that!

Has CNN done a poll on this?

And the intent of this article
is probably aimed at the Christian
Right,as usual!

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 10:49 PM

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 10:49 PM

True!
Every liberal born in the USA has said that pledge…& broken it by becoming a liberal.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:53 PM

OK,OK, The headline “Many Teens Don’t Keep Virginity Pledges” is from a new edition of National Lampoon, right??

How about “Gee, most kid’s lied about smokin’ dope”?
or
“Gee, most kids caught drinking said it was their first time, honest”?
or
“Most girls responded, This is the first time I’ve ever done this”?

Once again, hard hitting investigative journalism has me in rapt attention!

Tim Zank on December 29, 2008 at 10:54 PM

Comparing sex with drugs is a false equivalence. Sex is built into what it means to be human, and if teens don’t understand it, they will use it dangerously.

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM

No, it’s not. Sex is nothing more than chemical stimulation. Same as drugs. Which is why heroin users will go without sex in lieu of heroin.

And if teens don’t understand that, they’ll use heroin dangerously.

If you read the whole article, she mentions that abstinence programs tend to ignore safe sex education (hence the name, ‘abstinence only’), and also that the pledge-takers were somewhat less likely to use condoms.

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM

Of course she does, it’s part of her agenda.

Note also that there was NO difference in STDs or birth rates even with the nearly statistically insignificant point about condom use difference (10%).

Abstinence programs, btw DO mention birth control.

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 10:54 PM

This high rate of disaffiliation may imply that nearly all virginity pledgers view pledges as nonbinding,’ Rosenbaum said.”

Yeah I take mine back. ;-)

conservnut on December 29, 2008 at 10:38 PM

Have you disaffiliated from the Cowboys yet? ;-)

Y-not on December 29, 2008 at 10:55 PM

If you read the whole article, she mentions that abstinence programs tend to ignore safe sex education (hence the name, ‘abstinence only’), and also that the pledge-takers were somewhat less likely to use condoms.

Let’s see. If you’re trying to abstain from sex then I think you would be far less likely to have condoms on hand or take BC. Also, the not-even-planning-on-abstaining crowd has probably had sex far more times then those that had “abstinence only” class and there for the likelyhood of a comdom/BC being used would be far greater anyways.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 10:55 PM

BTW, for those of you that think “oh, they’ll have sex anyways. My wife was a virgin (in every way, meaning no oral either) until the day we were married. Keep in mind that (a) she was 32 when we got married and (b) we lived with each other for 1 year and a half before getting married.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 10:56 PM

“Previous studies found that pledgers were more likely to delay having sex than non-pledgers,” said study author Janet E. Rosenbaum, a post doctoral fellow at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. “I used the same data as previous studies but a different statistical method.”

I other words, I didn’t like those results so I massaged the stats to come up with mine own.

934 people in the study….934!
The average McDonalds gets more people through their doors each day. 934 is statistically worthless in a body numbering in the tens of millions.
Where were these 934 from…..hmmmm some liberal college somewhere maybe?
When you have a national sample numbering 9340 or better yet 93400 give a holler. Till then go back to banging the coeds in your study.

Rocks on December 29, 2008 at 10:57 PM

Thank God for surveys. Now I can sleep again.

Tim Zank on December 29, 2008 at 10:57 PM

Abstinence programs, btw DO mention birth control.

Yep. Infact, they mention how condemns aren’t 100% effective too.

Meanwhile, the sex ed that kids normally get teaches them about sex in a way that (a) makes them feel like a freak if they don’t have sex and (b) basically gives them permission to have sex by saying “but if you’re going to have sex…”.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM

True.

jgapinoy on Dec 29,2008 at 10:53PM.

jgapinoy:Dam_ straight!And A-Men:)

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM

Control the major institutions and you control the masses.

artist on December 29, 2008 at 10:22 PM

So very true.

Jaibones on December 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM

But you can live a rich, full life without sex, as I did for 30 yrs before getting married.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 10:49 PM

No question. And kids should be told about the benefits of abstinence, and how it is the only true guarantee against unwanted pregnancy and STDs. But it’s dangerous to simulteniously keep them in the dark on important sexual information that relates to contraception. You knew (I think I can safely assume) about the basics of sexual function and contraception before you met your eventual mate, and it certainly didn’t cause you to have sex before marriage.

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM

No, it’s not. Sex is nothing more than chemical stimulation. Same as drugs. Which is why heroin users will go without sex in lieu of heroin.

Didn’t the anti-drug commercial say that monkeys tested on cocaine also gave up sex for more cocaine? Men give up sex for marriage. Seems like sex is the first thing to go.

Jaibones on December 29, 2008 at 11:01 PM

20% of the time, it works every time.

Geronimo on December 29, 2008 at 11:02 PM

Perhaps we should give instruction in the care and use of sterilizing needles for drug use.

Maybe even give away clean needles at taxpayer expense.

Obviously because teens will do what teens will do.

This crap kills me. I was buying condoms 30 years ago when I was 14. From my neighborhood pharmacy no less. The guy there knew my parents. Why the hell can’t kids buy their own damn condoms?

If I was a girl I wouldn’t even sleep with a guy using a free condom. How good can it be if it’s free, ya cheap bastard. What’s next…take her to dinner and give her government cheese?

Rocks on December 29, 2008 at 11:03 PM

No, it’s not. Sex is nothing more than chemical stimulation. Same as drugs.

So do you think a man who makes love to his wife every day is the same as a drug addict? Heroin users give up sex for drugs because heroin is more intense than drugs, and has physioloigcal addictive properties that aren’t as present in sexual activity. This fact just highlights how false the equivalence is.

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 11:06 PM

Me also thinks,

ready!

That its awfully coincidental,that someone
way up North,who is a Republican,just had
a birth,and is near the teenage years!

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 11:07 PM

Of course she does, it’s part of her agenda.

Note also that there was NO difference in STDs or birth rates even with the nearly statistically insignificant point about condom use difference (10%).

Abstinence programs, btw DO mention birth control.

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 10:54 PM

- Her agenda was to refine the control group of previous studies using the same data, bringing it more in line with a clinical trial. How does it serve conservatism to assume that every study that contradicts the religious right is some kind of liberal conspiracy? Science can be messy sometimes, and this one study is hardly conclusive, but you do our country a disservice by dismissing it for spurious reasons.

- Not surprising given that the two groups both would have had low risk factors for transmitting STDs. The question is, how would those numbers be affected by abstinence only education in the larger teen population?

-If that were true, there wouldn’t be a controversy. Teach abstinence, teach safe sex, nobody has a reason to complain.

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 11:08 PM

The purpose of any such “pledge” is to coerce those who are not interested in making such a pledge into doing so. Just think of it like the Pledge of Allegiance. We all do it, but hardly anyone would do so spontaneously. We do it because the group is doing it. So it goes with pledges.

In our private lives we do whatever we want to based on risk/reward choices. Simple.

Viscount_Bolingbroke on December 29, 2008 at 11:09 PM

Here’s the non-rocket science approach from a father of three:

When boys figure out what makes them excited, they start asking girls to help. Girls then have a choice, help or not.

As I told my sons (26 & 17 now) and my daughter (13 now) you can have all the fun you want, just be painfully aware of the consequences that come along with the fun. If they have any brains, they’ll abstain, if they have any brains and are human, they’ll be careful. I don’t need a survey, a study, or the NEA, or Planned Parenthood, or Reverend Phelps for that matter to explain common sense to my children….

Be a parent, get a life, and ignore the horsehi%.

Tim Zank on December 29, 2008 at 11:09 PM

The working class town I came from didn’t have virginity pledges. There was just a “gentlemen’s agreement” that if you got a girl pregnant you’re life would suck. Worked for me and many others and you still could get lucky.

Different strokes for different folks I guess, but I’d hate to find out on my wedding night that me and my wife have no chemistry in bed.

LevStrauss on December 29, 2008 at 11:19 PM

When Sex is Outlawed only Outlaws will have Sex!

errhh…uh….wait!

What was the question?

Vntnrse on December 29, 2008 at 11:21 PM

In other words, there’s no controlling legal authority … thank you Al Gore.

Tony737 on December 29, 2008 at 10:34 PM

Me also thinks,

ready!

That its awfully coincidental,that someone
way up North,who is a Republican,just had
a birth,and is near the teenage years!

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 11:07 PM

Thanks, guys. That leftover eggnog was still good, you know.

—-wipes keyboard between guffaws—-

Hormones trumps good intentions. Who knew?

BTW, does the study take into account how many had their fingers crossed?

hillbillyjim on December 29, 2008 at 11:21 PM

As I told my sons (26 & 17 now) and my daughter (13 now) you can have all the fun you want, just be painfully aware of the consequences that come along with the fun. If they have any brains, they’ll abstain, if they have any brains and are human, they’ll be careful.

An acquaintance of mine was describing a recent hunting jaunt: The guys were in an open Jeep, scouting for rabbits. They saw a pair mating in the distance. As they approached, the female broke away from the male’s grasp to flee for her life, and the male was also running behind her, but not to flee. He soon tackled her and, uh, picked up where they had left off. This gave the hunters a chance to catch up, and soon both of our furry friends were in a stew.
The moral of the story is that sex drive can drive you off a cliff. You have to plan to abstain, & kids need help doing that.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:21 PM

trumps Awww.

hillbillyjim on December 29, 2008 at 11:23 PM

Depends what the definition of ‘is is’!

And thats what Bill(Sexual Predator)Clinton
tried to define what kind of sex was sex,or
sumpin like dat!A hem.

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 11:23 PM

So do you think a man who makes love to his wife every day is the same as a drug addict? Heroin users give up sex for drugs because heroin is more intense than drugs, and has physioloigcal addictive properties that aren’t as present in sexual activity.

Of course you always hear in the news every so often about those crazy milfs that give teens booze and drugs for sex.

LevStrauss on December 29, 2008 at 11:24 PM

LevStrauss on December 29, 2008 at 11:19 PM

Sex with her before you marry her leads to much higher divorce rates.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:25 PM

Her agenda was to refine the control group of previous studies using the same data, bringing it more in line with a clinical trial.
RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 11:08 PM

From the article:

Previous studies found that pledgers were more likely to delay having sex than non-pledgers,” said study author Janet E. Rosenbaum, a post doctoral fellow at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. “I used the same data as previous studies but a different statistical method.”

This method allowed Rosenbaum to compare those who had taken a virginity pledge with similar teens who hadn’t taken a pledge but were likely to delay having sex, she said. She added that she didn’t include teens who were unlikely to take a pledge.

She apparently compared church kids with church kids, those who had taken a pledge vs. those who didn’t.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:29 PM

So do you think a man who makes love to his wife every day is the same as a drug addict?
justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 11:06 PM

Yup.

Is that *love* that the teens are doing so hard that they can’t control themselves?

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 11:29 PM

- Her agenda was to refine the control group of previous studies using the same data, bringing it more in line with a clinical trial. How does it serve conservatism to assume that every study that contradicts the religious right is some kind of liberal conspiracy? Science can be messy sometimes, and this one study is hardly conclusive, but you do our country a disservice by dismissing it for spurious reasons.

Already went over this in the previous thread. She statistically sliced out people “likely to have sex but wouldn’t take a pledge” from the control group, leaving a false test set of “those who wouldn’t pledge to have sex but had no chance of getting any tali” and “those who did pledge but could get tail”.

I’m not aruging this from a conservative point of view but from strictly a technical point. (but you sure wish I was)

- Not surprising given that the two groups both would have had low risk factors for transmitting STDs. The question is, how would those numbers be affected by abstinence only education in the larger teen population?

I dunno, but if she had left the control group properly intact we could’ve found out.

Skywise on December 29, 2008 at 11:34 PM

BTW,does the study take into account how many had their fingers crossed?

hillbillyjim on Dec 29,2008 at 11:21PM.

hillbillyjim: And TOES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lets see,Sarah Palin’s daughter has a baby,and shazam,
the next day,there just so happenes to be an article
on abstinance!

I’m stunned I tell ya,btw HBJ,if I don’t catch you on
a thread in the near future,*HAPPY*NEW*YEAR*,eh!

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 11:34 PM

Sex with her before you marry her leads to much higher divorce rates.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:25 PM

I wouldn’t doubt that. People who have sex before marriage very well would be more likely to cheat during marriage. I would also guess that people who believe in a skygod enough to withhold sex before marriage would also stay in a crummy marriage because that skygod will make them burn in hell.

I don’t approach relationships like a insurance appraiser, people are individuals and they all approach these things differently with different results. There are smokers with pickled livers that live to be 100 years old.

LevStrauss on December 29, 2008 at 11:35 PM

Here’s an interesting phenomenon:

Kids lie.

About sex, about drugs, about fights, about homework, about what they were doing in the bathroom, about who was on the phone, about everything else. I know that a lot of parents have a wonderful relationship with their kids, but the sad truth is that kids are human–therefore they lie. Some are just better at it than others.

hillbillyjim on December 29, 2008 at 11:36 PM

I’m stunned I tell ya,btw HBJ,if I don’t catch you on
a thread in the near future,*HAPPY*NEW*YEAR*,eh!

canopfor on December 29, 2008 at 11:34 PM

A big ol’ fat Happy Happy to you and yours, too, my friend from the Great White North!

hillbillyjim on December 29, 2008 at 11:37 PM

I took a pledge and broke it. Thank God.

Dr. Manhattan on December 29, 2008 at 11:39 PM

She apparently compared church kids with church kids, those who had taken a pledge vs. those who didn’t.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:29 PM

Yes! That is the proper control. The previous studies were flawed because the test group had a predisposition to abstinence (while the control group did not). It’s like testing a drug. If you wanted to test a heartburn drug, you wouldn’t choose people who self-identified as not likely to try chili dogs and hamburgers as your test group. But if you did, for some reason, you’d have to compose your control group of people who similarly weren’t likely to try chili dogs and hamburgers.

RightOFLeft on December 29, 2008 at 11:42 PM

I would also guess that people who believe in a skygod enough to withhold sex before marriage would also stay in a crummy marriage because that skygod will make them burn in hell.

And here comes the christian-bashing.

BTW, has it ever accured to your that there ARE atheists out there that want to wait until marriage? Trust me, if you look you’ll find them.

I took a pledge and broke it. Thank God.

I took a pledge and broke it at the age of 22. I regret it.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 11:44 PM

BTW, I actually think the pledge thing shouldn’t be done on paper or with a ring or anything like that. Like many other things, it seems to be more of forcing one to do or not do something. Let the person pledge to themselves. Don’t force or coerce them.

BUT….

also don’t basically give them permission to have sex by saying “But if you do have sex…”.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 11:45 PM

hillbillyjim on December 29, 2008 at 11:36 PM

Apologies. I should have made my point. Duh.

That being, that any of these studies should be taken with a grain massive amounts of salt.

hillbillyjim on December 29, 2008 at 11:46 PM

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 11:44 PM

Yes I accidentally omitted “more likely to” from the statement. Of course there are probably atheists too, I was also talking about divorce rates followed by a disclaimer that odds are not absolutes. So yes it did accur to me.

I had a good friend in high school who was waiting for marriage, not because of any religious reasons, and I thought it was admirable, not because I see waiting before marriage as admirable but because I thought sticking to her principles was admirable.

LevStrauss on December 29, 2008 at 11:52 PM

Who’s administering these pledges, by the way?

Of course if you’re forcing kids to do this, there is a definite number of them who will go out of their way to break it out of youthful rebellion.

I waited until I was 18 before I drank alcohol, and now I have much better self-control. No one told me to do that, it was just something I did to prove to myself that I could. However, if someone had told me to wait to drink, no matter what, I probably would have gone out of my way to find alcohol.

It must be the same thing with these virginity pledges. I mean, is this something that a large group decides at a church meeting or something? Because unless the teens come to the conclusion that they want to wait, no matter what, on their own accord and it is something they want to accomplish, it is something that simply will not happen.
If someone is telling them, in an unconvincing manner, that they should wait, they’re probably more likely not to wait, IMO. They probably seek out sex just to say they did not hold to their pledge. Its classic teenage rebellion – that also leads to something enjoyable. What’s not to understand?

jimmy the notable on December 29, 2008 at 11:54 PM

Is there a teenager left in America who can’t figure out how a condom works? It takes two clicks on the internet to get information on this.

How stupid is this entire discussion? We live in the most hyper sexualized culture in known history, and yet we feel the need to demonstrate condom usage on bananas lest some youngster not know how to type “how to use a condom” into google?

ramrocks on December 29, 2008 at 11:57 PM

I would also guess that people who believe in a skygod enough to withhold sex before marriage would also stay in a crummy marriage because that skygod will make them burn in hell.

Actually, it’s more that people who’ve rolled in the hay with each other before getting married could very well be doomed when they get married and realize that they like sex more then anything else in the relationship. I see that happen ALOT.

Here’s the thing. Ever notice how to sluttiest people (that’s right, I said “sluttiest”) tend to either (a) never get married even though they want to or (b) get divorced constantly. It’s also like how some guy will marry a woman who he KNOWS was/is the town slut and then is SHOCKED when she cheats on him.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 11:57 PM

I waited until I was 18 before I drank alcohol, and now I have much better self-control. No one told me to do that, it was just something I did to prove to myself that I could. However, if someone had told me to wait to drink, no matter what, I probably would have gone out of my way to find alcohol.

Back when I was in the navy there was this guy on my ship who was waiting until marriage. Have no idea if it was religious reasons or what. He must have had massive self control, to, considering he was basically a chick magnet.

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 11:58 PM

DethMetalCookieMonst on December 29, 2008 at 11:57 PM

Yeah those types exist. Years long one night stands should be easily identifiable. If people cannot realize they only have a physical relationship that is not my problem, I can only look out for the health of my own relationships.

And the infidelity example exists too, you have to do your best to find someone you trust.

What did I say earlier about absolutes? Twice.

LevStrauss on December 30, 2008 at 12:08 AM

The moral of the story is that sex drive can drive you off a cliff. You have to plan to abstain, & kids need help doing that.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:21 PM

That’s what parents are for, right? So far my boys have adhered to getting laid (sp?) without any offspring and I never had to attend a “meeting” at school where we all put a condom on a banana. An amazing concept, just tellin’ ‘em what’s up…oh that truth thing..what a concept..

Tim Zank on December 30, 2008 at 12:25 AM

If someone is telling them, in an unconvincing manner, that they should wait, they’re probably more likely not to wait, IMO. They probably seek out sex just to say they did not hold to their pledge. Its classic teenage rebellion – that also leads to something enjoyable. What’s not to understand?

jimmy the notable on December 29, 2008 at 11:54 PM

The kids actually are the ones who come up with the pledge…it was peer driven. An “in” thing to do, and like most “in” things it goes out…

right2bright on December 30, 2008 at 12:33 AM

You could do what any self-respecting toothless hillbilly would do: Marry yer cuzzin when yer twelve. Problem solved.

hillbillyjim on December 30, 2008 at 12:37 AM

As a 20 year old male college student (and a proud virgin)…
HYTEAndy on December 29, 2008 at 10:29 PM

Dude, you are 20 years old; it’s time to stop beating the meat and try the real thing. Trust us, it’s pretty awesome.

factoid on December 30, 2008 at 12:37 AM

As soon as you can make keeping a virginity pledge more awesome than sex, it’ll start working.

justfinethanks on December 29, 2008 at 10:11 PM

+100

BacaDog on December 30, 2008 at 12:39 AM

Why do I see Planed Parenthood as a bunch of ambulance chasers in this article.

Kini on December 30, 2008 at 12:43 AM

As a 20 year old male college student (and a proud virgin)…
HYTEAndy on December 29, 2008 at 10:29 PM

Dude, you are 20 years old; it’s time to stop beating the meat and try the real thing. Trust us, it’s pretty awesome.

factoid on December 30, 2008 at 12:37 AM

Aw, now. Let’s not pick on the virgin. Maybe he didn’t have any purty cuzzins when he wuz twelve. ;-)

hillbillyjim on December 30, 2008 at 12:45 AM

Why do I see Planed Parenthood as a bunch of ambulance chasers in this article.

Kini on December 30, 2008 at 12:43 AM

Um, because you are perceptive, and informed about PP?

hillbillyjim on December 30, 2008 at 12:47 AM

People who have sex before marriage very well would be more likely to cheat during marriage.

Really? What do you base that statement on?

BacaDog on December 30, 2008 at 12:57 AM

“BacaDog on December 30, 2008 at 12:57 AM”

iirc, there’s a host of studies to back that up …

Buckaroo on December 30, 2008 at 1:03 AM

Aw, now. Let’s not pick on the virgin. Maybe he didn’t have any purty cuzzins when he wuz twelve. ;-)

hillbillyjim on December 30, 2008 at 12:45 AM

HA! That brings up some great one-line-er’s

I used to be a virgin. My rosy palms can testify to that.
I’ve been dating the Sears Lingerie catalog.

What’s a monica between friends?

Kini on December 30, 2008 at 1:07 AM

Sex with her before you marry her leads to much higher divorce rates.

jgapinoy on December 29, 2008 at 11:25 PM

The numbers don’t lie

Spirit of 1776 on December 30, 2008 at 1:20 AM

A pledge without accountability is worthless…

right2bright on December 29, 2008 at 10:02 PM

A pledge without morals is worthless.

Neither a pledge or accountability comes to mean anything without a conscience.

Speakup on December 30, 2008 at 1:38 AM

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