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Video: Suspicious fire at Palin’s church, $1M damage

posted at 7:53 am on December 14, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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A fire broke out at the Wasilla Bible Church yesterday while a group of women worked on crafts inside, all of whom escaped without injury. The church itself sustained an estimated one million dollars worth of damage, and investigators say that the fire looks like arson:

Gov. Sarah Palin’s home church has been badly damaged in a suspicious fire.

Larry Kroon, the pastor of the Wasilla Bible Church, estimates damages at more than $1 million to the church. …

Palin spokesman Bill McAllister said the governor stopped by the church Saturday morning and apologized if the incident was related to her.

In a written statement McAllister said Palin, “told an assistant pastor that she apologizes if the incident is in any way connected to the undeserved negative attention the church has received since she became a vice presidential candidate on Aug. 29. Whatever the motives of the arsonist, the governor has faith in the scriptural passage that what was intended for evil will in some way be used for good.”

It’s too early to know whether the fire has anything to do with Sarah Palin’s candidacy. Unfortunately, churches and other places of worship get attacked by nutcases for a wide variety of irrational reasons, and one cannot predict what made these nuts set fire to this Wasilla church. In one sense, it seems odd that the attack would come now, after the election, when passions have cooled somewhat and the Governor has returned to work.

Thankfully, the alarm and sprinkler systems did their job — an area of some expertise for me.  They’re designed to save lives, and the women in the crafts group were at serious risk of injury or death without them.  Too many older buildings skip or skimp on such systems, occasionally with tragic results.  This church was built three years ago, and we can see how these building requirements work to save lives.

Hopefully, the police in Wasilla will catch the perpetrator(s) and we will know what their motivation was very quickly.  Until then, regardless of your denomination, let’s keep the congregation of the Wasilla Bible Church in our prayers.  If they have any fundraisers, we’ll revisit the story to get Hot Air readers involved.

Update: Comments from Headlines imported.


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Are Obama’s “wolves” still up there?

jgapinoy on December 13, 2008 at 6:24 PM

IF arson, i hope they nail the punks …

Buckaroo on December 13, 2008 at 6:26 PM

Can Andrew Sullivan account for his whereabouts at the time of the fire?

Mark1971 on December 13, 2008 at 6:28 PM

She was summoning the devil, duh. Its all of that witchcraft that she loves so much.

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 6:31 PM

I’m glad no one was hurt, and I’ll wait until they catch the perpetrators to determine what my opinion is. Often, when a church is vandilized or set afire, the MSM makes it a major story. I’m waiting to see how coverage plays out on this fire.

Red State State of Mind on December 13, 2008 at 6:31 PM

The Trig Truthers will be claiming that Sarah Palin’s Vast Pregnancy-Faking Conspiracy did this to cover up some aspect of Trig’s birth. Wait for it.

Jim62sch on December 13, 2008 at 6:33 PM

“when a church is vandilized or set afire, the MSM makes it a major story.”

Only if it is a black church?

mred on December 13, 2008 at 6:36 PM

She was summoning the devil, duh. Its all of that witchcraft that she loves so much.

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 6:31 PM

Jimmy, you make a box of rocks look like Stephen Hawking.

Go back to braiding your mucus.
_________

RJGatorEsq. on December 13, 2008 at 6:40 PM

That’s terrible. I hope they find out who did it.

CP on December 13, 2008 at 6:42 PM

when a church is vandilized or set afire, the MSM makes it a major story.

Only if it is a black church?

mred on December 13, 2008 at 6:36 PM

Yep. If Trinity United was burned down it would be getting wall-to-wall coverage and some kind of new civil rights legislation would be rushed through Congress

Mark1971 on December 13, 2008 at 6:44 PM

Jim62sch on December 13, 2008 at 6:33 PM

No doubt. The newest story in the comments (and getting picked up by the crazy lady) over at your favorite Trig Truther site is that the doctor’s letter is a forgery.

On a serious note: I hope that, if it was arson, they catch whoever did it. I know that the church has gotten some flak and some threats since Palin’s candidacy, but it may have just been a couple of bored teenagers looking for something to burn (that happened in my town recently, but it was a warehouse not a church). Either way, it’s terrible.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 6:44 PM

mccain must’ve summoned a RINO-illegal robeast to do the deed. ST. PALIN MUST BE AVENGED!!!!!

eh on December 13, 2008 at 6:45 PM

I smell some Palin Derangement Syndrome going on…

Princeps on December 13, 2008 at 6:50 PM

RJGatorEsq. on December 13, 2008 at 6:40 PM

I was being sarcastic.

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 6:55 PM

I think it was the friction from Palin reading literally ALL of the magazines and newspapers in the world at once.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 7:04 PM

Here’s more on this story:

Palin spokesman Bill McAllister said the governor stopped by the church Saturday morning and apologized if the incident was related to her.

In a written statement McAllister said Palin, “told an assistant pastor that she apologizes if the incident is in any way connected to the undeserved negative attention the church has received since she became a vice presidential candidate on Aug. 29. Whatever the motives of the arsonist, the governor has faith in the scriptural passage that what was intended for evil will in some way be used for good.”

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:12 PM

All right, who didn’t keep the matches away from Trig.

rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM

@ rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM

In before the evangelical sh*tstorm.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 7:14 PM

Sarah will have to try harder in the future to contain her awesomeness so unfortunate incidents like this do not occur.

The Arctic sea ice is making a comeback, so she’s made progress. A setback was bound to happen sooner or later.

Brian1972 on December 13, 2008 at 7:15 PM

when a church is vandilized or set afire, the MSM makes it a major story.

Only if it is a black church?

mred on December 13, 2008 at 6:36 PM

Your heart is black.

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 7:17 PM

This is a sad story before Christmas. I can bet though that the good Christians up there in AK will provide a temporary home and sanctuary for those who are currently without one.

Christians are good Christians quite often.

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 7:18 PM

I wonder how funny some of you would find this story if it had been about an arsonist setting fire to Trinity United Church in Chicago?

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:18 PM

This reflects bad on the media and the nutjobs who have PDS… I think we have a few on here commenting already and mocking the unfortunate incident…sick folks…

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:19 PM

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:19 PM

Yeah, they come out of the wood works just to hate on Palin, in any way possible.

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 7:21 PM

rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM
muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 7:14

PM

Have you no decency? Any at all?

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:22 PM

Sullivan?

I’m thinking Powell.

How long before he attacks Trig?

artist on December 13, 2008 at 7:23 PM

I think it was the friction from Palin reading literally ALL of the magazines and newspapers in the world at once.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 7:04 PM

If I laughed a little at that, does it make me a bad person?

malan89 on December 13, 2008 at 7:24 PM

All right, who didnt keep the matches away from Trig.

rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM

Totally not cool.

malan89 on December 13, 2008 at 7:25 PM

This reflects bad on the media and the nutjobs who have PDS I think we have a few on here commenting already and mocking the unfortunate incidentsick folks

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:19 PM

palin diefication syndrome?

that’s what i was mocking. not the church fire, which was an accident for all anyone knows at this point.

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:27 PM

I wasn’t referring the comments to you eh….

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:30 PM

Is not Andi Sullivan on vacation? Does he have a verified alibi?

Blake on December 13, 2008 at 7:31 PM

Aftermath image

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:35 PM

All right, who didnt keep the matches away from Trig.

rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM

Please contact me anytime you’re in Cali for an ass-whoopin. I won’t cause any permanent damage, aside from your ego; I’ll buy the first round afterwards.

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 7:41 PM

if i were a jumping to conclusions kinda guy, i’d be pumping this story about a bomb placed in a portland bank. a cop was killed trying to defuse it. looks andrew mickel-ish to me.

http://www.kgw.com/news-local/stories/kgw_121208_news_woodburn_bank_bomb.58bf59dd.html

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:41 PM

well we have already been told bomb-setting radicals are really just another interest group to be listened to in the interest of diversity

It wasnt terrorism, it was more like extreme vandalism

CaptainObvious on December 13, 2008 at 7:42 PM

RedState has a thread about this with a couple of comments from “Achance” (he writes a diary over there and is an Alaskan who is retired from state govt). Worth a visit for a little local perspective.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 7:42 PM

Yeah, they come out of the wood works just to hate on Palin, in any way possible.

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 7:21 PM

They have no shame or sense of decency. As I noted earlier, image what would be said if Obama’s old church was the target of arsonists. I have no great love of Obama or his crazy old pastor, but I would be disgusted and saddened if anyone did to Trinity United what was done to this Wasilla church.

The left and their faux-Republican Useful Idiots on HA are just classless.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:43 PM

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:35 PM

Thanks for posting that, it certainly gives a better prospective and maybe the few who are making fun would think better if they saw it. Such a shame.

Cindy Munford on December 13, 2008 at 7:44 PM

An Era of Hate on December 13, 2008 at 7:35 PM

Your link isn’t working. There’s a pic up with the ADN story now.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 7:46 PM

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:43 PM

who did what to the church?

read the article. the fire is being branded as “suspicious” based on the pastor’s word, not the fire marshal’s estimation or police investigators’.

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:48 PM

Please contact me anytime youre in Cali for an ass-whoopin. I wont cause any permanent damage, aside from your ego; Ill buy the first round afterwards.

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 7:41 PM

Please let me know when he comes to Cali. I’ll join you in opening that can. (BTW, it’s always so nice to know there are other conservatives in California. Another friend of Ronnie left in Reagan Country!)

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:48 PM

Cindy Munford on December 13, 2008 at 7:44 PM

Hm, maybe it’s just me that it won’t work for.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 7:49 PM

read the article. the fire is being branded as suspicious based on the pastors word, not the fire marshals estimation or police investigators.

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:48 PM

SECOND PARAGRAPH.

“This fire is definitely suspicious,” said Central Mat-Su Fire Chief James Steele.

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 7:51 PM

if a penny in a fusebox started a “suspicious” fire at trinity church, the left would hardly jump to any fewer conclusions about the identity and intent of the presumptive “arsonists” than the palin-deifiers have so far.

though you’re right that skepticism would be punnished by msm moralists.

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:54 PM

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:48 PM

Actually, KTUU reported that: “The fire is being investigated as a crime.”

And according to the ADN article, it wasn’t just the pastor who called it “suspicious”:

“This fire is definitely suspicious,” said Central Mat-Su Fire Chief James Steele.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:54 PM

jimmy the notable on December 13, 2008 at 7:51 PM

can’t dispute that. i made a boner. sorry.

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:56 PM

@ ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 7:22 PM

Have you no sense of humor? Nvm, the answer is obvious.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 7:58 PM

@ rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM

Forget all the haters, I thought it was hilarious.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 8:00 PM

eh on December 13, 2008 at 7:54 PM

Speaking only for myself of course, I’m not ready to jump to the conclusion that the fire is related to Palin. It may well have been a couple of drunk locals or bored teenagers or just a firebug. Or it may just look suspicious and not actually be a criminal act.

I think that because the church got some flak during the campaign that it’s worth considering that the two things are related. I think the authorities are probably looking at all possibilities and I’ll wait for their conclusions. In the meantime, it’s a terrible thing and I wish the church the very best as they rebuild.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 8:01 PM

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 7:17 PM

Man, how do you manage to pop up anytime anyone dares suggest blacks get preferential treatment of any sort? Do you have a persecution radar chip implanted in your head or something?

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:02 PM

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 8:00 PM

I have a great sense of humor. I just think making fun of a Down Syndrome baby is cruel. I didn’t find it funny. I found it sick.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:03 PM

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:02 PM

the same way the Palin trolls arrive … Commissioner Axelrod turns on the signal and they come a runnin

joey24007 on December 13, 2008 at 8:05 PM

@ ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:03 PM

Name your favorite funny movie.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 8:07 PM

The pastor is estimating damage at more than $1 million.

For a church?
Wouldn’t that money help the poor?

I could never understand why so called Christians spend that kind of money on a building.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:09 PM

I think that because the church got some flak during the campaign that its worth considering that the two things are related. I think the authorities are probably looking at all possibilities and Ill wait for their conclusions. In the meantime, its a terrible thing and I wish the church the very best as they rebuild.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 8:01 PM

That church was made famous by the national news media. It became the poster child for “anti-gay Christian bigotry” on leftwing websites. The arson might not have had anything to do with the Governor per se, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it was politically motivated. Or maybe not. Who knows? But after witnessing what the anti-Prop 8 crowd has been doing in my state, I wouldn’t be surprised if some loon decided to set fire to this church.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:10 PM

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:09 PM

Judas, is that you?

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:12 PM

@ rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM
Forget all the haters, I thought it was hilarious.
muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 8:00 PM

I second. :-)

JustTruth101 on December 13, 2008 at 8:13 PM

Darth, just tell me the passages in the Bible about the rich.
I will quote you the ones about the poor.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:13 PM

Burning up a church that Palin attends. Low beyond low.
We all know liberals are rats and godless.
Karma will bite them hard on the ass for doing such a thing.

jencab on December 13, 2008 at 8:15 PM

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:02 PM

it’s a bullshit detector.

eh on December 13, 2008 at 8:15 PM

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:10 PM

I think we’re in agreement. I, like you I’m sure, just want to give investigators a chance to do their jobs. I’m also sure that the community is going to come out and help the church rebuild. A local church in my community was completely destroyed by an electrical fire that the insurance refused to pay on, and other local churches and the rest of the community raised the money to rebuild it. As Palin said in her statement: “what was intended for evil will in some way be used for good.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 8:20 PM

Name your favorite funny movie.

muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 8:07 PM

That’s a list that could go on for pages. Favorites off the top of my head: What About Bob, Groundhog Day, Annie Hall, The Sleeper, Tootsie, Mrs. Doubtfire, A League of Their Own, My Cousin Vinnie, Bringing Up Baby, Dr. Strangelove, His Girl Friday, Auntie Mame… the list could go on for pages…I’m sure I’m missing hundreds…

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:21 PM

Darth, just tell me the passages in the Bible about the rich.
I will quote you the ones about the poor.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:13 PM

How about I quote you the passages where Judas says the same thing you do?

John 12
4But one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, who was later to betray him, objected,
5″Why wasn’t this perfume sold and the money given to the poor? It was worth a year’s wages.[b]”
6He did not say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief; as keeper of the money bag, he used to help himself to what was put into it.
7″Leave her alone,” Jesus replied. ” It was intended that she should save this perfume for the day of my burial.
8You will always have the poor among you, but you will not always have me.”

There’s nothing wrong with spending money to honor God. The idea that this is unChristian is absurd. The church serves over 1000 people and probably conducts a lot of charitable events in it (like crafts classes or whaterver), and from what I know from friends who live in Alaska, housing costs in Alaska are ridiculously high so I’m not sure why a building that was meant to, at the very least, house that many people wouldn’t be worth several million dollars.

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:23 PM

Where is Bill Ayers at the moment?

…and I think it is worth noting too that it is fairly obvious that the reporter who wrote this article doesn’t like Gov Palin that much. Simply because the author doesn’t refer her as Governor Pailin but rather as the failed Republican Vice Presidential candidate or just plain Palin. I was not surprised to see that the AP contributed to this article and maybe that explains the level of disrespect shown toward Gov Palin in it.

Dreadnought223 on December 13, 2008 at 8:27 PM

ADN is not exactly favorable to Palin.

not good for her considering that it is really the only news source that makes it to the lower 48.

She needs to do what the founders would have done … start a newspaper !

joey24007 on December 13, 2008 at 8:30 PM

The AP photo service noted this:

A snow covered tree sits outside of the fire damaged Wasilla Bible Church in Wasilla, Alaska Saturday Dec. 13, 2008. Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin’s home church was badly damaged in an arson fire. No one was injured in the fire, which was intentionally set while people, including two children, were inside. [emphasis added]

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:33 PM

I hope the culprit(s) is(are) found and sent to jail.

SC.Charlie
A Gay Conservative

SC.Charlie on December 13, 2008 at 8:35 PM

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:23 PM

Look moron, you want to get in a pissing contest. Ok.

Lev. 25:35-37
If one of your countrymen becomes poor and is unable to support himself among you, help him as you would an alien or a temporary resident so he can continue to live among you.

So let me get this straight. Your version of Christianity allows you to spend money on objects, but not people?
Ever hear of multiple services? Smaller building, more money to aid the poor.
But hey, you got excuses.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:40 PM

The full AP story. Has a couple of more quotes from the fire chief, but nothing really new except this:

Outside temperatures were minus 20 as firefighters battled the blaze.

Dude.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 8:43 PM

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:40 PM

It doesn’t have to be an either/or scenario. Churches are quite capable of building places of worship and aiding the poor. In fact, if you go to the poorest places in the world, you’ll find Christian missionaries there feeding the hungry, sheltering the homeless, tending the sick.

Your either/or scenario reminds of people who automatically assume that when one person gets rich, another person gets poor.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:44 PM

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:23 PM

DT. 15:11

There will always be poor people in the land. Therefore I command you to be openhanded toward your brothers and toward the poor and needy in your land.

How much money was Mother Theresa’s church worth?
She was poor and lived among the poor.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:46 PM

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:44 PM
I assume no such thing. The church may indeed aid the poor. But at what expense to itself?
I say a multimillion dollar church is ridiculous. There are better ways to aid your fellow man.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:49 PM

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 8:43 PM

This sentence (from the AP article you linked to) stood out for me:

The fire was set at the entrance of the church and moved inward as a small group of women were working on crafts, Steele said. The group was alerted to the blaze by a fire alarm.

“The fire was set at the entrance to the church”… It was obviously arson. They’re not telling us other details because it’s an open investigation.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:49 PM

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:49 PM

I understand your point. I simply disagree. Some might say that the beauty of the Chartes Cathedral is “excessive”. I think it is a holy work of art and a testament to Christendom and western civilization. Obviously, God didn’t have a problem with Solomon building a beautiful and expensive temple. He could have just continued to worship in a tent. But he decided to built a temple instead.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:54 PM

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:49 PM

BTW, looking at the pictures of this church, it’s apparent that it is not excessive or opulent in any way. It looks like a big square box. $1 million for construction is nothing. It costs money to build buildings you know. And everything is more expensive in Alaska due the costs of heating.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:58 PM

I’m amazed at the number of responses here without any of the standard anti-Palin trolls present.

fiatboomer on December 13, 2008 at 9:03 PM

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 8:58 PM

To each his own. I just thought it excessive.
Just a throwaway line really, in this culture.
But the moron named darth had to compare me to Judas.
Really? The man who betrayed Christ?
Dope does not even know me.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 9:06 PM

fiatboomer on December 13, 2008 at 9:03 PM

Give them time. They’re out drinking.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 9:06 PM

Man, how do you manage to pop up anytime anyone dares suggest blacks get preferential treatment of any sort? Do you have a persecution radar chip implanted in your head or something?

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 8:02 PM

Get real. I tend to focus on one thread for a while. So I miss out on a lot of opportunities to annoy you. I’ll try to be more efficient in the future.

That being said snarked, I spit my twisted logic at many topics. I’ve been commenting here for a couple of years now. Yet, you completely misunderstand my posturing.

Blacks do get a lot of preferential treatment. Is that news?

That fact does not equate to the torrent of misguided remarks and flatout stupid statements I read at HA all the time. I think many commenters overstate the case for reverse-racism and are simply unwilling to acknowledge the lingering remnants of our nation’s past. Forgetting our nation’s history is becoming a national pasttime. That’s why God is being removed from public life. Conservatives and liberals have equal blind spots…just on different sides of the boxcar.

Ask yourself this question: Whom is more discriminated against? For whom are the cards less likely to produce a winning hand — all things being the same? (Insert your favorite or least favorite minority or majority group.)

Blacks, Whites, Christians, Catholics, women, Muslims, Arabs, homosexuals, journalists, Dr Yvonne Fulbright, RINOS, moderate Republicans, Democrats, Latinos, Mexicans, the Obamas, the Clintons, racists, actors, musicians and all types of people are frequently insulted herein. For better or for worse I have come to the defense and levied my own complaints against someone from every one of those groups and more.

However, my typical rant is cast against the hypocrisy I detect from my own party members and any general slight I perceive to be based on gross generalizations.

I have no favorite rant topic. But I find one every day.

You go ahead and characterize me as you see fit. I’ll be sure to ignore you next time you ignore the specifics about my comments.

Good day to you fine sir. To misquote a rising talk show star: Get off my phone dick you big dope.

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 9:08 PM

Obviously the fire was caused when the Cuda stood in one spot too long near the church … yowza

that joke was coming eventually, figured we get it over with

joey24007 on December 13, 2008 at 9:08 PM

Look moron, you want to get in a pissing contest. Ok.

Lev. 25:35-37
If one of your countrymen becomes poor and is unable to support himself among you, help him as you would an alien or a temporary resident so he can continue to live among you.

So let me get this straight. Your version of Christianity allows you to spend money on objects, but not people?

Nice rant but I never said anything about not helping people. I challenged your asinine demand that every extra penny has to be spent on other people.

Ever hear of multiple services? Smaller building, more money to aid the poor.
But hey, you got excuses.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:40 PM

Why bother with a building at all? Why not just hold service on the lawn? Or in a tent. Or just broadcast it over the Internet so people don’t even have to leave their house! The gas money spent on the trip can go to help feed the poor.

You’ve yet to explain what’s wrong with spending money on a church. Nowhere does God demand to spend every single extra penny you have on the poor, nor would God get upset at people spending money to service Him in the best way possible.

Consider actually answering the argument instead of throwing irrelevant texts about helping the poor at me when I never said there’s anything wrong with helping the poor. If your next post is as insubstantial as your last two don’t expect a response.

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 9:14 PM

FYI the ADN has updated their story again. They’ve added more details about the building and the fire department response.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 9:16 PM

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 9:16 PM

From the updated article:

A task force has been formed to investigate including people from the state fire marshal’s office, the Central Mat-Su Fire Department, the Wasilla Police Department and the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

When did they add the “Explosives” part to the ATF title? Is it just me, or does it seem like the ATF keeps adding new initials to its name to keep itself in business?

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 9:24 PM

Ill be sure to ignore you next time you ignore the specifics about my comments.

The Race Card on December 13, 2008 at 9:08 PM

As much as I admire your ability to rant like a madman, I never ignored the specifics about your comments. In fact,they’re virtually identical in every one: You’re a black dude with a chip on your shoulder. You think the world is out to persecute blacks and are outraged when anyone expresses any belief that maybe sometimes it’s blacks who do the persecution, or that it’s not blacks who are being persecuted, or that blacks have a positive spotlight in some areas. It is simply inconceivable to your tiny reptilian brain that these people could be right sometimes. A black man became president despite the fact that he’s a baby killing communist whose middle name is Hussein. Does this mean racism’s ended? Of course not. Does this mean that, overall, blacks are equal to whites and just about every other race? F**k yes, so quit your b****ing. A black man can, in America or Canada, achieve the exact same thing a white man can. To quote what that bearded dude told George Clooney in the cinematic masterpiece “From Dusk ‘Till Dawn”: are you so much of a loser that you can’t tell when you’ve won?

Darth Executor on December 13, 2008 at 9:24 PM

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 9:24 PM

So it’s the ATFE now? Good catch, I didn’t notice that when I read the article.

And you can color me surprised: MSNBC.com picked up the AP story (I’m not linking them. It’s just the same AP story linked above.). If you do a news search some other outlets, mostly local, have picked up the AP story too. I doubt this is going to get a lot of attention though. Maybe I’m wrong, I often am.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 9:29 PM

I say a multimillion dollar church is ridiculous. There are better ways to aid your fellow man.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:49 PM

Four points.

First, I would bet that you think any church is ridiculous.

Second, the areas that were damaged were offices and classrooms. Offices are necessary: pastors conduct a lot of private business (e.g. marriage counseling, alcohol and drug abuse counseling, and so on). Classrooms are also necessary. They are the place where, you know, teachers teach.

Third, I have seen photos of the church. It is fairly spartan. However, it doesn’t take much to rack up $1,000,000 in damage.

Fourth, there is nothing on which the money could have been spent that is more important than saving souls. If it takes a nice gym to get young people involved in a church, then you build a nice gym. Etc.
__________

RJGatorEsq. on December 13, 2008 at 9:43 PM

I say a multimillion dollar church is ridiculous. There are better ways to aid your fellow man.

rockdalian on December 13, 2008 at 8:49 PM

And a church building provides MANY ways to aid our fellow brothers and sisters – especially one in such a harsh climate.

Many church buildings house food pantries and clothes closets; host community support meetings like AA, Boy Scouts and various other support groups; operate soup kitchens; provide daycare and child support and even act as homeless shelters.

This is not to mention the basic community worship function of the church.

Point being that that $1 million dollars gets a bigger return on its investment into the community through the building of the church than if it just gave the money away.

Religious_Zealot on December 13, 2008 at 9:47 PM

RJGatorEsq. on December 13, 2008 at 9:43 PM

Fifth, don’t attend the church if you don’t like it

joey24007 on December 13, 2008 at 9:48 PM

Offices are necessary: pastors conduct a lot of private business (e.g. marriage counseling, alcohol and drug abuse counseling, and so on). Classrooms are also necessary. They are the place where, you know, teachers teach.

Thank you, I missed these in my post.

I’m not sure if churches EVER were simply for worship, but if they were they definitely not now.

Most church buildings also serve as community centers where the local populace can go to get the aid and help they need (and can also go for social activities which are vital in keeping the community linked together).

I am certain there are overly extravagant churches (the Crystal Cathedral leaps to mind), but this one isn’t.

Religious_Zealot on December 13, 2008 at 9:56 PM

So its the ATFE now?

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 9:29 PM

Soon it will be known as the bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, Explosives, and Copyright Infringement.

And after that they can add Cable TV Theft. Anything to keep it going. I’m sure they can find another Waco to justify their existance.

Fedzilla just keeps growing.

ramrocks on December 13, 2008 at 10:04 PM

Religious Zealot:

Agreed.

I am one of the lay leaders at a Methodist church. It is fairly good-sized: we have about 500 in average weekly worship. There is, literally, something going on at the church 7 nights a week: worship, instruction, Scouts, cancer support groups, divorce support groups, AA, youth ministries, singles ministries, music ministries, prayer vigils, food pantries, committee meetings, community outreach…dozens of things that Christians do.

Cheers.
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RJGatorEsq. on December 13, 2008 at 10:05 PM

Article from the Wasilla paper (The Frontiersman). They got a couple of comments from Palin’s parents.

meltenn on December 13, 2008 at 10:32 PM

Which subversive organization has claimed credit? The Associated Press or the ACLU?

viking01 on December 13, 2008 at 11:01 PM

“viking01 on December 13, 2008 at 11:01 PM”

HEH!

Buckaroo on December 13, 2008 at 11:17 PM

All right, who didnt keep the matches away from Trig.

rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM

What a ghoulish remark.

Renae on December 13, 2008 at 11:47 PM

@ rbj on December 13, 2008 at 7:13 PM
Forget all the haters, I thought it was hilarious.
muyoso on December 13, 2008 at 8:00 PM
I second.

JustTruth101 on December 13, 2008 at 8:13 PM

Now you all can run down to the nursing home and wax the steps, that’d be “hilarious” too.

Renae on December 13, 2008 at 11:50 PM

One more local news story, this one with video.

meltenn on December 14, 2008 at 12:11 AM

meltenn on December 14, 2008 at 12:11 AM

Team Sarah is all over this story:

The church itself has come under fire from activists who opposed Sarah Palin, accusing them of seeking to burn witches and other intolerance and making remarks that may be deemed to be threatening, although I have received no information that any specific threats were made.

Wiccan arsonists? Who knows? Such a shame. Apparently there were a lot of gifts and goods set aside to help families in need were also destroyed in the fire.

ramrocks on December 14, 2008 at 1:15 AM

Believe it or not, men, we really do appreciate you. I just tossed my Parrot Bay Mojito bottles in the recycling bin with a CRASH that sent my poor snoozing husband charging downstairs to my rescue.I love that man. He may find himself in the doghouse at times, but I always parole him within 24 hours, or at least by the time we hit the sack. No sense going to bed angry.

Sekhmet on December 14, 2008 at 1:18 AM

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