Wrong, without Sarah Palin we could have garnered many many more Independent voters – period. We lost because she alienated the average normal, moderate American.

AprilOrit on December 11, 2008 at 12:00 AM

When I read nonsense like this I haver to wonder – how many clandestine Dem saboteurs are out there co-opting and sabotaging conservative groups and forums, just like they did the educational community and are now doing to the churches? Simply put, I don’t believe that even *you* believe what you’re saying about the effect of Sarah Palin.

MoveOn is one helluva thorough organization, I’ll give ‘em that.

Joel Mowbray wrote an excellent piece at townhall.com claiming that 20% of conservatives deserted the GOP and voted for Obama, giving Obama the election. Maybe you should claim that Sarah was responsible for that as well-that she wasn’t conservative enough for these folks. Here’s my take: no one competing individual cost the GOP the election: it was the extraneous events of the financial meltdown and the hatred of the Bush administration that caused the GOP to lose the election; Rasmussen had McCain at 49-47 over Obama on September 15 and then for the next 3 weeks events intervened to cause him to be 7-10 behind Obama; as one pundit put it Reagan Democrats vote Democratic in harsh economic times and Republican in upbeat economic times; independents do as well; the Democrats always do well when a bad economy is presided over by Republicans (Hoover 1932). I will say this about McCain: he may not have cost the GOP the election but he certainly didn’t make the membership of his party feel kindly towards him after the loss-you hardly hear his name mentioned in GOP circles while Sarah Palin stills hogs the limelight and apparently will also in 2009. For a person that ALIENATED so many voters as you suggest, I find it hard to reconcile it with Palin’s unprecedented popularity after a defeat and to boot as a VP losing candidate. What you have here is cognitive dissonance on steroids.

Wrong. You just got your butts beat by an inexperienced nobody with extraordinarily questionable connections because the mob, unions (but I repeat myself), and media decided that Mr. Nobody was gonna win. And that was after Sarah Palin generated enormous enthusiasm and donations from the alienated base you want to “send packing.”

If you can’t compete with social conservative support, how in the world are you going to compete without it? Offer a better deal to the mobsters and media moguls so they ditch the Dems and go Republican? If that’s your party, you can have it. If I don’t have a more appealing choice than that, I’ll give it up just let the crooks divide up the goodies behind the scenes as they take turns looting America.

Venusian Visitor on December 10, 2008 at 9:15 PM

Wrong, without Sarah Palin we could have garnered many many more Independent voters – period. We lost because she alienated the average normal, moderate American.

Brilliant and so damn true….we do not need these loons in our party – period. Send them packing, sooner than later.

AprilOrit on December 10, 2008 at 7:35 PM

Wrong. You just got your butts beat by an inexperienced nobody with extraordinarily questionable connections because the mob, unions (but I repeat myself), and media decided that Mr. Nobody was gonna win. And that was after Sarah Palin generated enormous enthusiasm and donations from the alienated base you want to “send packing.”

If you can’t compete with social conservative support, how in the world are you going to compete without it? Offer a better deal to the mobsters and media moguls so they ditch the Dems and go Republican? If that’s your party, you can have it. If I don’t have a more appealing choice than that, I’ll give it up just let the crooks divide up the goodies behind the scenes as they take turns looting America.

Olaf, while we’re handing out awards, how ’bout one for you for being the most vacuous and sanctimonious poster who is a member of the authoritarian/fundamentalist Christian fringe right. It was between you and the certifiably whacked out poster formerly known as ITookTheRedPill (his deranged musings can still be found on mm.com).

dakine on December 10, 2008 at 4:19 PM

One other thing aboput Olaf – I somethimes think he/she is not for real. We know Red Pill is for real, he/she posts over at michelle’s blog and has a personal blog as well.

But with Olaf – sometimes it almost seems that what she/he posts is so Far Right Batsh*t Loon gone, that it almost seems like a plant from DU or KOS; with intentions of littering the comments with irresponsible Far Right comments – that should be pulled and deleted.

Olaf, while we’re handing out awards, how ’bout one for you for being the most vacuous and sanctimonious poster who is a member of the authoritarian/fundamentalist Christian fringe right. It was between you and the certifiably whacked out poster formerly known as ITookTheRedPill (his deranged musings can still be found on mm.com).

dakine on December 10, 2008 at 4:19 PM

Brilliant and so damn true….we do not need these loons in our party – period. Send them packing, sooner than later.

…sending the issue of abortion back to the states does not necessarily mean that abortion will not be outlawed-all it means is that voters or legislators will have the final say, not jurists.

technopeasant on December 10, 2008 at 2:34 PM

That’s fine. In a democracy you abide by the majority will as expressed through elections or move elsewhere. I don’t think that the federal government needs to get involved in this, and neither do the federal legislators.

Had it wished to do so, Congress probably could have passed a Federal Abortion Act under the Health & Welfare clause that would require the States to permit abortion in public institutions or forfeit federal funding. The reason that didn’t happen is that abortion is too much a hot-button issue; many people feel strongly about it one way or the other, and the regional differences in attitudes are dramatic. And that’s precisely why this should be a local issue for State legislatures to decide.

But we have had, since the late 1940′s, a runaway federal judiciary in general, and Supreme Court in particular. The judiciary’s job is to decide actual cases and controversies based on existing law. When a case is unique, courts have the power to interpret legislation or add to the common law for the purpose of resolving the single, narrow dispute that is before them. Until the 1950′s, court’s did not make sweeping pronouncements on matters of public policy. That’s what the legislature is supposed to do.

People vote for their legislative representitives, and therefore have influence on legislation. The public decides public policy. But federal judges are not elected; they are appointed for life and answer to no one. And we’re getting a great demonstration in the news this week of the type of factors that enter into making political appointments.

We are being ruled increasingly by judicial fiat. This is utterly unconstitutional, undemocratic, and corrupt. If the people of New Jersey decide through their legislatures to allow abortion,or the citizens of Utah legalize polygamy, then I’m fine with that even though I do not agree with the result. The democratic process has been respected. When it goes, freedom goes, too. And your ox might be the next to be gored.

Michael Steele is a fine fellow, but he’s wrong. Emphasizing the other reasons for non-fanatic pro-choicers to vote Republican makes a lot more sense than alienating those to whom abortion is a big deal by giving them nowhere to go politically.

Good posts thinkagain.

dakine on December 10, 2008 at 2:16 PM

Yeah good posts…ol thinkagain here wins the “Most Demon Possessed blogger of the year” award, in my book.

Vile..check

Hate filled…check

Violence inciting against Christians….check

Numerous anti-Christ inspired statements…check

Congratulations.

It was a close on this year between you and your buddy ronsfi but you take the cake man.

What was this thread’s original topic, anyway? Something about the Republicans wanting to lose with a broad base instead of with a narrow base?

Anyone check out the Modern Whig site? They’ve been growing rapidly. Apparently the party originated with servicemen stationed in Iraq and Afghanistan. I hope they get it up and running. I’m feeling under-appreciated; it would be nice to have someone courting the social conservatives for a change.

Good posts thinkagain.

dakine on December 10, 2008 at 2:16 PM

Thanks dakine, cheers.

—-

Some people here might get a kick out of Pat Condell’s wise and amusing thoughts:

Godless and free

Good posts thinkagain.

No you don’t. You want someone to pay attention to you…

Venusian Visitor on December 9, 2008 at 6:39 PM

And you’re playing right into my hands. ;)

LOL, good to see your true colors. most libs don’t let it hang out like that.

Ya I don’t mixing it up a bit. :) I’m not a lib, I’m centrist-there are views I (dis)agree with on both sides of the aisle.

Look, I’m no Christian but I don’t see where they harm the party. The problem is people like you that want them to shed their principles. That is not what a conservative does, that is what a dem does when the going gets tough. If you want a party with no moral principles they have what you’re looking for.

kongzilla on December 9, 2008 at 6:59 PM

No I’d like to see Christians shed their delusions (beliefs in imaginary things/creatures), otherwise I’ve actually had positive things to say about them as evident in my earlier posts on this site. I credit Christians with recognizing we’re at war with Islam, with having a love for country and valuing things like honor, service, sacrifice, views balked at by many dems/liberals.

However some of their ‘principles’ are outdated and retrogressive, like their stance on abortion, gay rights, euthanasia. Their views are based on the best ideas of the bronze age, its time they join our century.

You just owned yourself

thinkagain on December 10, 2008 at 12:29 PM

I’m the retard?

Think again.

I’ll take a nation of retards ober a nation of soulless, ignorant monsters like you any day of the week. Retards are incapable of the hatred you spout on a regular basis.

You just owned yourself and proved that retards are capable of spewing hatred. I can understand why you’d want to surround yourself with your own kind, birds of a feather…lol

BKennedy on December 9, 2008 at 4:05 PM

Atheism is a rejection of god-belief for lack of evidence-nothing more. Communism replaced god-worship with state-worship and the deaths were due to battling with pro-Capitalist and other socio-economic systems. So don’t attribute that to atheism.

Christianity has caused hundreds of millions of deaths through the crusades and colonization of other nations-so don’t act like your ideology has no blood on its hands when its drenched in it.

Hitler was a Christian.

Give up the crusade. It’s impossible to convince most people that something they believe in on faith is not true. Your time is better spent preventing them from imposing irrational belief systems on their fellow citizens. We don’t live in a theocracy but a free nation of individuals protected by common rights and objective, secular laws.

Sign of the Dollar on December 9, 2008 at 6:30 PM

How can you prevent them from imposing their irrational beliefs on others if you don’t confront them and offer an alternate viewpoint? Its not a crusade, I’m representing the secular perspective as they’re standing for the theocratic view.

This nation is secular because people like us fought to have a separation of church and state. However just like freedom, keeping the nation secular requires a constant struggle.

A smaller tent doesn’t lead to more votes, especially when the demographics change every four years and the GOP has to compete for young voters.

dedalus on December 10, 2008 at 10:07 AM

The primary problem is that folks are confusing general conservative stances with strict social conservative values. The latter did not win us Bush or Reagan. It was the general overlay of conservative principles, a balance of fiscal and conservative approaches that appealed to the masses, that time and again makes Americans vote Republican.

A total absence of conservative values is too weak, a la McCain. An overbearing restrictive approach stemming from desire for behavior control also doesn’t work, a la Huckabee.

Mark Garnett on December 10, 2008 at 7:31 AM

A smaller tent doesn’t lead to more votes, especially when the demographics change every four years and the GOP has to compete for young voters.

Mark Garnett on December 10, 2008 at 9:15 AM

Well, I didn’t say turning off the caps lock would make you any more coherent.

Just learn something.

Yeah, that’s what you need to stop being. Turn the damn caps lock off.

MadisonConservative on December 10, 2008 at 9:10 AM

bite me… that’s better… no caps…. moron