Breaking: Supreme Court declines to hear Obama birth certificate challenge
posted at 10:54 am on December 8, 2008 by Allahpundit
Denials of cert rarely come with explanations and this one’s no exception, although the math doesn’t lie: They needed four votes to take Leo Donofrio’s case and between Roberts, Scalia, Thomas, Alito, and Kennedy, they couldn’t get there. End of the line for birth certificate Truthers? Of course not. There are windmills aplenty still to tilt at, as Dave Weigel explains:
How much further will the fight to de-certify Obama go? It won’t stop if the Electoral College votes for Obama, as the skeptics will try to get a congressman or senator to officially challenge the result. Rep. Chris Cannon of Utah was willing to believe that Bill Ayers wrote Dreams From My Father, so the skeptics might have a chance.
And if every vote certification goes off without a hitch and Obama is inaugurated on Jan. 20? Gary Kreep is ready for that.
“When Obama starts signing executive orders and legislation,” Kreep says, “I’ll be filing lawsuits unless and until he proves he’s an American citizen. Some judge, someday, is going to want this proved on the merits. You can run, but you can’t hide.”
David Horowitz ponders the galactic clusterfark that might have been had the Court taken the case. If anything good comes of this, it’ll be Congress and the states revisiting the “natural born” qualification, which must surely be the single dumbest operative clause in the Constitution. Exit question for WaPo, which helpfully informs its readers that “right-wing blogs were outraged” when Souter turned down Donofrio’s petition originally: Care to name one?
Blowback
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And Joe the plumber’s financials !
macncheez on December 8, 2008 at 2:19 PM
One problem: she isn’t his paternal grandmother by blood, but one of his grandfather’s wives (polygamy). But perhaps she has some knowledge of the situation nonetheless.
baldilocks on December 8, 2008 at 2:19 PM
Ha.
Esthier on December 8, 2008 at 2:19 PM
esthier, ok, maybe you got me there with snopes – probably should have worded that a little better – ie. snopes and liberal factcheck.org
faraway on December 8, 2008 at 2:20 PM
You don’t understand my point, at all. I’m not saying that this will “make Russia stronger” or anything of the sort. And our enemies couldn’t care less about our Constitution or anything else of the sort.
What I am saying is that our reaction will be analyzed by our enemies to assess how they will deal with us. When Horowitz says that the Constitution should be ignored because of fear of the “64 million”, that says something about the nature of the American public, and our politicians and institutions, and what moves us – what we are willing to surrender because of fear. This is not lost on those who wish us harm. What is so difficult to understand about that?
progressoverpeace on December 8, 2008 at 2:25 PM
The big holes that the Supreme Court left are:
1) who does have standing to bring a suit to enforce a provision of the United States Constitution and
2) does a person have to prove that he meets the qualifications to hold office?
scrubjay on December 8, 2008 at 2:28 PM
OMG it has as much of a chance at being heard as a) all his other suits and b)as much of a chance at being heard as the one laughed out of court today!
The republic is doomed.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 2:29 PM
I agree 100%
beachgirlusa on December 8, 2008 at 2:31 PM
Once again, you pull out a quote, of someone who has NOT seen his Birth Cert… paraphrasing what another Official actualy said, when we HAVE THE DIRECT QUOTE from the first official!
And making an ILLEGAL release of information.
This new quote says that someone else said that Obama was born in Hawaii, when it is CLEAR that the origional quote said nothing of the sort.
Your quoting someones OPINION of what someone else said, as FACT, when we have the source material…
Epic Fail.
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 2:32 PM
This is such a foolish statement that I feel bad for pointing it out once again for the delicious irony.
…in order to point out this estimation and the reasoning that follows:
econavenger on December 8, 2008 at 2:34 PM
He never said this.
I read the article, and couldn’t find “the Constitution should be ignored because of fear of the “64 million”” in there anywhere. Did I miss it?
I also didn’t find any proof indicting Obama as somebody who is imminently unqualified for the Presidency on the basis of where he came out of his American mother’s womb. In fact, evidence, in the form of facsimilies of the document and falsifiable statements from government officials, has been presented to the contrary.
Now what’s the problem?
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 2:34 PM
Actualy, Pravda is all over this…
And one of the key things about getting a security clearance, is to ensure there is nothing you could be blackmailed for.
IF some foreign government could get this information, and use it to force a Constitutional crises at a time of their choosing? Remember dual citizens have standing as citizens, so an Iranian/US or Russian/US citizen can sue.
Ouchy.
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 2:35 PM
What this demonstrates to our nation’s enemies is that we will opt for convenience even if it makes us weaker. That we’ll gamble on hope and change rather higher expectations and self-reliance and a Constitution explicit in its demands, limits and expectations on government. Don’t rock the boat because the Titanic is unsinkable. So the experts keep claiming.
Neville Chamberlain tried the same sort of populist ignore it and it will go away claptrap and his nation was nearly assimilated in 1940. Britain is already at that juncture now as they try to be stylish, diverse and multicultural. At their peril. May we be more wise in our demands and qualifications of those whom would lead us.
viking01 on December 8, 2008 at 2:37 PM
Didn’t miss that, right2bright.
Took it into consideration. Someone earlier answered that in a way I agree with.
You need to understand that I’m not wired into the idea that Obama wasn’t born in Hawaii. (I figure he was.) Nor am I wired into the notion that there is a dual citizenship that would make any Constitutional difference.
It’s not that I buy these arguments as truth; it’s that I refuse to discredit them without the evidence to do so.
I simply think we have a right to KNOW.
The most essential (and more detailed) part of the evidence to these questions is the long-form birth certificate, and that is indeed locked in a vault.
This is an essential document, one that would put to rest these arguments about birthplace, adoption, etc.
No one can see it except Hawaiian officials, and no Hawaiian official, by law, can speak to its contents. Obama, however, could make it available, at least to judges in some of these numerous lawsuits. Instead, he goes to considerable lengths to keep it under wraps.
So all we are all doing here is standing outside the vault door, arguing about what is behind it.
There are those of us who marshal arguments as to how the official long-form birth certificate must surely corroborate the evidence so far, and therefore we should drop the issue.
There are others who argue that there is evidence casting sufficient doubt that it may not, so we should press the issue.
In any case, there is a basic document that would further elucidate these issues, yet apparently no one has a right to see it. Which is, on the face of it, completely absurd.
My scientific method tells me not to be put off at the vault door by any number of people seeking to humiliate me and others who want that birth certificate to see light. It tells me not to accept the flawed reasoning of those who wish to block vital evidence just because the person asking for it is supposedly risking his/her reputation and is a “loon.”
My reasoning tells me that there is no valid excuse for Obama refusing to provide it to court authorities.
My common sense tells me that when people go to great lengths to hide something, that means they are probably hiding something.
My experience tells me that if this can be successfully kept hidden under lock and key, so can a whole lot of other basic knowledge we may have once thought we had a right to know.
My guess is that Obama was born in Hawaii, but my logic tells me that my guess isn’t enough. And neither is anyone else’s, when we all know that the more definitive evidence is being hidden.
My sense of justice tells me no one should be above the law, particularly not our elected officials, and the most basic standard they have to meet is eligibility for their positions.
My sense of humor tells me that the only thing funnier than someone being somehow elected to President when he isn’t even qualified – if such has indeed happened – are those who try so hard to convince the rest of us we have no right to know.
Alana on December 8, 2008 at 2:38 PM
Good Lt, Right2bRight, et al.,
There is no weighting of Berg’s argument based upon the strength of his beliefs, nor is he even really quoted much. I find it offensive that people are dismissing the arguments based upon his insanity. You fail to realize that even a blind squirrel will occasionally find a nut, and many discoveries that you depend upon as a modern human were made by people who were considered insane by their compatriots.
Unlike the 9/11 truthers, the majority of us would be completely satisfied with compliance in the discovery process of at least one of these lawsuits. In the VA case, Obama did produce a 2007 COLB, which I found surprising, but it was just like one of the versions floating around the internet. However, it was not the requested long copy. The suit was dismissed upon the lacking standing basis, but that is a whole different problem.
Obama has complete control of this, however, there is just this nagging tendency of completely ignoring discovery in these law suits, and expending far more effort and money in getting cases dismissed. Circumstantially, this makes no sense.
What reason would he have to not simply comply? I can think of several, but that is all speculative, and I generally don’t discuss things of that nature. What needs to happen is for this to be put to bed by Obama forking over the documents to the SCOTUS, Congress, or heck I’d even be satisfied if the records were entered into the Library of Congress.
If I had been this sparing with my birth certificate, I never would have been granted my clearance, driver’s license, and a whole host of other things. Why is it wrong to request the same of the POTUS? BECAUSE the question was raised should be reason enough for compliance.
Marine_Bio on December 8, 2008 at 2:38 PM
(the Hawaiian official)
Not that I want to join the he said/she said game. How about releasing a straight pdf? Again I ask the question what makes this one person so special that a whole set of rules does/does not apply?
That is all a lot of us was asking, for a simple qualification step in any job seeker’s process. I am a natrualized citizen. If I have to rely on some official’s statement about a sealed document, I would never be able to get hired. I would get job offer(s) but HR would not accept the so-called ‘statement’.
It seems to me if/when anyone even mentioning this, it goes straight to the 9/11 troofer name-calling level. I don’t get it.
Sir Napsalot on December 8, 2008 at 2:40 PM
More or less the same sentiments I hold.
Marine_Bio on December 8, 2008 at 2:40 PM
Romeo, that isn’t the same Pravda as the real Pravda.
Alana on December 8, 2008 at 2:45 PM
This has to be one of the MOST TEH AWESOME statements I’ve ever elicited from a poster anywhere.
This is what we mean by Obama Derangement Syndrome. You’ll bite on the stark-raving nonsensical jabberings of a lunatic and ignore the rational, sane folks around you because you happen to like some of the things the raving, barking-mad lunatic with a history of making spurious lawsuits out of such ridiculous conspiracy fantasies has to say.
And to boot, you insult and demagogue those reminding you that you’re citing and clinging to the stark raving insaity of madmen.
Each to his own, I guess. Let us know when you find “the TROOF/PROOF.”
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 2:46 PM
Again, on the point that generated this whole thread.
All we ask Supremes to do is to ‘clarify’ the point in the Constitution, which essentially IS their job.
Well?
Sir Napsalot on December 8, 2008 at 2:46 PM
You can’t be serious, or you’re out of your mind. Your argument is essentially a categorical dismissal based on something I didn’t state, without even looking at the merits of what I’m stating.
I’ll make it crystal…Berg is irrelevant, his belief system is insane. His question however, once asked and not answered with is not.
The fact that the question has been asked should be reason enough to comply.
Marine_Bio on December 8, 2008 at 2:54 PM
1. I find it ludicrous and more than a little dangerous to allow someone a pass on basic documentation when that person is going to be in charge of the nuclear launch codes.
2. I really didn’t expect the USSC to rule against Obama- which member of the court really wants to burn down every major city in America?
3. That being said I’m certainly disappointed that they didn’t bother to address the issue at all, at least giving us the fig-leaf of constitutionality and a good definition of citizenship for the future.
Anyone want to place bets on how many years until the civil war?
Browncoatone on December 8, 2008 at 2:54 PM
Horowitz wrote (in “Obama Derangement Syndrome”):
This means, for those hard-of-thinking, IGNORE THE CONSTITUTION.
Here’s the fear appearing.
That is how it is. We are a Constitutional Republic … we were.
And here’s the reason to ignore the Constitution, “64 million voters”.
progressoverpeace on December 8, 2008 at 2:54 PM
Well then … why won’t he simply release it then? It makes no sense and only adds fuel to the fire.
darwin on December 8, 2008 at 2:54 PM
Thanks, that’s much better. I just think there are so many overtly biased sources out there that it does us no good to harp on the ones that aren’t. The people behind Snopes could be biased, but I haven’t seen any thing to prove that.
Esthier on December 8, 2008 at 2:55 PM
Nicely stated.
When things are out in the open those are more difficult to hide. I suspect that what Obama and his helpers are hiding is his father is represented on the forms by a big fat question mark or there’s a list of possibilities of who his father could be. There were some lingering questions about Bill Clinton’s true paternity because of his mother’s choices in life and certainly reasonable concerns about Clinton’s (an obvious sociopath) concealed medical records.
If there’s an issue which irritates me most on the topic it is the Supreme Court’s laziness. Even if they were to subpoena the relevant documents then rubber stamp the certification that likely would be enough for me. It would be proper for the documents to be public not digital photos or so-called expert claims presented as substitute.
Instead, the Supreme Court looks like they’ve more important things to do such as catching up on Christmas shopping. We still are allowed to call it Christmas shopping aren’t we? Okay, Breyer, Kennedy, Souter and Ginsburg, call it “holiday bartering” if it makes those four vain knuckleheads happy.
viking01 on December 8, 2008 at 2:55 PM
Right, the decision is counter productive, particularly for the Donofrio case. It is a sad day.
Marine_Bio on December 8, 2008 at 2:56 PM
Isn’t it funny that the people who want you to shut up are the very ones who post thread after thread after thread after thread goading you to keep talking about this.
/
Christien on December 8, 2008 at 3:00 PM
Because the stupidity of it all is entertaining to all the sane people.
Squid Shark on December 8, 2008 at 3:04 PM
WHO IS IGNORING THE CONSTITUTION?
HE PRODUCED THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOU THINK IT’S A FRAUD.
You’ve gone 9-11 Truther. The evidence refutes your conspiracy theories and you continue to believe them – nay, you double down on them and pretend your “questions” have gone unanswered.
Question? Was Obama born in the US?
All available evidence points to…..YES.
Is there evidence suggesting he was born somewhere else, and that there is a large, national, secret conspiracy to keep THE TROOF about his “long-form” birth certificate from being known, lest it destroy the very fabric of our electoral system and cause national catastrophe (even though it won’t)?
All available evidence points to…..BWAHAHAHAHA! WTF are you on? 9-11 Troof paintfumes?
The end.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:04 PM
Or to put it simply, if a Mad Man asks a question, it doesn’t count. (Even in the absence of an answer)
An as such we’re mad too.
Marine_Bio on December 8, 2008 at 3:04 PM
What interests me as well… is that if there is somthing embarrasing on his Birth Cert, NOW would be the time to realest that info.
It would be a 10 minute story, soon overshadowed by the economy and transition, and softballed by a friendly Press during this Honeymoon period…
Election is over, so unless there is somthing LEGALLY troubling… why hide it NOW?
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:06 PM
Sometimes the parodies write themselves.
MB4 on December 8, 2008 at 3:07 PM
And I thought the 9-11 conspiracy JREF forums and Screw Loose Change were amusing (not to mention that the 9-11 troofers in those places are also the ones promoting this OBC Proof nonsense…)
Here’s an idea. Since so many of you believe so strongly in this conspiracy, the way to make it go viral is to put all of your “evidence” into an amateurish internet video, put some creepy trip-hop beats in the background, have it narrated by some teenage dope smoker, and put it out there on teh intrawebs.
VOILA! You’ll have a conspiracy movement that will last a decade or more. Easy.
Any takers?
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:08 PM
Irony, meet MB4.
Have you produced anything suggesting that the BC we’ve all seen is fake?
Do you have a REAL one from Kenya or wherever the hell else you’re claiming Obama was REALLY born in?
If not, then all you’ve got is a conspiracy theory. And that’s a whole lot of NOTHING.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:10 PM
Subpoena duces tecum – plenty of opportunities in the near future.
Entelechy on December 8, 2008 at 3:15 PM
All you have is dreams – but you are entitled to them.
Entelechy on December 8, 2008 at 3:16 PM
File away!
Good luck!
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:17 PM
And when people have posted the Pravda article, others have misinterpreted it as being used as “evidence” of some sort. They don’t understand what that article really meant, in terms of what others are thinking about our dilemma, the strategizing going on in the Kremlin and the fear they see in America.
It’s interesting how everyone analyzed the Al Quaeda strikes around various elections, but they choose to imagine that no one is paying attention to our Constitutional crisis and how we are reacting to it, with respect to what our enemies are taking away from this.
progressoverpeace on December 8, 2008 at 3:17 PM
I’m sorry, but this statement is not evidence that the BC presented was a fake, nor does it prove that Obanma was born in Kenya/wherever.
Try again – without the conspiratorial dreams this time.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:18 PM
beachgirlusa on December 8, 2008 at 2:31 PM. I am also in agreement with that.
Reverse the outcome of the election. Presented with identical facts, what if the republican had won under the same cloud of illegitmacy? I imagine the MSM might suddenly consider the issues to be newsworthy had their candidate lost. Would the courts have also found a compelling interest? Would they have cared about disenfranchising millions of republican voters? In that situation, I think the tone of the discussion and the outcome would be very different, and the left would be insisting that the constitution trumps mob rule. If democrats and republicans were in agreement as to the expectations of proof and constitutional compliance, would we all be truthers?
Nikita on December 8, 2008 at 3:21 PM
Good Lt, I just want to run for president myself. Please don’t ask me, ever, for my naturalization document. I won’t show it to you. Your heads would explode, on the left.
Entelechy on December 8, 2008 at 3:21 PM
Guys, it was over before it started. ‘Nuff already!
newton on December 8, 2008 at 3:22 PM
Probably something more embarrassing or inconvenient when extrapolated to the political career or personal vanity. Perhaps Obambi being born with a congenital STD from an indeterminate, er, sire or Clinton being born sterile and explaining it to Chelsea.
No doubt whatever records out there exist in multiple copies and are readily available accessible should their Messiah deign to release them.
The USSC decision certainly does not surprise. After the Eminent Domain decision that made all clear their interests were themselves and not the Constitution as written. Too bad the populace didn’t notice what Marshall was up to a couple hundred years ago.
viking01 on December 8, 2008 at 3:22 PM
Fine. Good luck. Make sure you produce your birth certificate, and make sure you mail the original to each and every person who may not like you so that they may be sure it’s real. Gotta indulge the loonbots, after all. They’re part of the populace.
Fine. I’ll let the FEC, Secret Service, FBI, CIA, and whoever else handle that. Which, apparently, none of them have done for Obama.
Strange, that.
I’m not “on the left.”
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:24 PM
sigh… once again…
Under Hawaii law a COLB can be given to a child born outside of the US, if one of the parents was a resident of Hawaii for at least one year prior.
Under Hawaii law, the info on a COLB can be modified during adoption processes. Obama was by some accounts adopted by Soetoro, and went by Soetoro’s name in Indonesia.
Under Hawaii law (and once again, we don’t know this but its possible), Barry Soetoro’s COLB information was again modified during a further adoption process, for his grandparents… or by becoming emancipated from Soetoro… as he changed his name back to Barrak Obama.
or… also under Hawaiin law, you can request your OWN COLB info modified if you no longer have a Parent/child relationship with an adopted parent…
The Document shown was created in 2007 from a source of potentialy modified information…
Hawaii says a Legal long form exists, which would give better proof, than a potentialy impeached COLB.
Without a list of changes, or even specific information if it was changed, the COLB information is suspect, and would be open to Discovery by the opposing side… to see if it WAS changed.
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:25 PM
The One did have a lot of photos taken by a guy who was on TV this morning in D. C. and published all them in a book. He said He was always the same person.
Then I thought “what is wrong with me?”
I am gonna quit my bitchin’.
IlikedAUH2O on December 8, 2008 at 3:26 PM
Less than four years for $10.
txsurveyor on December 8, 2008 at 3:26 PM
OMG, reading some of these comments – you guys are just relentless.
You are acting exactly like The Left did in 2000.
And don’t you realize that all of this birth certificate crap was started by the loon PUMAs (mostly Leftie Democrats) who supported Hillary?
Why are you enabling them???
Where does it end?? He produced the birth certificate.
Case closed.
AprilOrit on December 8, 2008 at 3:26 PM
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:25 PM
If everybody in your camp is so convinced they’ve got such a slam dunk here, why not file repeated and multiple class action lawsuits to get all of this hashed out?
I mean, apart from the lawsuits currently being laughed out of court?
Put the money and lawsuits where the “questions” are.
Let us know how it turns out. We’ll be anxiously awaiting to hear.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:27 PM
Why then do it for me, and millions of others?
Glad, for your own sake. Then, you can’t be a dreamer :)
Entelechy on December 8, 2008 at 3:27 PM
Read Romeo13 above.
But here is how the public sees it:
A photographer was on local TV in DC this morning. He has been with Obama for over a year and has a whole book of pictures. He said that everyone who saw him fell in love with him.
The Founding Fathers gave the vote to these people so I guess it will work out well.
IlikedAUH2O on December 8, 2008 at 3:31 PM
I’m rather certain that you missed the point.
The HAVE done it.
Go ahead. File another lawsuit. Let me know when that goes to court and through discovery.
Why is everyone wasting their time here commenting on a blog when they could be rescuing the Republic from the foreign-born Kenyan/whatever named Barry/Barack Soetoro/Obama?
I simply can not allow you to waste your powers of investigation here. GO! GO! For the good of the nation!
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:31 PM
You’re not paying attention. No, he did NOT produce an original un-altered birth certificate. Ever. If he had, the courts would be telling you this.
Read Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:25 PM
Gregor on December 8, 2008 at 3:32 PM
I see no irony. You give not the first clue that you even understand what irony is.
It is my understanding that what has been seen by the public is a poor copy of a certificate of live birth which does nothing to resolve the matter. It is not my responsibility to produce His birth certificate, that is His responsibility. Where on Earth do you get the notion that it is my responsibility and not His?
I have not made any claims whatsoever as to Obama’s place of birth. My point has consistently been that He should release His birth certificate and that asking such is not at all to much to ask of Him. You really need to work on your reading comprehension as it is beyond embarrassingly poor. I don’t have a birth certificate for Him from Kenya, nor from Hungary, nor from Canada, nor from Czechoslovakia. So what! I just want Him to produce one from the United States of America. Why is that so much to ask given our constitution, which if you were a real lieutenant you would have taken an oath to defend?
There is not one of your “conspiracy theories” here. Stop acting delusional or one will be forced to conclude that you are. I just simply and reasonably want Him to release His birth certificate. What is so terribly difficult for you to understand about that?
MB4 on December 8, 2008 at 3:32 PM
Heh. Laughed out of court? They’re refusing to hear them on technicalities.
Can you quote any of the SCOTUS saying that Obama has given the required proof?
Keep on making stuff up. A few blind sheep will just accept it as fact.
Gregor on December 8, 2008 at 3:35 PM
Good Lt
I was visiting an old friend at the local state hospital for the insane. One of the crazier patients there said a few of the things you have said in your exact words. Now, by your standards, I can’t pay any more attention to you because someone here is crazy. But it was nice knowing you before your credibility was undermined.
Yes, Allah keeps saying, “You’re crazy to talk about this. Now, why don’t you do it in this special space I (the one sane person here) have set aside for you.” But, the thing is, Allah gets paid by the post and he knows what generates posts. He’ laughing all the way to the bank.
snaggletoothie on December 8, 2008 at 3:36 PM
MB4,
Excellent, neighbor! Keep destroying that pathetic Proofer.
Christien on December 8, 2008 at 3:36 PM
Wrotnowski Case referred today to full court by Justice Scalia (yes, another Obama natural born citizen case.)
debg on December 8, 2008 at 3:36 PM
Actualy, all we’re asking for is for Discovery to be allowed.
Let us get to the bottom of this… do the records searches, BUT THEY WON’T LET US.
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:37 PM
Reconcile these, please.
He produced it. You don’t believe it legitimate. He’s not going to mail you the original, and short of this, there is apparently nothing that will convince you that it is real.
Keep digging.
He did. You deemed it illegitimate and demanded something else.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:37 PM
He did and it was verified by a Hawaiian official.
SCOTUS says case closed, so do I.
Done, like we told The Left in 2000, you lost, Bush is the President, rise above it, get on with your life, he was democraticallty elected.
The same principle applies here.
This was inituated by Clinton supporters anyway, all the more reason to chalk it up to crazy behavior that should be ignored.
AprilOrit on December 8, 2008 at 3:38 PM
So file another lawsuit. Are you afraid that it won’t go to court?
What fear do you have? This is such a slam dunk, after all. BO is clearly violating the constitution. The Supreme Court said he was…oh, wait.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:38 PM
Interesting scenario. We may never know, however. Especially since the trolls appear to be coming in from the cold in full force today.
manwithblackhat on December 8, 2008 at 3:39 PM
Do you REALLY not understand the difference between a Birth Certificate and a Certificate of Live Birth? Really?
Good grief.
Do you really want to pretend you are just missing the posts explaining this, or the posts explaining that the BC that was produced is an altered copy and not the original?
Gregor on December 8, 2008 at 3:40 PM
He could not have been a Kenyan citizen at birth since Kenya as an autonomous nation-state did not exist. Before 1963 it was a British colony called British East Africa.
baldilocks on December 8, 2008 at 3:41 PM
http://origin.www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/08a469.htm
LOL, read it and be amazed….
Scalia just put another case, with the same base arguements up to the whole court….
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:42 PM
Actually, they didn’t. I believe only white male property owners had the right to vote originally. And even if it were universal, they also gave us a Constitution. We are a nation of laws, not the tyranny of an angry mob. This is why, were it determined that the winner of a general election was not a “natural born citizen,” it would not matter how many votes he/she received.
That’s the law. Don’t like it? Fine. Change the damn law.
manwithblackhat on December 8, 2008 at 3:42 PM
Hmm interesting question. We have a local politician here (named Jack Davis) who says that we will have a civil war in about two decades, this is his rationale.
California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas will be majority hispanic and try to secede in order to join Mexico. This will cause a civil war. I doubt that Obama will cause a civil war unless he can somehow get the Blue Dogs and moderates to join his socialism. I doubt it strongly.
But if he does – call me a Confederate. States rights and nullification may become an issue once again. Yes, the South will rise again.
Oh, I’m from Buffalo so I’m not predisposed to love the South, but I do ;)
Canerican on December 8, 2008 at 3:43 PM
Romeo13,
Scalia’s a Birther? Who knew?!
/
Christien on December 8, 2008 at 3:43 PM
Seems I dont need to… see this….
http://origin.www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/08a469.htm
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:43 PM
Very well laid out.
baldilocks on December 8, 2008 at 3:44 PM
Wow…. and thats Scalia folks…
Color me dumbfounded.
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:44 PM
No, he hasn’t. Try that trick yourself. Go ahead. Next time someone tells you to provide them with a certified copy of your BC, tell them to call an official in your birth state, and see if they accept that.
Obama didn’t provide anything, and in fact … he ordered them to seal it and not release it to ANYONE.
Why?
Again, SCOTUS is not hearing the case. They aren’t saying Obama has given proof. Have you heard any SCOTUS suggest that they’re satisfied with the documents? They haven’t seen them, or even asked for them.
Gregor on December 8, 2008 at 3:46 PM
Good Lt., Romeo couldn’t do any better than surface ships back in his Navy days. Cut him some slack…he’s a little slow and prone to gullibility.
dakine on December 8, 2008 at 3:47 PM
Yeah, I guess thats why I worked directly for COMSUBPAC for three years…
Bit wide of the mark there…
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 3:48 PM
What is with you? A birth certificate and a certificate of live birth are not the same. This has already been covered many times by others. Does nothing sink in with you? What are you a lieutenant in anyway? The Salvation Army?
The One apparently will not allow that.
MB4 on December 8, 2008 at 3:49 PM
Allah, can you explain what your refering to as dumb inside the US Constitution as far as the “natural born” qualifier goes?
TheHat on December 8, 2008 at 3:52 PM
I enjoyed your whole long comment. I couldn’t help but think that the small part I reproduced here is a job for Geraldo.
JiangxiDad on December 8, 2008 at 3:53 PM
http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2008/12/08/donofrio-application-denied-wrotnowski-application-still-pending/
DONOFRIO APPLICATION DENIED – WROTNOWSKI APPLICATION STILL PENDING
[UPDATE 12:23 PM The main stream media should stop saying
marti124 on December 8, 2008 at 3:54 PM
ps – I forgot to mention, Donofrio’s posting is much longer, go to the link I gave to read it all.
marti124 on December 8, 2008 at 3:55 PM
They did NOT deny CERTIORARI; they only denied the stay.
.
Doesn’t ANYONE know how to do THEIR OWN research anymore?
.
Allahpundit, you swallowed it whole. Now wash it down with a big swig of kool-aid.
.
The fact of the matter is Obama himself has said he was a dual citizen at birth. Natural born citizenship and dual citizenship are MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE. His DUAL status at birth cannot change. EVER.. The fact that his status meant he was under the jurisdiction of (and thereby held allegiance to) another country at birth PREVENTS him from being eligible to hold the highest office in our country.
.
Open the door to his presidency under these circumstances and we may as well throw out all the laws that govern us when or if we find them cumbersome or inconvenient. If and when the Supreme Court takes on the issue of amending the Constitution (which it has only done 27 times in the last 220+ years) then someone like Obama may be a legitimate choice. Until such times, he is putting this country in jeopardy. Any laws/actions/orders/wars/treaties he undertakes will be, LIKE HIS PRESIDENCY, ILLEGITIMATE.
NightmareOnKStreet on December 8, 2008 at 3:55 PM
The United States has become a failing nation of laws capriciously applied and selectively enforced.
Tav on December 8, 2008 at 3:55 PM
Not taking a side here but you do understand that a Certification of Live Birth and a Birth Certificate are two different types of documentation, do you not? Obama has put forth the former; the latter is what many people are asking to see.
baldilocks on December 8, 2008 at 3:57 PM
Report back when it’s been rejected like the others.
Clinging to that thread, I see.
The 9-11 Troofers filed lawsuits for similar minutia of their impossibly vast, endless conspiracies. Ask them how they’re all doing. Hint: NOT WELL, mentally or legally.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 3:58 PM
Only if he was born in another country.
baldilocks on December 8, 2008 at 4:02 PM
Yes, I realize this.
The problems is that the COLB is not illegitimate and is a valid form of documentation that is being ignored.
Obama’s mother, in addition, is American. He’s not a foreign national/questionable birth/illegitimate citizen, and those pushing and pushing for this are the same people “pushing” for a new 9-11 investigation.
Just report back to me – everyone – when it’s discovered that he has been lying to everyone about everything about his history – EVERYTHING, EVER – and I’ll be happy to eat some crow.
But until then, color me unconvinced and highly skeptical to the point of uproarious laughter couple with deep concern about my some of my colleagues.
Good Lt on December 8, 2008 at 4:03 PM
I was actualy just looking at what the Supremes said…
Donofrio had his STAY denied, but the case is still Pending… not dismissed, but the Emergency Stay denied…
Then Scalia puts up an almost identicle case for full review…
Case merge?
If there was no there… there… if the subject was closed in the initial case, Scalia would not have put it up for further discussion today…
Interesting…
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 4:04 PM
Thank you for clarifying the ion and the cate of it, but given the “Lieutenant’s” record I am doubtful that he will alter his extraneous and off target coordinates by a single mil.
MB4 on December 8, 2008 at 4:04 PM
LOL…. great minds… I was off researching… well posted.
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 4:05 PM
:)
JiangxiDad on December 8, 2008 at 4:06 PM
I need to get up to speed on this one…
1. Has Obama produced a physical birth certificate?
If so, what’s the problem? Do some think its a fake?
2. If Obama hasn’t produced a birth certificate, why not? The clause has been interpreted, so if he isn’t a legitimate candidate, he needs to be removed from office.
I’m not one for conspiracy theories, but we should abide by the law. If someone says to me that I have to have a physical birth certificate in order to obtain a passport, then I go and get my birth certificate (people have to do this for security clearances too). If I can’t produce a physical copy, I don’t get the passport and its my problem to work out. If Obama (or anyone) can’t produce the document, then he should be removed, period.
I don’t think its splitting hairs to follow up on this. The clause was included for good reasons, so let’s stick with the Constitution and demand the document.
Geministorm on December 8, 2008 at 4:07 PM
Case closed. It over, he was elected by a Democratic majority, as Bush was in 2000.
Again, it’s over.
AprilOrit on December 8, 2008 at 4:07 PM
Your thinking is becoming ever more frenzied and uncoordinated. You had best leave the deduction to others and confine yourself to the task of keeping watch in the street.
semloh on December 8, 2008 at 4:09 PM
OH, your story was soooo 10 minutes ago…
Case is not closed… just the initial STAY was denied, Case is still listed as PENDING.
And, Scalia just brought up another case for full review, with identical arguements (in fact, guy in origional case helped with the paperwork and arguements for the second case, involving a different state).
Romeo13 on December 8, 2008 at 4:10 PM
And neither could most of our elected leadership.
Frankly, I dont care what Obama’s bc says. I’m just curious as to WHY he wont release it and put out the brush fires. It’s like he’s egging this stuff on. Does it say something detrimental? I guess we’ll never know.
abcurtis on December 8, 2008 at 4:12 PM
Gotta love the uproariously laughable “report back” order issued by our deeply concerned colleague and (in)subordinate officer.
/*mock salutes*
Christien on December 8, 2008 at 4:12 PM
Scalia probably just brought it up so that he could settle this stupid once and for all when SCOTUS certifies the result.
Squid Shark on December 8, 2008 at 4:17 PM
Why does he egg this stuff on, because he knows that if he gives the truther element of the party enough rope, it will hang itself.
Squid Shark on December 8, 2008 at 4:19 PM
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