Obama website: Hey, let’s make community service compulsory for students
posted at 2:45 pm on November 7, 2008 by Allahpundit
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Intriguing. Will that be in lieu of or in addition to the three months of compulsory civil defense training Rahm Emanuel wants 18-to-25-year-olds to do?
The Obama Administration will call on Americans to serve in order to meet the nation’s challenges. President-Elect Obama will expand national service programs like AmeriCorps and Peace Corps and will create a new Classroom Corps to help teachers in underserved schools, as well as a new Health Corps, Clean Energy Corps, and Veterans Corps. Obama will call on citizens of all ages to serve America, by developing a plan to require 50 hours of community service in middle school and high school and 100 hours of community service in college every year. Obama will encourage retiring Americans to serve by improving programs available for individuals over age 55, while at the same time promoting youth programs such as Youth Build and Head Start.
Presumably, the penalty for being a 20-year-old who doesn’t want to spend two hours a week picking up trash would be not graduating. The penalty for dodging Emanuel’s program, only Rahm knows. I remember this subject coming up now and again in poli sci classes and my leftish professor arguing that a peacetime draft would violate the right of privacy sketched out in cases like Roe as an infringement of one’s physical autonomy. If The One pushes ahead with this, it’ll be fun watching conservatives suddenly trying to coopt that right and liberals just as suddenly trying to narrow it. (On which side, do you suppose, will the ACLU come down?) Alternatively, you could skip the right of privacy and try a First Amendment argument: If the state can’t compel students to say the pledge of allegiance, arguably it can’t make them go clean parks, either. That case would turn on the distinction between speech and conduct; given the current composition of the Court, refuseniks would stand at least a shot of winning.
It bears noting that Maverick’s also always been famously gung ho for kids doing some form of national service — “There should be more focus on meeting national goals and on making short-term service, both civilian and military, a rite of passage for young Americans,” he wrote in the Washington Monthly(!) in 2001 — but he’s been careful, at least lately, to say that it should be volunteer-only. Exit question: Won’t a lot of conservatives, especially older ones, dig this idea? Keeps kids busy and out of trouble, teaches spoiled teens responsibility, etc.
Update: Let’s not go nuts, please.
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Hahahahahahahahah! Obamas campaign workers got paid a fraction of what they earned! He can’t be trusted to pay the people who worked to get him elected! Hahahaha! Here’s how it actually go down: Kids work 100 hours, then learn that the gov’t really needs the money right now so their “tax credit” is going into one of those new government 401(k)s! They’ll get their money when they retire, at age 86!
Obama IS ILLUSIONS.
RushBaby on November 7, 2008 at 3:55 PM
The ACLU plus Obama Supreme Court appointments equals America divided, minus Boy Scouts.
saint kansas on November 7, 2008 at 3:55 PM
…theologically as well as historically, that is quite correct…”the priesthood of all believers”…as well as a return from church traditions to actual revealed Scripture….
…good reply….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 3:56 PM
GAG!!!
Just the mention of “Head Start” makes my blood boil. Hope… yeah right.
Here in Massachusetts Head Start is something for poor parents to send their kids to during the day so they can go sit at home to watch Jerry Springer and to make more children while we had to dish out for private day care.
krl on November 7, 2008 at 3:56 PM
Curious. Where does this $4,000 come from that he is going to refund?
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 3:56 PM
Oh, brother. Hyperbolize much?
JohnTant on November 7, 2008 at 3:57 PM
The people who voted for him have elected the world’s biggest egomanic as POTUS.
As long as he has himself, he will never be alone.
kingsjester on November 7, 2008 at 3:57 PM
Reharding the 13th Amendment, SCOTUS already decided in Buttler v. Perry that a State could constitutionally require able-bodied men to help with the maintenance of roads. While the court relied on the common law idea of trinoda necessitas, it also noted that the amendment was intended to address only ‘those forms of compulsory labor akin to African slavery which, in practical operation, would tend to produce like undesirable results’. While the desirable / undesirable questions seems to render the 13th Amendment woefully subjective, it is nonetheless a line that could be used to defend Obama’s program.
MikeGranby on November 7, 2008 at 3:58 PM
So the government compels you to work and then sets the wage for your labor?
phronesis on November 7, 2008 at 3:58 PM
It’s just an income redistribution scheme. And as AP predicted, we have social cons jumping all over it saying yay! good idea.
Sad. I didn’t mean to be all over social cons today, but I guess I was on to something :P
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 3:58 PM
They were pushing “service education” in my graduate classes almost 20 years ago…almost can’t believe it took ‘em this long to getting it going. Compulsory service…yeah, that’s how you make people *want* to serve and help others.
kas on November 7, 2008 at 3:58 PM
Okay, guys seriously? John, Akzed? Respectfully requesting the religious debate be put aside for now… I’d prefer if at all possible that Allah doesn’t have to close this thread for excessive off-topicness like he did yesterday… Thanks in advance…
*eats*
Grue in the Attic on November 7, 2008 at 3:58 PM
All we can do is shake our head in dismay. The rifts run deeper than initially thought; it seems.
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 3:59 PM
If I remember right it was it a liberal idea to implement “community service” for criminals in place of more traditional punishment (jail) in an effort to rehabilitate the offender. Now these very same liberals are suggesting “community service” be mandatory for everyone – are we being punished for something?
Browncoatone on November 7, 2008 at 4:00 PM
I’ll leave it alone, but in my defense it was an off-the-cuff remark exposing some guy in his invokation of “Christian Values” and not an attempt to proclaim The One True Religion as someone is trying to portray. I thought the context and the quote made that pretty clear.
JohnTant on November 7, 2008 at 4:00 PM
Ah…the beginnings of the Obama Youth. How do you say “Sieg Heil” in South Side Chicago-ese?
TexasEngineer on November 7, 2008 at 4:01 PM
Joe Stalin predicted the American people would not realize Socialist and Marxist ideology was being introduced in the society until it was too late.
He might have just been right.
Greetings, Comrades.
kingsjester on November 7, 2008 at 4:01 PM
On June 5th, 1931 – two year before the NSDAP came to power – German Chancellor Brüning gave authorization to create a national work service called the Freiwilliger Arbeitsdienst, or FAD – the Voluntary Labor Service. Konstantin Hierl was appointed as the head of this new national organization. Soon after its formation, Hierl began to absorb the many independent camps that had been formed earlier in a process of centralizing state control over the area of national labor work. Interestingly, Hierl was also a high-ranking member of the NSDAP at the time, being in charge of what was known as Organiztion Department II of the party.
Great link, thanks. Already sent it to me kids.
Akzed on November 7, 2008 at 4:01 PM
You forgot your sarc tag. We know where it’s coming from, don’t we?
So now Americans, who are the most charitable people in the world, will have an array of government-approved organizations (like ACORN or Planned Parenthood, one assumes) to “volunteer” their time, instead of helping the colleges, churches, nature conservancies, hospitals, museums, etc where they normally would spend their time (and money). Lucky us.
Thanks voters.
Y-not on November 7, 2008 at 4:02 PM
Heh, that reminds me of the movie Happy Gilmore when the nursing home orderly (Ben Stiller) has a quilt making sweat shop going and using the old folks as slaves!
“How ’bout a nice warm glass of shut the hell up” will be Obama’s answer to anyone that complains about the MANDATORY VOLUNTEERING!
Liberty or Death on November 7, 2008 at 4:02 PM
Ah, the Obama Youth. My Italian grandmother used to tell us stories about how much they all loved Mussolini because his black shirted civilian security force came in and cleaned the place up. A couple of years later there were Nazi soldiers billeted in their house.
patriette on November 7, 2008 at 4:02 PM
My stupid liberal wife thought it sounded like a great idea. Amazing. She’s as dumb as the rest. They can’t critically analyze this stuff or read in between the lines. Just, “it sounds nice”. Yeah, it sounds nice.
Liberals can’t think, they just feel. Rush was right.
worlok on November 7, 2008 at 4:03 PM
Where do you see this? I don’t see it except for the rare exception. It seems that one thing Liberal and Libertarians have in common is disdain, if not hatred for social conservatives, I don’t get it.
neuquenguy on November 7, 2008 at 4:03 PM
Not rolling in a 90% landslide for Leper Messiah?
Or something more traditional, like Slave Repirations?
Either way, don’t make it easy on ‘em… Let’s Be Bad Guys. Give ‘em hell.
*eats*
Grue in the Attic on November 7, 2008 at 4:03 PM
Ok, only for yue.
Akzed on November 7, 2008 at 4:03 PM
If called upon …… I will tell Obama to shove it.
I already served my country, wore the uniform proudly and I do volunteer work in the community – where and when I DECIDE I WANT TO.
Eat that you socialist creeps!
fogw on November 7, 2008 at 4:04 PM
98.8% of the time. Better than any politician, that’s for sure.
*eats*
Grue in the Attic on November 7, 2008 at 4:05 PM
Yep. I know where it comes from. I’m just making the point to those social cons who are inclined to support this that tax credits don’t come from thin air.
Those of us who, you know, pay taxes are covering the costs – as usual.
$4000 credit is just income redistribution again.
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 4:05 PM
What was the gird your loins foreign policy moment?
haikusrock on November 7, 2008 at 4:05 PM
I graduated not too long before they implimented it. I would have refused – I went into the military after high school, that’s my community service. I don’t have a problem with my own kids volunteering, but it has to be something they want to do, and I won’t be upset if they choose not to volunteer. Kids have choices other than community service and gang-banging (I did theater).
I do agree a lot of young adults today are lazy, but not all of us. There are plenty of good young folks in Iraq and Afghanistan, and right here at home too.
Anna on November 7, 2008 at 4:06 PM
Yes, for being American. Obama and the libs are ashamed of that.
aero on November 7, 2008 at 4:06 PM
Thanks guys. I enjoy a good debate as much as anyone, and religious debates when well handled are right up there with politics at the top of the list, but Allah’s been getting a bit tougher on keeping these things on-topic and I’d just like to err on the side of caution. :)
*eats*
Grue in the Attic on November 7, 2008 at 4:06 PM
‘Sup, Bro?
BacaDog on November 7, 2008 at 4:06 PM
In communist Amerika, government volunteers you!
First time youth voters buyers’ remorse setting in in 3… 2… 1…
Beo on November 7, 2008 at 4:06 PM
I know I’m going to get arrested by the Goons of Obama League (GOOL or Ghoul)(TM) but I would ask that all of us former combat vets band together our own Veterans Corps and face the people who are Obama’s veterans corps…… let’s see who REALLY loves the country… I’m just sayin….. I will NEVER be told what I should volunteer for…. never.
MNDavenotPC on November 7, 2008 at 4:07 PM
Here we go…
marklmail on November 7, 2008 at 4:07 PM
Welcome to the USSA.
*eats*
Grue in the Attic on November 7, 2008 at 4:08 PM
Tell your
stupidliberal wife that if she currently supports her alma mater or some other charity, she had better make her gift before Obama gets in — and it had better be the biggest one she can afford. Non-profits, particularly universities and other charitable organizations that are outside the social service sector, are bracing for extremely tight times under the Democrats. Quite a few colleges and universities are stopping building projects, implementing hiring freezes, and slashing their budgets already in anticipation of dismal times ahead.I’m sure you love your wife, but I have to say that despite having many good friends in my youth who were (and still are) very liberal, each night and morning I thank God I married a conservative. I really couldn’t be with a liberal right now.
Y-not on November 7, 2008 at 4:08 PM
People need to wait for specifics before freaking out.
Big S on November 7, 2008 at 3:24 PM
When I was in high school the famous quote, “ask not what your country can do for you,…..”, was coined by JFK.
If you wanted to go into the Peace Corps, the Marine Corps, the Army, Navy, Coast Guard, or AF was up to you, until you got a draft notice. This program of national service is nothing more than a draft.
No thanks, and I don’t have to wait to see the details to see it for what it is. WTF are families for, if not to take care of their own and if they CHOOSE to help the neighbor next door or down the street, its because they wanted to and weren’t coerced or threatened into doing it.
belad on November 7, 2008 at 4:08 PM
Can we also DEMAND the same “VOLUNTEERISM” from those who are on Welfare? Or would that be slavery???
PappaMac on November 7, 2008 at 4:09 PM
But in this case, even the children of “rich” people will be able to get it, which is odd for Obama to allow. I’m guessing they’ll figure out a way to deny the $4K “credit” to college students who “don’t need it.” But they’ll still have to do the service, of course.
aero on November 7, 2008 at 4:09 PM
Ive seen at least 3 or 4 supporters (even if its mild) in this thread alone. And these are people who are supposedly ‘tuned in’ to politics.
Now imagine people who don’t pay attention to what’s going on. The support would be higher, of course – they surely aren’t going to factor in the unspoken implications of such a program.
I don’t have a real disdain for social cons. I think a lot of what they believe is just fine. Live your own life by those beliefs. Don’t ask government to implement them. Lots of libertarians draw the line there.
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 4:09 PM
Can we also DEMAND the same “VOLUNTEERISM” from those who are on Welfare? Or would that be slavery???
PappaMac on November 7, 2008 at 4:09 PM
Nope, that would be RAAAACCIIST!
belad on November 7, 2008 at 4:10 PM
Stocks rise but waver after Obama speaks
All is not well in Obamaville.
Akzed on November 7, 2008 at 4:10 PM
“Put on a name tag, Grandma. You’re in my world now.”
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on November 7, 2008 at 4:13 PM
It’s a chance to indoctrinate the young. Remember, it’s rich people who supported Obama in the primaries and got him elected. He needs to keep the pipeline going.
Do you think that they will be allowed to do community service through a conservative-leaning church, their local right to life chapter, or the Boy Scouts? Not for a minute. They will be working at planned parenthood or Greenpeace or ACORN. Just watch.
Y-not on November 7, 2008 at 4:13 PM
…what is the source? Love to know…apt quote, especially after reviewing the blue/red map posted on HA earlier…proof that you can fool all of the people some of the time….
…and, thanks for your kind words…I hope that I was as correct in the facts displayed as in the verbiage used to express ‘em…eloquence without a foundation in fact…well…you end up with Obama, don’t you….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:15 PM
Might I quote the 13Th Amendment?
Sinner on November 7, 2008 at 4:15 PM
This was posted in NRO’s Corner. It brings up a point I wish I had thought of:
JohnTant on November 7, 2008 at 4:16 PM
Padme Amidala, Star Wars Episode 3: Revenge of the Sith
*eats*
Grue in the Attic on November 7, 2008 at 4:17 PM
Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime where of the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Sinner on November 7, 2008 at 4:15 PM
It doesn’t say anything about ‘volunteerism’, so its OK.
belad on November 7, 2008 at 4:18 PM
Wow, what a coincidence, my mother grew up in Italy under Mussolini too and also praised him for cleaning up her city, etc. I told her Mussolini was a fascist and she vehemently argued that he wasn’t. My mother (God rest her soul) was the sweetest and kindest person and was not stupid, yet she was obviously brainwashed by the Mussolini regime. It just goes to show how powerful and blinding the attraction to a smooth talking and charismatic leader can be especially when they promise lots of handouts and good deeds!
Sound like someone we know?
Liberty or Death on November 7, 2008 at 4:18 PM
I say that this plan gets nixed the minute someone putting it together asks the powers that be, “What happens if one of these kids gets molested?”
That being said, the Obama administration should focus first on getting HS graduation rates nationally above 90%.
rw on November 7, 2008 at 4:19 PM
…thank you, especially for allowing me to trot out a reply I’ve been longing to use for some time, but which circumstances haven’t permitted….
*AHEM*
Thank for the suggestion, but I’d rather steer clear of elective public service…you see, my mother was what they call a “single mother”…back in the ’50’s…before it became either fashionable…or profitable….
…for that reason, I can see no sense in seeking elected office…and thereby become a bastard twice…I had not choice the first time….
…anyway, I served 16 years in uniform, twice what any president elected will ever legally serve (even Roosevelt didn’t make it to 16)…that’s enough federal (or state or local) service for me, thank you very much….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:20 PM
I volunteer to round up resisters to toil away in Uncle Sugar’s mines.
/Hail, ObamANTS!
Christien on November 7, 2008 at 4:20 PM
A Thousand Points of Fright
Christien on November 7, 2008 at 4:22 PM
As a social conservative, I want as little government intervention in peoples lives as necessary, and I believe a majority of social conservatives feel the same way. Of course we all accept its involvement in protecting life and property, and for social conservatives, the life of the unborn is no different than the life of the born. Other than that I don’t want government to legislate morality, whether it is Christian morality or secular morality (like “tolerance”). As I said before, many social conservatives homeschool precisely because, in addition to government schools failing miserably to educate, they have become vehicles for the government’s social manipulation and liberal indoctrination.
neuquenguy on November 7, 2008 at 4:22 PM
…he could do it easily, with the help of the NEA and other party enablers…just lower standards….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:22 PM
is it just me? but where does the govt have the right to tell anyone they have to do “public service”
if thats the case then why are people who live on welfare
not out cleaning the streets. where will it stop?
this is not the country our forefathers built and I for one will never allow my children to take part in this, we as a people will have to make a line in the sand or we as a people will have no rights at all.
atwitsend on November 7, 2008 at 4:24 PM
4,000 for becoming a member of the Obama Young Pioneers!? Sign me up!
Oh, and sorry dad — and other taxpayers — for footing the bill. I… uh… I… uh… Nancy Reagan seance and potato salad.
Punchenko on November 7, 2008 at 4:25 PM
Or shot, or whatever. The thought occurred to me immediately, as I tried to think of what kinds of “community service” they might require my kids to do. How about painting over graffiti in gang-infested inner-city neighborhoods? Will the government provide them bullet-proof vests when they are required to go into urban jungles to help “clean things up”?
aero on November 7, 2008 at 4:28 PM
This ‘voluntary service’ is EVIL.
I can see how it can be used… ie. your kid is relatively conservative and close to his parents. Ayers and Rahm Emanuell decree that is ‘volunteer service’ be done on the opposite coast… in an inner city…. Your kid gets three months of abuse and may or may not survive…. “Oops.. sorry, he fell out the 10th story window… Hopey Changey…”
bullseye on November 7, 2008 at 4:29 PM
Answer: Yes, and who gives a damn! This is the United States of America. The first nation founded on the concept of individual liberty and freedom FROM the state not forced servitude to the state. Sure, we’re compelled to follow certain necessary laws, but it’s never for the good of the collective. That is impossible to demand or ensure in a state composed of free individuals.
I can’t wait to see how pissed off all the idiot idealist liberal children get when their messiah not only enslaves them but fails to end either of the wars that caused them to take to the streets in so many raging protests against President Bush.
Every soldier fighting in Iraq volunteered to serve.
Sign of the Dollar on November 7, 2008 at 4:31 PM
In addition to the many VOLUNTARY efforts by churches, scouts and charities, when I was in high school we had various service clubs. These were VOLUNTARY. We did VOLUNTARY school and community service projects.
I guess Obama has also not heard of Lions Club, Rotary, etc., all VOLUNTARY adult groups.
The thing is that Obama doesn’t see community service in quite the same way as many people do. From a 1995 Chicago item:
I don’t think he’s talking about the ordinary help-others type of programs. Even though that’s an old post, do you think he’s changed his ideas? Remember his amount of charitable giving from his own income? From 2000-2004, it was less than 1%. (That article says their giving will be up in 2007). I believe I read when his book came out it went up to about 6%.
INC on November 7, 2008 at 4:33 PM
…well said, and it needs repeating…and it should be my fellow believing Christians who repeat it.
Two kingdoms, people.
Social conservatism is all well and good when it begins at home, and good examples are set…but foisting mandatory goodness on people, rather than obeying the laws of the state (in our case, a liberal democracy…until 4 November, at least) and (as a Christian) the laws of God, is nothing better than what secularist regimes have done, time and again, since time immemorial.
…mandatory morality, divorced from commonly held public standards, with no accomodation for non-believers, is the very thing those who would wound Christianity are hoping for…make morality a stink in the nostrils, and morality becomes just another bumpersticker slogan….
…morality is lived, can can’t be legislated….
There are commonly held social beliefs, and those are codified into law, mostly because they’re practical and lead to a lessening of social tensions — the whole imbroglio over homosexual “marriage” is one example which comes to mind…but some people can’t seem to remember that we live in a mixed society in a mixed world…and that people differ….
…you invite people to church…start having them line up at the street corner and bus ‘em to church, and you might as well nail the church’s doors shut.
I remember a story I heard on Christian radio’s excellent White Horse Inn program:
What would society look like if Satan was in charge? Would all be chaos, pornography everywhere, sex in the streets, alcoholism rampant, murders on the rise?
No, the speaker said. All would be quiet.
Streets would be clean, schools would be full. Churches would be full, as well. You’d have to attend. You sit there, all in your best bib and tucker, the room smelling of oil soap and piety. You’d listen to the sermon and keep your trap shut.
The only difference between then and now?
You’d hear nothing of Christ and Him crucified. It’d all be ethics.
There’s more to Christianity than “thou shalt not”…and more to conservatism than the social dimension.
In both spheres, the common thread is conscience. As Martin Luther said, nearly 500 years ago, to go against conscience is neither right nor safe. Appeal to the conscience and be a good example.
Leave the lawyers to chase ambulances….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:38 PM
AMENDMENT XIII
Passed by Congress January 31, 1865. Ratified December 6, 1865.
Note: A portion of Article IV, section 2, of the Constitution was superseded by the 13th amendment.
Section 1.
Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Section 2.
Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
The little “o” can bite me.
Vorian on November 7, 2008 at 4:38 PM
You betcha – We’re being punished for failing to, as a nation, properly educating ourselves about this man before voting him into the highest office in the land.
I feel like the well-behaved kid who gets grounded because the rest of the class was being too rowdy.
Sign of the Dollar on November 7, 2008 at 4:39 PM
…somebody who’s an Obama scholar tell me? When has Obama ever voluntarily served?
He was a community organizer, whatever that is…but didn’t he do that for a paycheck? He was a professor for a paycheck…state and federal senator, also for a paycheck.
Was he ever a Boy Scout? Did he ever deliver meals to shut-ins? Did that political action committee masquerading as a church he attended ever prevail upon him to serve there in some capacity?
…it’s good to talk about volunteerism…and effortless, so long as you don’t have to do the dirty work….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:41 PM
Yep, Dave Rywall is a joke.
ProfessorMiao on November 7, 2008 at 4:43 PM
Yeah, I was just thinking, “Fewer 20-year old douchebags who act like they’re 12? Let’s think this over…”
Tanya on November 7, 2008 at 4:43 PM
But the jackanapes are always runnin’ round in some disguise
What they are really up to, the devil only knows
And every word is bittersweet
Up is down and down is up
When with the other side you must compete
Tav on November 7, 2008 at 4:43 PM
If anybody is interested, case law seems to indicate that the SCOTUS will support Obama on this. Yet more evidence that the Constitution isn’t as much a living document as it is a dead document.
Selectively edited to make my bitter point.
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=search&case=/data2/circs/2nd/957237.html
angelat0763 on November 7, 2008 at 4:43 PM
Reharding the 13th Amendment, SCOTUS already decided in Buttler v. Perry that a State could constitutionally require able-bodied men to help with the maintenance of roads. While the court relied on the common law idea of trinoda necessitas, it also noted that the amendment was intended to address only ‘those forms of compulsory labor akin to African slavery which, in practical operation, would tend to produce like undesirable results’. While the desirable / undesirable questions seems to render the 13th Amendment woefully subjective, it is nonetheless a line that could be used to defend Obama’s program.
MikeGranby on November 7, 2008 at 3:58 PM
I am all for it !
I just want to know how young black kids are going to feel about being FORCED to work for ” DA MAN”.
Out of bondage (1865) Back into bondage (2009).
And the most Ironic thing, 90+ % of them (black voters), voted themselves back into bondage!
ColdWarrior57 on November 7, 2008 at 4:44 PM
Ben Smith says that it’s “voluntary”? The site says it’s required…
V15J on November 7, 2008 at 4:45 PM
The social service “volunteers” can serve waffles and bacon to senior citizens, and then they can be called the Waffon SS
phreshone on November 7, 2008 at 4:46 PM
…glad to be of service…voluntarily….
…collectivization…the first step….
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:47 PM
WHere’s that list of conservative governors? Is there any chance they’ll pass state laws prohibiting this stuff. drawing a line in the sand before Obama even takes his seat?
This is Chicago politics on steroids. Don’t do community service? Good luck getting a decent job, getting your power turned on, garbage collection…good luck getting anything if you don’t support The Party.
angelat0763 on November 7, 2008 at 4:48 PM
One thing I forgot to mention is that those VOLUNTARY high school service clubs were sponsored by VOLUNTARY adult clubs like Lions Club, Rotary, etc., to try to model and encourage VOLUNTARY service of young people in the community.
On a rotating basis, a couple of club members from high school would go to the weekly adult club luncheons. This, again, was to encourage teenagers to not think only of themselves, but to do VOLUNTARY work to help your community.
INC on November 7, 2008 at 4:54 PM
I agree I won’t be submitting to “The Ones” slavery mandates. Your post, however, discounts some things. Think about that section of the Constitution and then think about the draft during Vietnam. Mandatory national service could be viewed as an extension of the draft tailored to address the dire national economic emergency. In addition there is historical precedent. Although not mandatory The Civilian Conservation Corps was eerily similar to what “O” proposes here.
Oldnuke on November 7, 2008 at 4:56 PM
…oh, brother, indeed….
…I don’t have the time or patience to find out which side of the “social conservatism” and “Christian values” discussion you came down on — and agree with Grue that it’s a distraction from the thread, but can’t resist getting a few licks in — but let me finish my tempting the thread to digress with this:
Christian values are summed up here:
…so, love God, love your neighbor, go to the Epistles to find out how to organize your church and act in society…and don’t be a misery to others in matters of observance….
I remember someone asked Martin Luther how to live in a sinful world as a Christian…he said “Make a good pair of shoes. Sell them at a fair price.”
Works for me.
Puritan1648 on November 7, 2008 at 4:57 PM
If they are tied to the democrat party they’ve never been out of bondage.
Oldnuke on November 7, 2008 at 4:59 PM
Muhfuggah
mr.blacksheep on November 7, 2008 at 5:01 PM
Re the Update: I’m not going to go as far as to compare it to Nazi concentration camps, but I do think it’s awfully brown shirty. Moreover, it is not true that it is voluntary! What part of the word “require” does Politico not understand, and where the hell does Politico get its “facts”? Team Obama’s press releases from the office of the President-Elect?
Yes, one of the proposals is to require service in college in exchange for a $4000 tax credit, but there is no such deal for middle school or high school students.
Moreover, the idea of a $4000 tax credit for college students is another fraudulent benefit since most of these students don’t have a job to be taxed on. So, do the parents get the tax credit while their child works as an indentured servant, or what?
Buy Danish on November 7, 2008 at 5:02 PM
Why the link to Politico and not straight to Derby? You have a Politico fetish.
BadgerHawk on November 7, 2008 at 5:04 PM
Works the same way as the “tax cuts” for the 50% or so who pay no tax: it’ll be a check. Works out at about $40/hr. Pretty good pay, no? Maybe that’s going to be the new minimum wage, and we’ll all be rich.
mr.blacksheep on November 7, 2008 at 5:07 PM
More tax “cuts” for people who pay no taxes. WONDERFULL!!
angryed on November 7, 2008 at 5:07 PM
And the most Ironic thing, 90+ % of them (black voters), voted themselves back into bondage!
ColdWarrior57 on November 7, 2008 at 4:44 PM
If they are tied to the democrat party they’ve never been out of bondage.
Oldnuke on November 7, 2008 at 4:59 PM
Point, set and match . You are correct.
Carry on that is all.
ColdWarrior57 on November 7, 2008 at 5:07 PM
It’s required that you volunteer.
:P
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 5:11 PM
Yes, but who does the check get made out to? Is it a rebate on paid tuition? What’s to stop them from taking the money, dropping out of community college and going to Vegas? Any requirements that you maintain your grades? Moreover, I just betcha that these CC’s will be forced into open enrollment plans.
Ya know, they tried that in NYC and it was a freaking disaster with radical racists
teachingindoctrinating illiterates.Besides, we Georgians don’t need Barry’s stinkin’ CC credit. We have the Hope Scholarship here and want to keep it.
Buy Danish on November 7, 2008 at 5:19 PM
I’m moving to Alaska. The state can survive with out the lower 48. We will elect Sarah for Prez. I’m not joking!
Mercy4Me on November 7, 2008 at 5:19 PM
The service is voluntary, but once you volunteer its required that you serve 50 hrs.
The service is voluntary, but once you volunteer its required that you serve 50 hrs.
but, thats doulbetalk for OBEY!
Mercy4Me on November 7, 2008 at 5:21 PM
Two tiny countries that need to ensure that every one of their citizens would be at least slightly prepared should they need them to serve in the military on short notices.
Y-not on November 7, 2008 at 5:26 PM
What you live in Valentine, NE? My concern in LA is my good kid getting stuck doing community service with a bunc of gang kids. This will not work outside the “heartland”:
jbh45 on November 7, 2008 at 5:26 PM
fify
Y-not on November 7, 2008 at 5:28 PM
Here’s some good info which argues against compulsory volunteerism. It’s a bit dated, but the principles are still sound.
Buy Danish on November 7, 2008 at 5:30 PM
military service, yes. Israel’s need is obvious.
lorien1973 on November 7, 2008 at 5:33 PM
100 Hours every year in college! Are you kidding me. I need that time to work so I can keep going to college.
nobleclem on November 7, 2008 at 5:34 PM
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