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David Frum: Forget McCain and stop Obama by saving the Senate

posted at 6:20 pm on October 25, 2008 by Allahpundit
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Tough stuff, but conservative passions this year have always been more anti-Obama than pro-McCain (at least until Palin joined the ticket) so I’m curious what you guys think. Nate Silver, a lefty but one who usually plays it straight in his poll analyses, gives Maverick a five percent chance at this point and only then if he gives up on Pennsylvania and starts targeting New Hampshire and New Mexico. Compare that to the thin spreads in various Senate races (as compiled at Silver’s FiveThirtyEight site) that the GOP desperately needs to win to preserve the filibuster: Mitch McConnell, Saxby Chambliss, and Roger Wicker are all clinging to leads of just a few points while Norm Coleman, Liddy Dole, Gordon Smith, and Ted Stevens trail narrowly. Every last one of them’s an incumbent. If the RNC pulls the plug on McCain, they could shower those seven with cash for the last week and try to put them over the top. Or, alternatively, they could stick with Maverick and hope for the best. How lucky do you feel?

The stakes according to Frum:

First, with the financial meltdown, the federal government is now acquiring a huge ownership stake in the nation’s financial system. It will be immensely tempting to officeholders in Washington to use that stake for political ends — to reward friends and punish enemies. One-party government, of course, will intensify those temptations. And as the federal government succumbs, officeholders will become more and more comfortable holding that stake. The current urgency to liquidate the government’s position will subside. The United States needs Republicans and conservatives to monitor the way Democrats wield this extraordinary and dangerous new power — and to pressure them to surrender it as rapidly as feasible.

Second, the political culture of the Democratic Party has changed over the past decade. There’s a fierce new anger among many liberal Democrats, a more militant style and an angry intolerance of dissent and criticism. This is the culture of the left-wing blogosphere and MSNBC’s evening line-up — and soon, it will be the culture of important political institutions in Washington.

Unchecked, this angry new wing of the Democratic Party will seek to stifle opposition by changing the rules of the political game. Some will want to silence conservative talk radio by tightening regulation of the airwaves via the misleadingly named “fairness doctrine”; others may seek to police the activities of right-leaning think tanks by a stricter interpretation of what is tax-deductible and what is not.

The best bulwark for a nonpolitical finance system and a national culture of open debate will be the strongest possible Republican caucus in the Senate. And it is precisely that strength that is being cannibalized now by the flailing end of the McCain-Palin campaign.

He goes so far as to suggest that Senate candidates concede the likelihood of Obama’s victory and run on the sort of divided government platform McCain himself intends to push this week. Exit question: You’re the chairman of the RNC and your phone’s ringing off the hook with demands for money. What do you do? After you print up a few million copies of Treacher’s post and mail it to Republicans, I mean.

Update (Ed): What do I do?  I do basic math.  The Republicans are defending 23 seats in the Senate, and the Democrats 13.  There’s no way on God’s green Earth that the GOP will have enough seats to block the Democratic agenda no matter how much the RNC spends; they’ll be lucky to get 43 seats, and they can’t spend the next two years filibustering everything if they plan to win seats back in 2010.  They’re better off spending the money on McCain — his odds are much better than the Senate Republicans.


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Note KLo’s sarcasm

Senatefrom The Corner by Kathryn Jean Lopez
IS a terribly important issue. But focusing on the Senate — something I don’t take lightly — this next week does not require waving a white flag on the presidency. This election is not over until Americans voter, whatever every genius pundit says.

CanadianGuy on October 25, 2008 at 7:20 PM

Does is really friggin matter if we have 43 or 41 or 39 Senators? There will always be enough RINOs to do whatever the Obamessiah wants if he wins.

Speedwagon82 on October 25, 2008 at 7:20 PM

Jerry Lewis once said that any true comedian is in greater need of comedy than his own audience.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 7:01 PM

Precisely why mimes are such sad creatures.

Patrick S, it’ll take a while to get rid of the blush.

Entelechy on October 25, 2008 at 7:22 PM

Precisely why mimes are such sad creatures.

Well if you were trapped in an invisible box you wouldn’t be too happy either.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:24 PM

Precisely why mimes are such sad creatures.

Patrick S, it’ll take a while to get rid of the blush.

Entelechy on October 25, 2008 at 7:22 PM

Actually, I was thinking of Richard Jeni. Mimes should be run over like squirrels. And I’m delighted to see I am not the rascal who caused you to blush.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 7:25 PM

Yeah but in what way? I mean if you haven’t already unsubscribed to the drivel called National Review you need to get your head examined. If you have then what can be done about Frum? Letters to the Editor?

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:13 PM

yeah the NR is a big JOKE!! the magazine that used to publish Buckley, Burnham, and Chambers, now has frum and kathleen parker….Buckley is spinning in his grave!!!

I used to subscribe to the NR, back in the old days when Burnham and buckley were there, chambers has been dead a long time. I remember they published solzhenitsyn’s harvard address.

That was conservatism. what they publish now is puke.

right4life on October 25, 2008 at 7:25 PM

I am having awful flashback to my youth…wondering how a nation can choose a philandering governor with questionable dealings over a President, Vice-President, Gulf War Leader, CIA head, military guy. In 1992, I just couldn’t understand how George lost to Bill. No new taxes, what a STUPID reason. Bill gave us new taxes to be sure!
Now we have a guy who could be a philanderer or have questionable dealings, we know he doesn’t care much for campaign finance laws. We don’t know squat! We know McCain is as center as they come, he has served honorably in the Senate, he is a war vet and a patriotic hero.
So what am I missing. Why do > 50% of the US want higher taxes? want Joe Biden in the executive branch? want a PLO loving, Israel eh-ing, socialist cavorting, terrorist “neighborhooding”, untested, unvetted, self-loving kid IN THE WHITE HOUSE??????
I’m spitting fire today, I’m so mad. WHY are we in this position? I lay it ALL at McCain’s feet. Like Bush and Dole he is too above going to the mattresses. I don’t understand that either because he had no problem ripping into Romney in front of the whole world…WHY?

Ah well, I’ll pay my 50% rate and like it, I guess. If I complain, they’ll come after me I’m sure.

jawbone on October 25, 2008 at 7:26 PM

Frum is writing in clear English the reality that is already evident in RNC and various Republican Senatorial ads. Over the next 10 days, reality will hit more and more people.

sanjeevn on October 25, 2008 at 6:28 PM

Find the nearest lake and surround yourself with it. Take Axelrod with you.

Jim Treacher on October 25, 2008 at 7:27 PM

David Frum: Forget McCain and stop Obama by saving the Senate

F*ck you Frum.

Republicans can vote for republican senators and McCain at the same time.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 7:33 PM

Wouldnt the RNC be sticking a shiv in the back of those who recently contributed even more to get McCain in, if they bail on McCain? That doesn’t seem a good way to motivate the base for other races.

aikidoka on October 25, 2008 at 7:34 PM

Yes they would, aikidoka.

This should be pretty obvious. As some conservatives have been against McCain since day one. Everything they want involves McCain losing and Obama winning.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 7:36 PM

David Frum?

A one-time scribe for the president who has been spending that currency ever since.

What exactly is Frum’s expertise in terms of campaign strategy? Has he ever managed a campaign for national office? No. Has he ever ran for national office? No.

David, fall in line with the rest of your media elitists and blow that bugle of retreat out your rear-end.

Captain America on October 25, 2008 at 7:39 PM

I’ve got an idea. Let’s forget David Frum.

rrpjr on October 25, 2008 at 7:43 PM

Even if Frum was right – which I consider to be about as likely as Nate Silver playing things straight (whatever his conscious intentions), or of Rudy Giuliani ever having become the Republican nominee and successful as same (around 5% or less in all cases) – it would be too late for “sinking loser McCain” to change strategies suddenly and spread hope and change to one or a few Senators who would then be able to mount valiant opposition to the Wise and Powerful Maximum Mandatee Obama the Great.

The die is cast. This is almost as stupid as Kathleen Parker’s notion that having Palin resign from the ticket a couple of weeks ago would not have been politically “unreasonable.” I qualify the remark only because nothing could be more politically ignorant.

The bad public polls “might” be accurate, but, if they are, it will because of luck, not because they are in any sense scientifically valid. Due to the manner in which they are conducted and the unjustified assumptions they make about the nature of the electorate, they can be presumed to be garbage-in/garbage-out until proven otherwise. Any article, blog post, or political agenda based on them can likewise be considered garbage-out.

Really, to think otherwise is to have blind faith in a sub-institution of the same pseudo-intelligentsia and larger media enterprise that everywhere else we pretend to be so skeptical of.

CK MacLeod on October 25, 2008 at 7:44 PM

Senator Jim Webb wrote a book Title “Born Fighting” How the Scots Irish shaped America. My maiden name starts with a (Mc) just like John McCain. I am an Independent AND I am not ready to give up the Ghost. What is wrong with people? Below.

Frum is writing in clear English the reality that is already evident in RNC and various Republican Senatorial ads. Over the next 10 days, reality will hit more and more people.

sanjeevn on October 25, 2008 at 6:28 PM

Obama has a Problem with Appalachia, Obama has a Problem with Rural voters, Obama has a problem with White Blue Color Voters. Obama has a problem with Bitter, Gun Toting, Bible Hugging, Stranger shunning Rural Folks. You Know the Jacksonians, who voted for Hillary Clinton in the Primary, No one thinks those votes need exploited, like in Virginia’s 9th District a battle ground state? Why does everyone think Sarah Palin was chosen in the first place to attract the Rural Vote. The Reagan Democrats, have a whole bunch of good reasons to vote for John (Mc)Cain. Who apparently was also Born Fighting. In fact he gave an endorsement on the back cover. The Obamaniacs are attacking Joe the Plumber, I guess no one thinks that Joe (Mc)I love my guns and bible are not paying attention?

I can’t get over how some are ready to roll over (sanjeevn on October 25,2008 at 6:28 PM)

John Murtha just gave McCain a gift in Pennsylvania, with calling Pennsylvanians both racist then rednecks…don’t leave the Appalachia Chain, Senator McCain, those are your folks. Ask them, they are always up for a Fight. Kin means a lot to them. You don’t have to take my word for it, Google Obama Problems, Appalachia, Rural Voters.

Dr Evil on October 25, 2008 at 7:45 PM

Captain America,

I read Frum’s book about Bush The Right Man in a public library one day in a fit of boredom. I can only conclude that he is has no fixed ideas about anything–no principles, no political philosophy. In other words the criticisms that Peggy Noonan (or was it Kathleen Parker?) laid at Sarah Palin’s feet could be just as easily laid at Frum’s.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:45 PM

Don’t anyone panic, everything is going to be fine. I have been talking to the American people so I know. And check out my sign. Is it over the top?
RNC HQ here was all out of McCain Palin signs so I did some arts and crafts.

kahall on October 25, 2008 at 7:46 PM

Dr Evil on October 25, 2008 at 7:45 PM

All this time I’m picturing Austin Powers’ nemesis and you are a woman?!

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 7:47 PM

Captain America,

I read Frum’s book about Bush The Right Man in a public library one day in a fit of boredom. I can only conclude that he is has no fixed ideas about anything–no principles, no political philosophy. In other words the criticisms that Peggy Noonan (or was it Kathleen Parker?) laid at Sarah Palin’s feet could be just as easily laid at Frum’s.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:45 PM

He’s an opportunist.

CanadianGuy on October 25, 2008 at 7:48 PM

right4life,

Yep. After its slump in the mid-80s NR was beginning to recover in the mid to late 90s with John O’ Sullivan as editor focusing on immigration restrictionism. Unfortunately Buckley got cold feet and fired him so now the mediocrity Rich Lowry pilots the magazine’s downward plunge.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:48 PM

I’m with Treacher.

ConMom on October 25, 2008 at 7:51 PM

Unfortunately Buckley got cold feet and fired him so now the mediocrity Rich Lowry pilots the magazine’s downward plunge. – aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:48 PM

Not to worry. After McCain takes office, they’ll have 4 years to torpedo Sarah Palin before her run in 2012.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 7:52 PM

Senator Jim Webb wrote a book Title “Born Fighting” How the Scots Irish shaped America.

To date all American Presidents have been of British/Irish lineage with the exception of three CinCs of Dutch extraction (Van Buren, Roosevelt and Roosevelt).

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:53 PM

I’m with Treacher.

ConMom on October 25, 2008 at 7:51 PM

ConMom. You truly had me thinking I was going mad. I would see your comment and be sure I had read it before, but it was new.

You’re a tricky one :)

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 7:56 PM

I’m with Treacher.

Jim are you still going to post on your blog after the election? You should, its funny stuff.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:57 PM

Furthermore – and sorry about any typos or unclarity in prior post, was just getting up from a nap – IF the “it’s all over” polls are accurate, then we’re looking at an electorate that will nationwide be overwhelmingly more Democrat than Republican, at levels not seen since modern polling began – and even worse in many battleground states. If that’s the case, the money and effort expended on Republican Senatorial campaigns in a last-second diversion would be better donated to charity.

CK MacLeod on October 25, 2008 at 7:57 PM

Unfortunately Buckley got cold feet and fired him so now the mediocrity Rich Lowry pilots the magazine’s downward plunge. – aengus on October 25, 2008 at 7:48 PM

I haven’t yet seen you wrong. I don’t know whether he’s a mediocrity or not. They do all seem to be awfully wet behind the ears over there.

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 7:58 PM

Not to worry. After McCain takes office, they’ll have 4 years to torpedo Sarah Palin before her run in 2012.

If you’re serious about boycotting NR you can read Mark Steyn’s NR articles online in the Orange County Register. No ad revenue need go to the NR.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 8:00 PM

Give up on McCain ==> low Republican turnout for Senate races

That’s not an option.

daryl_herbert on October 25, 2008 at 8:00 PM

To hell with David Frum! What the heck has he done since his “axis of evil” line? Nothing!
Good riddance! You one hit wonder!

RMR on October 25, 2008 at 8:02 PM

I haven’t yet seen you wrong. I don’t know whether he’s a mediocrity or not. They do all seem to be awfully wet behind the ears over there.

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 7:58 PM

Hes very poor in my opinion. Take the primaries for example. NR endorsed Mitt Romney in its editorial and then when McCain won New Hampshire (I think, might have been Iowa) Rich Lowry reversed himself–on the basis of one primary. It seems to me that Mr. Lowry is a weak reed who bends with the wind.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 8:05 PM

With McCain back in the Senate, we’ll need an additional conservative senator to offset his actions and keep the Dems from their fillibuster-proof majority.

Valiant on October 25, 2008 at 8:06 PM

To hell with David Frum! What the heck has he done since his “axis of evil” line? Nothing!
Good riddance! You one hit wonder!

RMR on October 25, 2008 at 8:02 PM

It was “axis of hate” when he coined it and someone else decided it should be changed to “axis of evil”. So he came up with “axis of” which, considering we’ve all heard of the Second World War, isn’t particularly original or clever.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 8:08 PM

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 8:05 PM

Could be. They are an intelligent bunch, but young and inexperienced. They might be very useful one day :)

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 8:09 PM

We need to get out the vote. The media is lying through its teeth to demoralize Republicans so some/many won’t vote. Whatever you do, don’t let that happen to you, your family, friends and neighbors. If you do nothing else this election, make sure you vote and at least one other Republican you know votes. If you do this, we will win.

DrDeano on October 25, 2008 at 8:12 PM

I say back McCain and let fortune take its toll. We Republicans have foolishly made this bed and we need to lie in it. Go big or go home. If we lose, it puts us where the Dhimmicrats were in 2002. So what.

Let’s come back conservative next time instead of spending other people’s money like drunken sailors.

Mojave Mark on October 25, 2008 at 8:15 PM

Screw (my senator) McCain, if we may keep a closure proof minority in the Senate and rebuild conservatism from there. Sarah Palin in that case may return whenever after primarily seizing Lisa Murkowsky’s seat in 2010.

exdeadhead on October 25, 2008 at 8:18 PM

Jim are you still going to post on your blog after the election?

Sure, if it’s still legal.

Jim Treacher on October 25, 2008 at 8:19 PM

Dr. Evil: I was driving in that woefully gerrymandered Murtha district the other day, and I saw plenty of McCain/Palin signs in yards. There were even “Democrats for McCain” signs. There were few Murtha signs; Bill Russell signs exceeded them in number. Obama signs? Not so many.

Murtha may have clinched the McCain/Palin vote for western PA.

Heh! I even saw a car today sporting a “Mac/Cuda!” bumper sticker. I want one of those…even though my own car was keyed when it sported a “W” sticker.

onlineanalyst on October 25, 2008 at 8:21 PM

Zogby has race tightening: 49% Obama, 46% McCain (h/t Drudge).

The polls are so inconsistent that we all must acknowledge the obvious — we cannot trust them. Clearly, participants are lying to pollsters.

With the race card being played so blatantly, the Bradley Effect has to be a factor. I suspect there is also a Bush Effect — Republicans so demoralized that they decline to be identified with their party. This would help explain the oversampling of Democrats in every major poll.

Today I was reading the background of a Nevada poll showing the race tied at 47%-47%. Palin polled extremely well with Hispanics, white men, and senior citizens. McCain, send Sarah to New Mexico pronto.

Terrie on October 25, 2008 at 8:22 PM

Both my ‘Republican’ senators voted for the bailout. I reprimanded them via email. In their replies, they said they did it for the ‘good of the country.’ Baloney! They did it for their seats. And they will do it again and again. They do not represent me or the Texans I know. And they will not stand up to Obama & Co.

Peri Winkle on October 25, 2008 at 8:23 PM

David Frum: Forget McCain and stop Obama by saving the Senate

Screw Frum! If you can’t run with the big dogs stay under the porch!

Speakup on October 25, 2008 at 8:24 PM

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 8:08 PM

“Axis of”…? It’s even worst than I thought. And for this Davey consider himself an expert? HA! HA! HA!

RMR on October 25, 2008 at 8:25 PM

I haven’t agreed with Frum much since Harriet Miers. We were both against.

Terrie on October 25, 2008 at 8:27 PM

The bad public polls “might” be accurate, but, if they are, it will because of luck, not because they are in any sense scientifically valid. Due to the manner in which they are conducted and the unjustified assumptions they make about the nature of the electorate, they can be presumed to be garbage-in/garbage-out until proven otherwise. Any article, blog post, or political agenda based on them can likewise be considered garbage-out.

CK MacLeod on October 25, 2008 at 7:44 PM

Polls are accurate, especially when you take an average of all polls. In 2004, the ave of polls accurately predicted every state except for Wisconsin. Furthermore, they predicted a 1.5% victory for Bush in the national vote. The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose. If some conservatives chose to be in denial, it just going to hurt more come the day after the election.

The good news for conservatives is that the political landscape can change fairly quickly. If somebody told me in 2004 that in just 4 yrs that Democrats would control all branches of the government I would of been incredulous.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 8:32 PM

If you’re looking for a little cheer amidst all the doom and gloom, try this.

Buy Danish on October 25, 2008 at 8:38 PM

The egregious Frum, (To quote Dr. Pournelle) has been a boil on American Conservatism for far too long now.

Can we just send him off with Christopher Buckley into whatever self-prescribed hades they have made for themselves, and get on with the real world.

Elitist upper-class twit of the year candidate, along with a few others I could name. If that’s the Conservative movement, I’ll have to go back to being a Libertarian, and I thought I got over that back in about 1970 or so when I grew up.

jefferson101 on October 25, 2008 at 8:38 PM

The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose. If some conservatives chose to be in denial, it just going to hurt more come the day after the election. – Ric on October 25, 2008 at 8:32 PM

It’s not a question of denial. It’s a question of fact. McCain will win. I realize this does not fit into your equation and appears to be at complete variance with what we know on October 25. But the election is not being held today – it’s being held on November 4. And on that day, McCain will be elected president of the United States. You can disbelieve me if you like, but that doesn’t change the reality of what is going to happen.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 8:41 PM

The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose.

Bookmarked.

Jim Treacher on October 25, 2008 at 8:47 PM

Forget Frum.

Fill the House with Joe the Plumbers!

Saltysam on October 25, 2008 at 8:49 PM

I think we really needed this election cycle to make the RINOs glaringly obvious and rid ourselves of them. Frum and Noonan and their like can kiss my arse when Mac and Cuda win on November 4.

To Frum’s point, I’d rather have the veto power and bully pulpit of the Presidency over the re-vote capability of congress.

pugwriter on October 25, 2008 at 8:50 PM

The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose.

And aren’t you going to be so upset when McCain wins, and Obama loses.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 8:52 PM

Zogby has race tightening: 49% Obama, 46% McCain (h/t Drudge).

I looked at Drudge and I didn’t see anything but maybe I was looking in the wrong place.

Polls are accurate, especially when you take an average of all polls. In 2004, the ave of polls accurately predicted every state except for Wisconsin. Furthermore, they predicted a 1.5% victory for Bush in the national vote. The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose.

Maybe yes and maybe no. We don’t know yet. If I read the polls that are anywhere between a 10 point gap and a dead heat I can say that everything is possible. But I must say that judging after the latest numbers Obama is the clear favourite.

The good news for conservatives is that the political landscape can change fairly quickly.

Ups I am not so sure with a MSm in the tank for Obama. What makes you think that they are not going to shield for him after he is elected and everybody that dares to speak against him is going to be branded as a racist and an enemy of the people?

clemycali on October 25, 2008 at 8:54 PM

And aren’t you going to be so upset when McCain wins, and Obama loses.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 8:52 PM

Its very close. McCain can still win. O’Blahblah is not home dry.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 8:57 PM

Polls are accurate, especially when you take an average of all polls. In 2004, the ave of polls accurately predicted every state except for Wisconsin. Furthermore, they predicted a 1.5% victory for Bush in the national vote. The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose. If some conservatives chose to be in denial, it just going to hurt more come the day after the election.

Taking an average of polls only corrects against random error, not against systematic error. As for predicting every state and a +1.5% Bush win, I presume you are referring to the election eve polls, not the averages of polls as of Election Day -10. Please provide the evidence for your claim so it can be properly addressed.

As for “bitter truths” and being “in denial,” I fully expect the sun to come up on Nov 5 and on most subsequent days, regardless of the election outcome. I also do not believe in losing a night’s sleep or beating a dog over the outcome of any election. What may be even more shocking to you is that I trust myself to formulate a response to the situation when the situation actually arises. I don’t need 10 long days to figure out how I personally will deal with an e.g. 61 – 39 as opposed 59 – 41 Senate either.

CK MacLeod on October 25, 2008 at 8:57 PM

Off-topic for a sec. Don’t know where else to post about it, but has anyone broken this ACORN story that’s been right before our eyes since Oct 8th? It was just posted on wikileaks.org and I’ve never heard a word about it. It was yanked from the net by Social Policy, but reposted on Wiki. Here’s just a small sample of some of the most interesting text from the ACORN written newsletter. Rather non-partisan, don’t you think?

Case Study:
Chicago-The Barack Obama Campaign
By Toni Foulkes

“It seemed to us that what Obama needed
in the March primary was what we
always work to deliver anyway:
increased turnout in our ACORN communities.
ACORN is active on the south and west sides of Chicago, in the south suburbs and on the east side of Springfield, the state capital. Most of the turf where we organize in is African American, with a growing Latino presence
in Chicago’s Little Village and the
suburbs.”

hot-heir on October 25, 2008 at 9:10 PM

And aren’t you going to be so upset when McCain wins, and Obama loses.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 8:52 PM

Not that upset, history has shown that divided government is usually the best government. As it forces both sides to go to the middle and comprise. I read somewhere that government grows slowest when its divided. Maybe its because I’ve been reading to much hotair but I thought about voting for McCain, but I can’t bring myself to vote against the chance of universal healthcare. I think its immoral that people can go bankrupt because they lose their jobs and get sick.

I would argue further about how polls are accurate, but really, were all going to know in a couple of days.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:12 PM

The bitter truth is that McCain is going to lose. If some conservatives chose to be in denial, it just going to hurt more come the day after the election. – Ric on October 25, 2008 at 8:32 PM
It’s not a question of denial. It’s a question of fact. McCain will win. I realize this does not fit into your equation and appears to be at complete variance with what we know on October 25. But the election is not being held today – it’s being held on November 4. And on that day, McCain will be elected president of the United States. You can disbelieve me if you like, but that doesn’t change the reality of what is going to happen.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 8:41 PM

This is going to be a bit lengthy but READ THIS:

CHICAGO, Oct 15, 2008 /PRNewswire-USNewswire via COMTEX/ — The following is the text of an open letter to the nation’s hunters and sportsmen issued today by Illinois State Rifle Association Executive Director Richard Pearson:

Fellow Sportsman,
Hello, my name is Rich Pearson and I have been active in the firearm rights movement for over 40 years. For the past 15 years, I have served in the Illinois state capitol as the chief lobbyist for the Illinois State Rifle Association.

I lobbied Barack Obama extensively while he was an Illinois State Senator. As a result of that experience, I know Obama’s attitudes toward guns and gun owners better than anyone. The truth be told, in all my years in the Capitol I have never met a legislator who harbors more contempt for the law-abiding firearm owner than does Barack Obama.

Although Obama claims to be an advocate for the 2nd Amendment, his voting record in the Illinois Senate paints a very different picture. While a state senator, Obama voted for a bill that would ban nearly every hunting rifle, shotgun and target rifle owned by Illinois citizens. That same bill would authorize the state police to raid homes of gun owners to forcibly confiscate banned guns. Obama supported a bill that would shut down law-abiding firearm manufacturers including Springfield Armory, Armalite, Rock River Arms and Les Baer. Obama also voted for a bill that would prohibit law-abiding citizens from purchasing more than one gun per month…..LINK

Get this story out in Pennsylvania and Colorado and I guarantee McCain will be our next POTUS!

Rovin on October 25, 2008 at 9:16 PM

I can’t bring myself to vote against the chance of universal healthcare. I think its immoral that people can go bankrupt because they lose their jobs and get sick. – Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:12 PM

And there it is. Saved us the trouble of outing him.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:17 PM

. I think its immoral that people can go bankrupt because they lose their jobs and get sick.

I would argue further about how polls are accurate, but really, were all going to know in a couple of days.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:12 PM

Don’t confuse health insurance with health care. The libtards already have the system of their dreams but they’re too dumb to know it. Here’s how it works:

If you don’t want to pay, you go to the emergency room for free. You get the best medical care in the world for free. Only the suckers pay, for themselves, and everyone else. Wise-up dickwad. You’ve got it better than communism.

(btw, the suckers call themselves patriots. quaint, aint it?)

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:17 PM

Maybe its because I’ve been reading to much hotair but I thought about voting for McCain, but I can’t bring myself to vote against the chance of universal healthcare.

Well before you say another stupidity about the benefits of the universal health care I suggest that you take a trip to Canada for a few days and ask the canadians why they are coming to USA for treatment. They have universal health care. Their answers might surprise you.
I agree that health care is expensive in US but I don’t thing that the so called universal health care is the answer.

clemycali on October 25, 2008 at 9:17 PM

And there it is. Saved us the trouble of outing him her.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:17 PM

I beg your pardon.

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:18 PM

Not that upset, history has shown that divided government is usually the best government. As it forces both sides to go to the middle and comprise. I read somewhere that government grows slowest when its divided.

That was Milton Friedman’s argument. However a Democratic White House, Congress and Senate would not constitute a divided government.

I think its immoral that people can go bankrupt because they lose their jobs and get sick.

The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune are cruel to bear but the purpose of government is to govern, not correct life’s ills.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 9:18 PM

But the election is not being held today – it’s being held on November 4.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 8:41 P

That’s not quite accurate. The election is, at least in part, in progress today, as 32 states offer early voting. In fact, I voted today.

(And yes, I voted for McCain — or more precisely, against Obama — even though I have no expectation of McCain winning. Well, he’ll win my state of Texas.)

paul006 on October 25, 2008 at 9:20 PM

Frum…You TOTAL IDIOT…In order to spend $$ on down-ticket candidates (e.g. senate seats w/i 2 polling points, etc.), the RNC would have have to buy television “space” WEEKS ago for these ads

Please try to be more realistic in your “salvage” efforts. Your present suggestions are pitiful

alwyr on October 25, 2008 at 9:20 PM

That was Milton Friedman’s argument

Repeated by Buckley with his Boston phone book quip. And of course, it’s most often true, because humans just seem to suck so much. Can’t live with ‘em, can’t live without ‘em.

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:22 PM

Bush win, I presume you are referring to the election eve polls, not the averages of polls as of Election Day -10. Please provide the evidence for your claim so it can be properly addressed.

CK MacLeod on October 25, 2008 at 8:57 PM

Here’s my evidence.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:24 PM

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:24 PM

Unless that evidence reaches into the future, it’s useless.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:25 PM

That’s not quite accurate. The election is, at least in part, in progress today, as 32 states offer early voting. In fact, I voted today. – paul006 on October 25, 2008 at 9:20 PM

Very true, Paul, but the overwhelming majority of voters will go to polls on November 4. And on Novembeer 4 the majority will elect John McCain. Period.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:27 PM

I beg your pardon. – JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:18 PM

I believe Nixon once uttered that to Gerald Ford when he bumped into him at a cocktail party in 1976.

Ford responded, “I thought I already did.”

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:28 PM

Saying over and over that McCain is going to lose and Obama is going to win does nothing other than to demoralize people who are planning on voting for McCain and want to defeat Obama. Planning on 2012 before 2008 hasn’t occurred yet is also in this same arena of stupidity.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 9:30 PM

heh

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:33 PM

Planning on 2012 before 2008 hasn’t occurred yet is also in this same arena of stupidity. – wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 9:30 PM

Unless it involves the election of Sarah Palin to the presidency. She will be elected in that year.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:34 PM

And there it is. Saved us the trouble of outing him her.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:17 PM
I beg your pardon.

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:18 PM

Are you trying to insult me by suggesting that I’m not a man but a women? Because if you are, you have some serious issues you need to work through

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:34 PM

Are you trying to insult me by suggesting that I’m not a man but a women? Because if you are, you have some serious issues you need to work through – Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:34 PM

You could be transgendered. That might explain the obsession with universal health care.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:38 PM

Well before you say another stupidity about the benefits of the universal health care I suggest that you take a trip to Canada for a few days and ask the canadians why they are coming to USA for treatment. They have universal health care. Their answers might surprise you.
I agree that health care is expensive in US but I don’t thing that the so called universal health care is the answer.

I actually go to school in Canada right now. And I have used their health care system, and can highly recommend it. When I twisted my ankle really bad, I went to the emergency room. Got it checked out, bandaged and left. Didn’t cost me dime, not a bad deal for $400 premium upfront to get Canada health insurance. Now I’m aware that for major surgeries, there is a long line. Its not ideal, but I’d rather wait longer for non-life threatening surgery, than have the risk of going bankrupt and getting treatment faster.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:44 PM

Repeated by Buckley with his Boston phone book quip. And of course, it’s most often true, because humans just seem to suck so much. Can’t live with ‘em, can’t live without ‘em.

JiangxiDad on October 25, 2008 at 9:22 PM

There is a subtle difference between the two arguments. Buckley believed that ordinary people could govern better than those who saw governing as their vocation whereas Friedman was so horrified at the prospect of government that he wanted to throw a sabot into the works. I’d be more inclined to side with Friedman.

I hate the way Truman’s comment about the “do-nothing Congress” is always seen as a disparaging comment. If it were up to me “Do Nothing Congress” would be a campaign slogan. :) Pay the bastards to idle and not screw everything by exercising their legislative ‘abilities’.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 9:45 PM

I actually go to school in Canada right now. And I have used their health care system, and can highly recommend it. When I twisted my ankle really bad, I went to the emergency room. Got it checked out, bandaged and left. Didn’t cost me dime, not a bad deal for $400 premium upfront to get Canada health insurance. Now I’m aware that for major surgeries, there is a long line. Its not ideal, but I’d rather wait longer for non-life threatening surgery, than have the risk of going bankrupt and getting treatment faster.

Well I must tell you that for major surgery if you don’t have the proper treatment in time you risk to die before your turn comes. So if I have to choose between dying and going banckrupt I choose the second. You know, you can get out from banckrupcy but you can’t resurect yourself. Big diffrence.
But I have friends that live in Canada, canadian citizens, and they have to wait in line for a month before seeing a specialist.

clemycali on October 25, 2008 at 9:49 PM

You could be transgendered. That might explain the obsession with universal health care.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:38 PM

Real mature ManlyRash. Stay classy.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:49 PM

Didn’t cost me dime,

Sounds great. Sign me up. Who cares where the money comes from as long as it’s free to me, right?

You know who else loves canadian healthcare? The second woman in this video, and the first? Not so much.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 9:50 PM

David Frum is being politically dumb.

Phil Byler on October 25, 2008 at 9:50 PM

A lot of that going around here this year, Phil Byler.

wise_man on October 25, 2008 at 9:51 PM

Today I heard a soldier wounded twice in Iraq gave his Purple Heart to McCain who gave it back with his blessing. I guess beyond his vote, it was like the soldier was giving his life to JMc.
ManlyRash, you’re right. We are going to win.

gracie on October 25, 2008 at 9:51 PM

I think David Frum should take his ego and his crap opinions and hit the road.

Republican on October 25, 2008 at 6:23 PM

Likewise. Door. Ass. Bang.

james23 on October 25, 2008 at 9:54 PM

Now I’m aware that for major surgeries, there is a long line. Its not ideal, but I’d rather wait longer for non-life threatening surgery, than have the risk of going bankrupt and getting treatment faster.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:44 PM

Ric,

You’re a fool if you think any government sponsored health care system is the answer to your avoidence to going bankrupt to have major medical. What makes you think this its the financial responsibility of American taxpayers to pick up your tab? Grow up and get a clue. Look in the constitution. No where does it say that health care is a right supplied by the government. What you are suggesting is another unfunded Social Security system that the liberals would love to embrace as another socialist policy that remands you to their idea of how you MUST live your life. I would rather be bankrupt than submit to this ideology.

Rovin on October 25, 2008 at 9:58 PM

Stay classy. – Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:49 PM

I always do, Ric. I always do.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 9:59 PM

In 1992, I just couldn’t understand how George lost to Bill. No new taxes, what a STUPID reason. Bill gave us new taxes to be sure!
Now we have a guy who could be a philanderer or have questionable dealings, we know he doesn’t care much for campaign finance laws. We don’t know squat! We know McCain is as center as they come, he has served honorably in the Senate, he is a war vet and a patriotic hero.
So what am I missing. Why do > 50% of the US want higher taxes?

jawbone on October 25, 2008 at 7:26 PM

What you’re missing is that Clinton only got 40% of the vote. His buddy Perot, in return for government remittance processing business, took enough ‘conservative’ votes to win the electoral college – twice. No democrat has gotten over 50% of the vote since 1976, and Carter got 50.2% with a Watergate tailwind.

Don’t forget that over 3 million Hillary voters are voting for McCain, and that as many real conservatives crossed over in the primaries to vote against her (later for her) and will not vote for Obama, but they do skew the polls. I believe the race is tied right now, with McCain having the momentum.

Vashta.Nerada on October 25, 2008 at 10:00 PM

Unchecked, this angry new wing of the Democratic Party will seek to stifle opposition by changing the rules of the political game

If the manufactured fraud that is Barack Hussein Obama gets elected with a dem super majority in controll of congress, were a screwed as a nation.

God help us all.

Dave R. on October 25, 2008 at 10:00 PM

Ric, You’re a fool if you think any government sponsored health care system is the answer to your avoidence to going bankrupt to have major medical. What makes you think this its the financial responsibility of American taxpayers to pick up your tab? Grow up and get a clue. Look in the constitution. No where does it say that health care is a right supplied by the government. What you are suggesting is another unfunded Social Security system that the liberals would love to embrace as another socialist policy that remands you to their idea of how you MUST live your life. I would rather be bankrupt than submit to this ideology.

Did some editing to save space, Rovin. Looks good now.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 10:01 PM

If the manufactured fraud that is Barack Hussein Obama gets elected with a dem super majority in controll of congress, were a screwed as a nation. – Dave R. on October 25, 2008 at 10:00 PM

But he won’t be. You can sleep well tonight.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 10:02 PM

Here’s my evidence.

Ric on October 25, 2008 at 9:24 PM

Thank you. The precise relevance of those poll results to the polls in use during the present election would be arguable on several scores. The shape of the same graph for this election would be very different. For example, McCain enjoyed a lead in the averaged results during the same period that Bush was enjoying his biggest lead over Kerry. This election is also probably the most ideological since 1984, and is the first in generations not to include an incumbent President or VP heading either ticket. There are many other peculiarities on the level of polling methodology unique to this election, as well as a widely noted over-profusion of polls, many by firms with limited or dubious track records. Since you’ve already said you don’t wish to discuss the matter in detail, I’ll leave it at that.

CK MacLeod on October 25, 2008 at 10:06 PM

In 1992, I just couldn’t understand how George lost to Bill. No new taxes, what a STUPID reason. Bill gave us new taxes to be sure!
Now we have a guy who could be a philanderer or have questionable dealings, we know he doesn’t care much for campaign finance laws. We don’t know squat! We know McCain is as center as they come, he has served honorably in the Senate, he is a war vet and a patriotic hero.
So what am I missing. Why do > 50% of the US want higher taxes?

jawbone on October 25, 2008 at 7:26 PM

It wasn’t just taxes. Bush 41 threw the NRA under the bus like an arrogant jackass and they responded by not endorsing him. It would have cost him nothing to support the 2nd Amendment but instead he said “Where else are they are going to go?” i.e. who else are they (the NRA) going to vote for? Their answer: not you. Bush 41 lost and the NRA are now the most powerful political lobby in America. The GOP will never make that mistake ever again.

aengus on October 25, 2008 at 10:07 PM

If Palin had called her husband Todd’s mother “a typical Eskimo woman” how much longer a career in politics would she have had?

Obama is a stealth candidate, with the MSM as his cloaking device.

Counting on “typical white women” to feel guilty for voting against a racist brown guy.

Because the Media says so.

profitsbeard on October 25, 2008 at 10:08 PM

The GOP will never make that mistake ever again. – aengus on October 25, 2008 at 10:07 PM

I’m the NRA. And Joe the Plumber.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 10:10 PM

Meanwhile, elsewhere at National Review Online, Mark Levin has written a must read that sums up my assessment: The Obama Temptation.

Terrie on October 25, 2008 at 10:13 PM

Obama is a stealth candidate, with the MSM as his cloaking device. – profitsbeard on October 25, 2008 at 10:08 PM

Ah, but if you saw Star Trek III you would know that a cloaked ship distorts the pattern of star light behind it. And the voters have seen the distortion. And when Obama decloaks on November 4…..BOOM.

Heh…

*looks around at stunned faces*

Um…that’s what a….friend of mine told me. Yeah…a friend of mine.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 10:13 PM

Meanwhile, elsewhere at National Review Online, Mark Levin has written a must read that sums up my assessment: The Obama Temptation. – Terrie on October 25, 2008 at 10:13 PM

Not for nothing do they call him The Great One.

ManlyRash on October 25, 2008 at 10:17 PM

Levin!

Jim Treacher on October 25, 2008 at 10:19 PM

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