Democrats to kill 401(k)s for … privatized Social Security?

posted at 9:30 am on October 23, 2008 by Ed Morrissey

In 2005, George Bush proposed privatizing a portion of Social Security contributions to allow workers to control their own funds and hopefully outperform the woefully inadequate entitlement system.  The partial privatization would eventually have helped postpone or eliminate the insolvency of Social Security, but Democrats screeched that the GOP wanted to steal benefits from Grandma and effectively killed the debate.  To this day, they accuse Republican candidates of supporting Bush’s partial privatization plan as though it were the equivalent of Teapot Dome.

So why are Democrats now looking to partially nationalize existing 401(k) plans into the exact same kind of private/public pension system?

Powerful House Democrats are eyeing proposals to overhaul the nation’s $3 trillion 401(k) system, including the elimination of most of the $80 billion in annual tax breaks that 401(k) investors receive.

House Education and Labor Committee Chairman George Miller, D-California, and Rep. Jim McDermott, D-Washington, chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee’s Subcommittee on Income Security and Family Support, are looking at redirecting those tax breaks to a new system of guaranteed retirement accounts to which all workers would be obliged to contribute.

Hmm …. “a system of guaranteed retirement accounts to which all workers would be obliged to contribute.”  That sounds very, very familiar, doesn’t it?  Don’t we already do this with Social Security?

A plan by Teresa Ghilarducci, professor of economic-policy analysis at the New School for Social Research in New York, contains elements that are being considered. She testified last week before Miller’s Education and Labor Committee on her proposal.  …

Under Ghilarducci’s plan, all workers would receive a $600 annual inflation-adjusted subsidy from the U.S. government but would be required to invest 5 percent of their pay into a guaranteed retirement account administered by the Social Security Administration. The money in turn would be invested in special government bonds that would pay 3 percent a year, adjusted for inflation.

The current system of providing tax breaks on 401(k) contributions and earnings would be eliminated.

That means your employer can no longer write off their contributions to your 401(k), and your capital gains would be taxable year-on-year.  In other words, it becomes just another investment or savings account, with no tax benefit at all, and no employer contribution.  Instead, Uncle Sam would give you your “matching” funds — up to a whopping $600 per year!  Whoopee!

As Michelle Obama says, you could buy a pair of earrings every year … except, of course, you can’t.  It’s in The Lockbox, defined by politicians as Locked Away from You but Accessible to Us.  It goes there along with 5% of your gross earnings, apparently to play with the 7% of your gross earnings that already goes to Social Security.  And what do they do with the money?  They give you government bonds as your only investment option.

Maybe you’ll be lucky, and they’ll have Franklin Raines running the agency issuing those bonds.

The Democrats want to end the private retirement system that has allowed Americans to become a vast investor class and put them back in thrall of the federal government.  This is nothing more than a second welfare system that would sit on top of the crumbling Social Security entitlement.  It would leave the American working and middle classes with no retirement option other than a government handout.

If the Democrats control both Congress and the White House, kiss your 401(k)s goodbye, and get into the bread lines first before the crowd arrives. (via Q&O)


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Can I have your Soylent Red? I love the Soylent Green too!

benrand on October 23, 2008 at 9:33 AM

If the Democrats control both Congress and the White House, kiss your 401(k)s goodbye, and get into the bread lines first before the crowd arrives. (via Q&O)

Only if the American public allows them to do it. Even after Obama takes over the presidency, the public will still have a voice as long as we challenge the politicians.

highhopes on October 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

If the Democrats control both Congress and the White House, kiss your 401(k)s goodbye, and get into the bread lines first before the crowd arrives.

*channeling Drive-Bys*

Nothing to see here, folks. All is well. Those nice men from the government are here to help you.

ManlyRash on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 AM

Hopefully they will move Bawny Fwanks over to manage this after bringing his experience to the lending industry.

I’m sure he has a current male lover that could serve as a tightly connected, inside source, deep within the bowels of agency to monitor the initial thrust of this maneuver by a Democratic majority.

Hening on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 AM

For several years I have been warning people that in the next few years government will gobble up IRA’a and 401′s and add it to the SS system and dole your funds to you at a poverty scale.

jed58 on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 AM

A plan by Teresa Ghilarducci, professor of economic-policy analysis at the New School for Socialist Research in New York

forest on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 AM

Whenever I hear “Democrats are eyeing proposals” I put my hand on my wallet to make sure it is still there.

digitsiam on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 AM

Somewhat off topic but important: Drudge Headline:

With $605 million already, Obama seeks only $10 more from each of us…

Sounds like his tax plan…McCain should use this! Its NEVER GOING TO BE ENOUGH

Use this analogy: Obama contributions are “tax revenues”. His campaign the “Federal Government”…the largest ever…

Make sense?

Yet obama wants more. He and the DEMS will always want MORE

joepub on October 23, 2008 at 9:37 AM

This plan needs to be exposed. Immediately. I’ve just mentioned it to a few of my office mates, ones that are pro-Obama, and they are upset.

Eliminate 401k’s and replace them with 3% govt bonds. Yikes.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 9:37 AM

If they try this, I guarantee it won’t apply to government employees.

Blake on October 23, 2008 at 9:39 AM

Powerful House Democrats are eyeing proposals to overhaul the nation’s $3 trillion 401(k) system, including the elimination of most of the $80 billion in annual tax breaks that 401(k) investors receive.

That means your employer can no longer write off their contributions to your 401(k), and your capital gains would be taxable year-on-year. In other words, it becomes just another investment or savings account, with no tax benefit at all, and no employer contribution. Instead, Uncle Sam would give you your “matching” funds — up to a whopping $600 per year! Whoopee!

Congress, keep your f***ing hands off my 401(k)

I hope I wasn’t unclear

NoFanofLibs on October 23, 2008 at 9:39 AM

Obama and his gaggle of Marxist kooks will make Mao look like the epitome of conservatism.

We’re doomed!

rplat on October 23, 2008 at 9:40 AM

It all comes down to fairness. Democrats need to spread the wealth from those who are earning it to those who vote Democratic.

Expect this to be just the start.

A few years ago I debated a dedicated socialist who declared that in addition to a minimum wage, there needs to be a maximum wage, and that govt should reduce the gap between the two every year.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 9:41 AM

Oh this is frackin’ great. Then what, the geniuses raid the fund every couple of years to pay for some asshat entitlement program for indigent inner-city yoots or something.

My wife’s employer gets a pretty serious match from her employer, something we have been taking full advantage of, and these fools want to kill that?

Seriously, you can smell a civil war coming

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 9:42 AM

Michelle doesn’t shop at the same places my wife does. Pretty soon the Neiman Marcus store will be renamed Gum.

flyoverland on October 23, 2008 at 9:42 AM

Start digging trenches in Texas.

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

The Democrats want to end the private retirement system that has allowed Americans to become a vast investor class and put them back in thrall of the federal government.

That’s the heart of the matter. The growing investor class threatens their power. It’s more about nurturing their political power than any concern for your retirement or mine.

petefrt on October 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Last time I looked at it, my 401(k) was pretty much worthless anyway.

Tommy_G on October 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

Powerful House Democrats are eyeing proposals to overhaul the nation’s $3 trillion 401(k) system, including the elimination of most of the $80 billion in annual tax breaks that 401(k) investors receive.

Well, who didn’t see this coming? Nothing is sacred to Democrats, accounts established under the premise of the 401k system being no exception. What bothers me more are the obvious Obama campaign plant/hit pieces in the LA Times where they make the case against HSAs (health savings accounts.) The HSA system is looking like the best instrument to defeat high medical costs and the occluded payment system; were we to lose HSAs under Obamanation it would eliminate any progress we’ve made towards a more functional free-market health care system.

The proposed single payer health care system under The One would guarantee us at least a few decades of inflated healthcare costs beyond what we have even now. Liberals have proposed that a nationalized, single payer system would help keep administrative medical costs down (paper work, filing claims, etc…) – what the hell else does Government do other than create extra administrative workloads as a means of job security?

/Facepalm

Tacitus_SGL on October 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

I have been moving closer and closer to stop contributing to my 401k all together and instead hold regular savings accounts – this probably closs the deal.

I am not very comfortable about putting money away so that 40 years from now I am hoping to God that the government doesn’t simply seize it all. I don’t trust them.

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

Grafted on October 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

My wife’s employer gets a pretty serious match from her employer,

Yes…I just managed to type that stupid statement.

My wife GETS a pretty serious match yada yada.

I am not a morning person.

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

“… play with the 7% of your gross earnings that already goes to Social Security.”

Sorry, Ed, but that’s 14% of your gross earnings, if you have a DBA, like Joe the Plumber. And I’d argue the 7% the company puts in for you is yours, too, It is part of your total compensation package.

One thing that ought to be noted is that surely the Dems would include this program as part of the Unified Budget, eliminating the deficit in one fell swoop of numbers manipulation, creating trillions in surpluses, which would then pay for the other trillion dollar programs Obama would want to pursue.

Dusty on October 23, 2008 at 9:45 AM

elimination of most of the $80 billion in annual tax breaks that 401(k) investors receive.

I spotted the first clue, raise taxes.

tarpon on October 23, 2008 at 9:45 AM

Democrats to kill 401(k)s for … privatized Social Security?

Fixed.

This is such an effing scam. This is book cooking.

toliver on October 23, 2008 at 9:46 AM

Last time I looked at it, my 401(k) was pretty much worthless anyway.

Tommy_G on October 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

Thanks to govt ineptitude and manipulations in the market.
Wait a year or two and it will come back.
Unlike govt bonds, which are never any good.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 9:47 AM

A plan by Teresa Ghilarducci, professor of economic-policy analysis at the New School for Social Research in New York,

“New School for Social Research” tells me everything I need to know …..

All I can say is, I’m glad stories like this are getting out before the election.

BigD on October 23, 2008 at 9:47 AM

When I said, “… puts in for you is yours, too ….” I meant “the average employee”.

Dusty on October 23, 2008 at 9:48 AM

But…but…I thought 95% of people were gonna get a tax cut…!?! The free market giveth, the Democrats taketh away.

CP on October 23, 2008 at 9:48 AM

Hening on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 AM

A very clever play on words. :)

OldEnglish on October 23, 2008 at 9:49 AM

When IRA legislation was originally enacted, I said one huge weakness was the implicit contract with government to keep its grubby claws off the money. In discussion with friends I said that retirement accounts would soon become the largest identified pile of capital the world has ever known–all tracked by the IRS. I asked if it’s wise to trust the government not to confiscate that capital. My friends agreed this was just more of my anti-government libertarian bias.

Bugler on October 23, 2008 at 9:49 AM

We MUST start referring to Putin, Chavez, and the rest of the nutjob leaders out there as Liberals. The sooner we start tying all these thieves and thugs to each other, the better.

AubieJon on October 23, 2008 at 9:49 AM

Actually, what it seems to propose (without saying it outright) is that 401(K)s will no longer be deductible, and by the way, we’re doubling the social security tax on you. Thanks but no thanks. I’m already putting plenty of money into non tax deferred instruments just in case the IRAs get snagged. More people believe in UFOs than believe they will get anything from social security, and I am doing my finanical planning under the same hypothesis.

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 9:50 AM

Whenever I hear “Democrats are eyeing proposals” I put my hand on my wallet to make sure it is still there.

OK, but I recommend putting (at least) your hand over something else so they don’t go up there.

Keep the faith, folks. The corpulent y-chromosome challanged entity isn’t even considering conditions above room temperature…

karl9000 on October 23, 2008 at 9:51 AM

Isn’t removing a tax DEDUCTION the same as raising taxes?

Big O is already breaking his promises and he isn’t even sworn in.

subbottomfeeder on October 23, 2008 at 9:52 AM

I feel like I’m walking through a Halloween House of Horrors this election season. Every time I turn a corner, another Obama/Democrat boogeyman jumps out and scares the friggin CRAP out of me.

Problem is, too many of the other people in the haunted house don’t realize the blood is actually real. They’re laughing and clapping and calling for more.

aero on October 23, 2008 at 9:52 AM

Dummy me……..to a democrat removing a tax deduction is called “closing the loopholes”

subbottomfeeder on October 23, 2008 at 9:52 AM

Isn’t removing a tax DEDUCTION the same as raising taxes?

Big O is already breaking his promises and he isn’t even sworn in.

subbottomfeeder on October 23, 2008 at 9:52 AM

He’s not increasing taxes on us. He’s increasing taxes on businesses.

The sad thing is that most of the people who vote Democrat will never spot the inconsistency in those statements.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 9:53 AM

So, how long does that government cheese last? And does it come with that big tin of peanut butter that the oil separates to the top of?

hawkdriver on October 23, 2008 at 9:56 AM

It goes there along with 5% of your gross earnings, apparently to play with the 7% of your gross earnings that already goes to Social Security. And what do they do with the money? They give you government bonds as your only investment option.

Just in case folks missed it, government bonds are what your current social security taxes buy as well. They just conveniently left that unmentioned. Same ‘lockbox’ that is currently filled with IOUs for all of your money that has been taken out to cover the deficits of the 1990s and onwards.

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 9:56 AM

Get this out on the stump, as vigorously as JTP !!
NOW !!

pambi on October 23, 2008 at 9:56 AM

Argentina has just done this to pension plans. Socialism is alive and well (make that sick) in this hemisphere.

wepeople on October 23, 2008 at 10:00 AM

And Dear Leader Obamassiah’s response when this plan goes through: “Why did you trust me, you knew I was a socialist when you voted for me.”

Welcome to the United Socialist States of America.

rbj on October 23, 2008 at 10:00 AM

Socialist is a code word for black. So watch your mouths.

Akzed on October 23, 2008 at 10:01 AM

its not YOUR money, it all belongs our wise and beneficent dear leader Barack Obama!! He KNOWS what to do with the money better than you do anyway!! you’d probably waste it on yourself, your kids, a new car, or TV.

He will INVEST it in the people!!! power to the people!!

can you dig it?

right4life on October 23, 2008 at 10:02 AM

Actually, you’d still have your 401k under this plan. It would just be open to taxation (which defeats the purpose of the 401k).

Personally, I can’t wait to get 3% return on my investment, which would be 1% after adjusting for inflation.

It’s pretty sad when my checking account would outperform my mandatory retirement savings.

Nethicus on October 23, 2008 at 10:02 AM

highhopes,
“Only if the American public allows them to do it. Even after Obama takes over the presidency, the public will still have a voice as long as we challenge the politicians.”

How much damage do you think a Demo House/Senate/Pres can do before Nov 2010?

exhelodrvr on October 23, 2008 at 10:03 AM

Socialism is awful, but gets only good press where it exists. Capitalism works wonderfully (when tried,) but gets mostly bad press were it exists. The real problem is education. It takes some intelligence and curiosity to separate the truth from all the hype, and lately we’ve had a real shortage of truth. The MSM is not in the truth business anymore. They’ve all become auxiliary campaign workers.

RBMN on October 23, 2008 at 10:03 AM

If Obumble wins, we all meet in the Autonomous Region of Texas and start over.

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 10:04 AM

Argentina is planning on nationalizing the 401K equivalents per todays Wall Street Journal.

Pat in NC on October 23, 2008 at 10:04 AM

[Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 9:56 AM]

While you are right, VN, the government bonds purchase has pretty much always been the case. The IOU’s have been covering the deficit since the budget was unified, in 1964 IIRC.

Dusty on October 23, 2008 at 10:04 AM

The market will tank on Nov. 5, if Obama wins.

Withdrawl penalties are meaningless with democrats planning to steal it all.

Right_of_Attila on October 23, 2008 at 10:06 AM

Pitchforks … check
tar … check
feathers … check
rail … check

Arrogant fools.

UndertheBridge on October 23, 2008 at 10:06 AM

Sounds like a plan to fix the Social Security shortfall by confiscating 401(k) assets, cloaked in the usual Demolishocratic BS.

Of course, their buddies will be given a special spigot threaded (not by Joe the Plumber) into the pipeline carrying the money, and Lordy Lord won’t we be surprised when find out (not from the MSM, evah) that their buddies kick some of it back into the campaign coffers.

Evool geniooses.

shaken on October 23, 2008 at 10:06 AM

Is it me? or are we F#&*ING SCREWED!

ronsfi on October 23, 2008 at 10:07 AM

The One…

Check, funny!

Dear Leader…

Check, funny!

Lordy Lord, ROTFL!

hawkdriver on October 23, 2008 at 10:09 AM

401k’s are RACIST

SDarchitect on October 23, 2008 at 10:10 AM

People would take their money out before they got nationalized. It wouldn’t net much cash.

But I don’t get the headline. Are democrats now supporting a partially privatized SS?

lorien1973 on October 23, 2008 at 10:10 AM

If Obumble wins, we all meet in the Autonomous Region of Texas and start over.

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 10:04 AM

Only if the plan is to just regroup there before we branch back out.

hawkdriver on October 23, 2008 at 10:11 AM

He’s not increasing taxes on us. He’s increasing taxes on businesses.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 9:53 AM

My bad, I was thinking about the eliminating the tax deduction for 401k’s. I had forgotten about the 5% mandatory tax on each of us.

Now this will put the Obamamites into a quandry.
I’m sure that they will come back and tell that this isn’t a tax, it’s just a contribution that we will get back when we retire.
If they try to go that route, then we can declare that McCain was right when he declared that Obama was going to give tax cuts to people who didn’t pay taxes. After all, if this contribution to a retirement fund is not a tax, then SS and Medicare aren’t taxes either.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

Dusty on October 23, 2008 at 9:45 AM

Darn right. All 1099 and self-employed/small business people get hit for the whole 14% social security. I can’t wait to add another 5% to that! 19% right off the top before we even get to income taxes.

forest on October 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

No, we are not screwed. The dumb libs have made the mistake they always make, believing that American angst at the GOP automatically means widespread acceptance of a pure leftist agenda.

The backfire is already occurring towards Odummy, it will only get worse if they keep proposing these stupid policies.

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

Just in case folks missed it, government bonds are what your current social security taxes buy as well. They just conveniently left that unmentioned. Same ‘lockbox’ that is currently filled with IOUs for all of your money that has been taken out to cover the deficits of the 1990s and onwards.

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 9:56 AM

And what happens when the debt gets so big, that govt defaults on all those bonds?

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 10:13 AM

Only if the plan is to just regroup there before we branch back out.
hawkdriver on October 23, 2008 at 10:11 AM

Of course, we just need a base at which to gather. This is our nation.

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 10:14 AM

All 1099 and self-employed/small business people get hit for the whole 14% social security. I can’t wait to add another 5% to that! 19% right off the top before we even get to income taxes.

forest on October 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

Why doesn’t the government just make it easy, and tell us what percentage of ‘their’ money they will let us keep?

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 10:15 AM

But I don’t get the headline. Are democrats now supporting a partially privatized SS?

lorien1973 on October 23, 2008 at 10:10 AM

They aren’t touching SS. This plan is in addition to SS.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 10:15 AM

The RNC needs to make this into an ad with a kitchen table discussion of the impact on people planning to retire.

This could become “Joe the Saver” for a Republican congress.

Right_of_Attila on October 23, 2008 at 10:15 AM

And what happens when the debt gets so big, that govt defaults on all those bonds?

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 10:13 AM

Same thing that happened when Fannie melted down. It’s all backed by you and me. Just triple the tax rate, and all will be well……

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

Are we really that stupid, as a nation, to elect this thief as our leader? Well, according to most polls, we are. At least there are more stupid than sensible Americans in 2008.

What was it that Ronald Reagan once said? “The nine most terrifying words in the English language are ‘I’m from the government, and I’m here to help.’”

Pope Linus on October 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

Why doesn’t the government just make it easy, and tell us what percentage of ‘their’ money they will let us keep?

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 10:15 AM

0%.

If they decide we need something, it will be requisitioned on our behalf.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

A fool and his money go separate ways; a fool and YOUR money go to Congress. – Will Rogers

ManlyRash on October 23, 2008 at 10:17 AM

Holy crap. It’s called stealing. OH CANNNNNADAAAA…

marklmail on October 23, 2008 at 10:17 AM

If they decide we need something, it will be requisitioned on our behalf.

MarkTheGreat on October 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

That would be funnier if I weren’t such a voracious reader of Russian history.

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 10:18 AM

I blame the RINOs. PURGE!

ronsfi on October 23, 2008 at 10:20 AM

Sounds like another incentive for those of us who are self employed to not work as hard…

Ann on October 23, 2008 at 10:20 AM

I’ve never had a 401k account and for years when people ask why I say because by the time I retire we will be a socialist country and the government will either pay for my retirement or kill me off so I’d rather spend the money now. I generally end with something along the lines of saying that I really appreciate that they have a 401k that will eventually be taken by the government so please keep it up because I’m depending on your money to retire on. It’s really sad that I may be right. So the only thing I can say now is. Keep those 401ks going folks because I’m depending on you for a happy retirement and with the way my job hunting is going it may be sooner then I thought.

jmarcure on October 23, 2008 at 10:21 AM

I dare these friggin thieves to even try it. I DARE THEM.

Riposte on October 23, 2008 at 10:21 AM

I blame the RINOs. PURGE!

ronsfi on October 23, 2008 at 10:20 AM

That’s already being done. They are being replaced by commies.

jmarcure on October 23, 2008 at 10:21 AM

Meanwhile Obama’s Website is encouraging younger voters to Scare their Grandparents! by using their love for you and getting them to vote for Obama.

Nelsa on October 23, 2008 at 10:22 AM

Another subtitle could be: “Want to trade your life savings for a block of 1954 cheese?”

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 10:23 AM

professor of economic-policy analysis at the New School for Social Research in New York

DO NOT WANT

DrSteve on October 23, 2008 at 10:23 AM

And how long until the 5% becomes 6%, 7%, 8%? Up up and away!

ronsfi on October 23, 2008 at 10:23 AM

jmarcure on October 23, 2008 at 10:21 AM

6 of one…

ronsfi on October 23, 2008 at 10:24 AM

Im in ur equity markets, pikin ur winners

DrSteve on October 23, 2008 at 10:25 AM

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 10:14 AM

I’m in. And I’m serious as a heart attack about demonstrating in Washington if they start legislation on the Fairness Doctrine again.

And I’m also serious about going Tazmainian Devil on these bastards that want to prosecute my boss. Here is the note on my office stationary I sent to Charlotte Dennett.

Ma’am,

As a loyal officer with the current administration and President George W. Bush, it’s my duty to inform you I have served under and have been in complete agreement with our commander in chiefs prosecution of this war. Further, I have deployed four times in support of this war to Qatar, Kuwait, Iraq and Afghanistan. I have conducted combat operations with Coalition Forces and enemy combatants have been killed in the process of those operations.

I understand that your aim is to prosecute my Commander in Chief if you are elected to the position of Vermont State Attorney General. I also understand that the prosecution lawyer who intends to assist you, Mr. Vincent Bugliosi, has stated that the death penalty would be an appropriate sentence in President Bush’s case should you win a conviction.

As having stated my duplicity in the alleged crimes you are talking about, I will surrender myself for trial also at the time you commence your proceedings against President Bush. Please contact me in order to provide details as to where I am supposed to surrender myself.

NAME REDACTED
CW5, AV
82ND CAB Standardization Officer

hawkdriver on October 23, 2008 at 10:27 AM

Can I have the Obamanation uniform franchise?

OldEnglish on October 23, 2008 at 10:29 AM

Seriously, you can smell a civil war coming

Bishop on October 23, 2008 at 9:42 AM

I certainly can smell it. The ONLY apprehension that I have with funding my Roth IRA is the fear that the government will begin to tax it like regular income accounts. The point is that I pay taxes now and don’t have to pay taxes later on the gains. This government is really not to be trusted. . . whether or not you elect them ‘democratically’, they have WAY too much power. And they aren’t competent to do anything.

If they touch my Roth (that they created because they know I won’t get social security), I will be recommending that Boston Tea Party on a more real level.

ThackerAgency on October 23, 2008 at 10:29 AM

Any one else think the market volatility is a forward looking reaction to a “he who must not be named” Presidency?

Ann on October 23, 2008 at 10:29 AM

This is the U.S. version “we pretend to work, and the govt pretends to pay us”. Except we have to keep working just as before, while the govt pretends to pay us. Won’t the people scream bloody murder if they mess with 401(k)s?

Paul-Cincy on October 23, 2008 at 10:31 AM

The further left the Democrats push, the more centrist the media can make Obama look. This is even more true if Obama wins and starts calling for compromises. Obama will become even more popular by pushing for “inclusiveness” while appointing judges that will enact the leftist agenda.

It’s brilliant in a horribly tragic way.

JohnJ on October 23, 2008 at 10:32 AM

All 1099 and self-employed/small business people get hit for the whole 14% social security. I can’t wait to add another 5% to that! 19% right off the top before we even get to income taxes.

forest on October 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

Why doesn’t the government just make it easy, and tell us what percentage of ‘their’ money they will let us keep?

Vashta.Nerada on October 23, 2008 at 10:15 AM

That would at least simplify things and make it harder for liberals to hide their tax hikes.

At least Obama wants to “cut capital gains taxes on small business”. Heh, what good is that going to do? Most small businesses have no capital gains income. It’s all earned income, fully taxed plus the extra 7% SS tax. I want to throw a brick at the TV when Obama surrogates start in with the small business/capital gains nonsense. And then the reporters either don’t understand what they are talking about, or don’t want to expose them, and it goes unchallenged – as if an Obama administration would be doing small business a favor. Small businesses rarely have capital gains income! It’s complete BS.

I won’t even get into the proposed expansion of the application of the full 14% self employment taxes on all s-corp income today…

Obama and the Congressional liberals will destroy entrepreneurship in the United States with their tax policies. Joe the Plumber is right, but it’s not just going to apply to those who make $250k.

forest on October 23, 2008 at 10:33 AM

“I want to spend our nation’s dollar for retirement security better. Everybody would now be covered” if the plan were adopted, Ghilarducci said.

Isn’t everyone already covered by Social Security?

I’m not ready to gove up another 5% of my income to provide retirement for others. No doubt the government would exempt some workers from the 5% thus creating another wealth transfer program. Would I get my 5% back or would I only get a fraction based on a socially correct maximum?

I can’t believe that Democrat voters would support this. There are a lot of Obama supporters who love their 401ks.

DerKrieger on October 23, 2008 at 10:33 AM

I give you $600.00. You give me $600.00. We all give each other $600.00. Why, it’s almost like…Utopia!

Buy Danish on October 23, 2008 at 10:33 AM

Don’t forget that Obama is proposing a 7% payroll tax for nationalized health care as well.

Prepare to be a whole Hell of a lot poorer under the socialists.

DerKrieger on October 23, 2008 at 10:34 AM

I work for government. We don’t have 401 k’s; we have “deferred compensation”. We can’t touch it until we retire. We can’t borrow from it and we can’t withdraw it and re-invest it elsewhere. We’re screwed.

If this idiocy goes forward, I would recommend to private sector workers that you withdraw all your money from your 401k before the government can nationalize it. You can re-invest it privately in stocks, bonds, or whatever. None of the benefits of a 401k will mean squat if the government takes it all before you can cash it out.

sdillard on October 23, 2008 at 10:36 AM

Don’t forget that Obama is proposing a 7% payroll tax for nationalized health care as well.

Prepare to be a whole Hell of a lot poorer under the socialists.

DerKrieger on October 23, 2008 at 10:34 AM

Oh crap. I forgot. Here’s the new math for self-employed/1099 people (subtract 7% for regular employees):

14% SS, 5% for the new socialist retirement program, and 7% for socialized medicine. 26% before federal, state and local income taxes are considered.

forest on October 23, 2008 at 10:37 AM

Do they want our money in Treasury bonds paying 3% to fund their deficit spending?

bopbottle on October 23, 2008 at 10:38 AM

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